From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2008 #88 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, May 31 2008 Volume 2008 : Number 088 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Chaka and Marcia Live [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Joni In Fiction Section [Jeannie ] Lesson In Survival [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Best Coffee I've Ever Tasted! NJC [Rian Afriadi ] Singles [Rian Afriadi ] NJC Desert Island Topic... [Rian Afriadi ] Travel Warning NJC [Rian Afriadi ] Need Your Comments, NJC [Rian Afriadi ] Re: Lost njc [Garret ] SV: From Bo (who WAS missing in action) ["Marion Leffler" ] Huh? [Russell Bowden ] Re: NJC Desert Island Topic... [Catherine McKay ] Re: Singles [Bob Muller ] Re: Huh? [Catherine McKay ] Mandolin Bros. photos [Chuck Eisenhardt ] Re: Lost njc [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Lost njc, spoiler alert [Monika Bogdanowicz ] Re: Gilligan's Island, Stomp NJC ["Mark Scott" ] RE:re: Aeolian wind in Saskatchewan (NJC)/NYT David Byrne [mia _ ] Re: Lesson In Survival ["Randy Remote" ] Re: Lesson In Survival ["Mark Scott" ] Re: Lesson In Survival ["T Peckham" ] Re: Lesson In Survival [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Joni Covers, Volume 101 - a silly millimeter longer [Bob Muller ] Re: Lesson In Survival [Monika Bogdanowicz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 17:55:45 +1000 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Chaka and Marcia Live Hi folks. Chaka Khan and Aussie/American diva (and Australian Idol judge), Marcia Hines perform live at the Enmore Theatre on June 14. Unfortunately the ticket prices are a little steep for me. Just wondering if anyone is going. I'd love to know if Chaka does, Ladies Man or Hejira in the show. She's bound to do at least one Joni cover, knowing how much of a fan she is. I'll be kicking myself if they BOTH do a Joni song. I'd love to hear Marcia do a Joni cover. They are off to Melbourne next. Mark in Sydney NP Hejira - Chaka Khan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 00:53:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeannie Subject: Joni In Fiction Section Earlier today I was at the JoniMitchell.com site and came across this one picture of Joni's, which appears next to the title link, 'Joni In Fiction,' and for the first was truly able to see how much Joni and Kilauren, her daughter, resemble one another. Jeannie ~nj~ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 18:45:23 +1000 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Lesson In Survival Hello again. Probably my favourite Joni album is, For The Roses and I have been listening to it quite a bit lately. I love the information I pick up here on Joni's song lyrics but I don't recall any discussions on the song, Lesson In Survival. I love the song although, I've never been quite sure what it is about. I know that Joni was living in the "back woods" in BC when she wrote the album. She has said that she wanted to get away from the urban life and get back to nature for a while but it is interesting to hear what she was looking back on previous to that, that inspired the songs on For The Roses. I remember Barangrill being discussed at length and it helped clear up some confusion for me. Especially the part about the American oil companies which I had no idea about ("humble makes pure"). I would love to hear some thoughts on people's interpretations of Lesson In Survival and the other songs on For The Roses. Here's a reminder of the lyrics. Lesson in Survival Spinning out on turns That gets you tough Guru books-the Bible Only a reminder That you're just not good enough You need to believe in something Once I could in our love Black road Double yellow line Friends and kin Campers in the kitchen That's fine sometimes But I know my needs My sweet tumbleweed I need more quiet times By a river flowing You and me Deep kisses And the sun going down Maybe it's paranoia Maybe it's sensitivity Your friends protect you Scrutinize me I get so damn timid Not at all the spirit That's inside of me Oh baby I can't seem to make it With you socially There's this reef around me I'm looking way out at the ocean Love to see that green water in motion I'm going to get a boat And we can row it If you ever get the notion To be needed by me Fresh salmon frying And the tide rolling in I went to see a friend tonight 'Was very late when I walked in My talking as it rambled Revealed suspicious reasoning The visit seemed to darken him I came in as bright As a neon light And I burned out Right there before him I told him these things I'm telling you now Watched them buckle up In his brow When you dig down deep You lose good sleep And it makes you Heavy company I will always love you Hands alike Magnet and iron The souls I know from interviews with Joni that she read a lot of pop psychology previous to her retreat to BC which explains the first few lines. Who's love could she once believe in? Who was Joni dating just prior to this album? Who's friends was she intimidated by? I gather by the "campers in the kitchen" line that she had a lot of freeloaders dropping by. It also seems to be a song of longing to be alone yet needing to be paired with someone. Her most common theme. The last paragraph has got me baffled too. Is this the same friend she is referring to earlier or is there a friendship under strain too? What made her "heavy company"? What is meant by the line, "Hands alike. Magnet and iron. The souls"? Any thoughts? Mark in Sydney NP Lesson In Survival - JM ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 02:22:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Best Coffee I've Ever Tasted! NJC A friend of mine who is a coffee-nut brought me Luwak Cofee (Kopi Luwak) (pronounced Ko-pee loo-waak). He said that Kopi Luwak is one of the best coffee in the world, and the price is expensive. I'm not a coffee expert but I really have to tell you that kopi luwak is absolutely the best coffee I've ever tasted. It's so delicious that I don't care about the origin of kopi luwak itself. The origin may make you raise your eyebrow. Luwak is a kind of animal, a fox-like animal, but herbivore, lives in tropical forest in remote areas of Indonesia. They eat coffee seeds (though their stomach cant digest it). They are so picky about coffee seeds, they only eat the best. And kopi luwak, is taken from their........ faeces. Not really from their faeces actually. Its from undigested seeds found in their faces. Luwak's digestive system is a good place to process coffee seeds to make it ripe and tastes good. Traditional kopi luwak harvesters usually walk in the forest to find "it" and then sell "it" for lots of $$$ and RpRpRp. I have tasted it, and it's sooooo damn goooooooood!!!! Are you going to taste coffee luwak too? Rian NP. Fleetwood Mac  Rhiannon Now in Jakarta ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 02:26:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Singles Just appear in my mind: Joni or the recording industry boss (i don"t know which) often made mistakes in choosing first single for some of Joni's albums. STAS : Night In The City, should be I Had A King Clouds : Chelsea Morning, should be BSN DJRD : Off Night Backstreet, should be Talk To Me S&L : Why Do Fools Fall In Love, should be IFTKOMS ChalkMark : Secret Place, should be The Beat of Black Wings or #1 TI : How Do You Stop, should be Sex Kill Am I the only one who thinks this? Rian Who listens to STAS a lot this week. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 02:25:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: NJC Desert Island Topic... I am not a geography expert,,, but i do think that desert island does not exist. There's no such thing called desert island. A desert should be existed in the middle of a large landmass, like Gobi in the middle of Asia, Sahara in Africa, etc... So, in a large landmass. I'm not sure if an island, with all waters around it, can have a desert in it. I don't equate sand-only island with desert island or with barren island. Well, that's my 2 bucks if not 2 cents. Rian PS. Don't get lost in a desert with CMIARS (specially because it contains Cool Water which will annoy you to death) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 02:34:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Travel Warning NJC USA finally called off its travel warning to Indonesia, after 8 years.... What took you so long? :-) Rian In this dangerously beautiful Indonesia. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 03:17:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Rian Afriadi Subject: Need Your Comments, NJC i am just an amateur photo-taking-freak. (not even an amateur photographer) in fact, i just bought my 1st camera a month ago. i uploaded some of my shots, here's the link : http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=22281&l=ca2bf&id=842350115 and to improve myself, i really need your comments. just senf those comments offlist, or on the page. thanks before. rian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 13:39:58 +0100 From: Garret Subject: Re: Lost njc I just started reading the Lost thread, was reading it and realised that you guys are two episodes ahead. In Ireland we get the final two episdoes of the season on Monday evening - please mark it spoliter alert, i did learn one thing that i didn't want to know. I'm sure it's nothing too major. I have found this season to be the most worthwhile since the first season, it finally feels like the writers have a direction again. Many thanks GARRET ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 14:30:59 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: SV: From Bo (who WAS missing in action) Bo, that's terrible! Don't beat yourself up for haven fallen for a scam, it could happen to anyone. I'm really sorry and hope that everything will be sorted out in the end. And then we can all laugh and toast to nothing and remember we're only human. Love, Marion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] Fvr Peep Richman Skickat: den 31 maj 2008 00:13 Till: joni@smoe.org Dmne: From Bo (who WAS missing in action) Hello, Hello, Hello!!!!! I've MISSED you sooo Much!!! And I am seriously behind in reading the Digests but I just finished reading V2008#85. Maybe we're secretly hooked together (maybe Joni helped in this a bit?) but a few people posted things relating to e-mail Internet SCAMS....and I just went through this and just YESTERDAY (Thursday...I think) a Sunset Pig was here...at MY request. After having been scammed with one of those lottery e-mails ( Okay....I'm dumb and getting dumber)and having had sooo much difficulty with my bank...dumb????(yep)....how about, a friggin IDIOT!!!!!) I was scammed once again!!!!!!! I'm writing about this because this was different than the e-mails that seem to be increasing....I get them every single day...many each day and I click on Spam...nothing seems to have an effect when you click Scam....back to the present and never back to my future...here's what happened: I put something on Craig's List. The next morning I discovered that I received an e-mail from a buyer. Such a no reason to think 'scam' response. This man sent me e-mails and I responded. And so the communications from him continued (without receiving a certified bank check for over a week) assuring me that the check was being sent, something very similar to the first scam I got myself into....the original e-mail had a complex story about his wife, who was about (any day) to have a baby and other stuff. I indeed received a check in the amount of $3500. I took care of this first with the fraud unit of the U.S. Postal Service (who never responded to my messages left on the answering machine of the fraud department) and concluded with the police....now they have copies of all the e-mails with my responses and they have the check. I was worried because this guy had my home address and telephone number....again, (am I an idiot or what!!!!) and because I was so busy being free. I really need to go to the Mermaid Cafe!!!! Monika, the line "Amelia it was just a false alarm." was seemingly permanent in my head...it also brought me a whopping much needed measure of comfort. Russell, I was really thrilled to read that you began the L.A. Express~!!!!! I love your group and the work you did with Joni! Patti, Mitchellian Completists...LOL...it's Patti and it's fabulous. "All my little landscapes, All my yellow afternoons, Stack