From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2008 #183 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Friday, August 29 2008 Volume 2008 : Number 183 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Fest reports ["Marion Leffler" ] Re: Attn NYers - Kay Ashley tonight - NJC [Laura Stanley ] River [do9eatdo9@yahoo.com] Re: River [Jerry Notaro ] raindance ["Mike Pritchard" ] Re: River ["Mark Angelo" ] Re: River ["Mark Angelo" ] Thanks a heap ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: cookbook and privacy concerns ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Thanks a heap [Jerry Notaro ] My dreams with the seagulls fly ....travelling update njc [rosemjoy@aol.c] Re: njc, Neil's comin' around again [camus8887@aol.com] Re: My dreams with the seagulls fly ....travelling update njc ["gene" ] Re: Joni fest UK 2008 ["Randy Remote" ] Re: cookbook and privacy concerns [Moni Kellermann ] RE: cookbook and privacy concerns ["Kate Bennett" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 12:12:18 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: Fest reports Hi everybody, well, I used up all my hankies drying my tears of regret for not having been able to go to the fest and am finally ready to thank everybody who took the trouble to report to the list. Sounds like you all had a wonderful time! And reading the reports I feel I know you better now though I wasn't there. I hope that somebody will load up pictures and maybe even music, that would be so great! Another matter: in some replies to Marian, her name was spelled Marion. That's alright with me but if you would like a cookbook file make sure you mail the right Marian (Russell) since I don't have it. Love to you all, Marion in Sweden ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 05:34:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Laura Stanley Subject: Re: Attn NYers - Kay Ashley tonight - NJC A Molson Aler wrote: I'll be with you in spirit. You can buy me a virtual beer! Hi Cat, Hmmm... wonder if I'd break my sobriety if I joined you? Love, Diamond Bear ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 14:03:21 +0200 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: jonifest Hi Thanks to all involved for making it a great experience on all levels. From a musical standpoint, I would highly recommend the upcoming dvd for the performances by Jeff, Christina and Dave & Robin. Chair in the Sky, Talk to Me and Dog Eat Dog stick in my ear among the 30 Joni songs this husband & wife duo played. As someone pointed out, Robin might actually be Joni is disguise. Jeff is incredible, he has over 100 original songs under belt. Great poetry, beautiful harmonies, catchy tunes and moving original voice. I'm afraid the dvd is all we're ever gonna get for posterity and i might add what a shame. Christina is a terrific natural singer. I got the 2 cds she & Oddmund released of all the < unreleased > Joni songs. Hope she carries on in her singing career. Too bad i missed Garrett's late night performance. And a big thanks to Barry for being such a talented musician and accompanist. To complement Bene's post and for anybody else wondering who is < World's second-best song writer > : at least in my book, John Hiatt and David Crosby. Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 22:09:30 +0700 From: do9eatdo9@yahoo.com Subject: River Did Joni write River as a christmas song? I mean, did she really plan "oh, i gotta make a christmas song"? I doubt she did because, imo, the song is not about christmas (but the setting was during christmast time). Rian NP. A case of you (track 9) (guess what track 8 is) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 11:26:05 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: River No, that is part of the genius of the song. Did you know that Sarah McLachlan's version of River was the #1 selling Christmas song last year? Jerry NP: Maureen McGovern - I Could Have Been a Sailor > Did Joni write River as a christmas song? I mean, did she really plan "oh, i > gotta make a christmas song"? > > I doubt she did because, imo, the song is not about christmas (but the setting > was during christmast time). > > Rian > NP. A case of you (track 9) (guess what track 8 is) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:37:25 +0200 From: "Mike Pritchard" Subject: raindance Did anyone thank Garret yet for the resounding success with his raindance? SHAME ON YOU ALL!! mike NP Here I Dreamt I Was An Architect - Decemberists NPIMH Garret - The Fields of Athenry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 12:38:05 -0400 From: "Mark Angelo" Subject: Re: River It's not a Christmas song, but she did incorporate elements of "Jingle Bells", deliberately and probably the first instance of it played in a wistful manner, as the song is one of remorse and she wanted to contrast what one "should" be feeling during that season, and the sadness she personally was experiencing at that moment. It has been covered and included on innumerable Christmas albums however, but I don't believe it was written as a Christmas song, anymore than the references in "Song For Sharon" or "Facelift" make them Christmas songs. - -- - -Mark