From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #174 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, April 17 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 174 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Diana Krall ["willytheshake100" ] Re: NJC W's Press conference PC [Chris Marshall ] Another Case of You ["G'n H" ] Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni [Ken ] Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Another Case of You [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: NJC W's Press conference PC ["Lucy Hone" ] re: Instant Bliss ["mia ortlieb" ] re: Woman of Heart and Mind (no PC, hooray) ["mia ortlieb" ] Re: A Free Joni Cover 4 U [david sapp ] Re: was posts about GWB, now "clean car" NJC [Em ] Re: NJC W's Press conference PC [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: Smug Americans, NJC [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: "Old Father Time"? [Catherine McKay ] Re: was posts about GWB, now "clean car" NJC [Catherine McKay ] Re: NJC W's Press conference - now why i decided not to vote ["ron" ] Re: Joni mention in Vancouver Sun ["tantra-apso" ] Re: Question regarding "Moon at the Window" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] speaking of "me toos." ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Re: speaking of "me toos." NJC [Em ] Never forget, NJC [LCStanley7@aol.com] Re: female or male, Nuriel? njc [Nuriel Tobias ] Hitler [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni [Ken ] Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Michael - a man or a child? [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni [Ken ] re: Nuriel, male or... [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC [Smurfycopy@aol.com] Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC [Nuriel Tobias ] Good food at the fest [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC ["tantra-apso" ] Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC ["hell" ] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC [Smurfycopy@aol.com] Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC [vince ] RE: Nuriel, male or... ["patrick leader" ] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC ["hell" ] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC [Smurfycopy@aol.com] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC ["hell" ] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC [Em ] Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC ["hell" ] speaking of "me toos." NJC ["Marianne Rizzo" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:31:27 +0100 From: "willytheshake100" Subject: Diana Krall Check out Diana Krall on Launch Music Videos talking about her new album including Black Crow at http://launch.yahoo.com/artist/default.asp?artistID=1014678 Go to 'Girl in the Other Room' and click on watch. WtS ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:42:51 +0100 From: Chris Marshall Subject: Re: NJC W's Press conference PC On 16 Apr 2004, at 19:10, AzeemAK@aol.com wrote: > I think he is clueless and ill-equipped intellectually to handle a job > he is > only doing because he is not as scary to voters as the people who are > really > making things happen, ie Cheney, Rumsfeld, Perle, Wolfovitz and co. Amen, Azeem. I was listening to the press conference on my way home from work yesterday and almost had to turn the radio off as I was squirming so much with embarrassment during GWB's "speech". I might not like Blair overly much but have a certain amount of respect for the fact that, pardon the analogy, he had the whole piece of music in his head and could improvise around it. Blair gives the impression of someone who gives these issues a lot of deep thought and consideraton. GWB was still busy figuring out the key signature as if it was a new piece to him. *That's* a big reason for the lack of respect many people have for Bush. Did anyone else howl at the start of the Q&A bit? GW: "We'll take three questions" GW: "One each..." Guffaw. I know he /really/ meant one question to each of three lucky press hacks, but... where was the other head of state? :) :) - --Chris Marshall chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 12:27:10 +0300 From: "G'n H" Subject: Another Case of You Here's a clip of a Jane Monheit's version, Richard Bona is playing the guitar and the bass. http://ubl.artistdirect.com/store/artist/album/0,,1125594,00.html _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:25:32 -0400 From: Ken Subject: Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni I don't know. Say they do her first album. Joni Mitchell - Naked. I would have to wonder if people would by it for the wrong reasons. K Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: >"Dog Eat Dog- Naked": sweetened demos of every song. > >Sure, Muller said this long ago but now that the Beatles have done it, Joni >can cash in on the latest marketing craze to rise from the cesspool. > >Lama ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:40:11 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni **I don't know. Say they do her first album. Joni Mitchell - Naked. I would have to wonder if people would by it for the wrong reasons.