up around this vacancy Like dirty cups and spoons No mercy sweet Jesus! No mercy from Turbulent Indigo". That says exactly where I've been. The last time I saw Richard was in December 2002. "Last chance lost-" We (NEVER) talked about anything "in terms of sacrifice and compromise" And for one year now I've been carrying around the knowledge that Richard did EXACTLY what he did to me AGAIN....found another lady in Philly and actually had the nerve (for want of a better, more descriptive word) to move right back to King's Grant...different location, but in King's Grant. I rambling....so sorry. But I'll bet you know what Joni CD I've been listening to..... Love and hugs to all!!!! From Bo ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 09:23:15 -0400 From: Chuck Eisenhardt Subject: NJC Aeolian, etc really nice post... a breath of 'air' amid all the tributes to 'Lost'... thanks for the links. a couple of resonances..... in the mid-70's, I was living with some people who were into Ouija board divination (and who were a bit more susceptible). In doing 'past life' regression, the 'spirit contact' (named Abe) reveled tat I had been a musician in a recent incarnation and had 'played the Aeolian'. In looking this up (the old fashioned way!) I discovered the primary meaning to be the wind harp. Also, as I am a musician in this life (probably the one most worth attending to) I know that aeolian was a brand of piano in the late 19th- when there were many hundreds, possibly thousands, of piano builders. it seems a wind harp would not be so much 'played' as an installation, begun with the conception and understanding of wind and vibration, and then fabrication and placement, and the wind, should it come, and after that, dependent completely on tchance and the external factors. The invisible hand. I play and study dulcimer. Howie Mitchell is a dulcimer maker in Shelton CT and who founded Folk-Legacy Records. The dulcimer is basically a wooden (sometimes cardboard!) box with tunable strings (probably descended from northern European instruments like the zither), easy to carry (so you can pack them into caves on Greek Islands) a coming in all shapes, sizes, voices, tunings, etc. Howie built really trad instruments and also wild excursions to the outer fringes of dulcimer-ness.....the 'courting duclmer' -- one instrument with two facing (and opposite) fretboards, for two players facing one another (preferably fond on each other) making 'beautiful music together'. To my main point, Howie Mitchell built a 'dulci-less'. This was a stick dulcimer, without a body (just fretboard, stings and pegs). He would experiment with playing this contraption on various surfaces, using them as the sounding board - plate glass, cigar box, anything wooden or prone to amplify vibration. He found that a hollow-core door worked the best. Sort of like playing a building. ChuckE ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 06:44:35 -0700 From: Russell Bowden Subject: Huh? El Gee, Well, yeah, I didn't want to say anything...but I want those god damned royalties now, Bud!!! I was also the 8th Beatle....I'm really Chuck Mitchell....been living low in Maine waiting for my revenge!! Chuck Dreams are the bright creatures of poem, and legend, who sport on earth in the night season, and melt away in the first beam of the sun,which lights grim care and stern reality on their daily pilgrimage through the world.Charles Dickens Date: Fri, 30 May 2008 19:01:49 -0700From: scjoniguy@yahoo.comSubject: Re: From Bo (who WAS missing in action)To: rustytrazom@hotmail.com Yes, me too Russell! LOL - ----- Original Message ----From: Peep Richman To: joni@smoe.orgSent: Friday, May 30, 2008 6:12:51 PMSubject: From Bo (who WAS missing in action)Hello, Hello, Hello!!!!! I've MISSED you sooo Much!!! And I am seriously behind in reading the Digests but I just finished reading V2008#85. Maybe we're secretly hooked together (maybe Joni helped in this a bit?) but a few people posted things relating to e-mail Internet SCAMS....and I just went through this and just YESTERDAY (Thursday...I think) a Sunset Pig was here...at MY request. After having been scammed with one of those lottery e-mails ( Okay....I'm dumb and getting dumber)and having had sooo much difficulty with my bank...dumb????(yep)....how about, a friggin IDIOT!!!!!) I was scammed once again!!!!!!! I'm writing about this because this was different than the e-mails that seem to be increasing....I get them every single day...many each day and I click on Spam...nothing seems to have an effect when you click Scam....back to the present and never back to my future...here's what happened: I put something on Craig's List. The next morning I discovered that I received an e-mail from a buyer. Such a no reason to think 'scam' response. This man sent me e-mails and I responded. And so the communications from him continued (without receiving a certified bank check for over a week) assuring me that the check was being sent, something very similar to the first scam I got myself into....the original e-mail had a complex story about his wife, who was about (any day) to have a baby and other stuff. I indeed received a check in the amount of $3500. I took care of this first with the fraud unit of the U.S. Postal Service (who never responded to my messages left on the answering machine of the fraud department) and concluded with the police....now they have copies of all the e-mails with my responses and they have the check. I was worried because this guy had my home address and telephone number....again, (am I an idiot or what!!!!) and because I was so busy being free. I really need to go to the Mermaid Cafe!!!! Monika, the line "Amelia it was just a false alarm." was seemingly permanent in my head...it also brought me a whopping much needed measure of comfort. Russell, I was really thrilled to read that you began the L.A. Express~!!!!! I love your group and the work you did with Joni! Patti, Mitchellian Completists...LOL...it's Patti and it's fabulous. "All my little landscapes, All my yellow afternoons, Stack up around this vacancy Like dirty cups and spoons No mercy sweet Jesus! No mercy from Turbulent Indigo". That says exactly where I've been. The last time I saw Richard was in December 2002. "Last chance lost-" We (NEVER) talked about anything "in terms of sacrifice and compromise" And for one year now I've been carrying around the knowledge that Richard did EXACTLY what he did to me AGAIN....found another lady in Philly and actually had the nerve (for want of a better, more descriptive word) to move right back to King's Grant...different location, but in King's Grant. I rambling....so sorry. But I'll bet you know what Joni CD I've been listening to..... Love and hugs to all!!!! From Bo _________________________________________________________________ Change the world with e-mail. Join the im Initiative from Microsoft. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Join/Default.aspx?source=EML_WL_ChangeWorld ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 07:11:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC Desert Island Topic... - --- On Sat, 5/31/08, Rian Afriadi wrote: > I am not a geography expert,,, but i do think that desert > island does not exist. There's no such thing called > desert island. A desert should be existed in the middle of > a large landmass, like Gobi in the middle of Asia, Sahara > in Africa, etc... So, in a large landmass. I'm not sure > if an island, with all waters around it, can have a desert > in it. I'm pretty sure that it's just another weird thing about English. When we say "desert" island, I think we really mean "deserted island," as in an island with no people on it. It is probably an archaic form. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 07:10:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: Singles I disagree, I think they made the right call with NITC. More universal appeal as opposed to the cryptic lyrics in IHAK. Not after Judy Collins had a huge hit with it. Chelsea Morning was the right call. Bullseye. I totally agree with this one, although maybe the "piss" inclusion would hurt it airplay-wise? Anyway, the entire album was so far ahead of its time (or maybe out of time is a better description) in 1977 that I don't see ANYTHING off it being remotely successful as a single. Except for the fact that IFTKOMS had already been released as a single back in 1975 (Boho Dance was the B-side). Anytime an artist releases a second version of a previous single it always seems to have a hint of desperation to it. No singles on CMIARS, so it doesn't really matter - throw a dart. I'm OK with it, except for commercial purposes the inclusion of Seal made it probably a better call. Funny though that she would pick the one song that's NOT her composition. Bob NP: Pink Floyd, "Pigs (Three Different Ones)" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 07:16:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Huh? - --- On Sat, 5/31/08, Russell Bowden wrote: > Well, yeah, I didn't want to say anything...but I want > those god damned > royalties now, Bud!!! > I was also the 8th Beatle....I'm really Chuck > Mitchell....been living low in > Maine waiting for my revenge!! > Wasn't there someone a week or two ago who posted to jonimitchell.com or jmdl.com (and Les passed it on to us) that he was the one who really wrote "Circle Game?" That was you, wasn't it! LOL! __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 10:22:35 -0400 From: Chuck Eisenhardt Subject: Mandolin Bros. photos Hi, Can anyone direct me to a place to acquire the photos by Stan Jay's wife, posted on the list a while ago, of Joni's visit to Mandolin Bros? (these are mosly of Joni trying out the mandocello from 'Song for Sharon' but in a couple of shots she's playing a vintage slotted-head Martin, which I believe she also may bought that day, or soon thereafter. One sees Dylan and Baez with a similar (the same?) Martin... and please share the info for folks who may not have seen them... ChuckE ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 12:19:36 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Lost njc > Ha ha ha - give me your phone number. I wasn't in the room but I'll ask my > daughter just so I can wreck it for ya, because you're so special, Jimmy! > Oh Catherine, my number is 481-516- 2342 , the same as Hurley's winning lottery numbers, also engraved on the building of the Dharma Initiative. :) Thanks for asking. Its' a breath of air from the aeolian posts.........just kidding Chuck! Jimmy ************** Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4& ?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 09:26:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Monika Bogdanowicz Subject: Re: Lost njc, spoiler alert ***********ONCE AGAIN, SPOILER ALERT, DO NOT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT WATCHED AND PLAN TO************** I thought the season finale was very entertaining and intense. One of my favorite scenes of the night was Sayid's fight scene with (I forget the guy's name) that rogue freighter guy who was killing everybody. Now we've all seen fight scenes before--punch here, punch there but that scene was seriously bad ass. I like my violence on tv thank you very much and that was top notch. I was also very upset when the helicopter left the boat WITHOUT Jin and a moment later, boom! I just could not believe that. I love Sun and Jin together as a couple. That was heartbreaking especially since they have a baby on the way. And man, I bet the "oceanic six" were like, "could anything else go wrong?" The helicopter loses fuel. They land on the boat which has a bomb with only minutes to go. They leave the boat without Jin. The helicopter loses fuel again and then the island disappears. That's when I would have just cried man. I also loved how cold Ben was when Locke told him you just killed everyone on the boat and he said, "so?" I felt a cold wind blow at that moment. Wow. I also yelled out "no!" when Sawyer leaped out of the helicopter, although it was very honorable of him to do so. I'm glad he was ok and made it back to the island. He's my favorite character. After that, I think I like Sayid best. I'd definitely stick with Sayid or Ben to ensure my survival though. They are the ones who seem like they know what they are doing. Locke would be too nuts for me. -Monika, looking forward to the next season with so many questions unanswered! Victor Johnson wrote: What did you think of the finale last night? I honestly thought it was maybe the best episode of LOST yet and really brought everything home. If LOST was a baseball game, they hit a grand slam last night. I loved the scene where Ben was turning the wheel to move the island. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 09:45:02 -0700 From: "Mark Scott" Subject: Re: Gilligan's Island, Stomp NJC - ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Eoll" To: "Joni people!" Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 9:30 PM Subject: Re: Gilligan's Island, Stomp NJC > The other thing that tweaks me, besides all the stuff you mention, > is the skewing of physical attractiveness toward the female members > of the cast. I guess thats typical show biz, but its particularly > obvious here I think. I guess the Professor was alright looking. > But, Ginger and Maryanne? Stunning. To the point of being sexual > icons even 40 years later. > > There are like 3 or 4 shows either currently running or recently run > that follow the fat guy/hot wife motif. King of Queens is one, and > there are a couple other shows starring 80s starlets (my age) Jamie > Gertz and Courtney Thorne-Smith in the hot wife role. My feeling about the sit-coms with the smart, attractive wife married to the kind of dorky, often paunchy husband is that it implies that men are shallower than women. Or that men are more oriented to the visual in sexual attraction. The women can see beneath the physical surface to the man's endearing qualities. The man may appreciat the wife's non-physical qualities but it was probably her looks that attracted him in the first place. As Marilyn Monroe said in 'Gentlemen Prefer Blondes': 'You wouldn't marry a girl just because she's pretty, would you? Well of course not! But my goodness, it certainly helps, doesn't it?' > I am now convinced that The Man will never be able to effectively > outlaw music. Because we can make music from literally anything. > What has convinced me of this, you ask? Stomp. > > Has anyone else seen Stomp? It would be no exaggeration to say I > was totally blown away by it. 'Stomp' is amazing. Travis and I saw it several years ago here in Seattle. Amazing energy. It's also wonderfully choreographed. A delight for both the ears and eyes. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 12:06:20 -0500 From: mia _ Subject: RE:re: Aeolian wind in Saskatchewan (NJC)/NYT David Byrne That's very cool - now everyone will be able to dance to architecture! ;) Mia <> _________________________________________________________________ Give to a good cause with every e-mail. Join the im Initiative from Microsoft. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Join/Default.aspx?souce=EML_WL_ GoodCause ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 10:41:19 -0700 From: "Mark Scott" Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark-Leon Thorne" > I know from interviews with Joni that she read a lot of pop > psychology previous to her retreat to BC which explains the first > few > lines. Who's love could she once believe in? Who was Joni dating > just > prior to this album? Who's friends was she intimidated by? I don't really know who inspired the lyrics for the song but they are very beautiful. > > The last paragraph has got me baffled too. Is this the same friend > she is referring to earlier or is there a friendship under strain > too? What made her "heavy company"? I have always felt that this was another friend that she went to and confided her doubts about the love relationship. The anxiety and 'maybe it's' paranoia have revealed 'suspicious reasoning'. She started out upbeat when she came in to see this friend but ended up unloading on them. Another one of those situations where she's very emotionally involved and can't let go of a problematic relationship. The friend senses this and the negativity that has come pouring out has made her 'heavy company'. > > What is meant by the line, "Hands alike. Magnet and iron. The > souls"? Soul mates. The hands seem to fit together. The souls stick to one another like iron to a magnet. My take, anyway, fwiw. Mark in Seattle. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 10:50:25 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival I tend to think this break-up song is another about James Taylor, from the lines "Black road double yellow line" which is almost another way of saying "Two Lane Blacktop", the feature film James had just made, and the lines "my sweet tumbleweed" "I'm gonna get a boat" that seem to reflect lines from Taylor's "Highway Song", released the previous year on his Mudslide Slim LP. It's a song about not being tied down, about the freedom of the open road, and contains the lines: Sweet misunderstanding..... ....I'm the one eyed seed of a tumbleweed ....let us build a boat and sail away These seem to me to be clues that the song is about James. I know he has siblings, Kate, Livingston, so the part about all the activity (campers in the kitchen) seems to express their different preferences for privacy in their personal lives: Joni would not last long in a commune type situation, whereas the subject of her song might thrive on it. The last lines acknowledge that they are still soul mates. Similar hands. Magnet and iron...will always attract each other, naturally. However, when someone says "I will always love you" it's a sad goodbye. I think the last verse about spilling her guts to someone is referring to a third party she went to for solace, and the unintended, troubling effect it had on him. It seems likely from the images of the ocean tides and 'green water in motion' that this was one of the songs she wrote in her coastal BC home-in fact, taken with the inner photo of her, nude on the rock ala Venus on the half-shell, this might even be the spiritual centerpiece of the album, her naked feelings. I really love this song (and FTR in general). It is one of those rare songs that makes no effort whatsoever to be commercial. There is no hook, no repeating lines or chorus, it just is what it is, unadulterated sorrow and honesty. RR From: "Mark-Leon Thorne" > I would love to hear some thoughts on people's interpretations of > Lesson In Survival and the other songs on For The Roses. Here's a > reminder of the