in Florida On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 11:09 AM, wrote: > Did Joni write River as a christmas song? I mean, did she really plan "oh, > i gotta make a christmas song"? > > I doubt she did because, imo, the song is not about christmas (but the > setting was during christmast time). > > Rian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 13:03:21 -0400 From: "Mark Angelo" Subject: Re: River "Song for Sharon" ... sorry I meant "Chinese Cafe"..."Christmas is sparkling out on Carol's lawn" getting Carol & Sharon confused I guess... On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 12:38 PM, Mark Angelo wrote in part: > I don't believe it (River) was written as a Christmas song, anymore than > the references in "Song For Sharon" or "Facelift" make them Christmas songs. > - -- - -Mark in Florida ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 10:41:47 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Thanks a heap Russ, I have never seen the cookbook & know little about it other than what I've read here. I think the primary issue is that it had bios about some of the contributors in it. It sounds as if this book was intended to be shared among friends. Somehow one of the friends sold it or gave it away & it ended up in a bookstore & then on ebay. A good analogy would be if you had some personal letters you wrote to a loved one & perhaps copied & made a nice compliation of the copies to share with your family & friends. Then you discovered they were being sold on ebay by someone you didn't know. I hope this helps to put this issue into a context that makes more sense to you & so you might begin to see why those who contributed might want this taken off the market. Kate >Congratulations to the Joni Taliban. Hope you are basking in some well earned self-righteous smuggitity. Sheesh! No love today, Russ< ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 10:52:44 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: cookbook and privacy concerns Moni, I'll try. There are gigantic ranges of comfort that people have about their privacy. For example, Joni wrote very personal songs. In interviews & concerts she would share much about her life with complete strangers. Much of her personal life is archived & accessible & will be for generations to come. I don't see any difference between that & what is shared on lists such as this. Some people don't feel comfortable sharing their personal thoughts while others, by nature of their personality or perhaps their profession, feel just fine. Hope this helps a bit. Kate >But as I have raised this topic at least twice before (hey, you can google it;) and I came up as about the only person sort of complaining about all this, I guess things won't change. What I ask myself is why hundreds of people here on this list do not care about their privacy. Maybe someone can enlighten me on this.< moni k. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 14:32:00 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Thanks a heap Somehow one of the friends sold it or gave it away & it > ended up in a bookstore & then on ebay. And not even as glamorous as that. She bought 2 copies at a flea market. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:14:27 -0400 From: rosemjoy@aol.com Subject: My dreams with the seagulls fly ....travelling update njc Just a quick update, as I? have limited?internet access... I am back in New Jersey where I belong:~) Virginia and Florida did not work out.....no jobs to be found. I found a roommate (Claudia) who I share an apartment with in Belmar (near E Street ;~), Hi Bob)?just 4 blocks from the beach and I'm loving it! The Bennies will soon be going home as summer's end approaches. I was able to catch Dylan at Convention Hall a few weeks ago... Gotta run...I miss yaw'll Rosie happy to be home in NJ Fly silly seabird No dreams can possess you No voices can blame you For sun on your wings My gentle relations Have names they must call me For loving the freedom Of all flying things My dreams with the seagulls fly Out of reach out of cry I came to the city And lived like old Crusoe On an island of noise In a cobblestone sea And the beaches were concrete And the stars paid a light bill And the blossoms hung false On their store window trees My dreams with the seagulls fly Out of reach out of cry Out of the city And down to the seaside To sun on my shoulders And wind in my hair But sandcastles crumble And hunger is human And humans are hungry For worlds they can't share My dreams with the seagulls fly Out of reach out of cry I call to a seagull Who dives to the waters And catches his silver-fine Dinner alone Crying where are the footprints That danced on these beaches And the hands that cast wishes That sunk like a stone My dreams with the seagulls fly Out of reach out of cry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:27:07 -0400 From: camus8887@aol.com Subject: Re: njc, Neil's comin' around again It was absolute grace to have been able to see and hear Neil Young perform solo back in 1999, up close, at a beautiful, intimate theater here in San Antonio. He's surely one of my FAVORITE mean ol' daddies and I loooove Neil