From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2004 #34 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Monday, January 19 2004 Volume 2004 : Number 034 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- On Inventing chords, 100% Joni Content ["Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: Responses (NJC) ["Evan and Vanessa Thomson" ] Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame ["mike pritchard" ] Re: Political Lyrics Game and TTT [Melissa ] Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame ["Dylan Rush" ] What genre is Hejira? ["Dylan Rush" ] Re: Joni's techniques - picking and painting [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: Joni's techniques - picking and painting [Dflahm@aol.com] [none] [simon@icu.com] Martin Luther King and war - NJC ["Cynthia Vickery" ] Re: Miraculous Messages from Water NJC ["Norman Pennington" ] Re: What we do for a living (VLJC) [Musicloverrick@aol.com] Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc ["J.David Sapp" ] Re:what do we all do for a living njc [HOOPSJOHN1@aol.com] A question (NJC) ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Re: Martin Luther King and war - NJC [Susan Guzzi ] Some are friendly,some are cutting... ["anon anon" ] Re: A Question, please someone....NJC [dsk ] Re: Some are friendly,some are cutting... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: What genre is Hejira? ["amelio747" ] both planets now NJC ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Re: Play the "Joni's Political Lyrics" game! very little JC ["kakki" ] Re: birthday announcement NJC mgval [magsnbrei ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 03:06:42 -0500 From: "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: On Inventing chords, 100% Joni Content Hi Howard, It's been a long time since I've seen a post from you. If you haven't heard Marian Russell play Overture/Cotton Avenue, you should. Marian makes it look as easy as drinking a glass of ice water. It's totally organic. Her grace seems totally at odds with the percussive slaps- the tension that Joni puts in there. I write about it at least three times per year because my mouth fell open. Another great slapping song is after the birthday rap on MINGUS. There's an ambient effect then she starts barking and slapping "God Must Be A Boogie Man". Joni and Jaco barking at each other. Life doesn't get any better. I wonder if Monk ever heard that album. All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu From the UK, Howard said in part, >>When playing the electric, her style is certainly different. But personally, I think the change in her right-hand technique (intricate picking, then more rhythmic strumming/slapping) came about on the acoustic. Personally, I love her later style - the way she manages to combine a mini percussion section with the strumming, by tapping and slapping the strings, is a source of constant wonder to me. I'm a sucker for poly-rhythms and off-beat stuff > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 03:13:37 -0500 From: "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: RE: Beat the blues, njc More: * Love somebody. Smile. * Maintain an attitude of gratitude. * Gather with friends, either in person or online * Counting my blessings whenever possible * Music: Like Jackson Browne says, "let the music keep our spirits high", like JT says "singing works just fine for me" * Be kind to yourself. If you're beating yourself up, imagine saying the things you are saying to yourself to someone you love dearly. It sounds ridiculous doesn't it? So knock it off! All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu King of Pain ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 19:43:23 +1100 From: "Evan and Vanessa Thomson" Subject: Re: Responses (NJC) Kevin wrote: > Maybe there are some sharing people here, but I'm not having much success in > finding them when looking for trades in the USA. I have got 1 or 2 responses > from my posts, but for the most part it seems that this list is not much about > circulating Joni's music, but rather focused on various discussion topics and > those not neccasarily relating to Joni. This is a difficult one to respond too and yet simple as well. I personally respond to very little posts as I find my time limited. Being on digest also means that I don't respond to many as it's usually been answered or it's difficult for me to select what I would like to respond too so I guess I just let it go. I also find that I "rely" on other Listers to respond if I feel they are better qualified than I am in regards to the questions. I am making a concerted effort to try and participate and read the posts this year. Joni related topics can be few and far between for numerous reasons but I'd say the main one is because of Joni herself. She is not in the media very much and what press coverage or events she attends etc is rare. So while you can discuss what she does it can only be to a point. Now if she was Britney that opportunity to talk would be more numerous! I am one who posts rare Joni content only because I have little to say when I find quite a few posters express how I feel but more eloquently. I understand that "me too" posts can be "tiresome" :-) This is an intelligent list (visit the Dream Theatre List for inanity) in regards to the kinds of people who frequent it and from these latest "What People Do" posts a very diverse, interesting and multi talented list. It is also quite a close knit community which can sometimes give the impression of having an "inner circle". Some people have met and formed strong ties so I guess that gives people alot to discuss. I did read your initial post and I didn't respond as I have no trades to offer. I assumed that writing and telling you this was a moot point. Do people prefer a response even if a negative one or what I mean is a "I can't help" one? I guess I don't want to look like a dickhead so I chose silence. I hope my interpretation of why people chat about non Joni stuff more than circulating her