From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2007 #297 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, August 1 2007 Volume 2007 : Number 297 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- native american -- joni -- now workplace conversation ["Patti Parlette" <] Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP [jeannie ] Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP [Victor Johnson ] NJC Hitler [missblux@googlemail.com] SV: JMDL Digest V2007 #290 ["Marion Leffler" ] Re: [RE]countdown to S H I N E [Catherine McKay ] NJC for the sake of discussion: "Through being cool" ["Lori Fye" Subject: native american -- joni -- now workplace conversation More workplace Joni! I love it! I just had a nice visit with one of our graduate students who is fast becoming a close friend. He comes for conversation; I comfort him sometimes. He's in Comparative Literature but he has got a thing that's unique and new with Native American Studies. And guess what! He's a Lakota! So, of course, I shared the lyrics with him. He said "wakan" loosely translates to "holy", in case any of you did not know that. (I did not.) Mother earth Mother Rocks pity me Father sky Father Water Standing in a wakan manner Mother earth Oh pity me In a wakan manner, I teach him about Joni, and he teaches me about Native Americans. It's a rich exchange, seems to me. I know no one's going to show me everything, but he showed me a lot in just half an hour. He said the that http://www.indianz.com/ is a good and reliable website to jump off from to other links and stuff. And THEN (oh, I am having to stifle myself, I'm giggling somethin' awful) he recommended a book, "Roofwalker" by Susan Power, about the Native American experience in Chicago. He said the author used to go the American Indian Center (?) there where she got beat up by you won't believe this, Bobble-head Bob HILLBILLYS! Bwaaaa haaa haaa! I think I'm going right out of my head days with all this Joni dizzy-dancing euphoria and JMDL synchronicity (Indians and hillbillys?). Theo then went on tell me that he is half Lakota from his dad and HALF HILLBILLY from his mom who is 1/2 Eastern Cherokee (Louise!) from Blount County, TN. Hey, honey, you got lots of cash, bring us out a bottle and we'll have some laughs! MoonSHINE's what I'm drinking...... Love, Patti P. "Treat the Earth well, it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your Children. We don't inherit the Earth from our Ancestors We borrow it from our Children." (Proverb posted UConn's Native American Cultural Society Office website) I know you will like that one, Earth Mother Marianne! ; ) Put away that DDT now. Marianne wrote: I heard a native american woman being interviewed the other day on the radio. . and her voice reminded me of Joni in some way. the way the words are pronounced I guess this strikes me because I seem to hold native americans with highest esteem. . I often wish /dream that I have native blood. . . but maybe I am only native in my heart. . native americans and their reverence for the earth, animals, the sky, water, air, fire. . every bit of life. . the rocks the soil seven generations. . etc. land preservation reverence spirit that's all where it's all at. . and joni. . this is what joni seems to be about. . so when I hear joni's voice lately I seem to hear the native voice. "let the wind carry me. . ." bring me closer to all these things it's a spirituality. . etc.). . maybe I will make a list sometime Marianne _________________________________________________________________ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 12:52:20 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP Oh, okay, now with actual dates, this circle game is just a play with synchronicity. So, Joni did mean MichelAngelo B after all. You think maybe Michelangelo A. could have been referring to both Joni M and Michelangelo B? Or simply, Joni M and Michelangelo A were both only reffering to Michelangelo B because of all of his clouds of the Sistine Chapel's ceiling. :) Jean anon anon wrote: >From: jeannie >Reply-To: jeannie >To: anon anon , Joni@smoe.org >Subject: Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP >Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 12:19:27 -0700 (PDT) > >whoa! So, Joni may have meant Michelangelo A. > > So, so interesting. It could be interpreted as both MA and MB. > > Thanks for the insight, Michael! > > jeannie > > I don't see how that could be. Joni's lyrics was written in 1977. the M.A. movie was released in 1982... _________________________________________________________________ http://newlivehotmail.com - --------------------------------- Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 13:00:39 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: Re: Hammerstein Ballroom tribute concert Hey, Clive! I can't find any record of your previous postings. j clive sax wrote: Hi all, Long time no post. I wanted to put a request out for a favour. Many thanks Clive _________________________________________________________________ 100s of Music vouchers to be won with MSN Music https://www.musicmashup.co.uk/index.html - --------------------------------- Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 16:04:36 -0400 From: "anon anon" Subject: Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP > Or simply, Joni M and Michelangelo A were both only reffering to >Michelangelo B because of all of his clouds of the Sistine Chapel's >ceiling. > :) > > Jean > c'est possible _________________________________________________________________ Need a brain boost? Recharge with a stimulating game. Play now! http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=club_hotmailtextlink1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 13:31:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Randy Johnson Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2007 #296 thanks bob for the cover info. listened to snippets which only brought me on a mad search for Robert Downey