From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2007 #123 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, March 21 2007 Volume 2007 : Number 123 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni's mama [Em ] Shine [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Download info [PassScribe@aol.com] [none] ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Blaming The Soldiers ["Colin Bishop" ] Myrtle [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Blaming The Soldiers ["Snatch N. Grabster" ] RE: BSN and Sufjan cover and more ["Richard Flynn" ] Re: dreaming [Kate Johnson ] NJC Re: dreaming now dying [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying ["Gerald A. Notaro" ] TCE - Bessborough plate [Kate Johnson ] RE: Good Old Days (Re: Joni and Folk) NJC ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Guardian article [Mike and Patti Haskins ] RE: Feminist choice (njc) ["Bree Mcdonough" ] the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC [Dave Blackbur] RE: Good Old Days NJC ["Bree Mcdonough" ] latest JM interview [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Blaming The Soldiers ["Randy Remote" ] Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying [Victor Johnson ] Myrtle [Les Irvin ] Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: NJC dreaming now dying [Debra ] RE: Good Old Days NJC [Debra ] Re: Good Old Days NJC [Debra ] Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC ["ron" ] Re: Joni's mama, the Sax Q and Joni Dreams ["P Bear" ] Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC [Michael P] Re: Good Old Days NJC [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC [Chris Mar] Saskatoon StarPhoenix Headline ["Randy Remote" ] Mrs Anderson's obituary ["Michael O'Malley" ] Joan ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Re: Myrtle ["Lori Fye" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 04:31:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Joni's mama and here's another - Joan Baez's father, Albert Baez, passed away yesterday. He was in his 90's also. Em - --- Victor Johnson wrote: > On Mar 20, 2007, at 8:18 PM, > > wrote: > > > This may have already been posted but I heard from a good source > > that Joni's > > mother passed away yesterday. It must be a terrible loss for her. > > > RIP dear > > Myrtle. > > > > Kakki > > > That's so weird as my best friend Amy's mother passed away yesterday > > as well...about 2:00am in the morning. We had been expecting her > to go pretty soon (she suffered from Parkinson's disease) but it is > never easy. Amy's mother raised her single handedly as her father > abandoned them when she was little. Amy had spent the last 5 years > or so caring for her herself and working full time. A nurse came 5 > days a week but it was still an enormous task and she always put it > before anything else. One reason I admire her so much. The memorial > > service is scheduled for Thursday and her mother told Amy several > years ago she wanted me to sing at her funeral, so I will be singing > > "Fire and Rain" by James Taylor. Oddly enough I sang in a choral > performance tonight w/orchestra accompaniment, Faure's Requiem, an > achingly beautiful peace...sad but beautiful. Maybe it was for > Myrtle and Jeri, Amy's mom. > > Victor, amazingly at peace with all of this...music is the best > medicine(and laughter) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:04:07 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Shine Thanks to all that posted Shine in various places so we all could hear it. Again, it points out that lower fidelity can promote speed and wideness of distribution in this digital information age we live in. I was much more impressed with the new music than some of you seem to be. I9m not one for worshipping at her altar. I9ve been critical of some of her work. But considering we thought we would never get any new music or performances from her, this is a treasure. And ANY time Joni approaches a piano is a time for celebrating. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:25:57 EDT From: PassScribe@aol.com Subject: Re: Download info > From: Mark-Leon Thorne > Subject: Re: Come In From The Cold: The Return of Joni Mitchell > > For those who didn't get to hear the show or can't stream it, I think > this turned out to be a pretty good recording. I only missed the first > 3 or 4 words of Amanda's introduction. WireTap records in AIFF > uncompressed format and then I converted it to a fairly high bitrate > mp3. The file is about 79Mb. > > Download it here: http://download.yousendit.com/1D68F98A7A4ACB93 > > I signed up for an account, Mark, but I don't understand how I get to download the file. I don't see a place to put in what I want to download or a menu to search for the above file. What am I doing wrong? Kenny B P.S. I'm also looking for a part-time job, having retired from my regular full-time job in July and receiving Social Security now. Anyone with a job lead would be appreciated. ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:42:36 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: [none] very sorry to hear about joni's mom. . my condolences. . I wish her well on her new journey (Myrtle) Joni, I wish you well on your new journey too. . (when your parent dies your life changes) very sad to hear the news. "like the turn of a page. . (time with those you love) _________________________________________________________________ Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon. http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglinemarch07 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:53:38 -0000 From: "Colin Bishop" Subject: Blaming The Soldiers It is a pity that Joni didn't disassociate Bob Dylan from her remark regarding the 'folkies' or 'protest singers' blaming the soldiers? Dylan is associated with both of those categories in people's minds, however much he tried to distance himself, but he didn't 'blame the soldiers'? Listen to 'Who Killed Davy Moore' for instance which questions the very fact of the assumed blameworthy person. I don't think that John Brown was blamed either in Dylan's song of the same name. This matter exhibits very well the error in putting artists into bags. Yes Dylan will be always identified with protest, but he wasn't a protest singer. Was he as superficial or literal as the genre exemplified by the protest song 'Eve of Destruction' for instance? I put Joni right up there with Dylan as an artist but maybe she was a piece wilful here? Considering I love Joni it is a surprise that I have another gripe regarding the BBC R2 show last evening. Poets muddy their meanings? Exactly the opposite surely? They attempt to give us deeper feelings, connections, experience by not using literal language? Ie widen the meaning rather than obscure it. I have only written once before in the years that I have been a JMDLer, now two in two days. No prizes for anyone who says no wonder! Colin Bishop, Northampton, England. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:59:19 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Myrtle I hope you all don9t mind but I left a general message of condolence from JMDL in Myrtle9s Guest Book. You can leave a message at: http://www.legacy.com/can-saskatoon/GB/GuestbookEntry.aspx?&PersonID=8688385 5 Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:17:46 -0500 From: "Snatch N. Grabster" Subject: Re: Blaming The Soldiers When exactly did Dylan reference the Vietnam War in any song? This is one issue where Bob more or less remained silent. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:02:01 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: BSN and Sufjan cover While it wasn't what I was originally hearing in my head, it was the fluorish of creativity and originality that Sufjan brings to his work. For me, if a cover is going to be interesting it should feature something original, something that the interpreter brings to it that is of themselves. As far as I am concerned, changing the words is a big NO. (See Billy Squier's embarrassing take on "River"..."It's coming on twilight"...etc) So I really like it when a cover plays with melody and/or tempo or brings something new to the party. Sufjan doesn't employ a new melody as much as he shifts the melody - I hear lots of Joni's original melodic structure in it. And of course the tempo is all Sufjan - I would have been disappointed had he just done a 'karaoke' version with everything the same except for his voice in place of Joni's. As the best covers always are! FMIP has been a consistent drawing card for creative interpretation. There's Andy Milne's rap version, Jimmy Winchell's gloomy depressed version, The Rhythm Method's acapella version, Count Zero's 'Bela Lugosi' version, and of course Neil Diamond's over-the-top dramatic Vegas version. Such is the appeal of Joni's creation. And of course I'm not implying that you're WRONG, Michael - it's all a matter of personal taste and preference anyway. Bob NP: Joni, "People's Parties" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:36:19 -0400 From: "anon anon" Subject: RE: Blaming The Soldiers >From: "Colin Bishop" >Reply-To: "Colin Bishop" >To: >Subject: Blaming The Soldiers >Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:53:38 -0000 > >It is a pity that Joni didn't disassociate Bob Dylan from her remark >regarding the 'folkies' or 'protest singers' blaming the soldiers? Dylan >is >associated with both of those categories in people's minds, however much he >tried to distance himself, but he didn't 'blame the soldiers'? > > > >Listen to 'Who Killed Davy Moore' for instance which questions the very >fact >of the assumed blameworthy person. I don't think that John Brown was >blamed >either in Dylan's song of the same name. This matter exhibits very well >the >error in putting artists into bags. Yes Dylan will be always identified >with protest, but he wasn't a protest singer. Was he as superficial or >literal as the genre exemplified by the protest song 'Eve of Destruction' >for instance? I put Joni right up there with Dylan as an artist but maybe >she was a piece wilful here? > > > >Considering I love Joni it is a surprise that I have another gripe >regarding >the BBC R2 show last evening. Poets muddy their meanings? Exactly the >opposite surely? They attempt to give us deeper feelings, connections, >experience by not using literal language? Ie widen the meaning rather than >obscure it. > > > >I have only written once before in the years that I have been a JMDLer, now >two in two days. No prizes for anyone who says no wonder! > > > >Colin Bishop, Northampton, England. I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here, but I don't think that many people blame the soldiers... Some do I know, but most do not I don't think... the song "universal soldier" does seem to blame them, if I understand the song correctly... I do think that war is a terrible, horrendous thing... but many of the people who join the military don't realize what they have signed up for.. they are joining for other reasons... and as sad as it is, arguably there are times