From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2010 #28 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, January 26 2010 Volume 2010 : Number 028 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: www.jonimitchell.com [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC [Lieve Reckers ] I thought I'd never say this! NJC [Lieve Reckers ] Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC Bruce Springsteen guests [B] Re: Come In From The Cold [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Joni Mitchell.com [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC [Em ] RE: www.jonimitchell.com [Susan E McNamara ] Re: "I'm very ill, I'm fighting for my life" [Rick & Susan ] Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC [Catherine McKay ] Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC [Lieve Reckers ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:28:34 +1100 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Re: www.jonimitchell.com Thanks Les for letting us know what's going on. It's all so clear now. The same thing must be happening to www.jmdl.com I'm not particularly computer literate but, is it not possible for the server to recognise bots and reject them? Some advice that was given to me when I started to drown in spam emails was to bounce them. By bouncing them, it appears to the sender that my email address doesn't exist. I do this every time there is an unsolicited email in my in box or from a sender I don't know. I have no doubt it has kept the numbers right down but, it doesn't always work. Somehow, it is possible to send mass emails from a bogus address that is outgoing only. I guess it's that way with these bots. No one is actually running them. Mark in Sydney NP Suntoucher (Nextmen Remix) - Groove Armada ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 10:02:02 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC There are sometimes advantages to being on digest! I got up this morning, read Cassy's message about season 2 of the Elvis Costello programme, wanted to ask if it could be available on DVD, and as I scrolled further down the digest, Stephen asked the question "for me", and Cassy promptly came up with a reply. So now all I have to do is find out about the region, because I fear that DVD won't play on a UK player... I also saw Vince's criticism of the series, but the digest was not long enough to find any further replies. I hope that other people who've seen the series will give their take on it, because Vince's post seems to make a fair point. Of course, we don't all have to agree, it may be a very subjective question of taste, but I would like to read some more on this point before I commit myself to a possibly long search for a UK-compatible version. Appreciating all takes on it, Lieve in London - ------- From: "Cassy" Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC Bruce Springsteen guests Here it is, Stephen: http://www.buy.com/prod/spectacle-season-1/q/loc/322/211960559.html - - ----- Original Message ----- From: <<< does anyone know if there are plans to release season 1 on dvd? >>> - --------- From: Vince Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC Bruce Springsteen guests at the risk of being contrary, I find Elvis Costello's Spectacle to be unwatchable the show consists of Elvis talking about himself, how the guest likes Costello, and then, they play Costello's music while the camera lovingly caresses Costello's every move "Hi, Ringo, here is a sample of your drumming and how do you like my drumming? Tell me about how much the Beatles liked my music and how I influenced them. Look at me! Look at me! Now let's play 2 bars of your song and 3 songs of mine! Am I precious or what?" Vince - ------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 05:21:19 -0500 From: Subject: Joni Mitchell.com Bob, Haha! I love the picture of our long-suffering leader, Les, finally shaking it all off and "absconding" and making tracks to South America after all these years of service to us all. LOL! He would certainly be entitled ;-) Oh, but luckily he hasn't left us quite yet, and is still here, faithfully, dealing with the bots and bits and all. Just an opportunity to thank Les, as always, for creating our refuge here and everything he does to maintain it. He is "as constant as the Northern Star." Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 10:37:18 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: I thought I'd never say this! NJC When I joined the list almost 10 years ago, there were often very heated and prolonged political arguments going on, as I'm sure most people now on the list still remember. The tone often turned very unpleasant, and, to my personal taste, I was often very bored by the length and detail of the posts. This went on for many years, but suddenly seems to have stopped in the last couple of years. And... I thought I'd never say this, but I have come to regret the almost total absence of any political discussion! I know this is the Joni Mitchell list, and that is why there is the NJC option, but... this is also a list made up of such a variety of intelligent and well informed people, who - most of the time - can discuss important issues in a respectful and considerate way, that I really miss that contribution. I realise that over recent years I have got a much clearer understanding of US life, thanks to this list. I don't wish to return to the bad old days of miles-long exchanges where people insist on having the last word, but a few intelligent observations would be very welcome, in my book! To give a specific example, the trigger in fact for this post: the election of a Republican in Massachusetts. I was baffled and upset by this outcome, and anxiously turned to the JMDL to see what my US friends had to say about it. At first: nothing! I couldn't believe it! Then I think it was Cassy who mentioned it, and a few other