From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2006 #302 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Friday, August 25 2006 Volume 2006 : Number 302 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Military matters (njc) [] Re: need joni help ["mike pritchard" ] India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians [Victor Johnson ] RE: India Arie etc, aka who's making magnificent, visionary music today? NJC [Em ] Re: artists of the 70's -- njc [Em ] Dylan imitated by 13-yr-old [Kate ] Re: India Arie ["Cassy" ] Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians ["Cassy" ] njc, goin' up the Hippiefest ["Patti Parlette" ] Re: Music... music... music... now NJC [Em ] Sax Masters ["Steve Anderson" ] Re: India Arie ["Randy Remote" ] Re: Music... music... music... ["mack watson-bush" Subject: Military matters (njc) Bob wrote: >Bush has in the last month OK'ed the "involuntary recall" of 2,500 Marines >because there aren't enough >volunteers. Hard to believe that we won't see the return of the >draft - how else will they >be able to support this mess? I think there is a lot more to all this than meets the eye. I've read some Defense articles that indicate that there is a move to downsize in some areas in all the branches of ther military, including new recruits. Modern warfare is not primarily fought with huge battalions of troops anymore. Despite what some "experts" may say, it is neither efficient nor strategic to have hundreds of thousands more troops on the ground in Iraq, for example. The recall of the Marines is strategic and a cost saver - they are seasoned and have greater expertise than a group of new enlistees. I know a few guys in the reserves and one former Army guy who wants to re-up. They are being paid large financial incentives to do additional tours and to re-enlist. It's just like in a business - if you want the greatest success, you hire the best, most experienced people for the job. Even if you have to pay more for them upfront, it's going to be a lot cheaper for your bottom line in the long run. At any rate, if you are interested in the subject, check out a few Defense-related publications. And I am so sick of hearing that somehow the draft is going to be reinstated. It's almost like some people WANT this to happen so we can have even bigger anti-war protests and more opportunities to be outraged just like back in the day. Believe me, that was a horrible, horrible time. If people think now is so horrible, they have no idea what it was like back then. I'm not trying to single you out, Bob. I've just been hearing this for so long and it really gets me. We don't need a draft! The only way I could ever see that happening again is if we are literally invaded or besieged on all sides. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:34:57 +0200 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: need joni help >>Absolutely. 'Cactus Tree' springs to mind as a full on picker. I don't know why she dropped the picking style after a while. I'm sure someone else has the gen on that.<< Thanks, Martin for reminding me of one of my father's favourite expressions (the 'gen') which I haven't heard for years. He used it as a synonym for information, or news, but does anyone know the etymology? Thanks too for your splendid work on the second Stryngs CD which arrived here while I was away on hols. Have played it a couple of times but haven't given it a thorough listen yet. I'll send comments when I have them. Cheers, and hi to the rest of the band, inc Les Irwin and Dan Cassidy. I love mandos and fiddles... mike in bcn np Alison Krauss - New Favorite ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:35:14 -0400 From: Victor Johnson Subject: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians > I bought Sgt Peppers on the first day of issue, as did I buy > Herjia on the first day of issue What do you want....a cookie? > the first explosion being Classical Music, which came to [an] end > didnt it Though you would almost certainly disagree there is still great classical music being written. I saw Golijav "The Passion of St. Marks" performed in Atlanta last year and it was breathtaking and amazing featuring Brazilian singer Luiciana Souza, now married to Larry Klein. I also met Michael Gandolfi, an awesome composer from Cambridge, Mass who told me he tried to bring Joni Mitchell to the Tanglewood symposium but his colleagues snubbed their noses up at her. By the way, the last time I saw Dylan he sounded awful. Victor On Aug 25, 2006, at 3:00 AM, JMDL Digest wrote: > Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:20:26 -0400 (EDT) > From: Andeemac2006 > Subject: Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians > > Cassy said > But regardless... YES, Dave Matthews' release "Under the Table and > Dreaming" and also "Live at Luther College" are every bit as good > as some > of the crap that came out in the 70s (((((((( so you do think these > albums were as good as " Blue " or Sgt Peppers and there > Crap????? )))))))))) his songs "Satellite" and "Typical > Situation" (just to name two) are brilliant and will pass any test > of time you want to devise. > > I will not get dragged into a futile debate. We'll have to agree to > disagree but your narrow perspective is your own loss Cassy > ______________________________________________________________________ > ___________ > > HEY its you with the narrow perspective, I have music from the > 1960's to 1990's, 30 years or more > of music on MY side!!!!!!!! you only have music from early 1990's > to today on your side > Now who has the narrow perspective. I lived through what will be > historically looked back as the