From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #498 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, October 2 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 498 ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested ["Kate Bennett] re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies ["Kate Bennett" ] RE: "Shades of Scarlett..." continued... now "Electricity" now njc [Cathe] Joni duds [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #308 [StDoherty@aol.com] Re: Joni duds [FMYFL@aol.com] (no subject) [JSerkes@aol.com] Re: donald o'connor (a patrick memory) njc [AsharaJM@aol.com] Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner.... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested [Jenny Goodspe] Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: crystal waters njc [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies -- now Joni duds [Steve Polifka <] Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Last Chance Lost/Joni Duds [KJHSF@aol.com] Robert Palmer Haute Couture Rocker -njc ["Suze Cameron" ] Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Last Chance Lost/Joni Duds [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: crystal waters sjc [FMYFL@aol.com] More Covers Giveaway craziness! [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Joni "duds" [Deb Messling ] update and thank you (njc) [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested [lfye@cresapar] Unfettered and Alive ["Sherelle Smith" ] Re: Joni "duds" ["Cynthia Vickery" ] Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC ["Donna Binkley"] Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC [FMYFL@aol.com] RE: Daryl Hall (NJC) ["Sherelle Smith" ] Democracy/republic NJC ["Lucy Hone" ] Re: Joni "duds" [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: More Covers Giveaway craziness! [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: rate your music ["StephenToogood" ] BBC IN CONCERT [PAUL LOGAN ] Re: Robert Palmer Haute Couture Rocker -njc [Jerry Notaro ] RE: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested ["Kate Bennett] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:23:42 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested kakki >ALL kinds of people in California are being hurt by the ineptness and corruption of Davis. But some will support him no matter what because all you are thinking about is the national election next year. Some people in California are more local and care about their livelihood and the destruction of their state before national politics.< lots of people have suffered during other california governors' terms & companies have been leaving california & moving to other states for much longer than davis has been in office...for me it has nothing to do with supporting davis (he's already in office & was elected to it) but it IS all about NOT supporting a recall which i find very very flawed... i am not & was never thrilled with davis either so i'm have no interest in defending his policies...however, as far as i know, 48 states are now considered bankrupt so california is hardly unique in that respect...even so, there are many factors to our state's financial woes & with so many other states in similar circumstances i think there is a bigger picture that is being ignored by folks who are so gung ho on the recall in this state... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:32:04 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies mia >This song is so dreamy, beautiful and hypnotic. Those key changes.....and those harmonies, sometimes together and sometimes drifting into a sort of polyphony. This is one of those songs that I'm constantly hitting the repeat button for on my CD player.< me too, i love it & the vocal harmonies & counter harmonies are chill factor...its kind of broadway musical to me... ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 00:49:44 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested Kate wroteL > lots of people have suffered during other california governors' terms & > companies have been leaving california & moving to other states for much > longer than davis has been in office... Davis came into office with a surplus of several billion dollars. Now there is a deficit of anywhere from $38 to $50 billion dollars. Companies have been moving to other states since before he came in. Why is that? Because we are the most overtaxed and over-regulated state in the U.S. Why is that? Why did he wait until after the last election to tell us we were billions in the hole - after all the propositions voting yes on spending billions more had passed? He did not work to solve any of the problems - he just arrogantly went along and is still going along bankrupting the state! >for me it has nothing to do with > supporting davis (he's already in office & was elected to it) but it IS all > about NOT supporting a recall which i find very very flawed... You don't have to support it. People have the opportunity to vote on it. Maybe it won't pass. However, all the polls from the beginning show a majority for it. Even all my friends and co-workers (all of whom are probably 98% Democrats) are for getting rid of Davis. They can't all have had their minds bent by Republican brainwashers! > i am not & was never thrilled with davis either so i'm have no interest in > defending his policies...however, as far as i know, 48 states are now > considered bankrupt so california is hardly unique in that respect... I'm interested in where you read that 48 states are now bankrupt. What I keep reading is that CA's debt is more than all the other states' debt combined. I read an analogy that it is if a person making $20,000 a year had a $5 million debt to pay off. >even so, there are many factors to our state's financial woes & with so many > other states in similar circumstances i think there is a bigger picture that > is being ignored by folks who are so gung ho on the recall in this state... There are so many bills that have been passed and are still being passed by Davis and the leglislature that you will never read about in the