From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #518 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, October 16 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 518 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: njc Felon voting rights ["kakki" ] Re: njc Felon voting rights ["kakki" ] Re: It'all over now baby blue ["Marian Russell " ] please resend transcription ["Marian Russell " ] Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) [Susan Guzzi ] Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] fairest of fair weather fans (njc) [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: Judy sings "Both Sides Now" at book signing - njc [Jerry Notaro ] Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction [Jerry Notaro ] Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: (NJC) Taking a break [Bob.Muller@Fluor.com] Re: njc question about emails [Steve Polifka ] Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) ["Lavieri, Vince [185776]" ] Re: Fw: wodehouse njc (for AOL members) ["ron" ] RE: njc Felon voting rights/addiction ["Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights Azeem wrote: > This does not change my view one jot, Kakki. Is it, or is it not true, that > > << Felons are barred for life from voting in 14 states, a prohibition that > can be waived only through a gubernatorial pardon or some other form of > clemency. >> > > And does this, or does this not, mean that about three quarters of US states > *do* allow convicted criminals to vote?? Azeem, you are moving the argument pieces around as you go. Your original point, I believe (or the point of the Palast article) was that Florida purged felons from the voting rolls to make the point that Bush and gang concocted this all to win the vote. The Palast article said nothing about how many other states purge felons from the voting rolls and gave the impression Florida was one of the few. At any given time most states will be purging felons from the voting rolls in an election either while they are in prison (which could be for life), on parole or probation or some other determined length of time. The Palast article did not give that information. That's what the Wash. Post article said. The point being you can't say one state does that deliberately and arbitrarily to disenfranchise certain voters from one specific election. > I've already acknowledged that whatever he says, someone somewhere will come > up with something that disputes it. Hell, I've seen the sort of stuff that > gets reported as fact on Newsmax.com, and it scares me! By the same token, > Palast, Moore, Al Franken and others will always be around to pick holes in the > arguments and propositions that those from the right put. No - I can believe Palast is wrong by just applying simple logic to his allegations. I could lay it all out here for you and also show where he contradicts himself, but I don't want to drone on. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 00:25:44 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights Jerry, Thanks for the articles. They sound more reasonable and make more sense as far as screw-ups go. But is you want to defend the Palast article, I would be interested in knowing from you as a Floridian if you believe (according to Palast) that Florida had a database of 57,000 names of alleged felons and it was later found that 90.2 percent of those people were completely innocent of any crime. I mean really think about that - do you really think it is possible in Florida to have screwed up that astoundingly? If so, really, how does the justice system run properly down there? California has its screw ups too but geez the court/justice databases are pretty accurate and up to date. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 04:50:07 -0400 From: "Marian Russell " Subject: Re: It'all over now baby blue Yeah, thank you, Vicenzo! I want to try it, too, and hope to add it soon to the guitar files. Marian + + + + + + + + + Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 18:50:08 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: It'all over now baby blue Vincenzo Thanks for doing this I am gonna try this out next weekend. Best Paz > Hi all, > > since I'm not a subscriber of "The wanderer" (the JM guitar > discussion list), I'm taking a little piece of the jmdl to spread > this it's great to have a "brand new" song to play! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 05:28:32 -0400 From: "Marian Russell " Subject: please resend transcription Someone recently (in the last six months?) sent in a transcription for addition to the JMDL guitar files. I think it never got added. If this was you, please resend it! Marian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 03:44:07 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction jim , no offense but i don't think you understand the nature of addiction...it is considered a disease & is very complex...much of it has to do with self medicating for chemical imbalances but unfortunately the wrong medication is used...addiction deserves a much more compassionate view in our society & our laws...if someone is a recovering addict but was once arrested on drug charges (with no violent or dealing charges) they most certainly deserve the right to vote...i have met many recovering addicts & alcoholics who are some of the most self-aware, compassionate, & giving people on the planet... >I think revoking a felon's privilege to vote makes a pro*duct*ive and pro*tect*ive dividing line. It separates people who are destructive from those who are not.< ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 06:56:48 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: lakota Thank you Kate, This is probably the most important thing I will read and think about all day today. Marianne >Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:19:36 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: lakota a friend who sends out various pieces of wisdom & inspiration sent me this which i thought might be of interest since we were just discussing lakota: food for thought & discussion---on the page about ceremony (http://www.elexion.com/lakota/rites/index2.html) they talk about people exploiting their spirituality...while i wouldn't call joni's song exploitation i wonder if someone from that nation might see it differently...& i wonder if joni consulted anyone before she released the song.... An Elder Speaks Up On Land and Property Let me tell you how we lost the land. It wasn't our land like we owned it. It was the land where we hunted or where our ancestors were buried. It was the land that the Creator had given us. It was the land where our sacred stories took place. It had sacred places on it. Our ceremonies were here. We knew the animals. They knew us. We had watched the seasons pass on this land. It was alive, like our grandparents. We were part of it. The land was part of us. We didn't even know about owning the land. It is like talking about owning your grandmother. For us, the earth was alive. To move a stone was to change her. To kill an animal was to take from her. There had to be respect. We saw no respect from these people. They chopped down trees and left animals lay where they were shot. They made loud noises. They seemed like wild people. They were heavy on the land and they were loud. Then these new people started asking us for the land. They wanted to give us money for the land. Our people didn't want this. Then these people said that we didn't belong here anymore. That there was a chief in Washington, which was a city far away, and the land was his, and he said they could live here and we could not. We thought they were insane. These people would ride across the land and put a flag up, then say that everything between where they started and where they put the flag belonged to them. That was like someone shooting an arrow into the sky and saying that all the sky up to where the arrow went belonged to him. We thought these people were crazy. They were talking about property. We were talking about the land. Your people came from Europe because they wanted property for their own. They had worked for other people who had claimed all the property and took all the things they raised. They never had anything because they had no property. That was what they wanted more than anything. Everyone believed that whoever had a piece of paper saying they owned the land could control everything that happened on it. The people came here to get their own property. We didn't know this. We didn't even know what it meant. We just belonged to the land. They wanted to own it. Your religion didn't come from the land. It could be carried around with you. Your religion was in a cup and a piece of bread, and that could be carried in a box. Your priests could make it sacred anywhere. You couldn't understand that what was sacred for us was where we were, because that is where the sacred things had happened and where the spirits talked to us. Your people didn't know about the land being sacred. You were killing all the animals. The buffalo was gone. The birds were gone. You would not let us hunt. You gave us blankets and whiskey that made our people crazy. We were put in little pens of land that were like tiny islands in your sea. The worst thing is that you never even listened to us. You came into our land and took it away, and didn't even listen to us when we tried to explain. You made promises and you broke every one. You killed us without even taking our lives. You killed us by turning