people reacted. Vince expressed exactly what I had been thinking: what a posthumous kick up the backside for Ted Kennedy, and even more importantly, what a disaster for the much needed health insurance solution! I don't mean to say that I just want to see posts expressing what I already believe, and I don't want to frighten anybody by asking for the "bad old days" to return, but from my humble perspective, I just want to say that as a person who always wants to learn and grow, I appreciate and miss the intelligent discussions from a trusted group of friends. One last clarification: if I sound very passive, i.e. just relying on getting the opinion from others and not contributing, this is because I am really talking about US matters. I am very happy to contribute to more general or typical European topics, if anyone is interested! Lieve in London ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 04:40:35 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com Bob also said that Les would have absconded with $5. I guess he wouldn't make it as far as South America, but maybe to the south end of town by bus, where he would then have the choice of either getting a cheap coffee or buying another ticket back home again. ________________________________ From: "kbhla@fastmail.fm" To: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com; joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 5:21:19 AM Subject: Joni Mitchell.com Bob, Haha! I love the picture of our long-suffering leader, Les, finally shaking it all off and "absconding" and making tracks to South America after all these years of service to us all. LOL! He would certainly be entitled ;-) __________________________________________________________________ The new Internet Explorer. 8 - Faster, safer, easier. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 07:58:56 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC Bruce Springsteen guests The ones that are on DVD are at the top of my Netflix queue, Cassy - can't wait to see them. Bob NP: Grizzly Bear, "Southern Point" (still saying that this was 2009's finest album) - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:15:07 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Come In From The Cold It hasn't been, Mark - but given the improvements in technology it wouldn't be overly difficult or costly to find a clean off-the-counter VHS and get it converted. I wasn't a huge fan of videos (I think they played a big part in making most 80's music forgettable in that artists spent more resources on the visual rather than on the actual music) but I will say that Joni made a good attempt at creating memorable and enjoyable mini-films. Bob NP: Mojave 3, "Bluebird Of Happiness" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:19:10 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, you always have to watch the quiet ones. Bob NP: Jimmie Lunceford, "Organ Grinder's Swing" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 05:30:54 -0800 (PST) From: Em Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC I like the show. It is like candy or mother's milk to me. But then again, I love Elvis Costello. I guess if you don't really really, REALLY dig him, then it might not seem so great. I like looking at his vintage guitars and watching the band and the songs he picks seem really perfect. I love hearing him cover the songs of the people he has on as guests. He hits some really improbable notes sometimes. I can tell some of those covers were not easy for him & I feel like he is very reverential to them, but at the same time he loves to have fun and remembers what rock and roll is all about. We were watching the show at my Mom's once and a friend came over who can't stand Elvis Costello. We had to take the show off, lol. He skeeved her so much we had to change the channel. So maybe a lot of it hinges upon liking - or at least being able to stand - Elvis. A couple of the episodes I could take or leave, but some of them have been like rivet guns. Made the mistake of starting to watch the Springsteen ep.1 kind of late on a work night and ended up turning it off because I was getting too fired up to ever get to sleep. So I still have that one to watch. I always catch it on the HD "on demand" channel, rather than actually getting it when its being broadcast on A&E or Sundance or whatever channel its really on. The beginning of the Bruce show was fun. Bruce had a case of the giggles, kinda. Very cute man. Anyway, looking forward to an Elvis and Bruce pig-out when I watch the ep. 1&2 back to back, one of these evenings (on a weekend). Em ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 10:06:41 -0500 From: Susan E McNamara Subject: RE: www.jonimitchell.com Hey Les, Thanks so much for all the work you do keeping the site up, beautiful and growing. I can't imagine life without jm.com. You rock my friend. Love, Sue ___________________ /___________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue Tierney || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake." - Joni Mitchell - -----Original Message----- Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 15:22:40 -0700 From: "Les Irvin" Subject: RE: www.jonimitchell.com > Just wondering what is happening with the jonimitchell.com website. > It has been down for days Here's the sitch... basically, the site is overloading the servers (too much traffic) so the host keeps shutting it down. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 07:12:30 -0800 From: Rick & Susan Subject: Re: "I'm very ill, I'm fighting for my life" Joni didn't attend the opening of the full-length version of The Fiddle and The Drum here in Vancouver last Friday as she was scheduled to do. Grand-Maitre made apologies for her absence, citing her recovering from her illness as the reason. The performance got one less than in-depth review and that was the last I heard. I had intended to go to the Sunday show, but when I tried to buy tickets, the show was listed as cancelled. I haven't been able to find any reason for or mention of the cancellation in any of the local media. Rick ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:18:53 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC I think I saw all (or most) of the Season one shows. Some were good and some not quite so good. If I happen to think of it, I'll probably watch Season 2, that is, if I know when and what channel it's playing on here. I think there's more than one channel that shows it. I may have seen it in re-runs. I enjoyed the one with the drummer from the Police (Stewart Copeland) as well as the one with Rufus W and Kate McGarrigle. I do see Vince's point about Elvis. He can be very annoying and possibly loves himself too much. I don't think he sings particularly well and yet, he can sound brilliant, depending on what he's doing. I'd rather hear him singing his own stuff than covering other people's stuff. Sometimes I think he tries too hard to look like a bum (this is from a person who never really did learn to dress properly.) I mean, c'mon, Elvis, you're rich and you're married to a babe. Wash your hair once in a while! ________________________________ From: Em To: jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 8:30:54 AM Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC I like the show. It is like candy or mother's milk to me. But then again, I love Elvis Costello. I guess if you don't really really, REALLY dig him, then it might not seem so great. I like looking at his vintage guitars and watching the band and the songs he picks seem really perfect. I love hearing him cover the songs of the people he has on as guests. He hits some really improbable notes sometimes. I can tell some of those covers were not easy for him & I feel like he is very reverential to them, but at the same time he loves to have fun and remembers what rock and roll is all about. We were watching the show at my Mom's once and a friend came over who can't stand Elvis Costello. We had to take the show off, lol. He skeeved her so much we had to change the channel. So maybe a lot of it hinges upon liking - or at least being able to stand - Elvis. __________________________________________________________________ Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:33:06 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Be careful what you wish for! I'd be interested too (god help me). Is it because the guy is good-looking? that may sound flippant, but I think, as a society, certainly in the west, people seem to be overly concerned with what people look like and/or with what they sound like, rather than looking for the deeper meaning. Maybe I'm just too cynical. Is it big business propping him up? If so, what are they doing to influence how people vote? Is it some kind of reaction to Obama? Is it a weird way of wanting to keep Democrats and Republicans balanced somehow, so that neither side has too much power? I still scratch my head wondering why it appears that the average Joe is so afraid of health care for all. Is the average Joe really foolish enough to believe everything big business tells them? I recently had a discussion with a co-worker who does a lot of work assisting Ontario citizens who have fallen ill while in the US, trying to get them back to Canada. We talked about the differences between the costs in the US vs in Canada and how you can negotiate with providers in the US for much lower rates in hospital for example, but that few people realize they can do this and often end up getting bills for ten times what it might cost here. Not that I want to veer off into a comparison between health care coverage in different places, but I'm wondering how much the average Joe knows about health care costs until he needs health care himself and whether or not the whole health coverage thing led to this particular outcome in MA. ________________________________ From: Lieve Reckers To: jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 5:37:18 AM Subject: I thought I'd never say this! NJC [...] To give a specific example, the trigger in fact for this post: the election of a Republican in Massachusetts. I was baffled and upset by this outcome, and anxiously turned to the JMDL to see what my US friends had to say about it. At first: nothing! I couldn't believe it! Then I think it was Cassy who mentioned it, and a few other people reacted. Vince expressed exactly what I had been thinking: what a posthumous kick up the backside for Ted Kennedy, and even more importantly, what a disaster for the much needed health insurance solution! ... When I joined the list almost 10 years ago, there were often very heated and prolonged political arguments going on, as I'm sure most people now on the list still remember. The tone often turned very unpleasant, and, to my personal taste, I was often very bored by the length and detail of the posts. This went on for many years, but suddenly seems to have stopped in the last couple of years. And... I thought I'd never say this, but I have come to regret the almost total absence of any political discussion! __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 08:35:35 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC I meant to respond to this part too. Sheesh - tell your friend to go home and watch TV at his own place, if he doesn't like what you're watching. So there. ________________________________ From: Em To: jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 8:30:54 AM Subject: Re: Elvis Costello Spectacle - Season 2 - NJC We were watching the show at my Mom's once and a friend came over who can't stand Elvis Costello. We had to take the show off, lol. He skeeved her so much we had to change the channel. So maybe a lot of it hinges upon liking - or at least being able to stand - Elvis. __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 