L.A. Times. I have mentioned a few of the laws passed that have been getting a lot of publicity and a more obscure one about everyone having to buy expensive products to catch stormwater. He just gave $120 million for preservation of wetlands here when the original deal was that the developer was to bear the cost of most of it. It's become insane. Who is going to pay for it all? The big corporations? Not at the rate things are going - they'll all be heading to Nevada. The residents? Yeah right. Too many of them are already wondering how they can afford to have a car anymore now that they have an extra $500-1,200 a year to pay to keep it registered. All this results in essential services being closed down - hospitals, schools, and other government funded institutions. They've already closed a third of the courthouses in L.A. last year because of the shortfall! The busiest, overburdened area for litigation in the state. What is so troubling is that if the bottom completely falls out, I can just hear people somehow blaming BUSH for it! Gawd!! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 11:23:56 +0100 From: tantra-apso Subject: health service? njc I am going for my myocardial perfusion test on Tuesday and Thursday next week. Not looking forwrad to it at all. All seems rather a waste. my last visit to hopsital had me on a an ecg machine for hours and i was in great pain and nothing showed on the ecg that was not normal, my pulse only bein 52bpm thanks to the Atenolol.This THIRD cardiologist also said the problem was not my heart but my spine. yet still I am going for this test and no one was lookingh into what is wrong with my spine. Having been in worsening pain since January, i finally decided to go privately. I am going for an MRI soon and will be paying about $1700 for it.(I am don't have private helath cover-John does but I am not hiswife or elgal partner-yet another reason we wnat equal rights) The consutlant I saw is concerned I have a tumour which is pressing on my spine. I have always defended our NHS but no more. it is terrible. I have been in limbo and a painful one for 9 mths now. I have been in hosptiital 3 times, by ambulance, have seen my gp countless times, and am taking about a half dozen different pills a day and still do not know what is wrong. How can this possibley be saving money? Maybe they are hoping I will die before they have to spend out big money. Anyone in the UK who has not got Private Health over and can afford it, I suggest you get it NOW. ps to MG-I wrote you from France, (back in first week Sept) Are you still at this address? - -- bw colin http://www.btinternet.com/~tantraapso/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 06:55:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: "Shades of Scarlett..." continued... now "Electricity" now njc --- "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" wrote: > That could be. Mike Timmins said that one can hear > "the air conditioning > equipment" on THE TRINITY SESSION. It wasn't until > decades later I found > out the recording was made in Toronto in NOVEMBER. > He said that a funace is > a kind of air conditing. What say, ye, McKay? > A funace? Air conditing? What language you speaking? OK, you probably mean furnace and air conditioning. I'm assuming it was a joke, meaning the heat part of the furnace wasn't working, but the fan was on, blowing just cold air. Or maybe it was a joke. Some people have to wait until it's REALLY cold before they want to turn the heat on. (I turned mine on because it's been really cold the last two days, but it still feels too early to have the furnace on!) ===== Catherine Toronto - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We all live so close to that line, and so far from satisfaction ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 06:59:12 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Joni duds In a message dated 02/10/2003 03:13:12 GMT Daylight Time, hvnphun16@hotmail.com writes: << "No Apologies" is a great song, too. >> To me it's half a great song; the first verse is tight, focused and full of righteous indignation; after that it loses focus and becomes a generalised moan. And I *still* find it jarring that that first verse about a wartime atrocity leads into a chorus about loan sharks and lawyers laying the country to waste. Pure bathos! << I guess if I had to pick a dud, I'd go with "Dancing Clown," "Good Friends," or "Snakes and Ladders." But, similar to what you once said before, a dud on a Joni-scale is still a great song when compared to another artist's collection. >> Agree with you about Dancing Clown (which I would categorise as a dud in "real terms" and not just by Joni's standards!) and Snakes & Ladders, and I'd add Number One and Reoccurring Dream from Chalk Mark as not meeting her usual benchmark. I've always liked Good Friends, though. It's *very* pop, and as such works very well to these ears; and I love the duetting with Michael McDonald, which seems much more organic than having Don Henley on Snakes & Ladders, Azeem in London NP: Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds (backed by the "Moron Tabernacle Choir") - The Curse of Millhaven. It's a grey Thursday morning, so listening to Murder Ballads just seemed like the right thing to do :-) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:10:20 EDT From: StDoherty@aol.com Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2003 #308 In a message dated 10/2/2003 3:01:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: Chris' Joni Duds.... 1.Lead Balloon 2.Dancin' Clown 3.Stay In Touch 4.Blue Boy (it just irritates the shit out of me, always has...) 5.Tax Free I'll stop at 5.... But will add a few runners up... 6.Tea Leaf Prophecy 7.Cool Water - - -Chris Stay In Touch is about as fine a song that Joni has ever written ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:31:26 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni duds In a message dated 10/2/2003 7:00:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, AzeemAK@aol.com writes: Agree with you about Dancing Clown (which I would categorise as a dud in "real terms" and not just by Joni's standards!) and Snakes & Ladders, and I'd add Number One and Reoccurring Dream from Chalk Mark as not meeting her usual benchmark. I'll 2nd, 3rd, & 4th that statement Azeem. I forget why I don't play CMIARS very often, and you just reminded me. With the exception of a few songs on that CD, CMIARS *is* Joni's duds imo. Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:48:26 EDT From: JSerkes@aol.com Subject: (no subject) "Good Friends," must have been one that Joni dug, cause its the first thing we hear one the cd (album for most of us). I loved it, it set the stage for Dog Eat Dog" Nyrogrl CrossEyed Productions 314.378.6052 "seeing things differently" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 07:49:18 EDT From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: donald o'connor (a patrick memory) njc Patrick, thanks for this memory. I also really loved his dancing and Moses Supposes is THE best part of Singing in the Rain!! Hugs, Ashara NPIMH: Moses supposes his toes are roses, but Moses supposes erroneously..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 08:17:06 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner.... OK, well not everyone, but ONE at least. Whoever gets the closest to the song printed in the hermetically sealed envelope wins a copy of the FABOO Joni Covers #45 + an Eastmountain South promo CD + a surprise Joni bonus! You veterans know how to play...for you newbies, here's what you do - just send me an email (offlist) and guess a song on one of Joni's albums, be sure and name both song & album, for instance: Michael From Mountains - Song To A Seagull That's all you have to do. I'll take guesses until Sunday midnight and announce a winner Monday AM. What better way to start your week than to hear that all these freebies are coming your way? Bob NP: Donald Fagen, "Chain Lightning" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 05:27:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested kakki wrote: Davis came into office with a surplus of several billion dollars. Now there is a deficit of anywhere from $38 to $50 billion dollars. hmm...that sounds so familiar..oh yeah Bush inherited a 287 billion dollar surplus and now we're in a record-breaking (in terms of amount and time taken to get there) 455 billion dollar hole - projected to reach 500 billion in the next year. Jenny - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- What if the Hokey Pokey *IS* what it's all about? - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 08:42:15 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies > Bob, my mission now in life is to convert you into liking POP. Well, I suppose there are worse things one could do with their life... :~) Because I value your opinion very highly Mia, I promise to give this song some additional eartime, but I don't know what I'm going to hear that I haven't heard before. It really is annoying to me on a couple different levels. > This song is so dreamy, beautiful and hypnotic. Are we talking about the same song? It's probably the only song from STAS that most Joni fans couldn't sing off the top of their heads because the melody is so jarring and inaccessible. While I appreciate the complexity of it, it sinks itself with it's own harmonic gimmickry. > Those key changes.....and those harmonies, sometimes together and sometimes > drifting into a sort of polyphony. We agree on this, but you see them as strengths, while I see them as weaknesses. Like, "how many key changes/chord changes/rhythmic changes/harmonic devices can I fit in 4 minutes"? It's Zappa-esque in that way, I think...at the end of the day there's not much to grasp. And speaking of not much to grasp, what about the song lyrically? I mean, what in THE HELL is it about? The 'Dancer' meets up with/ falls for the 'sailor/pirate' who then becomes 'Penance' (or not, maybe Penance is some kind of Greek chorus or something), then before you know it, 'Penance' says they're nowhere near the murder place...WHAT? Someone's been murdered? Who? The Dancer? No, because now she's in some kind of dazed stupor repeating "I don't know, I don't know..." so maybe she wasn't really murdered but just had the sense knocked out of her. (OK, I'm getting kind of silly now). But the bottom line is that this one is cryptic, but unlike the songs on HOSL I don't really care what any of it means! So Mia, you have an interesting "mission" on your hands. Perhaps one for "Mission:Impossible"! ;~) Bob NP: Julee Cruise, "Summer Kisses, Winter Tears" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 08:57:12 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC Bob writes: >That's all you have to do. I'll take guesses until Sunday midnight >and announce a winner Monday AM. What happened to giving one to "someone who lives in Florida" or "the first person that emails me and their last name starts with an S" ? You're changing the rules Muller :~) Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 09:04:49 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: crystal waters njc > second, she's flat on purpose. i think. it's style. > bending the notes. Patrick, I feel like I know a bent note when I hear one. But most of the notes here aren't bent, they're broken... Now, I admit that I didn't spin the rest of this CD after I dubbed Twisted to #45, so I can't comment on her greater ability as a jazz vocalist. But there are few bent or blue jazz notes on this recording, just flat ones, and an overall feel of Crystal not having a good sense of pitch. Take for example this phrase: "I knew I was a geeeeeeenius..." As a jazz vocal phrase, the bending of that last word works if the notes preceding it are where they are supposed to be, and if you dance correctly on the next phrase: "What's so strange when you know that you're a wizard at 3..." Joni sings it to perfection, whether through instinct, coaching, or practice, or rote memorization of her mentor Annie Ross's original take, she nails it. Ms. Waters, dancefloor diva though she may be, and kin of diva-ness as well...just doesn't have it. Paging Jimmy Stewart - bring in some back-up bro! Bob, delighted just the same to have an actual THREAD about one of his covers comps - whoo hoo!! NP: Can, "Last Night Sleep" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 08:30:21 -0500 From: Steve Polifka Subject: re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies -- now Joni duds Shear Lunacy! All of you! What Joni duds, I ask you; what? Dancin' Clown? LCL? NA? GF??? (One of my absolute faves which I will be doing at the next Jonifest, BTW.) I have yet to hear a Joni dud.