Jr.s' cover of "River" on of all things an old Ally McBeal Christmas c.d. I think Joni once even mentioned his version favorably, that while not vocally and technically perfect, she dug the rawness in his cover. ditto for me. JMDL Digest wrote: JMDL Digest Wednesday, August 1 2007 Volume 2007 : Number 296 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: - -------- Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws and guitars (njc) ;) [jeannie Re: Shine sampler [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC [Gary Z ] Re: guitars, vobaculary and grammar (njc) ;) [jeannie Re: Eurofest 2008 [missblux@googlemail.com] Joni Covers, Volume 91 - Can't Get it at Starbucks! [Bob Muller Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC [Bob Muller ] Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC [Gary Z ] Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws (njc) [Em ] Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws and guitars (njc) ;) [Em Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC [Em ] Re: cockfighting & dog fighting laws (njc) [Jerry Notaro Shine stuff [Em ] countdown to S H I N E NJC & Bobble-heads ["Patti Parlette" Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC & Bobble-heads [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] joni video on cbc website [Mags ] Re: Court and Spark [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: Shine sampler [Motitan@aol.com] Re: guitars, vobaculary and grammar (njc) ;) [Motitan@aol.com] Re:NJC NJC NJC Shine sampler [Motitan@aol.com] Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP [jeannie Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws and guitars (njc) ;) [Debra Shea Ingmar Bergman, NJC ["Marion Leffler" ] Re: Michelangelo A, Michelangelo B, [jeannie Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP ["anon anon" Hammerstein Ballroom tribute concert [clive sax ] Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws and guitars (njc) ;) [jeannie Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP [jeannie Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP ["anon anon" "Cagney and lacey" ["anon anon" ] Re: Hammerstein Ballroom tribute concert [jeannie - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 00:04:15 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: Re: cockfighting & dogfighting laws and guitars (njc) ;) Hello Deborah! Yes, it is a blow, IMHO. I'm real and I don't like racism but it's all over, like it or not. As the tensions of these present days get tighter, it seems like I hear more intolerance being spewed out of people's mouths like vomit and the innocents are always the scapegoats. That's why I stay determined to stand up for my convictions as long as I hurt no one intentionally. That is why enlightening and education is of upmost importance to me and obviously to most here on the JMDL. I don't sit around glued to the tubes or wires feigning that everything is fine and dandy, including myself. We're in a constant struggle for higher ground, if one chooses the right paths. You don't think the Germans still don't feel Hitler's sting even though his horrible war crimes were commited going on 70 years already and he wasn't even a German? And yet he was a Christian when he hated all Jews, so he had to have hated Jesus, too. Hypocrisy, too, kills me. I feel everybody's sting and it hurts, so be cool, fool, with me. I'll "drag" or bring baseball into this, Deborah, if I choose so, because with all of this steroid abuse, the lives of these baseball players is in peril. So, I'm glad you brought it up, just to be able to say I care for their lives, too. And if that dude, Vick, has his job, I shall not feel fine with that and I'm glad all this happened. Until he doesn't start sanctifying all life, I know what his soul is all about and it's barbaric. And about your opinions, I accept them, without much fuss or anxiousness to get argumentative. Besides, I'm a baseball, soccer and cycling mom, myself. Laters, Ms. Shea, I know I'll talk to you again. Besides, I'm a ranting rock-n-roller tonight, if 'ya still feel like talking. Let's just play nice, okay Madam? jean NP: Ry Cooder's, My Name Is Buddy, and to me he plays the best guitar in the whole wide world. PS: Speaking about guitar playing, Warren Zevon played a bad-ass guitar himself and those guitar sounds were the best I ever heard live and that's why I would have followed him all over the world, had he lived. Oh, and I looove Van Morrison's guitar and Neil Young's and Joni Mitchell's and Rickie Lee Jones' along with Tom Waits' style and Lou Reed's, and Keith Richard's and so many more Artists of Truth and Beauty. :) Debra Shea wrote: - --- jeannie wrote: > It's a dirty blow to the African-American > population What? What does one guy's wicked behavior have to do with millions of other people? > who have had more than enough racism to deal with > for so long. Yes. It shows up sometimes in the oddest ways. > It's a black and scarlett mark on the > sport of baseball. Vick is the quarterback for the Atlanta Falcons, a football team. No need to drag baseball into it. > If they don't fire that baseball player's > cocky ass, I fear baseball's demise coming on > and soccer could take over, which could be a > better thing. I wouldn't mind soccer (grace and finesse) replacing American football (brute force -- from my point of view). Baseball's my game. Last report I heard Vick's still got his job, which is hard to believe considering the gruesome and illegal activities he organized. Debra Shea ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ - - --------------------------------- Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 18:22:19 +1000 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Re: Shine sampler Monika, I just extracted the little song samples from the Amanda Ghost interview with Joni. They are varying lengths from a couple of seconds to just over 2 minutes. If you're having trouble downloading it, I can e-mail them one at a time to