Second Fantastic period of > Magnificent original music explosion in history. I bought Sgt > Peppers on the first day of issue, as did I buy Herjia on the > first day of issue, and I got home and looked and read the lyrics > from the Gate Fold sleeve for a half an hour even before putting > the LP on the turntable !!!!!!!!!!!!!! I notice Dylan seems to be > agreeing with me of late. > The first explosion being Classical Music, which came to and end > didnt it. Lastly and I mean lastly I dont understand how a person > that loves Joni Mitchell as you do, cant differenciate between > Amazing and average. > Last post on the Best Slide Guitarists post from me Pheww*!!?? what > a journey LOL ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:22:34 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians > By the way, the last time I saw Dylan he sounded awful. > > Victor And when did he sound good ? Jerry:) NP: Callas Went Away - Enigma from MCMXC A.D. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:55:54 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: India Arie has got to be loving all this publicity NJC But Randy - why do you want *another* Tommy, another Wish You Were Here, another Inner Visions? We've already got those! If you want to hear them, play them. Ironically, the closest thing I know of to The Who is the band that YOU highlighted last week - Green Day; explosive, confrontational, lyrically wicked, and a drummer who can excite as much as Keith Moon. And they're just now hitting their peak! You want something comparable to Inner Visions, check out any number of Me'Shell's records. "Bitter" is as soulful, melodic and emotional as anything Stevie has done. Beck's "Sea Change" plumbs the depths of melancholy in a way that immediately brought Hejira to mind (and that's saying a LOT for me), and then he follows that up with the musically diverse, energetic and downright fun "Guero". Brilliant. I can cheat and recommend David Gilmour's 2006 release "On An Island" as a modern day Floyd substitute, but Andeemac would just say I was proving his point so I won't do that. Instead, I'll mention Radiohead's "OK Computer" as a complex progressive challenging album of alienation, certainly on a par with Wish, The Wall, or DSOTM. Their run of The Bends/OK Computer/Kid A/Amnesiac/Hail To The Thief is on par with those great 70's runs, and their presence at Bonaroo this year made it the most successful one ever. Then again, I'm not looking for "new" Pink Floyds, Whos, and Stevie Wonders any more than I'm looking for new Joni Mitchells. I'm delighted to have them all on my shelf and excited to see what's around the corner from artists who I haven't yet even heard of. Bob NP: Fixed Abode, "The Time Has Come" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:49:44 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: Pure Sax, njc Ash's friend asked: " Do you know of any good saxaphonists, I am looking for a CD of pure sax, something bluesy without vocals - any recommendations?" Hi Ash, I would highly recommend CTI: Masters of the Saxophone, produced by Creed Taylor, manufactured and distributed by CBS Records/CBS Records, Inc./ 51 West 52 Street, NY, NY. Tracts include: 1. Stanley Turrentine - Sugar 2. Grover Washington, Jr. - Power of Soul 3. David Sanborn - Star Fire 4. Joe Farrell - Upon This Rock 5. David Sanborn - Red Eye 6. Joe Henderson - 117 Special 7. Hank Crawford - Mr. Blues 8. Hank Crawford - I'm Just A Lucky So And So I have the CD of this but had a hard time finding it on the Internet. I've listened to this recording for years and love it. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 05:50:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians NJC again The thing I don't get, (once we establish that there probably WAS kind of a golden age that happened and that its gone), is SO WHAT???? its gone, done, dead. MOVE ON. Or don't. Its entirely possible to stay in that place and listen to the same old stuff over and over. The sad thing though is that it was FINITE. But if it seems a bit stifling to listen to stuff loooooooong gone, over and over and over, then one really has to move on. For a breath of fresh air if nothing else. So just making the point that 60's and 70's music was great, elicits from me a huge "DUH"...and 3 nods of the head like Chevy Chase looking at the Grand Canyon in "Vacation". Uh huh, uh huh, uh huh.... now what?????? YES! it was great! and sometimes it rings fresh, but other times it seems a bit moldy. Even in times of dark and dread you gotta keep on pushing on, or to me you might as well call it a day. Humans tend to push on. Yes that stuff from back then was really really great! So what???? There are very few people who have 60's and 70's music tattoo'ed on thier hearts as much as me. But even I feel the need for fresh stuff. Its just stifling to sit there and listen to Sgt Pepper or Tommy one more time. Its starting to seem like it holds me in its its armchair and I feel its disease. You know? Em ps: but I just want to make one more comment, I do seem to recall thinking that 70's music SUCKED - at the time. - --- Andeemac2006 wrote: > Cassy said > But regardless... YES, Dave Matthews' release "Under the Table and > Dreaming" and also "Live at Luther College" are every bit as good as > some > of the crap that came out in the 70s (((((((( so you do think these > albums were as good as " Blue " or Sgt Peppers and there Crap????? > )))))))))) his songs "Satellite" and "Typical Situation" (just to > name two) are brilliant and will pass any test of time you want to > devise. > > I will not get dragged into a futile debate. We'll have to agree to > disagree but your