17:31:36 +0000 From: Anita G Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC > Lieve Wrote > > 'And... I thought I'd > never say this, but I have come > to regret the almost total absence of any > political discussion!' > Over here in the UK, I find it hard these days to distinguish between one political party and another. I found myself just the other day feeling quite nostalgic for the days of Margaret Thatcher when I clearly knew who my 'enemy' was. These days seem (to me) to be of centre ground politics with lots of pale imitations with no real political will. On BBC news last week, Gordon Brown appeared in a blue tie (he is Labour, colour red for those who may not know) and David Cameron in red (Tory, blue)! Just sums it all up for me. I long for lots more angry young people out there making loads of angry noise about the state of things. Maybe I'd get out of my own comfortable middle class position and get back on the streets myself again! Anita ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 11:42:58 -0700 From: "Les Irvin" Subject: RE: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) >Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, >you always have to watch the quiet ones. You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 13:55:34 -0500 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) I thought you were in Costa Rica?????? Jerry On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 1:42 PM, Les Irvin wrote: > >Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, > >you always have to watch the quiet ones. > > You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in > at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 12:58:39 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) I knew it!!! He ran off with the Sue Cameron woman that was running the SCAM thingy! Those wascals. I volunteer to go hunt them down in Central America. Paz Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Jan 26, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Les Irvin wrote: > Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, > you always have to watch the quiet ones. You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:20:50 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Hi Catherine! You're right, I should be careful what I wish for! But risking it, I'll give a few simple reactions to the points you made about the "average Joe". 1) I think a certain proportion of people like to be "contrary" and will vote against whoever is in power. On the BBC radio, I heard interviews with some random people in the streets of Boston who were asked why they had voted republican. One woman said: "Just to see if we could ever elect a Republican in this state". Wow, talk of political analysis! But surely this can't explain such a massive and historical shift! 2) I think another factor is that expectations of Obama were SO high that he was bound to disappoint a lot of people. Some people, even here in Europe, expected him to "magic" the recession away. So no surprise they are disappointed. But again, is that enough of a reason why people would want to put him now in a position where he really cannot make any real change any more, as the Democrats no longer have the majority of 60 in the Senate? 3) I am a big fan of the American people and always try to defend them here in Europe, where some people seem to think they are all superficial emperialist buffoons. I've read up on social history, and travelling through the vast Western states has even given me a feel for the pioneer spirit that underlies so much of the American mentality, but even then I am sad to see how paranoid some people are about "big government". It is just scary to think that many people think the Democrats are virtual communists! So is it really their fear of this new health insurance plan that has swayed such a large part of the voters? But then, why did they vote Democrat before? I would have understood this Massachusetts vote if it had always been a marginal state, and/or if Obama had been in power for longer and had made some big blunders. But now the electorate comes out of it looking incredibly feeble and whimsical, instead of informed or mature. Well, that's my take on it, anyway. Funny that the 2 replies I've had so far are from non-Americans, i.e. Catherine and Anita! Quick reply to Anita: I know what you mean about everything seeming so fuzzy these days. But I don't need or want "enemies" in politics, even if I agree that it makes things easier. I just try to understand where people come from, what drives them, and to come to my own reasoned conclusions, regardless of party loyalty. In a lot of cases, I just have to conclude sadly that "it's complicated and I don't have the easy answer"... Lieve in London ________________________________ From: Catherine McKay To: Lieve Reckers ; jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, 26 January, 2010 16:33:06 Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Be careful what you wish for! I'd be interested too (god help me). Is it because the guy is good-looking? that may sound flippant, but I think, as a society, certainly in the west, people seem to be overly concerned with what people look like and/or with what they sound like, rather than looking for the deeper meaning. Maybe I'm just too cynical. Is it big business propping him up? If so, what are they doing to influence how people vote? Is it some kind of reaction to Obama? Is it a weird way of wanting to keep Democrats and Republicans balanced somehow, so that neither side has too much power? I still scratch my head wondering why it appears that the average Joe is so afraid of health care for all. Is the average Joe really foolish enough to believe everything big business tells them? I recently had a discussion with a co-worker who does a lot of work assisting Ontario citizens who have fallen ill while