our land into pieces of paper and bags of flour and blankets, and telling us that was enough. You took the places where the spirits talked to us and you gave us bags of flour. To us the land was alive. It talked to us. We called her our mother. If she was angry with us, she would give us no food. If we didn't share with others, she might send harsh winters or plagues of insects. We had to do good things for her and live the way she thought was right. She was the mother to everything that lived upon her, so everything was our brother and sister. The bears, the trees, the plants, the buffalo. They were all our brothers and sisters. If we didn't treat them right, our mother would be angry. If we treated them with respect and honor, she would be proud. For your people, the land was not alive. It was something that was like a stage, where you could build things and make things happen. You understood the dirt and the trees and the water as important things, but not as brothers and sisters. They existed to help you humans live. You took the land and you turned it into property. Now our mother is silent. But we still listen for her voice. http://www.elexion.com/lakota/wisdom/texto41b.htm#< ps. As I see it, Joni's "Lakota" acknowledges and honors all of this. _________________________________________________________________ Concerned that messages may bounce because your Hotmail account has exceeded its 2MB storage limit? Get Hotmail Extra Storage! http://join.msn.com/?PAGE=features/es ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 04:22:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Susan Guzzi Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) YES Vince all is well in theuniverse again! And may we add yet another major choke to the Scrubs list 69, 84 and of course perhaps the biggest one of all 03! Yipeeeeee!!! Ahh but the weakness oof the national league rears its head again! Oh and let's remember that one fan catching a pop up is the reason this time that Scrub fans will lament till the end of time - how funny the other 26 outs in a game dont matter and have no effect on the outcome of a game. Sheesh if only scrub fans knew anything about sports and especially baseball - but then of course if they did - they would be WHite Sox fans - wouldn't they?! Goooo American league! Peace, Susan vince wrote: waytoblu wrote: >Yay!!! the Red Sox beat the Yankees. Game 7 tomorrow night! > >Now the Cubs just need to beat the Florida Marlins... > >Go Cubs! > Over my dead body. Please note I cursed the scrubs and thus they lost three games in a row, 2 games in their own ballpark, both games in which they had leads, with the fav pitchers on the mound if the only real Sox, the White Sox, aren't gonna make it, sure as hell the scrubs won't and for every frat boy - yuppie - tourist - drunk - who is a scrubs fan - - yahoo! and always remember the Sox beat the scrubs 4 games out of 6 this year - - oh and last year too - now whoever wins tomorrow, NY or Boston, will be my world series team since I always go AL, true blue American that I am... sorry victor, but as the t shirt says that I bought my grandson at his repeated insistence: "cubs suck." Order has been restored in the universe. Vince The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 08:02:21 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction It will be interesting to see if Rush "Lock 'em all up & throw away the key" Limbaugh changes his views on addiction after he gets out of his rehab for his Oxycontin addiction. And in a related question - is music addictive? Because sometimes I get in a mood where I just have to go buy a "fix". It's tough for me to walk in a record store and walk out without buying something. Bob NP: Dionne Warwick, "Walk On By" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 05:27:44 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: fairest of fair weather fans (njc) Go Red Sox ! Vince, I'm so sorry for whatever traumatic event so misaligned your baseball loyalties :-) Around here (in Boston), the catch phrase is "Cowboy up!" Too bad the Cubs lost last night. A lot of us have also been saying "Cubbie up!" Now, to ditch class tonight to watch the game, or not???? hmmmm..... lots of love Anne npimh: hearing the captain announce the score (2-0 Sox) while flying into Boston last Saturday, and having a planeload of New Englanders cheer... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 08:44:01 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Judy sings "Both Sides Now" at book signing - njc Lucky you, Bryan. Judy is a most gracious person. Thanks for the alert. I just ordered the book. I hope you also have her Sanity and Grace cd. Jerry On 10/16/03 1:31 AM, "BRYAN8847@aol.com" wrote: > I didn't NJC this because "Both Sides Now" gives it Joni content (sort of). > > Just a little anecdote - I went to Judy Collins' book signing (for her new > book "Sanity and Grace") tonight in Seattle. She started out the eveving by > singing most of Both Sides Now, and most of the audience of 150 or so joined > in. > It was very sweet. Judy looked and sounded mahvelous. > > Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 09:28:06 -0400 From: "Loa Nickloy" Subject: woops i forgot my adress hello again, Its 2408 Murray Dr Toledo,OHIO 43613 FB2CCB4-09FC8C4 As i said before i would like my nickname to be my own name.I do not like hideing under other names.OH DEAR,my teas on.i hope this is right.I Tend to get things messed up as you can see by two diffent emails.oh dear as always LO A. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 09:58:29 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction On 10/16/03 8:02 AM, "Bob.Muller@Fluor.com" wrote: > addiction...it is considered a disease & is very complex...> > > It will be interesting to see if Rush "Lock 'em all up & throw away the > key" Limbaugh changes his views on addiction after he gets out of his rehab > for his Oxycontin addiction. Well, most authorities on the subject think he's fooling himself if he thinks he is going to rehab himself from a 6 year addiction in 30 days. I don't wish anything but a full recovery for Mr. Limbaugh despite our vast differences. I only hope he learns a little compassion throughout his ordeal and moderates his tone. But, as William Bennett said in his first interview after we learned of his gambling habit, " I never said anything about gambling." Preach on, Bill. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 07:08:57 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) Sheesh if only scrub fans knew anything about > sports and especially baseball - but then of course if they did - > they would be WHite Sox fans - wouldn't they?! On behalf of my dad and my brother, I thank you for insulting them. Mark (who really doesn't care and doesn't get it) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 07:10:54 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: njc Felon voting rights/addiction > And in a related question - is music addictive? Because sometimes I > get in a mood where I just have to go buy a "fix". It's tough for me > to walk in a record store and walk out without buying something. > > Bob Then you definitely should be disenfranchised, Muller. Music sluts absolutely should not have the right to vote. ;-) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:19:36 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) In a message dated 10/16/2003 10:10:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, mark.travis@gte.net writes: > Mark > (who really doesn't care and doesn't get it) > I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs, but I'd cheer for the Miami Dolphins or Jacksonville Jaguars if they were in the playoffs, because they represent my state. Jimmy, who's happy that the Florida Marlins won even though I'm not a baseball fan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:54:10 -0400 From: lfye@cresapartners.com Subject: (NJC) Taking a break I'm going to take a break from most of my email for awhile, including the JMDL. Between running (training for the marathon, http://lrfye.lunarpages.com) and trying to get myself organized (my life is overwhelmed with papers and junk), I just haven't been able to keep up with email. If you need to get my attention for whatever reason, please email me at work: lfye@cresapartners.com Happy posting! Lori NP: Harry's House, from the Hissing Demos (thanks, Cindy!) NPIMH: singing "Happy Birthday" to my mom, who would be 66 today ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 07:59:11 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: waytoblu Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:17:50 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: (NJC) Taking a break You mean the rest of us are supposed to have our lives together? ;~) Hey good luck with the training Lori, we're all pulling for you & hurry back. Bob NP: The Silhouettes, "Get A Job" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:21:03 -0500 From: Steve Polifka Subject: Re: njc question about emails Geez, Paz, You musta been gay in a past life! LOL! Un-size queen- Un-cola nut! Now did you and Smurph meet on JMDL dating??? Just how is that going? Smurph? any thing you want to share??? Steve- not above gossip but I'll sit on a secret where honor is at stake... At 07:09 PM 10/15/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Yeah your Assholiness, but I am popular and in demand. Just ask Smurph! > >The UN-Size Queen- > >Paz > >P.S. I never have had a complaint by the way, not even from