From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #581 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, November 22 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 581 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: instrumental joni - NJC now ["ron" ] NJC gay marriages ["Loa Nickloy" ] Re: NJC gay marriages [vince ] Yesssssssss!!! njc [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: Counting Crows and Blue - TV ad ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! ["ron" ] t'log ["ron" ] Re: What kind of thing are we?? NJC [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: What kind of thing are we?? NJC ["ron" ] Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! [Catherine McKay ] NJC hello i was asked to intoduce myself ["Loa Nickloy" ] Re: Subject: Re: Spanish names NJC now Professors ["Joseph S.E. Palis" ] Re: Subject: Re: Spanish names NJC now Professors [Catherine McKay ] Re: Music for the People - Rickie Lee Jones at the Moore Theatre NJC [Emi] Re: washington post on gay marriage ban NJC [HOOPSJOHN1@aol.com] Re: sacred cows, NJC [Emiliano ] Joni Mitchell GORGEOUS Steel WHISKEY FLASK [Murphycopy@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 11:26:54 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: instrumental joni - NJC now hi catching up a bit here :-) instrumentals i love: phil keaggy - master & the musician (kinda classical) david grisman & tony rice - tone poems (kinda bluegrassy) strength in numbers - telluride sessions (very bluegrassy) willie & lobo - siete (silte??? - the writing isnt clear)(spanish/flamenco) mark o'connor - heroes(allsorts) david rogers (album name unkown) this one is largely instrumental - the instrumental tracks are just plain beautiful - so just pick them out (a great big thanks to mags who gave me some of his music at the fest ) ron np willie & lobo - (cant read the track name) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 05:40:28 -0500 From: "Loa Nickloy" Subject: NJC gay marriages Hello, I am new to this,a bit shy and not sure if i am using the right way of putting things. I know it"s NJC at least i think it is if it's not about Joni.But I lost the thing from the beginning.What is it if it is Joni related.Help me out please.Thank you! About gay marriges,yes lets get on with it and legilze them.I want to Know that my friends that are togeather and have brought houses togeather and loved each other for many years.Well they will be able to keep what they have worked so hard for if one should pass away.That they can hold on to everything that they built a life around. I am 52 and we seem to be at a age when some are passing away.It seems a shame to see them so unhappy and then have greedy pp trying to take away what was never their's in the first place ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 06:18:33 -0500 From: vince Subject: Re: NJC gay marriages Hekkiw back and great first post! I think many of us agree with you! You used the tags rughtly: NJC if No Joni Content and nothing if it ha Joni content, The server sorts out the NJC posts for separation for those who do "Joni only:, receive only non-NJC posts. again, welcome to posting and please post more often! Vince Loa Nickloy wrote: >Hello, >I am new to this,a bit shy and not sure if i am using the right way of putting >things. >I know it"s NJC at least i think it is if it's not about Joni.But I lost the >thing from the beginning.What is it if it is Joni related.Help me out >please.Thank you! >About gay marriges,yes lets get on with it and legilze them.I want to Know >that my friends that are togeather and have brought houses togeather and loved >each other for many years.Well they will be able to keep what they have worked >so hard for if one should pass away.That they can hold on to everything that >they built a life around. >I am 52 and we seem to be at a age when some are passing away.It seems a shame >to see them so unhappy and then have greedy pp trying to take away what was >never their's in the first place ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 06:53:14 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Yesssssssss!!! njc England have just won the rugby world cup! I'm hoarse from screaming at the telly. Oh happy day. Jonny Wilkinson for Prime Minister! That's all really... Azeem in London ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 07:51:12 -0800 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: Counting Crows and Blue - TV ad Titles can not be copyrighted. I could put an album out today and call it Blue if I wanted. Actually, I have a song called "Blue" on my first cd, Tangled. Joni would have had no reason to trademark Blue as she is not using it for anything other than the title of one of her albums. And Blue itself is a pretty general word, not having any specific conotations other than to Joni fans. As long as it is the name of a unique entity, and is not already being used, he can call his company Blue, or Green, or Purple... My own publishing company is Way to Blue Music, a nod to Nick Drake. Victor > Give Duritz's well documented love of that record, and the not insignificant > "brand name" value of Blue, I wonder if Joni has any involvement in this (at > least in allowing Blue to be used as the organization's name and/or symbol, > without copyright infringement). Also, does copyright law overlap trademarks in a > case like this ? > > Anyone know the answers here ? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 12:54:53 -0000 From: "TheWizardOfIs" Subject: New Orleans 06 May 1995 - Track listing Dear very nice people, Could someone please send me the set-list for the above show? (I'd like to compare it to a disc that I've just received.) muffinman@bongofury.fsbusiness.co.uk Many thanks AMO ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 08:02:22 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: New Orleans 06 May 1995 - Track listing "Could someone please send me the set-list for the above show? (I'd like to compare it to a disc that I've just received.)" Amo, here's mine: Joni Mitchell Jazz & Heritage Festival; New Orleans, LA May 06 1995 1. Sex Kills 2. Moon At The Window 3. Magdalene Laundries 4. Refuge of the Roads 5. Night Ride Home 6. Crazy Cries of Love 7. Yvette in English 8. Just Like This Train 9. Three Great Stimulants 10. Amelia 11. Hejira 12. Happiness is the Best Facelift 13. Song For Sharon ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 08:06:11 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC gay marriages Hi & welcome to the group! Take a minute and introduce yourself, no need to be shy as we're a friendly lot and are ready to welcome you with open arms! And you're exactly right (as Vince said) with your NJC...just remember those three letters in the subject line when your message has "No Joni Content" and all is well. Bob NP: Neil Halstead, "Sessions" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 08:20:24 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/flatulina ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 15:58:07 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: Yesssssssss!!! njc hi azeem well done to your team!!!! they played well & deserved to win!!!! & at least we were represented in the final - even if it was only the ref ( & even if some of hiss calls werent very popular with some of the english players :-) ron - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2003 1:53 PM Subject: Yesssssssss!!! njc > England have just won the rugby world cup! I'm hoarse from screaming at the > telly. Oh happy day. Jonny Wilkinson for Prime Minister! > > That's all really... > > Azeem in London ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:09:41 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! hi >>>>bob wrote > http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/flatulina ok - i can see why youre speechless............ ron np - well, what *can* follow that,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:18:19 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: t'log hi well, i see the t'log debate goes. strangely enough, last night, i really had a moment with t'log. other than one or two songs which i found quite interesting (god must be a boogie man & woodstock) i never liked it. actually found it quite boring and embaressing..............:-) yesterday i got home, had a terrible week, capped off with an even worse friday. the day was rescued a bit by taking the scenic route home - along the river, past the quarry, down the hill, thorugh another river, through the construction site - ahhh, the joys of commuting on a ktm - roads are very definitely optional :-) then i took an early night, when deciding what to put on the bedroom cd player, i saw t'log. havent listened to it for ages, so i put it on. well, i was captivated - suddenly it all made sense to me. it *is* a great album :-) i dropped my book, switched out the light, lay in bed & listened to the entire first cd, and just loved every minute of it. the tracks arent the same as the originals, yet somehow they flesh out the originals, add in new nuances, and years of additional life experience. although it may be be a type of music which i normally associate with "background" it very definitely requires much attention, and rewards it. yeah, the pro t'loggers were right all along............... then off to dream land, & dreams of a jonifest, with all the wonderfull folk there. yeah, a shitty week indeed, but ended on a high point........ ron ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:08:14 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: What kind of thing are we?? NJC In a message dated 21/11/2003 00:38:25 GMT Standard Time, mlg@ukonline.co.uk writes: << OK, Jarofopo it is then!! Martin. In London. HEY Azeem?? You've got the album now. How would you describe us? >> Jarofopo sounds like a member of the Tongan rugby team :-) I'd want to get some notion of the poetic resonance of the lyrics into the 'label'. FWIW worth, I'd eschew any mention of 'pop', if nothing else because that term has such negative connotations (and yes, some of my favourite groups are 'pop'...). I'd ditch 'jazz' too, that would be very misleading. I'd keep 'folk' because, as it's not what I'd call your music folk, it has strong elements of folk, especially in some of the guitar playing and the violin. Poetic folk rock? That any good?? Azeem in London, just over a week to go and another 20,700 words to go... http://www.nanowrimo.org/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=16854 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:24:49 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: What kind of thing are we?? NJC hi martin the phrase ive used to describe your music to a couple of friends was "acoustic poetry" ron - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Giles" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2003 9:49 PM Subject: What kind of thing are we?? NJC > Hi folks > > I've got a question. In the band (Stryngs) we have all had problems defining > our music. We usually end up referring to our various influences, but this > usually boils down to something in the singer-songwriter tradition - which > doesn't explain a thing about what WE actually sound like. > > When it comes down to press packs etc. we could really do with a short > phrase to sum us up. So my question is.. > > What is our style of music? > > Anybody who has heard us care to take a stab? Prizes available to the > winning suggestion at next year's Jonifest! : ) > > Martin. In London. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:23:05 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! Bob (not the Troy Bob) writes: > http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/flatulina LOL that was too funny! I guess it's true what they say about "idle hands". I'm suprised you haven't found a flatulenting BSN............or "Wild Things Fart Fast" :-) Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:26:25 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/flatulina "She's sassy, she's classy, and just a little gassy!" Thanks, Muller. I know my son is gonna love this one and will certainly share it with his friends. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:52:34 -0500 From: "David Rahall" Subject: Re: t'log "Travelogue" stays in my bedroom, too, and it has since I bought it. It's a perfect bedroom cd. (no snooze jokes, please!;-)) I play it a lot. David Rahall np: Stephen Sondheim's "Assassins" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "ron" > > then i took an early night, when deciding what to put on the bedroom cd > player, i saw t'log. havent listened to it for ages, so i put it on. > > well, i was captivated - suddenly it all made sense to me. it *is* a great > album :-) i dropped my book, switched out the light, lay in bed & listened to > the entire first cd, and just loved every minute of it. the tracks arent the > same as the originals, yet somehow they flesh out the originals, add in new > nuances, and years of additional life experience. although it may be be a type > of music which i normally associate with "background" it very definitely > requires much attention, and rewards it. > > yeah, the pro t'loggers were right all along............... > > then off to dream land, & dreams of a jonifest, with all the wonderfull folk > there. yeah, a shitty week indeed, but ended on a high point........ > > ron ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:00:06 -0500 From: "Loa Nickloy" Subject: NJC hello i was asked to intoduce myself Hello again, I am from Ohio and have been a Joni fan since 69.Married and have a daughter that is so the opposite from the way she thinks,that i guess my husband i never even saw it coming.Prob. vote rebublican.Oh well un conditioal love.right! I love music its better than tv.Husband is still in a band and works to keep peoples jobs.I am not working at the moment. Some seem to have a problem with that.Not the way i want it.Just all the shops i seem to work at close down.Still a free sprirt.I dance to the tune of my own drummer.Poor daughter! I have three cats and am happy enough.Wish the world was a better place. I dance still.am able to have a drink and enjoy life.I thank the two people that responed to me,Vince and i am sorry i forgot your name.you sounded very nice.oh to have seen Ricki Lee Jones.Was a Greatful deadhead and prob i would say i still am.Love Tom Waits! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:48:29 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! "I'm suprised you haven't found a flatulenting BSN............or "Wild Things Fart Fast" :-)" Well, someday...one can only hope! I guess that's why I left out the adjective in my subject line...it was accidental, but now that I think of it I don't know for sure if I'm glad, disappointed, or what...it might be a LITTLE bit of sacrilege to hear one of Joni's most tender songs pooted out. And like you say it opens up a whole new can of worms regarding song titles...but I'll leave that to other minds. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:55:01 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC hello i was asked to intoduce myself "i am sorry i forgot your name.you sounded very nice." It's Bob, not to be confused with Bob Murphy, who sometimes now goes by Troy or Smurf, then there's Bob Sartorius or Bobsart, then there's Bob Shemkovitz too, but he only pops in from time to time. I also post from my work address which is Bob.Muller@fluor.com. Hope that's not too confusing! :~) As for being nice, I do try most of the time, sometimes my sarcastic & cynical side wins the battle between the eagle & the serpent. "Love Tom Waits!" Me too, and many fellow Waits fans here as well, plus lots of fellow buckeyes on the list, great folks all! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 11:08:19 -0500 From: "David Rahall" Subject: Re: NJC hello i was asked to intoduce myself That is *such* a bitch. I agree!:-) David Rahall - ----- Original Message ----- From: > > As for being nice, I do try most of the time, sometimes my sarcastic & > cynical side wins the battle between the eagle & the serpent. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 08:22:09 -0800 From: Mary Casey Subject: Subject: Re: Rickie Lee Jones - oh my GOD! njc I'll be there! Mary Thanks for the intelligence, Les, Catherine, et al. I just scored tickets to her San Francisco show on Monday night at the Palace of Fine Arts. I've always loved me some Rickie Lee. Any other Bay Area jmdlers going? - - -Julius ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 12:08:12 EST From: Justalittlebreen@aol.com Subject: (njc)Spookily Similar results in the political/socail compass Kate mentioned an interesting site for political/social self-eval: http://www.politicalcompass.org/ She said: <> We must be socio-political soulmates, Kate -- I went there and got: Economic Left/Right: -6.38 Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.59 Pretty close, eh? If I have any complaints about the test, it's that it doesn't give you a "I don't care/no opinion/not sure" kind of option on each question. Still, it's interesting, and I can recommend it, with Kate, as an exercise. Best to all (and of course, love&peace, but only if you *want it*), Walt ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:23:30 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: (njc)Spookily Similar results in the political/socail compass High five walt! >Pretty close, eh?< ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 12:31:39 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: (njc)Spookily Similar results in the political/socail compass Walt writes: << Economic Left/Right: -6.38 Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.59 >> Matched me exactly on the L/A front, Walt! But my E L/R was -5.50. And I agree with all the criticism of this test, but then I always want to qualify my answers, so I probably shouldn't even attempt tests like this. --Troy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 09:39:41 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: Rickie Lee Jones - oh my GOD! njc >You mean her diction has improved somewhat? Yeah, I noticed too - I wonder what happened there? Elocution lessons?< Perhaps not so much JD while singing? Or definitely no more H....I thought she'd quit drinking but apparently someone said she was drinking on stage? Or was it a fakeout? She sure used to imbibe A LOT while performing... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 12:54:09 EST From: Justalittlebreen@aol.com Subject: (njc)Chinas and Princes and Fishies and Killers, Oh My! <> Don't forget Chastity Bono, Bob. And speaking of Jacko's children, I could have sworn that he had only two, but I thought I heard something in the news about his having a third. [shudder] There was a book out in the early or mid '80's about atrocious given names. The one I remember was some guy in Maine who called his two girls Fishy and Killer Bundy. Now at that time, I actually had two friends *from Maine* named Lisa and Allison *Bundy*, an artist and a writer, respectively (I hung out with a bohemian crowd back then). Natually, among their friends, they came to be known as Fishy and Killer, although the latter gradually morphed into "Kealer" instead. (In case anyone's wondering, my nickname was Uncle Walt, not necessarliy because i was one of the older members of my crowd, but because I was a good shoulder to cry on. Wasn't I nice?) Once, in a newly-opened West African restaurant (this was in Providence), I was with a fair-sized group of fellow gay male grad students from Brown, when who should come into the restaurant with a date, but Lisa Bundy. Without thinking, I stood up, waved to her, and called out "Hey, Fishy!!" Natually, the guys I was with, who did not know me well or Lisa at all, thought I was using an absolutely unacceptable derogatory term. Some of them actually scolded me, which caused me to erupt in giggles -- not the response they were expecting. Lisa, though, came over laughing and gave me a big hug. Walt ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:17:36 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Music for the People - Rickie Lee Jones at the Moore Theatre Mark, what an incredible review...thanks! How cool she played all those vintage songs...you had me right there with you in ectasy when you mentioned all of them...why oh why is she not coming to my town?! She did in her heyday & I saw her several times in the 80's ... I remember jeff pevar describing the experience of playing with rlj...it is a hazy memory paraphrase but he said something about how she was the most pure musical conduit he'd ever experienced...something like that... >She started with a fantastic rendition of 'So Long Lonely Avenue'. She also performed 'The Horses'...she launched into the opening chords of 'We Belong Together'. ... And then she went into 'Living It Up' ...a heartbreakingly lovely rendition of 'On Saturday Afternoons in 1963' to them. < ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 13:52:09 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > And like you say it opens up a whole new can of > worms regarding song > titles...but I'll leave that to other minds. Don't encourage us, Muller. We don't need it! ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 13:54:14 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC hello i was asked to intoduce myself --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > As for being nice, I do try most of the time, > sometimes my sarcastic & > cynical side wins the battle between the eagle & the > serpent. You sarcastic and cynical? No way! You're always nice. Unlike some of us. Welcome to the list, Loa. I also have three cats and a daughter (and a son, and a dawg.) Catie Bob ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 13:56:33 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Rickie Lee Jones - oh my GOD! njc --- Kate Bennett wrote: > >You mean her diction has improved somewhat? Yeah, I > noticed too - I wonder what happened there? > Elocution lessons?