(Well, okay, maybe Travelogue, but it is a rehash...) ;-) Dancin' Clown- simple fun, a great yarn. Last Chance Lost - when I first heard that song, I cried "Yes! It's about time!" Something about the way she sang that line - I got it without trying. No Apologies - Military heartlessness wrapped up in the same type of music. as someone said, brilliant. (It is not a favorite, but I do appreciate it.) Good Friends - total 80's pop- I love it, I have friends like that, and Michael McD is great. So there. (insert evil grin here) Steve At 08:06 PM 10/1/2003 -0700, Lori Fye wrote: >> "Pirate of Penance" from her debut is pretty much of a dud, and "No >> Apologies" from TTT is preachier than Lakota and Ethiopia, and offers >> even less melodic interest. > >I'm with Mia. I love POP and No Apologies! > >If I were to pick a dud off the top of my head, it would have to >be "Last Chance Lost." It kind of grates on my nerves. > >What's YOUR choice of Joni dud(s)? > > >Lori > >~ >http://lrfye.lunarpages.com >~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 09:35:35 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies Thanks much for your post, Jamie...very helpful. I suppose one of the drawbacks for me is that while she has it libretto'd to make you believe that it is a mini-play of kinds, there's not enough difference in the vocals to convey that. Additionally, Joni had so many songs that were stronger than this one going into her first session that I feel like she was hasty in including it. I would be delighted to have heard "Blue On Blue", "A Melody In Your Name", or especially "Just Like Me" (which could have been tremendously successful I think as a single) in its place. But at least you've helped this simple fool understand the storyline! I never mind putting my ignorance on display; it's the best way to learn. ;~) Bob NP: Jane Siberry, "Calling All Angels" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:38:50 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Last Chance Lost/Joni Duds I absolutely love this song. It may be my favorite on TI. I think it is Joni at her best. The guitar playing is wonderful, her voice, while husky, has some real strength to it still, the words are honed down to poetic perfection and her overlapped harmonies on the brief chorus are what I like best about Joni's work-the ability she has to nail intricate and difficult musical intervals, 2nds, 4ths, 9ths, etc. I have to echo the sentiment of whoever said they heard this and thought it was a real return to form for Joni. Ken H ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 09:48:42 -0400 From: "Suze Cameron" Subject: Robert Palmer Haute Couture Rocker -njc Gathering the mail today and I see this headline on my L'uomo Vogue magazine: Robert Palmer Haute Couture Rocker. There is a lovely interview where Robert talks about his latest CD, Drive. One particular quote caught me, where Robert stated that Drive is the first record he's made which he plays for his own pleasure. Drive is a 12 song set of covers. Very strange to read this article, with no note added on the fact that he has passed. Has anyone heard this record? How great that he got to finish this project before he died. Plus, it sounded like it was a complete joy to produce so what a high note to finish on. Patrick, thanks for posting about Donald O'Connor's death. I had no clue about this. He was a wonderful performer and you can tell when watching him that he loved what he was doing. We have lost a tremendous amount of talent this year. Gregory Hines, Katherine Hepburn, Gregory Peck, and the list goes on. Suze n.p. Sir Elton John on Ellen ____________________________________________________________ Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail! http://login.mail.lycos.com/r/referral?aid=27005 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:56:19 -0400 From: Dave Cuneo Subject: Joni "duds" Ciao Joniphiles, For me at least her biggest dud is "Jungle Line". I think this is the song that turned off many of her previous fans and began the career "descent". People suddenly realized she had clay feet. Which is somewhat ironic because the rest of the album is so good, and the first cut, (IFTKOMS) is so obviously an attempt at commercial success, similar to "Help Me" and "You Turn Me On I'm a Radio". I don't think she ever recovered from that song, careerwise. I know it took me until the early 90's to finally begin to listen to HOSL again and appreciate it's quality. This is true for everything that came after it as well - early to mid 90's before I listened again. And I was a HUGE Joni fan after FTR and C&S. Ciao, dave. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 09:54:55 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Pirates of Penance and No Apologies As Jamie's post to the list did not get through, I'm sending it on his behalf: > I love this song! It's a typical folk song, more in the vein of those lovely traditional English song-plays that were popular (at some point!). I can imagine someone like the McGarrigle's covering this as it would need more difference in the voices or maybe Eliza Carthy and her mum covering it. > > It concerns two women who have both fallen in love with a pirate who comes to port every so often and i just so happens that he is two-timing them. There is the Dancer and Penance Crane and the pirate. From the arguments that Penace Crane give, it would seem that the Dancer was the one who murdered the Pirate. We mainly hear Penance Crane as she has the louder voice in the mix and the Dancer get's second billing as the softer counter-melody. I know who I believe in terms of who actually murdered the Pirate but listen to it and come up with your own conclusion. Not a dud in my books. Just beautiful and beautifully written. I think the chord/key/metre changes are due to the changes in character, with 2 women singing it makes sense. It's a bugger to singer solo btw, as I've > tried!!!