myself (and you >know I can be quite picky!) > >> Bishop Vince writes: >> >> 50%-75% of my email is concerned >> with whether I can get it up and if I can, is it big >> enough once I get it up. >> >> No Vince, it's not you personally. It's "National Clergy Month", and you >> have to stay out of those chat rooms! Just kidding Vinnie :~) Paz gets those >> emails constantly, and they're from his friends. >> >> Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:43:58 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: Re: Jonifest 03/Ethiopia I spent some time with my Jonifest 03 CD's. Since I couldn't make it to the Fest its a real treat to listen to the superb performances and to feel the infectious spirit and fun. Get these discs - its REAL - a quality hard to find in today's corporate music scene. I hesitate to single out 1 performance but Bob Muller's Ethiopia is amazing. I guess a cover king would know how to cover a song - he stays true to Joni's intent but makes it his own by kicking up the emotional delivery without being overwrought. I like Joni's Ethiopia but it curiously never moved me. I think her vocal excels at painting the picture at the expense of giving emotional movement to the lyric. Well Bob's delivery kicked me in the gut. Outstanding. It belongs on Sweet Sixteen Take Three. <...I can always re-record it in 15 years with full orchestra. ;~)> Bob - when you do, have Klein re-contextualize it, Mendoza can arrange, tell Shorter "you are the flies on the eyes", Herbie can play one jagged chord after the phrase "poison spray", have a choir join you on the chorus "Ethiopia, Ethiopia", and tell Billy Preston to sit and watch :) peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:58:05 -0400 From: "Lavieri, Vince [185776]" Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) For those who don't get it, no words of explanation will suffice. I am happy that I get it because it adds a bit of entertainment zest in my life. And when I hear the words "I don't get it" it always sounds condescending to me. "Well that is your vulgar little interest but I don't get it." The Sox and Cubs thing is deeply rooted in that city's psyche. Just the way it is. And Sox fans are sick unto death of the media swooning over the lovable losers and oh how cute the cubbies are. Ask a cubs fan about us and they will tell yiou what they are sick of about Sox fans. And they wouldn't cheer for us - they didn't in 2000 when we were in the playoffs. When you share a city and loyalties divide friends and family - then trust me the separation is deep and fans don't cheer for the other team. My mother was a scrubs fan. She never said the words "White Sox" out loud in her life. It was always "your team" when she referred to the Sox. I never said 'cubs" to her, it was always "that minor league team on the north side." For Christmas 1983 she gave me a Sox mug with the team memebers names and "1983 West Division Champions" on it. That wasd the best gift ever because it must have very difficult for her to but a Sox souvineer but she knew how much I'd want one. On the other hand, she made she she let me know it was discounted, clearance price when she bought it - something the store was trying to get rid of. And if Mom went to 3 games in her life I'd be surprised. If the rivalry is that deep for people who don't go to games, imagine what it is for people who do. Susan's and my posts may have seemed intemperate to some but if you don't get it, sorry, I don't jazz, for example, we all have our things, I just don't comment about what I don't get. But I will say to anyone's relatives what I say to my own if they are cubs fans - you are people who do not know baseball but buy into the lovable losers thing. And this was the wrong time to start waving a cubs flag here since Sox fans have been trash talked to death the last three weeks that the cubs were in the playoffs and we weren't. So you got a reaction. Being miffed just verifies the cliches about cub fans. We are sick and tired of having to be so nice when anyone speaks of the cubs when that is never returned. In fact, I recall no one posting here about the White Sox when we were in the 2000 playoffs except Susan and me so anyone who posts about the cubs - you wave your flag, we wave ours. And yes that Steve Bartman did not cost the cubs that game or the series but it is just so perfect - a cubs fan who knows so little about baseball that when you are 5 outs away from the world series, you get the hell out of the way on a foul ball so your player can get the out. It was the quintessential cubs fan moment. That was just as perfect a commentary on cubs fans as it gets. Professionally, I am sure Miami Dolphin fan don't cheer for Tampa Bay and the reverse. College wise, do the Florida State fans