in the US, trying to get them back to Canada. We talked about the differences between the costs in the US vs in Canada and how you can negotiate with providers in the US for much lower rates in hospital for example, but that few people realize they can do this and often end up getting bills for ten times what it might cost here. Not that I want to veer off into a comparison between health care coverage in different places, but I'm wondering how much the average Joe knows about health care costs until he needs health care himself and whether or not the whole health coverage thing led to this particular outcome in MA. ________________________________ From: Lieve Reckers To: jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 5:37:18 AM Subject: I thought I'd never say this! NJC [...] To give a specific example, the trigger in fact for this post: the election of a Republican in Massachusetts. I was baffled and upset by this outcome, and anxiously turned to the JMDL to see what my US friends had to say about it. At first: nothing! I couldn't believe it! Then I think it was Cassy who mentioned it, and a few other people reacted. Vince expressed exactly what I had been thinking: what a posthumous kick up the backside for Ted Kennedy, and even more importantly, what a disaster for the much needed health insurance solution! ... When I joined the list almost 10 years ago, there were often very heated and prolonged political arguments going on, as I'm sure most people now on the list still remember. The tone often turned very unpleasant, and, to my personal taste, I was often very bored by the length and detail of the posts. This went on for many years, but suddenly seems to have stopped in the last couple of years. And... I thought I'd never say this, but I have come to regret the almost total absence of any political discussion! ________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar :Search from anywhere on the web and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 14:29:29 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) He told me he was going hiking on the Appalachian Trail...(little SC humor for those of you who remember our esteemed Guv'ner.) Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 14:57:43 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Probably a combination of all of the above things, Catherine - Brown of course had his infamous Cosmo shot, and American voters definitely seem to sway towards the pretty and the celebrity, the surface rather than the substance. America seems to have lost a lot of its critical thinking skills, and people don't seem to want to make the effort to research, check a variety of sources, and decide for themselves, not when its so much easier for ONE source to tell you everything you need to know. (Or as Rush Limbaugh says, "let me do your thinking for you") This laziness, both in terms of research and in terms of public involvement applies to members of both parties. I've tried to have dialogue with co-workers about health care and it instantly slides into a diatribe about Socialism. Sadly, our elected officials don't do much better, hence the failure to move these issues forward. By the same token, Obama has failed to deliver on many of the things he promised and that has cost him a lot of support. As to the reduced political content here, I would point to a couple of things: 1. The growth of alternative opportunities (Political websites, Facebook, etc) such that there are many more (and some would say more appropriate) places to voice your opinions about politics. 2. The devisive nature of political discussion in general - it's hard to keep the debate reasonable and stick to facts as opposed to feelings. Over the years, many of us have met each other, so we're not just anonymous people flaming in some chatroom or on some website - I think that keeps people from wanting to publicly hurt someone's feelings and is probably a good thing. Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:01:46 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC An interesting footnote to the MA election, Lieve...in those districts where electronic voting machines were NOT used, and votes had to be counted by hand, Coakley received more votes. I'm not a conspiracy theorist but I don't like or trust the Diebold voting machines. I believe there is enough evidence out there to prove that they are not reliable. Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 20:53:07 +0000 From: joe farrell Subject: re:www.jonimitchell.com relieved to get the explanation for the joni site being down. thanks les. no problem logging in if it keeps the site up and running. whatever you decide you have our full support, apart from the idea suggested in jest, hopefully, of permanent shutdown. it is too valuable a resource to lose. regards, joe. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 21:16:03 +0000 (GMT) From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Hi Bob! You make some interesting points. If you feel like it, I'd be interested to hear about all those things where Obama has failed to deliver. I could guess that would include the (non) closure of Guantanamo and the ongoing war in Afghanistan (both of which I think are so difficult that I can understand that he has not concluded them yet). Is that what you had in mind, or anything else? As to your 2 points regarding political discussions here on the list, I totally agree. I am certainly not missing political rants or personal attacks, but only, as I said, some intelligent exchanges of information or personal experience! All the best, Lieve ________________________________ From: "Bob.Muller@Fluor.com" To: Catherine McKay Cc: jonipeople LIST ; Lieve Reckers Sent: Tue, 26 January, 2010 19:57:43 Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Probably a combination of all of the above things, Catherine - Brown of course had his infamous