From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #39 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, January 22 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 039 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: On inventing chords - Hejira analysis - CORRECTION ["Marian Russell" ] Re: why would someone be cutting at a party? ["mike pritchard" ] Re: Joni and the Raelians [Catherine McKay ] Re: why would someone be cutting at a party? [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Joni for Kids, now Posall & Mosalm [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: On inventing chords - Amelia analysis [Jenny Goodspeed ] Re: Joni for Kids, now Posall & Mosalm [Randy Remote ] Re: Hot topic of the day NJC [vince ] Re: Songs to aging Children (shudder) Come. now njc [Catherine McKay ] Re: Hot topic of the day NJC ["Lori Fye" ] Hell test (njc) ["Sue Cameron" ] Wally's posts and AOL [PassScribe@aol.com] RE: Hot topic of the day NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] RE: Beat the blues, njc ["Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" ] RE: What we all do for a living (njc) [Catherine McKay ] Re: Hell test (njc) ["kakki" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 04:08:45 -0500 From: "Marian Russell" Subject: Re: On inventing chords - Hejira analysis - CORRECTION The first intro chord of Hejira is ii of the tonic (tonic is C). The second intro chord is major and a half-tone above the ii, which isn't III of the tonic. It's an example of chromaticism. Howard calls it Eb6/9 in his transcription. It can be related to the key of C as the IV/IV/IV - i.e. the sub-dominant of Bb which is the sub-dominant of F which is the sub-dominant of C. I don't know if you can do this in music theory, though! Maybe we could also call it a Bb6/9/sus4, which would make it only the IV/IV in the key of C. Anyway, it's just an intro chord and does not define the tonic for Hejira. The main chord progressions of Hejira are basically I, IV, V, as I said before. Marian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 10:12:35 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: why would someone be cutting at a party? I once had a very old copy of 'Brewer's Fact and Fable' and it mentioned many different types of 'cuts' (meaning here ways of averting the eyes from or ignoring the 'victim'; 'cutting someone dead', rather than merely being cutting). One I remember was the 'cut sublime' in which the cutter looks heavenward in order to avoid the cutee's eyes. Any librarians out there have this available? I'd like to know the other types. mike np - Fred Simon - Michael from Mountains ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 09:31:46 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Tamsin=20Lucas?= Subject: Re: What do we all do for a living (NJC) I work for an American games publisher, UK head office is in the world's worst town (Slough) so that's where I spend my days. I am a localisation manager so I project manage the European conversions of our games. Outside of my work I like to dance (jive), do yoga and generally try to be healthy - follow a vegan diet. Thanks so much to everyone who welcomed me back, I'm experiencing a bit of a life change at the moment having moved to a new town and also going through the break up of my relationship - looking to some Joni lyrics to help me through x - --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 21:28:14 +1100 From: "Dylan Rush" Subject: Joni and the Raelians Remember the Raelians, the weird cult from outerspace who claimed to have cloned a human baby? They've just opened a radio station in Australia, I noticed this in the Sydney Morning Herald: "The Raelians have hit the radiowaves. Spike was contacted yesterday by DJ and "guide" Tora Blackman with news that the local arm of the cult, which believes humans were created by an alien super race, has been preaching to late-night listeners in Lismore. Blackman has held the Sunday night slot on FM 2NCR for the past five weeks and told Spike she spends her two-hour program "informing people about the message that we are a deliberate scientific creation from another humanity in space". She also raps lyrical with her message of "self-responsibilisation", in between tunes by the Black Eyed Peas, JONI MITCHELL and Celine Dion. Curiously, though, she is yet to play hip-hop singer Lauryn Hill, who was recently anointed as the Raelians' "honorary guide" for criticising the Catholic Church." wow... wonder which joni song it was? probably "man from mars" *boom-tish* _________________________________________________________________ E-mail just got a whole lot better. New ninemsn Premium. Click here http://ninemsn.com.au/premium/landing.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 07:07:36 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Joni and the Raelians --- Dylan Rush wrote: > Remember the Raelians, the weird cult from > outerspace who claimed to have > cloned a human baby? ... > She also raps lyrical with her message of > "self-responsibilisation", in > between tunes by the Black Eyed Peas, JONI MITCHELL > and Celine Dion. Or maybe "Judgment of the moon and stars", "Moon at the window" or "God must be a boogie man." ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:03:49 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: why would someone be cutting at a party? > np - Fred Simon - Michael from Mountains > > Mike, > > How wonderful to see Fred9s name here. For those who are new, Fred, who lives > in Chicago, is, along with David Lahm and Roberto Holliston, one of our > 3Premier Pianists2 on the list. > > Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:50:05 EST From: MINGSDANCE@aol.com Subject: Joni mention in the Out traveler Yesterday my Advocate arrived and with it the Out Traveler came as well. On page 26 Side by Side has gay sites in the Village and Chelsea. It says Hotel Chelsea on 23rd street, which housed Tennessee Williams, Robert Mapplrthorpe, Joni Mitchell and Janis Joplin. Yes Gays' are so much fun:~)! Peace Mingus ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 14:49:14 -0000 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Re: Joni for Kids I've just stumbled on this site http://users3.ev1.net/~wbthomp/LP-LIST-1981.html where the writer [Bill Thompson of The Thompsonian Institution] claims to have donated, amongst others, a vinyl album by Joni called 'THE POSALL AND THE MOSALM' to his local library, which subsequently "burned to the ground". Are these the 2nd Fret recordings? Do any drawings of her "little woman creature petal thing" exist? - I see a lovely children's picture book. very best PaulC PMSIALL or MMSIALM (perhaps my soul is a little lady or maybe my soul is a little man) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 10:08:15 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni for Kids, now Posall & Mosalm Subject: Re: On inventing chords - Amelia analysis Dflahm@aol.com wrote:Recently, I have become increasingly suspicious that they are a useful labeling system with which we can assert briefly whether musical artifact A resembles or duplicates musical artifact B. They give us a terminology with which we can talk to each other. Perhaps no more than that, finito. It's nice to have a language for exploring certain sounds and chord progressions that resonate strongly in me. That's what is most interesting when analyzing Joni's music. And I come away having a larger toolbox to rummage through when writing myself. Dflahm@aol.com wrote:I believe I'd be receptive to an explanation of how theory accounts for the greatness and originality of JM's writing. Here's a link to an article Les brought to our attention a while back. It's a VERY academic analysis of Joni's compositional styles and use of harmony in her early career. on the pedantic side - but the author obviously also has a great respect and love for joni. http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=1056 Jenny also enjoying this thread Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:32:32 -0800 (PST) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: On inventing chords - Amelia analysis Well, I only have one year of formal study and that was 16 years ago, so I'm not much help in illuminating the Amelia analysis. But, I've been thinking about it since yesterday and I think what Joni is doing in this song is technically modulating between C and G and even F. I am honestly fascinated by this and not trying to debate. I have a feeling there is more than one way to correctly analyze this song anyway because she hovers in between keys without committing fully to one. However, I'm not familiar with the term used to describe using chords related to the IV and V without firmly modualting, Marian. And this sounds like what is going on. So if you dig that up, let me know, I'd be interested. Jenny Marian Russell wrote: >Randy Remote wrote: >I agree that Amelia can be thought of as being in C- >(although, in determining a key, 99% of the time, the >key is the same as the first chord, so; Dm, but >close enough). Well, if we think of "the first chord", I would rather go with G - where she starts singing. Most of Joni's songs have some kind of cute introduction that is not always repeated later and doesn't always define the key of the song. But if we go with G as being the root, then it's harder to explain the Bbmaj and the F, although the F could be explained by thinking of the song as being in mixolydian mode, as Jenny said. I think the Eb that I mentioned is actually more of a Bbsus4. I was trying to explain the Bb as the IV/IV - the sub-dominant of the sub-dominant F in the key of C and the Bm as the iii/V (the minor third of the dominant G of the key of C). It is usual in music to have chords related to the IV and the V of the root without modulating firmly into either the IV or the V. There is terminology for this in my music theory books at home. I will try to find it. Would love to hear from anyone with more recent study of music theory (mine is about 25 years old!). Marian Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 10:05:06 -0800 From: "Russell Bowden" Subject: Songs to aging Children (shudder) Come. JC= song titles Gang, This should get me banned from the list.......OK....so I'm one of those rotten nasty people who is all for ZERO POPULATION GROWTH...I mean...where the hell are these little people going to live in 30 or 40 years?? STOP THE MADNESS.....ADOPT!!!!!!!!!!! Songs for people who are thinking about have a dozen kids or so: Little Green Chinese Cafe Ethiopia Sex Kills Chalk Mark in a Rainstorm (Beat of Black Wings) The Fiddle and the Drum Harry's House ...and they might try reading that forgotten classic...The Populaiton Bomb by Paul Erlich..I think. Russ in Hawai'i.....where there is apparently no such thing as birth control. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Rethink your business approach for the new year with the helpful tips here. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 14:02:19 -0500 From: "Marian Russell" Subject: Re: On inventing chords - Amelia analysis On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:32:32 -0800 (PST), Jenny Goodspeed wrote: >However, I'm not familiar with the term used to >describe using chords related to the IV and V >without firmly modualting, Marian. And this >sounds like what is going on. So if you dig >that up, let me know, I'd be interested. Okay. From Piston, Harmony, Fourth Edition: The Nonmodulating sequence [this is about sequences - i.e., repeated melodic patterns - actually, but I think it pertains - I can probably find something more], p 298: "The sequence is either a modulating sequence, ***changing the tonal center with each transposition of the pattern***, or a nonmodulating sequence, sometimes called a tonal sequence, with one tonal center throughout. "In the nonmodulating sequence, the transpositions oare made to degrees of the scale of the key... "...The nonmodulating sequence is likely to contain variation, too, in the interval of transposition of the pattern... "...The employment of secondary dominants in the nonmodulating sequence adds the harmonic color of tones foreign to the scale of the main tonality, contributes the rhythmic element of dissonance, and emphasizes the unity of the group of chords comprising the pattern....." Then there are some examples given of nonmodulating sequences where the chords in Bb are: V of VI, VI, V of IV, IV, V of II, II .... D7 , gm , Bb7 , Eb, G7 , cm These kinds of chord changes seem even more dramatic than the chord progressions of Amelia, and yet the tonal center of this example is given as Bb. Marian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 14:06:28 -0500 (EST) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: RE: What we all do for a living (njc) OK, I'll play... I'm a technical writer. I write software documentation, having worked on the product that our own Les Irvin uses for a lot of stuff. (Bless his heart!) Right now, I'm slogging through thousands of lines of ActionScript code, inserting comments. Fun. Not. Thinking of all the great things I could have been instead. (I was a teacher. LOVED it!!!! But not the pay...) Maybe I should have been a cat vet. Or conductor of the Boston Pops. Or, hey, why not "lottery winner?" lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:16:34 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Hot topic of the day NJC "If judges insist on forcing their arbitrary will upon the people, the only alternative left to the people would be the constitutional process. Our nation must defend the sanctity of marriage." GWB State of the Union January 2004 Marriage laws are something that has been discussed here many times before. My reaction is that king george has extended his reach into yet more places where it does not belong... He has slammed the authority of state judges, defined people as only those who agree with his narrow views (who are those who the judges are defending rather than forcing their arbitrary will upon...non-people?), & what the he@# is the federal gov't doing defining or defending marriage sanctity? Kate www.katebennett.com "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" The All Music Guide ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:29:49 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Joni for Kids, now Posall & Mosalm SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > Sort of...they are excerpts from the Gene Sciaky interviews > which also featured some of the Second Fret recordings. > > JMDLer's are fortunate to have these interviews and recordings > in their entirety as a result of the tape trees, which are > also available on CDR. Even better news is that the audio > quality of the recordings that we have access to is superior > to the Posall & Mosalm bootleg. ....which was quite bad ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:39:59 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Ani & Kathleen Edwards NJC Righteous Babe is streaming the entire new Ani Difranco CD, "Educated Guess" at this site: http://www.righteousbabe.com/ani/educated_guess/listen.html And on an unrelated note, I just picked up a CD called "Failer" from Kathleen Edwards, it came out about a year ago but it never hit my radar screen. Anyway, it's a great CD and would be highly recommended for anyone who likes Lucinda Williams. She's been described as Lucinda fronting Crazy Horse, and I can definitely hear where that is coming from. Like Joni, Kathleen is a Canadian import, from Ottawa. The SCJoniguy says check it out. Bob NP: Kathleen Edwards, "Mercury" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:52:05 -0500 From: "Richard Flynn" Subject: RE: Ani & Kathleen Edwards NJC I'll second the recommendation of "Failer." I've been listening to it for several months now. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of SCJoniGuy@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:40 PM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: Ani & Kathleen Edwards NJC Righteous Babe is streaming the entire new Ani Difranco CD, "Educated Guess" at this site: http://www.righteousbabe.com/ani/educated_guess/listen.html And on an unrelated note, I just picked up a CD called "Failer" from Kathleen Edwards, it came out about a year ago but it never hit my radar screen. Anyway, it's a great CD and would be highly recommended for anyone who likes Lucinda Williams. She's been described as Lucinda fronting Crazy Horse, and I can definitely hear where that is coming from. Like Joni, Kathleen is a Canadian import, from Ottawa. The SCJoniguy says check it out. Bob NP: Kathleen Edwards, "Mercury" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 17:11:49 -0500 From: vince Subject: Re: Hot topic of the day NJC The disrespect for the legal system reeks of contempt, especially by someone who ran to the court - it was Bush vs Gore, not Gore vs Bush - when it suited his own self Vince Kate Bennett wrote: >"If judges insist on forcing their arbitrary will upon the people, the >only alternative left to the people would be the constitutional process. >Our nation must defend the sanctity of marriage." GWB State of the Union >January 2004 > >Marriage laws are something that has been discussed here many times >before. My reaction is that king george has extended his reach into yet >more places where it does not belong... He has slammed the authority of >state judges, defined people as only those who agree with his narrow >views (who are those who the judges are defending rather than forcing >their arbitrary will upon...non-people?), & what the he@# is the federal >gov't doing defining or defending marriage sanctity? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 18:15:38 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Songs to aging Children (shudder) Come. now njc --- Russell Bowden wrote: > Gang, > > This should get me banned from the > list.......OK....so I'm one of > those rotten nasty people who is all for ZERO > POPULATION GROWTH...I > mean...where the hell are these little people going > to live in 30 or 40 > years?? STOP THE MADNESS.....ADOPT!!!!!!!!!!! They're gonna live in YOUR house dude, because you're gonna be in the home... that their tax dollars are subsidizing. So be nice to 'em! Catherine (who only has two and therefore satisfies the ZPG issue in any case.) ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 18:26:18 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Hot topic of the day NJC --- Kate Bennett wrote: > "If judges insist on forcing their arbitrary will > upon the people, the > only alternative left to the people would be the > constitutional process. > Our nation must defend the sanctity of marriage." > GWB State of the Union > January 2004 > > Marriage laws are something that has been discussed > here many times > before. My reaction is that king george has extended > his reach into yet > more places where it does not belong... Kate, this irritates the crap out of me too. All this blather about "defend[ing] the sanctity of marriage." Who makes it sacred? Who says it's sacred only if it's between one man and one woman? Is every marriage (between one man and one woman) sacred? who says so? We have a political party here in Canada, which has changed its name so many times with its various joinings-up and breakings-away-from other parties, but sometimes known as Reform, sometimes known as Canadian Alliance and now, I think, (but am not totally clear on this) that they've joined up with the Progressive Conservative party (but not all of them, hence my not-sureness). They recently sent out a flyer, that I got at home, going on about the same thing - defending "the sanctity of marriage." I really have to wonder just what it is exactly that these people fear so much, that they can fail to grasp that love and wanting to pledge yourself to someone, is not the exclusive domain of heterosexuals. A former Prime Minister of ours, Pierre Trudeau, said that the state has no business in the bedrooms of the nation. So I believe. Consenting adults - people in love! Maybe if these sanctimonious creatures looked inside their own hearts, they'd find a little there, and realize that we're all just human. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 17:07:29 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Hot topic of the day NJC What if ... just what if ... legalizing and recognizing marriage between two persons of the same sex actually ended up LOWERING the divorce rate in the U.S.? One wonders how the "moralists" would react then. Lori NPIMH: "Fiction" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 20:46:16 -0500 From: "Sue Cameron" Subject: Hell test (njc) http://www.madblast.com/funflash/swf/helltest.swf> http://www.madblast.com/funflash/swf/helltest.swf My score? A whopping 127, most of which were accrued at JoniFests around the world ;-) Suze n.p. Jonatha Brooke & The Story "Nothing Scared" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 21:30:54 EST From: PassScribe@aol.com Subject: Wally's posts and AOL << From: Emiliano Subject: Fw: What do we all do for a living (VLJC) (for AOL users) Wally says [remember, I'm only forwarding wally's posts since they don't make, strangely, their way to AOL users] >> Emiliano: I'm using a Mac on AOL and I read Wally"s posts with no problem. Kenny B ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 18:42:36 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: Hot topic of the day NJC I agree with you & Pierre...either gwb is trying to enlist the vsupport of the extreme conservative christians who belives that homesexuality is a sin or he really believes it himself...the scary part is what he may actually believe... "Bush believes he was called by God to lead the nation at this time" Commerce Secretary Don Evans (close friend who talks with Bush every day) "George Bush was not elected by a majority of the voters in the United States. He was appointed by God." -Lt. Gen. William Boykin, the defense undersecretary in charge of hunting down top terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan An article on who & what has influenced Bush's religious beliefs: http://www.counterpunch.org/hill01042003.html Catherine >>Pierre Trudeau, said that the state has no business in the bedrooms of the nation. So I believe. Consenting adults - people in love! Maybe if these sanctimonious creatures looked inside their own hearts, they'd find a little there, and realize that we're all just human.< ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 22:35:19 -0500 From: "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: RE: Beat the blues, njc Okay, I said yesterday's batch was the end, but here's another entry. Who else wants to add to the list? What do you do to fight back against the blues or depression? * Get on a motorbike & ride so fast you *daren't* think about anything else. All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu also known as The King of Pain ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 22:46:00 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: What we all do for a living (njc) I manage a bunch of writers and clerks in a government office. We respond to letters that people write to our minister. Our job is bureaucratic (we're silly servants), even though a cabinet minister is a political post. It's kind of like Public Relations and kind of like customer service. You have to try to respond to the questions people ask, or their comments, in the "voice" of the minister. A lot of the work we do is fairly thankless, because there's a lot of rewriting involved, to satisfy the countless minions that have to approve this stuff before the minister signs. There is great deal of quibbling over the placement of commas and so on. As a middle manager in that office, I get to listen to griping from above and below. My manager is a control freak and the general feeling we get from her is that we can't do a bloody thing right. There are many times I feel like hurling my computer through the window and jumping out after it. But there are times when the job is rewarding and transcends all that. Every so often, we get a letter or an e-mail from someone who really has a distressing problem that requires immediate resolution. Why anyone would write or e-mail a minister when they're in dire circumstances is as much a mystery to me as it probably is to you, but some people get quite desperate and think he's the only one that can help them (kind of like Obi Wan Kenobi, I guess.) I remember an e-mail we got from a guy who was really stressed. He had a child with severe physical and mental disabilities and he was at the end of his rope. I got a weird feeling about that one - I was just afraid the guy was desperate enough that he might harm the child. I got in touch with someone at the regional office who called the guy and got him some help, for him and for his child. We don't get that kind of thing too often but, when we do, and we can actually help someone who needs help, and not just spew political or bureacratic rhetoric about some gov't policy, or deal with people who are basically just whining about petty things, it makes up for the petty stuff. I think we were supposed to come up with a Joni connection. I can't think of one really! As for hobbies (I'm not fond of that word), I sing alto in a choir/class (it's kind of like a chamber choir, I guess). We do two or three concerts every year and we've just started our rep for the Jan-April term and are doing "black" music, including some South African stuff, some African-American/gospel stuff and some Motown. I also play guitar and sing for fun, by myself and with a friend of mine. I used to take classical guitar lessons but had to drop it this year due to lack of money. I have three cats, two teenaged kids and one dog. Zero husband. Like many others on this list, one of the first things I did when I got access to the internet was to do a search on "Joni Mitchell" and voila! found this place. And like so many others, I've made friends here - some I've met, some I haven't met yet. I've gained a lot of strength and courage since arriving at the jmdl and am thankful to be here. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 20:34:09 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Hot topic of the day NJC (& PC) > An article on who & what has influenced Bush's religious beliefs: > http://www.counterpunch.org/hill01042003.html Wow. That article captures perfectly why I am afraid of GW Bush and his posse. And it's not as if GW's belief that he is an agent of his god isn't widely known. The McLaughlin Group discussed this on television, although not in quite as much depth, just this past weekend. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2004 23:10:31 -0600 From: "Steve Anderson" Subject: Fw: Hot topic of the day NJC (& PC) This has all been publicized before and while I don't agree with hardly any of Bush's tactics or policies or ideas I question the validity and the prepartion that went into the article. For someone to study the book of Revelation and keep referring to it as the book of Revelations is somewhat akin to Dean talking about Job from the New Testament. Jesus said the meek would inherit the earth not the power hungry. As in the days of Jesus his followers wanted to set up an earthly kingdom and rule and reign and be in command of the world so does the Bush gospel. Similar to the Jehovah Witness'. Rather than be servants and examples of righteousness they wanted to be important and establish Jesus as King Of The Jews or Bush King of the World. Wouldn't be surprised if Bush turns out to be the political anti-christ (only a pawn in their game). Steve Anderson - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lori Fye" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 10:34 PM Subject: Re: Hot topic of the day NJC (& PC) > > An article on who & what has influenced Bush's religious beliefs: > > http://www.counterpunch.org/hill01042003.html > > Wow. That article captures perfectly why I am afraid of GW Bush and > his posse. > > And it's not as if GW's belief that he is an agent of his god isn't > widely known. The McLaughlin Group discussed this on television, > although not in quite as much depth, just this past weekend. > > Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 23:05:00 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Hell test (njc) I scored a dull "normal" 67 but must admit some of those points were accrued at Jonifests, too. LOL Kakki NP: Allison Krauss - Baby, Now That I've Found You Suze wrote: > My score? A whopping 127, most of which were accrued at > JoniFests around the world ;-) ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2004 #39 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)