From: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2006 #164 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-joni-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Website: http://jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Friday, April 28 2006 Volume 2006 : Number 164 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: tax man, njc [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy [Em ] Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] RE: Enjoyin' the Ride NJC ["bluejr@adelphia.net" ] Republicanisms njc PC ["bluejr@adelphia.net" ] On the outside looking in (njc) [waytoblue@comcast.net] Re: on the outside looking in NJC PC ["Lori Fye" ] Re: On the outside looking in (njc) ["Lori Fye" ] Re: On the outside looking in (njc) ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Blonde in the Bleachers - Joni & Pink parallel? ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Wicked (NJC) ["Gerald A. Notaro" ] Neil Young NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: On the outside looking in (njc) ["Lori Fye" ] NJC - Thanks ["Cassy" ] Re: republican mysteries NJC PC [] RE: NJC - Thanks ["bluejr@adelphia.net" ] RE: NJC - Thanks ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Re: on the outside looking in NJC [] Re: NJC - Thanks ["Lori Fye" ] RE: NJC - Thanks ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Re: republican mysteries NJC PC ["Lori Fye" ] njc, Urgent Alert for Emmylou Harris fans ["Patti Parlette" ] Re: Wicked (NJC) [djp ] Re: republican mysteries NJC PC ["gene" ] Re: On the outside looking in (njc) ["Randy Remote" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 15:11:01 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy You should go ahead and march tomorrow, Patti - you might attract enough media attention to become our own Cindy - the JMDL's one woman army...oops, shouldn't use that word in the description, though. Bob NP: David & Marianne Dalmour, "Both Sides Now" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 15:14:47 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: tax man, njc Anne wrote: the maximum rate on income up to $336,550 is 28%, with anything over that taxed at 35%. Oh great sting of the Alternative Minimum Tax tooooooo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 12:19:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy wouldn't it be funny if there were a person like a Gandhi or an MLK, but they accidentally did all their stuff on the wrong day? So they were only marginally effective, but effective none the less? It would be like a Clouseau of non-violent action. heehehhhh..sorry I am bored... Em - --- Bob.Muller@Fluor.com wrote: > thinking, > I guess.> > > You should go ahead and march tomorrow, Patti - you might attract > enough > media attention to become our own Cindy - the JMDL's one woman > army...oops, shouldn't use that word in the description, though. > > Bob > > NP: David & Marianne Dalmour, "Both Sides Now" > > - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > The information transmitted is intended only for the person > or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, > business-confidential and/or privileged material. > If you are not the intended recipient of this message you > are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, > dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken > in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received > this in error, please contact the sender and delete the > material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message > are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect > the views of the company. > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 15:35:13 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: njc, March for Peace, Justice & Democracy I didn't read the book, but isn't that the gist of "Forrest Gump"? An individual who changes the course of history repeatedly just by being in the right/wrong place at the right time. Woody Allen's brilliant film Zelig also comes to mind. Like they say, half of life is just showing up. Bob NP: The Garrin Benfield Band, "Black Crow" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain proprietary, business-confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 15:10:57 -0400 From: "bluejr@adelphia.net" Subject: RE: Enjoyin' the Ride NJC Hey man, no biggie... I do it all the time (well not with the Dead/Jerry anyway...not after 183 Jerry performances! 141 - Dead / 42 JGB) No retraction nec.! JR in NH Original Message: - ----------------- From: Jim L'Hommedieu, Lama jlamadoo@sbcglobal.net Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2006 20:49:22 -0400 To: bluejr@adelphia.net, joni@smoe.org Subject: Subject: Re: Wizard of OZ with PC NJC I tell ya, every week that I post includes a retraction of some kind. Sigh. Okay, I stand corrected. It's "Hell In a Bucket". I don't get the details right but at least I'm enjoying the ride. Jim JR in NH said, >Actually, it's not Touch of Grey, but Hell in a Bucket, from the same album, 1987's In the Dark. "There may come a day when I will dance on your grave, If unable to dance I'll still crawl across it, If unable to dance I'll still crawl, If unable to dance, I'll crawl" - -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:00:31 -0400 From: "bluejr@adelphia.net" Subject: Republicanisms njc PC This is such a perfect distillation of red-state 'thought'. I'd laugh more at it, if I could just stop being disgusted and fed up for a minute. J/ Things you have to believe to be a Republican: Today Jesus loves you, and shares your hatred of homosexuals and Hillary Clinton. Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him, and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion. Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is Communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony. The United States should get out of the United Nations, and our highest national priority is enforcing U.N. resolutions against Iraq. A woman can't be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation. The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches, while slashing veterans' benefits and combat pay. If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents won't have sex. A good way to fight terrorism is to belittle our long-time allies, then demand their cooperation and money. Providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy, but providing health care to all Americans is socialism. HMOs and insurance companies have the best interests of the public at heart. Global warming is junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools. A president lying about an extramarital affair is an impeachable offense, but a president lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy. Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet. The public has a right to know about Hillary's cattle trades, but George Bush's driving record is none of our business. Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime, unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery. You support states' rights, but the Attorney General can tell states what local voter initiatives they have the right to adopt. What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the '80s is irrelevant. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:35:44 +0000 From: waytoblue@comcast.net Subject: On the outside looking in (njc) ***** what kind of bullshit is this Kakki???????? I NEVER said anything about Nazi Germany ... wtf??????????? and it is my perogative to say that I dont like having to show a passport to the US border guards.. I repeat, I NEVER said anything about Nazi Germany. Ever. STepping on some tender territory there Kakki. Mags, VERY surprised at Kakki for making such an accusation. This is exactly what happens when people jump to conclusions, misinterpret messages, and start making accusations--things quickly escalate to a whole other level and become very nasty. Also, on a side note, I've started to believe that when people write something and include that it is "their humble opinion", they don't really mean that at all but completely the opposite, and only write that to give themselves free reign to totally go off on someone. The days have been beautiful lately in Atlanta. I'm looking forward to the Inman Park Festival, a longtime local arts and music festival, and spending time outside enjoying the nice breezes. My two tabby cats, Joni and Jessica are getting bigger and bigger and are a constant source of amusement and simple friendship. I started a new piece for piano in F sharp major. Speaking of Germany, I recently finished writing my first solo piano piece entitled "Bavarian Sunset." It still needs a bit of touching up but I'm really enjoying learning so much about classical composition. All of this senseless bickering brings to mind this excerpt from Frank Zappa "Just Another Band from LA" album. Questions, Questions, Questions, flooding into the mind of the concerned young person today. Ah, but it's a great time to be alive ladies and gentlemen. And that's the theme of our program for tonight, "It's so FUCKING GREAT to be alive"! Is what the theme of our show is tonight, boys and girls. And I'm wanna tell ya, if there is anybody here who DOESN'T believe that it is FUCKING GREAT to be alive, I wish that they go now, because this show will only bring them down so much... ] God Bless America Land that I love Call any vegetable Call it by name You've gotta call one today When you get off the train Call any vegetable And the chances are good Oh, that the vegetable will respond to you ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:14:02 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: on the outside looking in NJC PC Mark wrote: >>> It seems to me >>> that many people in the US feel awfully self-important in many ways I responded: >> Excellent points, Mark! Although I am often a contributor to the American political discussion >> threads, you are absolutely right on. I'll be taking a break from all of that, starting right now. Then Debra added: > Hmm, what's that about? Does being worried about the > Bushies' destructive policies equal feeling self-important? An even more excellent point, Debra. I'm back in -- although I'll try to keep my comments to a minimum. I also liked this, from Debra: > To be fair about it, Mark, maybe your dislike is that > the info is on the joni/music list, rather than an > unwillingness to think about what the Bushies are > doing. I can understand that. As has happened many > times before, this political talk will wind down until > something else happens that gets it going again. If > Joni was going on tour, or doing something equally > exciting, the emphasis would be more on that. Her > "Beginnings of Survival" lets me know she's concerned > about what's happening politically these days. Again, I wonder ... WWJD (what would Joni do)? I think she would APPROVE of us having these conversations. : ) Lori P.S. - See Patti Witten's "WWJD" stickers and magnets here: http://www.cafepress.com/buy/joni+mitchell/-/pv_design_details/pg_1/id_897433 5/opt_/fpt_________F______P___b7_a2_H/c_76/hlv_t ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:03:29 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: On the outside looking in (njc) Victor wrote: > Also, on a side note, I've started to believe that when people write something and include > that it is "their humble opinion", they don't really mean that at all but completely the > opposite, and only write that to give themselves free reign to totally go off on someone. That's why, several years ago, I dropped the "h" from "imho." Because my opinion is rarely humble. I make no apologies for that. But now it's always just "imo." That's just more truthful for me. