From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #246 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, April 16 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 246 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: OVA njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] ****JONI AND JAMES**** [Cactustree78@aol.com] Re: ****JONI AND JAMES**** ["kakki" ] hotmail closing NJC ["mike pritchard" ] tunnel of love njc ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: hotmail closing NJC [Kellerfrau@gmx.de] Paradise Lost (no Milton content) [Gordon Mackie ] OVA and tunnel of love njc ["Lori Fye" ] Re: hotmail closing NJC [Jerry Notaro ] RE: men and boys... NJC ["Lori Fye" ] media moguls (njc) U.S. political content [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: OVA njc [AsharaJM@aol.com] Re: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc [Jenny Goodspeed ] RE: OVA njc ["theodore" ] Re: OVA njc ["chuty001" ] Re: I's A Muggin -- NJC [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: I's A Muggin' -- NJC [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: media moguls (njc) U.S. political content ["Lori Fye" ] RE: OVA njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP ["theodore" ] A Mighty Wind (NJC) [Steve Dulson ] Re: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: OVA njc ["chuty001" ] Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) Parker Posey ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: Now, how is it Nambla & Joni are related?? ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Re: Now, how is it Nambla & Joni are related?? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: Dar Williams njc [Jenny Goodspeed ] NJC Re: OVA njc [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Gertrude Stein of music NJC for sure ["mike pritchard" ] Re: ****JONI AND JAMES**** NNC (no nambla content) [Doug ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 04:02:50 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: OVA njc oh gosh! ted! heather is the most respectable person you could ever think of. she was just being a LITTLE facetious. please don't get carried away, man!!!! and i also love your style. wally - -----Mensaje original----- De: theodore [mailto:theodore@buckfush.org] Enviado el: Miercoles, 16 de Abril de 2003 03:29 a.m. Para: 'Wally Kairuz' CC: joni@smoe.org Asunto: RE: OVA njc With a box like that, you almost have to share! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 04:07:56 -0400 From: Cactustree78@aol.com Subject: ****JONI AND JAMES**** I got a gift this weekend of Joni and James at the Royal Albert Hall...Ive never heard this before and I was amazed at the quality of the sound...Im not a huge fan of James but after hearing this I may get a cd...Does anyone know if they were dating at the time of this show..They have some really "cute" banter...Its cool to hear James trying to keep up with our Joan..Besides all of the great Joni songs on there I am in love with this James Taylor song "You can close Your Eyes"..sung with Joni...They sound magical together...Did they perform together regularly??She remarks on the cd that they should be a duo..Talk about a "supergroup"...If ACOY is supposed to be about James it musta been heartbreaking for her to sing it with him on the guitar and Joan on the Appalachian Dulcimer..(its so cute that she adds the appalachian)This was a great gift.. my friend said that Joni sent it to him from her personal collection but hes full of sh**..But a great friend indeed ;) I reccomend this highly I know that alot of you may have it but if not try and find it..Its really really good....Hope you all have a fine day...***KEV*** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 01:28:02 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: ****JONI AND JAMES**** Kevin, That appearance was around time of the height of their relationship and it shows in the beautiful performances. I don't recall ever hearing that they performed together too many other times, but she did contribute a bit on vocals on his Mud Slide Slim album and some of his songs on it seem to be about her. I'm not sure that Case of You is about James. We had a discussion here a while ago trying to figure out who it was about but I don't think we ever came to any final conclusions. I think Case of You may have been composed before she started seeing him. This is so funny: >This was a great gift.. my friend said that Joni sent it to him from her personal collection but hes full of sh**..But a >great friend indeed ;) LOL - I think you should ask your friend to see what else he can obtain from her personal collection (but you must share any bounty with us ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:42:28 +0200 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: hotmail closing NJC Anyone out there heard (a rumour) about Hotmail closing in 7 days and asking everyone to send 10 names? Smells like data mining to me, but can anyone clear this up for me? Cheers, Mike in Barcelona ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 01:51:46 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: tunnel of love njc >Do you think Springsteen was inspired by his memory of the "Tunnel Of Love" sign in Rose's picture?