From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2005 #145 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, March 31 2005 Volume 2005 : Number 145 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: March Film Festival NJC ["mike pritchard" ] RE: March Film Festival NJC [Jamie Zubairi ] RE: March Film Festival NJC [Bob Muller ] RE: March Film Festival NJC [Bob Muller ] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat [Jerry Notaro ] At last, unity for Christianity, Judaism & Islam -- njc [Smurf ] Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC [rosemjoy@aol.com] Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC ["Donna Binkley" ] hunting & fishing ["Kate Bennett" ] Happy half century! ["Anne Sandstrom" ] re: Tragedy at Red Lake High School (njc)..now Internet hunting ["Donna B] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC ["Steven Polifka" ] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: smoking guns NJC ["Ruth Davis" ] Re: smoking guns NJC [Lori Fye ] Somedays you can't avoid the blues... (njc) [LittleBreen@comcast.net] Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat ["McMillan Brad" ] Extreme Women "the Book " [brianasymes@aol.com] What to give a woman who has everything? [John Calimee Subject: RE: March Film Festival NJC >>Don't know if anyone else has seen these, but if you get the chance you'll be glad you did. << Hi Bob, I've seen 'The Choir' (actually 'choirboys' here in Spain) and it's a kind of musical 'Dead Poets Club'. Moving yes, but a little too sentimental for my taste, esp the ending. 'Vera Drake' I may well go see today, it's playing in a cinema 100 metres from my home and I have no more classes today. Two other Leigh films you might be interested in: 'Life is Sweet' is wonderfully funny and a worthy follow up to 'High Hopes'. He did many wonderful tv plays for the BBC before making movies. Imelda Staunton is a wonderful actress, remember her as the hysterical mother in that awful 'Peter's Friends'? I like your crack about 'eating a brownie' but I didn't think it would get pass the censor in the USA. A brownie is what I think she is, isn't she? mike in bcn np - elvis Costello: pouring water on a drowning man ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:51:01 +0100 (BST) From: Jamie Zubairi Subject: RE: March Film Festival NJC I'd like to know what you think of Vera Drake. My friend Alex Kelly is in it playing Ethel, the daughter with a very sweet storyline. Jamie Z --- mike pritchard wrote: > >>Don't know if anyone else has seen these, but if > you get the chance you'll > be glad you did. << > Hi Bob, I've seen 'The Choir' (actually 'choirboys' > here in Spain) and it's a > kind of musical 'Dead Poets Club'. Moving yes, but a > little too sentimental > for my taste, esp the ending. > 'Vera Drake' I may well go see today, it's playing > in a cinema 100 metres from > my home and I have no more classes today. Two other > Leigh films you might be > interested in: 'Life is Sweet' is wonderfully funny > and a worthy follow up to > 'High Hopes'. He did many wonderful tv plays for the > BBC before making movies. > Imelda Staunton is a wonderful actress, remember her > as the hysterical mother > in that awful 'Peter's Friends'? I like your crack > about 'eating a brownie' > but I didn't think it would get pass the censor in > the USA. A brownie is what > I think she is, isn't she? > mike in bcn > np - elvis Costello: pouring water on a drowning man > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 03:36:24 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Muller Subject: RE: March Film Festival NJC I thought that was an awfully good bit of casting...in the opening scene when Ethel is helping Vera get supper on I found the resemblance uncanny. Please tell your friend how much I enjoyed her performance. Bob NP: David Baerwald, "Walk Through Fire" Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 03:39:47 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Muller Subject: RE: March Film Festival NJC Thanks for the reply, Mike - I've actually seen 'Life Is Sweet' & 'Secrets & Lies', both of which I thought were brilliant. I don't know how accessible his films are here on video, but I'm fixin' to find out. Bob NP: Natalie Merchant, "All I Want" Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:11:12 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat I'm with you on this one, Lucy. I have been near Joni several times, but would never approached her. I was at a party in Toronto once, very early on (1969) and Joni was there holding court. I inched closer to the group and pretended to be part of it to hear what she had to say, but that was it. And I have seen her fans rush her to where it was embarrassing. I've been good friends with a few famous people and I think it was because I respected their space and privacy. Oddly enough, that seems to get you closer to them. The only one who turned me into butter while standing in line with her was Liza. We were in an airport lounge, standing in line, and I just couldn't help it. Well, she was right in front of me! She couldn't have been more gracious and kind. When she sat down at a table with a friend, people around her sort of looked, but left her alone. I'm sure she appreciated that. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 05:19:47 -0800 (PST) From: Smurf Subject: At last, unity for Christianity, Judaism & Islam -- njc This article from the New York Times illustrates why organized religion makes me want to heave: March 31, 2005 Clerics of 3 Faiths Protest Gay Festival Planned for Jerusalem By LAURIE GOODSTEIN and GREG MYRE International gay leaders are planning a 10-day WorldPride festival and parade in Jerusalem in August, saying they want to make a statement about tolerance and diversity in the Holy City, home to three great religious traditions. Now major leaders of the three faiths - Christianity, Judaism and Islam - are making a rare show of unity to try to stop the festival. They say the event would desecrate the city and convey the erroneous impression that homosexuality is acceptable. "They are creating a deep and terrible sorrow that is unbearable," Shlomo Amar, Israel's Sephardic chief rabbi, said yesterday