you if you like. Mark. - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 04:15:10 -0400 From: Gary Z Subject: Re: countdown to S H I N E NJC Bob Muller wrote: In either case, I would pay a HUGE sum of dough for a Joni Bobble-head statue. Bob Or how about a Joni PEZ dispenser? You know there is an Elvis set of three dispensers (a military Elvis, young Elvis, and older Elvis) that have been released in the last month or so; in a round tin with a 3 song CD sampler included. PEZ said they would never make dispensers of humans. but they changed their minds recently and released the Orange County Choppers PEZ set, and now the Elvis PEZ set....;-) Best regards, Gary Z. - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 02:22:42 -0700 (PDT) From: jeannie Subject: Re: guitars, vobaculary and grammar (njc) ;) Please forgive my grammatical errors and unforgivable vocabulary and spelling mistakes and this snap-decision impatience I have to rush off my replies. I need to find another method for proof-reading and editing before I hit send. It's embarrassing! Any suggestions? jean jeannie wrote: Hello Deborah! Yes, it is a blow, IMHO. I'm real and I don't like racism but it's all over, like it or not. As the tensions of these present days get tighter, it seems like I hear more intolerance being spewed out of people's mouths like vomit and the innocents are always the scapegoats. That's why I stay determined to stand up for my convictions as long as I hurt no one intentionally. That is why enlightening and education is of upmost importance to me and obviously to most here on the JMDL. I don't sit around glued to the tubes or wires feigning that everything is fine and dandy, including myself. We're in a constant struggle for higher ground, if one chooses the right paths. You don't think the Germans still don't feel Hitler's sting even though his horrible war crimes were commited going on 70 years already and he wasn't even a German? And yet he was a Christian when he hated all Jews, so he had to have hated Jesus, too. Hypocrisy, too, kills me. I feel everybody's sting and it hurts, so be cool, fool, with me. I'll "drag" or bring baseball into this, Deborah, if I choose so, because with all of this steroid abuse, the lives of these baseball players is in peril. So, I'm glad you brought it up, just to be able to say I care for their lives, too. And if that dude, Vick, has his job, I shall not feel fine with that and I'm glad all this happened. Until he doesn't start sanctifying all life, I know what his soul is all about and it's barbaric. And about your opinions, I accept them, without much fuss or anxiousness to get argumentative. Besides, I'm a baseball, soccer and cycling mom, myself. Laters, Ms. Shea, I know I'll talk to you again. Besides, I'm a ranting rock-n-roller tonight, if 'ya still feel like talking. Let's just play nice, okay Madam? jean NP: Ry Cooder's, My Name Is Buddy, and to me he plays the best guitar in the whole wide world. PS: Speaking about guitar playing, Warren Zevon played a bad-ass guitar himself and those guitar sounds were the best I ever heard live and that's why I would have followed him all over the world, had he lived. Oh, and I looove Van Morrison's guitar and Neil Young's and Joni Mitchell's and Rickie Lee Jones' along with Tom Waits' style and Lou Reed's, and Keith Richard's and so many more Artists of Truth and Beauty. :) Debra Shea wrote: - - --- jeannie wrote: > It's a dirty blow to the African-American > population What? What does one guy's wicked behavior have to do with millions of other people? > who have had more than enough racism to deal with > for so long. Yes. It shows up sometimes in the oddest ways. > It's a black and scarlett mark on the > sport of baseball. Vick is the quarterback for the Atlanta Falcons, a football team. No need to drag baseball into it. > If they don't fire that baseball player's > cocky ass, I fear baseball's demise coming on > and soccer could take over, which could be a > better thing. I wouldn't mind soccer (grace and finesse) replacing American football (brute force -- from my point of view). Baseball's my game. Last report I heard Vick's still got his job, which is hard to believe considering the gruesome and illegal activities he organized. Debra Shea ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ - - --------------------------------- Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. - - --------------------------------- Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 11:28:41 +0200 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: Re: Eurofest 2008 Yes, Dave I want to be there! Thanks for asking.... I suffer from formula-phobia - knowing that I need to figure out if I still have a Pay-Pal account or if I should open a new one is enough to make me postpone signing up for days. For some reason, these things put me off in a way that is completely out of proportion. But I do want to go, and I want to camp put on the land. Lucy, I will read your email again and get it sorted. Will do.... Bene On 7/31/07, Dave Blackburn wrote: > What? No Dr. Bene or Marion nipping over the North Sea to join us in England > next year? It will be great to meet Oddmund, Catherine and the rest. > > So, Lucy, is there some kind of performance area at Holycombe with P.A or > are we envisioning bongos in the dirt around the oak tree? > > > > thanks, > > Dave - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 02:38:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Joni Covers, Volume 91 - Can't Get it at Starbucks! Howdy Ho, Joni fans. Hard to believe that the summer is starting to wind down, and that it's time to start talking about 'back to school' and such. And of course, here in America, all the stores will soon be aglow with Christmas displays. But enough of that...let's talk about something that's worthy of REAL celebration - yet another release in the never-ending series of Joni Mitchell Cover compilations. And August brings us to #91 as we inch our way to the