narrow perspective is your own loss Cassy > _________________________________________________________________________________ > > HEY its you with the narrow perspective, I have music from the > 1960's to 1990's, 30 years or more > of music on MY side!!!!!!!! you only have music from early 1990's to > today on your side > Now who has the narrow perspective. I lived through what will be > historically looked back as the Second Fantastic period of > Magnificent original music explosion in history. I bought Sgt > Peppers on the first day of issue, as did I buy Herjia on the first > day of issue, and I got home and looked and read the lyrics from the > Gate Fold sleeve for a half an hour even before putting the LP on the > turntable !!!!!!!!!!!!!! I notice Dylan seems to be agreeing with me > of late. > The first explosion being Classical Music, which came to and end > didnt it. Lastly and I mean lastly I dont understand how a person > that loves Joni Mitchell as you do, cant differenciate between > Amazing and average. > Last post on the Best Slide Guitarists post from me Pheww*!!?? what a > journey LOL ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:24:16 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: Military matters (njc) But haven't our own General and Military leaders gone on record as saying that we haven't sent in enough manpower to get the job done? I don't think Military Intelligence gets more "expert" than that. Which of course brings up the million-dollar question - just what is the mission anyway? To get the WMD's that were never there? To establish a western-style democracy in a Theocracy? The Shiites want a Shiite government, the Sunnis want a Sunni government, the Kurds want their own nation. How do you build a Democracy from that? We have to leave them to settle their own form of government or else it's not going to stick. Your point is well-taken and I think you're right. I think what frustrates a lot of us is the lack of outrage and even knowledge over what's going on. Believe me, with a 19-year-old son the LAST thing I want to see is the draft reinstated. By the way, his buddy Jeff in on a weeks leave and stopped by the house Wednesday night with his new wife. (Really bizarre thinking that my son's best school buddy is married). Anyway, Jeff couldn't be happier with the training and opportunities that he's been given - he and his wife ship out to Iraq in October. They commented that they prefer not to have reservists and National Guard in their units because they don't act like part of the trained family that they're more familiar with. Meanwhile, my running buddy Nick's brother-in-law is one of the 3,500 called back - he's NOT happy about it and his wife is beyond anguished. Again, I think if there were a clear purpose for all of this besides the "spreading liberty" cliches we're getting, the attitudes might be different. And I certainly don't feel singled out Kakki, and I appreciate your response. I've always thought of you as a pal and I always will. The good news is that we want the same stuff...a safer and secure America and World, and peace. We only differ in the pathway to those things. Bob NP: No Fixed Abode, "Ready For The Storm" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:24:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians - --- Andeemac2006 wrote: > I notice Dylan seems to be agreeing > with me of late. If you're referring to Dylan's recent interview where he talked about modern music, I took it to mean that the quality of the recordings themselves - the production - that is no good, not necessarily the music itself. "I don't know anybody who's made a record that sounds decent in the past twenty years, really. You listen to these modern records, they're atrocious, they have sound all over them. There's no definition of nothing, no vocal, no nothing, just like -- static." http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/11216877/the_modern_times_of_bob_dylan_a_legend_comes_to_grips_with_his_iconic_status/1 Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:09:00 +0100 From: "Jamie's Box of Paints" Subject: Re: "Your notches, liberation doll" - Don't Interrupt the Sorrow Serpent chained to the Ethiopian Wall? Surely it's the Original Sin that was commited by woman in the Garden of Eden (if you follow that mankind springs from the horn of Africa - i.e. Ethiopia). She's saying that this embittered man is blaming her for everything that Woman has ever done to him, even Eve's faults are hers. Just a theory, it's a beautifully put image. Zooby On 25/08/06, Richard Flynn wrote: > I'll work on it and get back to you. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Scott [mailto:mark.travis@gte.net] > Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:20 PM > To: Richard Flynn; 'mike pritchard'; 'list' > Cc: Dflahm@aol.com > Subject: Re: "Your notches, liberation doll" - Don't Interrupt the Sorrow > > > > You know, it's kind of a shame to limit this song with interpretation > > because it seems closer to poetry than most of Joni's lyrics. But I would > > guess that it's about the breakup of a relationship. The man seems to be > > hurling an insult at the woman in the song. He's seems to be saying, > > "You've driven me to drink. Everyone of these glasses in this room has > > your > > name on it"--or your "notches"--they're your "notches," not mine. > > Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, YES! Somebody else gets it! I feel > vindicated at last! > > > > > Now, I wonder what's going on with that Serpent chained to the Ethiopian > > wall? > > Richard if you can figure that one out, my hat's off to you. > > Mark E. in Seattle > - -- I am