when war is unavoidable... World War 2 for example, or when your country is attacked... I say arguably, becuase even in these situations there might be a better way to deal with it, but I think that it IS arguable... I blame the insane leaders like Bush, Cheney,Rumsfeld etc... who send young people off to die and be injured in unnecessary, misguided wars, while huge corporations make billions of dollars off of these wars... Dylan's "masters of war" is one of my favorite songs... _________________________________________________________________ Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon. http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglinemarch07 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:49:40 -0400 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: BSN and Sufjan cover and more I can't say I'm fond of this version, but I've never been much impressed with this artist either. The lyrics are the same, the melody too severely modified, and the chord progression seems inverted. Like listening through a funhouse mirror. While not uninteresting, it strikes me as pretty pretentious. While I enjoyed the interview, I agree with what others here have said about Joni spouting off about things she doesn't really know about. Take poetry, for example: she keeps referring to "rhyme-scheme" when clearly she means "metrical pattern." She says she doesn't write lyrics first because she'll get lock into a lockstep iambic pattern. (This is undoubtedly a wise composing strategy). But then she sets the utterly regular iambic doggerel of Kipling's "If" to music. I also agree with the folks here who point out her reductive assessment of her generation's protest music. At the same time, she was quite charming in the interview. But someone's being a little too stingy with the "Shine" preview. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:54:29 -0400 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: Blaming The Soldiers I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here, but I don't think that many people blame the soldiers... Some do I know, but most do not I don't think... the song "universal soldier" does seem to blame them, if I understand the song correctly... The key to "Universal Soldier" is that blame is both universal and particular. Buffy Sainte-Marie points out that no one is exempt from blame: http://www.creative-native.com/lyrics/univelyr.htm _________________________________________________________________ Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon. http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglinemar ch07 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:00:32 -0500 From: Kate Johnson Subject: Re: dreaming On 21-Mar-07, at 2:00 AM, onlyJMDL Digest wrote: > The weird thing is how REAL some dreams seem, to the point where I've > woken up and believed what happened in the dream actually took > place. More > than > once, I've dreamed about finding the first car I owned again (1950 > Merc > convert), after so many years, and buying it back. When I've woken > up after a > couple > of those, I actually thought it was parked in my garage until > reality set in. LOL Then you'll perfectly understand, Kenny, why I've sometimes been very angry (with good reason, naturally) at my spouse, in a dream, and when I've woken up it's taken me a while to warm up to him again. Poor bugger, I'm sure there are times he feels he can't win for losing! *** It must be nice to have your mother live into her nineties, but just as painful to have her die old as to see her die young, I bet. I suppose Joni is at the Bessborough by now ... I still haven't found out if she got the plate I left there for her. Sure hope so. Kate http://xoetc.antville.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 11:22:42 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: NJC Re: dreaming now dying My Mom died very young, so there is that sense of loss in them not being there for things. She loved her grandchildren and though she was able to know them all, she was not able to watch them grow up. Of course, it's a natural course of events for our parents to precede us in death, but that fact doesn't make it any easier nor does a parent's age - except that there is a realization that people like Myrtle pretty much got to accomplish what they wanted to in terms of having enough time. Certainly was not the case with my Mom. The big thing though is that regardless of age, no one wants to see a loved one suffer for an extended time. One of the wonderful things about the CBC interviews with Bill & Myrtle is that you get the sense that they are still very sharp, so I'm glad that Joni and Bill have not had to deal with an extended illness. My wife's grandfather just passed Monday at 93 after a tough year of dealing with Alzheimer's. Meanwhile, the guy in the next cubicle is celebrating the birth of his first grandson, which leads me to think of Joni's line about 'death & birth & death & birth..." Bob NP: Tom Waits, "Virginia Avenue" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 11:34:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald A. Notaro" Subject: Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying My mother says that after 25 years of her mother dying she still has the urge to run to the phone when something very good or very bad happens to her. She also says there are two stages of your life, before and after your mother's life. I guess Joni now begins the second. Jerry Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > as painful to have her die old as to see her die young, I bet.