Young!!!! He's soooo in tune to those in tune with real time and when I turn him on, I dare not touch those dials, avoiding all static or commercial interruptions (which seem to be interrupting me more and more these days)?and believe me, Neil Young turns me on?with bonfire-like flames?starting iup in my head, neck and?spine when?his music begins to spin, especially when he begins to play his guitar and harmonica, and then my heart really starts on fire.... ...and these's so much more. Jeannie - -----Original Message----- From: Victor Johnson To: Patti Parlette Cc: motitan75@yahoo.com; joni@smoe.org Sent: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 9:32 am Subject: Re: njc, Neil's comin' around again On Aug 19, 2008, at 10:15 PM, Patti Parlette wrote:? >? > Neil Young is pleased to announce pre-sale? > ticketing for his Fall 2008 Tour. You can buy tickets to select Neil? > Young shows before they go on sale to the public through? > http://www.neilyoung.com/ and these webpages:? >? ? Neil's skipping the south again...lame! I think he should schedule a date at the new ampitheatre in Alpharetta, or better yet at the Fox.? ? Victor? ? NP: Dave Matthews Band "Kit Kat Jam" (live at the Gorge)? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 12:36:17 -0700 From: "gene" Subject: Re: My dreams with the seagulls fly ....travelling update njc > My gentle relations > Have names they must call me > For loving the freedom > Of all flying things > My dreams with the seagulls fly > Out of reach out of cry these are the first lyrics that turned me unto joni. i loved them back then and i still love them now. thanks for sharing, gene "you don't beat the reaper by living longer----you beat the reaper by living well" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:50:20 -0400 From: Vince Subject: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? Joni toured with Dylan in fall 1998 and the internet was still new to me (I went online in late 97 or early 98) and about the first things I did an alta vista search on (I am going way back in time) were Samoyeds (my breed of dog) and Joni Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and the jmdl - I lurked forever because I was not cool enough to join or smart enough to figure out the hip lingo: NP, NPIMH, etc etc etc., but finally did join to get the Joni news and somewhere on jm.com is about the first thing i ever posted on line: my review of Joni in Chicago. I was so proud! anyway - what about you? Vince ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 16:02:12 -0400 From: "Mark Angelo" Subject: Re: My dreams with the seagulls fly ....travelling update njc Didn't you sell a lot of your belongings in preparation for the move? Are you OK now as far as basic furniture, kitchen utensils, etc...? It sounds from the message that your heart (and home) never really left NJ. These travels and journeys are never wasted time as we gain so much incredible perspective from them. "Where some have found their paradise, others just come to harm" Take Care - -- - -Mark in Florida On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 3:14 PM, wrote in part: > Just a quick update, as I? have limited?internet access... > > I am back in New Jersey where I belong:~) > > Virginia and Florida did not work out.....no jobs to be found. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 13:48:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? Sometime in the spring or summer of 1999. Like you, I did a search for Joni Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and jmdl.com. I didn't have a computer at home so I used to read the jmdl posts at work. I lurked a while before posting. After that, I didn't shut up for a while. Now I've simmered down a bit again. I still haven't figured out the acronyms but my brain just doesn't work that way - never has and never will. For me, it's usually faster to type a whole world than to think about the acronyms and usually can't figure out what they mean when they are used. - --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Vince wrote: Joni toured with Dylan in fall 1998 and the internet was still new to me (I went online in late 97 or early 98) and about the first things I did an alta vista search on (I am going way back in time) were Samoyeds (my breed of dog) and Joni Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and the jmdl - I lurked forever because I was not cool enough to join or smart enough to figure out the hip lingo: NP, NPIMH, etc etc etc., but finally did join to get the Joni news and somewhere on jm.com is about the first thing i ever posted on line: my review of Joni in Chicago. I was so proud! anyway - what about you? Vince __________________________________________________________________ Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 22:26:00 +0100 From: Garret Subject: Re: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? Late 1999, just like Catherine i lurked at first. I had spent many good hours reading through Joni's bio on jm.com and soaking up the information on the two sites. I contacted Jody Jonson first when she offered a live Joni show that had alternate ACOY lyrics. She sent me this cd and introduced me