** LOL Ken! Except for the fact that she's already been there, done that, right? In regards to DED & CMIARS, Joni's really painted herself in a corner. She has given the impression that she was the guiding hand behind all of this glossy/techno production, although she has hinted that she wasn't and said that sometimes she doesn't think of them as 'her' projects. It would almost seem a contradiction for her to go back and do it "right". We all know about the Beatles-Phil Spector thing, so it was logical for a re-release from the remaining band members, but with Joni it would be a different thing. Besides, the skeletal structures of most of the songs on these 2 records are pretty weak, and in some cases the studio bells and whistles actually enhance the weakness of the song itself. Besides, she blew her chance by throwing the Geffen Box in the marketplace last year. I say - let those 2 stand as is. She's diluted her catalogue enough with BSN & T'log as it is. Bob NP: Aerosmith, "Sweet Emotion" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 09:10:22 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Another Case of You Thanks Grace...I'll see your "Case Of You" and raise you one: http://www.vineyardsound.org/ (Go to the bottom - click on "albums". Select: Live In Concert: 2002 Kick back and enjoy - this is Smurf's favorite group to unwind with when he goes to his Martha's Vineyard retreat and chills with JT & Billy Joel. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 14:52:59 +0100 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Re: NJC W's Press conference PC Debra wrote in her answer to Brees' (I think) question.. > Do you think Bush is at fault for 9/11 ? "No. I think Bush and Clinton and all of the people who worked in government for the past 30 years while the seeds of the terrorists' complaints were being planted and grew could have done a better job at protecting us. If the people in charge don't feel any responsibility to do that, and my complaint is that the Bushies don't seem to feel that responsibility enough to have taken any action at all, then who does? " My question would be to all and sundry (there must be loads of you who may have an oppinion on this) and I hate for anyone to think they have to feel bear the brunt of all the questioning.. asfter all its not your fault is it Debra (unless there is something you are hiding from us!!!) "Dont you think they had a duty to NOT behave in a way that would piss other people off, so there would be no NEED to protect you, or us, or any other nation?" Are we not (US and UK) reaping the rewards of our hegemony in world affairs. Isn't this all about being the biggest bully, the boy with the biggest toys, the largest selection of sweeties and the most powerful friends? Eventually as they carry all this largesse they are bound to be blinkered enough to trip over a few splinters and come crashing! Anyway... I wish there was an answer to all this... but there is not, there never will be and its all a sad and sorry mess. Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:10:10 -0500 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: re: Instant Bliss This is interesting! Thanks for sharing it with us, Nuriel. Sounds yummy, and I think it should be added to the JMDL lyric glossary page......Les? Nuriel wrote: <> Mia _________________________________________________________________ Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN Premium! http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:41:47 -0500 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: re: Woman of Heart and Mind (no PC, hooray) <> A part two would be lovely! However, I have to admit, given the time restraints on the film, I'm glad the producers put more emphasis on the pre-Blue Joni. For me, this film is more about, who is Joni, what has shaped her, and how has she arrived? If the film was just about her accomplishments only, well then, yes the producers have failed miserably. After Blue, Joni's career could be followed more closely as she was famous and already in the public eye. But the pre-Blue period has always been somewhat of a mystery to me. It almost has a magical, fairy-tale like quality. I want to know what makes Joni tick, and WOHAM has certainly revealed this for me. Mia _________________________________________________________________ MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page  FREE download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:52:18 -0500 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: Question regarding "Moon at the Window" Does anyone know the meaning behind the line: "rattle, rattle, rattle, In the spoon and the glass" from Moon at the Window? Maybe I'm just a big dunce. I picture someone with a headache from all the miseries of love stirring some sort of medicine concoction in a glass. LOL! Thanks, Mia _________________________________________________________________ MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page  FREE download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:53:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: "Old Father Time"? Could someone please explain to me what does the expression "old father time" mean? "May old father time Never be unkind" (My Best To You) Thanks and Love, Nuriel Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 11:08:48 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: david sapp Subject: Re: A Free Joni Cover 4 U Hey Bob - does this include Travelogue and Chalkmark? heeheeheehee. Listening to Sweet 16 Vol 1 again - truly a GREAT album - The Joni tribute imo. peace, david PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 09:50:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: was posts about GWB, now "clean car" NJC lol, and I was looking forward to an "auto detailing" ala joni thread....wondering what that could possibly entail. Linda (partner)is out spit polishing the Mustang.... :) happy Saturday, all. Em - --- kate@katebennett.com wrote: > anne>Honda has developed a fuel cell powered car. I want > one! But it's not for sale to consumers yet. You can > read about it here: > > http://www.hondacorporate.com/fcx/< > > met a guy yesterday at the auto show who is a scientist working on > this > technology, he was on his way to japan... he said it was still a > couple of > years out... ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 12:55:22 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC W's Press conference PC Bree wrote: In closing, there was enough justification for stopping Hussein for him denying UN weapon inspections for so long...forgetting every thing else... It was and is the right thing to do. Hi Bree! Thanks for your very good post. I thought you stated your outlook very well, and I do understand and value your views and opinions. Yes, Hussein needed to be dealt with... I think most people agree with that. The difference seems to be in the "how" to deal with him. Let me be counted as one who does not hate Bush but who does disagree with his decision to go to war. I must admit, I didn't listen to the press conference. It didn't interest me. I did see Bush in person before the war, when I was still counted among those who supported him and was invited to places where he was appearing. I was impressed with the way he speaks despite being a stutterer. His stuttering really showed up more in person than it does on TV, and prior to seeing him in person, I didn't know he was a stutterer because he masks it so well. A friend of mine in medical school was a stutterer, and I thought it was very courageous for him to choose a career where he would have to speak to a lot of people, and I feel the same way in regard to Bush. With love and peace, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 13:11:30 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: Smug Americans, NJC Lori wrote in response to Bree: > And Frankly..I don't care what the rest of the world thinks. Really? You should. Perhaps not on a personal level, but you really ought to care what the rest of the world thinks about your nation. One of the reasons that 9/11 happened is because too many smug Americans weren't giving a damn. Hi Lori, This struck me as funny... it is as if there is another person to blame for 9/11... Bree?!... a "smug" American who doesn't care what the rest of the world thinks. I don't like the blame game at all. The people who were behind 9/11 were crazy murderers... period. They hit the WORLD trade center and in essence affected many countries in doing so. I think we do need to take a look at how we can improve ourselves on all levels, but that is ongoing regardless of Iraq or the world. Love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 13:28:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: "Old Father Time"? --- Nuriel Tobias wrote: > Could someone please explain to me what does the > expression "old father time" mean? > > "May old father time > Never be unkind" > (My Best To You) > Father Time is the personification of time as an old man. You often see him around New Year's, where he is the old man about to leave, while the new year "baby" is ushered in. He is linked to Cronus, the Titan, and to the grim reaper, death. If Father Time is unkind to you, it means you age un-gracefully. The wish that "old father time never be unkind" is a wish that you will age gracefully and without troubles. See here: http://www.mythology.com/cronus.html - this one also links Cronus (or Chronus) to the crow (there's a crow flying, black and ragged)... and just for laughs, because there is a website for everything, http://www.fathertimes.net/favorites.htm ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 13:32:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: was posts about GWB, now "clean car" NJC --- Em wrote: > Linda (partner)is out spit polishing the Mustang.... > :) And the Mustang is 40 years old today. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:34:53 -0700 From: frasere@intergate.ca Subject: Joni mention in Vancouver Sun I know the recent Rolling Stone list has been almost talked to death here, but this from today's Vancouver Sun: "Women under-played in music list" Rolling Stone magazine's top 50 list of the greatest artists of all time is almost entirely male. Compiling a Top 50 list of the greatest artists of all time is a thankless task and sure to invite controversy, which is precisely the reason for releasing one. In honour of the 50th anniversary of rock and roll, Rolling Stone magazine released such a list this week, in the first of three commemorative issues planned for 2004. More than 50 recording artists, critics and industry types (including Quentin Tarantino and Neil Diamond) were asked to contribute to the list, which includes many of the classics you'd expect, such as The Beatles, Bob Dylan, Elvis Presley and the Rolling Stones. The list has the boomer demographics fingerprints all over it, since the majority of the artists are long out of circulation. For example, an argument could easily be made for the hugely influential English band Radiohead to have earned a spot on the list. The real surprise of the list isn't so much who's there, as who isn't- the women. Madonna, Janis Joplin, Patti Smith and Aretha Franklin are the only women to make the cut. Unbelievably, Joni Mitchell is nowhere to be found, an artist who's not only relentlessly creative but whose influence is felt in the far corners of music to this day. Since everybody will soon be slinging arrows at this nearly pointless exercise, let us add an addendum of our own to the list. We attempt to correct the oversight of several talented female artists, some of whom embody the spirit of rock 'n' roll even if they couldn't be classified as rock stars. Here are some women whose contributions were ignored by Rolling Stone: Joni Mitchell Tina Turner The Supremes Lucinda Williams Carole King Annie Lennox Billie Holiday The Ronettes Patsy Cline Dusty Springfield Chrissie Hynde Nina Simone Blondie Etta James. Best, Stephen in Vancouver ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 10:40:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: was posts about GWB, now "clean car" NJC Today?? exactly?? really?? cool!!!! vroom! :) em np going going gone...bobby d what a clutzy yet highly satisfying bridge it has - --- Catherine McKay wrote: > --- Em wrote: > > Linda (partner)is out spit polishing the