Joni Cover Centennial. And as is the case with most of these, I've gone around the globe and back to bring it to you. As is usually the case, I didn't do it by myself. I gotta thank the JMDLer's who chipped in with this one, so a tip and a shake of the cap to Michael Paz and Mark-Leon Thorne for their help. So, let's get into it, shall we? Go get it here: http://download.yousendit.com/990D29456428EE17 And listen along while I jabber my spot-on evaluations and opinions about these artists & songs: 1. Michelle Branch - River: Michelle made an appearance on "Good Morning America" in December 2005 and performed Joni's happy holiday classic. Michelle is a semi-famous solo artist and also is half of The Wreckers, a country duo. Her take on River is quite nice and features some nice instrumentation too. 2. BeTI - Big Yellow Taxi: BeTI is short for "Beyond The Influences". This cover lifts it's arrangement from Janet Jackson's "Got 'til it's Gone" (even including the phrase at times) and as such is sort of a slow-soul-jam. While I don't necessarily dislike it, and I'm always happy to hear a BYT cover that doesn't just try and imitate the Crows' cover, this one goes on too long so a lot of makes it interesting to start with wears thin. 3. Rose Bygrave - Woodstock: Australia makes another fine contribution to the collection. The opening slide guitar sets the scene perfectly, and the pacing and harmonies are divine. She also inserts a unique bridge in the center. 4. Norbert Gottschalk - Both Sides Now: The first of a couple of German entries in this edition, Norbert's guitar playing is very nice and so is his voice, shining with a warmth that is highlighted by his nimble playing. 5. Susan Cowsill - A Case Of You: A JMDL exclusive! Susan has been a part of the music scene for a long time, first as part of The Cowsills and now a singer-songwriter on her own. I love the heartfelt quality of her voice, a perfect fit for this song. Also featured is some beautiful acoustic guitar to match. Susan also contributed "Chelsea Morning" and "The Last Time I Saw Richard" to the 2-CD Pazfest collection. 6. Satin Sheets - Big Yellow Taxi: Semi-Cheesy 70's instrumental arrangement, sounds like the MOA version played at 78 or maybe background music for a magician or a dog act - still, there's some nice horn work and in the right setting I suppose you could get into some serious twisting by the pool with it. 7. Brenda Morie - Twisted: Like her website says, it's a blending of smoky jazz vocals and rich flute. I've always been a flute fan, so I can dig this one as we don't get a lot of flute here in Jonicoverville. 8. Poon Sow Keng - Both Sides Now: Chinese-language version of BSN. To my ears a pretty and tender version of the song. 9. Denise Kaufmann - Edith And The Kingpin: Denise recorded this track in 1976, and that's pretty noteworthy as HOSL had not been out long at that time. She obviously had a better jump on lots of the press that had dismissed the album. Denise stays pretty true to the original arrangement but puts several personal twists and spins on some of the melodic lines. Me likey. 10. Denise Kaufmann - The Last I Saw Richard: Like her or not, you have to give Ms. Kaufmann credit for digging deep into Joni's catalogue for covers. Denise substitutes James Taylor-like guitar for piano and once again sticks close to Joni's arrangement, offering some small deviations to help put her own stamp on it. 11. No Fixed Abode - Big Yellow Taxi: This folk duo from England offers up a spirited version of BYT. Some nice original vocal touches, a solid effort throughout. 12. Steven Curtis Chapman - The Circle Game: From his 2005 CD "Musical Blessings", and a nice fresh arrangement that sets SCC up to navigate the melody in a very pleasant fashion. If I remember correctly, SCC is mostly a Christian-music artist, and has adopted Chinese children. He pays tribute to that union by including a Chinese children's choir here and including part of the chorus in Chinese and part in English. I find it very moving and I like this track a lot. He also release a video to promote the track. 13. b-flower - Both Sides Now: Japanese pop-folk with Byrds-like jangly guitars. I like the peppy arrangement but not so much for the vocal. Although I suppose the liteness and airiness of it complements the musical setting. 14. Rafael Jung Trio with Britta Rex - The Dry Cleaner From Des Moines: Germany sends this one to us, a solid jazz workout with some great solos from all concerned. Although I hear drums, guitar, bass, organ - not sure how many other members in the 'trio', but that's a minor point as this track is such a strong one. Britta's vocals complement the band and she navigates the changes with ease and even throws in some blue-scatting. 15. Ralph Usdan - Carey: Hmmm...this one hits the ear pretty hard. Ralph's Johnny Cash-wannabe voice is more basso profundo which is odd enough when you're used to hearing Joni's soaring soprano. He alters the lyrics in order to switch gender..."Carey, I'll whip out my cane"??? Reminds me of Blazing Saddles. Will probably not be your favorite track on this one. 16. Linda Wilmot - Big Yellow Taxi: Basic GwG, nothing to get overly excited about. Both girl and guitar are pretty dull. Better than Track 20 at least. 17. Plastik - A Case Of You: Also from England, this website-download-only track came out in 2006. Plastik typically rocks pretty hard so this is a bit of a different sound for them. I don't particularly care for the male vocalist, a bit too much warble and emoting for my tastes. I do like the backing musicians and arrangement however. 18. Julian Dawson - The Gallery: Another English entry, Julian is based in Somerset and is a solo artist as well as a member of the group Plainsong. This Graham Nash-like take on The Gallery (a very underdone song in the Joni canon) was part of his latest CD which was a tribute to women songwriters titled "Nothing Like A Dame". 