cheer for Florida while they cheer for Miami U? Hardly. Vince loves Joni but the tatooes are Sox tats I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:59:30 -0400 From: "Lavieri, Vince [185776]" Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) For those who don't get it, no words of explanation will suffice. I am happy that I get it because it adds a bit of entertainment zest in my life. And when I hear the words "I don't get it" it always sounds condescending to me. "Well that is your vulgar little interest but I don't get it." The Sox and Cubs thing is deeply rooted in that city's psyche. Just the way it is. And Sox fans are sick unto death of the media swooning over the lovable losers and oh how cute the cubbies are. Ask a cubs fan about us and they will tell yiou what they are sick of about Sox fans. And they wouldn't cheer for us - they didn't in 2000 when we were in the playoffs. When you share a city and loyalties divide friends and family - then trust me the separation is deep and fans don't cheer for the other team. My mother was a scrubs fan. She never said the words "White Sox" out loud in her life. It was always "your team" when she referred to the Sox. I never said 'cubs" to her, it was always "that minor league team on the north side." For Christmas 1983 she gave me a Sox mug with the team memebers names and "1983 West Division Champions" on it. That wasd the best gift ever because it must have very difficult for her to but a Sox souvineer but she knew how much I'd want one. On the other hand, she made she she let me know it was discounted, clearance price when she bought it - something the store was trying to get rid of. And if Mom went to 3 games in her life I'd be surprised. If the rivalry is that deep for people who don't go to games, imagine what it is for people who do. Susan's and my posts may have seemed intemperate to some but if you don't get it, sorry, I don't jazz, for example, we all have our things, I just don't comment about what I don't get. But I will say to anyone's relatives what I say to my own if they are cubs fans - you are people who do not know baseball but buy into the lovable losers thing. And this was the wrong time to start waving a cubs flag here since Sox fans have been trash talked to death the last three weeks that the cubs were in the playoffs and we weren't. So you got a reaction. Being miffed just verifies the cliches about cub fans. We are sick and tired of having to be so nice when anyone speaks of the cubs when that is never returned. In fact, I recall no one posting here about the White Sox when we were in the 2000 playoffs except Susan and me so anyone who posts about the cubs - you wave your flag, we wave ours. And yes that Steve Bartman did not cost the cubs that game or the series but it is just so perfect - a cubs fan who knows so little about baseball that when you are 5 outs away from the world series, you get the hell out of the way on a foul ball so your player can get the out. It was the quintessential cubs fan moment. That was just as perfect a commentary on cubs fans as it gets. Professionally, I am sure Miami Dolphin fan don't cheer for Tampa Bay and the reverse. College wise, do the Florida State fans cheer for Florida while they cheer for Miami U? Hardly. Vince loves Joni but the tatooes are Sox tats I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" I don't get it either. I can't understand why a city (or a state) wouldn't cheer for their other team. I know I have my favorite Florida football team. My favorite is the Tampa Bucs There, we agree on something. I am a proud fan of the Tampa Bay Bucanneers. They even get credit on the liner notes in "Parsonage Lane". I don't get it either. I have been a Braves fan for many years but after they were knocked out by the Cubs, and I was watching the NLCS, I sympathized with Chicago, seeing as they have been waiting 95 years to win another world series...must be the romantic in me. Florida though, clearly was the stronger team. And all things considered, the fan in the stands who tried to catch the foul ball had virtually nothing to do with the Cubs failing to advance, and it is a shame all the frustration is being vented on him. Chicago fans should be grateful the Cubs advanced as far as they did. But then again, their division was referred to as the Comedy Central for the latter half of the season. So now I'm hoping the Red Sox will rally to beat the Yankees tonight. Go Sox! Victor NP: Bob Marley "Rebel Music" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 18:07:09 +0200 From: Emiliano Subject: Fw: Joni @ PBS show Perma-Vine Offer... from Europe now! Hi, dears! I'll write it short, 'cause my kb is having a life of its own: I can't believe nobody has asked for this wonderful show! yours: Emiliano - ----- Mensaje original ----- De: "Emiliano" Para: "JMDL" Enviado: miircoles, 15 de octubre de 2003 15:26 Asunto: Joni @ PBS show Perma-Vine Offer... from Europe now! > Hi, dears! > I've already received the disc John kindly sent to me! > As you could imagine, I'm absolutely delighted! > > Now's your turn: send me your snail-mail address... and it's yours! > I'll take one for continuing the vine, and one "burnerless" person to receive > it. > > Since John sent two copies into the U.S.A., responses from Europe, Asia, > Africa & Oceania will take advantage in this offer! > > Have a Wonderful time! > Emiliano > > NP: Cactus Tree > ----- Mensaje original ----- > De: CDTraderJohn@aol.com > Para: joni@smoe.org ; emilianopd@mundo-r.com ; ppeterson4@nyc.rr.com ; > sewbead@starband.net > Enviado: lunes, 06 de octubre de 2003 16:44 > Asunto: Perma-Vine Offer Closed > > > SUBJECT: Vine Offer Closed > > Hi all, > > Please see below for a CORRECTED description of this show based on > newly received information. > > I have decided to take 3 Perma-Viners instead of two. The first > recipients of this vine are: > > Emiliano Patiqo emilianopd@mundo-r.com Spain > Paul Peterson ppeterson4@nyc.rr.com New York > Linda Crawford sewbead@starband.net Georgia > > I will mail these discs within the next few days. Re-offerings should > begin to appear on JMDL within about one week. > > To avoid confusion, I have posted the Perma-Vine rules below. > > Enjoy, > John in Massachusetts > > > > > > PERMA-VINE RULES: > 1) When you receive your Perma-Vine disc you must MAKE COPIES FOR YOURSELF and > re-post an offer on JMDL. You will forward the ORIGINAL DISC onto the next > recipient (you may NOT keep the original Perma-Vine disc). This method > ensures that all participants can get a clean, glitch-free copy of this show > directly off the original disc. > > 2) You must re-post your offer of this vine only to JMDL. (NOTE: Please give > digesters ample opportunity to respond, too.) Once you have selected the next > recipient, you must post their name, e-mail and state/country to the JMDL > list. (A typical closing post would read: Vine Offer Closed. John Smith > (johnsmith@abc.com) has agreed to continue this Vine on JMDL). If, after TWO > postings within a 48-hour period, there is no response, you may then, and only > then, post the Perma-Vine offer to another group, but you MUST post an > announcement to JMDL indicating which group you have transferred this > Perma-Vine to. > > 3) By requesting these Perma-Vine discs, you have agreed to make this show > available to those who are unable to burn copies for themselves (and, thus, > cannot participate directly in this Perma-Vine). You agree to post an > offer(s) on JMDL for at least one burnerless individual as soon as you have > forwarded the original Perma-Vine disc onto the next recipient. You must post > the name, e-mail and state/country of the burnerless recipient to the JMDL > list. Additionally, you may B+P or trade this to as many as you like AFTER > you have forwarded the Perma-Vine discs onto the next recipient. You are not > required to post subsequent trades or B+P's to the list > > 4) You further agree to keep the Perma-Vine disc in your possession no longer > than 72 hours before re-offering. > > 5) Lastly, you agree to ENJOY this music immensely! > > > Here is the track information: > > Joni Mitchell > > PBS-TV > Los Angeles > November 30, 1969?? > > [*** NOTE: Bob Muller indicates this show is most likely from July 7, 1969; > Mississippi River Festival, Southern Illinois University - Edwardsville, IL, > broadcast August 3, 1969 on PBS as "The Sounds of Summer" as indicated on > Simon's site. However, the same site also mentions the following: 07-19-69 > Newport Folk Festival Newport RI USA PBS?-TV Broadcast as "The Sounds Of > Summer '69", Nov. 1969. In the absence of setlists for the above > performances, I would expect Bob's information is correct.] > > > 11) Chelsea Morning > 12) Cactus Tree > 13) Night in the City > 14) Marcie/Nathan LaFraneer > 15) Two Houses (medley: Rainy Night House/Blue Boy) > 16) For Free > 17) Get Together > 18) The Fiddle and the Drum > 19) I Think I Understand > 20) Both Sides Now ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 12:17:01 EDT From: OzWoman321@aol.com Subject: I Still Miss Someone (Johnny Cash) Hello, All - Just read this in my FolkWax e-zine - who knew Joni was a Johnny fan?!? (or maybe I'm the last to know... :-) << - Johnny Cash's television legacy is being honored in a video retrospective at the Museum of Television & Radio in New York and Los Angeles. Running through January 25, 2004, the retrospective is titled Hello, I'm Johnny Cash. The series currently highlights Cash's television appearances through 1969, including