lyrics. > > Lesson in Survival > Spinning out on turns > That gets you tough > Guru books-the Bible > Only a reminder > That you're just not good enough > You need to believe in something > Once I could in our love > Black road > Double yellow line > Friends and kin > Campers in the kitchen > That's fine sometimes > But I know my needs > My sweet tumbleweed > I need more quiet times > By a river flowing > You and me > Deep kisses > And the sun going down > > Maybe it's paranoia > Maybe it's sensitivity > Your friends protect you > Scrutinize me > I get so damn timid > Not at all the spirit > That's inside of me > Oh baby I can't seem to make it > With you socially > There's this reef around me > I'm looking way out at the ocean > Love to see that green water in motion > I'm going to get a boat > And we can row it > If you ever get the notion > To be needed by me > Fresh salmon frying > And the tide rolling in > > I went to see a friend tonight > 'Was very late when I walked in > My talking as it rambled > Revealed suspicious reasoning > The visit seemed to darken him > I came in as bright > As a neon light > And I burned out > Right there before him > I told him these things > I'm telling you now > Watched them buckle up > In his brow > When you dig down deep > You lose good sleep > And it makes you > Heavy company > I will always love you > Hands alike > Magnet and iron > The souls ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 11:13:41 -0700 From: "Mark Scott" Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Remote" > It seems likely from the images of the ocean tides and 'green > water in motion' that this was one of the songs she wrote > in her coastal BC home-in fact, taken with the inner photo > of her, nude on the rock ala Venus on the half-shell, this > might even be the spiritual centerpiece of the album, her > naked feelings. Good observation. That picture always makes me think of those lines: 'I'm looking way out at the ocean Love to see that green water in motion' From 'Lesson in Survival'! Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 15:41:05 -0500 From: "T Peckham" Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival I think Randy nails it (with assists from the two Marks). ;-) On 5/31/08, Randy Remote wrote: > > I tend to think this break-up song is another about > James Taylor, from the lines "Black road double yellow > line" which is almost another way of saying "Two > Lane Blacktop", the feature film James had just made, > and the lines "my sweet tumbleweed" "I'm gonna get > a boat" that seem to reflect lines from Taylor's "Highway > Song", released the previous year on his Mudslide Slim > LP. It's a song about not being tied down, about the > freedom of the open road, and contains the lines: > Sweet misunderstanding..... > ....I'm the one eyed seed of a tumbleweed > ....let us build a boat and sail away > These seem to me to be clues that the song is about > James. This is great. Tho I listened to the two albums over and over at the time, I don't think I made the connection w/"Highway Song," or specifically w/"Two Lane Blacktop." I think this is spot on. I know he has siblings, Kate, Livingston, so the part about all the activity > (campers in the kitchen) seems to express their different preferences for > privacy in their > personal lives . . . From *Girls Like Us*: "In the song she complains about how James's 'friends* protect you [and] scrutinize me' . . . * {Footnote} Although James's women friends had, as Betsy Asher noted, formed a "fence" around him, Joni's confidantes recall that it was his famiily, not his friends, who intimidated her." (Betsy Asher was the wife of James's producer Peter Asher, and a intimate of both James and Joni at the time.) This kind of makes sense to me because of other revelations in the book regarding Trudy Taylor, James's rather formidable-in-her-own-way mother. Were I forced to choose just one song to play for someone to introduce them to Joni Mitchell, it would be this one. Terra ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 11:24:06 +1000 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival Excellent analysis, Randy. I hadn't thought about the songs James Taylor had recorded. The "Tumbleweed" connection makes sense now. I also didn't know he had made a movie. The "magnet and iron" line does seem to describe Joni's relationship with James. They have remained very close but this song seems to chronicle the shift in their relationship. I guess it was an experiment in intimacy which lead them to establish a close non romantic friendship. It seems that the majority of the songs on For The Roses are about James Taylor. Is the one who comes to her "like a little boy" in Woman of Heart and Mind also James? I'm still curious though, who the friend was that Joni went to with her issues regarding James. I'm also wondering about the timeline; when did James start dating Carly Simon? It would be my guess that it was some time after this period Joni describes in Lessons in Survival. Carly doesn't seem to be the reason for Joni opting out of a romantic relationship with James. A question for Bob Muller: Has anyone recorded a cover of Lessons? Sorry, just too lazy to check the website. Mark in Sydney NP Let The Wind Carry Me - Judy Kuhn On 01/06/2008, at 3:50 AM, Randy Remote wrote: > I tend to think this break-up song is another about > James Taylor, from the lines "Black road double yellow > line" which is almost another way of saying "Two > Lane Blacktop", the feature film James had just made, > and the lines "my sweet tumbleweed" "I'm gonna get > a boat" that seem to reflect lines from Taylor's "Highway > Song", released the previous year on his Mudslide Slim > LP. It's a song about not being tied down, about the > freedom of the open road, and contains the lines: > Sweet misunderstanding..... > ....I'm the one eyed seed of a tumbleweed > ....let us build a boat and sail away > These seem to me to be clues that the song is about > James. I know he has siblings, Kate, Livingston, so the part about > all the activity (campers in the kitchen) seems > to express their different preferences for privacy in their > personal lives: Joni would not last long in a commune type > situation, whereas the subject of