19. Husker Du - "You're So Square, Baby I Don't Care": I'm happy to include this one, never released by the 80's SST power trio but included on a live bootleg LP. Puts their heavy, dark and fast stylings on display, and stretches out to 4-minutes what most folks do in two. Bob Mould went on to a memorable career, both solo and as the leader of Sugar Blue. 20. David Devaney, Jr. - Big Yellow Taxi: Bad karaoke. In a perfect world, this track would not exist. Hate to end such a fine volume on such a crappy note - but hey, if I'd have kicked #91 off with this track you might not have kept listening. Anyway, hope you found a couple here that you like - as always thanks for reading, thanks for listening, and thanks as always to Joni for writing such an incredible catalogue of songs that continue to inspire musicians from all corners of the world. === message truncated === ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 16:31:54 -0400 From: Victor Johnson Subject: Re: Ingmar Bergman and Michelangelo Antonioni-RIP On Aug 1, 2007, at 3:52 PM, jeannie wrote: > Oh, okay, now with actual dates, this circle game is just a play > with synchronicity. So, Joni did mean MichelAngelo B after all. > > You think maybe Michelangelo A. could have been referring to both > Joni M and Michelangelo B? > > Or simply, Joni M and Michelangelo A were both only reffering to > Michelangelo B because of all of his clouds of the Sistine Chapel's > ceiling. > :) > > Jean It must have been the collective unconscious. I've been working on a new song called "Shine", completely unrelated to Joni's upcoming release. It will be pretty cool if I can just get it done. Sometimes wrapping it up is the hardest part. Victor ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 13:43:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Smurf Subject: Re: native american -- joni -- now workplace conversation -- now njc Congratulations! You are my 5000th unread (until now) JMDL post since last Christmas! (Although I do my best to keep up, that's how far behind I have fallen.) Funny this post would also happen to be from my girl Shirl! Carry on! XO, --Smurf Patti Parlette wrote: More workplace Joni! I love it! I just had a nice visit with one of our graduate students who is fast becoming a close friend. He comes for conversation; I comfort him sometimes. He's in Comparative Literature but he has got a thing that's unique and new with Native American Studies. And guess what! He's a Lakota! So, of course, I shared the lyrics with him. He said "wakan" loosely translates to "holy", in case any of you did not know that. (I did not.) Mother earth Mother Rocks pity me Father sky Father Water Standing in a wakan manner Mother earth Oh pity me In a wakan manner, I teach him about Joni, and he teaches me about Native Americans. It's a rich exchange, seems to me. I know no one's going to show me everything, but he showed me a lot in just half an hour. He said the that http://www.indianz.com/ is a good and reliable website to jump off from to other links and stuff. And THEN (oh, I am having to stifle myself, I'm giggling somethin' awful) he recommended a book, "Roofwalker" by Susan Power, about the Native American experience in Chicago. He said the author used to go the American Indian Center (?) there where she got beat up by you won't believe this, Bobble-head Bob HILLBILLYS! Bwaaaa haaa haaa! I think I'm going right out of my head days with all this Joni dizzy-dancing euphoria and JMDL synchronicity (Indians and hillbillys?). Theo then went on tell me that he is half Lakota from his dad and HALF HILLBILLY from his mom who is 1/2 Eastern Cherokee (Louise!) from Blount County, TN. Hey, honey, you got lots of cash, bring us out a bottle and we'll have some laughs! MoonSHINE's what I'm drinking...... Love, Patti P. "Treat the Earth well, it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your Children. We don't inherit the Earth from our Ancestors We borrow it from our Children." (Proverb posted UConn's Native American Cultural Society Office website) I know you will like that one, Earth Mother Marianne! ; ) Put away that DDT now. Marianne wrote: I heard a native american woman being interviewed the other day on the radio. . and her voice reminded me of Joni in some way. the way the words are pronounced I guess this strikes me because I seem to hold native americans with highest esteem. . I often wish /dream that I have native blood. . . but maybe I am only native in my heart. . native americans and their reverence for the earth, animals, the sky, water, air, fire. . every bit of life. . the rocks the soil seven generations. . etc. land preservation reverence spirit that's all where it's all at. . and joni. . this is what joni seems to be about. . so when I hear joni's voice lately I seem to hear the native voice. "let the wind carry me. . ." bring me closer to all these things it's a spirituality. . etc.). . maybe I will make a list sometime Marianne _________________________________________________________________ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 - --------------------------------- Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2007 20:49:31 +0000 From: "Patti Parlette" Subject: cockfighting and dogfighting njc Dreaming of the pleasure I'm going to have watching Huh? Dog eat dog? Dogs ripping each other apart? Who gets pleasure out of watching vicious dogs rip the flesh off of other dogs in mean ugly snarling growling violent attacks? What I cannot fathom is that there is any audience for this at all, anywhere. Pardon my French, but that's some really sick merde. Degoulasse. With trembling in my bones, Patti P. _________________________________________________________________ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_pcmag_0507 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 16:54:18 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Covers #91 You're welcome, Randy - glad you took me up on it and went and snagged it. I'm with you on the Robert Downey Jr. cover - it's a goodie. Just saw him in "Zodiac" and thought he did a real good job, but then he seems to always be solid. Bob NP: Led Zeppelin, "Candy Store Rock" - ------------------------------------------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. 