From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #156 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, April 8 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 156 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- (NJC) Laura Nyro Anniversary [Gary Zack ] Re: DJRD not sure if this needs a NJC or not, probably/Randy [Em ] Re: (NJC) Laura Nyro Anniversary [Jerry Notaro ] flick NJC [Em ] Re: NJC troops in Iraq [Lori Fye ] Re: NJC- Something to offend every American! [Lori Fye ] Re: flick =?ISO-8859-1?B?oA==?=NJC [Jerry Notaro ] Re: NJC "Bush Doctrine" and Kay ["Norman Pennington" ] Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC ["Norman Pennington" ] Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom ["Norman Penni] Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC [Smurfycopy@aol.com] Re: I hate getting older, njc ["Norman Pennington" ] (NJC) Bombing on the JMDL [Lori Fye ] Re: Bombing Mosques NJC ["Lavieri, Vince [185776]" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 06:33:05 -0400 From: Gary Zack Subject: (NJC) Laura Nyro Anniversary Today is the anniversary of Laura Nyro's death. Love you Laura and miss you - If you are a Laura fan - play some Laura today. NYROLAND - -Gary Zack / April 15, 1997 End of a dark hall End of roses and devils and captains Trains and....God.... how could you take her? Well I can close my eyes, see black New York skies And will myself to... Nyroland. I've got her touch - at least that much That snowy day when I met her at the plane In from Japan - to the jesuit hall My rose she took, my hand she shook She let me into... Nyroland. I'm singing in purple and crying in my color blues So broken-hearted, the strings feel it too - I can't seem to focus on the sorrow I face She stares at my soul, in black velvet and lace. Ends of long black hair Ends of textures and colors and piano chords Cats and....God....maybe you needed her too Still - I can close my mind, get high and blind And will myself to... Nyroland. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 05:12:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: DJRD not sure if this needs a NJC or not, probably/Randy - --- Randy Remote wrote: > This is a hot little setup!...snip... Anyway, welcome to the list, > and glad you have a kickin' setup for your tunes. Hi Randy, thanks for the welcome. The thing is, I had denied myself a stereo for years and years. Had some of these pieces lying around from "past lives", but was just listening to a boom box. Didn't allow myself a "room" for music and art and I never realized how "poor" life had become in some ways - related to these things. Very small house, partner always has TV or videogames on, blah blah blah so many excuses, but I've found it sooooooo refreshing and wonderful to have this space now, tiny though it is - for music and candles and books and my little corner where I can "live in a box of paint" when I want to. Wish every human on the planet could have themselves *at least* a little room like mine. oops, did that sound socialist??? ;) So yeah, ye little olde stereo sounds wonderful to me - had no idea BSR made those turntables. Used to have a BSR in the 70's but it was pretty crummy, musta been their totally low-end one. Anyway, nice to meet ya Randy. :) Em ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 13:59:35 +0200 From: "Gillian Apter" Subject: RE: NJC spanish "appeasers" + Iraq Patrick, thank you so much for your reply. Of course, rationally, I am aware of what you say below... > dear gillian (and mike in barcelona, and any other posters from spain): please rest assured that many of us united statesian posters know plenty about why the PP lost. " .. but my heart sometimes takes over. I am not Spanish, but have lived here for over 20 years, so I often say "we" when defending this country.... And it is great to hear what people like yourself and Kay, who have been too close for comfort to the devastating effects of terrorism, have to say.. One of the reasons I stick with this list is that. I am so pleased to hear so many intelligent and rational "united statesians" talking, what I view is, such absolute and utter SENSE about Bush and his neocons... He is a danger to his own country and to the rest of the world. Spain has now 191 fewer people (25% were non-Spaniards) as an indirect result of his, and his Blair, Aznar, Berlusconi, etc. cronies', inflammatory international policies. And according to recent news, this is only just the start of the attacks on Spain. The next president you elect is so important to the rest of the world . Please, please, please those disaffected voters, get off your butts and vote out Bush. best wishes, Gill ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 14:20:16 +0200 From: "Gillian Apter" Subject: NJC troops in Iraq Given the recent posting in US troop action in Iraq, here's an EL PAIS article I read a few days ago. I paraphrase the first part. A Spanish reporter was involved in one of the early civilian uprisings against a Spanish/Salvadorean base in Nayaf under attack. on 4th April. US troops then joined in. The reporter describes the surprise and fear sparked by the attack in a place where Spanish troops had built up some amount of trust with Iraqi civilians. Spanish troops had to open fire to defend themselves against insurgents, but tried to keep it contained and controlled. But with the arrival of the US troops, that went all to pot. The reporters described them as "Rambos", whooping and screaming at the excitement of the battle". letting off huge amounts of ammunition,, crying out for more ammunition (yes, Colin, a Bruce Willis film does come to mind). Then two fighter planes fly low over the zone. Spanish officials warn that they are going to drop bombs. "What are they going to bomb?" they wonder. "There is nothing here but small three-storey houses... .Luckily, they do not drop the bombs. (I am directly translating now) "Rambos are up on the terraced roofs, whose exhilarated screams are heard when two US helicopters fly over. US artillery fire is then unloaded on an area dotted with civilian homes. Frustration spreads among Spanish troops. "We've been doing a good job here for the last eight months," explained a Spanish