music helped? Vanessa ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:45:50 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame >>Court and Spark in Grammy Hall of Fame<< How nice of the music 'industry' (sic) to name an award after Diane Keaton's grandmother. mike in barcelona NP Fairport Convention - Tam Lin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 20:24:36 +1100 From: Melissa Subject: Re: Political Lyrics Game and TTT Apologies if these have already been listed, but my contributions to the political lyrics game are: Raised on Robbery: They were pushing through a four lane highway Government gave us three thousand dollars You should have seen it fly away Chinese Cafe: Uranium money Is booming in the old home town now It's putting up sleek concrete Tearing the old landmarks down now Paving over brave little parks Ripping off Indian land again How long how long Short sighted business men Ah nothing lasts for long As for TTT, I too find it somewhat under-rated. I particularly love the lines in "Love Puts on a New Face": About a month or so later he said, "Why can't you be happy? You make me feel helpless when you get this way" I said, "I'm up to my neck in alligators - Jaws gnashing at me! Every one trying to pull a piece away!" Love the title track too! NP: TTT (of course!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 06:35:51 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame **Are there others like that ? I forget, but it seems like there must have been. Well, there's the segue from Otis & Marlena to Tenth World, and it probably doesn't count since you're talking about studio work, but the S&L trifecta of "Amelia/Pat's Solo/Hejira" is pretty darn swell too. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 23:31:37 +1100 From: "Dylan Rush" Subject: RE: C&S in Grammy Hall of Fame >As an aside, bringing up The Same Situation reminds me of my much I love >the way Joni from time to time segues one song into another: Such as Lesson >in Survival / Let the Wind Carry Me, and Boho Dance/Harry's House, in >addition to People's Parties/Same Situation. > >Are there others like that ? I forget, but it seems like there must have >been. The Trouble Child/Twisted segue is quite nice, but the all-time best Joni segue ever is Otis and Marlena/The Tenth World. In and out, in and out, those thundering piano chords, Joni's eery wailing, the percussion brooding underneath the surface, before it's final emergence and the eight minutes of glorious Latin fever that follows. One of the greatest moments on DJRD. _________________________________________________________________ ninemsn Premium transforms your e-mail with colours, photos and animated text. Click here http://ninemsn.com.au/premium/landing.asp ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 23:37:28 +1100 From: "Dylan Rush" Subject: What genre is Hejira? I've just been thinking about this... You really can't categorize Hejira can you? It's a style all it's own. It's not pop, it's not folk, it's not rock, it's not jazz, it's somewhere in between - it's just Joni. Or is there a word for that style of music? _________________________________________________________________ Hot chart ringtones and polyphonics. Go to http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilemania/default.asp ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 08:46:49 EST From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's techniques - picking and painting Howard posted: Later on, her guitar style is an audio equivalent of using broader brush strokes - less concerned with the exact details of which string to hit at each precise point, but more concerned with rhythmic, dynamic and textural effects. The analogy with her painting can't be taken too literally, but the amount of fine detail is certainly much, much less in her later paintings. I have often felt this way about Joni's guitar playing, too. However, I think the analogy Howard draws between the development of her painting styles and picking styles is so strong as to be almost incontrovertible. Not that I'm not a novice in painting styles - I am less than that. But if it is apparent to me, then I conclude it must be pretty obvious indeed. :-) A very fine post, overall, from a true professor of Joni's instrumental work. Thanks, Howard Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:28:53 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's techniques - picking and painting Yes, Howard's discussion was clear, pertinent and comprehensive. DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:09:09 -0500 From: simon@icu.com Subject: [none] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:17:03 -0600 From: "Cynthia Vickery" Subject: Martin Luther King and war - NJC Many people know Dr. Martin Luther King only by his "I Have A Dream" speech at the 1963 March on Washington. Others know also of his commitment to non-violence as a means of resistance, a commitment that led to his being awarded the Nobel Peace Prize. Today, especially, it seems especially important to remember an often forgotten side of Dr. King. In the last year or so of his life, he found himself challenging Americans regarding a very different subject - our participation in an unjust war. As a result, many of his friends and supporters criticized him - out of fear or a sense of patriotism or out of the belief that he was abandoning his commitment to working for racial justice - but Dr. King knew that the quest for justice and the quest for peace are inextricably entwined. "I have worked too long and too hard against segregated public accommodations to end up segregating my moral concern," Dr. King responded to his critics. "Justice is indivisible." "It must also be said that it would be rather absurd to work passionately and unrelentingly for integrated schools and not be concerned about the survival of a world in which to be integrated." "To me, the relationship of [my] ministry of the making of peace is so obvious that I sometimes marvel at those who ask me why I am speaking