Mustang.... > > :) > > And the Mustang is 40 years old today. > > ===== > Catherine > Toronto > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 20:58:19 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: NJC W's Press conference - now why i decided not to vote hi >>>> Catherine McKay wrote: > > >>>I've heard that voter turnout in the US tends to be really poor. Is this true? If so, why is that? >>>>>randy replied >>>>> I think 50 years of television has lobotomized a large percentage of the population. I know other countries have TV, but I doubt if they watch it an average of 10 hours a day. That can make you apathetic and stoopid. well, i cant speak for everyone, (and especially not for americans) but personally i didnt bother to register for, or vote in, the recent elections held here. not because im apathetic, but because ive thought about it & come to the the following conclusions: - youre voting for politicians. on some moral level i have a problem with taking even indirect responsibility for perpetuating the bunch of scum who call themselves politicians. - you will never know the truth about politicians unless you have some kind of personal contact. pretty much everything you will read about them will have some kind of lie or spin. how can you expect to make an informed decision? (i have been unfortunate enough to have some contact with some of the politicians here. what a bunch of greedy, manipulative, lying, stealing, dishonest bunch of shit they were(still are i guess?).} - the elections here are rigged anyway. confirmed by a good friend who was involved in the vote counting during our first "democratic" elections. so i didnt vote. dont think i will ever do so again. its not a waste of my constitutional right, so much as a realisation that my constitutional right is a sham. ron np - carly simon - coming around again ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:02:07 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: female or male, Nuriel? njc Nuriel Tobias, Excuse me Nuriel, YOur name sounds to me as if you're female but someone told me that they think you are male. . So are you male, female or what? Also, I forgot where you are from? No disrespect intended. . .you seem quite different too. : ~ ) Marianne ps. different is good in my book. . . _________________________________________________________________ Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your waist. http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=et_pv_030104_lovehandles ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 20:24:41 +0100 From: "tantra-apso" Subject: Re: Joni mention in Vancouver Sun From: To: Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2004 6:34 PM Subject: Joni mention in Vancouver Sun > I know the recent Rolling Stone list has been almost talked to death here, but > this from today's Vancouver Sun: > Blondie Oh dear, a journo ought to know better! Deborah Harry will not be pleased.... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:24:56 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Question regarding "Moon at the Window" **Does anyone know the meaning behind the line: "rattle, rattle, rattle, In the spoon and the glass" from Moon at the Window?** Well, I don't attest to 'knowing', but I'll certainly take a stab at it...it's actually a pretty nice combination of lines: "I wish her heart I know these battles Deep in the dark When the spooks of memories rattle Ghosts of the future Phantoms of the past Rattle rattle rattle In the spoon and the glass" I think first & foremost the rattling is in reference to the "spooks, ghosts, and phantoms", like Marley's ghost in A Christmas Carol rattling his chains. After all, the first rattle is in that 4th line. She's talking about the ghosts of old romances, no? Apparantly she's also saying that one way of dealing with those ghosts & phantoms is with medicines, or drinking, or other 'concoctions', as you say. She says "I know these battles, deep in the dark", which to me is addressing the way a person has to come to terms with and deal with their bad memories, the "dark" meaning the inside of one's mind. Just some thoughts...I don't know if that helps or just muddies the water, Mia. Maybe I'm a dunce too! Bob NP: Elvis Costello, "Pills & Soap" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:26:01 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: speaking of "me toos." Hey, You know, I always enjoy it when someone says "me too." Usually the lister says a little more too. . . and EVEN IF they don't, it is alwys fine by me. . . From somebody who doesn't care for that "me too" rule. Marianne >Deb writes: >>I remember finding the actual prose unbearably pretentious and "look at >>me." I've always liked more unassuming prose. A roadside attraction himself writes: >A big ME TOO for this, Deb. I did enjoy "Jitterbug Perfume" and maybe one >other book of his whose title I can't remember, and I really tried to like >him with each book I attempted to read but . . . zzzzzzzzzz. I think I >pitched "Another Roadside Attraction" myself! _________________________________________________________________ Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar  FREE! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 12:50:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: speaking of "me toos." NJC "Me too" rule? the list has a rule that no "me too" posts are allowed? lol, how about "yup"? Is it permitted to just post "yup"? I swear, I've seen it done...MORE than once. :D Em np weirdly enough re: your other post Richrd Thompson "Woman or a Man"! I swear!!!!!!!!!!!! that was playing when I read your post to Nuriel. Album = live album "Small Town Romance" "Different" is also good in my book.... was gonna post "yup" but thought twice... - --- Marianne Rizzo wrote: > Hey, > > You know, I always enjoy it when someone says "me too." > Usually the lister says a little more too. . . and EVEN IF they > don't, it is > alwys fine by me. . . > > From somebody who doesn't care for that "me too" rule. > > > Marianne > > >Deb writes: > > >>I remember finding the actual prose unbearably pretentious and > "look at > >>me." I've always liked more unassuming prose. > > > A roadside attraction himself writes: > > >A big ME TOO for this, Deb. I did enjoy "Jitterbug Perfume" and > maybe one > >other book of his whose title I can't remember, and I really tried > to like > >him with each book I attempted to read but . . . zzzzzzzzzz. I think > I > >pitched "Another Roadside Attraction" myself! > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar  FREE! > http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 16:08:49 EDT From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Never forget, NJC CLICK HERE http://members.cox.net/classicweb/email.htm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 13:53:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Re: female or male, Nuriel? njc Marianne, (I nearly had a heartattack when i opened my mail and saw your e-mail...) I think you thought i'm a woman cause my name is close to the name muriel. But no, i'm a man. (35 years old). I'm from Israel, and not too proud about it these days. Nuriel ("fire") Angel of hailstorms in Jewish legend. Moses encountered Nuriel in the 2nd Heaven When he issues from the side of Hesed (kindness), Nuriel manifests in the form of an eagle, an eagle that, when issuing from the side of Geburiah (force), is Uriel. In The Book of Protection, Nuriel is characterized as a "spellbinding power" and is grouped with Michael, Shamshiel, Seraphiel, and other great angels. According to The Zohar I Nurielis governs Virgo. He is 300 parasangs tall and has a retinue of 50 myraids of angels "all fashioned out of water and fire." The height of Nuriel is exceeded only by the erelim; by the watchers; by Af and Hemah; and of course by Metatron, who is the tallest hierarch in heaven--excepting, perhaps, Hadraniel and Anafiel. In gnostic lore, Nuriel is one of seven subordinates to Jehuel, prince of fire. [Rf. King, The Gnostics and Their Remains, p. 15; Ginzberg, The Legends of the Jews II, 306 and V, 428.] As a charm for warding off evil, Nuriel is also effective. His name is found engraved on oriental amulets, as noted by Schrine, Hebrew Amulets. Now you tell me, my dear, why do i seem different?:) Is it my broken english?:) (You're all welcomed to share you're thoughts on the subject "Nuriel - the different", but try not to hurt me too much) Love, What's my name again? Marianne Rizzo wrote: Nuriel Tobias, Excuse me Nuriel, YOur name sounds to me as if you're female but someone told me that they think you are male. . So are you male, female or what? Also, I forgot where you are from? No disrespect intended. . .you seem quite different too. : ~ ) Marianne ps. different is good in my book. . . _________________________________________________________________ Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your waist. http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=et_pv_030104_lovehandles Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 14:20:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Hitler In the lyric glossary i saw that the project needs help regarding the word "Hitler". I would like to contribute then, if i may. Do you know what killed Hitler? The gas bill. Love, Nuriel Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:28:17 -0400 From: Ken Subject: Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: >**I don't know. Say they do her first album. Joni Mitchell - Naked. >I would have to wonder if people would by it for the wrong reasons.** > >LOL Ken! Except for the fact that she's already been there, done that, right? > Yes but tastfully IMHO. Joni Mitchell - Naked sounds like a Penthouse Layout. . >In regards to DED & CMIARS, Joni's really painted herself in a corner. She >has given the impression that she was the guiding hand behind all of this >glossy/techno production, although she has hinted that she wasn't and said that >sometimes she doesn't think of them as 'her' projects. It would almost seem a >contradiction for her to go back and do it "right". > It might be interesting to hear what she would do but it might also turn out to be a mess. > >We all know about the Beatles-Phil Spector thing, so it was logical for a >re-release from the remaining band members, but with Joni it would be a different >thing. Besides, the skeletal structures of most of the songs on these 2 >records are pretty weak, and in some cases the studio bells and whistles actually >enhance the weakness of the song itself. > >Besides, she blew her chance by throwing the Geffen Box in the marketplace >last year. I say - let those 2 stand as is. She's diluted her catalogue enough >with BSN & T'log as it is. > >Bob > As far as the Geffen Box Set maybe she had no choice. Geffen always claimed she never made money with some of those albums and if they gave her large advances she could end up owing them money. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:32:41 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni **As far as the Geffen Box Set maybe she had no choice. I dunno about that...if I recall the liner notes correctly this was pretty much a project of her choice and she was trying to 'rescue' the recordings. Maybe somebody who has it can share her exact words (I sold mine after I dubbed the bonus tracks). Bob NP: Uli Scherbel, "Beide Seiten" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 14:43:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Michael - a man or a child? I often read that Michael from mountains is the man that the king from "I had a king" couldn't and never wouldn't be. I always thought (and still do) that Michael is a child. I realy can't explain why, but i always had this image of a little sunshine boy who was the only one that could put a smile on Joni's face, even on a rainy day."Wakes you up with sweets", "Needs you to care" the "Mothers" lyric, "A stick that he found", and the "someday i will know you very well" (and more) - it all seems as if she's painting an image of a child, more than of a man. Am i the only one who feels this way? Love, Nuriel Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:51:20 -0400 From: Ken Subject: Re: Next marketing gimmick for Joni I'm just speaking from stuff I've previously read. I never owned the Geffen Box Set so I didn't see the liner notes. K SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > **As far as the Geffen Box Set maybe she had no choice. > > > > I dunno about that...if I recall the liner notes correctly this was > pretty much a project of her choice and she was trying to 'rescue' the > recordings. Maybe somebody who has it can share her exact words (I > sold mine after I dubbed the bonus tracks). > > > > Bob > > > > NP: Uli Scherbel, "Beide Seiten" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 14:58:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: re: Nuriel, male or... Marianne, (I nearly had a heartattack when i opened my mail and saw your e-mail...) I think you thought i'm a woman cause my name is close to the name muriel. But no, i'm a man. (35 years old). I'm from Israel, and not too proud about it these days. Nuriel ("fire") Angel of hailstorms in Jewish legend. Moses encountered Nuriel in the 2nd Heaven When he issues from the side of Hesed (kindness), Nuriel manifests in the form of an eagle, an eagle that, when issuing from the side of Geburiah (force), is Uriel. In The Book of Protection, Nuriel is characterized as a "spellbinding power" and is grouped with Michael, Shamshiel, Seraphiel, and other great angels. According to The Zohar I Nurielis governs Virgo. He is 300 parasangs tall and has a retinue of 50 myraids of angels "all fashioned out of water and fire." The height of Nuriel is exceeded only by the erelim; by the watchers; by Af and Hemah; and of course by Metatron, who is the tallest hierarch in heaven--excepting, perhaps, Hadraniel and Anafiel. In gnostic lore, Nuriel is one of seven subordinates to Jehuel, prince of fire. [Rf. King, The Gnostics and Their Remains, p. 15; Ginzberg, The Legends of the Jews II, 306 and V, 428.] As a charm for warding off evil, Nuriel is also effective. His name is found engraved on oriental amulets, as noted by Schrine, Hebrew Amulets. Now you tell me, my dear, why do i seem different?:) Is it my broken english?:) (You're all welcomed to share you're thoughts on the subject "Nuriel - the different", but try not to hurt me too much) Love, What's my name again? Marianne Rizzo wrote: Nuriel Tobias, Excuse me Nuriel, YOur name sounds to me as if you're female but someone told me that they think you are male. . So are you male, female or what? Also, I forgot where you are from? No disrespect intended. . .you seem quite different too. : ~ ) Marianne ps. different is good in my book. . . Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:58:35 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC Nuriel writes: << Am i the only one who feels this way? >> No, Nuriel. That's what George Bush feels ever since his recent meeting with his handlers. - --Smurf, getting this list back to politics and away from dreaded Joni discussions! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:11:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC Oh, so now you're comparing me to George Bush, Smurf? Help! Somebody! Mommie - Smurf is calling me names! You just wait, Smurfy, just you wait...:) Nuriel Smurfycopy@aol.com wrote: Nuriel writes: << Am i the only one who feels this way? >> No, Nuriel. That's what George Bush feels ever since his recent meeting with his handlers. - --Smurf, getting this list back to politics and away from dreaded Joni discussions! Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:21:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Good food at the fest So i hear that there's gonne be good food at the fest. Beside eachother (and i'm sure you're all tasty) - what are you going to eat? Nuriel (Eating himself for being unable to be there with you all) Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 23:30:00 +0100 From: "tantra-apso" Subject: Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC bw colin http://www.btinternet.com/~tantraapso/ > > --Smurf, getting this list back to politics and away from dreaded Joni > discussions! Oh thank you so much Smurphy for trying to keep the list alive and on track. And such a polite way to jump on those who insist on discussing Joni. You know it only leads to arguments..... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 18:46:35 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC Colin writes: << And such a polite way to jump on those who insist on discussing Joni. You know it only leads to arguments..... >> That's right, Colin, squash it NOW before it gets out of hand. Next thing you know someone will be bringing up "your notches, liberation doll" and then where will we all be? - --Smurf, wondering if anyone has any hints on how I should vote this coming November, or if it's even worth bothering to vote at all . . . ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 15:52:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Good food at the fest - --- Nuriel Tobias wrote: > So i hear that there's gonne be good food at the fest. Beside > eachother (and i'm sure you're all tasty) - what are you going to > eat? dang!!!! I may have to make it up after all, $$ be damned. :P em ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 11:01:04 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC Smurph wrote: > That's right, Colin, squash it NOW before it gets out of hand. Next thing you > know someone will be bringing up "your notches, liberation doll" and then > where will we all be? Ooooh yes, let's start another one of those threads! Maybe she was trying to say "noches" (Spanish for "night") and it got spelled incorrectly in the lyrics? Has anyone thought of THAT before?! > --Smurf, wondering if anyone has any hints on how I should vote this coming > November, or if it's even worth bothering to vote at all . . . No, don't vote - it only encourages them......;o) Hell - reminded of yet another episode of "Kath and Kim" where Kath asked Kim to get her a statue of baby Jesus, and ended up with a sculpture made of tiny individually wrapped edams..... - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman Hell's Pages - a WHOLE NEW EXPERIENCE! http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:04:03 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC Hell suggests: << Ooooh yes, let's start another one of those threads! Maybe she was trying to say "noches" (Spanish for "night") and it got spelled incorrectly in the lyrics? Has anyone thought of THAT before?! >> I always thought it was "you're not just Librace's doll" myself. - --Smurf, who can't help wondering if Ralph Nader has an opinion on this ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:24:44 -0400 From: vince Subject: Re: Michael - a man or a child? -- NJC vote for Kerry you must vote for Kerry two things can happen in November: Kerry wins Bush wins No other options your call (if you were kidding, then never mind!) Vince >--Smurf, wondering if anyone has any hints on how I should vote this coming >November, or if it's even worth bothering to vote at all . . . ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:28:32 -0400 From: "patrick leader" Subject: RE: Nuriel, male or... dear nuriel: i'm posting, below, what i think was the first post you (or someone named ada wittenberger, but signing herself nuriel) sent to the list. it was one of the most provocative posts i've seen on list, because i know 4ad's music, and the label's releases were deeply important to me for many years. and i really really couldn't see what 'nuriel' was talking about. do you have anything to tell me (us) about the post below? i'd truly love to hear. and i think it does speak to why some of us have been confused about whether you're a woman or not... >I think you thought i'm a woman cause my name is close to the name > >Now you tell me, my dear, why do i seem different?:) Is it my >broken english?:) nuriel's first post to jmdl... *** Hi everyone. My name is nuriel. I was born in nazareth and I still live in north israel. What Im about to tell you may seem as a madmans letter. Most of the times I told this to anyone I was treated as a madman. Im sure most of you would feel the same  but Ive got nothing to loose. Id like to say that everything I'm about to tell you is true. Youre free to believe it or not. Theres a music company in london named 4ad. 4ad is an alternativ music group. The first time I've ever listened to a 4ad artist was in the late 80s. At the summer of 89 I felt an urge to send my music to 4ad. I couldve composed some songs  but Ive chosen not to. I asked 3 friends to meet me at a recording-basement. We played a jam that was recorded on a broken tape. I was singing and my friends were playing guitar, bass , keyboards and drums. All songs were improvised. We recorded 6 songs. It lasted an hour. 2 days later I mailed the tape to 4ad. It was called "highland" and I named our band "riss  which means in hebrew an eye-lash A month later I got a call from the manager of 4ad. His name is ivo watts-russel. He told me that "highland" was the strangest thing he has ever listened to. He couldnt believe that anyone could improvise such a thing. He said that it was a revelation and said that he thinks Im the messiah. I dont think that Im the messiah and I never will. (please go on reading  I promise you that youll be amazed) ivo confused me. He asked me where did I get the idea of improvising music. I told him that by listening to 4ad artists d e b u t albums Ive noticed that they were all very home-made. Ivo said that its true, but added that none of them were an improvisation, and insisted on a better answer. Our conversation became very open and free. I had to tell him that 4ad artists debut albums always reminded me of something. I told him that they all had the same format of jonis debut Ivo words were yes  jonis debut is what started 4ads tradition. 4ad is the temple of her He added we always thought that our lilyth will last forever  till you came along  And hung up the phone. Then new albums were released on 4ad. Photos of me were on every cover. My name was mentioned on every song. Everything was about me and highland. Ivo and 4ad were celebrating the come of the child. Then night ride home" was released. I instantly understood that joni has listened to "highland" too and was a part of the "celebration" I knew I had to talk to ivo again  but first I had to understand what has happened at the "lilyth temple" before my "revelation". I searched for all the albums on 4ad that came out before 90. You dont have to be a genius and you dont have to be very much inlightened to notice That the albums and the artists that ivo personally chose to release were all about her. The songs  the covers  everything was about joni. I called him again. The moment he picked up the phone I asked him is joni aware of this, mister? Ivo laughed and said no, you fool  shes B E H I N D this!!! I asked him are you her representative? He laughed again and said my relationship with joni is a private matter!!! Then he hung up the phone. That was too much for me. I had a breakdown and was taken to an asylum. I was out of there after a month. A new 4ad album was released. It was a band named "his name is alive" and the album was