commander. We had good relations with all the political and religious groups." Now, suddenly, that has vanished. Nothing will be the same in Nayif from now on... " Later on, the paper says... "Some Spaniards cannot hide the discomfort over the US troops' behaviour. "Instead of helping, they just cause problems." " OK this is one article by one person, an eye witness, though. .. all the best, Gill ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 08:29:43 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: (NJC) Laura Nyro Anniversary What a wonderful tribute, Gary. I hope you are looking forward, as much as I, to the live 1970 at Fillmore East recording to be released soon. I hold my 2 cd Japanese import of Season of Lights up there with Shadows and Light as one of the great live performances. Jerry > Today is the anniversary of Laura Nyro's death. Love you Laura and miss > you - > If you are a Laura fan - play some Laura today. > > NYROLAND > -Gary Zack / April 15, 1997 > > End of a dark hall > End of roses and devils and captains > Trains and....God.... how could you take her? > Well I can close my eyes, see black New York skies > And will myself to... Nyroland. > > I've got her touch - at least that much > That snowy day when I met her at the plane > In from Japan - to the jesuit hall > My rose she took, my hand she shook > She let me into... Nyroland. > > I'm singing in purple and crying in my color blues > So broken-hearted, the strings feel it too - > I can't seem to focus on the sorrow I face > She stares at my soul, in black velvet and lace. > > Ends of long black hair > Ends of textures and colors and piano chords > Cats and....God....maybe you needed her too > Still - I can close my mind, get high and blind > And will myself to... Nyroland. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 08:33:30 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: NJC- Something to offend every American! KNOW YOUR STATE MOTTO ============================ Alabama : Hell Yes, We Have Electricity ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Alaska : 11,623 Eskimos Can't Be Wrong! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Arizona : But It's A Dry Heat ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Arkansas: Literacy Ain't Everything ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ California : By 30, Our Women Have More Plastic Than Your Honda ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Colorado : If You Don't Ski, Don't Bother ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Connecticut : Like Massachusetts, Only The Kennedy's Don't Own It Yet ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Delaware : We Really Do Like The Chemicals In Our Water ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Florida : Ask Us About Our Grandkids ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Georgia : We Put The "Fun" In Fundamentalist Extremism ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hawaii : Haka Tiki Mou Sha'ami Leeki Toru (Death To Mainland Scum, Leave Your Money) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Idaho : More Than Just Potatoes...Well, Okay, We're Not, But The Potatoes Sure Are Real Good ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Illinois : Please Don't Pronounce the "S" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Indiana : 2 Billion Years Tidal Wave Free ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Iowa : We Do Amazing Things With Corn ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kansas : First Of The Rectangle States ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kentucky : Five Million People; Fifteen Last Names ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Louisiana: We're Not ALL Drunk Cajun Wackos, But That's Our Tourism Campaign ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Maine: We're Really Cold, But We Have Cheap Lobster ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Maryland : If You Can Dream It, We Can Tax It ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Massachusetts : Our Taxes Are Lower Than Sweden 's (For Most Tax Brackets) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Michigan : First Line Of Defense From The Canadians ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Minnesota : 10,000 Lakes...And 10,000,000,000,000 Mosquitoes ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Mississippi : Come And Feel Better About Your Own State ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Missouri : Your Federal Flood Relief Tax Dollars At Work ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Montana : Land Of The Big Sky, The Unabomber, Right-wing Crazies, and Very Little Else ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Nebraska : Ask About Our State Motto Contest ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Nevada : Hookers and Poker! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Hampshire : Go Away And Leave Us Alone ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Jersey : You Want A ##$%##! Motto? I Got Yer ##$%##! Motto Right here! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Mexico : Lizards Make Excellent Pets ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New York : You Have The Right To Remain Silent, You Have The Right To An Attorney... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ North Carolina : Tobacco Is A Vegetable ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ North Dakota : We Really Are One Of The 50 States! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ohio: At Least We're Not Michigan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oklahoma : Like The Play, Only No Singing ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oregon : Spotted Owl...It's What's For Dinner ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Pennsylvania : Cook With Coal ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rhode Island: We're Not REALLY An Island ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ South Carolina : Remember The Civil War? We Didn't Actually Surrender ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ South Dakota : Closer Than North Dakota ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Tennessee : The Educashun State ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Texas : Sm, Hablo Ingles (Yes, I Speak English) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Utah : Our Jesus Is Better Than Your Jesus ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Vermont : Yep ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Virginia : Who Says Government Stiffs And Slackjaw Yokels Don't Mix? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Washington : Help! We're Overrun By Nerds And Slackers! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Washington , D.C. : Wanna Be Mayor? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ West Virginia : One Big Happy Family...Really! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wisconsin : Come Cut The Cheese ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wyoming : Where Men Are Men...And The Sheep Are Scared! KNOW YOUR STATE MOTTO ============================ Alabama : Hell Yes, We Have Electricity ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Alaska : 11,623 Eskimos Can't Be Wrong! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Arizona : But It's A Dry Heat ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Arkansas: Literacy Ain't Everything ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ California : By 30, Our Women Have More Plastic Than Your Honda ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Colorado : If You Don't Ski, Don't Bother ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Connecticut : Like Massachusetts, Only The Kennedy's Don't Own It Yet ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Delaware : We Really Do Like The Chemicals In Our Water ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Florida : Ask Us About Our Grandkids ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Georgia : We Put The "Fun" In Fundamentalist Extremism ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hawaii : Haka Tiki Mou Sha'ami Leeki Toru (Death To Mainland Scum, Leave Your Money) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Idaho : More Than Just Potatoes...Well, Okay, We're Not, But The Potatoes Sure Are Real Good ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Illinois : Please Don't Pronounce the "S" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Indiana : 2 Billion Years Tidal Wave Free ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Iowa : We Do Amazing Things With Corn ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kansas : First Of The Rectangle States ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kentucky : Five Million People; Fifteen Last Names ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Louisiana: We're Not ALL Drunk Cajun Wackos, But That's Our Tourism Campaign ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Maine: We're Really Cold, But We Have Cheap Lobster ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Maryland : If You Can Dream It, We Can Tax It ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Massachusetts : Our Taxes Are Lower Than Sweden 's (For Most Tax Brackets) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Michigan : First Line Of Defense From The Canadians ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Minnesota : 10,000 Lakes...And 10,000,000,000,000 Mosquitoes ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Mississippi : Come And Feel Better About Your Own State ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Missouri : Your Federal Flood Relief Tax Dollars At Work ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Montana : Land Of The Big Sky, The Unabomber, Right-wing Crazies, and Very Little Else ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Nebraska : Ask About Our State Motto Contest ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Nevada : Hookers and Poker! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Hampshire : Go Away And Leave Us Alone ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Jersey : You Want A ##$%##! Motto? I Got Yer ##$%##! Motto Right here! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New Mexico : Lizards Make Excellent Pets ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ New York : You Have The Right To Remain Silent, You Have The Right To An Attorney... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ North Carolina : Tobacco Is A Vegetable ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ North Dakota : We Really Are One Of The 50 States! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ohio: At Least We're Not Michigan ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oklahoma : Like The Play, Only No Singing ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oregon : Spotted Owl...It's What's For Dinner ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Pennsylvania : Cook With Coal ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rhode Island: We're Not REALLY An Island ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ South Carolina : Remember The Civil War? We Didn't Actually Surrender ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ South Dakota : Closer Than North Dakota ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Tennessee : The Educashun State ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Texas : Sm, Hablo Ingles (Yes, I Speak English) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Utah : Our Jesus Is Better Than Your Jesus ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Vermont : Yep ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Virginia : Who Says Government Stiffs And Slackjaw Yokels Don't Mix? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Washington : Help! We're Overrun By Nerds And Slackers! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Washington , D.C. : Wanna Be Mayor? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ West Virginia : One Big Happy Family...Really! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wisconsin : Come Cut The Cheese ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wyoming : Where Men Are Men...And The Sheep Are Scared! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 09:48:13 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrome The 4 J's ushered in the era of women refusing to use provocative images of themselves to sell their music (and how the pendulum has swung today!) In fact, I can't think of an uglier picture that that of Joan Baez on the cover of Farewell Angelina. It was the anti image. So it is interesting that both Joni and Judy (for her 40th birthday) did nude covers later on, both though were certainly innocent and artistic, and not the least bit titillating. Jerry NL: Condi, who has been thrown to the wolves..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 09:59:51 -0400 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: I hate getting older, njc Prankster Lama wrote: > I think I'm getting older. It started when I had to get bifocals at 43. At > the end of the day, I'm totally exhausted. Every day. > > Anybody else feel like that? Hell yes! My suggestion for your eyes: get laser surgery, and opt for mono-vision (where one eye is adjusted for distance and the other for closer seeing). Otherwise, exercise. Or don't, and just drink your blues away. (J/K!) Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 07:01:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: flick NJC Was wondering, and I know there's a good chance you all may have touched on this already and/or already discussed the heck out of it, but did anyone see that movie "A Mighty Wind"?? Thats like a spoof of the early folk scene?? Anyway, it TICKLES me soooooooooo much. seen it like 4 times now and it just makes me ROAR!!! which is a good thing...laughing is good...yep. Saw it first on pay per view, since no local theatre here saw fit to screen it (that I know of). Now its on HBO. so, anybody else seen it?? its very silly I know... but.... I think the one component of this flick and the other 2 by these same people, SpinalTap and that one about he dog shows, is that they kinda "embarass" a grin onto your face, that you *know* what they mean about certain things. They draw out things we share in our heads. :D Aunty Em < Subject: Re: NJC troops in Iraq Gill shared: > (I am directly translating now) "Rambos are up on the terraced roofs, whose > exhilarated screams are heard when two US helicopters fly over. This doesn't surprise me in the least, given the culture in the U.S. in general and in the U.S. military in particular. And it makes me wonder (and here comes a loaded statement) if it might not be better to have a military draft in the U.S., afterall, because then at least there would be a CHANCE for some kind of balanced thinking within the participants. As it stands now, with an all-volunteer force, what you get is a lot of ... wannabe Rambos. Thanks for sharing that, Gill. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:16:02 -0400 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: NJC- Something to offend every American! LOL ... speaking of this one: > California : By 30, Our Women Have More Plastic Than Your Honda Did anyone see any of the new awful Fox "reality" show, "The Swan," last night?? Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 07:27:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrome - --- Jerry Notaro wrote: > In > fact, I can't think of an uglier picture that that of Joan Baez on > the cover > of Farewell Angelina. It was the anti image. Hi Jerry. Funny, I used to also find that photo quite ugly and sort of disturbing. But now (and for the last several years) I find it quite breathtakingly beautiful. Maybe cuz I get to see her details. I recall a part of some liner notes (I think thats where its from) that Dylan wrote for her and part of it where he's on some train tracks and says "all beauty's ugly" and then there's more. Interesting, your post was. :) Em ps Jerry are you in St Pete??? I see by your email addy.... I'm over in Tampa ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 10:45:36 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: flick =?ISO-8859-1?B?oE5KQw==?= Yes, there has been disucssion of that film here Em, for obvious reasons. It played our town but I saw the DVD which of course has some cool bonus features. I loved the movie, what an incredible talent pool. And a real mix of humor and sadness too. The same crew also did an uproarious sendoff of community theatre called "Waiting For Guffman", if you've missed it and enjoyed the others this one is a must see. Wha Hoppen? :~) Bob NP: REM, "Country Feedback" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 07:51:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Em Subject: Re: flick  NJC - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: The same crew also did an uproarious sendoff of community > theatre called "Waiting For Guffman", if you've missed it and > enjoyed the others this one is a must see. Didn't know about that one!!! thanks so much! Now I gotta rent it. Like tonight. lol!!!!! that wha happened guy, I just want to DO something to him!!!! lol!!!!!!!!!!! I gotta stop. am laughing in my office they're wondering why I am so cheerful. Suspicious! btw thanks for the RS list link, still gotta read it. :) Em ===== "A minotaur gets very sore" ....ISB '68 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 10:58:35 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: flick =?ISO-8859-1?B?oA==?=NJC > --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > The same crew also did an uproarious sendoff of community >> theatre called "Waiting For Guffman", if you've missed it and >> enjoyed the others this one is a must see. > > Didn't know about that one!!! thanks so much! Now I gotta rent it. Like > tonight. You must. A brilliant film, and maybe the best of the Mock-u-mentary films. And like Bob if you have ever been involved with community theater, even funnier. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 08:07:49 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Bush doctrine (was What Is Reality?) (NJC) "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" wrote: > What do you mean, they're not available for comment? US forces were being > SHOT AT from the building for weeks. The mosque had been used for cover for > weeks. What kind of religious person uses a place of worship as a fortress? > > Besides a terrorist, I mean. > I think the same type of person that uses religion as a shield for warmaking. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:24:22 -0400 (EDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: Bush doctrine (njc) I have to wonder about believing in self determination, when we are, in effect, "imposing democracy" in Iraq. (quote taken directly from press conference w/Donald Rumsfeld.) A question I ponder lately is: Can democracy work in a society that is not really heterogeneous? In other words, is the diversity of the U.S. population what makes it all work (well sometimes anyway...) Is democracy possibly not the solution for Iraq, which consists mainly of three major groups hostile to one another? As for Bush's treatment of the military... well, those stationed in Iraq won't be getting hot meals anymore. And, of course, he's cut benefits and determined that, unlike in past conflicts, someone in the military who serves in both Iraq and Afghanistan will only get one medal, not two. Talk about a slap in the face! (In WW II, if you served in both the Pacific and Europe, you got two medals.) Sometimes (to pervert a famous quote) "the devil is in the details." I think that's certainly true with this administration. lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 09:41:50 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Bombing Mosques NJC I'm not quite sure what Lori meant when she wrote: > > (me) OTOH, we could have (and did) simply kill the SOBs and get on with it. > > (Lori) Well, damn those SOBs anyway, defending their country and their beliefs and > all. Hmmm. I guess it really IS true that "one man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter." Do you REALLY believe those insurgents are/were "defending their country, etc.?" I view it as a radical Shiite grab for power and a blatant attempt to disrupt the transition process. Best Regards, bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 09:58:13 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: NJC "Bush Doctrine" and Kay In a "call and response" manner, Lori writes: > > a. Taliban eliminated as a viable force and government in Afghanistan > > b. Removed Afghanistan as Al Qaeda sanctuary > > c. Killed or captured 2/3rds of Al Qaeda leadership > > d. Disrupted Al Qaeda and reduced their operational efficiency > > e. Eliminated S. Hussein as a threat > > f. Initiated action to introduce democracy in Iraq > > a. You don't really believe that the Taliban won't reemerge as soon as we've > turned our backs (as we eventually will), do you? Actually, I DO believe the Taliban will not SUCCESSFULLY re-emerge. The general Afghani population has NO desire to return to Taliban rule. > b. Have we blown away all those mountains? Are we SURE Al Qaeda isn't still in > hiding there? Those mountains aren't anything a few tactical nukes couldn't fix. ;-) Al Qaeda is hiding everywhere, and I believe you understand my point that the officially-sanctioned protection of the Taliban government has been removed. > c. But no sign or capture of Osama bin Laden, yet. Hmm. His days are numbered...and the numbers are LOW. > d. Perhaps. Otoh, 200 Spaniards might disagree. The Madrid bombings were abominable. I didn't say we had eliminated Al Qaeda, I said we reduced their operational efficiency. Doubtless there will be more atacks before this is over. > e. Okay, I'll give you that. But at what cost? Nothing is free. What were the costs of our previous conflicts? And, were they worth it in the final accounting? I submit the answer is "yes." > f. This is so arrogant on the part of the USA. We assume democracy is desired > by everyone, just because it works for us. I emphasized self-determination in my clarifying remarks to point "f." Democracy is an option, and the preferable option to most of the world's peoples. Remember the "Goddess of Liberty" in Tianamen (sp?) Square? It looked a lot like Lady Liberty in New York harbor to me... > > But, oppression is oppression...whether it originates from a ruthless > > dictator, a commissar, or a mullah. > > Or an Ashcroft? Oh, Lori...Ashcroft is SO oppressing us. We really ought to get rid of his gulag, his torture chambers, and his assassination squads. Really, now. With Love and Respect, bp NP: Condi Rice and the 9/11 Witch Hunt ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:04:00 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom Steve Dulson wrote: > Think of the original covers of > Blind Faith and Electric Ladyland. The Blind Faith cover created a firestorm; the original covers were removed from the shelves and replaced with a non-descript version. If you have an original cover LP, you may own something valuable. Best Regards, bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 12:13:28 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom > Steve Dulson wrote: > >> Think of the original covers of >> Blind Faith and Electric Ladyland. > > The Blind Faith cover created a firestorm; the original covers were removed > from the shelves and replaced with a non-descript version. If you have an > original cover LP, you may own something valuable. > > Best Regards, > bp > If I remember correctly, it wasn't that the girl was topless as much as she was reported to be 15. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:17:36 -0400 From: Lori Fye Subject: Re: Bombing Mosques NJC Buck sez: > I'm not quite sure what Lori meant when she wrote: > >>> (me) OTOH, we could have (and did) simply kill the SOBs and get on with it. > >> (Lori) Well, damn those SOBs anyway, defending their country and their >> beliefs and all. > > Hmmm. I guess it really IS true that "one man's terrorist is another's > freedom fighter." Do you REALLY believe those insurgents are/were > "defending their country, etc.?" I view it as a radical Shiite grab for > power and a blatant attempt to disrupt the transition process. I meant who are we to think they're SOBs because they're defending what they believe, within THEIR country, regardless that it's not what we think they should be doing? That the Shiites may be attempting to grab power is not much different, imo, than the Bushies rigging the election in Florida. A power grab is a power grab. Who are we to decide what's best for the Iraqis, and who should be in charge? Or is it exactly as it seems, that we're going to install the regime that best suits our interests (whose interests? big businesses'?) What's next? Converting the Iraqis to GW's brand of Christianity? I'm simply amazed at how bewildered the administration and military are that things are not going their way. We had no idea what we were getting ourselves into, because we don't understand the country or the culture, and we really haven't tried to understand. Meanwhile, more people (on all sides) die each day, for what? We are not stopping terrorism, merely providing more excuses for its growth. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:21:18 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC Smurf opined: > Another thing is, the overwhelming majority of men and women who enlist in > the military are from the middle and lower classes and are in the service > because it is the best employment they can find in bad economic times, and/or they > are attracted by the education and job training benefits they can receive. > Although I am sure there are a few exceptions, most people who enlist do not have > topnotch colleges and universities offering them scholarships, or parents who > can afford to give their children the best education this country has to > offer. Most enlisted people would likely be products of American public schools > which, especially in poor and middle-class neighborhoods, would not have prepared > these young people for much more than the military or minimum-wage jobs. > > There are, of course, exceptions to everything I am saying. But in my > opinion, most of the men and women in the American military would most likely be > loyal, trusting, and kind people who aren't particularly astute when it comes to > complex world issues. This probably applies in a general way to military people > anywhere in the world -- and throughout history. Who has ever heard of an > army that wanted mature, intelligent recruits? They wouldn't be too great at > taking orders -- they'd say, "You want me to WHAT?!" > I disagree that "the overwhelming majority" of enlistees are there because the military is "the best employment they can find in hard economic times." You also do not address the officer corps, the great majority of which enter service with ROTC commissions...not degrees from our military academies. There are many, many individuals, both officer and enlisted, that enter military service because of a simple belief in "duty, honor, country." That simple belief is alive and well in this country, especially in our rural areas. We in this country have a great tradition of "citizen soldiers," and the military has not had a problem staffing an all-volunteer force since the draft ended...through good times and bad. You need to get out of the salons of Boston and into the heartland, Smurf. I read more than a whiff of condescension and/or elitism in your post, intended or not. Best Regards, bp, a retired USAF MSgt ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:25:53 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Bombing Mosques NJC -- PC Lori writes: << I'm simply amazed at how bewildered the administration and military are that things are not going their way. >> And I remember just over a year ago, many people -- liberals among them -- were predicting that things would not go well. Glad to see you're back, Lori! - --Smurf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:29:39 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: I hate getting older, njc Lama wrote: > I think I'm getting older. It started when I had to get bifocals at 43. At > the end of the day, I'm totally exhausted. Every day. > > Anybody else feel like that? > I hate to tell you this, Lama, but it gets MUCH worse. I, too, got my bifocals in my mid-40s, and the cumulative aches and pains of old age, not to mention the "senior moments," are beinning to drive me flipping crazy. But...there are GOOD things, too. One tends to become a bit more tolerant, a bit more philosophical, and a LOT more laid back. You also tend to appreciate your friends more, and those rare times when you can summon the energy to party-hardy. I also find my seven-year old son has a tendency to keep me "young," but I wouldn't recommend late-life parenting as a panacea. It does wear you out... Best Regards, bp...who's pushing 60, HARD. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 11:29:26 -0500 From: "mackoliver" Subject: Re: NJC "Bush Doctrine" and Kay Cannot not respond to this anymore. NP wrote: > Those mountains aren't anything a few tactical nukes couldn't fix. ;-) Al > Qaeda is hiding everywhere, and I believe you understand my point that the > officially-sanctioned protection of the Taliban government has been removed. - --As Joni sang 'no tanks have ever rumbled through these streets.' Easy to write about such actions when they don't affect us here at home. Discussing the use of nukes as easily as 'let's go get an ice cream.' > > His days are numbered...and the numbers are LOW. - --I don't know about his numbers but the numbers of those that will resist the U.S. and our deplorable actions in that region are not low and will only continue to grow. And I don't refer to the soldiers there, only doing what they are told to do, but to that person in the white house now and his cronies. > > The Madrid bombings were abominable. I didn't say we had eliminated Al > Qaeda, I said we reduced their operational efficiency. Doubtless there will > be more atacks before this is over. - --Strange to me that these are called attacks but what we are doing in Iraq is not called the same thing. > > Nothing is free. What were the costs of our previous conflicts? And, were > they worth it in the final accounting? I submit the answer is "yes." - --I don't imagine all the families of those men and boys already lost would say yes. Some would I suppose but even that will change with time. No more Christmas time with them, no more birthdays, no more kisses upon their cheeks, no future, no children, no life. And for what? For what? Freedom? My ass. > > I emphasized self-determination in my clarifying remarks to point "f." - --Self determination. That might apply