< yes, i went on the tunnel of love ride at pt pleasant (just up the coast from asbury pk) as a kid (btw, the pt pleasant roller coaster is in the credits on that song)...however the tunnel of love is anything but...it was a very scary ride (for a kid) & if you listen to the words of the song you will see that it is written with that metaphor in mind... www.katebennett.com "Lyrically, it's a work of art overall. Brilliant writing, absolutely." Indie-music.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:06:45 +0200 (MEST) From: Kellerfrau@gmx.de Subject: Re: hotmail closing NJC > Anyone out there heard (a rumour) about Hotmail closing in 7 days and > asking everyone to send 10 names? Smells like data mining to me, but can anyone > clear this up for me? Cheers, Mike in Barcelona It's a hoax. What else should it be... Why should Hotmail close? Why should anyone have to tell you via e-mail instead of Hotmail letting you know? Why should you send ANY mail to TEN names? Asking someone to forward a mail to a specific number of people is ALWAYS a chain mail characteristic. Please never send any "warnings" to your friends etc.! It will only generate millions of e-mails that are annoying and completely useless. If you are in doubt about the contents of a mail, check the anti-virus and hoax info pages on the Web. Some of them are: http://www.f-secure.com/virus-info/hoax/ http://hoaxbusters.ciac.org/ moni - -- +++ GMX - Mail, Messaging & more http://www.gmx.net +++ Bitte ldcheln! Fotogalerie online mit GMX ohne eigene Homepage! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:52:51 +0100 From: Gordon Mackie Subject: Paradise Lost (no Milton content) Hello my friends Re the sorrow/sore-oh/saw-row etc thread, the other word I love Joni saying is 'paradise', which to my ear sounds like 'peradise'. To mimic my pronunciation you would have to say pah-rah-dize. Er..I now need to get a life...lol Gordon in truly sunny Scotland..honest ! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:59:56 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: OVA njc In a message dated 4/16/2003 1:29:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, theodore@buckfush.org writes: > ladies and gentleman that was neil hamburger the > funniest man in cyberspace, Ted, please refrain from booking Neil again. Your message was one of the most disgusting and inapproapriate things I've seen here in a long time. "Unmoderated" shouldn't imply "No standards". Bob NP: Joni, "Refuge Of The Roads" Autry Museum show, 1/26/95 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 05:10:16 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: OVA njc > "my my ... this one's a candidate for the *Goodyear* model" Too fecking funny, Heather ... TOO FECKING FUNNY!!! My grandparents and uncle were career Goodyear employees; they always held family reunions at Wingfoot Park near Akron. I saw my second concert at the Akron Rubber Bowl. Coincidentally (is there such a thing?) I once lived in Goodyear, Arizona ... but with all this Goodyear knowledge, I never knew the company made diaphragms! ; ) Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 05:14:32 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: OVA and tunnel of love njc OVA and tunnel of love within the same hour ... see? There are NO COINCIDENCES! : D Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:15:59 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: hotmail closing NJC Mike, I'm sure it is a hoax. Jerry mike pritchard wrote: >Anyone out there heard (a rumour) about Hotmail closing in 7 days and asking >everyone to send 10 names? Smells like data mining to me, but can anyone clear >this up for me? Cheers, >Mike in Barcelona ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 05:21:35 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: RE: men and boys... NJC > on ...off .... 0 ... 1 Sorry Theodore, but you have your numbers backwards. On = 1 Off = 0 Therefore, on ... off ... 1 ... 