a lonely Painter I live in a Box of Paints I'm frightened by the devil But I'm drawn to those ones that 'aint afraid... Jamie Zubairi can be found for voice-overs at http://uk.voicespro.com/jamie.zubairi1 acting CV and showreel at http://uk.castingcallpro.com/u/81749 and on myspace at http://www.myspace.com/jamiezoob ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:54:45 +0100 From: "Azeem" Subject: RE: India Arie etc, aka who's making magnificent, visionary music today? NJC Bob wrote, amongst other things: << I can cheat and recommend David Gilmour's 2006 release "On An Island" as a modern day Floyd substitute, but Andeemac would just say I was proving his point so I won't do that. Instead, I'll mention Radiohead's "OK Computer" as a complex progressive challenging album of alienation, certainly on a par with Wish, The Wall, or DSOTM. Their run of The Bends/OK Computer/Kid A/Amnesiac/Hail To The Thief is on par with those great 70's runs, and their presence at Bonaroo this year made it the most successful one ever. >> I can't resist from chiming in here [and changing the subject line to shoehorn my post into the debate...], as I've just been listening to a work of genius: Kate Bush's recent album, Aerial - and more specifically, the second disc, which is some of the most beautiful music I've heard in years. She's been around nearly 30 years (yikes!!), her music is timeless, especially now that she's relying less and less on the Fairlight, on which she was a pioneer and true innovator. I know she's never been that big in America, and I have no idea if this album made much of a splash over the pond, so for those who are curious, see if you can get a listen to Nocturn, and once you've succumbed to it, get the whole album and PLAY IT LOUD! Azeem in London NP: Kate Bush - Nocturn - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/427 - Release Date: 24/08/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:27:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: once you are a bit older NJC old music vs newer another reason I sometimes think new music I hear doesn't always sound quite as wonderful as back then..is that I (like all of us) have, by this time, experienced so very much more music. Zillions of songs. Its hard for a given piece to seem truly special standing in a crowd of one million. I have become jaded and cynical. I recognize this and I try to fight it off. (altho really I've been jaded and cynical since I was about 9) Its like with Christmas. The first 20 or so are really, really neat! But once you've done your 45th Christmas it loses it shine maybe, and even gets boring or pointless. Like oh Christ now we have to do this sh_t again..... So the music that had this fantastic appeal back when I (we?) only OWNED 10 or 15 albums seemed so very special because it was not only great, but a brand new love, for me (us). Stuff that happened first time around just tends to stand out as special, right? I would love to meet a today kid totally into music. A kid like the one in "Almost Famous" only from *now*. A kid to whom music isn't just pop or background radio, but to whom it is near religion - as it was for me (us?) See what they think and feel. Em ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:30:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: RE: India Arie etc, aka who's making magnificent, visionary music today? NJC are you SURE Azeem???? cuz I'm gonna buy it, man! Based on what you are saying. so it better be splendid! ;) kidding.... riddle me this...do I need to buy the actual CD in order to have some album notes?? or would this be a decent candidate to simply buy on iTunes? is there some aspect of the printed materials on this one that one NEEDS to have? thank you, Em - --- Azeem wrote: > Bob wrote, amongst other things: > > << I can cheat and recommend David Gilmour's 2006 release "On An > Island" > as a modern day Floyd substitute, but Andeemac would just say I was > proving his > point so I won't do that. Instead, I'll mention Radiohead's "OK > Computer" > as a complex progressive challenging album of alienation, certainly > on a > > par with Wish, The Wall, or DSOTM. Their run of The Bends/OK > Computer/Kid > A/Amnesiac/Hail To The Thief is on par with those great 70's runs, > and > their presence at Bonaroo this year made it the most successful one > ever. >> > > I can't resist from chiming in here [and changing the subject line to > shoehorn my post into the debate...], as I've just been listening to > a > work of genius: Kate Bush's recent album, Aerial - and more > specifically, the second disc, which is some of the most beautiful > music > I've heard in years. She's been around nearly 30 years (yikes!!), > her > music is timeless, especially now that she's relying less and less on > the Fairlight, on which she was a pioneer and true innovator. I know > she's never been that big in America, and I have no idea if this > album > made much of a splash over the pond, so for those who are curious, > see > if you can get a listen to Nocturn, and once you've succumbed to it, > get > the whole album and PLAY IT LOUD! > > Azeem in London > NP: Kate Bush - Nocturn > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/427 - Release Date: > 24/08/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 16:05:18 +0100 From: "Azeem" Subject: RE: India Arie etc, aka who's making magnificent, visionary music today? NJC Oh, I'm sure! Actually, I ought to add that Kate Bush can arouse strong passions in listeners, and some are anti - she's too intense and full-on for some, but those with taste (ha!) recognize her as one of music's great innovators. As for Aerial, I'd strongly recommend getting