to the music of Tom Waits, and, if i'm not mistaken, she also shared some Dylan with me. So i soon said hello to the crowd, Chris and i then made contact and that opened up a world of possibilities. And here i am all these years later trying to sort out some thoughts for a jonifest report. GARRET NP- silence On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 9:48 PM, Catherine McKay wrote: > Sometime in the spring or summer of 1999. Like you, I did a search for Joni > Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and jmdl.com. I didn't have a > computer at home so I used to read the jmdl posts at work. I lurked a while > before posting. After that, I didn't shut up for a while. Now I've simmered > down a bit again. > > I still haven't figured out the acronyms but my brain just doesn't work that > way - never has and never will. For me, it's usually faster to type a whole > world than to think about the acronyms and usually can't figure out what they > mean when they are used. > > --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Vince wrote: > > > Joni toured with Dylan in fall 1998 and the internet was still new to me (I > went online in late 97 or early 98) and about the first things I did an alta > vista search on (I am going way back in time) were Samoyeds (my breed of > dog) and Joni Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and the jmdl - I > lurked forever because I was not cool enough to join or smart enough to > figure out the hip lingo: NP, NPIMH, etc etc etc., but finally did join to > get the Joni news and somewhere on jm.com is about the first thing i ever > posted on line: my review of Joni in Chicago. > > I was so proud! > > anyway - what about you? > > Vince > > > > __________________________________________________________________ > Be > smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot > with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail > today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 14:33:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? I learned of the Joni list from Lori Fye (hi Lori!) several years ago, in Arizona, while on a vacation gathering of several of our internet motorcyclist friends. We were in AZ to ride. That was the 1st time I met Lori and her partner Allison, aka Mary. Not sure how the topic of Joni came up, but I was fairly geeked! This list has been an invaluable connection for me to reconnect with Joni Mitchell, and also to learn of the music of many others I may never have known of, without the JMDL. Also, I feel I have made more real friends, although I've only had the opportunity to meet a couple of you 3-d. Large lurv, Em - --- On Thu, 8/28/08, Vince wrote: From: Vince Subject: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? To: joni@smoe.org Date: Thursday, August 28, 2008, 3:50 PM Joni toured with Dylan in fall 1998 and the internet was still new to me (I went online in late 97 or early 98) and about the first things I did an alta vista search on (I am going way back in time) were Samoyeds (my breed of dog) and Joni Mitchell and found both jonimitchell.com and the jmdl - I lurked forever because I was not cool enough to join or smart enough to figure out the hip lingo: NP, NPIMH, etc etc etc., but finally did join to get the Joni news and somewhere on jm.com is about the first thing i ever posted on line: my review of Joni in Chicago. I was so proud! anyway - what about you? Vince ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 17:40:53 -0400 From: "Mark Angelo" Subject: Re: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? I actually saw Joni live in Austin, TX while attending a College Preparatory School (aka Boarding School) known as St. Stephen's Episcopal School in the 10th grade - as children of expatriates working in Saudi Arabia had to go to school elsewhere as 9th grade was as far as American schools went. I loved seeing Joni live...I remember this is the time when THOSL came about approximately...though I was seated in the rear, and could not see a whole lot and the sheer number of people (and maybe the fog of pot?) made it somewhat less of the ideal event I had hoped for. Anyhow Bob Dylan was brought out at the end during an encore - here are the details of the concert - too lazy to type them in myself: 1976.01.28 Joni tours with the LA Express Municipal Auditorium Austin, TX Bob Dylan makes a surprise appearance and duets with Joni on "Both Sides Now." He also performed a solo version of "Girl From The North Country." I learned about the JMDL list via the web site and started subscribing (checks mail) back on 11/16/07 through the website.. and I believe one earlier time in which I simply read the messages before getting overwhelmed. So I remained a "lurker" until everyone and their brother started dumping on "The Windfall". Naturally, often being the contrarian, I chimed in with my opinion that I loved the song. So that is my history with the JMDL. NP: Imogen Heap - Candlelight (Live) - -- - -Mark in Florida On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 3:50 PM, Vince wrote in part: > > anyway - what about you? > > Vince ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 17:58:47 