against the war. Have they forgotten that my ministry is in obedience to the one who loved his enemies so fully that he died for them?" From the beginning in Montgomery, Alabama, Dr. King preached non-violence and reconciliation, freedom and justice. "We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for the victims of our nation and those it calls enemy, for no document from human hands can make these humans any less our brothers," he said exactly a year before his assassination. His words are just as true today as they were nearly four decades ago. Commentary from The Rational Radical comparing today's war to the Vietnam War: http://www.therationalradical.com/dsep02/01/martin-king.htm MLK's "Beyond Vietnam" speech (04/04/67) in full: http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/058.html Chapter 31 from MLK's autobiography, regarding the Vietnam War: http://www.stanford.edu/group/King/publications/autobiography/chp_30.htm cindy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 15:14:33 +0000 From: Chris Marshall Subject: Re: A Question, please someone....NJC On 19 Jan 2004, at 6:24, Kevin Arshad wrote: > Maybe there are some sharing people here, but I'm not having much > success in > finding them when looking for trades in the USA. I have got 1 or 2 > responses > from my posts, but for the most part it seems that this list is not > much about > circulating Joni's music, This *is* primarily a discussion list, after all! Most of the "trading" I've seen here (and occasionally been on the receiving end of), has been of the spontaneous generosity type. This is in contrast to the trading one sees on the internet at large, which is mostly "I have X, what have you got in return?" If you've nothing to offer, "tough luck buster", is frequently the answer I've encountered in such circles. I've also seen a couple of messages of late along the lines of "come on... trade something dammit, call this a list?" as if it's *expected* of the list. No, I don't recall who the messages are from, before I'm accused of pointing fingers at someone directly! > but rather focused on various discussion topics and > those not neccasarily relating to Joni. Correct - hence the presence of the only-joni list for those that only want joni-specific chatter. Regards, - --Chris Marshall chrisATstryngs.com (AIM: Chr15Marshall) "If you're ever lost, I'll beat the world to finding you" Stryngs, "Bobblehats and Beer" Band website, with downloads, at http://www.stryngs.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:42:04 -0500 From: simon@icu.com Subject: "I HAVE A DREAM" JONI MITCHELL: "They kill people who give hope in this culture." "I HAVE A DREAM" by The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. Delivered on the steps at the Lincoln Memorial, Washington D.C. August 28, 1963 _____________ Five score years ago, a great American, in whose symbolic shadow we stand signed the Emancipation Proclamation. This momentous decree came as a great beacon light of hope to millions of Negro slaves who had been seared in the flames of withering injustice. It came as a joyous daybreak to end the long night of captivity. But one hundred years later, we must face the tragic fact that the Negro is still not free. One hundred years later, the life of the Negro is still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination. One hundred years later, the Negro lives on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity. One hundred years later, the Negro is still languishing in the corners of American society and finds himself an exile in his own land. So we have come here today to dramatize an appalling condition. In a sense we have come to our nation's capital to cash a check. When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir. This note was a promise that all men would be guaranteed the inalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. It is obvious today that America has defaulted on this promissory note insofar as her citizens of color are concerned. Instead of honoring this sacred obligation, America has given the Negro people a bad check which has come back marked "insufficient funds." But we refuse to believe that the bank of justice is bankrupt. We refuse to believe that there are insufficient funds in the great vaults of opportunity of this nation. So we have come to cash this check -- a check that will give us upon demand the riches of freedom and the security of justice. We have also come to this hallowed spot to remind America of the fierce urgency of now. This is no time to engage in the luxury of cooling off or to take the tranquilizing drug of gradualism. Now is the time to rise from the dark and desolate valley of segregation to the sunlit path of racial justice. Now is the time to open the doors of opportunity to all of God's children. Now is the time to lift our nation from the quicksands of racial injustice to the solid rock of brotherhood. It would be fatal for the nation to overlook the urgency of the moment and to underestimate the determination of the Negro. This sweltering summer of the Negro's legitimate discontent will not pass until there is an invigorating autumn of freedom and equality. Nineteen sixty-three is not an end, but a beginning. Those who hope that the Negro needed to blow off steam and will now be content will have a rude awakening if the nation returns to business as usual. There will be neither rest nor tranquility in America until the Negro is granted his citizenship rights. The whirlwinds of revolt will continue to shake the foundations of our nation until the bright day of justice emerges. But there is something that I must say to my people who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice. In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred. We must forever conduct our struggle on the high plane of dignity and discipline. We must not allow our creative protest to degenerate into physical violence. Again and again we must rise to the majestic heights of meeting physical force with soul force. The