From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #367 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, July 22 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 367 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Today in History: July 21 [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] re: MOJO rates buying Joni Mitchell ["c Karma" ] Re: MOJO rates buying Joni Mitchell [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Re on of my cars got torched NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band", njc [Randy Remote ] Re: Steely Dan (njc) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Steely Dan (njc) ["Music Is Special" ] Re: Steely Dan (njc) [AzeemAK@aol.com] ALL MESSAGES FROM PAST WEEK UNREAD, PLEASE RESEND TO NEW ADDRESS ["David ] Re: For Free, now Electricity/FTR [Bobsart48@aol.com] Re: That Cloying LOTC [Bobsart48@aol.com] Today in History: July 22 [ljirvin@jmdl.com] Today's Library Links: July 22 [ljirvin@jmdl.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 07:53:27 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Today in History: July 21 In a message dated 7/21/2003 1:00:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, ljirvin@jmdl.com writes: > Joni was joined onstage by flutist James Galway, performing with a pre-recorded backing track on the song "Goodbye, Blue > Sky." Further to this, both the CD and DVD have been remastered and re-released as of about a month ago. Don't know that it's truly worth having imo, but Joni's contribution is really nice. Bob NP: Becker & Fagen, "Red Giant/White Dwarf" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 14:35:35 +0000 From: "c Karma" Subject: re: MOJO rates buying Joni Mitchell Les wrote: The performances on MOA apparently 'calls to mind Steely Dan at their best'. Comments anyone? We will go ' round and 'round on this new "best" list, I'm sure. But I was surprised to see MOA on the list, and suspect its inclusion is good as a sampler, although for the record my HO discounts it to number 10. While it has many moments that clearly preserve the familiar loving rapport Joni had (has) with her audience, some of the musical moments leave me wondering i.e., MOA's RNH: "Who in the WWOOOOOORRRRRLLLLLDDDD?" I shudder. If MOJO chose HOSL as their pick for numero uno and felt the need to draw a Steely Dan comparison, they should also have made note that both HOSL and MOA preceded "Aja", widely considered Steely Dan's high point. The chicken came before the egg in this case. "Comparisons are odorous," wrote Bill. CC "They toss around your latest golden egg." -- JM _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:00:56 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: MOJO rates buying Joni Mitchell In a message dated 7/21/2003 9:35:35 AM Eastern Standard Time, ckarma@hotmail.com writes: > While it > has many moments that clearly preserve the familiar loving rapport Joni had > (has) with her audience, some of the musical moments leave me wondering > i.e., MOA's RNH: "Who in the WWOOOOOORRRRRLLLLLDDDD?" I > shudder. I don't shudder at any of MOA, far from it. To me it signifies early on that Joni was not going to be a jukebox and just "give the people what they want" as she uses a concert venue to update her sound in general, introduce 2 new songs never released, and re-invent her "hits" in new context. Even the MOA version of BSN has those 'bent' notes at the end of the 2nd line, like 'ice cream castles in the air" where it appears she's going flat but really she's not. Everytime I hear MOA I enjoy it & appreciate it even more. As for the Dan, I don't know that I'd agree that "Aja" is widely considered their finest hour, though many would say so. Many other sources (Rock Guide, All-Music Guide) point to Pretzel Logic as the best of the Dan. As for me, it's a tough call as they had a 70's run almost as masterful as Joan herself. But I would say you're right in that Joni was not influenced by SD but most likely the other way 'round. Bob NP: Steely Dan, "Bodhisattva" 6/3/00 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 09:52:56 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: Re on of my cars got torched NJC how awful vince, i hope you had insurance to cover this...glad you are okay too... kate www.katebennett.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:30:53 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Steely Dan (njc) Bob wrote: > As for the Dan, I don't know that I'd agree that "Aja" is widely > considered their finest hour, though many would say so. Maybe in dispute as their finest but I remember when I first listened to it being blown away and thinking it had to rank as one of the greatest albums ever created. > Many other sources (Rock Guide, All-Music Guide) point to Pretzel Logic as > the best of the Dan. As for me, it's a tough call as they had a 70's > run almost as masterful as Joan herself. My personal best of Dan would be half the tunes from Countdown to Ecstacy and half from Katy Lied. > But I would say you're right in that Joni was not influenced by SD but > most likely the other way 'round. I don't think either influenced the other but they definitely admired and respected each other and maybe bolstered each other to continue being innovative. Kind of like a Laura Nyro thing ;-) > NP: Steely Dan, "Bodhisattva" 6/3/00 Oooo! My very favorite SD song! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:49:50 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band", njc "Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu" wrote: > Right. On to the question. My question to you JMDLers is "Is the > black-label Capitol that says 'STEREO' at the top of the front cover more > valuable than the orange-label Capitol?" The black label is the original 60's label, so, all else being equal, it is worth more. > Are either of these going to pay for my trip to the L.A. JoniFest? Maybe if you live in San Diego : ) > Since > everyone who speaks English either as a first language or a second one (Hi > John) already has a copy, these are worth nothing, right? True, their value is diluted by their sheer numbers. Record condition is the other determinant. I recently saw an original sealed copy of the white album go for over $1400. A look at ebay shows a US black label stereo copy of Sgt Pepper with insert in M- (mint minus) condition for sale for $55 with no bidders after 4 days. Most of the Beatles discs were also released in mono- a mint copy of Pepper in mono would be worth considerably more. The runout groove you describe, I believe, was never on the US release, only the first UK pressing. You can hear it at the end of the CD, too. RR ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:52:30 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Joni's PWWAM on cable Joni's concert video, Painting with Words and Music will be shown on the cable network Trio on Tuesday July 22 at 9AM & again at 3PM (EST). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 16:08:25 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Steely Dan (njc) > Maybe in dispute as their finest but I remember when I first listened to it > being blown away and thinking it had to rank as one of the greatest albums > ever created. And I certainly didn't mean to dismiss it in any way! Back in those days, I used to keep a stock of cassette tapes, and record my LP's to tapes, typically two LP's on 1 tape. Aja was the ONLY record I ever put on BOTH sides of the 90 minute tape because when it was over I only wanted to hear it all again. (And I even filled out the tape with "FM" off of the soundtrack) A true sonic wonder - and the drums are so exciting on this LP it spoiled me for what they're doing now which I find very boring. Bob NP: Steely Dan, "Rikki Don't Lose That Number" 3/20/74 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 15:37:49 -0500 From: "Music Is Special" Subject: Re: Steely Dan (njc) Here is one vote for Gaucho as their best, especially Third World Man eric ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 17:47:20 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: Steely Dan (njc) I'd count myself as a Steely Dan agnostic. I had Can't Buy A Thrill years ago, but I thought it was inconsistent, and didn't like the "other" singer's voice (David Palmer, was it?). I love individual songs, but overall I find them a bit, erm, dare I say it, passionless. I've got a 2 CD compilation which is probably as much Dan as I'll need. For Christine Collister fans: she once did a terrific version of Black Friday in a concert I saw - the same one where she covered Sex Kills, actually, now I come to think of it (Joni Content!). And in a revue called Hell Bent Heaven Bound, she also had a spirited stab at Show Biz Kids, which I'd never heard at the time. When I got to hear their version, I thought it sounded a bit flat by comparison. Azeem in London NP: The Fatima Mansions - Valhalla Avenue (blimey, strong stuff - anyone else like this band??) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 18:11:38 -0400 From: "David Callan" Subject: ALL MESSAGES FROM PAST WEEK UNREAD, PLEASE RESEND TO NEW ADDRESS heartcorps@hotmail.com. Also, in the tradition of Whitman, Dickinson, Shakespeare, Woolf and so on, I have self-published my manuscripts at my website http://www.geocities.com/djcallan1/index.html. Sorry to EXQUISITE CORPSE & TAMPA REVIEW, but considering the lack of response to my inquiries, I had to assume you were no longer publishing and therefore the copyright of these poems reverted to me. So sue me if I was wrong![IMAGE] I'd rather be a gay folksinger anyway![IMAGE] [IMAGE]"You don't like the sound of the truth coming from my mouth. You say that I lack the proof, well baby that might be so. I might wake up at the end of my life - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 00:31:31 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: For Free, now Electricity/FTR