the whole thing. Apart from anything else, a lot of the songs run into each other, and I don't know if that can be reproduced from Itunes; also, it's not one of those albums that has a few good tunes and the rest is filler (although in any case I disagree strongly with those who contend that nearly ALL albums these days are like that) - it's all good stuff. The artwork is lovely too. So, my recommendation is to listen to one or two songs, if you don't know what her voice sounds like, and go from there. From this album I'd say the songs to go for as tasters are King of the Mountain (the first single), Prologue and Nocturn. If you decide that Kate is to your liking, the next one to go for is Hounds of Love, which is one album that has brought me to tears. The Dreaming is an extraordinary album, eccentric even by her standards. Her 1978 debut, The Kick Inside, is one of the most stunning debut albums ever (her voice was quite shrill back then, but I still love it). And if you want to try ONE song from her whole oeuvre that sums up her genius, try the title song from The Sensual World. Enough Kate Bush for now... Azeem in London NP: Kate Bush - The Fog - -----Original Message----- From: Em [mailto:emzdogz@yahoo.com] Sent: 25 August 2006 15:30 To: Azeem; joni@smoe.org Subject: RE: India Arie etc, aka who's making magnificent, visionary music today? NJC are you SURE Azeem???? cuz I'm gonna buy it, man! Based on what you are saying. so it better be splendid! ;) kidding.... riddle me this...do I need to buy the actual CD in order to have some album notes?? or would this be a decent candidate to simply buy on iTunes? is there some aspect of the printed materials on this one that one NEEDS to have? thank you, Em - --- Azeem wrote: > Bob wrote, amongst other things: > > << I can cheat and recommend David Gilmour's 2006 release "On An > Island" > as a modern day Floyd substitute, but Andeemac would just say I was > proving his > point so I won't do that. Instead, I'll mention Radiohead's "OK > Computer" > as a complex progressive challenging album of alienation, certainly > on a > > par with Wish, The Wall, or DSOTM. Their run of The Bends/OK > Computer/Kid > A/Amnesiac/Hail To The Thief is on par with those great 70's runs, > and > their presence at Bonaroo this year made it the most successful one > ever. >> > > I can't resist from chiming in here [and changing the subject line to > shoehorn my post into the debate...], as I've just been listening to > a > work of genius: Kate Bush's recent album, Aerial - and more > specifically, the second disc, which is some of the most beautiful > music > I've heard in years. She's been around nearly 30 years (yikes!!), > her > music is timeless, especially now that she's relying less and less on > the Fairlight, on which she was a pioneer and true innovator. I know > she's never been that big in America, and I have no idea if this > album > made much of a splash over the pond, so for those who are curious, > see > if you can get a listen to Nocturn, and once you've succumbed to it, > get > the whole album and PLAY IT LOUD! > > Azeem in London > NP: Kate Bush - Nocturn > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/427 - Release Date: > 24/08/2006 > - -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/427 - Release Date: 24/08/2006 - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/427 - Release Date: 24/08/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:26:41 +0000 From: waytoblue@comcast.net Subject: artists of the 70's The funniest thing about all of this is that several of the artists you mention have praised and cited the influence of up and coming artists. Elton John stated that he was influenced by John Mayer and Phil and Friends(Phil Lesh of the Grateful Dead) even did a cobill last new year's eve w/John Mayer where they even performed a set together. Stevie Wonder has had nothing but praise for India Arie and had her provide guest vocals on his last album, "A Time 2 Love" as well as perform along with her at the superbowl last year in Detroit. So it seems the very artists you are referencing have a much different attitude than you do yourself. By the way, Michael Stipe of REM released a single along with Chris Martin of Coldplay recently, another example of artist from the '70s (ooops....I meant '80's :) ) collaborating with a contemporary artist. I'm beginning to thing your argument has very little substance at all. NPIMH: Dave Matthews singing "In My Life" at the John Lennon tribute in October 2001 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:00:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Smurf Subject: Re: artists of the 70's -- njc Leave it to an artist of the 70s (and 60s) to sum up this whole everything-good-is-history attitude . . . Ladies and gentlemen, Ray Davies and "Twentieth Century Man" . . . My mama said she can't understand me She can't see my motivation Just give me some security I'm a paranoid schizoid product of the twentieth century You keep all your smart modern writers Give me William Shakespeare You keep all your smart modern painters I'll take Rembrandt, Titian, Da Vinci and Gainsborough Girl we gotta get out of here We gotta find a solution I'm a twentieth century man but I don't want to die here Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:28:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: artists of the 70's -- njc especially poignant with the Yahoo tag line looking like its part of the lyrics.... arghhhh.... Em - --- Smurf wrote: > Leave it to an artist of the 70s (and 60s) to sum up this whole > everything-good-is-history attitude . . . > > Ladies and gentlemen, Ray Davies and "Twentieth Century