From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2010 #356 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website: http://jmdl.com JMDL Digest Monday, November 29 2010 Volume 2010 : Number 356 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs [Mark-Leon Thorne ] paypal NJC [Mags ] Re: "Amelia" transcription [Jamie Zubairi Home ] Re: "Amelia" transcription [Sam Stone ] RE: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs [Walt Breen ] Re: "Amelia" transcription [Mags ] Re: paypal NJC [Mags ] Re: paypal NJC [Gerald Notaro ] Re: paypal NJC [Mags ] Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs [Michael Paz Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi Walt. Nice to hear from you. Please feel the strength and encouragement coming from your peers and pull through this. You raise an interesting point about Joni's attitude towards men. Do you see her as fulfilling that desire that Nietsche suggests or railing against it? Mark in Sydney ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:44:50 +0000 From: Anita G Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi Walt Like Mark I'd like to add to the 'strength and encouragement' as a peer and also say so sorry to hear that you've been poorly. Hope you feel even better soon. I'm not quite sure what you meant, Walt, about the Nietsche comment explaining Joni's fascination with 'men.' Is it that danger and/or play were part of Joni's agenda in her relationships with men or were you suggesting that men or Joni herself are 'dangerous' playthings? I might be being a bit thick, but I wasn't quite sure how you saw it. However you see it Walt,there's one thing I reckon that's certain. Joni spent a fair amount of time exploring relationships with men in order to find out whatever it was she was searching for! Both wild and kennelled dogs seem to have had a place for sure Love Anita ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:32:24 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi Walt! So good to hear from you, I had just begun wondering where you were! I do get the Nietsche quote, but just like with the "women and sexual equality" discussion of a few weeks ago, I would say it can also work the other way around. It is quite a sexist quote, not surprisingly in its historical context and given the fact it was written by a man. I think these days either side can end up with those elements of play and danger. Women can be drawn to that too, especially when the playing gets wrapped in strong emotions, and that inevitably can bring danger with it. Maybe men like danger more than women do, but I can certainly say that it's not always the woman who brings danger to a relationship. She can be the one who is in danger, when her feelings are strong enough to make her want to play. So to bring the discussion back to Joni: surely she did not always bring "danger" to a man, but she must have found herself in danger because of her strong feelings for (and thus desire to play with) a man. I am sure the same can be said in same-sex relationships. I think Nietsche just generalised a bit too much from his own personal position: "Relationships can mean danger, therefore woman personifies danger". It's an easy let-off: "I'm a man, I can't help it, this is how I tick." On your other point, I've been wondering about the possible link between "Just like a Woman" and "Just Like Me". I have not checked if date-wise it is possible that Joni wrote her song in reaction to Dylan's, but I would say that otherwise it is just possible, given the similarities in song titles and some of the subject matter, but that in any case she turned it into something quite different, where the link, if it ever existed, really does not matter any more. But with the Good Samaritan, it is strange, now that you have mentioned it, I can almost hear the similarity in the sound. (And lyrically there is of course also a link.) It may, after all, just be coincidence, but I can hear it! All the best, Lieve in London ________________________________ From: Walt Breen To: Jonilist Digest Sent: Sat, 27 November, 2010 17:05:31 Subject: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi gang, Sorry 've been absent of late, but I've had a really nasty flareup of AIDS-related neuropathy, and can barely type. I've come back before, and I will again. In the meantime, I thought y'all might enjoy this quote from Joni's hero Nieztsche: The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything. Friedrich Nietzsche Kind of explains Joni's fascination with *men*, too, doncha think? Also, has anyone ever noted that Joni's "Hunter/the Good Samaritan" could be construed as an answer song to Dylan's "Shelter from the Storm", just as her "Just Like Me" was some kind of response to "Just Like a Woman"? Walt "Little" Breen Let the walls come tumbling down Let them fall right on the ground Let all the dogs go running free The wild and the gentle dogs Kenneled in me (Joni Mitchell, Jericho, 1974) Visit my websites: www.learninginsights.info and www.booksbywalt.