From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2009 #112 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, April 8 2009 Volume 2009 : Number 112 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- More Tracy and Joni [Oddmund Kaarevik ] Re: Tin Angel [T Peckham ] Re: WTRF - Moon at the Window [T Peckham ] Remastered boxes from the Beatles soon, njc ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: Remastered boxes from the Beatles soon, njc ["Randy Remote" ] re: Tin Angel ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] nuclear arms, njc [Laura Stanley ] RE: nuclear arms, njc ["anon anon " ] Fwd: nuclear arms/now guns, njc [kjhsf@aol.com] re: Tin Angel [Mags ] Tin Angel [Rian Afriadi ] RE: nuclear arms, njc [Rian Afriadi ] RE: Fwd: nuclear arms/now guns, njc ["anon anon " ] RE: Tin Angel ["anon anon " ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:45:01 +0200 From: Oddmund Kaarevik Subject: More Tracy and Joni You drive a hard bargain Bob ! But I do appreciate your response. Always good to know someone is actually reading what I wrote. But Okay. You're right about what you say, that none of Tracy's album can match her debut. And if you still haven't please watch this (especially Tracy's smile at the end of the song. I'm sure it could end wars) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rZbvi6Tj6E (Tracy saluting Nelson Mandela on his birthday in 1988, if I remember correctly he was then still in prison) Tracy's debut album - oh gosh - I think I've listened to it over 200 times. I don't know. Fast Car is for me one of those magical songs, I've never get bored of listening to. The album as a whole has such a nerve, such great melodies and not to mention her great voice. I think this is the case of many debutalbums and artists making their debut. Their innoncence and their strength are often so strong and convincing, to a much stronger degree than they're even aware of themselves. I've heard Tracy isn't that pleased with her debut, which so many of us love. Partly because she was so nervous during the sessions, you can in fact hear her voice shiver. Since this is Joni Mitchell discussion list - I would like to mention Joni to. Unlike Tracy - Joni didn't start out with her peak album. I know many of you love Songs of a seagull (but was that really her frist? I mean there are lots of other songs produced in the prelimunary years) But she just continued to evolve and experiment and through that climb even greater heights. For me Ladies is a album that stands out, more and more through the years. Blue was my best friend during my tumultous early 20's. Hejira is pure magic. I don't love all her albums. I think what Azeem wrote about WTRF is true. It's not over all a great ablum - as you can say of some of Tracy's follow up albums to her debut. But that doesn't mean they're not worthwhile. As Bob said Chines Cafee is as good as it gets. Love the song. Love the lyrics. Love Jonis voice. As for Tracy I don't love all songs on New Beginning : But track 11 I'm ready is for me an everlasting hymn. Pure magic. Let the river flow over me. And Bob, if she hadn't released this, this song would never come. As with Joni if she hadn't released WTRF we wouldn't have no Love or no Chinese Cafee and Chaka Khan would not do her great cover of Ladies man. And you would not have your good friend when you moved to a new place. I sometimes wish we on this list could be a bit less harsh in our critizism. We are all full of nostalgia in some manner that makes us blind to our own very subjectie opnions. And yes, I'm the first to admit I am a sensitive soul. But I think for the respect of the artists we cherish and love, we should also let them make mistakes - try to be a bit openhearted. For if we are not. If everyone was afraid to finish anything in fear of being disliked or critiziced - we would have no new music , no new art something that would make me dreadfully disappointed. Love and peace Oddmund, Norway On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 1:17 AM, Bob Muller wrote: > > Thanks Oddmund, Tracy has already played with so many giants, as she said > there are not many left for her to pick from. Glad she mentioned Joni. > The new song you sent is just another reminder that she is not likely to > scale the heights she climbed with her debut album anytime soon. Throwaway > melody, banal lyrics. > I do love her though and she is way talented, and seems like a real sweet > and kind person. > > Bob > > NP: Robin Adler, "Down To You" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 03:56:52 -0500 From: T Peckham Subject: Re: Tin Angel Very interesting discussions about *Wild Things Run Fast* and "Tin Angel." I'm surprised by the somewhat polarized opinions of WTRF, and especiallly of "Chinese Cafe/Unchained Melody." I'm in the "love it" camp on "Chinese Cafe." Knowing very little of Joni's history at the time, in awe of her in all respects---as a musician and songwriter, but just as important, as a woman leading exactly the kind of life I still thought I was going to lead---I was almost shocked to hear her describing such mundane activities as hanging out listening to a juke box in a smalltown cafe. Joni "middle class" and "middle aged"? Looking like her mother did? Impossible! I remember wondering about the lines "My child's a stranger/I bore her/But I could not raise her"---and in my still somewhat immature and very naive 26-yr.