Man" . . . > > My mama said she can't understand me > She can't see my motivation > Just give me some security > I'm a paranoid schizoid product of the twentieth century > > You keep all your smart modern writers > Give me William Shakespeare > You keep all your smart modern painters > I'll take Rembrandt, Titian, Da Vinci and Gainsborough > > Girl we gotta get out of here > We gotta find a solution > I'm a twentieth century man but I don't want to die here > Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:40:31 -0600 From: Kate Subject: Dylan imitated by 13-yr-old onlyJMDL Digest: > I notice Dylan seems to be agreeing with me of late. Speaking of Dylan ... my son and I were doing dishes one day and Dylan came on the radio. We listened. He said, "Ew! You know what that guy sounds like? Like a teenager whining and complaining to his mother!" And he went on to make up his own lyrics and sing them in the Dylanesque style: "and you MAKE me do ALL this WORK and you DON'T even PAY me ... I still laugh, remembering it, and try to get him to sing it again. Quite cracks me up. SaskKate http://xoetc.antville.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:53:41 -0400 From: "Cassy" Subject: Re: India Arie Hi Randy. I was not saying that Beck's or Matthew's music is better, or as good as or making ANY kind of comparison. What I originally replied to was the statement that firstly... there is NO good music from recent years and secondly that any new music won't be memorable in future years. I love the music from the period you call the "Renaissance" but in my mind that doesn't mean there is nothing of value in today's releases. Warmly, Cassy - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Remote" To: Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 1:10 AM Subject: Re: India Arie > The renaissance period was, in my mind, from about 1965-1975. > There is nothing to compare it to today; Joni was putting out a killer > album every year, as was Dylan. The Beatles put out 12 monsters > in 6 years. Hendrix left a trail of genius in 3 years. There are some > good artists out there now, but none who consistantly deliver like > that. > Factor in CSNY, Floyd, Yes, Traffic, The Who; where is today's > "Tommy" or "Wish You Were Here" or "Inner Visions"? > Beck? Matthews? Don't make me laugh. On the other hand, the next wave of > devine inspiration may be > on it's way at any moment; sometimes I think I can sense it.... > RR ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:55:24 -0400 From: "Cassy" Subject: Re: India Arie, Slide Guitarists and Singers & Musicians I hadn't realized we were on any "side" Andeemac. I hadn't realized we were in a fight of any kind. Silly me! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:53:46 -0400 From: "Cassy" Subject: Music... music... music... This will be my final post on the topic of new music. I own 2,500 + vinyl records and over 600 CDs. Everything from Bach, Zappa, The Who, Beatles, Stevie Wonder, Journey, George Benson, The Section, Tchaikovsky, Steely Dan, CSN&Y and I could go on and on breaking them all down into genres, alphabetically (as my collection is set up) from blues to jazz to rock to show tunes... I also own Dave Matthews, Beck, Coldplay, Apocolyptica (a fabulous string quartet who play Metallica and Faith No More covers classical-style), Chevelle, Trapt, Linkin Park, Tori Amos, Sarah McClachlan, Seal and on and on ad nauseum. If one wants to think of me as "narrow" in my perspectives and tastes that's their prerogative. My point is this: I can love the music that is considered "classic rock", hell, I grew up with it (I remember when I lived in Lancashire and my sister sneaking off to see a band called "The Beatles" in Liverpool without my parent's knowledge) but that doesn't preclude me appreciating new talent. I kept my vinyl in excellent condition and still play it today, especially those L.P.s that will NEVER be released on CD. I won't ever forget seeing Jethro Tull in concert on the "Thick As A Brick" tour, tripping on acid and getting into watching a full grown man in a rabbit suit. My musical history is rich in culture as my family didn't even own a television until I was 13 and radio was the only entertainment to play board games by or play with my Spirograph (which I still have in it's original box). My friends make fun of me for singing along to Nat King Cole, Johhny Mathis, Andy Willliams and Perry Como and wonder how I know all the words to this "dated" stuff. To say there is nothing between classical music and the rock explosion of the 60s and 70s is preposterous. What about the swing era, Tommy Dorsey, Glenn Miller, Louis Armstrong? What about the crooners in the Rat Pack, Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin? What about the 50s greats like Buddy Holly, Elvis, Fats Domino and Chuck Berry, the forerunners of contemporary rock and roll? To say that 60s and 70s rock is the be all and end all of music is the more limited view, in my opinion. I LOVE 60s and 70s rock, it's what I grew up with, it represented MY generation when I came from England in 1969 and couldn't understand the dress, culture and attitudes of my peers. Discovering Joni and Jimi and Jim Morrison was the biggest breakthrough in my personal growth I've ever experienced. But, my growth has continued over the years. I haven't stagnated and closed my mind to accepting that there is more to music than classic rock. The fact that I have continued to pay attention to newer artists and embraced those I like and discard those I don't... Jacko Pierce, Toad the Wet Sprocket, Del Amitri, Sonia Dada are all bands that would have passed me by without notice (they passed most