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:03:29 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: On the outside looking in (njc) Victor wrote: > Also, on a side note, I've started to believe that when people write something and include > that it is "their humble opinion", they don't really mean that at all but completely the > opposite, and only write that to give themselves free reign to totally go off on someone. That's why, several years ago, I dropped the "h" from "imho." Because my opinion is rarely humble. I make no apologies for that. But now it's always just "imo." That's just more truthful for me. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:12:01 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Blonde in the Bleachers - Joni & Pink parallel? Joni: The blonde in the bleachers She flips her hair for you Pink: Maybe if I act like that, flipping my blond hair back Push up my bra like that, stupid girl! Maybe if I act like that, that guy will call me back Lori, with Pink's latest cd STILL stuck in my head, weeks after purchasing it ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 16:31:37 -0700 From: "Lindsay Moon" Subject: Wicked (NJC) Has anyone seen the musical "Wicked" the 'untold story' of the Wicked Witch from the Wizard of Oz? It's coming to San Diego and I was thinking of taking my kids but I'm not sure if it would be too complex for them (they're 12 and 10). We so rarely see any live theater, I was excited about this possibility. If anyone has any input, please email me off list. Thanks. Lindsay ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:58:13 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald A. Notaro" Subject: Re: Wicked (NJC) Kids love it. I didn't. Jerry, resident Broadway Queen Lindsay Moon wrote: > Has anyone seen the musical "Wicked" the 'untold story' of the Wicked > Witch > from the Wizard of Oz? It's coming to San Diego and I was thinking of > taking my kids but I'm not sure if it would be too complex for them > (they're > 12 and 10). We so rarely see any live theater, I was excited about this > possibility. If anyone has any input, please email me off list. Thanks. > > Lindsay ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 18:34:11 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Neil Young NJC Neil Young Lets Loose a War Cry By Robert Everett-Green The Globe and Mail Wednesday 26 April 2006 The world awaits Young's most powerful album in years, a disc fuelled by outrage at Washington. We met outside a bagel joint in north Toronto, then drove a few blocks to a quiet street where two strangers could sit in a big old Cadillac and listen to the car stereo in peace. Then Robert Young slipped a CD-ROM from a plain white sleeve and gave me a rare preview of the nine explosive new songs on his brother Neil Young's much-anticipated album, Living With War. The disc was made in a hurry, recorded in three days on Neil Young's California ranch and another 12-hour session in a Los Angeles studio. I can hear the urgency in Young's singing, as if there's not a moment to lose when a great lie has spread over the land and only strong, sustained truth-telling can turn it back. Living With War is a fierce, comprehensive indictment of the Bush administration and all its failures, at home and abroad, but it doesn't feel like an outsider's dissent. It's the work of someone who clearly identifies with the core values of ordinary Middle Americans who voted for Bush, who sent their sons and daughters to war, and who are beginning to feel betrayed. Flags of Freedom, for example, starts like a proudly patriotic song from the days before the Vietnam War began to stain the self-image of the republic. Young depicts a parade of recruits marching off to war down the main street of their small town, church bells ringing and "the flags of freedom flying." But when the soldiers have passed, with parents and sisters watching, Young pointedly asks: "Have you seen the flags of freedom? / What colour are they now?" It would be hard to miss the sense of doubt and disappointment, made sharper by Young's allusion to a similar, more confident query at the end of The Star-Spangled Banner. The disappointment turns into rage in Let's Impeach the President. This long impassioned outcry begins with a trumpet flourish from the Last Post and ends with a 100-voice chorus shouting Young's angry responses to numerous clips of Bush's own words about Bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and the case for war in Iraq. "Let's impeach the president for lying / and leading our country into war," Young hollers, "abusing all the power that we gave him / and shipping all our money out the door . . . Let's impeach the president for spying / on citizens inside their own homes / breaking every law in the country / tapping our computers and telephones." The text alone can't convey the sense of gasping outrage in Young's singing, and