is they were doing that for themselves. This is Georgie Bush determination, nothing more. NP: Condi Rice and the 9/11 Witch Hunt - --I hope they burn her on the cross, along with the rest of them. Repubs don't like these kinds of things when they aren't the ones running the show. mack ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:41:37 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom Jerry writes: > > The Blind Faith cover created a firestorm; the original covers were removed > > from the shelves and replaced with a non-descript version. If you have an > > original cover LP, you may own something valuable. > > > > Best Regards, > > bp > > > If I remember correctly, it wasn't that the girl was topless as much as she > was reported to be 15. Yep, that was the issue. Can you imagine that cover TODAY? The photgrapher, the record company, and the band would all be drawn and quartered.... bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:50:03 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC buckpennington@yucca.net writes: << You need to get out of the salons of Boston and into the heartland, Smurf. I read more than a whiff of condescension and/or elitism in your post, intended or not. >> Ha! I am from the same background as the people I was writing about, Einstein. And I have been seeing middle and lower class people -- from my old neighborhood and places like them -- come home in body bags since the idiotic Viet Nam years. Young lives wasted for no good reason. A couple of years ago there was a national news story about an upper-class man from Massachusetts whose prep-school son joined the marines rather than going off to college. Why was it newsworthy? Because recruits don't usually come from the upper classes. As for "a whiff of condescension and/or elitism in (my) post," what can I say? You support a man who is the most condescending and elitist president of my lifetime, so maybe that's what you're smelling. And as far as sniffing posts go, I think all of your political posts stink. The fact that you actually served in the military and see the war in Iraq as a solution to anything at all just mind-boggling. Enjoy your war. - --Smurf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 10:51:41 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: I hate getting older, njc Lori, with tongue in cheek, wrote: > Otherwise, exercise. Or don't, and just drink your blues away. A Fat Tire (or three!) a day keeps the blues away! bp, looking forward to Happy Hour. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 11:07:43 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: NJC "Bush Doctrine" and Kay mack writes: > > Those mountains aren't anything a few tactical nukes couldn't fix. ;-) >> Al Qaeda is hiding everywhere, and I believe you understand my point that the > > officially-sanctioned protection of the Taliban government has been >> removed. > > --As Joni sang 'no tanks have ever rumbled through these streets.' Easy to > write about such actions when they don't affect us here at home. Discussing > the use of nukes as easily as 'let's go get an ice cream.' > Did you miss the smiley in my nuke comment, Mack? It IS there... And, while tanks haven't rumbled through these streets, airliners HAVE been used as cruise missles to visit death and destruction upon us. > > > > His days are numbered...and the numbers are LOW. > > --I don't know about his numbers but the numbers of those that will resist > the U.S. and our deplorable actions in that region are not low and will only > continue to grow. And I don't refer to the soldiers there, only doing what > they are told to do, but to that person in the white house now and his > cronies. > > Former senator Bob Kerrey made an interesting comment in today's 9/11 hearings. He stated (and I paraphrase) that we don't want to describe our current actions as "a war on radical Islam, and that's what it REALLY is." He is oh-so-correct. There is no compromising with the jihadists, no negotiating, no appeasement is possible. The hard truth is we have to confront them...and kill them, if all else fails. The Jihadists have made it quite clear that they want to eliminate us. Period. I'll not respond to your other points. Best Regards, bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 13:08:33 EDT From: Gertus@aol.com Subject: Re: Welcome (NJC) In a message dated 07/04/2004 23:27:57 GMT Standard Time, emzdogz@yahoo.com writes: > Sorry to hear that Dave Swarbrick > is not well. I remember him as kind of the central figure in Fairport > Conv. after the Richard Thompson days. Thinking the albums "Gladys' > Leap" and farther back, I think it was called "the Bonny Bunch of > Roses". Love that stuff! Hope he gets better. Before Fairport he was in a partnership with Martin Carthy and prior to that with the Ian Campbell Group, I believe. Now he has serious lung problems, is in a wheelchair and on oxygen but even this doesn't stop him playing. Considering his obituary appeared in a national newspaper about 5 years ago, he's doing pretty well! > I've never actually heard the music of Martin Carthy, though I've heard > him referred to so much as an influence for so many people. Same with > Davey Graham, never heard an actual piece played by him. Martin still records, often with his wife, Norma Waterson, but his daughter, Eliza, tends to have a higher profile, currently. Davey is a strange dude but very influential. I have several of his albums, including "Folk Blues and Beyond" which is probably the most famous but I guess he will always be best known for composing "Angie". I wonder what he's doing now? Regards Jacky > As for Renbourn and Williamson..I have a CD of them together! a concert > CD. Need to listen again. Interesting indeed. I didn't know one existed. > I met Pentangle once, shy one John Renbourn, this was mid 80's they did > a tour here of very small venues. Jaqui McShee was just as awesome as > ever. :) christ I love those crystaline female voices...they slay me. > But what reminded me of that..Bert seemed quite the bored guy, lol. > I think they had a new album, "Open the Door" perhaps was the name?? > not sure. It has pebbles on the cover. hmm..long time ago already. > Yes, I can imagine Bert being bored. In fact, I think he mentioned on a radio interview recently, how he disliked touring with Pentangle. An interesting book, if you ever come across it, is "Dazzling Stranger - Bert Jansch and the British folk and blues revival" by Colin Harper. It covers the whole BJ era right up to quite recently. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 13:10:32 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom -- NJC About the issue of using a photograph of a topless 15-year-old girl for an album cover, buckpennington@yucca.net writes: << Can you imagine that cover TODAY? The photgrapher, the record company, and the band would all be drawn and quartered.... >> Gee, Buck, this post has more than a whiff of a nostalgic attitude for a time when the abuse of minors was more accepted in American society. - --Smurf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 11:11:49 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC > And as far as sniffing posts > go, I think all of your political posts stink. The fact that you actually > served in the military and see the war in Iraq as a solution to anything at all > just mind-boggling. > > Enjoy your war. A very respectful position point (not), and a perfect example of liberal intolerance for a POV other than your own. Enjoy your intolerance. bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 13:15:42 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Welcome (NJC) The Ian Campbell Group did a cover of Circle Game and also a COOL cover of "Dr. Junk", one of the handful of Joni covers that she didn't record! If you haven't heard Davey Graham's "Both Sides Now", you should. I find it electrifying. I'm happy to send a .wma to whoever would like to hear it. As for Bert Jansch, he recorded "Goodbye Pork Pie Hat" but it was an instrumental version WAY prior to Joni's lyrical one. Many many connections with Fairport, of course, and all those British folk legends. Bob NP: REM, "Ignoreland" (Sometimes I forget how good REM is) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 11:29:56 -0600 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Joni's nude photo on FTR and the "kiss my ass" syndrom -- NJC > << Can you imagine that cover TODAY? The photgrapher, the record company, > and the band would all be drawn and quartered.... >> > > Gee, Buck, this post has more than a whiff of a nostalgic attitude for a time > when the abuse of minors was more accepted in American society. > > --Smurf Welcome to my kill file, Smurf. You're the first and only JMDL'er to join the spammers and other idiots. bp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 13:36:54 EDT From: Smurfycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC buckpennington@yucca.net writes: << a perfect example of liberal intolerance for a POV other than your own >> You lost all credibility with me when you dissed Lori on the issue of W's mispronunciation of "nuclear," calling it a "regional accent" and saying something about "liberal Intolerance" then, too. And when the JMDL was flooded with posts -- some from Texas! -- about how "nucular" was not part of any known regional accent, but just incorrect, you never even responded to those e-mails. What this told me about you is that you either fight dirty like the Bushes you love, or that you are not too swift. In either case, I don't think you don't deserve my time or anyone else's. I am sorry I have responded to any of your posts. I will try my damnedest not to do so in the future, no matter what crap you spew. - --Smurf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:52:13 -0500 From: "mackoliver" Subject: Re: Bombing whatever NJC -- PC smurph wrote: Lori on the issue of W's > mispronunciation of "nuclear," calling it a "regional accent" and saying > something about "liberal Intolerance" then, too. - --and I ain't a texan transplant or wannabe. no one says that except the idiot. and I live here and have lived here in the 'heartland' for my entire life (other than the year in good ole wisconsin). mack ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 14:15:37 -0400 From: Lori Fye Subject: (NJC) Bombing on the JMDL Time out please! Smurf and Buck (and Mack and others), given the opportunity, you would probably find out that -- except for this one hot-button issues that evokes so much passion in each of us -- you would like each other very much for the endless list of other things you DO have in common. Buck and I completely disagree about the war and about Bush, but we've been friends for 27 years for a reason. Trust me on this, okay? Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 14:43:01 -0400 From: "Lavieri, Vince [185776]" Subject: Re: Bombing Mosques NJC Lori typed the following which In agree with and aren't you all surpised I have been avoiding a political thread but I am disgusted by the actions of this administration since this whole thing began and dropping bombs on mosques and anything else they can do BUT IT IS NOT IN MY NAME. You may be poresident, G w Bush, but whatever you do is not in my name and not in the name of the country I love. Vince Lori's words: I meant who are we to think they're SOBs because they're defending what they believe, within THEIR country, regardless that it's not what we think they should be doing? That the Shiites may be attempting to grab power is not much different, imo, than the Bushies rigging the election in Florida. A power grab is a power grab. Who are we to decide what's best for the Iraqis, and who should be in charge? Or is it exactly as it seems, that we're going to install the regime that best suits our interests (whose interests? big businesses'?) What's next? Converting the Iraqis to GW's brand of Christianity? I'm simply amazed at how bewildered the administration and military are that things are not going their way. We had no idea what we were getting ourselves into, because we don't understand the country or the culture, and we really haven't tried to understand. Meanwhile, more people (on all sides) die each day, for what? We are not stopping terrorism, merely providing more excuses for its growth. ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2004 #156 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)