people by without notice) and I love to listen to them all. Bela Fleck is talented beyond words and can play more instruments than almost anyone I know. My life would be poorer for not having opened up my mind and my ears to these artists. I understand that they're not to everyone's tastes but then neither is jazz fusion which is brilliant! I didn't realize that by being open to newer sounds I was "narrow" of perspective. I hadn't realized that by listening to new music I had precluded my membership in the fan clubs of anyone pre-1990. Obviously the time frame from 1990 to today is narrower... DUH! But my tastes encompass everything from the 15th century to the 21st century and hopefully for many more years to come. I don't try to compare "String of Pearls" with Pearl Jam... it's impossible. I simply enjoy what I enjoy for it's own value. Some seem to think I'm a traitor for liking anything more recent than 1975. Had I realized that by replying to someone's original denial that there were any redeeming qualities in the state of modern music that I would get cast into the role of narrow minded person who didn't appreciate what I had when I was 14-19 I would have kept my fingers firmly under my ass. Now it's time to let this go and continue to keep an open mind/ear and enjoy what I enjoy without having to put up with adamant incorrect information, closed minds and critical psycho-analysis for my choices Cassy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:08:24 +0000 From: "Patti Parlette" Subject: njc, goin' up the Hippiefest Happy Friday, everyone! NPIMH: Gotta get goin', cause I can't stay here long, now. Cause I'm tired of the way, I've been dogged around. Well, I've got to roam, maybe find me a brand-new home. I'm goin' up the country, baby don't you wanna go? I'm goin' up the country, baby don't you wanna go? I'm goin' to some place where I've never been before. I'm goin', I'm goin' where the water tastes like wine. Well, I'm goin' where the water tastes like wine. You can jump in the water and stay drunk all the time. I'm gonna leave this city, got to get away. I'm gonna leave this city, got to get away. All this fussin' and fightin', man you know I sure can't stay. Now baby, packin' up the truck you know I got to leave today. Just exacly where I'm goin' I can not say, but we might even leave the USA. It's a brand-new game and I don't wanna play. - --------- Remember that one? Yep, I'm goin' up the Hippiefest tonight. Now don't make fun of me, please! Will it be cheesy? Maybe. Prolly. But I just couldn't resist the opportunity to see some of these guys -- even if they end up having old gravelly voices and are past their prime.....LOL! I'm counting on having some fun (I want to have fun), and I'm really looking forward to seeing Melanie lay down some candles in the rain, and singing out loud w/ Country Joe and the Fish ("and it's one, two, three, what are we fightin' for?....."). Those are my anticipated highlights, but we'll see what else happens. Probably a lot of: "Oh yeah! I remember THAT one from high school!" Scheduled to appear: Blood Sweat and Tears, Felix Cavaliere's Rascals, Rare Earth, Mitch Ryder, Canned Heat, Melanie, Badfinger, Mountain with Leslie West and Corky Laing, Denny Laine, Country Joe Macdonald. Hosted by Wavy Gravy. All in good fun. I need to charge up on light-hearted fun before I get back to the fear and loathing of Lieberman on the campaign trail. Bon weekend, tout le Joni monde! Love Patti P. P.S. If you ever liked Melanie, you will be interested in her recent letter: August 08, 2006 Hippiefest My dear ones At any other time in my life, I might have taken it wrong, especially in the 80s on the day the music died, or the next day, when I slipped through the safety net of corporate music. But now all that grieving is long ago. Longer ago than childhood memories, longer ago than the bus ride when the old man was being ridiculous and made everyone laugh and I felt the connection with all humanity and would have written Its Almost Like Being in Love, but it was already written. I wrote Beautiful People. And so it goes that I am doing these concerts called Hippiefest, and its ok. 25 minutes each group has, and thats not me. Im a slow starter. Ive never been a hit em with a bang and keep that up for 25 minutes and leave kind of girl. Can I still say girl? Yes Can I still say album? Yes Are you sure? Yes I did the first Hippiefest at Meadowbrook in NH ~ it looked like a good turnout. Ive always loved the Rascals and Felix Cavaliere. Mountain was for me an acquired taste. There was this incident, when it almost came to physical blows. One of those days on the road. Maybe we were all tired and pummeled and wondering why, and Peter threatened to beat the shit out of someone in the group or maybe everyone. I think they were making noise on two-way radios while I was onstage. Anyway, it never came to that, and today were all laughing about it. And now live from the days of peace and love, and Rare Earth gives up a couple of their minutes because I went over two or three ~ I could never count and sing. For a person in an audience I think it would be fun. For me....its tricky, but it gives me this great opportunity (because it was so long ago and so many brain cells away) to sing other peoples hits and pass them off as my own. Who will know? Those were the days my friends, We thought theyd never end. Wed sing and dance forever and a day...... Its not the lineup of usual suspects. And then there is ME! But remember, there was a time, and this almost happened, when Jimmy Hendrix would follow Joan Baez and Ravi Shankar (sitar player and father of Nora Jones) was before Melanie, and Sly and the