marvelous new militancy which has engulfed the Negro community must not lead us to distrust of all white people, for many of our white brothers, as evidenced by their presence here today, have come to realize that their destiny is tied up with our destiny and their freedom is inextricably bound to our freedom. We cannot walk alone. And as we walk, we must make the pledge that we shall march ahead. We cannot turn back. There are those who are asking the devotees of civil rights, "When will you be satisfied?" We can never be satisfied as long as our bodies, heavy with the fatigue of travel, cannot gain lodging in the motels of the highways and the hotels of the cities. We cannot be satisfied as long as the Negro's basic mobility is from a smaller ghetto to a larger one. We can never be satisfied as long as a Negro in Mississippi cannot vote and a Negro in New York believes he has nothing for which to vote. No, no, we are not satisfied, and we will not be satisfied until justice rolls down like waters and righteousness like a mighty stream. I am not unmindful that some of you have come here out of great trials and tribulations. Some of you have come fresh from narrow cells. Some of you have come from areas where your quest for freedom left you battered by the storms of persecution and staggered by the winds of police brutality. You have been the veterans of creative suffering. Continue to work with the faith that unearned suffering is redemptive. Go back to Mississippi, go back to Alabama, go back to Georgia, go back to Louisiana, go back to the slums and ghettos of our northern cities, knowing that somehow this situation can and will be changed. Let us not wallow in the valley of despair. I say to you today, my friends, that in spite of the difficulties and frustrations of the moment, I still have a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream. I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal." I have a dream that one day on the red hills of Georgia the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slaveowners will be able to sit down together at a table of brotherhood. I have a dream that one day even the state of Mississippi, a desert state, sweltering with the heat of injustice and oppression, will be transformed into an oasis of freedom and justice. I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today. I have a dream that one day the state of Alabama, whose governor's lips are presently dripping with the words of interposition and nullification, will be transformed into a situation where little black boys and black girls will be able to join hands with little white boys and white girls and walk together as sisters and brothers. I have a dream today. I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight, and the glory of the Lord shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together. This is our hope. This is the faith with which I return to the South. With this faith we will be able to hew out of the mountain of despair a stone of hope. With this faith we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood. With this faith we will be able to work together, to pray together, to struggle together, to go to jail together, to stand up for freedom together, knowing that we will be free one day. This will be the day when all of God's children will be able to sing with a new meaning, "My country, 'tis of thee, sweet land of liberty, of thee I sing. Land where my fathers died, land of the pilgrim's pride, from every mountainside, let freedom ring." And if America is to be a great nation this must become true. So let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of New Hampshire. Let freedom ring from the mighty mountains of New York. Let freedom ring from the heightening Alleghenies of Pennsylvania! Let freedom ring from the snowcapped Rockies of Colorado! Let freedom ring from the curvaceous peaks of California! But not only that; let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of Georgia! Let freedom ring from Lookout Mountain of Tennessee! Let freedom ring from every hill and every molehill of Mississippi. From every mountainside, let freedom ring. When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, Black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last! free at last! thank God Almighty, we are free at last!" andmoreagain, ___________ simon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:42:33 -0500 From: simon@icu.com Subject: Dr. King, Not! a dreamer JONI MITCHELL: "They kill people who give hope in this culture." DUBBED PLACID, KING's MILITANT VOICE IS REVEALED By Maynard Eaton All too often the media, political leaders and too many historians miscast and misrepresent Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. as merely a placid, non-confrontational civil rights advocate who was content to focus on integration. The world has been duped into believing that the essence of Dr. King's message and mission is embodied in his "I Have A Dream" speech. While that marketing ploy and characterization of Dr. King's work and wizardry has made him a palatable folk hero, it has also skewed the substance of the King saga. That personification fails to recognize how this charismatic leader emerged as such a threat to America's economic interests he had to be eliminated. Those who worked with and marched with Dr. King say image-makers are attempting to sanitize this African-American icon. "Dr. King was a radical revolutionary," opines Georgia State Representative Tyrone Brooks, formerly the national field director for the Southern Christian Leadership Conference. "White America is trying to change the image of King so that our children and unborn generations will not view the real King that we knew. Dr. King was not someone who walked around dreaming all the time. Dr. King was an activist and a true revolutionary." "He was always militant," says former SCLC President Dr. Joseph Lowery of King. "Anybody who talks about staying off the buses and challenging folk to walk is militant. Talking about