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 14:10:31 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs I personally don't see any links between those two, but JLM sure does sound a lot like This Flight Tonight, I'm thinking that's why she dropped it. Bob NP: Red House Painters, "Cruiser" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 22:56:40 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi Bob, rather than "in the sound", I should have said "in the melody". That's what I hear, but I could not prove it or give any theoretical explanation of it... Lieve - ----- Original Message ---- From: Bob Muller To: Lieve Reckers ; Walt Breen ; Jonilist Digest Sent: Sun, 28 November, 2010 22:10:31 Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs I personally don't see any links between those two, but JLM sure does sound a lot like This Flight Tonight, I'm thinking that's why she dropped it. Bob NP: Red House Painters, "Cruiser" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:08:10 -0500 From: Sam Stone Subject: "Amelia" transcription Hi again JMDL-ers! Last time I left you, I had just purchased Clouds on LP. Since then I have listened to, absorbed, and--when possible--played along to all the other Joni albums! I just overcame my fear of post-1972 Joni and borrowed my aunt's Hejira LP. I'm totally fascinated by it. So far my favorite track is "Amelia." The moment I heard it I thought, 'I need to learn this.' So I went to the guitar archives and played along!!! Fun time to be had... Anyway, upon further examination of the track, I have realized that there is another guitar part -- pedal steel guitar -- that I really like. Since I don't play pedal steel guitar, I started thinking of how I could play this. I realized.....harmonics! Are there any transcriptions available of the pedal steel part arranged for guitar or will I have to make my own? And what tuning would that be in??? Thanks for everything, Sam PS: If this is in the wrong section/list please inform me! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 15:10:43 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: paypal NJC Just a little head's up here...I have been getting some spam emails supposedly from paypal but it is NOT from them at all. The email says it's from Paypal Security Centre and the body of the email tells you that unless you update your information by such and such a date, they will close out your account. There are links embedded in the email, and one click and you're on your way to spamland or malware/spyware, what have you. fortunately, I did not click on any of the links, and feel pretty lucky at that. The links are in blue and the whole thing looks "legit". I have been in touch with the real paypal folks and this is a common occurrence. anyhoozles, just wanted to share :( Mags ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 23:24:11 +0000 From: Jamie Zubairi Home Subject: Re: "Amelia" transcription Hey Sam, You're talking about Joni and/or her music. This IS the right section/list to be discussing this in. Pedal steel... I must listen further to this to hear it properly. Welcome to the list. Is this your first post? Jamie On 28 November 2010 23:08, Sam Stone wrote: > Hi again JMDL-ers! > > Last time I left you, I had just purchased Clouds on LP. Since then I have > listened to, absorbed, and--when possible--played along to all the other > Joni albums! > > I just overcame my fear of post-1972 Joni and borrowed my aunt's Hejira LP. > I'm totally fascinated by it. So far my favorite track is "Amelia." The > moment I heard it I thought, 'I need to learn this.' So I went to the > guitar > archives and played along!!! Fun time to be had... > > Anyway, upon further examination of the track, I have realized that there > is > another guitar part -- pedal steel guitar -- that I really like. > Since I don't play pedal steel guitar, I started thinking of how I could > play this. I realized.....harmonics! > > Are there any transcriptions available of the pedal steel part arranged for > guitar or will I have to make my own? And what tuning would that be in??? > > > Thanks for everything, > Sam > PS: If this is in the wrong section/list please inform me! > - -- Jamie Zubairi Actor, Voiceover, Painter, Photographer. Facebook: http://tinyurl.com/yapqx3j Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at http://www.voices.com/people/jamiezooby acting CV and showreel at http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 http://www.spotlight.com/interactive/cv/965489410181 agent: http://www.pelhamassociates.co.uk 01273 323 010 Website: http://www.jamiezubairi.com Randomly Related Blog: http://jamiezubairi.