her song might thrive on > it. The last lines acknowledge that they are still soul mates. > Similar hands. Magnet and iron...will always attract each > other, naturally. However, when someone says "I will always > love you" it's a sad goodbye. > I think the last verse about spilling her guts to someone is > referring to a third party she went to for solace, and the > unintended, troubling effect it had on him. > It seems likely from the images of the ocean tides and 'green > water in motion' that this was one of the songs she wrote > in her coastal BC home-in fact, taken with the inner photo > of her, nude on the rock ala Venus on the half-shell, this might > even be the spiritual centerpiece of the album, her > naked feelings. > I really love this song (and FTR in general). It is one of > those rare songs that makes no effort whatsoever to be > commercial. There is no hook, no repeating lines or chorus, it just > is what it is, unadulterated sorrow and honesty. > RR > > From: "Mark-Leon Thorne" >> I would love to hear some thoughts on people's interpretations of >> Lesson In Survival and the other songs on For The Roses. Here's a >> reminder of the lyrics. >> Lesson in Survival >> Spinning out on turns >> That gets you tough >> Guru books-the Bible >> Only a reminder >> That you're just not good enough >> You need to believe in something >> Once I could in our love >> Black road >> Double yellow line >> Friends and kin >> Campers in the kitchen >> That's fine sometimes >> But I know my needs >> My sweet tumbleweed >> I need more quiet times >> By a river flowing >> You and me >> Deep kisses >> And the sun going down >> Maybe it's paranoia >> Maybe it's sensitivity >> Your friends protect you >> Scrutinize me >> I get so damn timid >> Not at all the spirit >> That's inside of me >> Oh baby I can't seem to make it >> With you socially >> There's this reef around me >> I'm looking way out at the ocean >> Love to see that green water in motion >> I'm going to get a boat >> And we can row it >> If you ever get the notion >> To be needed by me >> Fresh salmon frying >> And the tide rolling in >> I went to see a friend tonight >> 'Was very late when I walked in >> My talking as it rambled >> Revealed suspicious reasoning >> The visit seemed to darken him >> I came in as bright >> As a neon light >> And I burned out >> Right there before him >> I told him these things >> I'm telling you now >> Watched them buckle up >> In his brow >> When you dig down deep >> You lose good sleep >> And it makes you >> Heavy company >> I will always love you >> Hands alike >> Magnet and iron >> The souls ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 18:01:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Joni Covers, Volume 101 - a silly millimeter longer And if you remember that phrase "a silly millimeter longer", you're probably as old as me. Well, June is bustin' out all over, temps in the 90's here today and Dubya giving the Commencement Speech at nearby Furman University, so it's a great day to stay indoors, sit back and spin some new Joni covers, in this case the 101st Volume in the never-ending series of tributes to Joni that I've compiled, with a little help from my friends, that is. This time around, thanks go to my good friend Monica C and also to Richard Flynn as well as a couple of the artists who voluntarily sent me their CD's - always very cool. Here's where the download be: https://download.yousendit.com/731937D66C55111B And here's what's on it - as always a mix of old and new, sweet and sour, and coming from all corners of our wonderful world: 1. Mads Baerentzen Trio - Trouble Child: In case you don't know by now, I love to kick off the disc with something that I think is pretty awesome, and this one from 2005 is certainly no exception. Some tasty jazz from Denmark; Mads is on piano, and Vivian Sessoms provides the sultry soulful vocal. Some lovely sax work and a bass-drum section round out the sound and a sweet, sweet sound it is, stretched out to over 6 minutes and still ends too quickly. Makes you wish more jazzers picked up on this one. 2. Sara Gazarek - Carey: A sweet jazz take on the Blue classic - Sara has previously graced this series in 2005 with her take on The Circle Game. Here she swings a bit more, and the original arrangement and playing is very light & playful, and highlighted by some fine piano and bass. A definite keeper. 3. Dave Hill - Both Sides Now: An acoustic instrumental from his 2007 release, Dave is from Fort Collins, Colorado and is a fingerpicking champ. His style is akin to Chet Atkins. You'll like this. 4. Sanne - Met De Molen Mee (The Circle Game/Dutch) Our only foreign language cover this time around - not the first TCG cover we've heard in Dutch, but lovely nonetheless, particularly the guitar playing. 5. The Ukelele Orchestra of Great Britain - For Free: We discussed this band not too long ago, and there are many videos out there with some of their creative treatments of popular song; with this one (as with their earlier cover of ACOY) they play it pretty much straight up and turn in a lovely version of a Joni song that we don't get enough of. 6. Emilie Claire-Barlow - Twisted: She's got a great voice, navigates this one with ease and the band keeps it swinging - I love the muted horn, one of the many musical sounds I'm a sucker for. 7. Lauren Lapointe - Big Yellow Taxi: From a 2007 compilation of Savannah-area singer-songwriters. Not great, but not bad. 8. Lou Jolly - Woodstock: Lou reminds me a lot of one of the guys from Seals & Croft, not sure which one though. This track from his 2006 release is a very pleasant version of Woodstock, some laid-back guitar and vocal. 9. baSix - River: Acapella from Denmark - six of them in the group, hence the name. Great harmonies and some original arrangements and touches throughout. 10. Saya - Both Sides Now: From Japan, a beautiful jazz trio version featuring the also beautiful Saya on piano. From her 2006 album "Twilight". Nice arrangement and lovely playing from everyone. 