performances on Town Hall Party, the Ozark Jubilee, Shindig and the Ed Sullivan Show. In December, the series moves forward in time, beginning with historic clips from Cash's ABC-TV series. Taped at Nashville's Ryman Auditorium, the clips include performances by Bob Dylan, Merle Haggard, Joni Mitchell and June Carter Cash. >> Great online publication, by the way - to s*bscribe, go to http://www.folkwax.com/ Susan http://www.heartsdesireconcerts.com http://www.horseofadifferentcolorbooking.com "You've got work to sustain you, you've got friends to hold your hands, You say "life is just as beautiful as I think I can stand..." ~ Kris Delmhorst ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:39:05 -0500 From: John Evans Subject: Question about the cover of Clouds Hi Everybody: I'm new to this group and I look forward to reading all of the message! I have a question about the self-portrait on the cover of Clouds. Is it true that the art was retouched after the promo release? I recently bought a promo copy, but I only have images from the internet to which I can compare it. Thanks for the help. - -John ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:04:58 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@Fluor.com Subject: Re: I Still Miss Someone (Johnny Cash) Subject: Re: Red Sox win!!! (njc) "Lavieri, Vince [185776]" wrote: > > Professionally, I am sure Miami Dolphin fan don't cheer for > Tampa Bay and the reverse. College wise, do the Florida > State fans cheer for Florida while they cheer for Miami U? > Hardly. "Professionally?" I don't know what that means in this context. Fanhood sounds vicious out there in Chicago. What exactly is such hatred of the other team based on? I get the impression the choice of favorite team is largely a class issue, that is, the Cubs fans seem to be mostly working class, and White Sox fans seem to be mostly middle or upper class. That's just an impression from many different sources over the years, so if you're still feeling crabby, Vince, feel free to jump all over that if you wish. Vent baby vent! (I'm trying to save ya from a heart attack here!) I sure am glad I live in NYC, where, if my beloved, scrappy, usually the underdog Mets aren't in the playoffs, then I have no trouble hoping the Yankees win, and from what I can see, it's that way with most people here. Intellectually, I was rooting for the Cubs and Red Sox to be in the Series since fans of both teams have waited so long for a championship, but now that the Cubs are out (darn! those poor fans! :-) ok, Vince, I know, I'm being really annoying now!), I've gotta go with my heart. Go Yankees Go! I could watch Derek Jeter beautifully catch, turn, flip, toss, throw, or hit all day! And when Mariano Rivera comes out to close the game, ahhhhh! Such focus, such eyes, such grace, and such a good pitcher, too! And what's up with Graciaparra of the Red Sox and his obsessive/compulsive gestures at the plate? It's surprising to me that he can ever calm down enough to hit the ball. I'm glad he's finally out of his slump because the games are most interesting when everyone is playing at their best (and my usually noncompetitive spirit would like everyone to win), but still... go Yankees! Debra Shea, in NYC ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 19:58:30 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: Re: Fw: wodehouse njc (for AOL members) hi > Wally K, through his representative on earth, emiliano, writes: > << why aren't there any really funny writers nowadays? except for joe keenan's novels, nothing makes me laugh anymore >> well, one of the funniest books ive read for a while was sherman alexie's "reservation blues" which was just great - funny, intelligent, sensitive - all this and with a music theme too - what more could you ask for?? and i think ive probably read just about every wodehouse book as well ... ron np - famous curtain trick - everytime ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:12:21 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: njc Felon voting rights/addiction it will be a lifelong struggle & an everday focus for him to stay clean...he's got a whole lot to learn about himself & some places to go that require tremendous humility...i hope he gets it (30 days is only the first step) & if he does he will eventually learn compassion along the way... >Well, most authorities on the subject think he's fooling himself if he thinks he is going to rehab himself from a 6 year addiction in 30 days. I don't wish anything but a full recovery for Mr. Limbaugh despite our vast differences. I only hope he learns a little compassion throughout his ordeal and moderates his tone.< ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #518 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)