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:55:14 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: Last Chance Lost/Joni Duds In a message dated 10/2/2003 9:46:52 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jamie.zubairi@metrosafety.co.uk writes: how many voices are there harmonising? I count 3 on top of hers but I can't tell!!!!! I'm thinking there are three other voices on top of the lead. I'll dig out the sheet music and look at the chord itself and see if I can figure it out. I have good memories of singing it in the car with a friend out in Cali (who became a Joni fan of sorts) who could always pull out and harmonize the odd note that gives the chord it's tension. It's really cool to hear yourself in part of a choral sound when the harmonics are so broad and fun! For more amazing broad choral harmonic structure, I say check out the Bulgarian Women's Choir. Kate Bush did some work with them a while ago to brilliant effect, and I had been listening to them prior to that and seen them perform. They absolutely nail you to the wall when they open up and sing these incredible chords that, while very old and traditional, modulate at times like contemporary music. Ken h Ken H ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:58:29 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: crystal waters sjc In a message dated 10/2/2003 9:04:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, SCJoniGuy writes: >Paging Jimmy Stewart - bring in some back-up bro! I'll back you up all the way on this *twisted* issue. > ">What's so strange when you know that you're a wizard at 3..." I just cringe when Crystal sings that line. It gives me the fantods, and my dogs hide under the bed. She's just plain FLAT !!! I'd rather hear Roseanne sing the "Star Spangled Banner". But, I really like the rest of the CD. LOL IMO nobody (including Joni or Annie Ross) sings "Twisted" as well as Bette! Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 10:25:29 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: More Covers Giveaway craziness! Since #45 is so cool, I just can't bear keeping it all to myself, so I want to give more copies away. Therefore, freebies will also go to: The first one to mail me who has a Tennessee address; The first one to mail me whose LAST name starts with the letter "C". Go for it, and you too can decide...Crystal Waters, flat or phat! :~) Bob NP: Nat King Cole, When I Take My Sugar To Tea" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 11:00:21 -0400 From: Deb Messling Subject: Re: Joni "duds" Wow, I don't know what to say! "The Jungle Line" is one of my favorite songs; certainly it's my favorite HOSL song. The melody and the lyric are intriguing, Joni's singing is first-rate, and I love those drums. Of course, I'm weird, so I like Joni's "weird" stuff. I even love "The Wolf Who Lives in Lindsey." Duds? Most of my picks have been mentioned: The Windfall, Number One, Dancing Clown. I would add: Ladies Man At 09:56 AM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > For me at least her biggest dud is "Jungle Line". I think this is the >song that turned off many of her previous fans and began the career >"descent". - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- messling@enter.net - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 08:01:36 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: update and thank you (njc) Hi everyone. Wally tells me I've been a bit silent lately, so I thought I'd say hello. I've been lurking lately, getting back to "normal" life. The walk for the National Ovarian Cancer Coalition was a great success! Thank you so much to everyone who contributed. I raised over 5 times (yep, for those who contributed, I got even more support) the suggested amount! And I've been cancer free for just over a year now. That's a milestone I never thought I'd see. Now they're doing all kinds of analysis to figure out why the vaccines worked for me, and how to make them work for others. Maybe eventually this will save more lives. I hope so. I'll be lurking for the next week and a half - actually I'll be away on a vacation I've been looking forward to for 3 years. lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:13:24 -0400 From: lfye@cresapartners.com Subject: Re: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested Kakki, you've brought up some excellent points. Without knowing all of the background, I'll "step in it" and give you my usual uneducated, shoot-from-the-hip opinions. > Tell me truly if you believe in people who buy new cars > paying $1,200 a year for the freaking registration fee. > People with cars four years old are paying $500 a year > for registration. It doesn't seem fair to people who live in rural CA, but they're probably having to pay for the excesses of the people who live in the cities, where the wear and tear on the roads and smog containment must be quite costly. I have no idea why CA hasn't come up with a viable public transportation system, but until it does, then all the people driving constantly (and probably not carpooling) will have to pay for the luxury of doing so. > Tell me if you really believe illegal immigrants should be > entitled to drivers licenses which automatically give them > an opportinunity to VOTE per Clinton's motor-voter > legislation. Well, they probably WON'T vote, so is it really that big a deal? And if they do vote, hey, more power to them. At least they would be speaking up for themselves. Most people in the U.S. (let alone California) don't bother to register or vote, which is their own mistake. Sometimes I wonder if we shouldn't consider revoking citizenship based on apathy. > Tell me if you believe all businesses, not just the "big > corporations" but