public accommodations and the denial of the voting rights; all that is militant. He was dynamically and actively militantly non-violent." Brooks contends that Dr. King was assassinated because he was about to redirect the civil rights movement into another dimension -- economic parity. "White America decided that this man has certainly been a catalyst in bringing about social change in terms of desegregation and voting rights, but now this man is talking about altering the way America does business and talking about a redistribution of American wealth to the poor and the disenfranchised," Brooks said. "It really upset America." Says Dr. Lowery of the discernable shift in Dr. King's thinking and leadership; "The movement moved away from the customer side of the lunch counter to the cash register side. People who were willing to deal with segregation and busing and lunch counters were not quite ready to deal with economic integration. And so he died. They didn't care about niggas riding the bus, but when you talk about owning the banks and dividing the pie up, that's another proposition. You're talking about a seat at the economic table and even today there is pretty stiff resistance [to that]." During the first decade of the civil rights movement, Martin Luther King, Jr. had been hesitant to become involved in other political issues, for fear of weakening the cause for racial justice. By 1967, however in a speech at Riverside Church in New York City that many considered momentous, he declared his opposition to the Vietnam War. That speech; that moment amounted to a paradigm shift for the movement and the man. "Peace and civil rights don't mix, [people] say," Dr. King said. "Aren't you hurting the cause of your people, they ask. And when I hear them, although I often understand the source of their concern, I am nevertheless greatly saddened, for such questions mean that the inquirers have not really known me, my commitment or my calling." "I knew that America would never invest the necessary funds or energies in rehabilitation of its poor so long as Vietnam continued to draw men and skills and money like some demonic, destructive suction tube," Dr. King continued. "So I was increasingly compelled to see the war as an enemy of the poor and to attack it as such? We were taking the young Black men who had been crippled by our society and sending them 8,000 miles away to guarantee liberties in Southeast Asia, which they had not found in Southwest Georgia and East Harlem." Both Lowery and Brooks say that after that controversial speech, Black and White America took a different view of King. "The war was about economics as well as humanness," Dr. Lowery argues. "Martin said 'the bombs that explode in Vietnam in the '60s will explode in our economy in the '70s and '80s.' And, it did." "[Dr. King] was roundly criticized by all the establishment Black leadership. They all condemned Dr. King for that speech," Rep. Brooks recalls. "They said he'd gone too far and that the movement ought not get involved with foreign affairs. King said look at the amount of money that is coming out the American taxpayers' pocket, including Black people, that's financing this war. After that speech, you saw the anti-war movement really grow, young, White liberals and other civil rights leaders got on board. So, the King speech at Riverside Church laid the foundation for that overwhelming American response which said the war must end now." Brooks said it is most important and ultimately tragic that people began to see Dr. King as just a civil rights leader who would focus on domestic policy, not as an international, global leader. Hopefully future generations will recognize that his deeds and his direction include far more than just his dream of integration. andmoreagain, ____________ simon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 08:22:28 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Responses (NJC) Kevin wrote: > Maybe there are some sharing people here, but I'm not having much > success in finding them when looking for trades in the USA. Like Vanessa, I don't have anything to trade. I do have some videos that I'm happy to loan for copying (I don't have two VCRs to do the copying myself), but I don't have a method of duplicating CDs or cassettes that would produce anything of good quality. On another note, perhaps music trading is something that would benefit from a message board? Lori ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:38:45 -0700 From: "Norman Pennington" Subject: Re: Miraculous Messages from Water NJC Kate Bennett directed us to: > This is so amazing: > http://www.wellnessgoods.com/messages.asp > The pics ARE good. Wasn't it Tom Robbins who told us (in "Even Cowgirls Get the Blues," I think) that water invented people as a means of transporting itself from place to place? Best Regards, bp...back from Clovis and into his mail for the first time since Friday ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:48:16 -0600 From: "Kevin Arshad" Subject: Loving Joni, but not her music Could someone explain to me for what reason people are attracted to = Joni, if not for her music ? Why are so many on this list not interested = in great recordings of her beautiful performances ? There are many items = available in good sound quality; some in fair and others in less.