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:42:19 -0500 From: Sam Stone Subject: Re: "Amelia" transcription This is my second post...third maybe(?) On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, Jamie Zubairi Home wrote: > Hey Sam, > > You're talking about Joni and/or her music. This IS the right section/list > to be discussing this in. Pedal steel... I must listen further to this to > hear it properly. > > Welcome to the list. Is this your first post? > > Jamie > > > On 28 November 2010 23:08, Sam Stone wrote: > >> Hi again JMDL-ers! >> >> Last time I left you, I had just purchased Clouds on LP. Since then I >> have >> listened to, absorbed, and--when possible--played along to all the other >> Joni albums! >> >> I just overcame my fear of post-1972 Joni and borrowed my aunt's Hejira >> LP. >> I'm totally fascinated by it. So far my favorite track is "Amelia." The >> moment I heard it I thought, 'I need to learn this.' So I went to the >> guitar >> archives and played along!!! Fun time to be had... >> >> Anyway, upon further examination of the track, I have realized that there >> is >> another guitar part -- pedal steel guitar -- that I really like. >> Since I don't play pedal steel guitar, I started thinking of how I could >> play this. I realized.....harmonics! >> >> Are there any transcriptions available of the pedal steel part arranged >> for >> guitar or will I have to make my own? And what tuning would that be in??? >> >> >> Thanks for everything, >> Sam >> PS: If this is in the wrong section/list please inform me! >> > > > > -- > Jamie Zubairi > Actor, Voiceover, Painter, Photographer. > > Facebook: http://tinyurl.com/yapqx3j > > Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at > http://www.voices.com/people/jamiezooby > > acting CV and showreel at > http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 > http://www.spotlight.com/interactive/cv/965489410181 > > agent: http://www.pelhamassociates.co.uk > 01273 323 010 > Website: > http://www.jamiezubairi.com > > Randomly Related Blog: > http://jamiezubairi.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:41:55 -0700 From: Walt Breen Subject: RE: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Hi all, So nice to hear from so many of you, and thanks for all the kind thoughts and prayers. I thought the Nieztsche quote was interesting, in that many people are attracted to people who are "wrong" [Nietzsche's "dangerous"] for them, all the time wondering silently, or wailing aloud, "Why can't I find a *good/nice* guy/gal who will treat me *right*? Songs like Coyote, Don Junan's Reckless Daughter, and A Strange Boy, and many others lead me to believe that Joni was well aware of this conflict, being attracted to boys who were somehow "inappropriate". The amazing thing about her is her gimlet eye in examining not just what *he* did wrong, but how *she* misbehaved or had unrealistic expectations, rather than just bashing "the other". I'm not sure how much that helps the former objects of affection as they hold their breath, waiting for her dissective songs to come out. ;-} Best to all, Walt "Little" Breen Let the walls come tumbling down Let them fall right on the ground Let all the dogs go running free The wild and the gentle dogs Kenneled in me (Joni Mitchell, Jericho, 1974) Visit my website: www.learninginsights.info ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 18:55:52 -0500 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: paypal NJC Their spelling of Center as Centre should have been the tip-off. Jerry :^) On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Mags wrote: > Just a little head's up here...I have been getting some spam emails > supposedly from paypal but it is NOT from them at all. The email says it's > from Paypal Security Centre and the body of the email tells you that unless > you update your information by such and such a date, they will close out > your account. There are links embedded in the email, and one click and > you're on your way to spamland or malware/spyware, what have you. > > fortunately, I did not click on any of the links, and feel pretty lucky at > that. The links are in blue and the whole thing looks "legit". I have been > in