the mom and pop businesses should > be required to spend $100,000 in installing big sponges > under their properties to catch stormwater. And - all > property owners in CA will likewise have to do the same > in a few years. I would guess this would be because of the perceived "water shortage" in CA? If that's the reason and the solution, then everyone who is sucking water out of the ground out there is going to have to pay for it. Who else is going to pay for it? Where will the money come from? Let's face it: water is going to be the single most valuable commodity in the not-too-distant future. There will probably be wars fought over it. Pay now or pay later. > Tell me if you believe prison guards should not only be > paid $100,000 a year and be able to retire at 50 years old > and be paid $100,000 a year for the rest of their lives aas > a retirement benefit. First, look what prison guards do for a living. They probably should be paid so well, as should cops and firefighters and the military. As for retiring at 50, would you rather we have 65- and 70-year-old prison guards, or would it be better to have guards who are physicially fit and able to do the job? Regarding the generous retirement benefit, all kinds of politicians and others receive astronomical pensions, and by comparison most of them don't do a damn thing. If you want to continue to incarcerate people (rather than spend the money on programs to educate people so they'll have a chance for a good and decent life, and/or rehabilitate them if they screw up), then you have to pay somebody to keep them in line, and you have to pay them well so they'll stay in the job. Second, salaries are so out of whack in so many industries that it's difficult to complain about one over another. The federal minimum wage for most people working their butts off is $5.15 an hour ($10,712 a year based on a 40-hour work week); I wonder what the average intern in a politician's office earns? (Many people assume that all internships are unpaid; that's incorrect.) Third, my partner Mary and I took a trip to CA this summer with the thought of possibly moving there. Everywhere we looked, the cost of living was so high that we would each HAVE to make $100,000 a year just to live in a manner we would consider decent. (What is with CA, anyway??) > Tell me you believe that all in CA should pay for millions of > illegal immigrants' (who are not on the tax rolls) college > education. You would rather they not go to college and just continue to pick grapes and clean rich people's house? If CA has a sales tax, then they're paying taxes when they purchase goods and services. If they're renting an apartment, they're indirectly paying property taxes. And, other than Native American Indians, everyone in this country descended from from immigrants, some legal, many not. I get so tired of people claiming that they have more of a right to be in the U.S. than their neighbor does. > Tell me if you believe that Davis is not to blame for paying > utilities executives as advisors who told him to buy energy > contracts at the highest price on the market and lock CA > into paying off those contracts for the next several years. I'll agree with you on this one, but then I'll also have to liken it to Cheney and Enron and our (still secret) energy policy, and Halliburton and the rest of that mess. I don't think we've seen even the tip of that iceberg yet. > all for a freaking campaign contribution and/or kickback. Yep. Unfortunately, that's how it works across the board. It's wrong, but them's the breaks. > And all you think about is the national election?! Where is reality?! Mary is from Sacramento and her family still lives there, so I suppose I should think more about California than I do. Mary opposes the recall; I don't know her mom's and sister's opinions about it. I think more about the national election because I live 12 miles from the White House and it's in my face everyday, and because I truly believe that Bush, et al, are taking us down a very hellish path. I believe they're trying to put into place all the people who will help them win again. This worries me, and it should worry you too. This reminds me of a bumpersticker I saw recently: Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket? Lori ~ http://lrfye.lunarpages.com ~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 15:27:35 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: Unfettered and Alive Hi everyone, I was listening to my smooth jazz station yesterday morning when the radio personality, Al Santos, made a statement and used the phrase "Unfettered and Alive". Well, I almost fell out of my chair! Since I am a loyal listener trying to win a free plane trip for two to the Bahammas, I immediately hopped on the email and wrote to him. I told him that he had to be a Joni fan to use that phrase! This is the second time I've corresponded with him and he was kind enough to reply this morning with an "Oh Yeah!" comment as his first words. He said that he plays Joni sometimes during his Sunday Brunch program. I told him how happy I was to hear that and requested "Yvette in English" when he could play it next time. I told him that I didn't care if I missed it, but I wanted other people to know about Joni. I also told him about the JMDL and how close knit we are. Amazing! Sherelle _________________________________________________________________ Instant message in style with MSN Messenger 6.0. Download it now FREE! http://msnmessenger-download.