< > > Perhaps not so much JD while singing? Or definitely > no more H....I > thought she'd quit drinking but apparently someone > said she was drinking > on stage? Or was it a fakeout? She sure used to > imbibe A LOT while > performing... She was drinking but she could have been making it up about *what* she was drinking - it could have been water, for all I know. She didn't seem to be drunk, that's for sure, but some people hide that awfully well. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 14:17:37 -0500 From: "Joseph S.E. Palis" Subject: Re: love actually I agree. The movie was good but not that great, though it went to many places in my heart that were too complex for me to articulate. For some reason, the joyous feel of the film heightened my loneliness here in a foreign land. That said, I found the story involving this guy who fell for the bride of his friend (Its great fun seeing Chiwetel Efiojor do a light film after the darkness of the brilliant "Dirty Pretty Things") more real than the rest, maybe because it showed the nuance of love which can sometimes be excruciating for its exclusivity. The fact that love did not really work its way for this guy made it bittersweet (although the film's end hinted a troublesome (for me) resolution). I found Colin Firth's story the most romantic though the way it was resolved was a bit too tidy and a tad superfluous (I will learn Portuguese too). I found the Laura Linney story the most touching because of her almost masochistic love for things unrequited, be it the guy in the office or her brother who she loves unconditionally. The Emma Thompson character was, in my opinion, the most fully fleshed out. Her character has this consistency that makes your heart break to see her in despair. That scene where she played Joni's BSN while fighting back tears is quite moving because Joni acted like a real friend to her gently admonishing her for believing that love can last even if two married people already reached a certain age where parting is out of the question. That Joni moment in the bedroom was in stark contrast to the young Joni singing in the background when Emma was still quietly living her life of wedded bliss. Martine McCutcheon is a lounge/cabaret singer, was she not? She is so drop-dead gorgeous and lovely here. Didn't care much for the High Grant character as I have seen enough of his schtick to be moved (though his impromptu dance was admittedly funny). Its great to see a film with more than adequate Joni references. Most people here in school who watched it, remembered the Joni reference. With so many Altman-esque stories in the film, its hard not to remember the Joni moments. Joseph in Chapel Hill (with no crutches) Quoting BRYAN8847@aol.com: > Subject: love actually > > > > I know this isn't news, but I just got back from seeing Love > Actually and the Joni moments were so grand, I had to write to tell > everyone to go see it for those moments alone! > > > > > > I was so taken by the BJM (Big Joni Moments) that I went a second > time. I thought it a considerably better film after the second > viewing (though still flawed). > > Bryan > Joseph S.E. Palis Department of Geography University of North Carolina Saunders Hall, CB 3220 Chapel Hill, N.C. 27599-3220 palis@email.unc.edu joepalis@yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 14:28:15 -0500 From: "Joseph S.E. Palis" Subject: Re: Subject: Re: Spanish names NJC now Professors Hi Mike, I know Larry Grossberg and he is a famous guy in campus because he is one of the authorities in cultural studies (Fredric Jameson teaches in nearby Duke), but I have not taken a course under him (yet). His class is usually full of grad students. This term he is co-teaching "Re- thinking the Political" and next term he will co-teach "Re-thinking Economies". Both post-colonial/PoMo courses will be helpful for me, I'm sure but I will wait next fall to take a course under him that's more suited to me. Girma Negash is also known because of his publications though I met him only once in a forum. Thanks for asking. If Maya already subscribed to this List, I am sure she can tell you about them as she works under Grossberg. Maya, speak up and welcome to the List. As for my leg, I had a minor bike accident last week when I was on my way to meet The Bob Muller of JMDL. I thought it was minor, but that night it was so painful . . . The health center in school bandaged it and had to walk with crutches for a few days. May I ask what conference you attended with Grossberg and Negash? Are you a professor, too? Just curious, I guess. Joe in CH Quoting mike pritchard : > Hello Wally, Emiliano and Joseph, > Joseph, do you have any classes with Lawrence Grossberg? Or Girma > Negash, an > Eithiopian guy now teaching in Political Science in Chapel Hill? I > met them > both in a conference recently. Very interesting to meet them both. > What > happened to your legs? > mike in barcelona > NP the folks who live on the hill - brad mehldau > Joseph S.E. Palis Department of Geography University of North Carolina Saunders Hall, CB 3220 Chapel Hill, N.C. 27599-3220 palis@email.unc.edu joepalis@yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 14:34:22 EST From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2003 #580 In a message dated 11/22/2003 12:01:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: > Give Duritz's well documented love of that record, and the not > insignificant > "brand name" value of Blue, I wonder if Joni has any involvement in this (at > > least in allowing Blue to be used as the organization's name and/or symbol, > without copyright infringement). Also, does copyright law overlap trademarks > in a > case like this ? > > Anyone know the answers here ? > > Bobsart Don't know anything about any official or unofficial connection to Joni or Blue. But there's no copyright or trademark on song or album titles...anybody can title anything Blue as often as they want. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 15:10:41 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! Cautious Catherine writes: << Don't encourage us, Muller. We don't need it! >> I passed a little wind last night It sounded like a fart . . . --Troy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 15:52:27 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: love actually --- "Joseph S.E. Palis" wrote: > Joseph in Chapel Hill > (with no crutches) Joseph, what happened to you? A few days ago you had crutches - now you don't (and that's good), so I guess it wasn't anything too bad? Haven't seen the film "Love actually" but Emma Thompson is just so superb that she could probably make any character sympathetic. She does light up the screen, doesn't she? ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 15:53:53 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Subject: Re: Spanish names NJC now Professors Joseph, disregard my question about your leg - you've answered it! I hope it's all better now. --- "Joseph S.E. Palis" wrote: > As for my leg, I had a minor bike accident last week > when I was on my > way to meet The Bob Muller of JMDL. I thought it was > minor, but that > night it was so painful . . . The health center in > school bandaged it > and had to walk with crutches for a few days. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:05:33 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: What kind of thing are we?? NJC --- AzeemAK@aol.com wrote: > I'd want to get some notion of the poetic resonance > of the lyrics into the > 'label'. FWIW worth, I'd eschew any mention of > 'pop', if nothing else because > that term has such negative connotations (and yes, > some of my favourite groups > are 'pop'...). I'd ditch 'jazz' too, that would be > very misleading. I'd keep > 'folk' because, as it's not what I'd call your music > folk, it has strong > elements of folk, especially in some of the guitar > playing and the violin. > > Poetic folk rock? That any good?? and Ron said: > the phrase ive used to describe your music to a > couple of friends was "acoustic poetry" Martin, fwiw, I like what both Azeem and Ron have to say here. Incorporate the poetic aspect of it somehow. I agree with Azeem about leaving out the "pop" bit - it doesn't tell you anything anyway (no "value-added", as people seem to say everywhere these days). After all, anything that's popular music could be called "pop". And although there is a bit of a jazz flavour, it might be misleading to use the word "jazz" anywhere. (and btw, I really was kidding with that whole jarofopo thing. It's completely lame!) ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:08:54 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! --- Murphycopy@aol.com wrote: > Cautious Catherine writes: > > << Don't encourage us, Muller. We don't need it! >> > > I passed a little wind last night > It sounded like a fart . . . > > --Troy See??? Make him STOP! ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:19:30 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Music for the People - Rickie Lee Jones at the Moore Theatre njc --- Mark or Travis wrote: > At around this point she announced > that her family > was in the house and dedicated a heartbreakingly > lovely rendition of > 'On Saturday Afternoons in 1963' to them. She sang that in Toronto too. This is a very simple song, but I just love it. It really brings me back to being a kid of about ten or so hanging out with my best friend Margaret in Pembroke Ontario where summer days seemed to last forever... The most as you'll ever go Is back where you used to know If grown-ups could laugh this slow Where as you watch the hour snow Years may go by Mark, thanks for the excellent description of RLJ at the Moore - there were a few differences in the songs she sang here in Toronto, but not a lot. She really is a very expressive performer who puts her heart and soul into it and she's a lot smaller than I would have expected her to be. In Toronto she wore a pair of brownish/purplish bellbottom pants with a floral design on them, a mannish-looking jacket that she took off after her first few songs, then put on again for the last few, and a pink BERET. She doffed the beret after the first few songs and her blonde hair came cascading down making her look both wild and somehow vulnerable. She put the beret back on again for the last few songs (I guess she wanted to make sure she didn't lose her jacket and hat!) ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 18:00:15 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! Catherine drones: << See??? Make him STOP! >> Rows and floes of fetid air Putrid flatulence ain't Maloderous vapors so rare Those baked bean stinkers ev'rywhere I've looked at farts that way --Troy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 18:02:57 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! It was supposed to be: << Rows and floes of fetid air Maloderous vapors ain't so rare Those baked bean stinkers ev'rywhere I've looked at farts that way >> . . . but I hit send. --Troy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:52:34 EST From: LCStanley7@aol.com Subject: Re: sacred cows, NJC Wally wrote: does anybody REALLY feel> > >threatened by same-sex > >couples being able to get married? maybe i'm missing > >something or not > >thinking straight (no P int.) > >wally Yes. I know some people like