-old mind, I took that to mean that the narrator's teenage child was *bored with her*, had *become* a stranger to her, and was rebelling so mightily that the mother *couldn't* raise her anymore. (I had decided, as with "Little Green," that Joni was describing characters utterly separate from herself.) I should have known better by her absolutely aching (and totally resigned) reading of "Ah, nothing lasts for long/Nothing lasts for long/Nothing lasts for long . . ." and then the coda, "Time goes/Where does the time go/I wonder where the time goes . . . " (With a tip of the fedora to Sandy Denny). Even at my age, I *got* that. I also thought her interweaving of "Unchained Melody" (which I knew only as a Righteous Brothers song) was ingenious and seamless. Not every song on the album means as much to me as that one, but for my money, "Moon at the Window" and "Man to Man" rank up there with her best songs. (I must confess that I haven't heard the record in its entirety in about 20 years, as I have only the original album and no current means to convert it to disc, and used cd copies start at $30 at amazon and the like. [Hel*lo*, reissue it!!] ). Still, I recall that I felt then as I do now that musically--and to a great extent, lyrically--it was much more interesting (and listenable) to me than either *Dog* or *Chalkmark*. (Just my opinion). Mags---very thoughtful post. (You're NOT a "sentimental sap" for loving *Chinese Cafe*.) ;-) I've always loved the starkness and somewhat deceptive simplicity of "Tin Angel." Probably my favorite song on *Clouds*, now that I think about it---and a pretty gutsy choice to open an album with, particularly one's sophomore effort. I never pondered the deeper or dual meaning of the lyric---back then I was often more intent on figuring out how to play and sing stuff; it was a sad-sounding love song, I was around 16 when I first heard it---'nuff sed! (And to this day, I'm often stunningly tone-deaf to metaphor.) (Gad, I'm embarrassed to admit that, HERE of all places!) At any rate, since you mention *Girls Like Us*, here's Sheila Weller's take on the song: "They [Blues Project/Seatrain drummer Roy Blumenfeld] frequented the Tin Angel (the sad song she wrote about finding love "in a Bleecker Street Cafe," which she titled "Tin Angel," is likely about Roy." Her sources include her interviews w/Blumenfeld and bandmate Al Kooper's autobiography. The link is to a Blues Project promo pic of the time. Based on more recent photos of Roy, I think he's the second one from the left in this pic. (Correction welcomed). T http://www.wolfgangsvault.com/dt/the-blues-project-promo-print/ZZZ011062-PP.html On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 6:49 PM, Mags wrote: > thanks to all concerned for the invitation to revisit Wild Things Run Fast > as > well as the song, Tin Angel. > > WTRF: fwiw, I love Chinese Cafe. speaks to the sentimental sap within ;-) > > Tin Angel: It's been a while since Ive listened to Clouds. Tin Angel is a > gorgeous, sad song. Only four years after Joni's baby girl was > relinquished, > tied in with the heart break of failed relationships, marriage and > otherwise. > No wonder she sounds, not only sad, but reluctant as hell to get involved > again. > > a few thoughts scribbled down on a piece of paper: > > 'reflections' of love's memories...I thought this might be in reference to > photographs but then the next stanza talks about letters. Perhaps both? > > Maple leaves: signifier of Canada, which she likes to do in other songs too > (javex bleach bottles etc) > > Bleeker street cafe ... Bleaker/bleak? the tone of the song certainly is > bleak. As is the nature of the quandry she's in.. > > minor chords: represents past hurts? fear of future ones (knowing that's > coming anyway, due to her experiences) > > major chords, hmm hopefullness...she might take a chance, but she sure if > reluctant all the same. > > Mia, I like your idea about Chuck Mitchell and whether or not he wanted to > raise Joni's child in the face of their musical future. Having just read > Girls > Like Us, there are a few different interpretations as to how that went > down. I > believe Joni though, he wasnt interested. For Joni, a time of great > confusion. > Not an easy decision for her to make either way, there's hell to pay. > > One thing that GLU describes very well is the climate within which she > became > pregnant. Hard to believe that this is the way it