at a news conference in Jerusalem attended by Israel's two chief rabbis, the patriarchs of the Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox and Armenian churches, and three senior Muslim prayer leaders. "It hurts all of the religions. We are all against it." Abdel Aziz Bukhari, a Sufi sheik, added: "We can't permit anybody to come and make the Holy City dirty. This is very ugly and very nasty to have these people come to Jerusalem." Israeli authorities have not indicated what action, if any, they might take to limit the events. Banning the festival would seem unlikely, though the government could withhold the required permits for specific events, like a parade. Interfaith agreement is unusual in Israel. The leaders' joint opposition was initially generated by the Rev. Leo Giovinetti, an evangelical pastor from San Diego who is both a veteran of the American culture war over homosexuality and a frequent visitor to Israel, where he has formed relationships with rabbis and politicians. Organizers of the gay pride event, Jerusalem WorldPride 2005, said that 75 non-Orthodox rabbis had signed a statement of support for the event, and that Christian and Muslim leaders as well as Israeli politicians were expected to announce their support soon. They said they were dismayed to see that what united their opponents was their objection to homosexuality. "That is something new I've never witnessed before, such an attempt to globalize bigotry," said Hagai El-Ad, the executive director of Jerusalem Open House, a gay and lesbian group that is the host for the festival. "It's quite sad and ironic that these religious figures are coming together around such a negative message." Rabbi Sharon Kleinbaum, co-chairwoman of the festival and the rabbi of Congregation Beth Simchat Torah, a gay synagogue in New York City, said the controversy was another sign that each religion had become polarized between its liberal and conservative wings. The global Anglican Communion split deeply over homosexuality in the last two years after its American affiliate ordained an openly gay bishop and the Canada affiliate decided to allow blessings of same-sex unions. "I reject that they have the right to define religion in such a narrow way," Rabbi Kleinbaum said of religious leaders who denounce homosexuality. "Gay and lesbian people are saying we are equal partners in religious communities, and we believe in a religious world in which all are created in God's image." The festival is planned for Aug. 18-28 and is expected to draw thousands of visitors from dozens of countries. The theme is "Love Without Borders," and a centerpiece will be a parade on Aug. 25 through Jerusalem, a city that remains deeply conservative, though other parts of Israel have become increasingly accepting of gays in recent years. Other events include a film festival, art exhibits and a conference for clerics. When the first WorldPride festival was held five years ago in Rome, religious opposition came from the Vatican, while secular opposition came from a neo-Fascist group that vowed to hold a counterdemonstration. But the neo-Fascists canceled their demonstration, the march came off peacefully, and even a few center-right politicians joined many thousands of marchers. One day later, however, Pope John Paul II appeared on a balcony over St. Peter's Square and delivered a message expressing his "bitterness" that the gay festival had gone forward, calling it an "offense to the Christian values of a city that is so dear to the hearts of Catholics across the world." Both WorldPride festivals were initiated by an umbrella group, InterPride, that says its mission is to promote gay rights internationally. The outcry over the 2005 festival will not be confined to Israel. The American evangelical leader who helped to galvanize the opposition, Mr. Giovinetti, is the senior pastor of Mission Valley Christian Fellowship, an independent church that meets in a hotel in Southern California. A former band leader in Las Vegas, he is also host of a radio program heard on stations around the United States. Neither he nor other evangelical American leaders were at the news conference in Jerusalem, which was called by the chief rabbinate of Israel. But by all accounts Mr. Giovinetti played a crucial role in spreading the first alarms among religious leaders about the gay festival. He said he had first heard about WorldPride from a congregation member who had told Mr. Giovinetti that he was gay for many years and still monitored gay Web sites. Mr. Giovinetti said he alerted Israeli politicians and religious leaders. Mr. Giovinetti circulated a petition against the festival, titled "Homosexuals to Desecrate Jerusalem," which he said had been signed by every member of the ultra-Orthodox Shas Party in the Israeli Parliament. Another American who helped bring together the opposition was Rabbi Yehuda Levin, of the Rabbinical Alliance of America, which says it represents more than 1,000 American Orthodox rabbis. At the news conference in Jerusalem, he called the festival "the spiritual rape of the Holy City." He said, "This is not the homo land, this is the Holy Land." Annual marches by homosexuals have become routine in Tel Aviv, a secular coastal city. For the past three years, gay parades have also been staged in Jerusalem. Religious groups have complained, but the police have issued permits for the events, which have been held without any serious incidents. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:21:28 -0500 From: "Scott and Jody" Subject: The BorderCollies have a small favour to ask...NJC Victor asked that I send this to the list: jody > [Original Message] > From: BorderCollie World Headquarters > To: CollieMania! \(E-mail\) > Date: 3/30/05 5:25:06 AM > Subject: The BorderCollies have a small favour to ask . . . > > Hey there. This is Michael Robbins. I wondered if you could do us a small > favour. I'd like you to write a complaining email to someone on our behalf. > > It seems that another band in Ireland that knows us has decided to use our > band name for their own. Their leader, Colm O'Donnell, actually told me > about this the last time we were there, in the summer of 2003. He also > mentioned that he liked the t-shirt I gave him so much that he copied the > printing (complete with the logo) to use for his own, new band as well. I > told him face to face that I didn't think this was cool, and he shrugged it > off. I was appalled, but couldn't do much at the time, right there in > Ireland. > > In May of 2004, an article about his so-called Border Collies appeared in > Irish Music Magazine. At that point, their band didn't even have a CD out, > but they got a there-page write up anyway. In the article (I have a copy) > Colm O'Donnell (leader) mentioned OUR band, and mentioned meeting me in (by > name) and alluded to there being a "connection" between the two bands. > > I have since tried every means to contact him and get them to cease and > desist, but to no avail. They have never returned emails, phone calls or > any type of correspondence. I even posted an "open letter" to him on our > website, and emailed many of his friends and relatives to view the site. > > In December of 2004, they released a CD titled "Unleashed" by the Border > Collies to worldwide press and international on-line distribution. Again, I > tried to reach them and their supporters, relatives, etc., to get them to > stop. It's a small international Celtic music community, and having two > bands with the same name is ridiculous - very confusing to say the least. > Again, no response. > > Finally, at my wits end, I recently hired an attorney, who took on the case > and has had me file for US Trademark and Servicemark protection. This has > been a very expensive action, costing about $1,000 for filings and for the > attorney. These items, once set in place through the legal system, will > also give us protection of our name (for both CD's and products as well as > performance name protection) both in the US and with other countries that > have adopted the international trade agreements therein. The UK and Ireland > have both signed these agreements, so it's a matter of a few months before > we get the thing legally secured. We can then have a strong legal basis to > sue the bastards, and possibly have them have to appear in US Federal court > here in Atlanta, rather than a costly lawsuit in Ireland. Also, I've found > out they are planning a US tour this summer, and are even planning on coming > through the Southeast - our very own backyard. With the trademark and > servicemarks in place, they can be denied a work visa for entering the US as > the BorderCollies, and any performances or CD's they sell here will come > under this protection. > > In the meantime, I have started contacting various individuals with > profession organizations to begin a email-writing campaign, since Colm's > band just published (like last week) a website and an email address. Our > fans have started pouring letters of complaint to them, and so I'm asking > that if you can, please take a moment to write to these guys and tell you > know who the real BorderCollies are, and are displeased with their > arrogance, their lack of respect and their posture. They have admitted to > stealing our name in the press - so it's a matter of public record. The > fact that we can prove that we've been a band with an international presence > since 1999, having released our first CD in December of 2000 and our second > CD released in 2002 is very obvious. They state on their website that their > band was formed in 2002 - clearly quite some time after ours was > established. They are deliberately pissing on us! > > Their new website even mocks ours. Our site is > http://www.thebordercollies.com > > there's is > > http://www.thebordercollies.net > > their email address is > > thebordercollies@eircom.net > > Please copy me on any emails you send them. I'd like to read them. Also, > please pass this on to anyone you know that might be pissed at such a > blatant act of disrespect. We'd love to have mail pouring in to them from > around the world, to show that it's not just a local Georgia issue, and to > show international support of our band. > > Thanks, > > -Michael Robbins ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 05:29:45 -0800 (PST) From: Smurf Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat - --- Jerry wrote: > The only one who turned me into butter while > standing in line with her was > Liza. We were in an airport lounge, standing in > line, and I just couldn't > help it. Well, she was right in front of me! She > couldn't have been more > gracious and kind. When she sat down at a table with > a friend, people around > her sort of looked, but left her alone. I'm sure she > appreciated that. I left Liza alone the one time I saw her, too, Jerry - -- at the concession stand at a movie theater in NYC. But I remember thinking that she was so tiny, not anything like the 20-foot woman in "Cabaret!" Is she really that petite? I don't know if that's the actually the case, or if I just expect performers I like to be enormous. I think I would say the same thing about Joni if I got that close to her (after the restraining orders expire, of course). - --Smurf, really late now -- bye! __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:13:44 -0500 From: rosemjoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC Happy Birthday Michael!!! Much Love, Rosalita xxoo - -----Original Message----- From: Smurf To: Lori Fye ; FMYFL@aol.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:57:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC Dearest Michael, I would do anything for love, but I won't do that. Oh, okay. Happy 50th, you big lug. XO, - --Smurf __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:35:13 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC Happiest of Birthdays to my Pazmania, man of a thousand songs! Have a martini for me and hope you have a great day. love Tex >>> 3/30/2005 1:47:33 PM >>> Many Happy Returns on your BIG birthday, Mikey! I won't divulge how old you are, but a half-century is a pretty good chunk of time, ain't it? I wouldn't know since I'm such a Spring chicken myself. :-) You're my bestest friend in the Whole Wide World, so do me a favor: don't go changing, okay? Love, Julius ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 07:29:41 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: hunting & fishing The older I get the less I judge others for their personal choices. I could never kill an animal, bird or fish. I tried fishing once & when I caught it, looked into its beautiful eyes & saw it gasping for breath & put it back into the sea. There is no joy in any of those activities for me. I think it is wonderful that some have had the experience of getting their own game growing up, not as 'sport' but as honest to goodness food gathering for consumption. I am a hypocrite. I wear cow shoes & coats. My fur is faux however. I eat chicken, fish & sometimes cow. No baby animals though unless you consider unfertilized eggs to be so. I'd rather be drinking carrot juice. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:33:40 -0500 From: "Anne Sandstrom" Subject: Happy half century! Happy birthday, Monsieur Paz!!!! Technically, you're only halfway to being an antique :-) But for a semi-antique you do have a pretty nice patina LOL! Hope you celebrate in style! lots of love, Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:53:44 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: re: Tragedy at Red Lake High School (njc)..now Internet hunting This is horrible. db >>> "mia ortlieb" 3/30/2005 9:29:21 PM >>> <> Hi Donna, sadly it is true. I heard of it from my uncle, who is a (responsible) hunter in Wisconsin. There may be a moratorium soon, if not now, because of all the eyebrows that have been raised. Here is one website I just now came across: http://www.theeagle.com/sports/outdoors/120204sasser.php Mia ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 11:43:24 EST From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat Lucy asked: Over the years just how many other people will have done this? .........gone up to her in a peaceful moment to unload their Joni story? Hi Lucy, I wouldn't be added to this number. I would be all ears and questions with Joni. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:52:22 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat >I will not be part, ever of anyone's discomfort. I would never ever approach her... If her car broke down out side my house and she came to ask for help I might let on I knew her but only as she was driving away........ But then that is me... Lucy< LOL Lucy. I recently had an experience such as you mention above. Our house is on the market & we have had many very interesting folks of all kinds looking at it. Once in a while, when our agent can not do the showing, we do it ourselves. 2 Saturdays ago I got a call from our agent asking if we could show the house to another agent & a client from out of town. No names were mentioned. When the person walked in the door I knew who it was because I had been a huge fan all of my life & not too long ago, gone to one of this person's concerts (no I am not naming names & no it wasn't Joni but someone similarly admired). I was thrilled & whispered to Jeff when this person was out of the room who it was. I gave this person the tour around our property & we spoke of so many things. It is obvious Jeff & I are musicians when you walk through our home. I never mentioned music, I never let on I know who this person was. It never felt right to do so. It was a lovely connection & I am still in the glow of what a surreal yet totally natural situation this was, to have someone show up AT MY DOOR who is an true icon in my world. I have met & mingled & befriended a considerable amount of celebrities through the years & have become used to it. I usually let them be just a person, rather than a 'name'. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:00:05 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat Lucy Hone wrote: > Hello Laura , and thanks for reading my post. > > My view on going to the grill is.......... I think you would find > that > if she showed up, almost every other person in the grill probably > was > there for the same reason. The food might be wonderful, the > atmosphere > brilliant and there may be tired waitresses and grumpy chefs and it > might be a bit like living in an Edward Hopper painting.... and it > might be tacky and it might be lovely... I've been to the Daily Grill. It's a very nice but informal restaurant with good food and reasonable prices. My understanding is that Joni likes it because it has outdoor seating where she can smoke. A pleasant place to enjoy lunch on a sunny southern California afternoon. Joni wasn't there the day & Travis I were. Kakki was there along with Ken Corral, Michael Paz, Clark Carleton, Phyliss Ward, Catherine Turley and her husband, Lori Fye, Steve and Michelle Dulson and a few others who I hope will forgive me if they are still on the list and did not mention them. It was a mini-Jonifest. We had just seen the Van Gogh exhibit at LACMA. Later we had a lovely evening of song and conversation at Kakki's place. Several people on the list have encountered Joni at the Daily Grill at one time or another. I have never heard of any of them approaching her or 'stalking her'. Some of them have talked to her there, however, as it seems Joni is a gregarious person and engages people in conversation from time to time. I completely agree with you, Lucy. I think everyone should have the right to their privacy and be able to walk the public streets without being harrassed by total strangers. We have had many reports, however, that Joni is very gracious with fans when she meets them. I doubt very much that she is ever mobbed these days or accosted by over-zealous teens, hounding her for autographs. On the odd occasion when she has come face to face with an obviously tongue-tied fans, she has said that her impulse has been to give them a hug. Mark E. in Seattle 'Autograph fiends! Those gangs of adolescents who run around like packs of coyotes. They're nobody's fans! They're mental defectives! They've never even seen a play. They're never indoors long enough!' -Bette Davis as Margot Channing in 'All About Eve' (just for you, Jimmy) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:59:51 -0600 From: "Steven Polifka" Subject: Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC So Mikey, You need to tell us how you partied down for that big celebrtation and how that pink halter went over... Hope all your (s)wishes come true! LOL! But you know, (sigh) no one would really look twice at a cross-dressing Honduran in New Orleans... Stevo >>> 3/31/2005 9:13:44 AM >>> Happy Birthday Michael!!! Much Love, Rosalita xxoo - -----Original Message----- From: Smurf To: Lori Fye ; FMYFL@aol.