> > > My Mom died very young, so there is that sense of loss in them not being > there for things. She loved her grandchildren and though she was able to > know them all, she was not able to watch them grow up. Of course, it's a > natural course of events for our parents to precede us in death, but that > fact doesn't make it any easier nor does a parent's age - except that > there is a realization that people like Myrtle pretty much got to > accomplish what they wanted to in terms of having enough time. Certainly > was not the case with my Mom. > > The big thing though is that regardless of age, no one wants to see a > loved one suffer for an extended time. One of the wonderful things about > the CBC interviews with Bill & Myrtle is that you get the sense that they > are still very sharp, so I'm glad that Joni and Bill have not had to deal > with an extended illness. My wife's grandfather just passed Monday at 93 > after a tough year of dealing with Alzheimer's. > > Meanwhile, the guy in the next cubicle is celebrating the birth of his > first grandson, which leads me to think of Joni's line about 'death & > birth & death & birth..." > > Bob > > NP: Tom Waits, "Virginia Avenue" > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > The information transmitted is intended only for the person > or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, > business-confidential and/or privileged material. > If you are not the intended recipient of this message you > are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, > dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken > in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received > this in error, please contact the sender and delete the > material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message > are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect > the views of the company. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:44:14 -0500 From: Kate Johnson Subject: TCE - Bessborough plate Just called the hotel and yes, she picked up the plate a couple weeks ago. I am glad it didn't disappear into the ethers like that mask a few years ago. If anyone is interested in seeing what the plate looks like, email me offlist. I don't know how Our Joan responded to the actual item when she received it, but can tell you that she was interested enough to respond with a resounding "yes please" via her manager's office when I offered it to her. I was not expecting a thank you note or anything, but feel quite certain Joni tried to call and simply could never get through, as I am always working online via dialup and the phone's busy. Heh, right. Kate http://xoetc.antville.org actually, i'll put a photo of the plate on my site gimme a few minutes ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:23:02 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: Good Old Days (Re: Joni and Folk) NJC Actually..not that it matters..but Richard Nixon was the first president I voted for. >I've leaned "right" since birth....it just happened. Reagan was the first >president I voted for...I was just a mere babe....but "right" was for me. _________________________________________________________________ Its tax season, make sure to follow these few simple tips http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMMartagline ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:18:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike and Patti Haskins Subject: Guardian article Hi All, Stepping in out of lurkdom, don't know if this has been posted already and I missed it, but here's an article online from the Guardian dated March 19, 2007. http://music.guardian.co.uk/folk/story/0,,2037337,00.html Patti Haskins http://pattihaskins.wordpress.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:18:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike and Patti Haskins Subject: Guardian article Hi All, Stepping in out of lurkdom, don't know if this has been posted already and I missed it, but here's an article online from the Guardian dated March 19, 2007. http://music.guardian.co.uk/folk/story/0,,2037337,00.html Patti Haskins http://pattihaskins.wordpress.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:54:23 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: Feminist choice (njc) It's a habit also..for instance..lipstick..or lip gloss...I don't got out the door with out it. Stupid..but I don't feel like I'm dressed or that something is missing if I don't wear lipstick. I might not wear any other make-up..but the lip stuff is a must. Also..there is a big difference in ornamental application of make-up and make-up used for enhancing or concealing flaws. I'm like Kakki..if I do wear a "full face"...it's less than five minutes of time. lori asked: > >"I know you were referring to "real issues," but really, don't you think >all >of the time spent oohing and aahing at ourselves in the mirror, and trying >to "fit in" to the fashion of the moment, is rather a huge waste of time?" > >Not for me - As far as hair and make-up - I can pull it all together in 10 >minutes or less (practice makes perfect ;-) I don't agree that everyone >should >try to "fit in" - they should just do what they like, wear what they like. >I >don't think all women are motivated by one particular thing or another. >Some >people (men included) just like expressing themselves by their style and/or >appreciate certain fashions. It is mostly harmless and makes the daily >grind >a little more interesting and colorful, no? > >Kakki _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from Microsoft Office Live! http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:55:12 -0700 From: Dave Blackburn Subject: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC You guys like lists right? This one is priceless... http://www.stevecarter.com/albumcovers.htm Dave ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:10:21 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: Good Old Days NJC Actually...I was being facetious when I wrote BAD. I should have put a wink or something there to let you know that. Speaking of Hillary being a BAD woman..;-) .. Laura sent me her autobiography a few months ago and as with any gift..I accepted it with love. Only on chapter two..but I will finish it....still amazed at her ambition. I don't mean that in a pejorative way....I'm thinking ...if I had one ounce of Hillary's go-getter nature..I could have ruled the world. Bree >. I'm not crazy about >Hillary Clinton but am not afraid of her so don't feel >hysterical whenever I think of her, and I'd never >label her or anyone as BAD. That's way too simple for >me. >Debra Shea > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________________________ >No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go >with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started. >http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail _________________________________________________________________ Live Search Maps  find all the local information you need, right when you need it. http://maps.live.com/?icid=hmtag2&FORM=MGAC01 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:06:58 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: latest JM interview I believe it is common knowledge that if asked about the music industry, JM, the celebrity, will say something quotable. So I find the GUARDIAN interview to be, as journalism, shamefully lazy. I don't blame JM for saying what she believes, since she was apparently asked a direct question. On the other hand, to the extent that she characterizes herself as unrecognized or unrecompensed for her pre-eminent musical accomplishments, she is, IMO, laying it on a bit thick. LAHM ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:31:34 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: Blaming The Soldiers From: "Snatch N. Grabster" > When exactly did Dylan reference the Vietnam War in any song? This is > one issue where Bob more or less remained silent. > I don't think he mentioned Vietnam as such, but his anti- war songs like Masters of War came out in the Vietnam era and surely were written under it's influence. Maybe he wanted to give them more longevity. I wouldn't say he remained silent about war, although he did quickly back away from his folk/protest beginnings after his first couple of albums. Joni was more silent about it than he, writing only one antiwar song in those days. Not that she was the only one, other counter-culture icons of the time ignored it completely, too-The Grateful Dead, for instance. RR ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:36:24 -0400 From: Victor Johnson Subject: Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying On Mar 21, 2007, at 11:22 AM, Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > > The big thing though is that regardless of age, no one wants to see a > loved one suffer for an extended time. Very true Bob. That's why part of me is glad that Amy's mother can finally rest as I watched her body deteriorate firsthand to the point where she couldn't even talk or eat or do anything except lay there. I clearly remember her mother before she got sick and she was one of the most cheerful, friendly people I knew. She was the one who let me stay at her home when I first moved to Atlanta and didn't have a place to live. She was really like a second mother to me here. She had her 64th birthday earlier this year and I came and sang "When I'm 64" for here. Even though she could not speak, I knew inside she was happy that I came by. Last night I was fine but today I am a wreck. I left school early today and I'm meeting Amy for lunch in an hour. It's funny how you can be happy one minute and then all of the sudden filled with sorrow. Victor ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 09:14:15 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Myrtle I will be sending flowers to Myrtle's funeral on behalf of JoniMitchell.com and the JMDL. If anyone would like to make a contribution towards this please do so here: http://jonimitchell.com/donate.cfm Thanks, Les ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:53:21 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: NJC Re: dreaming now dying It always strikes me as funny (not funny ha-ha but funny strange) that we (as a culture) won't allow our pets to go through that kind of suffering but we will let family members extend their suffering as long as it is humanly possible. It also seems to me that those who believe in a life after this one are the ones who cling the most tenaciously to the one they are certain of. Bob NP: Ani, "Lost Woman Song" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 11:21:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Debra Subject: Re: NJC dreaming now dying - --- Victor Johnson wrote: > Last night I was fine but today I am a wreck. I > left school early > today and I'm meeting Amy for lunch in an hour. > It's funny how you > can be happy one minute and then all of the sudden > filled with sorrow. That's the grieving process. I felt