From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2013 #1116 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe:mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website:http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, August 1 2013 Volume 2013 : Number 1116 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: bigotry in Saskatchewan/Memphis [Clint Norwood ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2013 07:04:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Clint Norwood Subject: Re: bigotry in Saskatchewan/Memphis These discussions, while only happening on the Joni newsgroup are just great. It is talk like this that would help these situations but as we see talks like this are all too rare. I am from Memphis, Tennessee and I can tell you that racism is very alive here in 2013. Of course I wouldn't say that it is as bad as in 1950 or before but you would be surprised at how many white people here in the area still can countenance being in the same place with groups of black people. I still live in my old inner-city neighborhood where I am quite the minority but I still chafe at seeing lots of black teenagers hanging around. I still think in the back of my mind that the mean black lady at the DMV is going to treat me badly because she has a scowl on her face. There is racism all around and developers are constantly bulldozing surrounding forests for suburban hoods for white people to live in so they can get back to the 1950's. The black people always follow and the pattern repeats itself. I have been to city council meetings where representatives told me to my face they "don't help crackas" like me. I have been beaten up by gangs of black kids (jumpers) when I was younger. I have seen my own family get weird when I brought black friends to parties. I could go on but you get the picture. I get very stuck on "Furry Sings the Blues" because, as a native I know that we have a lot of racist history but also a lot of beautiful architecture and neighborhoods that we used to have but lost due to this racism. Beale Street isn't much of what it used to be because when MLK was shot and there were riots, white people simply didn't go downtown any more. That has changed many years later but there is no real remnants of the good part of our past here in 2013. Beale Street, while having good music still is only a shell which I call Bluesneyland sponsored by Budweiser!! I suppose that is more of an American marketing everywhere problem thing but my heart has always been heavy about how easily people will give up their neighborhoods just because a couple of black folks moved in. This is what we are America to a far greater extent than Canada. Or so I think? - -Clint ________________________________ From: Anita To: Kate Johnson Cc: "joni@smoe.org" Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 12:29 PM Subject: Re: bigotry in Saskatchewan Kate, I think your writing is courageous because it challenges us all to look at our own internalised racism. The issue that hits me in the face in middle England is our current attitudes to gypsies. A more derided or despised group of people it would be hard to find. I am a little informed about their position because my partner,Steph, led the inclusion course at a local university. She would talk about including people with disabilities, issues for gays and lesbians, issues that black kids face, being sensitive to the variety of Asian cultures etc. However, the lecture Steph would personally feel under attack and where the vitriol and hatred would erupt most was about including travellers and gypsies. They were ALL filthy, dirty people who would rob you of everything. At the end of one lecture about six years ago, she was approached by a young student teacher who asked to speak with her and told Steph that she was a gypsy. The young gypsy never told anyone else about her life for fear of being hated in all four years of her training, but she took Steph and I to great traveller fairs where we were able to share in her experience of not being served in pubs and being asked to leave a restaurant, as it was assumed we were travellers. Although as lesbians we have had a fair amount of abuse over the past thirty years, we are able to pass as middle class white straight women. I have experienced that as a great relief several times in my life. Not so easy to duck under the radar for many other "minority" groups. Anita On 30 Jul 2013, at 17:17, Kate Johnson wrote: > There is still terrible racism (particularly when it comes to the First > Nations) in this entire province, though we white people refuse to admit it. > Not only do we not WANT to see it in ourselves; it appears we CAN'T. Our good > intentions surely do not match with our bigotry, which is deep-down, built in. > We may think one way on the surface, but our automatic responses seem to come > from social attitudes that are quite different and deeply ingrained. > > We think we are just being "realistic" when we describe "Indians" as lazy, or > thieves, or drunks, or wife-beaters, or parents who don't take good care of > their children. But we DO think these things, in spite of knowing that they > can't possibly be true of every First Nations person, and knowing (alas, many > don't: they will still say, quite self-righteously, that First Nations people > bring these problems upon themselves and that if they would just be "more like > us" their lives would be just as comfy) that the huge social problems of First > Nations communities spring from government (and civilian; let's not kid > ourselves) actions and attitudes generations ago that are still affecting them > in the present. > > I don't know how things are in the city where you live, Rob, where there is a > high First Nations population, but where I live, I see informal segregation. > First Nations kids come to the schools in town, so you'd think "we" and "they" > would mix naturally; but no. When "we" go to a concert or community event, > there are NO First Nations people there. They do not work in the businesses in > town either, and because they have such a reputation for wrecking houses, many > landlords don't advertise vacancies publicly (because they can't legally > refuse to house a First Nations person), but instead advertise only by word of > mouth so it's easier for them to pick and choose their tenants. > > And whenever you read an RCMP (that's Canada's national police force) report > in the paper, the perpetrator of the crime almost invariably has a First > Nations surname. When you hear about a home break-in or a knifing or murder in > Saskatoon, it's often the same. It's no wonder white people have these bigoted > attitudes toward Native people, perhaps ... because people don't tend to look > too deeply behind these things, to the causes of these social problems. We > sure as hell don't take any responsibility for them. WE didn't do it; our > PARENTS didn't do it; our GRANDPARENTS didn't steal the First Nations land; it > was the GUMMINT!! But it was our grandparents, great-grandparents, etc, and by > extension US, who benefited from that theft and those terrible laws that were > made for the benefit of white settlers, to the detriment of the culture of the > First Nations. > > Bigoted people rarely admit they are bigoted. We think we are better than > that. And we want to be. But the prejudice IS there; we just don't see it in > ourselves. This is probably why folks are so pissed off about what Joni said. > > It's a very big subject and could use a lot more examination, that's for sure. > > Re the smalldeadanimals webpage: ugh. An embarrassment. Always has been. > > Kate in Saskatchewan > > > b?b > 1b.b?b > 1b.b?b > 1b. > Stubblejumpin'Gal > http://goldengrainfarm.blogspot.com ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2013 #1116 ****************************** ------- To post messages to the list, sendtojoni@smoe.org. Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------