11. Colored Wolf - Shadows And Light 12. Colored Wolf - Amelia 13. Colored Wolf - Sunny Sunday 14. Colored Wolf - Magdalene Laundries 15. Colored Wolf - The Crazy Cries Of Love: Firstly, my hats off to Germany's Colored Wolf for the song selections here. Imagine doing an album with FIVE Joni covers and ALL of them are way off the road always traveled. CW plays electric guitar and sings. His playing is always very solid, I do have to say that the vocals vary a bit - some of these songs suit him better than others. He sounds a bit like Paul Carrack (Squeeze's "Tempted" & Mike & The Mechanics) for those of you who remember him. 16. Annie Moscow - Michael From Mountains: Originally from New York and now residing in Arizona, Annie plays piano and sings on this track, and stretches it to over 7 minutes. Her fragile voice suits the song, and a mournful violin, chimes, and lovely backing vocals add to the haunting quality. If you've forgotten just how lovely this melody is, this cover is a good reminder. 17. Janet Jones - Both Sides Now: The oldest track on this disc, and the rarest as well. I had given up on giving this one as copies of this British folksinger's LP's fetch around $500 or more on Ebay. Lucky for us, a generous soul sent me a recording of the cover, and it's pretty basic - there's a little skip in the record so you'll have to forgive that. 18. Terry Duggins - Rainy Night House: Danger, Will Robinson! Man, this one is really awful. Terry plays the dulcimer on this one, and should have either made it an instrumental or employed another singer as his voice is simply unbearable. I don't even know who to compare it to, sort of a cross between Count Chocula and Anthony Newley. 19. Huang Zhong, Jin Hao, Sun Wenjun & Zhou Wenting - The Circle Game: And we close with a sprinkling of cheese from China. As you know there are a couple ways you can pull this one off; pick the tempo that Joni uses and take 5 minutes, or pick the Ian & Sylvia tempo and knock it out in about 3. OR...you can go the route these kids do and just sing the first verse-chorus combo twice and be done with it - however, this approach is NOT recommended because in so doing you basically castrate the power of the song as is evidenced here. And that draws the curtains on another CD's worth of Joni covers. Hope you enjoy most of these - I bet you will, and don't touch that dial - LOTS of Joni covers yet to come! Bob NP: Saya, "Both Sides Now" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 19:19:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Monika Bogdanowicz Subject: Joni playing Mr. Blue http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ps8i1zqIYms A live AUDIO performance of Mr. Blue. Visually, it is just a pic of Joni but there is some chatter from Joni before and after the show. Good stuff. -Monika ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 May 2008 19:03:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Monika Bogdanowicz Subject: Re: Lesson In Survival I agree with everything that has been said about this song. I love how the title of the song has a double meaning. Lesson in survival, you know, conjures images of wilderness (which as we know Joni wrote this alone in her BC home as you said) while at the same time it suggests survival in love or survival of self. That's what I think anyway. I've always thought the friend in the last part is not that good of a friend. I can understand the problems with the lover she is talking about and how her analyzing their situation causes another problem. That is clear and understandable. I mean, you've got a messy relationship with someone you're dating, and he/she isn't exactly going to be so very open to your ways of thinking or dealing with something when there is a problem. However, I would expect a friend to be able to listen to you. I imagine she must have been real "heavy company" to have a friend turn his back almost. I don't believe Joni was suggesting a strain on this particular friendship as must as she was trying to say how emotional and upset she must have really been to even bring a friend down. I don't know about you but most of my friends would try to bring me some comfort if I came to them upset. That is just something I observed within the song though I don't think Joni intended to suggest anything like that. -Monika Mark-Leon Thorne wrote: Lesson in Survival Spinning out on turns That gets you tough Guru books-the Bible Only a reminder That you're just not good enough You need to believe in something Once I could in our love Black road Double yellow line Friends and kin Campers in the kitchen That's fine sometimes But I know my needs My sweet tumbleweed I need more quiet times By a river flowing You and me Deep kisses And the sun going down Maybe it's paranoia Maybe it's sensitivity Your friends protect you Scrutinize me I get so damn timid Not at all the spirit That's inside of me Oh baby I can't seem to make it With you socially There's this reef around me I'm looking way out at the ocean Love to see that green water in motion I'm going to get a boat And we can row it If you ever get the notion To be needed by me Fresh salmon frying And the tide rolling in I went to see a friend tonight 'Was very late when I walked in My talking as it rambled Revealed suspicious reasoning The visit seemed to darken him I came in as bright As a neon light And I burned out Right there before him I told him these things I'm telling you now Watched them buckle up In his brow When you dig down deep You lose good sleep And it makes you Heavy company I will always love you Hands alike Magnet and iron The souls I know from interviews with Joni that she read a lot of pop psychology previous to her retreat to BC which explains the first few lines. Who's love could she once believe in? Who was Joni dating just prior to this album? Who's friends was she intimidated by? I gather by the "campers in the kitchen" line that she had a lot of freeloaders dropping by. It also seems to be a song of longing to be alone yet needing to be paired with someone. Her most common theme. The last paragraph has got me baffled too. Is this the same friend she is referring to earlier or is there a friendship under strain too? What made her "heavy company"? What is meant by the line, "Hands alike. Magnet and iron. The souls"? Any thoughts? Mark in Sydney NP Lesson In Survival - JM ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2008 #88 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------