his forceful arrangements for guitar, bass, drums and sometimes trumpet. His electric guitar's gnarly, saturated tone has an almost drunken quality, as if it too were reeling from the great betrayal. But the music throughout the album feels sparse and tightly controlled, as if these statements were too important to be gussied up with ornament. The trumpet, when it appears, does so only briefly, with a different character each time, evoking the sounds of a border town in Bush's native Texas (in Shock and Awe), or doubling the guitar melody like a quasi-human voice (in Living With War). Likewise, the choir plays several roles, and offers much more than backing vocals. It's the sound of the people, whether represented as a church congregation (in the title song) or a chanting crowd of protesters (in Let's Impeach the President). Mostly, it's a big-tent collection of ordinary citizens, which at the end of the album sings an a cappella version of America the Beautiful, recalling in a more robust key the final scene of Michael Cimino's devastating Vietnam film, The Deer Hunter. The title song makes the most powerful use of core American themes and symbols, and the rhetoric of the religious right. Both the melody and the lyrics ("I join the multitudes, I raise my hand in peace . . . I take a holy vow never to kill again") feel hymn-like, in spite of the song's rock idiom. The voices rise as Young inserts a line from The Star-Spangled Banner ("the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air") and it seems at first as if the reference is purely ironic. But he goes on with another line from the anthem, and suddenly the meaning is more ambivalent, more complicated by a sense of bedrock patriotism. At bottom, this is a profoundly patriotic record. Its predominant theme is spoiled hopes, and the list is long, including hopes for a safe environment, for economic justice at home and abroad, for peace between nations. But a few songs make it clear that Young isn't finished with hoping. Looking for a Leader, which comes right after Let's Impeach the President, is an unvarnished call for a new authority figure who can right the wrong, clear out the corruption, and make the nation's symbols feel pure again. "Some one walks among us, and I hope he hears the call," Young sings, "Maybe it's a woman, or a black man after all." Young supported Reagan, and was one of the first major rock musicians to lend support to the so-called war on terror, in his 2001 song Let's Roll. It would seem to be a challenge for Bush's allies to brush off his attacks on "the shadow man running the government." But the struggle is already skewed in their favour, because most of these songs probably won't make it on to American radio, which is heavily dominated by the ClearChannel empire. Those are the folks, you may remember, who yanked the Dixie Chicks from the airwaves after Natalie Maines dared to criticize the President in front of a microphone. Young knows all about that, which is why this album will be streamed for free on his website (http://www.neilyoung.com) for a week starting Friday, before a commercial release on Reprise/Warner. It's going to spread on-line, and on college radio, and by word of mouth. It's a media virus, and it's also Young's strongest record in years. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 19:27:08 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: On the outside looking in (njc) >> That's why, several years ago, I dropped the "h" from "imho." Because my >> opinion is rarely humble. I make no apologies for that. But now it's >> always just "imo." That's just more truthful for me. > Plus they won't think you're claiming to be a ho ~ LOL ... and oops! Maybe I should restore the "h"! 'Cause I do be a ho ... mosexual! ; ) Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 22:25:56 -0400 From: "Cassy" Subject: NJC - Thanks I rarely participate in political or religious debates of any kind, it's a fast way to lose friends. I do, however, avidly read almost everything posted to the group, Joni related or not and though I prefer the Joni content I don't mind reading other people's opinions on world events and entertainment etc. The NJC is a great way to weed out the immediately interesting from the mail I can read when I have more time. Thanks to everyone that gives their input, it can sometimes take courage to put one's feelings and opinions in the mail, especially when things get a bit heated. I like that links are posted to articles I might otherwise have missed so thanks again to those who feed my mind. Warmly, Cassy NP: Screaming Angels Dancing In Your Garden - Lisa Germano ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 19:36:34 -0700 From: Subject: Re: republican mysteries NJC PC Debra, I'm not even going to attempt to respond to most of your post. Here's my bottom line. You and Mike and a few others here are provacateurs. You have every free choice and right to be that way but you are not entitled to demanding responses from people who do not agree with everything you say. I thought it odd that Mike would challenge me on an original post that I did not think was very controversial. I wondered if Mike was deliberately trying to bait me or set me up (especially by copying you on the post that you were not involved with) so that you (his friend and his other friends) could then step in and start bashing me. Looks like I was right. I tried to give Mike an honest answer and that included responding to his question regarding your and others opinions. I think I am being honest in saying that I cannot speak to your and others' opinions because it's obvious I don't agree with all of them and you and others do seem 1000 percent set in your convictions. What is the point then? I don't want to fight with you and "the others." Any debate goes nowhere so why not just let it go? You have enough people here who agree with you. Isn't that enough for you? Why must I be harrassed until I submit to your opinions? Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 22:58:43 -0400 From: "bluejr@adelphia.net" Subject: RE: NJC - Thanks Original Message: - ----------------- From: Cassy Siquomb@Comcast.net Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 22:25:56 -0400 To: joni@smoe.org Subject: NJC - Thanks >I rarely participate in political or religious debates of any kind, it's a >fast way to lose friends. Why the f$%^k would I want any Republican friends? J/ - -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 23:09:45 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: NJC - Thanks A Republican lover perhaps? >>Why the f$%^k would I want any Republican friends? >J/ > >-------------------------------------------------------------------- >mail2web - Check your email from the web at >http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:17:25 -0700 From: Subject: Re: on the outside looking in NJC Mags, !!!! Hey, I just recall you writing a post or two (very well written and capitvating, by the way) about your experience coming back from Canada (I thought on a train but maybe it was some other kind of land transportation) and you were either stopped or taken off the let's say a "train" so that some sort of government officials (border agents or something like that) could review your papers (don't recall if it was passport or visa or something else). If you never wrote a post about this please let me know because I may need to be tested for deficient mental faculties. It was written in a very "noir" style. I can visualize it now - it was like something out of a 40s movie and Ingrid Bergman was standing there huddled in the cold, waiting while the intimidating and grim-faced "agents" perused her papers. I did get the sense from your post that you were somehow frightened and horrified at being subjected to this episode. To me, your writing premise was to convey all the horror of the Gestapo suddenly emerging from nowhere demanding papers from the innocent who did not know what was going to happen next. I'm sorry if I was wrong to interpret it this way. But we all know how good a writer you are and you have fooled a few of us here a few times. ;-) "and it is my perogative to say that I dont like having to show a passport to the US border guards." But what about the rest of the world who have to show passports? Hell, we here have to show our passport or other proof of citizenship when we are hired for a job (maybe it's just California but I think it's a Fed. regulation). I left my job for awhile (where they had my passport on file) and then was rehired and they STILL made me show them my passport again. As mad as you may be at me, you have made me think about a lot of things - love of home, being in a place that was alien to me and longing for home and many other of my own experiences. I once lived in another state that shall remain nameless for three years. I was so miserable there and thought the people were the most backward, crude, oppressive and unsophisticated people I'd ever met. And I let them know it! And they would kick my a**! And I thought that just proved how backward they were. As I got older, intellectually I was able to sort out that my perceptions were colored by my own personal unhappiness and those people actually did me a favor as far as life lessons to knock me off my lofty perch and bring me to appreciate and respect differences. But ya know what? Whenever someone tells me they are thinking about moving to that state, I still say "Oh NO!" So I am still prejudiced against it, even though I know deep down that maybe it was really mostly my own colored perceptions and not them. All that aside, you do live in a glorious and beautiful country, Mags, and you have every right to love it and be proud of it. "There's no place like home," said Dorothy and it's true. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:20:08 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: NJC - Thanks J/ asked (or perhaps exclaimed is a better word): > Why the f$%^k would I want any Republican friends? J/, if you had a friend (good friend or casual friend, doesn't matter) and for some reason you didn't already know what American political party s/he belonged to, and you learned s/he was a Republican -- or maybe had simply voted for a Republican candidate -- are you telling me you would cease to be friends with that person? I have friends who are Republicans. Of course I wish they weren't Republicans, but I'm not going to stop being friends with them over that difference. There are a bunch of shades of GOP-ism. May not seem as if there are, but there are. And not all Repubs vote the party line (my mother certainly didn't). Sometimes my Repub friends and I agree that we won't discuss politics. Sometimes we discuss the hell out of politics. But I don't turn away from my friends (unless they've done something truly egregious, like molest children or commit a rape or something like that -- murder is debatable; it would depend on who they killed and why). Republican friends make my life interesting. Variety is the spice of life and all that ... : ) Lori, who also LOVES to discuss religion even though I'm ... I dunno ... agnostic? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 23:28:27 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: NJC - Thanks I bet....I bet you one hundred bucks if you and I sat down and talked about music ..Joni...over a drink...you would think afterwards...she isn't so bad...that repub is okay. What do you think? Bree >A Republican lover perhaps? > > >>>Why the f$%^k would I want any Republican friends? >>J/ >> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------- >>mail2web - Check your email from the web at >>http://mail2web.com/ . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:07:57 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: republican mysteries NJC PC > Why must I be harrassed until I submit to your opinions? Because we are RIGHT, Kakki! ; ) I'm teasing you, of course (and besides, we may be correct but we are mainly LEFT). Seriously though, it does seem that since 9/11, if a person disagrees with anything the Administration says or does, that person is labelled "anti-American," "anti-patriotic," etc. Maybe *you* don't label dissenters that way, Kakki, but plenty of other Republicans do. What's up with that? Lori ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 03:41:48 +0000 From: "Patti Parlette" Subject: njc, Urgent Alert for Emmylou Harris fans Hello Dears, I just got home from the over-long (3 hours+ !) undergraduate French play and want to just crawl into bed (quelle journee!), but I just learned that Emmylou Harris and Mark Knopfler are going to be on the Letterman Show tonight. I feel it is my civic JMDL duty to inform you all, especially notre Kate B. la chanteuse who recently had an EHRA (Emmylou Harris related absence). Okay, mes ami(e)s? That's in 5 minutes for East Coasters. Others, check your local listings. Bon nuit, bonne musique, bonnes reves, et bon everything..... Bisous, Patti P., absolument fatigue ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 20:25:58 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: NJC - Thanks >> Why the f$%^k would I want any Republican friends? > A Republican lover perhaps? I admit, I would have to draw the line at that. Republican FRIENDS, yes. Marianne might be able to do it, but I'm not going to SLEEP with the "enemy!" ; ) (Love ya, Bree!) Lori, who is very lucky in that my partner is a registered Democrat who shares almost all of my politcal and social values ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 23:13:05 -0500 From: djp Subject: Re: Wicked (NJC) Answering the question that you didn't ask, I'll say that I liked the novel a lot. I was going to mention in the "Oz" thread that it is a interesting and entertaining excursion into teasing apart the ways in which good and bad are very complex categories AND the political value in erasing that complexity. Also, I used to record books for the blind, and had a fun time wondering how to pronounce "Horse" differently from "horse". Answering the question you did ask, I'll say I don't know. I never saw the show, or heard the score or anything. djp At 07:58 PM 4/27/2006, Gerald A. Notaro wrote: >Kids love it. I didn't. > >Jerry, resident Broadway Queen > >Lindsay Moon wrote: > > Has anyone seen the musical "Wicked" the 'untold story' of the Wicked > > Witch > > from the Wizard of Oz? It's coming to San Diego and I was thinking of > > taking my kids but I'm not sure if it would be too complex for them > > (they're > > 12 and 10). We so rarely see any live theater, I was excited about this > > possibility. If anyone has any input, please email me off list. Thanks. > > > > Lindsay ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 22:35:47 -0700 From: "gene" Subject: Re: republican mysteries NJC PC hello kakki, i always don't agree (rarely) with you, but i really cherish your insights, knowledge, humor, social contacts, and all that other stuff. different strokes for different folks. just carry on. take care gene - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "dsknyc05" ; "mike pritchard" Cc: Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 7:36 PM Subject: Re: republican mysteries NJC PC > Debra, > > I'm not even going to attempt to respond to most of your post. Here's my > bottom line. You and Mike and a few others here are provacateurs. You > have every free choice and right to be that way but you are not entitled > to demanding responses from people who do not agree with everything you > say. I thought it odd that Mike would challenge me on an original post > that I did not think was very controversial. I wondered if Mike was > deliberately trying to bait me or set me up (especially by copying you on > the post that you were not involved with) so that you (his friend and his > other friends) could then step in and start bashing me. Looks like I was > right. I tried to give Mike an honest answer and that included responding > to his question regarding your and others opinions. I think I am being > honest in saying that I cannot speak to your and others' opinions because > it's obvious I don't agree with all of them and you and others do seem > 1000 percent set in your convictions. What is the point then? I don't > want to fight with you and "the others." Any debate goes nowhere so why > not just let it go? You have enough people here who agree with you. > Isn't that enough for you? Why must I be harrassed until I submit to your > opinions? > > Kakki > > !DSPAM:144,445180d7114741245114690! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:06:10 -0700 From: "Randy Remote" Subject: Re: On the outside looking in (njc) > That's why, several years ago, I dropped the "h" from "imho." Because my > opinion is rarely humble. I make no apologies for that. But now it's > always just "imo." That's just more truthful for me. > > Lori > Plus they won't think you're claiming to be a ho ~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 08:53:20 +0200 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: RE: Republican mysteries NJC PC Kakki wrote to Debra and myself. My response here is on my own behalf and has not been discussed with Debra. She will no doubt make her views clear herself. >>Debra, Here's my bottom line. You and Mike and a few others here are provacateurs.<< I deny that I am a provocateur, and I think the others are not either. >>I thought it odd that Mike would challenge me on an original post that I did not think was very controversial. << I did not think my 'challenge' was controversial either. I merely pointed out that in my opinion there are other countries which have equally fine (or better) records of liberty, tolerance and civil and social rights in general. I did not mention these things specifically, we were talking about an ambiguous concept such as 'freeedom', but this is what I meant. I think neither my tone nor my content was challenging. I was trying to be informative, and offering an alternative to your examples. Here is something you wrote which I find challenging, aggressive and provocative, but I did not respond to it. >>For one thing many on the left have nothing but contempt for any notions of "patriotism" and always seem to loudly reject it as "fascist." But then they get all upset if someone calls them "unpatriotic." Why would they care to be called "patriotic" anyway if is something they revile?<< Debra responded to these and similar matters in another, wonderfully argued and so-far non-rebutted thread (Talk vs Actions PC NJC (was RE: njc, I'm the Decider) which dealt with similar issues, i.e. Joe Wilson, leaking secret information to selected reporters, Karl Rove, New Orleans floods, budget deficits, Guantanamo, invasion of Iraq, torture, stock market situation, softball questions, chemical and industrial pollution, although no mention of Kyoto here, oil addiction, inadequate school funding, pharmaceutical profiteering, WMD, tax cuts for the rich, church funding, and more. Of course I copied my subsequent post to Debra; she was already in the thick of the argument. >>I wondered if Mike was deliberately trying to bait me or set me up (especially by copying you on the post that you were not involved with) so that you (his friend and his other friends) could then step in and start bashing me. Looks like I was right.<< This is simply absurd, and unworthy of any serious response, except to repeat that Debra was already involved in this debate, if not exactly in the same thread. >>I tried to give Mike an honest answer and that included responding to his question regarding your and others opinions. << And I accepted your answers and agreed that I did not live in the USA etc and probably had less local knowledge of what goes on there; hence my question 'Given what's been happening recently in the US, do you really think these reflect present-day US values, or are they goals to be achieved one day in the future, or memories of a golden age in the past? >>Why must I be harrassed until I submit to your opinions?<< I don't know if you mean Debra's or my opinions, probably you mean hers, but I do not want you to be harassed or to submit to my/her/our/anyone's opinions. I would be perfectly satisfied if you would, for once, accept that not all is well in the USA (see Debra's list) and that the blame for these things falls on the Bush administration, not on Clinton, or Debra, or 'non-patriotic' Americans. People have a right to express an opinion about the state of their country, or, in my case, a country which is not mine but which for generations has been profoundly affected by what happens in the USA, and what the US government does, both legally and illegally. I live in Spain, but was born and raised in the UK. The US government has used airports in both these countries to kidnap European citizens and illegally transport them to third world countries in order to be tortured. Does this give me a right to criticise the US government? I think so. While I'm in a critical mode, I'll mention two books which criticise the two countries I know and love best. Mike Davis' magnificent 'Late Victorian Holocausts', which describes the deliberate massacre of sixty million people in the 19th century. British governments were responsible for this, and I condemn it with no compunction. Eduardo Galeano's also magnificent 'Open Veins of Latin America' on the pillage of Latin America, by the UK, Spain, Portugal among others, and the USA enters the stage in the final act here, but it's principally about Spain. I condemn the imperial project of the European countries which left Latin America in the state it's now in. Someone once wrote, I think it was Kubrik, that small countries always acted like prostitutes and big countries like pimps. Will you now accept, and admit, that the USA has acted in this way, bearing in mind Debra's list of accusations? If not, I will drop the matter and harass you no more. I don't want you to submit to my opinion, I would like you to accept that other people too have opinions which are worthy of respect, not derision and accusations of non-patriotic. At least you didn't mention Marxism this time around. mike in barcelona ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2006 #164 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe -------