From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #86 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, February 24 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 086 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Beef? njc ["Lucy Hone" ] Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) [Chris Marshall ] re: Atkins (njc) ["Marian Russell" ] re: London calling (NJC) [Garret ] Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Joni Mitchell and Jewel [Jerry Notaro ] re: i made it!!!!!!! njc [Garret ] Re: Two Grey Rooms [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: Harry's House and Hissing [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: Atkins (njc) [colin ] RE: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) ["Maggie McNally" ] Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC [notaro@stpt.usf.edu] tofu njc ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Re: Harry's House and Hissing [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC ["Sherelle Smith" ] great audiences, njc i suppose ["Patricia Parlette" ] light-jazzy husband-and-wife duo identified; was Maria Muldaur, Wendy Waldman... ["Timothy Spong" ] Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC ["Sherelle Smith" ] Re: tofu njc [colin ] pup update njc [colin ] Re: Buttons/Cat thread (NJC) ["Donna Binkley" ] Re: pup update njc ["Donna Binkley" ] Re: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) ["mackoliver" ] From Walt -- not a letter to you, but at least one *from* me(njc, 6969) [] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:27:44 -0000 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Re: Beef? njc Jono jlobello@famvid.com wrote......... "About population controls: How about a one child policy in the US and Western Europe, and a two child policy other places where population densities are not as critical such as Canada and Australia. I mean it seems to work for the Chinese (when they can enforce it) ." The whole thing about population enforcement in China is that it has ended up with girl children being left to die in gutters, on rubbish piles, and in the "dying rooms". Population control works on paper but fails to take into account the cultural heritage of places like china where only male heirs can mourn their parents and ensure their passage into the hereafter.... We may see that as totally la la land but it is how their culture works... ( in the main... not all chinese but for the larger proportion). Women who know they are expecting girl children know they are unlikely to be able to keep that child or they will have to abandon or kill it... see this link http://www.oneworld.org/tvandradio/dyingrooms.html All children should be loved and wanted regardless of gender. What needs to happen is for women to be allowed to control their fertility, and for men who really do not want to father children to have vasectomy on demand.... .. I have to go out now but I can feel a real rant coming on about the sorry state of parenting and too many kids brought up unwanted, unloved, and without hope... boiling in my viens..... Lucy...... who has to go and talk to some really really rich kids about what its like to be poor... and they wont believe that some families do not have a car, have no holidays any where... and that they possibly might not have enough money for new clothes..... OOOOOOOOOOOOOoh I like these talks.. they really start to think... and more to the point they raise money for us......... YES!!!!!!! peace all ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:32:58 +0000 From: Chris Marshall Subject: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) The day I've been dreading arrived today: at nearly 17 years of age, Buttons - my old black moggy - had to be put to sleep. His kidneys had been gradually getting worse and he had a stiff back leg, but for a long time was still a happy, if cranky, old man. Yesterday he stopped eating, was throwing up, and all but lost the use of his back legs - all pretty much at the same time. My feeling, and that of the vet and others, was that it was probably kinder to let him go now rather than prolong things and have his quality of life suffer through trying to patch him up, probably repeatedly. http://www.hatstand.org/albums/cats/DCP_1181.sized.jpg I imagine he's spending his time weeing on the great living room carpet in the sky now, perhaps getting John Moore's little scally, Dealer, into trouble in his spare time :) - --Chris Marshall chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:28:33 -0500 From: "Marian Russell" Subject: re: Atkins (njc) jlobello@famvid.com wrote: > Sounds to me that you are practitioner of the > Atkins diet which in my opinion should only be > used for rapid weight loss. That diet is very > unhealthy! "Atkins", aka low-carb, can be used for dieting, but it is really better to think of it as a way of eating. It is, IMO, a healthy way of eating. I have been eating mostly low-carb (I indulge in sweets now and then - e.g., birthday cake) for about five years now. I used to have rather high cholesterol and not very goot rations of HDL to LDL. In one year on Atkins my cholesterol went from 330 down to 250 (still high, but a big improvement) and the important blood cholesterol ratios improved dramatically. My doctor said: "Congratulations! Are you doing Atkins? Whatever you are doing, keep it up!" Everything colin said about not eating so many carbs and the food pyramid being upside-down is true. Until agriculture, humans basically ate protein, nuts, seeds, berries, fruit. Our ancestors ate that way for millions of years before agriculture and refined flour and breads. Read Life Without Bread. Read Protein Power. Both of these books contain information about the science behind the low-carb approach and will explain better than Atkins why this way of eating is healthy. I recently read this in a news article: + + + + + + The World Health Organisation has published a report on health and diet advising consumers to limit their sugar intake. The new guidelines stress that sugar should form no more than 10% of a person's diet. But the US Sugar Association has criticised the WHO, saying that their recommendations are "unfair, misguided and misleading". The Sugar Association, which includes such giants as Coca-Cola, Pepsi-Cola and General Foods, is reported to have threatened to lobby Congress to withdraw funding from the WHO unless its sugar report is withdrawn. + + + + + + So I find myself wondering how much influence the sugar industry has on keeping things the way they are - keeping people believing that low-fat is healthy. In the 20 years of the low-fat approach, the average obesity in the USA has gone from below 50 percent of the population to more than 60 percent of the population. When fat is removed from food, what is it replaced with??? Sugar and carbs. I think sugar is the villian in our diets and is what is causing heart disease, diabetes, etc. When you are young, the amount of sugar you eat doesn't usually impact your body immediately. Unfortunately, if you eat too much sugar for too long of a time in your life, you eventually become insulin resistant and unable to process well even the unrefined sugars in complex carbohydrate foods - so that when you eat carbs of any kind, the sugars get stored as fat and you gain weight. And if the WHO is recommending that sugars be only 10% of our diet, what does that mean? Do they mean refined sugar, or can we take that to mean carbs that get converted to sugar, too? If I had indulged less in chocolate and sweets in my younger days, I could probably eat more carbs than I do, but if I eat carbs now, I just gain weight. Probably carbs make up about 10% of my current diet. When I am good about keeping to this low-carb way of eating, my moods are even (rarely feel depressed), I don't experience food cravings, I need less sleep, I have a lot of energy - in short, I feel good! The low carb way of eating seems right for me and I am convinced, after five years, that it is the healthiest way of eating for me. Marian Vienna P.S. I'm on joni-only digest, so if you reply to this email, please also send a copy to marian@jmdl.com so that I will see it. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:05:30 +0000 From: Garret Subject: re: London calling (NJC) Well i dont really know you Kerry, but im in London and would be more than interested in a London JMDL get together; it's been far too long since i saw martin, azeem, and les. Maybe jacky would join in too? And Chris? And dr. strings? And of course, anyone else that i dont know/forgot to mention! i'll root around in my head and send some sightseeing suggestions to you in the next day or two ( i've been doing the tourist thing *very slowly* since last august) GARRET Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:47:17 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: London calling (NJC) I will be in London in April and would love to get together with some JMDLers for a drink or two! :>) Also, if anyone would like to recommend things to see and do, I would appreciate it! Please e-mail me privately. Thanks! Kerry - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:20:16 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC I have been a long time fan of Beth NC and have posted about her in the past to little comment. I'm glad she is gaining popularity. She had made it, in my mind, when Trisha Yearwood recorded Down On My Knees for her first cd. One of Beth's most beautiful songs. Jerry, still reeling from seeing Cyndi Lauper and her At Last tour last night from the 12th row! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:22:46 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell and Jewel > The reviewer (Bernard Zuel) said: "It's not hard to see in Jewel someone who > has studied Joni Mitchell. To quote the brilliant Miss Mitchell: "I don't see it." Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:29:12 +0000 From: Garret Subject: re: i made it!!!!!!! njc that is such good news Wally; fair play to you! what exactly is the course? is it taught or research/applied otj? sounds like you'll have an interesting few years! GARRET (considering applying for clinical psych doctorate course next year) - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:48:30 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Two Grey Rooms Bob Muller wrote in part about Two Grey Rooms (I cut out the "long dong"......................references, that is :-) Here's Joni's explanation, from a 1994 interview: ______________________________________________________________ "Two Grey Rooms" on the last album, for instance, was a jam. ......... We recorded it for "Wild Things" and it came out on the last album. ..........I finally found a story about a homosexual love story from a fellow from Fassbinder's crowd in Germany, a story of obsession, and when I read the story I think in Interview Magazine, I didn't think of it as making a song out of it, but it was a kind of a haunting story of obsession........ " Read the whole interview at Les' reading room: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=583 Further to that, I found this interview from a couple of years later (Robert Hilburn, for the LA Times, 12/8/96 - I first read it in Stacy Luftig's "Joni Mitchell Companion"), which was the one I had been recalling in my earlier post. http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=144 TWO GREY ROOMS (1991) I had that music back around the time of [1982's] "Wild Things Run Fast," but it took seven years to find the story to fit the music. It's a story of obsession ... about this German aristocrat who had a lover in his youth that he never got over. He later finds this man working on a dock and notices the path that the man takes every day to and from work. So the aristocrat gives up his fancy digs and moves to these two shabby grey rooms overlooking this street, just to watch this man walk to and from work. That's a song that shows my songs aren't all self-portraits. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:12:57 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Harry's House and Hissing Bob Muller replied (re lines from Harry's House) It's all faux. Like the blond hair; not real but rather from a bottle at the beauty parlor. As fake as Harry's relationship with his wife, his job, his life. Of course, this being one of the main themes of THOSL, may I cite from the title song a line that I feel is underrated. Amid the amazing poetry of that song (it is cutting, but it is so artistic) is the punchline, which contains another side to the story, it seems to me: "Still she stays with a love of some kind It's the lady's choice The hissing of summer lawns." I wonder why she separated THOLS and Harry's House with The Boho Dance (which feels to me like it belongs on the side with Jungle Line and Edith). In a way, I'm thinking like STAS - the first side "I Came To the City". Just a slight rearranging, really... In France They Kiss on Main Street The Jungle Line Edith and the Kingpin The Boho Dance Shades of Scarlett Conquering Then "Out of the City and Into the Suburbs" for Dont Interrupt the Sorrow THOSL Harry's House Sweet Bird Shadows and Light Just a feeling I had Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:20:23 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Atkins (njc) Hi Marian-I have found much the same benefits. My cholesterol down from 323 to 179, tri's less than 1(english count). No longert take meds for stomach acid. Sleep well. No more 'trots', or fatigue, nor moodiness. And best of all, no hunger. Oh and my blood sugar less than 5. My weight decrerases approx 1.5 to 2lb per week, tho in practice I got for weeks with no loss then drop 10 quite quickly. Recent studoies have shown low carb works, is haelthy, and has benefits for cardiovascular health. One 12 moth study in denamrk and another of same length in UK showed this to be so. I have neevr known a diet be so contraversial. Sales of bread, rice, potatoes and other cereals are dropping by quite a percentage. So that worries the big buck companies. meat and egg sales are up. That conernns the animal rights lobby. The most vociiferous anti's are a group of Dr's whose agenda is an animal rights one but they don't mention tht when on news items trashing Atkins. And they will resort to lies. Such as Dr Atkins died from heart disease and weight 285 lbs when he dies. NOT TRUE. He dies , at age 72, because he fell and hit his head. He did not wake from his coma. He did not weight 285lbs. Any fool can see that as he was filmed shortly before his death. Drug treatment did bloat him. The Independent newspaper pointed out that if he did have heart disease, what has that got to do with anything? Would you say an oncologist was no good because they die of cancer? In the end, there will always be the scare stories, the knockers, those with an agenda. People ahve to make up their own minds and those of us that have been released from this food merrygoround can just reap the rewards and smile to ourselves. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:21:57 -0500 From: "Maggie McNally" Subject: RE: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) Oh, Chris, I'm so sorry that you have lost your beloved Buttons. I've got tears for your loss and in remembrance of similar losses I have experienced. I applaud your wisdom - know that you made the right decision. The picture is lovely, particularly so with Buttons' black beauty set against the flowers. Maggie "Cats give a home a heartbeat." - -----Original Message----- From: Chris Marshall [mailto:chris@hatstand.org] Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 5:33 AM To: jmdl list; NortheastJonifest@yahoogroups.com Subject: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) The day I've been dreading arrived today: at nearly 17 years of age, Buttons - my old black moggy - had to be put to sleep. His kidneys had been gradually getting worse and he had a stiff back leg, but for a long time was still a happy, if cranky, old man. Yesterday he stopped eating, was throwing up, and all but lost the use of his back legs - all pretty much at the same time. My feeling, and that of the vet and others, was that it was probably kinder to let him go now rather than prolong things and have his quality of life suffer through trying to patch him up, probably repeatedly. http://www.hatstand.org/albums/cats/DCP_1181.sized.jpg I imagine he's spending his time weeing on the great living room carpet in the sky now, perhaps getting John Moore's little scally, Dealer, into trouble in his spare time :) - --Chris Marshall chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:41:05 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Harry's House and Hissing I asked "I wonder why she separated THOSL and Harry's House with The Boho Dance (which feels to me like it belongs on the side with Jungle Line and Edith)." Then I remembered - The Segue. Well, I can hear The Segue II coming between THOSL and HH - Darkness, Darkness, Darkness.......WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Bobsart How about the other side, where Boho segues into Scarlett - I think that can be managed, too - or are there key change issues ? ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:49:53 -0500 From: Gary Zack Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Yes Jerry, it was Trisha not Wynnona who recorded "Down On My Knees." I guess I got my country ladies mixed up! Beth is definitely someone worth discovering! Best, Gary Jerry Notaro wrote: >I have been a long time fan of Beth NC and have posted about her in the past >to little comment. I'm glad she is gaining popularity. She had made it, in >my mind, when Trisha Yearwood recorded Down On My Knees for her first cd. >One of Beth's most beautiful songs. > >Jerry, still reeling from seeing Cyndi Lauper and her At Last tour last >night from the 12th row! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:03:06 -0500 (EST) From: notaro@stpt.usf.edu Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Quoting Gary Zack : > Yes Jerry, it was Trisha not Wynnona who recorded "Down On My Knees." I > > guess I got my country ladies mixed up! Beth is definitely someone > worth discovering! Hi gary, Ironically, I posted mine before you did. So it was a coincidence and not a correction! But a wonderful coincidence. So great to see so many posts about this immensely talented lady. She has many fans on this list, and many big names in Nashville that support her. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:30:42 -0500 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: tofu njc >Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:33:03 -0800 (PST) >From: Catgirl >Subject: Re: all this talk about beef. NJC >I have not had a peice of bacon in over 15 years. I gave that up befor I >gave >up the chicken. Pigs are smarter then dogs and to think the poor life they >live, I could ne ver eat them. I would one day like to have one as a pet. >I >live near Hatfield Meat Packing and they KILL over 70,000 female pigs a >day. It >is so sad. I beleive everything in moderation and cheese does not have >alot of carbs in it >nor does any animal die from the making of cheese. And TOFU, yet again >there >re so many tofu choices. If you have never tried tofu then you might want >to >take a plunge and try it. If you buy at the groceries, get Tofu Mate and >use >that with the tofu. It makes the tofu YUMMY! >Debi Thanks Debi. For those of you motivated to cook something made of tofu, be sure to drain all of the water out of it first. Drain it and squeeze it gently. . and then pat it dry with a towel . . G E T T H E W A T E R O U T And then it will absorb the other flavors that you mix with it. Uh hum, I think about the brutality involved with slaughtering and eating animals. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:57:12 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Harry's House and Hissing Man, I've got a hankerin' to play this CD now! :~) I think really that you can sequence the songs on HOSL in any order and it works, because they don't really tell a "start- to-finish" story per se but rather examine a similar theme through several different references & profiles. You're right about the title track being underrated, but then again isn't ALL of Joni's work underrated, excepting for BSN, BYT, and a (small) handful of others? The line that always stuck out to me is the one about the room full of Chippendale furniture that nobody sits in - reminds me of my Uncle Bill's house, where there was a "purple room" that none of us kids were allowed in, with special furniture, artifacts and such. Bob NP: Little Feat, "Day At The Dog Races" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:56:46 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Thanks Gary! I remember part of the chorus went "Walk My Way" or "Look My Way" but I can't remember anything else but the fantastic beat she had on the song. Now I'm getting perplexed! I need to go try to find a sound bite! Love, Sherelle >From: Gary Zack >To: Sherelle Smith >CC: anima_rising@yahoo.ca, joni@smoe.org >Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC >Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:01:05 -0500 > >Yes, Beth is a great singer/songwriter! I believe the song that got a lot >of airplay that you mentioned was called "I Keep Coming Back To You." I >remember that when I heard it I thought she sounded so much like Jennifer >Warnes on that particular track, who is also one of my big favorites. The >song is from her first self-titled album. On the same album is a song >called "Down On My Knees" which is also lovely. I believe Wynnona Judd >also covered that song. > >Best regards, > >Gary >Detroit > >Sherelle Smith wrote: > >> >>I love it!!!! I agree with 100% about her voice and who it reminds you of. >>Beth also had a top 40 hit whose title I can't remember but the melody and >>beat were very unique. I'm glad she is still performing and that she is a >>survivor. >> >>Sherelle >> >>Catherine wrote: >> >>Last night I saw Beth Nielsen Chapman at Hugh's Room >>here in Toronto with a couple of friends. I wasn't all >>that familiar with her work, but one of her songs had >>been used as an example in a songwriting seminar I >>went on back in the fall with one of the same friends >>I saw her with last night. >> >>I was absolutely blown away by this woman. She is an >>amazingly versatile singer with a beautiful voice >>(sounds to me, a bit like Jennifer Warnes), who writes >>lovely music with very touching, very human and very >>heartfelt lyrics and not a bit of bullshit. She is >>also an excellent guitarist and piano player... who >>doesn't read music and "writes" all her songs by >>recording them as she works them out. Performing with >>her was her son, Ernest Chapman, who is about 23 or so >>and looks a lot like her, and a guy by the name of >>John Raguzzo (I think that's his last name) on wind >>instruments of all kinds (flutes, piccolos, trumpet >>and conch shell - who would believe you could get so >>many tones out of a shell!) >> >>_________________________________________________________________ >>Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. >>http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ >> > > _________________________________________________________________ Click, drag and drop. My MSN is the simple way to design your homepage. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200364ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:00:39 -0500 (EST) From: notaro@stpt.usf.edu Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Quoting Sherelle Smith : > Thanks Gary! I remember part of the chorus went "Walk My Way" The closest thing she ever had to a hit. Great song with a great hook. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:03:14 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Hi Catherine! I wasn't very familiar with her either. All I knew was that I liked her writing and her singing very much. I wish I could be that adventurous when purchasing a CD or going to a concert! I think that is an exciting mindset to have. When I shop for a CD or go to a concert, I am trying to create a memory or a collection. I usually have thought very long and hard about making the purchase. Very interesting! Sherelle >From: Catherine McKay >To: Sherelle Smith , Jonilist >Subject: re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC >Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:01:05 -0500 (EST) > > --- Sherelle Smith wrote: > > Hi Catherine! > > > > I love Beth Nielsen Chapman as well! She wrote and > > recorded a song called > > "Harbor of Each Other's Arms" that absolutely adore > >She did sing that one. I wasn't familiar enough with >her stuff before going to see her that I would have >been able to give a set list, but, now that you >mention it, she definitely sang that one. > >Sometimes I like going to see people I know very >little about, or buying a CD or a book based on a >hunch - it's like getting a surprise gift, and I've >never gone wrong going on instinct with stuff like >that (or hardly ever anyway!) > > >===== >Catherine >Toronto >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction > > > > >______________________________________________________________________ >Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:11:54 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) Dear Chris, I am so sorry to hear about Buttons. He was lucky to have owned you. May he rest in peace. love db >>> Chris Marshall 2/24/2004 4:32:58 AM >>> The day I've been dreading arrived today: at nearly 17 years of age, Buttons - my old black moggy - had to be put to sleep. His kidneys had been gradually getting worse and he had a stiff back leg, but for a long time was still a happy, if cranky, old man. Yesterday he stopped eating, was throwing up, and all but lost the use of his back legs - all pretty much at the same time. My feeling, and that of the vet and others, was that it was probably kinder to let him go now rather than prolong things and have his quality of life suffer through trying to patch him up, probably repeatedly. http://www.hatstand.org/albums/cats/DCP_1181.sized.jpg I imagine he's spending his time weeing on the great living room carpet in the sky now, perhaps getting John Moore's little scally, Dealer, into trouble in his spare time :) - --Chris Marshall chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ This message has been scanned by the E250. This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:40:01 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: i made it!!!!!!! njc Congratulations Wally! You go boy!! love ya, db This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:38:43 +0000 From: "Patricia Parlette" Subject: great audiences, njc i suppose Liebe Joni-lovers: I think you all will chuckle at how I first mis-read Hell's sign-off. Here is the real one as she wrote it: Hell (AKA Helen in NZ) ___________________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman And here it is as my eyes saw it at first glance: ____________________________________ "To have great posts, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman Cheers to the great audience that is the JMDL! Having a wonderful time, Patti _________________________________________________________________ Dream of owning a home? Find out how in the First-time Home Buying Guide. http://special.msn.com/home/firsthome.armx ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:46:56 +0000 From: "robin mortlock" Subject: Miss America - NJC Does anyone know of a late eighties album called Miss America by a certain Mary Margaret O'Hara. This, i believe, is her only album although someone said to me recently that she has done a soundtrack to a movie in the last months. Does anyone know this amazing album and if there are any secret recordings by MMO. Robin Where some may find their paradise, others just come to harm......... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:59:28 +0000 From: "Timothy Spong" Subject: light-jazzy husband-and-wife duo identified; was Maria Muldaur, Wendy Waldman... On Mon, 23 Feb 2004, "Maggie McNally" wrote (on Subject: RE: Maria Muldaur, Wendy Waldman - and Joni?): " Azeem - I used to own this album, but don't know if I still do. I'll have to look in the cabinet when I get home. But I do know the song you refer to (Mad, Mad Me). I cannot think of what song you are thinking of. I[t] reminds me of Roberta Flack or that light-jazzy husband and wife duo where he plays guitar and she sings (oh lordy, cannot remember their name), maybe, but Joni? If you think of it (or anyone else does) I'm dying to know." Almost surely, Maggie refers to Tuck and Patti. See www.tuckandpatti.com. Now, I receive the only-Joni Digest, and this question may have already been answered. Tim Spong Dover, Del., U.S.A. _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:59:14 -0600 From: Steve Polifka Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC What about No System For Love? that's the song I heard on the radio and I had to hunt it down because the CD had just come out. It's very Joniesque in a way... Steve At 11:00 AM 2/24/2004 -0500, notaro@stpt.usf.edu wrote: >Quoting Sherelle Smith : > >> Thanks Gary! I remember part of the chorus went "Walk My Way" > >The closest thing she ever had to a hit. Great song with a great hook. > >Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:01:20 -0500 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: RE: tofu njc >>I have not had a peice of bacon in over 15 years. I gave that up befor I >>gave >>up the chicken. Pigs are smarter then dogs and to think the poor life >>they >>live, I could ne ver eat them. I would one day like to have one as a pet. >> I >>live near Hatfield Meat Packing and they KILL over 70,000 female pigs a >>day. Debi > > > > >Thanks Debi. > >For those of you motivated to cook something made of tofu, be sure to drain >all of the water out of it first. Drain it and squeeze it gently. . and >then pat it dry with a towel . . >And then it will absorb the other flavors that you mix with it. > >Uh hum, I think about the brutality involved with slaughtering and eating >animals. >Marianne I know what you mean..I love tofu on a bun with mustard and.. oh...tofu and chips....tofu tar tar..surf and tofu....blackened tofu...tlt..A TLT..tofu ..lettuce and tomato. In all seriousness..I try to avoid meats such as veal...I won't go into the brutality of that..no doubt inhumane..and such things as lobster. But I do think animals were put here for many reasons and one reason is for our consumption. I do admire vegetarians..i really do..their heart is in the right place. My late great sister.. whom I adored was a very committed vegetarian,. AND the love of my life is also a comitted vegetarian. (who will not let me share the same grill with her. ;-) Love to all.. Bree _________________________________________________________________ >Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. >http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx _________________________________________________________________ Stay informed on Election 2004 and the race to Super Tuesday. http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:10 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Hi Jerry! I think I remember that thread and am happy to say that I'm pretty sure I responded. I really like her and I think she has such