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Sent: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:57:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Happy Birthday, Paz! NJC Dearest Michael, I would do anything for love, but I won't do that. Oh, okay. Happy 50th, you big lug. XO, - --Smurf __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:35:31 EST From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat Mark wrote: ...hounding her for autographs. On the odd occasion when she has come face to face with an obviously tongue-tied fans, she has said that her impulse has been to give them a hug. Hi Mark, If I saw Joni in a situation where there wasn't a crowd, I would first be in disbelief that is was her. So, my first question would be, "are you Joni Mitchell?" My second question would be, "may I have your autograph please?" And, my third question would be, "would you like to be left alone?" If she said no to the third question, I would tell her I'm a tongue-tied fan and ask for a hug. The rest would go from there. Love and joy, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 18:21:15 GMT From: "Ruth Davis" Subject: Re: smoking guns NJC I would like to see Bill Gates or Warren Buffett, or someone like that invest in the Indian reservations and other economically depressed areas in this country. They could start up manufacturing operations that would create solar retrofit packages to be sold to residential homeowners. That way, their investment would have dual impact by giving people jobs and hope, and it would help decrease our countries reliance on imported oil. Ruth "...guns aimed at the hot blood of being no one..." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:41:55 -0500 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: smoking guns NJC Ruth wrote: > I would like to see Bill Gates or Warren Buffett, or someone like that invest in the > Indian reservations and other economically depressed areas in this country. > They could start up manufacturing operations that would create solar retrofit > packages to be sold to residential homeowners. That way, their investment > would have dual impact by giving people jobs and hope, and it would help > decrease our countries reliance on imported oil. Ruth, have you ever considered running for public office? Maybe you should. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 19:43:16 +0000 From: LittleBreen@comcast.net Subject: Somedays you can't avoid the blues... (njc) Hi gang, Most of you know me as a cheerful person, and it's not a front -- I find humor in the strangest places (The tiny amount of Joni in this post is my translation of "Heart, Humor and Humility" Heart comes out as Ferocity, only as needed (most often on buses), and the humor is me most of the time. When I'm not being "Thor of the Buses", I'm mostly laughing. But some days... Yesterday I was looking through my current partner Robert's old cassette (audio) tapes, and came upon, to my delight, Malcolm McLaren's "Fans". If you don't know it, it's hard to describe, but I'll try -- each cut -- there are only six, starts with an aria from a well-known opera, and builds around it with rap, R&B-ish stuff, some 80-ish electronica (it dates from 1984), and the aria itself sung by a professional, or at least operatically trained, singer. I don't know if McLaren did this to try to lure kids into opera, or just for the sake of eclecticism. Most of the cuts work to one degree or another, and the opening cut, Madame Butterfly, is brilliant, but will probably offend any opera purist. I put the tape on, not knowing -- it hadn't been played, according to Robert, in at least 15 years, possibly more -- how it would sound. It turned out to be in near-perfect condition. I smiled just as McClaren (is he Australian, does anyone know? -- he does a pretty good American accent, but I'm suspicious of some of his vowels) started up with "Back in Nagasaki..." and then immediately started weeping. Now, if you know the storyline of Madame Butterfly and you're not an unfeeling cad, this might not surprise you -- Tragedy City -- but that's actually not why I was crying. My second lover, Charles, committed suicide on June 27th, 1987. (Weird aside -- Another lover, Chris, who later died of AIDS, was born on June 27th, and a third lover died of AIDS on June 27th, 1993. Guess which is my least favorite day of the year?) I'll spare you the details -- it was a mess, needless to say, and devastating -- but the connection is that one of the pieces Charles listened to more or less non-stop when it came out was, you guessed it, McClaren's "Fans". (Something I hadn't noticed before, or had forgotten, was the following comment on the insert to the cassette: "The real business of fans is to attract attention. To move gracefully and charismatically through social events. Their season is brilliant but brief. They grow brittle and harder to handle with age. Some self-destruct!" Yeah, ouch.) Another album Charles had listened to a lot when it came out was Peter Gabriel's "So", particularly "Red Rain" and (ironically) "Don't Give Up", the duet with Kate Bush in which she tries to convince him not to commit suicide. So those two albums were, for me, after Charles died, sort of "only to be listened to at home alone when you have an hour or two to cry" music. I did come up with "response" music -- Carly Simon's "Coming Around Again," and Kate Bush's "Runnin' Up That Road" -- but they made me cry, too. Anyway, Robert came in to the bedroom when he heard me playing "Fans", mostly to confirm that the sound was still good, and caught me gnashing my teeth and rending my garments. Or actually, just weeping. "Oh my god, what's wrong, is it the music?" I nodded, but it was a few minutes before I could tell him what *about* the music. Oh, well. I pulled myself together and went about my day, and when I got to my mailbox in the Castro, I found that my first ex-husband (still alive, obviously, god