touch with the real paypal folks and this is a common occurrence. > > anyhoozles, just wanted to share :( > > Mags ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 15:54:08 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: Re: "Amelia" transcription AND... you will find many kindred spirits of the Hejira kind...keep writing, we love hearing new impressions. Mags - --- On Sun, 11/28/10, Jamie Zubairi Home wrote: > From: Jamie Zubairi Home > Subject: Re: "Amelia" transcription > To: "Sam Stone" > Cc: joni@smoe.org > Received: Sunday, November 28, 2010, 6:24 PM > Hey Sam, > > You're talking about Joni and/or her music. This IS the > right section/list > to be discussing this in. Pedal steel... I must listen > further to this to > hear it properly. > > Welcome to the list. Is this your first post? > > Jamie > > On 28 November 2010 23:08, Sam Stone > wrote: > > > Hi again JMDL-ers! > > > > Last time I left you, I had just purchased Clouds on > LP. Since then I have > > listened to, absorbed, and--when possible--played > along to all the other > > Joni albums! > > > > I just overcame my fear of post-1972 Joni and borrowed > my aunt's Hejira LP. > > I'm totally fascinated by it. So far my favorite > track is "Amelia." The > > moment I heard it I thought, 'I need to learn this.' > So I went to the > > guitar > > archives and played along!!! Fun time to be had... > > > > Anyway, upon further examination of the track, I have > realized that there > > is > > another guitar part -- pedal steel guitar -- that I > really like. > > Since I don't play pedal steel guitar, I started > thinking of how I could > > play this. I realized.....harmonics! > > > > Are there any transcriptions available of the pedal > steel part arranged for > > guitar or will I have to make my own? And what tuning > would that be in??? > > > > > > Thanks for everything, > > Sam > > PS: If this is in the wrong section/list please inform > me! > > > > > > -- > Jamie Zubairi > Actor, Voiceover, Painter, Photographer. > > Facebook: http://tinyurl.com/yapqx3j > > Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at > http://www.voices.com/people/jamiezooby > > acting CV and showreel at > http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 > http://www.spotlight.com/interactive/cv/965489410181 > > agent: http://www.pelhamassociates.co.uk > 01273 323 010 > Website: > http://www.jamiezubairi.com > > Randomly Related Blog: > http://jamiezubairi.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 16:10:14 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: Re: paypal NJC Centre is how we spell centre here in Canada ;-) okay Mister Librarian, check it out xo - --- On Sun, 11/28/10, Gerald Notaro wrote: > From: Gerald Notaro > Subject: Re: paypal NJC > To: "Mags" > Cc: joni@smoe.org > Received: Sunday, November 28, 2010, 6:55 PM > Their spelling of Center as Centre > should have been the tip-off. > > Jerry :^) > > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Mags > wrote: > > > Just a little head's up here...I have been getting > some spam emails > > supposedly from paypal but it is NOT from them at all. > The email says it's > > from Paypal Security Centre and the body of the email > tells you that unless > > you update your information by such and such a date, > they will close out > > your account. There are links embedded in the email, > and one click and > > you're on your way to spamland or malware/spyware, > what have you. > > > > fortunately, I did not click on any of the links, and > feel pretty lucky at > > that. The links are in blue and the whole thing looks > "legit". I have been > > in touch with the real paypal folks and this is a > common occurrence. > > > > anyhoozles, just wanted to share :( > > > > Mags ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 19:39:58 -0500 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: paypal NJC That I know. I grew up on the border and spent almost 20 summers there. I drank more Molson's Golden than I can remember. And saw many shows at Molson Centre! Jerry On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 7:10 PM, Mags wrote: > Centre is how we spell centre here in Canada ;-) okay Mister Librarian, > check it out xo > > > --- On Sun, 11/28/10, Gerald Notaro wrote: > > > From: Gerald Notaro > > Subject: Re: paypal NJC > > To: "Mags" > > Cc: joni@smoe.org > > Received: Sunday, November 28, 2010, 6:55 PM > > Their spelling of Center as Centre > > should have been the tip-off. > > > > Jerry :^) > > > > > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Mags > > wrote: > > > > > Just a little head's up here...I have been getting > > some spam