In a message dated 7/20/03 9:22:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time, SCJoniGuy writes: > Electricity is an interesting pick to add to that list, Bob. You could have > gone with "Let The Wind Carry Me", which is clearly autobiographical and all > in the first person. Electricity is not so clear, maybe because I'm not in > tune with whose names are being named here. So if it's just my ignorance > please excuse me. > Well, I think I recall this song being pretty much dissected within the past year. All of the other songs I had named had pretty obvious "inside" references to other people in her life/circle (autobiographical sketches are obvious about whom they portray, by definition - third person descriptions can - and often if not generally are - more anonymous, and most often not about another famous person. Willy (Nash's nickname, no?), Rainy Night House (lots of past references to probable Leonard Cohen sketch), then the obvious See You Sometime (pack your suspenders) and the less obvious FTR (also about JT). But Electricity (while the song that he sang her to soothe her to sleep runs all through her circuits like a hearbeat) sounds for all the world to my ears like her looking at Carly and James after her relationship with James flamed out. Given the timing of this song, is there any reasonable chance that this is not about that menage a trois ? Perhaps, but it would surprise me more than Ben Curtis's becoming the Champion Golfer For The Year :-) Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 01:04:30 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: That Cloying LOTC > In a message dated 7/18/2003 11:40:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > jlamadoo@fuse.net writes: > > > I may have to surrender my decoder ring when this is widely known but > > LADIES > > OF THE CANYON often strikes me, in places as cloying. > > This has been my initial opinion as well, but I didn't "grow up" with LOTC, > I > pretty much grew up with everything from C&S forward and didn't go back > until > I signed up here which was 1998, so I've had only 5 years with it. One of > the > things that striked me the most about is the introduction of new "colors" on > > this record, where STAS and Clouds feel VERY *solo*, much of LOTC feels more > > corporate - for example in 'For Free', that clarinet ending. It sounds to > these > ears that Joni was starting to play with some of her jazz & orchestral > paints > that would flower much further on FTR. Well, Jim, I can understand how you would feel LOTC is cloying in the sense that it is overly sentimental. And in the other sense, too - that it is almost sickening how many beautiful songs run into each other one after another - it could also be considered cloying. However, LOTC was my very first JM album, and I sat up all the night to listen to Joni, to hear, who in the world she might be. And if LOTC satiated me with an overdose of chocolates, it was a delicious assortment of sweet and bittersweet, some filled with cherries, and others with nuts and caramels and coconut. On the bittersweet side we have For Free, Conversation, The Arrangement, Rainy Night House, The Priest, Blue Boy and Woodstock. On the sweet side there is Morning Morgantown, LOTC, Willy, Big Yellow Taxi and The Circle Game. Really, the first 9 songs were delicious - and then she hits us with the 3 hits to close things out. For the work of a 26 year old (some written earlier, no doubt), it was quite a collection. Was anyone really expecting Hejira yet at that point ? Sort of like, from the current era.............er, uh, well, um, you know, I mean, what's his or her name...........well, maybe not.....Of course, when she got finished with LOTC, there was nothing left in her tank, so her next record was that bomb Blue, followed by 5 or 6 other stinkers in a row................ Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 02:38:08 -0400 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today in History: July 22 1978: Joni was called onstage for the second encore of the Crosby, Stills and Nash concert at Madison Square Garden to help sing "Teach Your Children". Rolling Stone commented (in issue #274) that "she sounded terrible, but you could hardly hear her, anyway." 1979: Joni performed in New York City 1983: Joni performed at Meriwether Post Pavillion in Maryland - ---- For a comprehensive reference to Joni's appearances, consult Joni Mitchell ~ A Chronology of Appearances: http://www.jonimitchell.com/appearances.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 02:38:08 -0400 From: ljirvin@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Library Links: July 22 On July 22 the following article was published: 2000: "Would Joni Mitchell please shut up" - Vancouver Sun (Opinion) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/view.cfm?id=737 ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #367 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)