was. > > Major complications no matter which way she turned. Life long > repercussions, > that we can hear in many of her songs, as well as stories told, then and > now. > Close friends were witness to the pain, and thankfully, Joni had at least > somewhere to try and lay that down in her songs. Some of her friends said > that > the pain of her losing her baby stayed with her throughout her life. Joni > is a > woman who feels her life deeply as she has demonstrated time and time > again. > > I agree, Girls Like Us may be seen as a socialogical/feminist perspective > of > what it was like to be a woman in the music industry when all three women > were > starting out. Again, complications all round. > > GLU, well worth the read. I think I gained a deeper understanding vis a > vis > the struggle that Joni has faced in her life. It is very interesting to > read > about her roots on the prairie, the vast landscape upon which she grew, and > yet, she felt so claustrophobic and was driven by her urge for going. > > Just a few thoughts. > > Mags > > > > > > > > > > > > - -- Some things in life it just gets too late to learn . . . --Bob Dylan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 04:18:16 -0500 From: T Peckham Subject: Re: WTRF - Moon at the Window A belated thank you very much for this! T On Sat, Apr 4, 2009 at 12:06 PM, mia _ wrote: > I was unsuccessful in finding the acoustic version of Moon at the Window > (from > the Much Music Show in Toronto), but here is a similar video with just the > sound of Joni playing and singing. It's great, but not quite as lively as > the > version I've previously seen: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5U8CA-jXjM > > Mia > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Rediscover Hotmail.: Get quick friend updates right in your inbox. > > http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover_Upda > tes1_042009 > - -- Some things in life it just gets too late to learn . . . --Bob Dylan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 2009 15:46:05 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Remastered boxes from the Beatles soon, njc http://www.thebeatles.com/core/home/ On the horizon: * a Rock Band video game of Beatles songs * a 16-CD stereo box set * a big mono box set If I'm reading correctly, all of this "product" will be released on 9 September, 2009. Jim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 17:00:17 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: More Tracy and Joni Thanks for your thoughts, Oddmund - and yes, I read everything that you and everyone writes here, as most of us do. Tracy's problem, if you want to call it that, was that she honed her skills on the streets and in small clubs for awhile, and when she made that first album she had a backlog of great songs - undoubtably she discarded many along the way that weren't as strong as the ones she went with. Unfortunately she didn't have that luxury after the first album, especially with the fact that it was a hit and the record company wanted a follow-up as soon as they could get it, to strike while the iron was hot so to speak. That being said, it was pretty astonishing that Crossroads had as many good songs on it as it did - I remember buying it the day it came out based on the strength of her debut and not being that disappointed with it. After that she went downhill pretty quickly - nothing on Matters Of The Heart resonated with me, and I only picked up New Beginnings when I found it on sale. If I recall correctly, "Give Me One Reason", the song that sparked that album, was an older one from her early days that she resurrected - not a good sign. I picked up Telling Stories and thought it was a real stinker and that was the end of my Tracy Chapman run. But that first album & a half will always remain on my playlist. And you're right in saying that Joni also had LOTS of songs when she recorded STAS and also her unreleased album recorded with the Siegel-Schwall Band. Through the course of her first three albums, she seemed to have filtered what she considered her best songs (Urge For Going notwithstanding) along with songs she was composing at the time. Unlike Tracy Chapman, Joni challenged herself to bust out of the 'singer-songwriter' pattern and explore new styles, genres, tunings, etc. and in so doing maintained an upward trajectory in her career that Tracy has not been able to match. Hopefully that doesn't come off as being harsh, just my honest observations. I'm glad that Tracy's work resonates with you Oddmund! I've never seen Tracy live but would certainly do so if the opportunity presented itself in a venue that would work for me. In the meantime, I've got tix to Jonatha Brooke Wednesday and k.d. lang Thursday, so lots of live music coming my way soon. Bob NP: Traffic, "Medicated Goo" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 22:33:24 +0100 From: gerard mclaughlin Subject: Re: Tin Angel