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: njc when did you join the JMDL and how did you find it? It was about the same for me, Vince. I found JoniMitchell.com back in '97. My best friend David Mingus (who's birthday was yesterday) was/is a bigger fan of Joni than I am. He didn't have a computer, so I would print off all the Joni Bio pages for him to read. I knew about the JMDL, but didn't join until Jan or Feb. '98 when Wally announced a Joni writing contest. Mingus wanted to write a story, but you had to belong to the JMDL in order to enter. So I joined and David was able to submit his story on my computer. I just read the digests and never posted for several months. It was prior to the Joni/ Dylan tour that I started posting. Wally had asked Pearl, Mingus, and I to photograph her Atlanta concert which was on her birthday. I missed the JMDL get-together prior to the concert since we had stage passes and were setting up our photography equipment. So, I just got to meet Pearl and Marsha Doyle (remember her??? sour grapes. LOL) It was exciting leaning on the stage watching Joni, even though my good camera's battery was dead!!! I just pretended to take pics, but David and Pearl got some good shots. I just wish I would have listened to Pearl and gone to the hotel where Joni was staying, and I could have had my photo taken with Joni just like Muller. I don't post that much anymore due to time, threads I've seen many times, and the fact that Joni hasn't toured. Still, after 10 yrs on this list, I've met so many wonderful people at several Jonifests, I still stay. Jimmy ************** It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 19:41:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Laura Stanley Subject: Can we still be friends, njc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Olc1PTyeCzM&feature=related ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 11:27:58 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: Joni fest UK 2008 Great to hear all the reports about the UK fest- I'm getting a contact high reading them. Shine on you crazy crow diamond dogs! RR ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2008 06:56:37 +0200 From: Moni Kellermann Subject: Re: cookbook and privacy concerns Wie Kate Bennett so vortrefflich formulierte: > Moni, I'll try. There are gigantic ranges of comfort that people have about > their privacy. For example, Joni wrote very personal songs. In interviews > & concerts she would share much about her life with complete strangers. > Much of her personal life is archived & accessible & will be for generations > to come. I don't see any difference between that & what is shared on lists > such as this. Some people don't feel comfortable sharing their personal > thoughts while others, by nature of their personality or perhaps their > profession, feel just fine. Hope this helps a bit. Kate Hi, Kate, thank you for taking your time. I am not wondering why people are sharing personal stories on a LIST. That, of course, is the purpose of a list like this here. That's why I read the messages. The point is that there is a difference between sharing personal details with a certain number of people and sharing it with everyone who is on the web and can handle Google search. And there is a difference between sharing a personal story with some people and letting anyone know something about you. I love all this "Web 2.0" stuff. I am on Facebook, I have a MySpace page at http://www.myspace.com/kellerfrau and I have a blog about something special at http://hillforceone.blogspot.com. (Thank you, Google, for indexing this and show this message in your search results). The difference between all these things and being a member of the list here is that with a MySpace page I control what I display and I intentionally want anyone in the world to know. With the list, I only want to communicate with list members and do NOT want any internet user on this planet to know. Joni Mitchell is a performer and as such her work is accessible online. I do object to the idea that "much of her personal life is archived and accessible". Her artistic work may be, but for sure not her personal life. This mailing list's archive does not have to be freely accessible on the internet and be searched by Google. It could as well be stored and being accessed by members only and just not show up in Google search results. And I still cannot see the benefit from everything being displayed by Google. moni ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 22:26:20 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: cookbook and privacy concerns Joni has enthusiastically shared so much about her personal life over the years in concerts, interviews, etc which are beautifully archived on the website jonimitchell - something that I understand she is very supportive of. Kate >Joni Mitchell is a performer and as such her work is accessible online. I do object to the idea that "much of her personal life is archived and accessible". Her artistic work may be, but for sure not her personal life.< moni ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2008 #183 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------