named "mouth by mouth" A photo of me was on the front cover, and my closest friends were amazed. But what amazed me was that jonis voice was recorded on it. A conversation she had with some woman. At this point I'd like to stop. You must understand that what you've just read is a little piece of the information I have. Many of the things I wrote here may seem crazy or at best needing more explanation. I could tell you everything step by step and explain everything  but I know that only few of you will be interested in this case And believe me folks  youve heard nothing yet. For those of you who need to know more  Im willing to tell you all the details. Its impossible to do so on one letter  and thats why I stopped. For those of you who found this a madmans words  I hope you had fun. Yours, nuriel ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 11:43:23 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC Smurph wrote: > << Ooooh yes, let's start another one of those threads! Maybe she was > trying to say "noches" (Spanish for "night") and it got spelled incorrectly > in the lyrics? Has anyone thought of THAT before?! >> > > I always thought it was "you're not just Librace's doll" myself. And now, brand new from the creators of "Thesaurus Joni", Hellsmurph Enterprises brings you.......... "PHONETIC JONI"! How do you hear a Joni song? Impress your friends and neighbours with your not-so-tight grasp of the English language. Lovers of mondegreens rejoice - this is hours of fun for the whole family! DON'T INTER, RAPPED THE SOARING CROW Don't inter, rapped the soaring crow Dawn rite Inflame for profit which is a Beam of light "A rune" - fool of the class says He says, "You've no cheese, have a little dollop" Andy changes me, with that sherbet To that, ether or opium for all..... Hell - obviously with too much time on her hands..... - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman Hell's Pages - a WHOLE NEW EXPERIENCE! http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:50:34 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC Hell writes: << Hell - obviously with too much time on her hands..... >> Your knot a loan, Heil! Seven teens' glass is Grind whine Ilk of the mad donna Candle signs - --Smurf, wondering if Vince is serious about voting for Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 12:04:58 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC I wrote: > << Hell - obviously with too much time on her hands..... >> and Smurph replied: > Your knot a loan, Heil! But of course, we have "known chives to maize" Hell - this is getting weirder by the second..... - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman Hell's Pages - a WHOLE NEW EXPERIENCE! http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:24:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC ya'll are freaking me out.... :P em - --- hell wrote: > I wrote: > > > << Hell - obviously with too much time on her hands..... >> > > and Smurph replied: > > > Your knot a loan, Heil! > > But of course, we have "known chives to maize" > > Hell - this is getting weirder by the second..... > - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "To have great poets, there must be great > audiences too." - Walt Whitman > > Hell's Pages - a WHOLE NEW EXPERIENCE! > http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/index.html ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 12:36:02 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Notches, noches - or was it no cheese? NJC Em wrote: > ya'll are freaking me out.... > :P > em Don't worry, Em - it's all a dream, that we have baked..... Hell - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman Hell's Pages - a WHOLE NEW EXPERIENCE! http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 20:35:28 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: speaking of "me toos." NJC I think "yup" is definitely acceptable. Haven't heard any cautions about that. : - ) - ----Original Message Follows---- From: Em To: Marianne Rizzo , jonilist Subject: Re: speaking of "me toos." NJC Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 12:50:48 -0700 (PDT) "Me too" rule? the list has a rule that no "me too" posts are allowed? lol, how about "yup"? Is it permitted to just post "yup"? I swear, I've seen it done...MORE than once. :D Em np weirdly enough re: your other post Richrd Thompson "Woman or a Man"! I swear!!!!!!!!!!!! that was playing when I read your post to Nuriel. Album = live album "Small Town Romance" "Different" is also good in my book.... was gonna post "yup" but thought twice... - --- Marianne Rizzo wrote: > Hey, > > You know, I always enjoy it when someone says "me too." > Usually the lister says a little more too. . . and EVEN IF they > don't, it is > alwys fine by me. . . > > From somebody who doesn't care for that "me too" rule. > > > Marianne > > >Deb writes: > > >>I remember finding the actual prose unbearably pretentious and > "look at > >>me." I've always liked more unassuming prose. > > > A roadside attraction himself writes: > > >A big ME TOO for this, Deb. I did enjoy "Jitterbug Perfume" and > maybe one > >other book of his whose title I can't remember, and I really tried > to like > >him with each book I attempted to read but . . . zzzzzzzzzz. I think > I > >pitched "Another Roadside Attraction" myself! > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar  FREE! > http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/ ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25" http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash _________________________________________________________________ Check out MSN PC Safety & Security to help ensure your PC is protected and safe. http://specials.msn.com/msn/security.asp ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2004 #174 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)