From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #244 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe:mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website:http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, February 19 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 244 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Wizard of Id vs Suzanne [Kevin Foehr ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2013 20:00:30 -0800 (PST) From: Kevin Foehr Subject: Re: Wizard of Id vs Suzanne Thanks Rob and Mark for your responses. It sounds like you guys know what you are talking about, and it does make sense too. Joni may have heard Suzanne via Judy and decided to use a similar melodic progression (or what ever it's called -- I'm not a musician) in one of her songs, but then decided not to record it, especially after LC's '67 recording of it became so popular. That's a bit of a shame as W of I has enough of Joni's unique style to obviously be her work, but there are also a few bars repeated two or thee times that smack of Suzanne a little too much and might have tainted the entire song and maybe her reputation too, which would have been an even greater shame! Thanks again for your comments and for sharing your research. Good work! Kevin ________________________________ From: Mark To: Robert Sartorius ; joni@smoe.org; onlyjoni-digest@smoe.org Cc: kfoehr@sbcglobal.net Sent: Monday, February 18, 2013 9:09 PM Subject: Re: Wizard of Id vs Suzanne I was just researching some of what is known about Joni's relationship with Cohen. One source, 'Heck of a Guy - The Other Leonard Cohen Site', other being other than the official Leonard Cohen site, said that Judy Collins introduced Joni to Leonard at the Newport Folk Festival in 1967. Copyright on JoniMitchell.com for 'The Wizard of Is' says 1966. That would put it before the two met if what I read was accurate. According to Wikipedia, the song Suzanne was first recorded by Judy Collins on her 1966 album 'In My Life'. The lyrics were first released in Cohen's 1966 book of poetry, 'Parasites of Heaven'. So if all of that is true, it is possible that Joni had heard 'Suzanne' before she wrote 'The Wizard of Is'. Mark in Seattle Perhaps they had collaborated on developing the music and then she decided to let him have it instead of her? Or could she have written it first and then she let LC adapt it into Suzanne with his lyrics? And perhaps that is why it was never released on an album by Joni? Or was it released? I don't recall it on her early albums. Sorry if this was discussed already, but I looked back and couldn't find where it was." I rarely post without doing my homework/research/fact-checking, but I am going out on a limb here. I believe that I looked at this at one point in the past, and concluded to my satisfaction that Suzanne was written before Cohen/Mitchell became an item. That would make W of I something of a knockoff by Joni of an already written LC song. Which might also explain why she had the good sense not to record it. If I am wrong, I apologize to all (including Joni). Bobsart ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2013 #244 ***************************** ------- To post messages to the list, sendtojoni@smoe.org. Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------