For me its a putting away your toys song. Joni is waking up to life away from home and from the romantic fantasies of adolescence. I figure she has had one or two boyfriends and is realising its not all its cracked up to be. Maybe she'd had her king in her tenement castle by then I dont know but certainly the painful melody and the sparseness of the opening tells me she means buisness and wants to almost warn us that its not christmas, all this posessive coupling. Its really a good growing up song. Ive always loved it and love that she opens the album up with it.Its the sort of song sung by the sort of person Joni later addresses in The Silky Veils of Ardor. I love it. I also really like the two trips to Bleeker Street she has taken me on In a Bleeker Street cafe I found someone to love today. I get to sit at another table and watch her jotting down her notes , maybe sketching him . She gets to find those chords and lose the past and move into the now and become more and more of who she is.,,, She makes it all so real, so exquisitely vivid.... Later on Theres a gypsy down in Bleeker Street, I went in to see her as a kind of joke She lit a candle for my love luck and eighteen bucks went up in smoke!! I love that with age and experience she can see and share the humour of it all with us in the much more highly evolved Song for Sharon which for all the years it has on Tin Angel is still tinged with a sense of unfulfillment. Later on the wild thing is still running fast and... why do we dream flat tyres when we dream flat tyres when we dream flat tyres. Which reminds me I have to go get my bicycle tyres pumped up or I wont be going anywhere. On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Laura Stanley wrote: > Hi Monika, > > I love the song. It has always been one of my favorites. I wonder what > particular "angel made of tin" she was talking about? The crying sound of > the song and the idea of throw away love replaced with new love captivates > me. > > I have thrown away letters and things from former loves and felt the > sentiments of the song... letting go with a sorrow of a sort in the reserved > joy of somebody new. I don't know if it is possible to ever really let go > completely though. "Reflections of loves memory," the memorabilia, can be > thrown away but the memories and mark on one's heart are still there. > > Tin is cheap, and I get the feeling Joni is saying love is cheap through > the song. Throw away the old, and the new could be thrown away at some > point too. The tin angel guy seems to have been thrown away or thrown away > love in the past too given his sorrowful disposition. > > The concept of the prince is gone for both of them. He doesn't have to > be that, and she doesn't have to expect that. So, on some level it is > coming into the reality of tarnishing of love, losing the innocent childhood > idea of love. > > Loving is always taking a chance. The hope in the song comes in her > taking this chance again. > > Love, > Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 13:49:05 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: Remastered boxes from the Beatles soon, njc From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" > http://www.thebeatles.com/core/home/ > > On the horizon: > * a Rock Band video game of Beatles songs > * a 16-CD stereo box set > * a big mono box set > > If I'm reading correctly, all of this "product" will be released on 9 > September, 2009. That's 9-9-09....number 9, number 9.... The CDs will be released individually on that day, too: "Each of the CDs is packaged with replicated original UK album art, including expanded booklets containing original and newly written liner notes and rare photos. For a limited period, each CD will also be embedded with a brief documentary film about the album." [in Quicktime format, funny after their big dispute with Apple Computers].... the full story: http://www.thebeatles.com/core/news/ I'm glad they are remastering them but not remixing as they did with Let It Be Naked and Yellow Sub Soundtrack-since they can't seem to get the remixing right. This is good news indeed, and long overdue, although I will have to sell my car to buy all this shit. RR ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 17:39:43 -0400 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: More Tracy and Joni all this talk about Tracy reminded me of a funny story about her. A member a of the Neville clan told me that they were standing around backstage at some big fundraiser and it was John Goodman and Aaron and Art Neville and their wives and a few other folks. Apparently Tracy was brought in and the story goes that Aaron went over to talk to her and she shrugged him off which was pretty much embarrasing to everyone involved. Goodman was furious as he is a huge fan of the Nevilles. So as the story was related to me, Goodman started singing to the tune of "Fast Car" "I've got sexual problems