=20 It's certainly the individuals perogative, but it seems very strange to = me that people here don't want to hear her live recordings to get a more = complete sense of Joni. The older recordings are ,without a doubt, of = historic importance and are some of the most other-worldly performances = I've ever heard; right on-par with Van's Astral Weeks. = Kevin I did read your initial post and I didn't respond as I have no trades to offer. =20 Vanessa I have nothing to share - not a collector of those sorts of things=20 Vince Like Vanessa, I don't have anything to trade. =20 Lori [demime 0.97c-p1 removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of LED.jpg] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 12:45:26 EST From: Musicloverrick@aol.com Subject: Re: What we do for a living (VLJC) Well ladies and gentlemen, I think you all have much more interesting jobs and careers than I do....I've mostly just done various retail work over the last ten years, since I was 17......Anyone can do that.....But some of the careers that you all have require real skill....I think I am in the company of a very interesting group of people, and glad to be so.....rick [demime 0.97c-p1 removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of Shania Twain 1 .gif] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 12:31:25 -0600 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: Re: "The Arrangement" now back to jc Here is what Joni says about The Arrangement: Joni's own evolvement into working with and within the jazz framework came about gradually. "It started, I would say, back on Ladies of the Canyon," she explains. "There was one song, 'The Arrangement,' which was predecessor (it was like a predecessor for 'Blue,' which came on the Blue album) which had a bit of that voicing-post-Stravinsky modern open-voicing-and in the chordal patterns, too. It's been very organic. It definitely wasn't rock 'n' roll voicing or movement." While you still have the time You could get away and find A better life, you know the grind Is so ungrateful Racing cars, whiskey bars No one cares who you really are courtesy - A Search For Clarity by Anthony Fawcett "California Rock, California Sound" 1978 JMDL LIBRARY. peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:18:34 EST From: Michaelpaz@aol.com Subject: Jonatha Brooke NYC NJC Hey JONATHA BROOKE fans, Herebs an amazing opportunity to be a part of JONATHA BROOKEbS appearance on LAST CALL with CARSON DALY on Tuesday, January 27th. Our friends at 1iota Productions are looking for diehard fans to be a part of this performance. The show will take place in New York City. If you are one of the lucky fans we ultimately and exclusively invite, know that you are an integral part of the performance! If you are interested in being a part of the show, please visit www.1iota.com, go to the "FUTURE EVENTS" page and click the "JONATHA BROOKE" event link. Then follow the simple registration directions. We will respond back to you via email about a week prior to the show day, with a confirmation letter that will have all the necessary information that you will need to attend this SPECIAL EVENT!!! ATTENDANCE TO THIS EVENT IS BY INVITATION ONLY!!! Remember, BE QUICK, because space is EXTREMELY LIMITED!! MUSTS: - - YOU MUST BE AT LEAST 16 YEARS OLD - - YOU MUST BE AVAILABLE ON TUESDAY EVENING, JANUARY 27th - - YOU MUST HAVE A VALID PHOTO ID - - PLEASE DO NOT WEAR WHITE, LIGHT BLUE, BIEGE OR LOGOS, AS THEY DONbT COME ACROSS WELL ON CAMERA - - PLEASE DO NOT BRING LARGE HANDBAGS OR KNAPSACKS - - NO CAMERAS OR RECORDING DEVICES GO TO: http://www.1iota.com/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 2: Back In The Circus Contest ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Please Be Sure to register at Jonatha's new Discussion Board/Email List to be entered in the contest. Visit http://www.jonathabrooke.com/contest.php for contest information and rules. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ NEW TOUR DATES ADDED: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit: http://www.jonathabrooke.com/ontour/tourdates.php ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ http://www.jonathabrooke.com/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This email is sent to you because you are a registered member at http://www.jonathabrooke.com/ for the Jonatha Brooke Discussion Board/Email List. To delete your account and to unsubscribe from further email newsletters and updates please send your request via email to: webmaster@jonathabrooke.com Non-technical inquiries should be directed via email to Jonatha's Management at pra@prarecords.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 15:25:28 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: What do we all do for a living (VLJC) i work as an applications consultant. my clients are people who want to apply to graduate university programs and phd's in the US, europe and canada. i help them create good application essays and position themselves competitively. i train them to beat the system and get fulbright scholarships and do effective interviews with the admissions committees and other big shots. i also teach standardized admission exams (GRE, GMAT, LSAT, etc) -- especially quantitative skills and critical reasoning -- to potential applicants, but only during the first part of the year. i teach english as a foreign language at advanced level and english usage for writers. i edit material for publication in english and i do a lot of ghostwriting. i have also translated lots of material into english -- both fiction and non-fiction. i am currently translating a book on araucanian dialects and meta-discourse to be published by the university of texas, of all places. i had very formal education -- i only finished high school. this year, at 43, i'll be going back to school! for the next five years i'll be studying to get a degree in clinical psychology. after that, i'll start my practice as a bug doctor and leave argentina. i'll probably move to canada or some nordic country when i'm 50. the joni content: i taught myself english listening to joni mitchell and using a dictionary and a grammar book. wally ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 15:31:18 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: birthday announcement NJC today is mg's birthday. you can write to mg at MGVal@aol.com wally ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:32:31 EST From: HOOPSJOHN1@aol.com Subject: Re:what do we all do for a living njc i'm a certified looney toon, nut case, whacko...with to many degrees to go into. i am unable to work because i have a crippling fear of paychecks peace noel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:40:10 -0500 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: A question (NJC) >ron wrote: > >ive also seen other lists using NR = "Now Reading" >And there's also NPIMH, which means "now playing in my head". I use that often because I like quiet non-music times and, if I'm writing anything about Joni or anything even slightly emotional, there's usually a Joni lyric, with her singing it, circling around in there. People use all sorts of other "Nows" at the end of their messages. Some of them I just make my best guess on, and even if I can't figure it out, I at least know that that, whatever that is, is important to that particular person. Is that clear enough? :-) Debra Shea, in NYC< and what does NFCK mean? Marianne _________________________________________________________________ Scope out the new MSN Plus Internet Software  optimizes dial-up to the max! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/plus&ST=1 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:40:45 -0800 (PST) From: Susan Guzzi Subject: Re: Martin Luther King and war - NJC Cindy thank you for putting this message out there on this day and at this time in history as well. I agree wholeheartedly - with the perception precipitated out there by the right and even middle at times that being against war is unpatriotic - it is that by no means at all. To me it is being even more patriotic as I have said here before - not only that but it is human, it is moral and it shows a conciousness that should be an example and be mentoring to our youth and to all of our brethren in general. Dr. King was a trailblazer in this regard. And at this time in history - we could sure use another hero - but I fear there is little hope of that in this world right now. It seems so clear to me that civil rights and justice go hand in hand in challenging a commitment to war and especially an unjust one or one motivated by greed. I for one, am thankful to a leader like Dr. King for bringing that to the forefront of my conciousness. These days with the media swaying so far to the right and news and information under the thumb of corporations such as Clear Channel ... I fear alternative messages will become less and less an option for all to process and to choose from or to embrace. Thankfully, on another day and in another time we had Dr. King. In his honor and for those causes we should honor those convictions and pass that torch by word of mouth and by any means neccessary, to do what we can to keep the dream alive. Justice is most definitely indivisible! Many thanks to Dr. King and as always ... Peace, Susan Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 14:28:35 -0500 From: "anon anon" Subject: Some are friendly,some are cutting... Why would anyone be cutting at a party? _________________________________________________________________ There are now three new levels of MSN Hotmail Extra Storage! Learn more. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 14:39:40 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: A Question, please someone....NJC Kevin Arshad wrote: > > Maybe there are some sharing people here, but I'm not having much success in > finding them when looking for trades in the USA. I have got 1 or 2 responses > from my posts, but for the most part it seems that this list is not much about > circulating Joni's music, but rather focused on various discussion topics and > those not neccasarily relating to Joni. And those one or two responses were not enough? If one of them was from the person I'm thinking of, but don't want to put on the spot so won't name, he has everything of Joni that's available and has been willing for years to share it with anyone who asks. You're right, Kevin, this list is not now primarily about circulating Joni's music. There was a time, 4-5 years ago, when recordings were being discovered and tape trees were set up to distribute them. There have also been some video tape trees. When Joni was touring in recent years, there was also a lot of talk about recordings then. Most of the people who wanted those recordings already have them. Not everyone has the ability to make copies for other people. As a general tip, I've found that it works best to be specific in your requests. A big general "gimme" is easy to ignore, especially when it's from someone new to the list. When I write to a person who's mentioned a recording that sounds interesting and request a copy of it if that person can make one, I've always gotten a positive response. And I've also gotten music I didn't even ask for, but that people thought I would enjoy. So, yes, in my experience people here are very generous. You mentioned on list wanting full videos of the clips that were part of "Woman of Heart and Mind." Well, so would we all. Many of those clips were directly from Joni, home videos, things like that, so I don't know if such "full videos" exist. If having them is your passion, and it seems to be, I suggest that you investigate it yourself, and write to the director or the American Masters show or wherever you can think of to find out how to get what you're looking for. I don't think anyone here has done that yet because they would probably share it with the list if they had found something out. (I assume that based on past experiences here.) You taking the initiative to do such investigating would be a much more effective approach than scolding listmembers because we haven't responded the way you would like us to. That approach isn't going to get you anywhere. In the meantime, another and more specific request to the list may get you some more responses. That's another thing that happens -- not everyone reads every single message so it's sometimes necessary to repeat things. Good luck to you in your quest. Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 14:38:26 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Some are friendly,some are cutting... Subject: Re: What genre is Hejira? Yes I I've always thought that! It sounded so dull when I first listened but of course I really love it now. I play it when I'm feeling mellow and by myself. All I can say is it's timeless, its Hejira! * * * * * * Stephen T "I get the urge for going But I never seem to go" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dylan Rush" To: Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 12:37 PM Subject: What genre is Hejira? > I've just been thinking about this... You really can't categorize Hejira can > you? It's a style all it's own. It's not pop, it's not folk, it's not rock, > it's not jazz, it's somewhere in between - it's just Joni. Or is there a > word for that style of music? > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hot chart ringtones and polyphonics. Go to > http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilemania/default.asp ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 15:32:38 -0500 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: both planets now NJC Russel wrote: "Both Planets, Now". that sounded catchy. . . what else can we insert here? hmmm. let's see. . . Both lovers Now Both cigarettes Now Both _________ Now. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ High-speed usersbe more efficient online with the new MSN Premium Internet Software. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 12:53:45 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Play the "Joni's Political Lyrics" game! very little JC Mike wrote re: Joni's little lawyer lyrics: > And it could be interpreted as commenting (negatively) on whichever > government(s) policy allowed such rampant litigious behaviour become > established. I don't think it was any one government policy that led to the problems, but collectively years of laws being made and changed that overall bring in more money to the lawyers and not the people they represent. Laws that also increase insurance costs for everyone. The Trial Lawyers Assoc. is one of the largest and most powerful lobbies in the U.S. > And it could be interpreted as commenting (positively) on the ease with which > the 'little people' (the 'economically challenged') can if not 'get' justice, > then can at least participate in it, rather than justice being available only > for those able to afford the best lawyers. Unfortunately, in most cases of the "little people" bringing a lawsuit, the lawyers end up with most and sometimes all of the money awarded in damages, if their client wins. If they don't win the case for their client, the client still has to pay at least the costs to the lawyer. Costs can end up being more than legal fees in the end. I think Joni is referring to some of the personal injury lawyers that advertise on TV and say "I can get you a million dollars for your whiplash injury." Many people are tempted by such a promise and don't know how the system really works, i.e., in reality, certain injuries are often awarded an averaged amount, say $100,000 for whiplash. Meanwhile the lawyer, if he wins, gets about half of that, and then the costs of depositions, experts, photocopying, etc. are added on top of it. The client can often end up owing the attorney in the end. These are some of the reasons there has been a call for reform in the laws. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 16:05:51 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Music message board [was Responses] (NJC) Lori Fye wrote: > > On another note, perhaps music trading is something that would benefit > from a message board? Lori, I think that's a great idea since some people would rather cut to the chase and get the music, and expecting everyone to be involved in the community aspect of this list may be asking too much. So if people interested in doing trading, especially the joni stuff, were able to post their information somewhere that would be great! And then people asking on list about it could be directed to that information. It would lessen the frustration level of people in a hurry to get music, and make it a much less arduous process, as in, "stick around for a very long time, ask in a particular way, and then maybe you'll get to trade some music." Some form of that is what I usually tell newcomers, but at the same time I can imagine how frustrating that process could be for some people. Can you add the music message board idea to the poll you're taking? Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:17:59 -0800 (PST) From: magsnbrei Subject: Re: birthday announcement NJC mgval Wallistah my brother, I am so glad you wrote to the lists about MG's birthday. Oh how I miss the birthday faerie and was looking forward to his interpretation of the significance of this remarkable woman's birthday. Each and every birthday we get to celebrate is unique because it is our own, and it marks another year that we've navigated through this life, no matter what challenges we face . This is part of why it's so wonderful to see our birthday faerie pay that special attention to each one that arises as the years go by . Today, especially today, I invite you all to soften your hearts, and think of Mary Grace. Keep her in your thoughts & prayers, whatever it is you do, to make this day, her day. Help her to know that she is not forgotten, that she is cared for, that we wish her strength. Mary Grace exemplifies the meaning of the word courage. here's a beautiful little piece of writing I found recently that I'd like to dedicate to Mary Grace. I, the firery light of divine wisdom, I ignite the beauty of the plains, I sparkle the waters, I burn the sun and the moon and the stars, With wisdom I order all rightly. I adorn the earth. I am the breeze that nurtures all things green. I am the rain coming from the dew That causes the grasses to laugh With the joy of life. I call forth tears, the aroma of holy work. I am the yearning for good. - -Hildegard of Bingen- (1098-1179) Mags and Brian. Wally Kairuz wrote: today is mg's birthday. you can write to mg at MGVal@aol.com wally ***** your absence has gone through me like thread through a needle everything i do is stitched with its colour. w.s.merwin Yahoo! 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