Family Stone and Credence Clearwater (one of my all time favorites) could all be seen at any time at any show. It was just all music. And when Theres only two kinds of music, good and bad (I think it was Count Basie who said that) seemed to be the rule. When musicians transcended category, almost. Before the reins were pulled and the people began to buy into what the marketers were selling. What do you study in school? The answer eight out of ten times is Marketing! Watch out, my dear ones ~ but you already are watching out, arent you? Yeah, youre a pretty clever group. Someday well all take over this planet and live happily ever after in the Motherhood of Love. So back to Hippiefest and 25 minutes. Theres a lot of musical integrity here, not just a bunch of musicians dressing up and being clowns ~ summoning up old images and stamping out performances. People are actually playing their music live, still. Rare Earth, Janis Ian, Felix, Leslie West, all falling out of the safety net, flitting, flying, and holding on tight to nothing at all. Its a beautiful circus. Where are the clowns? Not here. Except for Wavy Gravy, who introduced me and whispered in my ear something in Sanskrit. I think it means May all the beings of all the planets be happy. Im just guessing. Its the only thing I know in Sanskrit, and it is in my song to Amma. Phonetically, it sounds like this: Lokah Samasta Sukhino Bhavantu. May all the beings of all the planets be happy. Be Happy Love and Peace ~ Posted by Melanie at August 8, 2006 08:08 PM ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 12:15:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Music... music... music... now NJC aww.. c'mon Cassy! just one more post please on this! I have really enjoyed reading your posts on this - as well as the others' too. I will flick my Bic and stamp on the wood floor til we get one more out of you! :D Em < wrote: > This will be my final post on the topic of new music. ...snip ...... > Now it's time to let this go and continue to keep an open mind/ear > and enjoy > what I enjoy without having to put up with adamant incorrect > information, > closed minds and critical psycho-analysis for my choices > > Cassy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:51:55 -0500 From: "Steve Anderson" Subject: Sax Masters Without a doubt you should try John Coltrane Ballads. Also my favorite Art Pepper Wintermoon. Beautiful song with strings. Dexter Gordon has a cd called ballads as well. Charlie Parker with Strings. Of course Miles Davis with John Coltrane cd Kind of Blue (probably the most famous of all time jazz cds. Steve Anderson ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:29:06 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: India Arie - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cassy" > Hi Randy. I was not saying that Beck's or Matthew's music is better, or > as good as or making ANY kind of comparison. What I originally replied to > was the statement that firstly... there is NO good music from recent years > and secondly that any new music won't be memorable in future years. > > I love the music from the period you call the "Renaissance" but in my mind > that doesn't mean there is nothing of value in today's releases. I'm certainly not saying there is nothing of value coming out today-there is actually alot, from Bebel Gilberto to Bela Fleck, lots of good stuff... I'm just saying that there seemed to be a heavy concentration of sustained creativity through those years, with artists turning in brilliant albums in rapid succession. Bob M said: > But Randy - why do you want *another* Tommy, another Wish You Were Here, > another Inner Visions? We've already got those! If you want to hear them, > play them. I didn't say I wanted another...those are just examples of (IMO) masterpieces which were commonplace then, and have no modern counterpart. > Ironically, the closest thing I know of to The Who is the band that YOU > highlighted last week - Green Day; explosive, confrontational, lyrically > wicked, and a drummer who can excite as much as Keith Moon. And they're > just now hitting their peak! Yes, they are all that, but songwritingwise, you could take the 10 best songs in their whole carreer, and it would still pale next to "Who's Next"*. Or try taking the 10 best songs of any modern artist, and making an album that is as good as C&S or Disraeli Gears. And Joni was pumping them out yearly, as was Dylan, as were The Beatles, The Stones, etc... *they might very well agree with that. I think Fiona Apple is brilliant, but it's taken her 10 years to do 3 albums. Bands like U2 have been hit or miss. I guess I'm just saying that the muse was sprinkling lots of fairy dust around during that period. RR ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:16:51 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: Music... music... music... Cassy, unfortunately although this place is touted as an open forum with open minds, it rarely is. Nevertheless, there are a lot of very good people here that like to read different opinions and can handle them when they are not like their own. The delete button is for the rest and if you have learned nothing else from Joni Mitchell, remember to use it when you need to. And please don't stop posting, I enjoy your posts and your opinions. One more thing to remember; your opinion is yours, you own it. Dont' have to justify it, don't have to defend it. And if we all had the same opinion on everything, what a boring world it would be. Also, you know what they say about opinions. mack ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2006 #302 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------