a fantastic voice and great songwriting ability! I don't think I've ever heard "Down On My Knees" but I sure would like to. I see myself adding her music to my CD collection. I really like her! P.S...I'm so glad that you had the chance to see Cyndi Lauper. She is someone whose talent I feel is off the charts. I'm still blown away by her rendition of "Carey" (sp?) during Joni's tribute. I still get goosebumps thinking about it..so original! Sherelle >From: Jerry Notaro >To: Catherine McKay , Sherelle Smith >, Joni List >Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC >Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:20:16 -0500 > >I have been a long time fan of Beth NC and have posted about her in the >past >to little comment. I'm glad she is gaining popularity. She had made it, in >my mind, when Trisha Yearwood recorded Down On My Knees for her first cd. >One of Beth's most beautiful songs. > >Jerry, still reeling from seeing Cyndi Lauper and her At Last tour last >night from the 12th row! > _________________________________________________________________ Get fast, reliable access with MSN 9 Dial-up. Click here for Special Offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:07:13 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC Hi Steve! I've never heard of this song...Man! That's it, I'm looking her up on Amazon.com! I would love to hear a Joniesque type song from Beth! Thanks for letting us know about it! Sherelle >From: Steve Polifka >To: notaro@stpt.usf.edu, Sherelle Smith >CC: nyro_in_detroit@sbcglobal.net, anima_rising@yahoo.ca, joni@smoe.org >Subject: Re: Beth Nielsen Chapman NJC >Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:59:14 -0600 > >What about No System For Love? that's the song I heard on the radio and I >had to hunt it down because the CD had just come out. It's very Joniesque >in a way... >Steve > > > >At 11:00 AM 2/24/2004 -0500, notaro@stpt.usf.edu wrote: > >Quoting Sherelle Smith : > > > >> Thanks Gary! I remember part of the chorus went "Walk My Way" > > > >The closest thing she ever had to a hit. Great song with a great hook. > > > >Jerry > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get fast, reliable access with MSN 9 Dial-up. Click here for Special Offer! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:08:25 -0600 From: Steve Polifka Subject: Re: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) Isn't that the truth about cats? they own you/ adopt you/ love you/ depend on you/ fuck with you/play with you (and your mind-my favorite trait). I've been without Melissa, my black/chocolate brown companion for 16 years now. We spent 13 great years together. She was more like a dog than a cat-always vying for my attention- answering the phone, sitting on top of an open door and stare down at you like a vulture, play fetch and badmitton (over the back of a directors chair) grab and run with the TP all through the house- never a dull moment... I still miss her and sometimes, she comes back to me in my dreams... Steve At 10:11 AM 2/24/2004 -0600, Donna Binkley wrote: >Dear Chris, > >I am so sorry to hear about Buttons. He was lucky to have owned you. >May he rest in peace. > >love db > >>>> Chris Marshall 2/24/2004 4:32:58 AM >>> >The day I've been dreading arrived today: at nearly 17 years of age, >Buttons - my old black moggy - had to be put to sleep. > >His kidneys had been gradually getting worse and he had a stiff back >leg, but for a long time was still a happy, if cranky, old man. >Yesterday he stopped eating, was throwing up, and all but >lost the use of his back legs - all pretty much at the same time. > >My feeling, and that of the vet and others, was that it was probably >kinder to let him go now rather than prolong things and have his >quality of life suffer through trying to patch him up, probably >repeatedly. > >http://www.hatstand.org/albums/cats/DCP_1181.sized.jpg > >I imagine he's spending his time weeing on the great >living room carpet in the sky now, perhaps getting John >Moore's little scally, Dealer, into trouble in his spare >time :) > >--Chris Marshall > >chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) > >"If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" > Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" > Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ > > >This message has been scanned by the E250. > > > > >This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:51:01 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: tofu njc If you do an internet seacrh on Soya, you might be shocked at what you find out and strike this item from your menu..... - -- bw colin http://www.btinternet.com/~tantraapso/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:53:52 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: tofu njc Bree Mcdonough wrote: > and such things as lobster. > I recently found out, when saying \i wouldn't eat lobester, that they have no nerve endsings so don't feel anything when dropoped in the boiling water...still puts me off tho. It came up cos I was tlaking about being in a restaurant in France where we wewre seated nexted to tank with lobaster and crabs in it. We asked to be moved but they didn't so we left. > > > > > bw colin > http://www.btinternet.com/~tantraapso ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:59:14 +0000 From: colin Subject: pup update njc Both litters arrived on saturday. i wa sup and down stairs all day/night. Napoli had 3 boys and 3 girls and so did Nechung. Unfortunate;y, one of nechung's did not make it and one is still touch and go. They were too early and 6 was a bit much for such a small girl. Due to being early, Nechung's tits engorged(blood not milk) making them very tender and dry-no milk. So every 2 hrs day and night, I have been bottle feeding them. Excpet for the one little girl, the others are doing well. I have been giving her hormone shots 6 times a day yesterdya and today and now her milk is coming in. The little girl is strong but only weighs 3.5ozs. She sucks like mad tho on the bottle. so hopefully..... At times like this i swear i will never breed another litter...at lerast not till the next time..... bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:24:13 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: Buttons/Cat thread (NJC) Steve this