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I found this page of audio and video, which I haven't seen before: http://archives.cbc.ca/IDD-1-68-2462/arts_entertainment/joni_mitchell/ Doug Mags wrote: > Ive tried to run this but for some reason, cannot get it to work. however, here's the link to the cbc home page, where you'll find the video The Scene: Joni Mitchell. > > if anyone has a suggestion as to how i can get this to work, pls let me know off list, thanks > > mags > > > --------------------------------- > All new Yahoo! Mail > --------------------------------- > Get news delivered. Enjoy RSS feeds right on your Mail page. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 23:51:00 +0200 From: missblux@googlemail.com Subject: NJC Hitler For all I know, Hitler was very ambiguous about religion, sometimes he would talk as if he were a Christian, but I believe that fundamentally, National Socialism and his own role in it were just not compatible with Christianity, given that the ideology was more like a religion and he was supposed to be the Saviour.... Did you know that the -olf-part of his name means wolf, and that the town of Wolfsburg where they produce the Volkswagen was named after him and, as far as I remember, destined to be some sort of retreat for him after the war was over? I don't think Volkswagen like to make a big fuss about that. BN Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 10:58:00 EDT From: Motitan@aol.com Subject: Re: guitars, vobaculary and grammar (njc) ;) In a message dated 8/1/2007 5:24:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dreamin1957jeannie@yahoo.com writes: You don't think the Germans still don't feel Hitler's sting even though his horrible war crimes were commited going on 70 years already and he wasn't even a German? And yet he was a Christian when he hated all Jews, so he had to have hated Jesus, too. Hypocrisy, too, kills me. - - ------------------------------------------------------ Ok I realizing I'm going sort off topic here highlighting just a point you mentioned but I find Hitler/Nazis/WW II fascinating. As far as hypocrisy goes, you're right. Hitler was one of the biggest hypocrites to have ever lived. He hated Jews even though he had Jewish blood in his family. He thought up his Master race as "German, not Jewish of course, blonde, etc etc" even though he was hardly any of the things he thought were superior. It is just fascinating to me how such men could grow to be so powerful with so much hate in their hearts. I realize that fear is the greatest motivator but fear can only be attributed so far to this. I remember reading before how nearly every German household had a copy of Mein Kampf (before the reign of Hitler) yet hardly anyone read it. Had anyone read it, they may have prevented themselves a lot of trouble and tragedy to see the danger Adolf Hitler represented as it truly was before fear set in. Mein Kampf is a good read if you haven't read it. Obviously not a good read in that its entertaining like a normal book or in that you "get" something out of it but more because its asbolutely mind boggling to see how twisted Hitler really is. Crazy. - - -Monika ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2007 00:50:56 +0200 From: "Marion Leffler" Subject: SV: JMDL Digest V2007 #290 Bruce, you certainly have been diving deep into the well of passion but I think we could agree upon that we all interpret lyrics against the background of our own experiences, hopes, dreams, fears, memories, moods, emotions, knowledge, past and present. In other words, the lyrics have the meaning we each give them and none of us are right or wrong. That's the beauty of a good poem, isn't it? Marion - -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fren: owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org [mailto:owner-onlyjoni@smoe.org] Fvr Bruce Eggleston Skickat: den 31 juli 2007 08:24 Till: joni@smoe.org Kopia: DONALD SHEARER Dmne: Re: JMDL Digest V2007 #290 I beg to differ with both points of view on the line "I could drink a case of you and still be on my feet". This is my signature line from my signature song from my favorite Joni album, so I have spent much time contemplating this wonderful metaphor. I see this as the height of passion, where no thought or substance is greater than her feelings for the object of her desire. She laughs off the strong intoxicants because her love and raw desire are much stronger, and she is able to persist in her passion, to still be on her feet. This is the essence of aggressive determined passion. The key to this interpretation is the lines, "I drew a map of Canada, Oh, Canada, And your face sketched on it twice." In that moment of loneliness she calls out to her innermost roots, Oh, Canada, in an epiphany of longing and sorrow for the way things were and the way they might have been. In the center of that passionate outburst for home and sanctuary, your (his) face was sketched on it twice. In the vortex of the duality of loss and passion, of home and loneliness, she recites the litaney, "You are in my blood like holy wine Oh, and you taste so bitter but you taste so sweet Oh I could drink a case of you I could drink a case of you, darling And I would still be on my feet Oh, I'd still be on my feet." This is the divine passion, beyond the mundane, beyond ideomatic logic, pure Joni. Then she turns to the threnody, [ORIGIN mid 17th cent.: from Greek thrDnEidia, from thrDnos bwailingb + EidD bsong.b] "Oh, I am a lonely painter I live in a box of paints. I'm frightened by the devil And I'm drawn to those ones that ain't afraid." The passion and outpouring has passed and deep introspection has set in. Joni could have ended the song there, but she divines this coda, a visit from the saintly Mother, "I met a woman, she had