bless'em) had sent me, quite early, my birthday present -- a DVD of the Incredibles (which I can't wait to see), and Lea Delaria's new CD, "Double Standard". I've always loved Lea D. as a hilarious in-your-face dyke standup comic/actress, but she's also an incredible singer, and she's taken some interesting stuff and turned it into mostly upbeat jazz. This is the most interesting album of re-interpretation of songs (for me) since Cyndi Lauper's "At Last". But when I saw that cut #4 was Neil Young's "Philadelphia" (not to be confused, of course, with Bruce Springstein's song of the same name and from the same soundtrack -- both of these songs, of course, also belong to the at-home-alone-avec-kleenex category), I thought, uh-oh, here we go again. People, Lea's version is absolutely lovely, better than the original, imho, and it'll rip your heart out. The whole album is highly recommended. Excuse me, now, while I go blow my nose. hugs all around, Walt - -- Let the walls go tumbling down Falling on the ground And all the dogs go running free The wild and gentle dogs (and maybe some of Kate B's Hounds of Love) Kenneled in me ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:47:10 -0500 From: "McMillan Brad" Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat Lucy; I like your observation and I think it is spot on. I saw Joni inconcert in '74 in Miami. My lady and I went to the ramp coming out of the basement of the convention center and stood with about 75 rabid fans and waited for her to come walking up the ramp to the waiting limo. She was carrying a spray of about three dozen roses. She had about six gentlemen escorting her from the hall. When she got to where we were, the security guys started to form a phalanx in front of her and a couple of them linked arms preparing to push us back. Joni said: "It's okay, they're my friends". One young woman murmered: "We love you Joni". She smiled and said "I love you too". Then she said she was tired and wanted to go to her hotel and crash. There were a couple more we love you's and Joni waved as she ducked into the limo and was wisked away. I imagine that scene was repeated a few hundred times in her touring career. I agree with you, Lucy. We have no right to expect that kind of grace when she's minding her own business on her own turf. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lucy Hone" To: ; "Joni List" Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 1:42 AM Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat > Hello Laura , and thanks for reading my post. > > My view on going to the grill is.......... I think you would find that > if she showed up, almost every other person in the grill probably was > there for the same reason. The food might be wonderful, the atmosphere > brilliant and there may be tired waitresses and grumpy chefs and it > might be a bit like living in an Edward Hopper painting.... and it might > be tacky and it might be lovely... > > Whilst it would be an honour for any of us who really get her music (or > even some of it) to meet her and get the chance to chat I doubt it would > be an honour for her. What do we have in common? what is it about our > lives that we think would be so rivetting for her to know? Do we assume > that because she has touched our lives she needs to know about it? Over > the years just how many other people will have done this? .........gone > up to her in a peaceful moment to unload their Joni story? Imagine what > that must feel like? There you are....in the local diner...........you > are there having a quiet cup of coffee. You have spent the morning busy > being about your life and its the way you like it.. not driven by the > passions of the past, nor encumbered by contractural obligations. Even > the worst moments of your young life are no longer a burden. You have > achieved a comfortable balance of notoriety and anonymity. You can go > about your life fairly comfortably and go for a cup of coffee in your > local diner. It is maybe a sunny morning with slants of sunlight and > slabs of fat on the thighs of the waitress and there are far too many > pancakes on your plate......... you feel comfortable and in a > wonderfully observational frame of mind. The sun is cut from your view > by a person who clears their throat and its a sinking feeling that makes > you grab your cup of coffed and stiffen your shoulders as you know you > are about to hear......."Excuse me Miss Mitchell, or may I call you > Joni... I feel I know you so well, you see............ your music has > meant so much to me over the years ......... and you can barely manage a > smile make your escape. > > I have had some fairly inside access to some pretty famous musicians via > my last marriage and (by all reports) they "put up" with fans who come > to gigs, and the ones who demand an autograph or a photo.... that is > fair game. They have paid money for a show and getting to "be with" is a > fair exchange (if they are quick and dont think you are a friend, or > share any sort of bond because they have their photo taken). > > What was hated and feared was the "OH MY GOD!, YOU?, HERE?" sort of > "chance encounter" which had been planned, and smacked of stalking. > Cornering an object of such reverence in a place in which they thought > they might be safe is, to me, just not on. > > WE all know how we feel when we get the telephone canvas as we are about > to eat, the "have you read our version of the world" callers to our > door.Those are random invasions and can be politely refused. To go to > where you expect someone to be, in order to see them and maybe approach > them, would make the person feel cornered and probably threatened. It is > also really difficult for celebs to be rude (as we might be) in case its > a press set up so that bad publicity results... So they are doomed to > having to put up with us. > > I will not be part, ever of anyone's discomfort. I would never ever > approach her... If her car broke down out side my house and she came to > ask for help I might let on I knew her but only as she was driving > away........ But then that is me... > > Lucy > > > LCStanley7@aol.com wrote: > > > Lucy wrote: > > > > .... I would not approach her if I saw her, I would let her be > > > > > > Hi Lucy, > > > > If I saw Joni, I would hope it wasn't in a crowd so I could > > approach her. I have thought of (with two other JMDLers) going out > > west to that grill she likes in California and waiting for the chance > > to meet her. I wonder if the food is any good and if they serve > > breakfast, lunch, and dinner and are reasonably priced? > > > > What a thought... to meet her. I'm so initially shy around > > people, but maybe I wouldn't be shy around her. I don't feel like she > > is a stranger to me although I am to her. Nice thought. > > > > Love, > > Laura ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 11:54:33 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: The BorderCollies have a small favour to ask...NJC Since the faux "Border Collies" are deliberately 'pissing' on the real ones (lifting their legs?), I doubt that they are just going to stop because people email them and ask them to, plus these slimeballs will have your email address! Seems an ill-advised and ineffective request. They are in clear violation of trademark law, and should also be sued for expenses. Seems like a fairly straightforward matter, although frustrating. The real band needs to alert all relevant media about the problem. Once the media knows what's going on, they will not promote the faux band, tho the real BC's might get some extra publicity. RR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:59:37 -0500 From: "McMillan Brad" Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat Reading Jerry's post, I remember a chance meeting with a celeb about 10 years ago. I was on the island of Maui, eating dinner at a place called Cheeseburgers in Paradise. I was with my son and several of his shipmates. I looked over the shoulder of the young man sitting opposite me and there at the next table looking back at me was Randy Travis. He glanced around and then looked back at me as I was calculating that he was who I thought he was. I mouthed the words: "Aren't you Randy Travis?" He looked from side to side and then looked back at me and gave a short grin and nodded his head once. I gave him a thumbs up and mouthed "I like your music". He gave me another quick nod and I never looked at him again during the rest of the meal. When he and his party got up to leave, Travis waved at me and said "Nice t'see you again", and they disappeared. My dinner companions who saw that move, dropped their jaws and started asking me if I really knew Randy Travis. I just shrugged. I thought it was a nice, funny thing for him to do. My reward for not spoiling his dinner. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Notaro" To: "Lucy Hone" ; "Joni List" Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 8:11 AM Subject: Re: Birthday gift to Joni: a cat > I'm with you on this one, Lucy. I have been near Joni several times, but > would never approached her. I was at a party in Toronto once, very early on > (1969) and Joni was there holding court. I inched closer to the group and > pretended to be part of it to hear what she had to say, but that was it. And > I have seen her fans rush her to where it was embarrassing. I've been good > friends with a few famous people and I think it was because I respected > their space and privacy. Oddly enough, that seems to get you closer to them. > The only one who turned me into butter while standing in line with her was > Liza. We were in an airport lounge, standing in line, and I just couldn't > help it. Well, she was right in front of me! She couldn't have been more > gracious and kind. When she sat down at a table with a friend, people around > her sort of looked, but left her alone. I'm sure she appreciated that. > > Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:04:01 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: The BorderCollies have a small favour to ask...NJC Scott and Jody wrote: > > > Finally, at my wits end, I recently hired an attorney, who took on the > case > > and has had me file for US Trademark and Servicemark protection. This has > > been a very expensive action, costing about $1,000 for filings and for the > > attorney. These items, once set in place through the legal system, will > > also give us protection of our name (for both CD's and products as well as > > performance name protection) both in the US and with other countries that > > have adopted the international trade agreements therein. The UK and > Ireland > > have both signed these agreements, so it's a matter of a few months before > > we get the thing legally secured. We can then have a strong legal basis > to > > sue the bastards, and possibly have them have to appear in US Federal > court > > here in Atlanta, rather than a costly lawsuit in Ireland. ps: I'm not a lawyer, but I question this...the trademarked name automatically belongs to whoever was using it first, regardless of whether it was filed. They can already prove they have widespread recognition, plus they have published proof the guy is doing it intentionally. Seems like a civil suit would be the way to go. I hope they are using a music lawyer; this is essential! Regular lawyers don't cut it for this kind of thing. RR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 15:06:54 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Somedays you can't avoid the blues... (njc) His Paris cd is a favorite of mine. Jerry > Malcolm McLaren's > "Fans". If you don't know it, it's hard to describe, but I'll try -- each cut > -- there are only six, starts with an aria from a well-known opera, and builds > around it with rap, R&B-ish stuff, some 80-ish electronica (it dates from > 1984), and the aria itself sung by a professional, or at least operatically > trained, singer. I don't know if McLaren did this to try to lure kids into > opera, or just for the sake of eclecticism. Most of the cuts work to one > degree or another, and the opening cut, Madame Butterfly, is brilliant, but > will probably offend any opera purist. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 20:36:18 GMT From: "Ruth Davis" Subject: Re: smoking guns NJC I would rather be a Karl Rove type - but a benevolent Karl Rove (if that is possible!) Ruth - -- Lori Fye wrote: Ruth wrote: > I would like to see Bill Gates or Warren Buffett, or someone like that invest in the > Indian reservations and other economically depressed areas in this country. > They could start up manufacturing operations that would create solar retrofit > packages to be sold to residential homeowners. That way, their investment > would have dual impact by giving people jobs and hope, and it would help > decrease our countries reliance on imported oil. Ruth, have you ever considered running for public office? Maybe you should. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 15:42:43 -0500 From: brianasymes@aol.com Subject: Extreme Women "the Book " I have been way to busy to read much of these posts plus I really did not have anything to say about Joni. Until I picked up a coffee table book store called Extreme Women and opened it to the page about Joni alot of the women hold the same sword in all the pictures of course it has her holding it like a guitar.This book has pictures of the women when they were young and now ,what's strange is I think that all the women look much more lovely now versus back then, sure there skin was smoother and they were a thinner, but much more boring. The age makes them more complex and interesting to look at. Brian In Portland in an office with no music UGH. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:05:27 -0600 From: John Calimee Subject: What to give a woman who has everything? What do you give a woman who has everything? Why, paint of course. -Forget the cat business. I can think of a lovely package that would put a sparkle in Joni's eyes. I'd do it personally butI haven't a clue how to get it to her. A container of the ultra-expensive Blockx Amber so she can paint luscious Faux Pre-Raphaelite techniques. Special Aged Oil, Ugly Dog brush Soap, Copal Medium, paint from Robert Doak, Trekkle brushes. Gift certificates to Sinopia or Kremer. -The works. These are hard to find, ultra professional items, she may know about already. Still, what artist could resist the temptation of more toys in the tool box to work with. I bet she'd love to know how to reproduce the effect of a Hunt or Rosetti. Lucy, you're spot on that Joni doesn't need or crave our attention. Save perhaps a boyfriend, I suspect she's got all the company she wants. But not speak to her if you saw her???????? -------------!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! My god, woman, get thee some counseling and treatment. So long as one is being respectful -and brief- Joni will happy give you the magic moment all fans crave. She is a joy to encounter as many, many list members can tell you. If I ever hear you were in shouting distance of Joni and didn't speak with her... Well. I don't know what I'd do, but I'd be the first to shove you in front of that bus (meaning, Joni, of course.) OT, I got a chuckle when the Tlog version of BSN popped up in a scene from the movie LIKE A HOUSE. I haven't seen Love Actually, so this gives me some idea of what my friend Neil refered to as the "worst moment he ever endured in his life." Sitting in a theatre watching the ultimate chick flick...almost 3 hours of unending torture, when "SHE" comes on. Singing and singing. Poor guy barely made it out alive. He seems excited about Sin City, tho. Btw, Anyone with news on the film of Travelogue? And what about that VG-8 page on the JMDL???????? Ok, I know I shouldn't talk. I keep meaning to start a series of Joni paintings to raise monies for the JMDL community for years now. -But I'm closer. Just as soon as I figure out this Blockx Amber thing... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:29:41 -0800 (PST) From: Em Subject: NJC right wingers and right to life/Schiavo, if you're tired of this then DELETE NJC OK since they have a monopoly on the notion that life is a great thing, and lets not take it if at all possible, where are there cries of "right to life" when its time to NOT kill innocent people, even children, in dumb-ass wars? Why don't they count? As I'm sure you're aware, Terri Shiavo has died. I can't even GO in my own living room because my S.O. is glued to the FOX news, where husband Michael Schiavo is being made to seem "of the Devil". Heard an interview with Ralph Nader - even he, who I more or less consider a "free" thinker, is saying she should have been given over to her parents and they be allowed to tend to her forever. That HER right to live was violated. So I don't know, its hard to maintain my own conviction on this, that her wish not to be kept alive with false means be honored. The media is making me feel like a MEAN person, who wants all people with feeding tubes to die. Not so! but there are no shades of gray right now. Right now in this part of Florida, you're either a good sweet "life" person, or a bad, nightmarish "death" person. I feel sooooooo isolated from soooooo much of the human race right now. It's mostly this RIFT, I think, that is saddening me, because, truth be told, in my heart I believe Terri has found peace finally. But hey, what do I know, maybe her life was just groovy before while she was on the tube. Maybe she'd memorized the whole "Blue" album and was on her private desert island w/it - quite content. What do I know? I know SQUAT. As humans we have to go with our hearts and minds, and sometimes it leaves us empty and cold - and thats how I feel now. Sorry, I know we discussed this into the ground before and that some indicated they thought it should go away as a topic. But here, locally, there is NO escaping it. I feel like I'm being made out to be one of the mean, "death" people. But I'm not. For instance, I don't think we should have wars. At least not the kind with bombs and guns. BUT!!! I'll bet some of these very people who seem to be considered the shiny, glowing "life" people out here, support BUSH and his F___KING war! What if by some weird twist, the people I admire politically had been at the forefront to maintain Terri on the tube? Instead of the Randall Terry's? I don't know. I just don't know! Religion is just too damn convenient. Why can't more people "not know"? True believers frighten me. They're like Rottweilers with a swollen brain disease. There's no more talking sense to them - they're "another kind of gone". <