From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #1242 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe:mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website:http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, August 28 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 1242 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] RE: Minor chords ["Susan E. McNamara" ] Re: renaldo and clara / art noveau [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Minor chords [Anita ] renaldo and clara / art noveau [Andreas Schmitz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 13:47:32 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM To: Dave Blackburn Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Subject: Re: Minor chords Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) Dave On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! > > If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. > > Dave > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: > >> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >> >> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 13:47:32 +0000 From: "Susan E. McNamara" Subject: RE: Minor chords That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. Susan Tierney McNamara email: sem8@cornell.edu - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM To: Dave Blackburn Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com Subject: Re: Minor chords Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) Dave On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! > > If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. > > Dave > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: > >> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >> >> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 08:26:29 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: renaldo and clara / art noveau Hi Andreas, I'm sure the reason that no one responded is that no one really has any information such as you are looking for. I can't say anything about Renaldo & Clara other than I'm aware of the project. I had the "Love" film on VHS, I must have loaned/given it to another JMDL'er because I can no longer locate it. I did watch it in its entirety once, and let me tell you, once is plenty. The entire film is awful, and Joni's segment is the worst because it forces you to watch someone you deeply admire in a truly wretched piece of work. The writing, the acting, the story, the direction, the entirety of the segment is meandering and pointless. There's a good reason it got buried and stays hidden. To quote "O Brother Where Art Thou": "Do NOT seek the treasure!" Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 15:09:32 +0100 From: Anita Subject: Re: Minor chords Dave, at the very end of 'A Case of You' , Joni chucks in a really unexpected chord that throws up a question mark. What is that? Is it the same thing you're talking about here? Anita On 28 Aug 2013, at 14:47, "Susan E. McNamara" wrote: > That turn in Yvette in English kills me every time. Pain and joy ... it's amazing how music can mix the emotions like that. > > Susan Tierney McNamara > email: sem8@cornell.edu > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-joni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-joni@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Dave Blackburn > Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:26 PM > To: Dave Blackburn > Cc: Corey Blake; Steve Dulson; joni-digest@smoe.org; joni@smoe.org; jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com > Subject: Re: Minor chords > > Well, since that went over okay, here are some more moments employing chords from the parallel minor/major chord scales ; ideal for your next stump the dinner guests game and sure to result in their prior commitments when you invite them over again: > > Passion Play "like washing on a LINE" borrowing the minor V chord from Dminor Yvette in English "little bit of instant BLISS" using the bVI chord from Dbminor and moving to the VI chord of Db major., Court and Spark - moves throughout between E major and E minor tonalities. > Blue -last chord unexpectedly converts the "expected" Bminor into a B7. Called a Picardie third in traditional music theory. > Cotton Avenue - the whole intro is in minor and moves to parallel major when the lyric begins, > > And many more. These are off the top of my head. Stop me when/if this gets tiresome :-) > > Dave > > > > > On Aug 27, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: > >> Ha, Corey! Be careful what you wish for! >> >> If there are others that might like to read about this stuff I'd be glad to write about some facets of JM's music pertaining to theory and method, and make sure it doesn't get too esoteric. As Jim said there is the Lloyd Whitesell book that gets a bit too exhaustive even for the keen student. Joni's music is often an odd mix of pedestrian and highly original, and the fact that she may not know which was which makes it all the more interesting. I believe she trusted her "feelers" so much that no other guidelines were needed or heeded. >> >> Dave >> >> >> On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:37 AM, Corey Blake wrote: >> >>> Dave, I love this stuff. I'd love to see an ongoing or recurring series of posts that looks at the music theory behind the magic of Joni's music. >>> >>> -Corey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 10:46:14 +0200 From: Andreas Schmitz Subject: renaldo and clara / art noveau I am writing the following lines again since nobody answered the previous time. Hopefully somebody can help me with the following: In my holidays I finally found the time to read the book about Joni by Katherine Monk. The Creative Odyssey. During my reading I learned a lot of new information about Joni's artistic life. I asked myself whether the bootleg video of Bob Dylan's "Renaldo and Clara" really don't contain any scenes with Joni. I am talking about the video that is supposed to run about 260 minutes. And the internet sources do tell us that Joni is part of the cast. On wikipedia I found the info that Dylan later edited a cinema version of his material lasting only about 2 hours. Perhaps this is the answer to the question. The writer of the book, K. Monk, often repeats that Joni can't be seen in individual scenes because Joni decided against her commitment to this project. Do you know whether the long video does include footage with Joni that finally was left out for the shorter version? My second question is about Joni's male alter ego that she has nurtured over the years. It would be wonderful to finally get the chance to see Art Noveaus appearance in a short film called The Black Cat in the Black Mouse Socks (part of the compilation "Love" done by several female artists). On the internet I didn't find any video material. I know that the film was shown in Munich a couple of months ago. But they couldn't help me either. It would be great if someone could send me useful information on Renaldo and Art. Thank you very much, Best wishes Andreas. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2013 21:11:24 +0100 From: Anita G Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2013 #1198 Jim, you speak so much for me! How did I miss Paul's posting first time and Sheila's book references? Oh well, people will tell you where they've gone etc.........I too thought I paid close attention to JMDL, but maybe not as much as I thought. I too have learned this past years about the influences in Joni's music, but, added to Buffy's influence, I think that Joni's childhood experience (witnessing Cherokee Louise's abuse) and perhaps her spiritual self (the respect First People's teachings have for the natural world) may be fundamental to her feeling so strongly about the rights of First Nations people, Happy Sunday, Jim! Anita On 25/08/2013, jlhommedieu@insight.rr.com wrote: > Thanks to everyone who brought up this influence again. I guess i missed it > when Paul posted the first time. I guess I missed it when reading Sheila > Weller's book too. It seems strange that I missed it because I thought I > paid close attention to the JMDL. > > In the past year, I learned that Joni seems heavily influenced by Buffy St. > Marie and Laura Allen. Too bad she didn't give the props when Hear Music > asked about her influences for that compilation disc. > > Combining these influences, it makes sense that Lakota, and Cherokee Louise > came from the same muse. > > I think I understand better why Joni feels strongly about the health of > First Nation issues. > > Some long held questions got answered this year, for sure. > > Jim L. > > >> Shari, thanks to Paul Castle posting this to the JMDL awhile ago....... >> >> Laura Allen.....like Joni singing >> >> Native American Ceremonial Song >> >> http://www.flyingsnail.com/Podcast/LauraAllan.mp3 ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2013 #1242 ****************************** ------- To post messages to the list, sendtojoni@smoe.org. Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------