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 10:18:51 -0500 From: "Cynthia Vickery" Subject: Re: Joni "duds" <> oh deb, me tooo!!!! "jungle line" was the only thing i listened to on HOSL until you guys on the list brow-beat me into giving the rest of the disc another chance. (embarrassingly enough, you guys were right - now it's my favorite joni disc!) and the much-despised "dancin' clown" is just plain fun, dang it! the joni-dancing-with-the-cat video catapulted this song into my list of favorites - it's just so full of joy! my "duds" - "yvette in english" - that annoyingly chirpy little repeating "yvette!" gives me hives. "last chance lost" - lyrically, this one is great. i just hate the drone-iness of the repeating "last chance lawwwwsssssttttttttt." "lakota" - heavy-handed and just yicky. most of travelouge - but that's another story for another day! cindy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 10:42:30 -0500 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC Oh bitch bitch bitch, Jimmy yer just mad because you can't delve into the deepest mind of the great Joni-Bob! ha ha! It's quite a task i'll admit! love ya, db >>> 10/2/2003 7:57:12 AM >>> Bob writes: >That's all you have to do. I'll take guesses until Sunday midnight >and announce a winner Monday AM. What happened to giving one to "someone who lives in Florida" or "the first person that emails me and their last name starts with an S" ? You're changing the rules Muller :~) Jimmy This message has been scanned by the E250. This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:50:55 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Covers #45 Step right up, everyone's a winner....NJC Donna Binkley aka The Texas Tush writes: > Oh bitch bitch bitch, Jimmy yer just mad because you can't delve into > the deepest mind of the great Joni-Bob! ha ha! It's quite a task i'll > admit! > And to think I was going to suggest to Bob, "Texas" as the state and "B" as the first letter of the last name. Then you could have had yourself 2 copies of Covers #45 and listen to Crystal Waters "Twisted" in your living room AND your bathroom. That could relieve constipation for anyone :~) Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 16:39:52 +0000 From: "Sherelle Smith" Subject: RE: Daryl Hall (NJC) Dear Mack, Still behind on the digest but gaining ground! You are so welcome! I heard the remake of "She's Gone" but wasn't sure it was him until they announced it on the radio this morning. This album is definitely on my wish list. Glad that I could be of service! Love, Sherelle Sherelle, you are the greatest. I had no idea that Daryl had a new album out until you mentioned the tune. He didn't tout this album during the concert or if he did I missed it. Purchased it today. Different effort from him as it doesn't have any r and b overtones, which I love, but nevertheless is quite good, and that is on first listen. He also does a new version of 'she's gone.' Actually, reading the liner notes, not really sure when this album came out as it is not mentioned at all. Will have to run to their site to find that out. Anyway, thanks Sherelle. mack np: daryl hall- _________________________________________________________________ Get MSN 8 Dial-up Internet Service FREE for one month. Limited time offer-- sign up now! http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:26:25 +0100 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Democracy/republic NJC Hey its Queen Lulu here... been lurking a lot... See below my post re Kate's and Lori's exchange.... I seem to remember that Russia was a group of REpublics... Union of Soviet Socialist Republics... as it was ... and since they have now devolved into their own states... need a good old dose of heavy socialist republicanism to get them all back on track!!!! Who was it said that "the only way to assuage the chaos following the fall of a dicatorship, can only be resolved by a strong dictator!... The world is an odd place isn't it.... I dont think it matters whether you call it a republic, a democracy, a monarchy or a commune... all of them seem to be run by men (predominantly) who have a thirst for power, a disregard for the real needs of the people, and ignore the common sense of some of their less lofty advisors... And is there any way we can change it by voting out the people that got put in?.... ERRRRRRRR NOPE!!!!.. because there is a long line of other power thirsty people just waiting to take their places.... Hmmmmm.. wishing there was a dog food called Tony Blair so I could feed it to my hound....... HO hum.... Lucy From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: democracy/repbublic njc so why do we (myself included) keep using the word democracy? kate, who obviously needs brushing up on her political science history lori > Well, it never really was a democracy, Kate. < ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 13:23:09 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni "duds" > and the much-despised "dancin' clown" is just plain fun, dang it! > the joni-dancing-with-the-cat video catapulted this song > into my > list of favorites - it's just so full of joy! I'll admit to liking the video (with the sound turned down), and agree that it's fun & joyful, but why is the song itself fun? IMO if you want "fun" Joni, play "Raised On Robbery", with it's boogie-woogie beat and lines like "I'm a pretty good cook, sittin' on my groceries...come up to to my kitchen, I'll show you my best recipes..." Fun. Coyote (regardless who it's about) is another "fun" Joni song, again combining the playful interplay between her guitar and Jaco's bass, and several injections of humor. Fun. But "Dancin' Clown?" While the thinly-veiled plot is frivolous to be sure, Joni gives us 3 one-dimensional characters, that we know little about and therefore care nothing about. And musically it suffers from the worst of the 80's musical pop cliches; although I admire Steve Stephens guitar in the right setting, it's out of place here. Much more phony than funny. And for all the announcements about Tom Petty being here, he sings all of 5 words. Bob, wondering if Joni should have issued a "Duds" along with Hits & Misses? :~) NP: Graham Nash, "Simple Man" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 13:51:01 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: More Covers Giveaway craziness! > Am I too late??? Nope - right on time, Sue Cameron with a "C"! Send your address to me and Covers #45 is on its way...congrats! Bob NP: Joni, "Judgement of the Moon & Stars" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 18:50:25 +0100 From: "StephenToogood" Subject: Re: rate your music Yes this is a great site - came across it about a month