reminds me of Snowpuff, my beloved kitty who was also with me for 13 years and she still visits me in dreams. My great aunt (also beloved to me) painted her portrait from a photo I took of her. It has the most honored place in my home. I wrote to the list about her in our cat thread a couple of weeks ago, she was the one who played chased with my pet rabbit. I still miss her sometimes. love ya, db >>> Steve Polifka 2/24/2004 11:08:25 AM >>> Isn't that the truth about cats? they own you/ adopt you/ love you/ depend on you/ fuck with you/play with you (and your mind-my favorite trait). I've been without Melissa, my black/chocolate brown companion for 16 years now. We spent 13 great years together. She was more like a dog than a cat-always vying for my attention- answering the phone, sitting on top of an open door and stare down at you like a vulture, play fetch and badmitton (over the back of a directors chair) grab and run with the TP all through the house- never a dull moment... I still miss her and sometimes, she comes back to me in my dreams... Steve At 10:11 AM 2/24/2004 -0600, Donna Binkley wrote: >Dear Chris, > >I am so sorry to hear about Buttons. He was lucky to have owned you. >May he rest in peace. > >love db > >>>> Chris Marshall 2/24/2004 4:32:58 AM >>> >The day I've been dreading arrived today: at nearly 17 years of age, >Buttons - my old black moggy - had to be put to sleep. > >His kidneys had been gradually getting worse and he had a stiff back >leg, but for a long time was still a happy, if cranky, old man. >Yesterday he stopped eating, was throwing up, and all but >lost the use of his back legs - all pretty much at the same time. > >My feeling, and that of the vet and others, was that it was probably >kinder to let him go now rather than prolong things and have his >quality of life suffer through trying to patch him up, probably >repeatedly. > >http://www.hatstand.org/albums/cats/DCP_1181.sized.jpg > >I imagine he's spending his time weeing on the great >living room carpet in the sky now, perhaps getting John >Moore's little scally, Dealer, into trouble in his spare >time :) > >--Chris Marshall > >chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) > >"If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" > Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" > Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ > > >This message has been scanned by the E250. > > > > >This message has been scanned by the E250. > > This message has been scanned by the E250. This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:29:12 -0600 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: pup update njc Colin, - thanks for the "Pupdate". Are you a veterinarian? If not you are certainly an honorary. Take care of the little babies, hope they will grow up strong, db >>> colin 2/24/2004 11:59:14 AM >>> Both litters arrived on saturday. i wa sup and down stairs all day/night. Napoli had 3 boys and 3 girls and so did Nechung. Unfortunate;y, one of nechung's did not make it and one is still touch and go. They were too early and 6 was a bit much for such a small girl. Due to being early, Nechung's tits engorged(blood not milk) making them very tender and dry-no milk. So every 2 hrs day and night, I have been bottle feeding them. Excpet for the one little girl, the others are doing well. I have been giving her hormone shots 6 times a day yesterdya and today and now her milk is coming in. The little girl is strong but only weighs 3.5ozs. She sucks like mad tho on the bottle. so hopefully..... At times like this i swear i will never breed another litter...at lerast not till the next time..... bw colin This message has been scanned by the E250. This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:45:28 -0600 From: "mackoliver" Subject: Re: Buttons the cat, R.I.P. (NJC) My Prissy was my best friend, the best I ever had. 14 and 1/2 years she shared with me. Gone to another place for nearly three years now. Still miss her, look about for her, wait for her. Still can't even think of having another cat. mack ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:13:41 EST From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: From Walt -- not a letter to you, but at least one *from* me(njc, 6969) Better Living Through... Disgruntled Letter-Writing (From the Better Living series, )2004 by Walter Breen) An Open Letter to Gov. Arnold Shwartzenegger Tuesday, February 24, 2004 San Francisco, CA Dear Gov. Schwartzenegger: I've never written a letter to a governor before, although heaven knows I've composed them in my head. But the appearance of two stories on the front page of yesterday's San Francisco Chronicle has led me to write this letter. The concepts I'm going to talk about are basic, and given your well-documented difficulty with English, and my background in ESL (I beg you, Governor, find time in your busy schedule to take some evening classes!), I'll try to keep the language simple as well. The two headlines in question are: Governor Fears Unrest Unless Same-Sex marriages Are Halted and President of Foreign Origin?/Schwartzenegger favors change to Constitution Wow, Governor! Two stories featuring you on the front page of a more-or-less major newspaper in one day! The first story quotes you as having said "All of a sudden, we see riots, we see protests, we see people clashing. The next thing we know, there is injured or there is dead people. We don't want it to get to that extent." You said this on NBC's "Meet the Press" on Sunday morning. First of all, since I promised myself I wouldn't, I won't comment on any grammatical mistakes, as hard as it is for me as a retired teacher of English. So I'll get straight to the facts: As Hallye Jordan, spokesperson for State Attorney General Lockyer said when she heard of your comments on "Meet the Press", What riots? What protests? What people clashing? True, on Friday, some 25 people were arrested for blocking the door of the county clerk's office, but that was peaceful (if annoying). The only people probably trying to foment violence are that "Reverend" Jim Phelps guy, the one who goes to prominent gay funerals, such as Matthew Shepard's in Wyoming some time back, and has his klan of buddies (and their children!!) hold up signs saying "God Hates Faggots", and the like. If you're worried