0 Lori, a big fan of the binary system ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 06:12:32 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: media moguls (njc) U.S. political content I've debated sharing this with the list. In June, the FCC in the U.S. will decide whether to lift the final regulations on who can own which media outlets in the U.S. If they do so, ALL media will be controlled by a handful of corporations. It could result in all your news being controlled by one corporation. I've sent the following to the FCC chairman (his email is at the top, if you'd care to email him as well.) I think of Joni and her rants over the years against the "star maker machinery" and the music industry. This not only effects the entertainment industry, but news as well. I suspect she'd be against this final de-regulation... Thanks for listening. lots of love Anne WHAT I WROTE TO THE FCC CHAIRMAN AT mpowell@fcc.gov Dear Mr. Powell; I am writing to implore you not to further de-regulate the communications / broadcasting industry. The existence of a diversified media is essential to democracy. Further de-regulation will assure that all news dissemination in this country will be controlled by a few corporations. If anything, the industry need further regulations resulting in breaking up what is fast becoming a communications cartel. The airwaves belong to the people, not corporations. I urge to to act on the behalf of American citizens, not these few corporations. Sincerely, Anne Sandstrom ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 09:49:52 EDT From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: OVA njc Bob wrote: > Ted, please refrain from booking Neil again. Your message was one of the > most disgusting and inapproapriate things I've seen here in a long time. > > "Unmoderated" shouldn't imply "No standards". > I must finally speak up here. I totally agree with Bob. This, Ted, is absolutely *not* the kind of thing that I have ever seen here, and I've been around for over 6 or 7 years. One of the things I've loved about this list is that the discussions are usually intelligent and well thought out, and the humor is usually tempered with grace. I feel that the JMDL holds itself to high standards just by the fact that there are such incredible people that belong to it. I enjoy most of the discussions here and find most of the debates interesting, even though I might not be comfortable with all of it. But this truly goes way over the line, at least for me. I've so enjoyed the fact that the list has returned to an interesting place again. Please think before you post! Hugs, with outrage, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 06:57:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc Unfortunately...and I don't mean to be critical...but in my opinion, (omg could I be more passive agressive?) ...I believe Dar has made a decision to try and write to please the masses more and her songwriting has suffered greatly. I haven't bought her new CD, but I listened to some of the songs and read most of the lyrics from them and they seem purposely mediocre...unchallenging, uninteresting. I respect a person's choice to try and have more mass appeal, I just miss the stellar kind of writing that we find on "The Honesty Room" and "Mortal City". Jenny - --- Kate Bennett wrote: > thank you for the beautiful song...dar is up there > with joni & this song is > evidence but you really have to hear her sing it for > the full impact... > > www.katebennett.com > "Lyrically, it's a work of art overall. > Brilliant writing, absolutely." > Indie-music.com ===== "Now I used to think that I was cool running around on fossil fuel, until I saw what I was doing was driving down the road to ruin..." JT The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:10:18 -0700 (PDT) From: magsnbrei Subject: Re: OVA njc thanks Ashara and Bob for speaking out. A great big ME TOO here. Ted, this kind of post is completely uncalled for . Ive never seen anything like this ever, on the jmdl, in the three years that Ive been part of this community. Sure, we may disagree on issues but this was WAY over the top. This post of yours was completely offensive , inappropriate and insulting. NOT funny!!!!!!!!!! a very angry Mags. You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:16:36 -0700 From: "theodore" Subject: RE: OVA njc Maybe we should start up a really offensive thread by and for heterosexuals. Are there enough of us on the JMDL to support that? We'll talk about oversized vaginas for starters and see who gets uns*bbed first. How long do you think it would take? Six hours? Twelve? Who wants to start? Lama I'm sorry I was deliberately being waaayy unfunny ... it's soooo not funny it's almost funny, I really thought the entire vagina thread was a deliberately sick joke ... good thing I didn't post the limerick. Ok what do you get when you cross a gorilla with a ... Ba doom tsssssh Lama guy made me do it, Ted - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of AsharaJM@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 6:50 