ago. As you can see from the top 100 most of the users have great taste in music and Joni also appears in certain year top 100's quite high up. So far I've done a few reviews including a few of Joni's. ************** Steve T amelio@sev47.fsnet.co.uk "Red is autumn green is summer Greens are turning and the sand" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "mack watson-bush" To: "joni" Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2003 12:05 PM Subject: rate your music > Has anyone else found 'rate your music?' A fun website where one is able to > rate albums. I don't know how they come upon their ratings that are listed on > the main page but charles mingus' album 'the black saint and the sinner lady' > is rated number one. Dear Joan is at number 14 with 'Blue.' > > mack > > np: Daryl Hall-Can't Stop Dreaming. (Thank you, thank you, thank you > Sherelle Smith) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 11:08:06 -0700 From: PAUL LOGAN Subject: BBC IN CONCERT Did anyone in the UK happen to see & record this??? http://66.218.71.225/search/cache?p=joni+mitchell+on+bbc+4&sub=Search&url=Sz PhZMA5TTAJ:www.bleb.org/tv2/channel.html%3fch=bbc4%26all%26day=5 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2003 14:20:37 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Robert Palmer Haute Couture Rocker -njc On 10/2/03 9:48 AM, "Suze Cameron" wrote: > n.p. Sir Elton John on Ellen And wasn't he great! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:29:45 +0100 From: "StephenToogood" Subject: Re: American Indian song subject > >In the case of "Lakota", I think the Indian American thing is an issue that > is so easy to preach about that a lot of artists jump on the opportunity > (i.e. Enigma in "The Cross of Changes"). It kinda sickens me, actually. > - - Dylan< Well I think most of CMIARS is lousy full stop! However Tori Amos has done a good job with this subject on _Scarlet's Walk_. There is at least a reference in almost every song. Tori is part Cherokee so she really can see things from both sides. Here are the lyrics to "Wampum Prayer" from the album: In our hand an old old old thread Trail of Blood and Amens Greed is the gift for the sons of the sons Hear this prayer of the wampum This is the tie that will blind us NP: The Lamb Ran Away With The Crown (live) - Judee Sill ************** Steve T amelio@sev47.fsnet.co.uk "Red is autumn green is summer Greens are turning and the sand" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:47:50 +0100 From: "StephenToogood" Subject: Re: Joni "duds" "The Jungle Line" is marvellous! Hated it at first but love it now. You get the full effect with headphones. It's so original and I love the way Joni sings those lows. Also love "Pirate Of Penance". Those chords really set the mood for the story and the way Joni's sing up and down is amazing. Also sounds great with headphones. "No Apologies" - well okay it's by far not one of her best but definitely not a dud. The song sounds a bit MOR in places but really stands out for me on TTT. Oh no "Blue Boy" is a really beautiful sad song. At first I thought it quite weak with the rest of LOTC but know it has stood the test of time for me. "The Windfall" is one of the better songs on NRH. It can make me laugh sometimes but the music really emphasizes the lyrics. Okay real duds! Well I listened to "Dancing Clown" again the other day - OMG the things I do for Joni! Just as I remembered really terrible. I would feel insulted even if it was a bonus track. "Underneath The Streetlight" - no still nothing! NP: Blue Boy - Joni ************** Steve T amelio@sev47.fsnet.co.uk "Red is autumn green is summer Greens are turning and the sand" - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deb Messling" To: Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 4:00 PM Subject: Re: Joni "duds" > Wow, I don't know what to say! "The Jungle Line" is one of my favorite > songs; certainly it's my favorite HOSL song. The melody and the lyric are > intriguing, Joni's singing is first-rate, and I love those drums. > > Of course, I'm weird, so I like Joni's "weird" stuff. I even love "The > Wolf Who Lives in Lindsey." > > Duds? Most of my picks have been mentioned: The Windfall, Number One, > Dancing Clown. I would add: Ladies Man > > > > > At 09:56 AM 10/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > For me at least her biggest dud is "Jungle Line". I think this is the > >song that turned off many of her previous fans and began the career > >"descent". > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Deb Messling -^..^- > messling@enter.net > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 11:55:24 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: california recall njc for bob & anyone else interested > And all you think about is the national election?! Where is reality?! Bush political advisers met with Schwarzenegger in 2001 about the prospect of Schwarzenegger running for CA governor in 2002. The New York Times reported on the meeting, "That would be nice, Mr. Rove said of the prospect of a Governor Schwarzenegger. That would be really nice. That would be really, really nice." [New York Times, 4/15/01] Schwarzenegger visited the White House for a meeting with top Bush adviser Karl Rove on April 12th, 2003. Both Schwarzenegger and Rove claimed that politics was not discussed during the meeting. [Washington Post, 4/13/03] "Bush isn't staying entirely out of the election. His liaison in California, businessman Gerald Parsky, summoned representatives of potential Republican candidates to his office Tuesday to discuss how the GOP could help recall Davis." [Sacramento Bee, 7/30/03] Mindy Tucker (Bush spokesperson in the 2000 election and currently a high level Bush campaign strategist) is involved in the recall election strategy & said, "We've identified some areas where the recall will help us build the party -- not only for the recall, but also for '04, which everyone believes is important." [San Francisco Chronicle, 8/6/03] ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #498 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)