the same after my mother died a few years ago. As a friend who'd been through the experience said, it's a very confusing time. One minute okay. The next minute feeling like an important part of me has been violently ripped away and I'll never get over the loss. Even when a person's been sick for a long time, or even when a person's very old, I found out through experience that whenever a person "goes", it's always too early. And a shock. I spent months thinking "where is she?". That question kept popping into my head like I was a kid lost in a store and afraid. Answers about heaven and afterlife were "head" answers and didn't stop the heartache and didn't stop my question. It was so disorienting that my Mom would just go away like that even though we all knew the end was coming. One thing I am grateful for is that all the conflict Mom and I had felt over the years had been resolved before she died. I felt so sad at her leaving but at the end was accepting too. There was nothing left unsaid or unfelt. I hope Joni had come to a peaceful relationship with her mother while she was still here. Debra Shea ____________________________________________________________________________________ Need Mail bonding? Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396546091 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:08:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Debra Subject: RE: Good Old Days NJC - --- Bree Mcdonough wrote: > Actually...I was being facetious when I wrote BAD. > I should have put a > wink or something there to let you know that. > > Speaking of Hillary being a BAD woman..;-) .. > Laura sent me her > autobiography a few months ago and as with any > gift..I accepted it with > love. Only on chapter two..but I will finish > it....still amazed at her > ambition. I don't mean that in a pejorative > way....I'm thinking ...if I > had one ounce of Hillary's go-getter nature..I could > have ruled the world. Bill Clinton has said that she probably should have been the one to be president, rather than helping him to be. In some ways Hillary embodies, more than some conservatives do, the family values they claim to prize so much. She moved to Arkansas to be with her man, and then stuck with him through good and bad times. Isn't that the ideal of a marriage commitment? I can understand right-wingers not liking Bill because of some of his actions, but the hatred of Hillary is some weird psychological craziness that's never made sense to me. If people hate Bush it's because of what he's done, like getting people killed for no good reason and selling the U.S. to China to cover income lost because of the tax cuts to the wealthy (a process he started before 9/11), adding to the hatred of the U.S. and putting us all in more danger, but right-wingers hate Hillary just because she's Hillary. I've heard Rush Limbaugh insulting her. Not talking about issues. Just insulting her personally. It's such bizarre behavior there's obviously (to me anyway) something going on besides just not agreeing with her politically. Disagree all you want, Bree, but there's a "how dare she" tinge to the insults so sexism is definitely a part of some people's hatred of her. It's not the whole reason but it's a part. She's not "staying in her place" (as defined by white men, like Rush Limbaugh, who are used to being in charge). Expect similar veiled "how dare he" insults toward Barack Obama. For now Condoleeza Rice seems to be the darling of the conservatives, although she's completely ineffective and lies through her teeth. That doesn't matter to conservatives, though. They'll like her as long as she's saying she won't run for office, and as long as she continues to play the role of Bush's handmaiden. She's the one who tells staffers not to "upset" Bush. Jeez. She's in a powerful position, but she's still in her place. Not to worry, Rush. She's not gonna hurt you. LOL! Debra Shea ____________________________________________________________________________________ The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:04:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Debra Subject: Re: Good Old Days NJC - --- Victor Johnson wrote: > On Mar 20, 2007, at 11:45 PM, Debra wrote: > > > Rush Limbaugh probably insults > > moveon.org a lot. > > > And moveon.org probably insults Rush Limbaugh. No, Victor, they don't. They would disagree with his politics, and may even urge people to take action against something he's done, but, no, they do not toss around insults the way Rush Limbaugh and other right-wing talkers do. I characterize Rush Limbaugh as an ignorant blowhard, but that's me being obnoxious. Moveon.org's organizers focus on specific issues, and always have material to back up their view, and are much more action-oriented, as in "this is what this person did; here's one way to take action against that if you choose to." That's a lot different than the general character assassination that Limbaugh excels at. The entire Bush administration uses the same type of character assassination. Rather than work out disagreements, they just try to destroy whoever dares to say something they don't like. That's not very effective leadership. It doesn't help people understand each other to claim that all things are equal. All people do not behave the same way. Fox News tossing softball questions to Dick Cheney in a private interview is not equal to Helen Thomas asking Bush pointed questions during press conferences. (Dick Cheney would never allow Helen Thomas to question him.) > So > neither side likes > the other side. That's