this who do feel threatened by same-sex couples being able to get married. Some of these people are just anti-gay and some are really good loving people who love all people regardless of their race, creed, or orientation. I think the sincere ones feel the same way as Hindu's would if a person brought their own cow to India and ate it for dinner. It would be useless to try to convince them it's really no harm. Hindu's would take offense at this. Marriage is a sacred cow of a sort to many people of many religions. It is a good thing to respect people's beliefs even if we don't share their beliefs about their sacred cows. A diverse, peaceful society does well to show respect like this, and at best, it even finds beauty in the existence of sacred cows. Catherine wrote: > When you come right down to it, why does marriage exist at > all? It started out as an economic thing, as a way of> > keeping couples together and as a way of uniting > kingdoms. It cannot be ignored that the concept of marriage has roots in what are sometimes referred to as "the great religions." In Judaism, Protestantism, and Islam, marriage is spoken of as a "covenant" or a "divine command." In Catholicism and Hinduism, marriage is spoke of as a "sacrament." Buddhism regards marriage as a secular affair but speaks of "bride" and "bridegroom" and affords a blessing to the marital couple in the temple after the secular ceremony. These great religions have in common a belief on some level that the divine makes itself known in marriage by the birth of a child although this is not the only thing they believe is manifested in marriage. I find great beauty in the religions of our world. I don't think anybody means to step on anybody's toes, but sometimes it happens. There are many good books on religion which are excellent for learning more about the diversity of people and their beliefs. In reading these books and studying about many religions, I have gained a deep respect for sacred cows of all sorts and respect that people do hang on pretty tight to these things and really mean no harm in doing so. With love, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:01:11 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: NJC I'm there's no "River" here! --- Murphycopy@aol.com wrote: > It was supposed to be: > > << Rows and floes of fetid air > Maloderous vapors ain't so rare > Those baked bean stinkers ev'rywhere > I've looked at farts that way >> > > . . . but I hit send. > > --Troy It's a good thing you sent your corrections. Your previous version didn't scan AT ALL. In fact, it STUNK! ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:30:17 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: sacred cows, NJC Wally wrote: << does anybody REALLY feel threatened by same-sex couples being able to get married? maybe i'm missing something or not thinking straight (no P int.) >> And Laura replied: << Yes. I know some people like this who do feel threatened by same-sex couples being able to get married. Some of these people are just anti-gay and some are really good loving people who love all people regardless of their race, creed, or orientation. >> I think I can see where you're coming from Laura, though I don't accept your reasoning here, nor the distinction you make between people who are 'anti-gay' and those other 'really good loving people' - as far as I'm concerned this is a distinction without difference. A *truly* loving person would not be against gay marriage or feel threatened by it - yet this is one definition of anti-gay, surely. << I think the sincere ones feel the same way as Hindu's would if a person brought their own cow to India and ate it for dinner. It would be useless to try to convince them it's really no harm. Hindu's would take offense at this. > > I think this is an unfortunate analogy (I should declare an interest as a non-meat-eater). Regardless of what you think about eating meat or vegetarianism, eating beef involves killing and butchering an animal, and there are no two ways about this. A living creature is destroyed - harmed. If, on the other hand, two women or two men get married, I can't see *any* harm to *any* living creature, of *any* sort. << I find great beauty in the religions of our world. I don't think anybody means to step on anybody's toes, but sometimes it happens. There are many good books on religion which are excellent for learning more about the diversity of people and their beliefs. In reading these books and studying about many religions, I have gained a deep respect for sacred cows of all sorts and respect that people do hang on pretty tight to these things and really mean no harm in doing so. >> I know a lot of people who would find this circle impossible to square, and who would vigorously dispute your assertion that nobody 'means to step on anybody's toes'. Members of all of the 'great religions', in large numbers, have very deliberately trod on the toes of people who were doing them no harm, and confining the argument to the subject under discussion here, they have vilified and persecuted gay people down the ages, and continue to do so. There is nothing loving about most of this stuff, despite all the cant about 'hating the sin not the sinner'. A friend of mine, with whom I did my counsellor training, had been an Anglican Priest for many years, nearly half of his life I'd say. He had lived with his male partner for many years; all his congregation knew he was gay, and few were particularly bothered by it. However, the anguish he was going through about having to keep up an official pretence that his partner