about violence, ask him and his friends to leave! What I've seen on the news is happy, smiling people getting married and therefore suddenly gaining a whole bunch of civil rights previously denied them. You see, there is a difference between a civil marriage and a religious marriage. A religious marriage gives you recognition of your union within your chosen church; a civil marriage gives you recognition under the law, so that you can get all sorts of tax breaks, and so you can't be prevented from visiting your beloved in the hospital, and so that you can adopt children as a couple so that if one of you dies, the kids can't be taken away from the other, among many, many other rights. Some people don't think gay people should have any of these rights. Well, it's a free country, as people in the United States have a habit of saying (without really thinking about what it means). However, some people want to keep gay people from getting married, even in the civic sense, anywhere in the country. Some people want to pass a law (charmingly called the Defense of Marriage Act -- these people aren't defending marriage, they're trying to keep other people from getting married!) or even an amendment to the constitution (!!! - -- Maybe Maria can explain how unusual amendments are, and how hard they are to pass, now that she has stepped down as a reporter and can devote herself full-time to helping you be Governor), both the proposed law and the proposed amendment basically saying that only one man and one woman can get married, and in case any place in the country decides it's time to give a sizable portion of the country's population full civil-marriage rights, that the other states can ignore their marriage. Wow! Pre-emptive law! ("Pre-emptive" means before the fact; for example, a pre-emptive strike would be dropping bombs on some place with people in it because some of those people might drop bombs on you, if they have bombs, at some unspecified time in the future.) This may seem like a sudden shift in topics, Governor, but did you know that February is Black History Month? I bet you get cable TV down there in L.A., and I also bet you get several PBS channels. Well, in February each year, they show lots and lots of shows about how black people were treated in the history of the United States (and actually, for quite a few years before the U.S. even existed). When those black people who were slaves were freed (by the Emancipation Proclamation, by President Lincoln, on 1/1/1863... perhaps, again, Maria can help you with the details), some of the white people, particularly but by no means exclusively in the South, weren't thrilled with the idea of black people being citizens, and therefore having the right to vote, and getting the same public education as white people, among other things. Some of the white people in some states came up with some pretty creative ways to keep black people from voting, or from going to their children's public schools. Things started getting tense in the 1950's and '60's, when various presidents started telling the people in those states that enough was enough, and that by federal law that had to stop jerking black people around. Some nasty stuff happened -- people were terrorized, some were killed. But in the long run, common sense prevailed, and now it's even considered in bad taste to tell racist jokes in public! (Although I bet you've heard some great ones on the sets of movies you've made -- you probably already know this, but if you remember any of those jokes, keep them to yourself!! Maria will back me up on this one.) Do you see why I brought up Black History Month, Governor? It's not (I can't emphasize this enough) because gay people have had a necessarily parallel history with black people in this country. Most obviously, it's hard to "pass" (which means to get away with pretending you're a member of a majority group) if you have brown or black skin; it's a lot easier to "pass" if you're gay, and that's what most gay people did until quite recently. In any case, we've never, for example, been denied the right to vote. But still, we don't have a lot of the same rights as other people, including the civil rights entailed with getting married. If some people don't want gay people to get married in church, fine, let those people, gay and straight, fight that issue out in their respective churches. But to pre-emptively deny any segment of the population basic civil rights is wrong. If it is law (such as Proposition 22 here in California, of the Defense of Marriage Act), it is bad law, and sooner or later it will be abolished. How would you rather be remembered in history, as a governor who helped to end pointless discrimination against a sizable minority group in your state, or as one who upheld that discrimination? That's pretty much up to you -- I'm not naive, I know politics are involved here, and the recently elected Mayor of San Francisco is not hurting his chances of re-election by letting gay people get married here, but by coincidence, it's also the right thing to do. So please, think about it. And finally, with respect to the second front-page story, and changing the Constitution so that people not born in the U.S., such as yourself, can be elected President: As I mentioned above, it's hard to add an amendment to the Constitution. But clearly, you like the idea of the law being changed to give you (here we come full circle!) a new civil right -- in this case, the right to run for President. You already have most civil rights of a citizen of the U.S., since you are one. Imagine how you'd feel if you lacked a lot of rights! One more word about running for President: I hope for Maria and the children's sake, you opt out on that one. If you thought the press was harsh on your treatment of women and your positive thoughts on Hitler while you were running for Governor of California, it'll be a lot worse if you run for President. And to come full circle one more time, have Maria "brief" you on Hitler's record concerning the civil rights (including, ultimately, the right to live) of Jews, Gypsies and gays. More food for thought, perhaps. Best wishes to you and your family, Walter J. Breen, Jr. ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2004 #86 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)