emails > > > supposedly from paypal but it is NOT from them at all. > > The email says it's > > > from Paypal Security Centre and the body of the email > > tells you that unless > > > you update your information by such and such a date, > > they will close out > > > your account. There are links embedded in the email, > > and one click and > > > you're on your way to spamland or malware/spyware, > > what have you. > > > > > > fortunately, I did not click on any of the links, and > > feel pretty lucky at > > > that. The links are in blue and the whole thing looks > > "legit". I have been > > > in touch with the real paypal folks and this is a > > common occurrence. > > > > > > anyhoozles, just wanted to share :( > > > > > > Mags ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 17:42:34 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: Re: paypal NJC so you are really a Canadian, eh? xo ;P - --- On Sun, 11/28/10, Gerald Notaro wrote: From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: paypal NJC To: "Mags" Cc: joni@smoe.org Received: Sunday, November 28, 2010, 7:39 PM That I know. I grew up on the border and spent almost 20 summers there. I drank more Molson's Golden than I can remember. And saw many shows at Molson Centre! Jerry On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 7:10 PM, Mags wrote: Centre is how we spell centre here in Canada ;-) okay Mister Librarian, check it out xo - --- On Sun, 11/28/10, Gerald Notaro wrote: > From: Gerald Notaro > Subject: Re: paypal NJC > To: "Mags" > Cc: joni@smoe.org > Received: Sunday, November 28, 2010, 6:55 PM > Their spelling of Center as Centre > should have been the tip-off. > > Jerry :^) > > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Mags > wrote: > > > Just a little head's up here...I have been getting > some spam emails > > supposedly from paypal but it is NOT from them at all. > The email says it's > > from Paypal Security Centre and the body of the email > tells you that unless > > you update your information by such and such a date, > they will close out > > your account. There are links embedded in the email, > and one click and > > you're on your way to spamland or malware/spyware, > what have you. > > > > fortunately, I did not click on any of the links, and > feel pretty lucky at > > that. The links are in blue and the whole thing looks > "legit". I have been > > in touch with the real paypal folks and this is a > common occurrence. > > > > anyhoozles, just wanted to share :( > > > > Mags ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 21:06:49 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Dangerous fools these mortals be, and Q&A songs Walt Keep strong brother. Half the battle is attitude, will and positive energy. Sending you all the above from Brazil where you would really be in trouble. Land of music, love and beauty. Everyone is beautiful and the energy is amazing. Just spent the night eating and drinking and listening to so much great music in the trad vein and I thought I knew this music. I didn't know shit. I was fortunate enough to hear it from the masters (which are so many) and my heart and head are full). Sending you so much energy and love. Be well! Paz Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Nov 28, 2010, at 5:41 PM, Walt Breen wrote: Hi all, So nice to hear from so many of you, and thanks for all the kind thoughts and prayers. I thought the Nieztsche quote was interesting, in that many people are attracted to people who are "wrong" [Nietzsche's "dangerous"] for them, all the time wondering silently, or wailing aloud, "Why can't I find a *good/nice* guy/gal who will treat me *right*? Songs like Coyote, Don Junan's Reckless Daughter, and A Strange Boy, and many others lead me to believe that Joni was well aware of this conflict, being attracted to boys who were somehow "inappropriate". The amazing thing about her is her gimlet eye in examining not just what *he* did wrong, but how *she* misbehaved or had unrealistic expectations, rather than just bashing "the other". I'm not sure how much that helps the former objects of affection as they hold their breath, waiting for her dissective songs to come out. ;-} Best to all, Walt "Little" Breen Let the walls come tumbling down Let them fall right on the ground Let all the dogs go running free The wild and the gentle dogs Kenneled in me (Joni Mitchell, Jericho, 1974) Visit my website: www.learninginsights.info ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2010 #356 ***************************** ------- To post messages to the list, send to joni@smoe.org. Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------