was 'just a good friend', and the reiteration by the Lambeth Conference that his 'lifestyle' was an abomination, were making his life a misery, and he was preparing to leave the church. I doubt he would recognise your notion of them not meaning any harm. I'm not religious and never have been, so it's probably easy for me to dismiss these sacred cows as irrelevant at best and malignant at worst. My dictionary describes a sacred cow as 'a person, institution or custom unreasonably held to be beyond criticism.' That says it all. Azeem in London ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:37:20 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: sacred cows, NJC --- LCStanley7@aol.com wrote: > I find great beauty in the religions of our > world. I don't think > anybody means to step on anybody's toes, but > sometimes it happens. There are many > good books on religion which are excellent for > learning more about the > diversity of people and their beliefs. In reading > these books and studying about > many religions, I have gained a deep respect for > sacred cows of all sorts and > respect that people do hang on pretty tight to these > things and really mean no > harm in doing so. You're right - most people mean no harm. Unfortunately some of them do and it's at a gut-level of emotion that simply can't be argued with or reasoned with and I wouldn't even want to try. There is great beauty in many of the world's religions, but it's the rigid orthodoxy, the dogma, the belief that theirs is the ONLY right way that I can't take. I have no tolerance for those who have no tolerance. I certainly wouldn't go to a Hindu's home and expect to eat steak (I don't like steak anyway - no problem!) And I wouldn't serve them beef if they came to my house. ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 02:38:33 +0100 From: Emiliano Subject: Re: Music for the People - Rickie Lee Jones at the Moore Theatre NJC Hi, Mark, many thanks for your extraordinary review! I'd say you must send it to more forums, to reader's delight... even it is a very slice pie of yours! Have a Wonderful time! Emiliano np: On Saturday Afternoons in 1963 - ----------------------------------------------- [...] > You can see her life written on her face. It is a face that reflects > every emotion from great joy to deep despair and everything in > between. I think she is a true visionary, judging by her work and > that face, and she strives to tell her truth in the most effective and > moving ways that she is capable of. And what she is capable of is > considerable. [...] Rickie of course mentioned her > involvement with 'Furniture for the People' and the various causes > they support. Her newly awakened political conscience was voiced more > than once throughout the show. There had to have been a lot of cash > laid out for this tour considering the number of musicians and all the > instruments and equipment that were used. But the tickets did not > cost an arm and a leg and the concert did not take place in a > basketball arena. I think she was truly offering music for the > people. And speaking for this lucky person who got to experience this > event, I am extremely grateful to her and also for the chance to share > it with some very dear friends who made the show all that much more of > a peak experience for me. > > Mark E ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 21:26:37 EST From: HOOPSJOHN1@aol.com Subject: Re: washington post on gay marriage ban NJC In a message dated 11/22/03 3:01:33 AM EST, les@jmdl.com writes: << what's the big deal, i ask? does anybody REALLY feel threatened by same-sex couples being able to get married? maybe i'm missing something or not thinking straight (no P int.) wally >> I agree with you 100% wally, what's the big deal? i think, at least from my homophobic father's veiw point, the threat comes from recognition. if we ( same sex couples) are recognized as being equals under the law in ANY way, then we must truly exist and our exisitance, the fact that gays may possibly be real and may live next door to them, just the very thought of this is threatening to the homophobe's happy little narrow minded life. in saying this, i can't tell you why a person would be threatened, i suppose there are as many reasons as there are people. fear is a very personal thing and can be a very destructive thing. God give us strength, acceptance forgiveness and love. peace noel ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 03:19:31 +0100 From: Emiliano Subject: Re: sacred cows, NJC Hi! Laura wrote: > > << I think the sincere ones feel the same way as Hindu's would if a person > brought their own cow to India and ate it for dinner. It would be useless to > try to convince them it's really no harm. Hindu's would take offense at > this. > > > > I too think this is an unfortunate analogy: As I understand, there's no people in this bringing anything to another land. The land we're talking of are our own(s) countries. I mean, it's such a pity religions don't want to "relligare", but I thought we were talking about *laws*, nor creeds! (or I'm wrong with this?) Have a Wonderful time! Emiliano NP: Take this waltz, LC, Toronto, 9 nov '88 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 21:53:42 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Joni Mitchell GORGEOUS Steel WHISKEY FLASK http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2966271621&category=1468 Hmm. The perfect gift for all good dreamers? --Troy ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #581 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)