certainly clear. But I > wouldn't agree that > moveon.org does not tell people what to think. They > certainly have > an agenda as much as any other political > organization. Of course they have an agenda! But as I said, their style of trying to persuade people is much different than the style of right-wing talkers like Rush Limbaugh. > They're just > portrayed as good and friendly while the "other > side" is portrayed as > wrong and trying to control people. And someone who > listens to Rush > Limbaugh would probably say the reverse. Maybe so. I think the test is how readily people repeat whatever RL or others like him are saying. That happens a lot. Complex issues are made very simple. That's not the case with moveon.org or with most Democratic thinking. > It basically comes down to each side saying I'm > right and you're > wrong. It seems to me to gain any ground you would > have to get past > all of that, to really communicate which neither > side wants to do. To gain ground, people have to acknowledge their differences and then work out those differences. Denying differences (in style, in politics) in order to keep it all nice just pushes it all into a mess that can never be sorted out. > disclaimer- I listen to neither of these > organizations/people I have. And there's a huge difference in general in the way the left-wing and right-wing communicate, and differences specifically between moveon.org and Rush Limbaugh. Right-wingers have much disdain for the messiness of the Democratic party. Well, yeah, when you take in all ideas it takes a while to hash it all out. When you just take in what the boss says (the way too many Repubs do), that's quick and easy. The fact that Dems recognize the complexity of some problems, and have respect for all types of views, and that it takes a while to come to agreement is a good thing, as long as there's time for it. Unless your style, like the Bushies', is to create a crisis and then demand instant action (that benefits only them), there usually is time to work things out. > but I > agree that it is fascinating that people view things > differently. > That's what makes life interesting. Everyone is > unique. Yes. I agree. If you think that, though, why would you think each side is the same? That's all from me for a while. Debra Shea ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for earth-friendly autos? Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. http://autos.yahoo.com/green_center/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:29:54 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC hi >>>dave wrote > You guys like lists right? This one is priceless... with a joni cover!!!! ron ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 20:22:50 -0000 From: "Joe Farrell" Subject: re: joni's mama So sorry to hear of the death of Joni's mum. Deepest sympathy to her and her dad at this very sad time. regards, Joe. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 07:46:38 +1100 From: "P Bear" Subject: Re: Joni's mama, the Sax Q and Joni Dreams Hi Christopher , would you say it's not a bad life being a critic . Deadlines , etc . But as a music fan , I admit I don't know about other fans , but following many musicians , I rely on those reviews . Anyway all these singers - Dianna Ross and Joni , are elderly aren't they ? I don't expect their performances to be as tight as at their peak , say at 30 . And truthfully it's been a joy to follow Joni's Journey , and with each album she gets more laid back . I like that ! It is true about digital technology running ahead , but nothing can replace talent , and that's musicians jamming or listening to a singer and the ballads . And of course that's the experience we dream of . - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Chat with 1000s of Sexy Singles right now right now ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 13:59:51 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Saskatoon Phoenix obit Myrtle Anderson, mother of Joni Mitchell, dies at 95 By Jeremy Warren of the Star Phoenix Myrtle Anderson, the mother of musician and artist Joni Mitchell, died early Monday morning. She was 95. Anderson and her husband, Bill, moved to Saskatoon when Mitchell was nine years old. Bill, 96, continues to reside in the city. "She brought so much joy into (our) lives," family friend Ron Lamb said of Anderson. "Myrtle was a tremendous woman. She was very intelligent." Anderson and her husband were living in Fort Macleod, Alta., when Mitchell was born. The family moved to Maidstone and then to North Battleford, eventually settling in Saskatoon. Anderson taught elementary school in southern Saskatchewan until she married. Anderson's only child, Mitchell, 63, was recently inducted into the Canadian Songwriter's Hall of Fame. That occasion was the last time family friend Bob Hinitt spoke to Anderson. "We had a really nice conversation about Joni. I just let her know how wonderful Joni was that night," Hinitt said. "(But) you'd never know Myrtle had a famous daughter. She never bragged about Joni. She was a very unassuming and modest woman." Hinitt was Mitchell's French teacher and art mentor in high school. Mitchell would bring Anderson to Hinitt's house, where they would sit in the garden admiring the flowers while drinking tea and chatting. "We're always called (by the media) to talk about Joni, so it's nice to talk about Myrtle," Hinitt said. Lamb became friends with Anderson after meeting Bill during a golf game. He has known the couple about 15 years. "Myrtle had this phenomenal laugh. It was just like Joni's-it was sort of like a laugh and a giggle at the same time," Lamb said. The Andersons have always been supportive of their daughter's career, Lamb said, adding it was Anderson who instilled the love of nature in Mitchell. Lamb said Mitchell will be in Saskatoon for the funeral later this week. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 16:18:18 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC This is hysterical. I actually know someone that had the Tino album (and NO it was not Bob Murphy) Best Paz On Mar 21, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Dave Blackburn wrote: You guys like lists right? This one is priceless... http://www.stevecarter.com/albumcovers.htm Dave ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 17:23:19 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Good Old Days NJC It doesn't seem right to me to even try and compare Rush Limbaugh and moveon.org. Limbaugh, like Ann Coulter, Michael Moore, and a host of others, are basically ENTERTAINERS playing the part of provocateurs exploiting the emotions of people in order to SELL PRODUCT. Whether we agree with their opinions or not, that's basically what they do. Moveon.org simply enables progressives to take action; to more easily involve themselves in the political process that they should be involved in anyway. They present petitions that you can electronically sign (and they hand-deliver them to Congressmen and Senators), they allow you to email your Representatives and voice your opinions about issues, or give you phone numbers so you can call your Representatives and make your opinions known. Yes, they have an agenda, but I would guess that most members behave as I do; pick those issues which matter to them and act accordingly. I have sent emails to Lindsay Graham and Bob Inglis and have gotten responses from them. (I don't bother with DeMint as he's nothing more than a Bush rubber stamp). In an age when less than half the voting population don't do even that, it's nice to be able to feel that sense of involvement. Bob NP: Gomez, "Cry On Demand" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 21:02:16 +0000 From: Chris Marshall Subject: Re: the worst real album covers of all time (no fake ones) NJC On 21 Mar 2007, at 16:55, Dave Blackburn wrote: > http://www.stevecarter.com/albumcovers.htm Well, there's a touch of synchronicity. See, I happen to know Steve Carter, the guy whose website this is. Confirmed car nut, very musical, and once lent me a fretless Status bass guitar for, oh, ages. Thoroughly nice chap, insanely talented. Lives in an insanely gorgeous house. The build blog for which is also on that website. Well worth a read if you have several hours (really!) to spare. - --Chris Marshall chrisAThatstand.org (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:56:02 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Saskatoon StarPhoenix Headline From the Saskatoon StarPhoenix- Wed. March 21, 2007 Myrtle Anderson, mother of Joni Mitchell, dies at 95 Myrtle Anderson, the mother of musician and artist Joni Mitchell, died early Monday morning. She was 95. (This is all they give you without a subscription.) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 22:44:30 +0000 From: "Michael O'Malley" Subject: Mrs Anderson's obituary So sad to hear this news. I'm sure Joni spent some time with her parents this winter after her stint in Calgary. Joni was lucky to have her mother around for so long. I'm thinking of all the keepsakes that Mrs. Anderson held on to over the years, which formed the nucleus of the Mendel show last summer that portrayed Joni's childhood. Now the keeper is gone. It must be heartwrenching for the entire family. A virtual guestbook is available at the Saskatoon Star Pheonix website. http://www.legacy.com/can-saskatoon/Obituaries.asp?Page=Lifestory&PersonId=86883855 Michael in Quebec We can't return, we can only look behind from where we came _________________________________________________________________ Have Some Fun Out Of The Sun This March Break http://local.live.com/?mkt=en-ca/?v=2&cid=A6D6BDB4586E357F!142 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 19:02:43 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: Joan I am thinking of Myrtle Anderson. . so she died on the first day of spring? the partial first day of spring. . just as the seasons change. "and the seasons they go round and round. . . this song touches my heart on any day. . but today I played it for one of my classes. .(my 8th graders) over and over again. . and for my 10th graders . . (they were learning three dimensional letters.) I made the assignment: Write in 3 d letters, "you don't know what you got 'til it's gone." Shade in the 3rd dimension. and I played Big Yellow Taxi over and over again. . Marianne _________________________________________________________________ Interest Rates near 39yr lows! $430,000 Mortgage for $1,399/mo - Calculate new payment http://www.lowermybills.com/lre/index.jsp?sourceid=lmb-9632-18466&moid=7581 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 17:18:25 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Myrtle > I will be sending flowers to Myrtle's funeral on behalf of JoniMitchell.com > and the JMDL. If anyone would like to make a contribution towards this > please do so here: http://jonimitchell.com/donate.cfm Thanks, Les. Peace be to Myrtle ... and to Bill and to Joni. Lori Santa Rosa, CA ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2007 #123 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------