a mouth like yours". The Mother causes passion to well up again, but this time around she says, "You're my holy wine", moving form the metaphor to the fact. Bonneville Bruce A Case of You Just before our love got lost you said I am as constant as a northern star And I said, constant in the darkness Wheres that at? If you want me I'll be in the bar. On the back of a cartoon coaster In the blue tv screen light, I drew a map of Canada, Oh, Canada, And your face sketched on it twice. Oh, you are in my blood like holy wine Oh, and you taste so bitter but you taste so sweet Oh I could drink a case of you I could drink a case of you, darling And I would still be on my feet Oh, I'd still be on my feet. Oh, I am a lonely painter I live in a box of paints. I'm frightened by the devil And I'm drawn to those ones that ain't afraid. I remember that time that you told me, you said, Love is touching souls, Surely you touched mine Cause part of you pours out of me In these lines from time to time. Oh you are in my blood like holy wine, And you taste so bitter but you taste so sweet Oh I could drink a case of you, I could drink a case of you darl,ing Still I'd be on my feet, And still be on my feet. I met a woman, She had a mouth like yours She knew your life She knew your devils and your deeds And she said, Color go to him, stay with him if you can, Oh but be prepared to bleed, Oh, but you are in my blood you're my holy wine Oh, and you taste so bitter, bitter, and so sweet Oh, I could drink a case of you darling, Still I'd be on my feet, I'd still be on my feet. On Jul 30, 2007, at 1:00 AM, JMDL Digest wrote: > Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2007 14:55:12 +0200 > From: "Marion Leffler" > Subject: A case of you > > Hi all, > > Kevin wrote: > > > > "As I was on a roll I remembered that anther posting said they > could not > > understand the line from "Case of You" - why would you want to > drink a case > of > > you but still be on my feet". I see this as Joni's way of putting > someone > down > > bigtime. This shows that Joni can be ruthless: "constantly in the > > darkness...where's that at?...if you want me I'll be in the bar"; > the image > of being > > two-faced (bitter and sweet/ darkness and light). In contrast to > Strange > Boy" > > where love is the strongest poison and medicine of all the "love" that > exists > > between her and her lover is now as strong as diet coke!" > > > > I beg to differ, Kevin! I think that what she means is that > although he is > "in her blood like holy wine" she will get over him and "still be > on her > feet". That's not putting somebody down as much as encouraging > oneself to > move on. > > > > Marion ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 19:01:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: [RE]countdown to S H I N E - --- Suze Cameron wrote: > 57 things to do each day while waiting for SHINE > > August 19th - decide if 'reuben' tipping is really a > sport OK, I give up. What is reuben tipping? Or should it be who is Reuben Tipping? If it has anything to do with American politics, or anything to do with baseball or football, no need to answer. P.S. I'm guessing you kind of like "Gratitude." Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 16:35:07 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: NJC for the sake of discussion: "Through being cool" For no particular reason other than seeing what kind of comments transpire, I feel like sharing this here: http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/bos/367672638.html Lori Santa Rosa, CA ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 20:11:31 -0400 From: Victor Johnson Subject: Re: NJC for the sake of discussion: "Through being cool" "American boys don't have this. The best have a much weaker version of this, but the commitment is conditional and halting, the bonds constantly tested by vicious games of conformity and obedience. Maybe men at war have the real thing, but I have no experience of this. Coming back to the USA, I had to teach my male friends to be mates, and it never came naturally to any of my new friends. I have American mates now, some of whom I've been friends with for twenty years, but it took an enormous amount of work, and included really rocky periods, and a lot of struggle. New people I meet, especially younger people, have no understanding of what it means to be a mate. Friendships, especially among young people, are temporary, fleeting, strategic. They exist in order to jockey for social position. American men seem treacherous, insecure, and ungrounded in comparison to Aussie men. It's killing us as a society. It's one of the great tragedies of our time." - ------------------------------------------------- This reminds me of my ex-girlfriend from France who would constantly tell me how stupid American girls were. Maybe some people fit his description but certainly not enough to make such a generalization. To say he's a bit jaded would be an understatement. Victor On Aug 1, 2007, at 7:35 PM, Lori Fye wrote: > For no particular reason other than seeing what kind of comments > transpire, > I feel like sharing this here: > > http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/bos/367672638.html > > Lori > Santa Rosa, CA ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 17:16:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Muller Subject: Re: NJC for the sake of discussion: "Through being cool" Not overly impressed with this essay - for one thing, the guy seems to flutter from one point to the next. I don't get the thrust of what his focus is. Does he think that people need to resort to fisticuffs more to have friends and improve their self-esteem? I would hope that we've risen above that, though I will say that it's important to stand up for what you believe in. I've got 4-5 solid "mates" for over 30 years now, and we never had to engage in fighting matches to prove our manliness or friendship to each other. Generalizations are always bad. I can't tell