I'm not pretty and my hairs fucked up" There might have been a couple other lines but that is all I can remember. I thought it was funny though cause I have spent time around Mr. Goodman when he was heavily medicated. Paz P.S. I have also heard my pal Warren Haynes (currently in SF rehearsing for the Dead tour) covering Tracy Chapman and it was awesome. On Apr 7, 2009, at 5:00 PM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: Thanks for your thoughts, Oddmund - and yes, I read everything that you and everyone writes here, as most of us do. Tracy's problem, if you want to call it that, was that she honed her skills on the streets and in small clubs for awhile, and when she made that first album she had a backlog of great songs - undoubtably she discarded many along the way that weren't as strong as the ones she went with. Unfortunately she didn't have that luxury after the first album, especially with the fact that it was a hit and the record company wanted a follow-up as soon as they could get it, to strike while the iron was hot so to speak. That being said, it was pretty astonishing that Crossroads had as many good songs on it as it did - I remember buying it the day it came out based on the strength of her debut and not being that disappointed with it. After that she went downhill pretty quickly - nothing on Matters Of The Heart resonated with me, and I only picked up New Beginnings when I found it on sale. If I recall correctly, "Give Me One Reason", the song that sparked that album, was an older one from her early days that she resurrected - not a good sign. I picked up Telling Stories and thought it was a real stinker and that was the end of my Tracy Chapman run. But that first album & a half will always remain on my playlist. And you're right in saying that Joni also had LOTS of songs when she recorded STAS and also her unreleased album recorded with the Siegel-Schwall Band. Through the course of her first three albums, she seemed to have filtered what she considered her best songs (Urge For Going notwithstanding) along with songs she was composing at the time. Unlike Tracy Chapman, Joni challenged herself to bust out of the 'singer-songwriter' pattern and explore new styles, genres, tunings, etc. and in so doing maintained an upward trajectory in her career that Tracy has not been able to match. Hopefully that doesn't come off as being harsh, just my honest observations. I'm glad that Tracy's work resonates with you Oddmund! I've never seen Tracy live but would certainly do so if the opportunity presented itself in a venue that would work for me. In the meantime, I've got tix to Jonatha Brooke Wednesday and k.d. lang Thursday, so lots of live music coming my way soon. Bob NP: Traffic, "Medicated Goo" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Paz michael@thepazgroup.com Tour Manager Preservation Hall Jazz Band http://www.preservationhall.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 2009 20:13:01 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: re: Tin Angel >Bleeker street cafe ... Bleaker/bleak? the tone of the song certainly is bleak. As is the nature of the quandry she's in..> Yeah, that could be, Mags. It could be one of Joni's famous double meanings. I guess you probably know that Bleeker Street is a real place: http://www.mccullagh.org/db9/1ds-14/greenwich-village-bleeker-street.jpg It's in a section of NYC called Greenwich Village... And it's next to Chelsea. http://www.sublet.com/images/map%20ny.gif I didn't know that "Tin Angel" uses a modal form. This is interesting stuff. Thanks to everyone who chimed in. Jim L'Hommedieu Dayton, OH USA ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 19:21:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Laura Stanley Subject: nuclear arms, njc Hi, What do you all think of Obama wanting nuclear arms destroyed? Do you think all should be destroyed? I'm of the opinion we should keep some of them incase we need them to defend our planet from who knows what is out there in space... like astroids, etc. What is your opinion? Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 02:47:03 +0000 From: "anon anon " Subject: RE: nuclear arms, njc my anti nuke activist friend would be thrilled! - -----Original Message----- Date: Tuesday, April 07, 2009 10:27:08 pm To: joni@smoe.org From: Laura Stanley Subject: nuclear arms, njc Hi, What do you all think of Obama wanting nuclear arms destroyed? Do you think all should be destroyed? I'm of the opinion we should keep some of them incase we need them to defend our planet from who knows what is out there in space... like astroids, etc. What is your opinion? Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 2009 22:58:43 -0400 From: kjhsf@aol.com Subject: Fwd: nuclear arms/now guns, njc - -----Original Message----- From: kjhsf@aol.com To: sillyseabird@yahoo.com Sent: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:57 pm Subject: Re: nuclear arms/now guns, njc NOTHING ABOUT THE NUCLEAR ARMS ISSUE IS AS DISTURBING AS THE RATE IN WHICH AMERICANS ARE HORDING GUNS AND AMMO IN REACTION TO THE OBAMA PRESIDENCY.? I LISTENED TO A REPORT ON NPR TODAY WHICH SAID THAT AMMO SALES ARE UP 31% BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE SO AFRAID THAT OBAMA IS GOING TO TAKE AWAY THEIR GUNS.?? A TRULY FRIGHTENING SEGMENT OF SOCIETY... THEN, THIS EVENING, NEWS AND (UNBELIEVABLY) FOOTAGE OF A MOTHER SHOOTING HER 20 YEAR OLD SON IN THE BACK OF THE HEAD BEFORE TAKING HER OWN LIFE AT THE SHOOTIN' RANGE. WE JUST LUUUUUUV OUR GUNS, DON'T WE? BLAME TAKING AIM, KEN (I THINK THIS IS MY FIRST "POLITICAL" POST) - -----Original Message----- From: Laura Stanley To: joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:21 pm Subject: nuclear arms, njc Hi, What do you all think of Obama wanting nuclear arms destroyed? Do you think all should be destroyed? I'm of the opinion we should keep some of them incase we need them to defend our planet from who knows what is out there in space... like astroids, etc. What is your opinion? Love, Laura The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 20:14:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags Subject: re: Tin Angel thanks for the heads up on that one Lama. more to say, when i have some time. Mags - --- On Tue, 4/7/09, Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: From: Jim L'Hommedieu Subject: re: Tin Angel To: "Mags" , joni@smoe.org Received: Tuesday, April 7, 2009, 8:13 PM >Bleeker street cafe ... Bleaker/bleak? the tone of the song certainly is bleak. As is the nature of the quandry she's in..> Yeah, that could be, Mags. It could be one of Joni's famous double meanings. I guess you probably know that Bleeker Street is a real place: http://www.mccullagh.org/db9/1ds-14/greenwich-village-bleeker-street.jpg It's in a section of NYC called Greenwich Village... And it's next to Chelsea. http://www.sublet.com/images/map%20ny.gif I didn't know that "Tin Angel" uses a modal form. This is interesting stuff. Thanks to everyone who chimed in. Jim L'Hommedieu Dayton, OH USA __________________________________________________________________ Connect with friends from any web browser - no download required. Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger for the Web BETA at http://ca.messenger.yahoo.com/webmessengerpromo.php ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 21:23:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Tin Angel Err... This is one of my least played Joni track... Rian going to vote tomorrow ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 21:32:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: RE: nuclear arms, njc Dr Laura wrote : I'm of the opinion we should keep some of them in case we need them to defend our planet from who knows what is out there in space... like astroids, etc >>> Serious. Laura. At first I thought you're going to mention "alien" Rian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 04:34:43 +0000 From: "anon anon " Subject: RE: Fwd: nuclear arms/now guns, njc what's it all about alfie? its a strange, crazy, mysterious world... - -----Original Message----- Date: Tuesday, April 07, 2009 11:00:08 pm To: joni@smoe.org From: kjhsf@aol.com Subject: Fwd: nuclear arms/now guns, njc - -----Original Message----- From: kjhsf@aol.com To: sillyseabird@yahoo.com Sent: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:57 pm Subject: Re: nuclear arms/now guns, njc NOTHING ABOUT THE NUCLEAR ARMS ISSUE IS AS DISTURBING AS THE RATE IN WHICH AMERICANS ARE HORDING GUNS AND AMMO IN REACTION TO THE OBAMA PRESIDENCY.? I LISTENED TO A REPORT ON NPR TODAY WHICH SAID THAT AMMO SALES ARE UP 31% BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE SO AFRAID THAT OBAMA IS GOING TO TAKE AWAY THEIR GUNS.?? A TRULY FRIGHTENING SEGMENT OF SOCIETY... THEN, THIS EVENING, NEWS AND (UNBELIEVABLY) FOOTAGE OF A MOTHER SHOOTING HER 20 YEAR OLD SON IN THE BACK OF THE HEAD BEFORE TAKING HER OWN LIFE AT THE SHOOTIN' RANGE. WE JUST LUUUUUUV OUR GUNS, DON'T WE? BLAME TAKING AIM, KEN (I THINK THIS IS MY FIRST "POLITICAL" POST) - -----Original Message----- From: Laura Stanley To: joni@smoe.org Sent: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:21 pm Subject: nuclear arms, njc Hi, What do you all think of Obama wanting nuclear arms destroyed? Do you think all should be destroyed? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 04:39:06 +0000 From: "anon anon " Subject: RE: Tin Angel clouds is an underrated work of art imo. there are some real gems on that album... - -----Original Message----- Date: Wednesday, April 08, 2009 12:30:13 am To: joni@smoe.org From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Tin Angel Err... This is one of my least played Joni track... Rian going to vote tomorrow ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2009 #112 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------