Cosmo shot, and American voters definitely seem to sway towards the pretty and the celebrity, the surface rather than the substance. America seems to have lost a lot of its critical thinking skills, and people don't seem to want to make the effort to research, check a variety of sources, and decide for themselves, not when its so much easier for ONE source to tell you everything you need to know. (Or as Rush Limbaugh says, "let me do your thinking for you") This laziness, both in terms of research and in terms of public involvement applies to members of both parties. I've tried to have dialogue with co-workers about health care and it instantly slides into a diatribe about Socialism. Sadly, our elected officials don't do much better, hence the failure to move these issues forward. By the same token, Obama has failed to deliver on many of the things he promised and that has cost him a lot of support. As to the reduced political content here, I would point to a couple of things: 1. The growth of alternative opportunities (Political websites, Facebook, etc) such that there are many more (and some would say more appropriate) places to voice your opinions about politics. 2. The devisive nature of political discussion in general - it's hard to keep the debate reasonable and stick to facts as opposed to feelings. Over the years, many of us have met each other, so we're not just anonymous people flaming in some chatroom or on some website - I think that keeps people from wanting to publicly hurt someone's feelings and is probably a good thing. Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 13:46:36 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC This may be a world-wide phenomenon. Here in Canada, they all seem the same too. Often it's not a case of voting for the best person, but for the least-bad person - if you can remember their names. I really think they're all the same person, and that that person is just a shill for big business. I also think that, the way things are going, with the growing ranks of unemployed or underemployed people and the growing gap between rich and poor, and let's add the fact that the boomer generation is all getting old at the same time, that there IS going to be a revolution one of these days, and it's not going to be pretty. What, me? Paranoid? I agree that we need more angry people and we all need to ask more questions and demand real answers to those questions. More often than not, you get a non-answer consisting of nothing but "messaging." ________________________________ From: Anita G To: Catherine McKay Cc: Lieve Reckers ; jonipeople LIST Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 12:31:36 PM Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Over here in the UK, I find it hard these days to distinguish between one political party and another. I found myself just the other day feeling quite nostalgic for the days of Margaret Thatcher when I clearly knew who my 'enemy' was. These days seem (to me) to be of centre ground politics with lots of pale imitations with no real political will. On BBC news last week, Gordon Brown appeared in a blue tie (he is Labour, colour red for those who may not know) and David Cameron in red (Tory, blue)! Just sums it all up for me. I long for lots more angry young people out there making loads of angry noise about the state of things. Maybe I'd get out of my own comfortable middle class position and get back on the streets myself again! Anita __________________________________________________________________ Get the name you've always wanted @ymail.com or @rocketmail.com! Go to http://ca.promos.yahoo.com/jacko/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 13:47:57 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) Let me write you a cheque to cover that, Paz. Yeah, that's right. I said cheque. As in, it's in the mail. ________________________________ From: Michael Paz To: Les Irvin Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 1:58:39 PM Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) I knew it!!! He ran off with the Sue Cameron woman that was running the SCAM thingy! Those wascals. I volunteer to go hunt them down in Central America. Paz Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Jan 26, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Les Irvin wrote: > Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, > you always have to watch the quiet ones. You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 16:51:56 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) LMAO!!! Just send me your platinum Amex card. I will keep it to expenses only. You know martinis and such Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Jan 26, 2010, at 3:47 PM, Catherine McKay wrote: Let me write you a cheque to cover that, Paz. Yeah, that's right. I said cheque. As in, it's in the mail. From: Michael Paz To: Les Irvin Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 1:58:39 PM Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) I knew it!!! He ran off with the Sue Cameron woman that was running the SCAM thingy! Those wascals. I volunteer to go hunt them down in Central America. Paz Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Jan 26, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Les Irvin wrote: > Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, > you always have to watch the quiet ones. You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. The new Internet Explorer. 8 - Faster, safer, easier. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 16:28:01 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) hell no, he's been hanging with me in Winnipeg.. first of all, because Colorado keeps (ahem) SHARING their weather with us. and it makes Les feel right at home..I always suspected he was secretly a Canadian anyway :PP secondly, Les Irvin is also trying to find a suitable venue for a Joni Fest here , at long last. He has even offered to pay for the entire thing, for everyone. Isnt he just the MOST generous, wonderful sweetheart of the list? Mags - --- On Tue, 1/26/10, Michael Paz wrote: From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) To: "Les Irvin" Cc: joni@smoe.org Received: Tuesday, January 26, 2010, 1:58 PM I knew it!!! He ran off with the Sue Cameron woman that was running the SCAM thingy! Those wascals. I volunteer to go hunt them down in Central America. Paz Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com On Jan 26, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Les Irvin wrote: > Obviously I was cracking a joke...then again, > you always have to watch the quiet ones. You guys talkin' about me? Sorry, Internet access is spotting down here in at my new beach house down here in Ecuador. __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 16:37:56 -0800 (PST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) It's really amazing how far $5 goes these days. Heh-heh. ________________________________ From: Mags To: Les Irvin ; Michael Paz Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, January 26, 2010 7:28:01 PM Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell.com njc (believe it or not) hell no, he's been hanging with me in Winnipeg.. first of all, because Colorado keeps (ahem) SHARING their weather with us. and it makes Les feel right at home..I always suspected he was secretly a Canadian anyway :PP secondly, Les Irvin is also trying to find a suitable venue for a Joni Fest here , at long last. He has even offered to pay for the entire thing, for everyone. Isnt he just the MOST generous, wonderful sweetheart of the list? Mags __________________________________________________________________ Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 17:55:43 -0800 (PST) From: Mags Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Im with you Lieve, I enjoy reading some discussions but it is very challenging when things get angry fast. I wonder what the solution to that is. Ive been thinking about this idea a lot today (ha inbetween tasks at work of course :) and Id also love to hear about other countries, not necessarily politics, but perhaps what you like about your country, like a bit of a pitch for those of us who havent been there. Hopefully this doesnt sound too corny. I havent had a lot of time these many months to be as engaged or involved on this list or politics, but I have to say how heartbreaking it was for me to hear that Obama was sending many many more troops over to Afghanistan. Also, I was shocked to see that Mass had voted Republican. That said, I have no idea how the voting works (see above comment as to my lack of time to learn about such things). life is turned upsidedown. But today is a good day, and I am deeply thankful for that. And Paz, I want a Cosmo okay? or a glass of that champagne that Jimmy likes....Veuve something or other lol! Pretty high class girl eh .. you betcha.. Mags, wishing I could bottle this day of respite .. :) - --- On Tue, 1/26/10, Lieve Reckers wrote: From: Lieve Reckers Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC To: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com, "Catherine McKay" Cc: "jonipeople LIST" Received: Tuesday, January 26, 2010, 4:16 PM Hi Bob! You make some interesting points. If you feel like it, I'd be interested to hear about all those things where Obama has failed to deliver.. I could guess that would include the (non) closure of Guantanamo and the ongoing war in Afghanistan (both of which I think are so difficult that I can understand that he has not concluded them yet). Is that what you had in mind, or anything else? As to your 2 points regarding political discussions here on the list, I totally agree. I am certainly not missing political rants or personal attacks, but only, as I said, some intelligent exchanges of information or personal experience! All the best, Lieve ________________________________ From: "Bob.Muller@Fluor.com" To: Catherine McKay Cc: jonipeople LIST ; Lieve Reckers Sent: Tue, 26 January, 2010 19:57:43 Subject: Re: I thought I'd never say this! NJC Probably a combination of all of the above things, Catherine - Brown of course had his infamous Cosmo shot, and American voters definitely seem to sway towards the pretty and the celebrity, the surface rather than the substance. America seems to have lost a lot of its critical thinking skills, and people don't seem to want to make the effort to research, check a variety of sources, and decide for themselves, not when its so much easier for ONE source to tell you everything you need to know. (Or as Rush Limbaugh says, "let me do your thinking for you") This laziness, both in terms of research and in terms of public involvement applies to members of both parties. I've tried to have dialogue with co-workers about health care and it instantly slides into a diatribe about Socialism. Sadly, our elected officials don't do much better, hence the failure to move these issues forward. By the same token, Obama has failed to deliver on many of the things he promised and that has cost him a lot of support. As to the reduced political content here, I would point to a couple of things: 1. The growth of alternative opportunities (Political websites, Facebook, etc) such that there are many more (and some would say more appropriate) places to voice your opinions about politics. 2. The devisive nature of political discussion in general - it's hard to keep the debate reasonable and stick to facts as opposed to feelings. Over the years, many of us have met each other, so we're not just anonymous people flaming in some chatroom or on some website - I think that keeps people from wanting to publicly hurt someone's feelings and is probably a good thing. Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2010 #28 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------