you how many times I was picked last for games in school, but I didn't turn into some kind of pretentious rebelious type. And by the same token, I'm now a much better athlete than most of my peers. This essay may be wasted on this particular group. I don't think Joni fans, especially in the 21st century give a toss about being cool. Did we ever? Thanks for the opener. Bob NP: Rickie Lee Jones, "Bitchenostrophy" - --------------------------------- Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 20:48:58 EDT From: Motitan@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Hitler In a message dated 8/1/2007 5:51:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, missblux@googlemail.com writes: Did you know that the -olf-part of his name means wolf, and that the town of Wolfsburg where they produce the Volkswagen was named after him and, as far as I remember, destined to be some sort of retreat for him after the war was over? I don't think Volkswagen like to make a big fuss about that. BN - ------------------------------------------ Wow, I did not know that. That's definitely not something to brag about! Did you know Time magazine named him "man of the year" at some point? I can't recall the exact year though. Man of the year, eh? What are the qualifications? Not very high standards I presume... Did any of you ever see a program that aired not too long ago on the History channel about Hitler's family? It seems there are still a few people/families related to him. The sad thing is, even though these families have nothing more in common with him than unfortunately blood, they hide their family history well. It seems a shame you'd have to live in secrecy like that when surely you have no Nazi relations. It also seems that the families that are left are slowly trying to disappear. I mean, the youngest are not having children. I think the family wants the "family name" to die out.... - -Mon ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 23:46:53 +0200 From: "Oddmund Kaarevik" Subject: SJC (LONG) Racism, but also (Starbucks) both sides now... This weekend I attended on of the concerts in beautiful Arendal and the Canal Street Blues and Jazz festival (yes, I know they have an image problem, they want to grasp the whole of it.) Last saturday Lauryn Hill held a consert ,I wasn4t there but heard from inside staff that it wasn4t a great concert. Than again I love Lauryn Hills music, especially the songs of MTV unplugged 2.0 I was therefore sadened to hear that she would only have black guards. Imagine a white artist like Madonna or Joni saying that they only wanted white guards. That would have been in the front pages: under racism. Unfortunately Lauryn gets away with it. Now I know that black have a long history of racism behind them, and I can see why Lauryn here in some way here seem to want to give it back to white, but is this the way to go? Even though this is racism the other way around if what has been ususal in the western world, it still is racism. And it makes me sad that a great artist like Lauryn Hill judge her fellow human beings on behalf of the color of their skin. The organizers in Arendal was just happy that they had two black people (remember were in south of Norway, and the black population isnt too big here) in the staff to please Lauryn4s needs, but it just makes me wear very heavy boots, indeed. I had hoped that we now had come a bit further. But I just guess that all of us, each and one of us just have to go inside ourselfes and fight racism, sexism or whatever kind of surpressing when it4s found near us, and when we have the nerve and the energy to do so. Because, I was dreamin, in dreamin - a livng aspect, bright and fair.... In my living aspect a merge between the great music and composer Joni Mitchell and the beautiful, strong and politically moving artist Ani DiFanco would really rock my world. Oh that would be something, so right.... Of course I4m grateful for Joni getting back to music, and Starbucks inspiring her to do so, and me neither have any strong thoughts about Starbucks since I4ve never had one or TEN in my city. But we do have McDonalds here in Norway. Imagine Joni collaborate with them. Would we then have the same forgiving and reconciling tone...? In some respect I must give Owen and others who has raised their voice against Starbucks cooperation some right. Because Joni did really critizise both Geffen and Reprise for turning into multiconglemorats, we,ve all read dozens of interviews quoting that. Than , her sgning up with Starbuck makes me realize that this wasn4t any big time social critiscism raised from the voice of our great Lady of duality , after all this was just the hurted child, Joni, letting out her anger for being dropped, (and who could blame her for that) So what appears to be social critique, was maybe just, well feelings... Hmm. Well, we all have to look from life from both sides, now. And I don4t think Joni has signed up with the devil. But I4m sure she could do better, if she wanted to....So in my dreamin, it would be like our dear Alison Krauss mangement person says - signed up with Ani DiFranco. A modern symbol of female mepowerment - Righeteous babe! Well, I4m starting to be agitating here...How do you stop, how do I stop...Have to ask Joni, i guess And if Starbuck is able of giving joni to the people - of course I4m grateful for that. It4s the only cure. "There ain4t no cure for love", Cohen has told us, but there are some cure for sorrow, and Joni is some main inspiration for me here...So don4t interrupt the sorrow, darn right !!! Oh that energy. Oh that Joni. oh CANADA ! Our lady of duality.... And despite this quite heavy political content - coming from me i wish you all love and peace ! Oddmund, for the time being in Tromsoe, the most exotic city in Norway. Where the sun never sets, and IT still is light 10 to mdnight, norwegian time... ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2007 #297 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------