From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #494 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, December 16 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 494 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- voices that grate (njc) ["Anne Sandstrom" ] RE: voices that grate (njc) ["Azeem" ] RE: voices that grate (njc) ["Richard Flynn" ] Re: Scott Peterson (NJC) [Lori Fye ] RE: voices that grate (njc) ["Anne Sandstrom" ] NY Times list of chocolatiers in Paris, njc [] RE: voices that grate (njc) ["Richard Flynn" ] Re: voices that grate (njc) [FMYFL@aol.com] Was: voices that grate / Now: great voices (njc) [Smurfycopy@aol.com] Re: voices that grate (njc) [colin ] "HERE TODAY, GONE TOMORROW" on ebay [] NJC Congratulations Michael Paz!! [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: NJC Congratulations Michael Paz!! [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Scott Peterson, njc [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: skin crawlers, njc [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC [Smurfycopy@aol.com] RE: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC ["Wally Kairuz" Subject: voices that grate (njc) Kate said: Speaking of... Bette's voice (most notably Wind Beneath My Wings) crawls my skin... off key & harsh imo... I agree totally, Kate. (Although, I was impressed when she sang at a gathering for American Airlines staff right after 9/11. It was on City Hall Plaza here in Boston. She sang the song, then sat down and buried her head in her hands, sobbing for the rest of the event.) However, Sheena Easton (yeah, I said that) does an amazing job on this song. Why anyone would ever bother trying to record it after her is beyond me. I've also always thought that Bob Dylan basically kind of half writes his songs. Then, talented singers actually finish them for him. Blashpehamy, I know. But I always thought people like Judy Collins and Shawn Colvin, to name a couple, actually supplied the melody when Dylan had only sketched one. And has anyone heard that awful, but strangely funny, Christmas song that goes something like "Ay! Ay! Ay! It's Christmas" in which a guy is panicked about what he's going to get his girlfriend as a gift? Thinking I'm going to go order Diane Ziegler's "December in Vermont" CD. lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:18:17 -0000 From: "Azeem" Subject: RE: voices that grate (njc) Anne wrote: << I've also always thought that Bob Dylan basically kind of half writes his songs. Then, talented singers actually finish them for him. Blashpehamy, I know. But I always thought people like Judy Collins and Shawn Colvin, to name a couple, actually supplied the melody when Dylan had only sketched one. >> I hope you've said your Hail Marys Anne! I know this is a most contentious area, and I can certainly see your point (Shawn's version of You're Gonna Make Me Lonesome When you Go is surely the gold standard for that song - though Madeleine Peyroux's new version is lovely too). HOWEVER (you knew there was going to be a but, didn't you?), and notwithstanding the it's-all-a-matter-of-opinion factor, I have to reiterate something I've probably said before: The boy could really sing! I was listening to Mr Tambourine Man in a pub - one with a very enlightened music policy, stretching to Nick Drake, John Martyn, Jeff Buckley, etc - a few days ago - and both my girlfriend Fiona and me were rhapsodising about, yes, his singing on that song. I truly think it's beautiful, and infinitely superior to that self-satisfied and anodyne version by the Byrds. And the melody is 100% there, Anne :-) And his singing on Like a Rolling Stone is magisterial. So there! Azeem in London NP: Sam Cooke on the radio, who, I have to admit, is a marginally greater singer than our Bobby ;-) - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.802 / Virus Database: 545 - Release Date: 26/11/2004 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 10:13:05 -0500 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: voices that grate (njc) I can't stay out of this anymore! I'm with Kate! Excerpt from the screenplay of _Don't Look Back_: Dylan: Yeah, well you know, I have no idea. First of all, I'm not even a pop singer. Interviewer: You think you have a big audience? Dylan: I don't know. I have no idea. Interviewer: Well, you appeal to your audiences in some sense as a pop singer. Well, you know, even if it's Caruso, he's, uh, you know appealing to a popular, you know, this is a . . . Dylan: But, he's a pop singer . . . and I'm just as good a singer as Caruso. . . . Have you heard me sing? Have you ever heard me sing? Interviewer: I like Caruso better Dylan: Ohhh . . . well, you see right there now, right there we have a little disagreement. I happen to be just as good as him . . . (laughter) a good singer, have to listen closely . . . (laughter) but I hit all those notes and I can hold my breath three times as long if I want to. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 11:26:35 -0500 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: Scott Peterson (NJC) Steven Blue wrote: > To quote a late night TV show, I stand in this matter: > > I am very happy to see that it is FINALLY Illegal to kill your wife in > California and that you will be sentenced to punishment. > > what say ye? I say -- while I realize that being okay with capital punishment is not politically correct or maybe even morally correct -- Scott Peterson deserves the death penalty, although I think lethal injection is far too kind a way to execute him. Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 11:34:09 -0500 From: "Anne Sandstrom" Subject: RE: voices that grate (njc) Richard said: > I can't stay out of this anymore! I'm with Kate! Actually, I wasn't really knocking Dylan's voice, but (gasp!) his songwriting! I just think other people work wonders with his sketchy melodies. But, since we're talking about voices, his voice does grate on me. And, the excerpt from the play was tongue in cheek, right? I mean, was he (his character) comparing himself to Enrico Caruso???? Yeah, and Pink sounds just as good as Jenny Lind. (not that I'm an opera fan, actually...) It is nice to be having a heated discussion about music, though! lots of love, Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 12:01:44 -0500 From: Subject: NY Times list of chocolatiers in Paris, njc For JMDLers heading for France soon: I think this link only works on Wednesday (for everyone). http://travel2.nytimes.com/2004/12/12/travel/12tab.html?oref=login&th All the best, Jim ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 12:11:43 -0500 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: voices that grate (njc) It's from a documentary by DA Pennebaker), and of course Dylan was putting the interviewer on. It's probably my favorite rock 'n' roll movie of all time. But one doesn't have to have a great voice to be a good singer, as fans of later Joni will attest. - -----Original Message----- From: Anne Sandstrom [mailto:anne@sandstrom.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 11:34 AM To: Richard Flynn Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: RE: voices that grate (njc) Richard said: > I can't stay out of this anymore! I'm with Kate! Actually, I wasn't really knocking Dylan's voice, but (gasp!) his songwriting! I just think other people work wonders with his sketchy melodies. But, since we're talking about voices, his voice does grate on me. And, the excerpt from the play was tongue in cheek, right? I mean, was he (his character) comparing himself to Enrico Caruso???? Yeah, and Pink sounds just as good as Jenny Lind. (not that I'm an opera fan, actually...) It is nice to be having a heated discussion about music, though! lots of love, Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:11:30 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: voices that grate (njc) I'm real late on this thread, but the voice that really grates on me (sorry Smurph) is Dave Van Ronk. Even though he sings some Joni songs, his voice is the worse. Just for the record, I love Mahmoud Abbas "Take a Chance on Me" :~) Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:50:58 -0500 From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Was: voices that grate / Now: great voices (njc) Jimmy wrote: << Just for the record, I love Mahmoud Abbas "Take a Chance on Me" :~) >> And I have not been able to stop listening to Ella James's "Blues to the Bone" since I recently bought it with the Borders gift certificate a JMDLer gave me quite a few months ago. I can't find her date of birth anywhere, but since she was recording in the mid-50s, I assume she is 70 or more. This album is all new stuff and her voice is incredible. - --Smurf, blue through and through ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 20:13:06 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: voices that grate (njc) Anne Sandstrom wrote: >Richard said: > I can't stay out of this anymore! I'm with Kate! > >Actually, I wasn't really knocking Dylan's voice, but (gasp!) his songwriting! I just think other people work wonders with his sketchy melodies. > >But, since we're talking about voices, his voice does grate on me. And, the excerpt from the play was tongue in cheek, right? I mean, was he (his character) comparing himself to Enrico Caruso???? Yeah, and Pink sounds just as good as Jenny Lind. (not that I'm an opera fan, actually...) > >It is nice to be having a heated discussion about music, though! > >lots of love, >Anne > > > I agree with you anne-if his voice is good then I am just as pretty as brad pitt - -- bw colin http://www.btinternet.com/~tantraapso/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 16:34:42 -0500 From: Subject: "HERE TODAY, GONE TOMORROW" on ebay http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2293973116 Let's review: "HERE TODAY, GONE TOMORROW", was copy-written as "Here Today AND Gone Tomorrow" and at least one handwritten version was tagged "Vic's Song". Wow, Joni was re-titling stuff even before "From Both Sides, Now". I mean, "Clouds". I mean... Lama ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 18:28:03 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC Congratulations Michael Paz!! I received in the mail today a copy of the latest edition of "La Prensa", which is New Orleans' Latin American Newspaper, and who's the cover boy? Why, it's the muy guapo y sympatico Michael Paz! The caption reads "La Prensa spotlights five Hispanics whose talents and efforts reap benefits for our community". Barely recognized the boy with the necktie on, though...the "penis gourd centerfold" in the middle is more the Paz we all know & love. Congratulations, Michael. I know that you've certainly made THIS community richer for your presence too. Bob NP: Bob Dylan, "It's Alright Ma (I'm Only Bleeding)" (sounds just fine to me...) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 18:56:47 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC Hey Smurf, here's what I just read about this song/phrase: "This was based on (Howlin') Wolf's "Crying At Daybreak" recorded years earlier and itself modeled on Charley Patton's "Moon Going Down". The inspiration, said Wolf, was watching trains cut through the night: "We used to sit out in the country and see the trains go by, watch the sparks come out of the smokestack. That was smokestack lightning." So there you have it, buddy. Bob NP: Andrew Hardin, "Just Like This Train" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 20:20:56 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Congratulations Michael Paz!! Bob writes: > Barely recognized the boy with the necktie on, though...the "penis gourd > centerfold" in the middle is more the Paz we all know &love. > Yayee Paz! I'm so glad you still have the penis gourd. Did you have the halter top on too? :) Seriously though, congratulations on this wonderful recognition buddy. You're the best. Jimmy P.S. Bob, I know you're feeling down since Anna Kournikova got married today ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 20:34:20 EST From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: Scott Peterson, njc Steve B. wrote: I am very happy to see that it is FINALLY Illegal to kill your wife in California and that you will be sentenced to punishment. Because so many have gotten away with murder there Hi Steve, Maybe the sentence is only because this guy wasn't rich and famous. The famous part is changing though thanks to the media... the agar in the petri plate where ugly bugs grow. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 20:42:52 EST From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: skin crawlers, njc mags h wrote: > >now, thanks to this lovely thread, > I've got Orlando running through my head > > Colin wrote: > I think you mean Fernando. Hi Ya'll, You crack me up!!! LOLLLLL Maybe she meant Tony Orlando! Maybe he was singing Fernando. That would be a skin crawler! Or maybe it comes out Orlando when you are in -20 F. Know one knows, they can never get that close because ABBA repells! And the German guy covering his ears.... ROFL Sorry again Colin, but I couldn't resist! Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 21:03:12 EST From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC "Ask Jeeves" Muller writes: > The inspiration, said Wolf, was watching trains cut through the night: > Bob! You're a net-surfin' wonder! Really -- I knew about the Howlin' Wolf connection. Hell, I found out about connections to Virginia "Wolf" by the time I was finished reading everything that came up on the internet in my search for the meaning of smokestack lightning. But all I could find was stuff about the song or Cajun cooking -- not what smokestack lightning means. Thanks so much for figuring this out. And I never even guessed that it referred to sparks from a locomotive's smokestack. Cool! This is the nicest thing anyone has ever done for me, Bob. Thanks! Now the lyrics make sense: Smokestack Lightning Ah-oh, smokestack lightning Shinin', just like gold Why don't ya hear me cryin'? A-whoo-hooo, oooo Whooo Whoa-oh, tell me, baby, What's the, matter with you? Why don't ya hear me cryin'? Whoo-hooo, whoo-hooo Whooo Whoa-oh, tell me, baby, Where did ya, stay last night? A-why don't ya hear me cryin'? Whoo-hooo, whoo-hooo Whooo Whoa-oh, stop your train, Let her, go for a ride Why don't ya hear me cryin'? Whoo-hooo, whoo-hooo Whooo Whoa-oh, fare ya well Never see-a you no more A-why don't ya hear me cryin'? Oooo, whoo-hooo, whoo-hooo Whooo Whoa-oh, who been here baby since, I-I been gone, a little, bitty boy? Girl, be on A-whoo-hooo, whoo-hooo by Chester Burnett (aka Howlin' Wolf) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 23:19:19 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC whaddayamean, you ungrateful gnome! > -----Mensaje original----- > De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de > Smurfycopy@aol.com > Enviado el: Miercoles, 15 de Diciembre de 2004 11:03 p.m. > Para: SCJoniGuy@aol.com; Smurfycopy@aol.com > CC: joni@smoe.org > Asunto: Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC > > > > > This is the nicest thing anyone has ever done for me, Bob. Thanks! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 23:22:21 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC oops... incomplete sentence! it should've read: whaddayamean, you ungrateful gnome! once i bought you dinner! *W* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 21:21:44 EST From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC *w* writes: > whaddayamean, you ungrateful gnome! > Relax, my feisty diva. I said it's the nicest thing anyone's ever done FOR me, not TO me. XO, - --Grateful Gnome ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 21:29:57 EST From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC *w* bitches: > once i bought you dinner! > Yeah, well it's not as if I never offered you anything to eat. - --Smurf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 02:02:22 -0500 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Library Links: December 16 On December 16 the following articles were published: 1974: "An Evening Spent at Joni's" - Time http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=6 1974: "Rock 'n' Roll's Leading Lady" - Time http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=5 1977: "Joni Mitchell is Still Going Her Own Way" - New York Times http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=255 1985: "Joni Mitchell" - People http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=240 1999: "Joni Mitchell" - Rolling Stone http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=591 2000: "Yorkville's Evolution" - Toronto Star http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=785 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 07:52:04 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: NJC Smokestack Lightning - mystery solved - NJC hi > "Ask Jeeves" Muller writes: >> The inspiration, said Wolf, was watching trains cut through the night: ok - that explains the following lyric where michelle shocked also talks about smokestack lightning + sparks http://www.michelleshocked.com/dngoodnews.htm ron ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2004 #494 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? 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