AM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: OVA njc Bob wrote: > Ted, please refrain from booking Neil again. Your message was one of the > most disgusting and inapproapriate things I've seen here in a long time. > > "Unmoderated" shouldn't imply "No standards". > I must finally speak up here. I totally agree with Bob. This, Ted, is absolutely *not* the kind of thing that I have ever seen here, and I've been around for over 6 or 7 years. One of the things I've loved about this list is that the discussions are usually intelligent and well thought out, and the humor is usually tempered with grace. I feel that the JMDL holds itself to high standards just by the fact that there are such incredible people that belong to it. I enjoy most of the discussions here and find most of the debates interesting, even though I might not be comfortable with all of it. But this truly goes way over the line, at least for me. I've so enjoyed the fact that the list has returned to an interesting place again. Please think before you post! Hugs, with outrage, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:23:51 -0400 From: "chuty001" Subject: Re: OVA njc This is a new low even for this place. It is just plain gross, but I guess that was the point. Chuck > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "theodore" > To: "'Wally Kairuz'" > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 2:29 AM > Subject: RE: OVA njc > > > > With a box like that, you almost have to share! I tried to eat her out, > > had to get doggy bag! We were on vacation, I told her lay down in the > > road and sold tickets to the grand canyon ... I'm telling you, that > > chick's got a big pussy ... how big is it? It's so fucking big the first > > time you fuck her you get guided tour! No really I'm talking biiig, she > > wears tight pants looks she's got an extra ass between her legs ... she > > don't use a tampon, she sticks one of those rolls of brawny up in there! > > I mean this chick douches at the fucking car wash ... I left her alone > > at the zoo and an elephant jumped on that shit... I mean big, big, hey > > her first kid the doctor had to use a shovel! I mean that's a big snatch > > right, she lost her virginity, didn't know it for a month! hey ...I'm > > here all week ... ladies and gentleman that was neil hamburger the > > funniest man in cyberspace, that's right let's hear it for neil > > hamburger ... > > > > Ok so I'm not sorry, > > Ted > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of > > Wally Kairuz > > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2003 11:04 PM > > To: Heather; _JMDL > > Subject: OVA njc > > > > heather!!!!!! your post made me SHRIEK big time and it's 3 am here!!! > > the > > neighbors will call the cops again! > > wally, still giggling and giggling!!!! > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > > De: Heather [mailto:chiaroscuro@snet.net] > > Enviado el: Miircoles, 16 de Abril de 2003 12:21 a.m. > > Para: Wally Kairuz; Lama, Jim L'Hommedieu; _JMDL > > Asunto: RE: NAMBLA, njc > > > > > > hi- > > i have an oversized vagina. it is no picnic. being fitted for a > > diaphragm > > was THE most embarrassing thing! the doctor saying to the nurse "my my > > ... > > this one's a candidate for the *Goodyear* model" THEN trying to have > > the > > opportunity to USE the damn thing. > > i have joined 'oversized vaginas anonymous' (OVA) to try and deal with > > my > > vastness. > > thanks for letting me share. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:34:50 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: I's A Muggin -- NJC Victor writes: << When is it plagiarism? For me? If you take someone else's work, like a copywritten logo for example, duplicate it, maybe put a "wash" over it, and call it a Warhol original. >> Most of what we think of as "Warhol's art" began with other sources. For example, he never took the original "Marilyn" photo, but used it two days after her death and turned it into a kind of American Mona Lisa. He used someone else's photograph to make a much greater work of art. And it did it over and over again. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:35:29 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: I's A Muggin' -- NJC Hell asks: << where do you draw the line between using a photograph a piece of art (as I would class the cover photos for Hejira, for example) and using it to create another piece of art? >> Depends upon the eventual new creation, in my opinion. The cover of "H" could *inspire* someone to paint a piece featuring a hundred berets in a winter tree, or it could lead someone to take a photograph of the cover. One is creation, one is copying. And everything in between is up for debate! --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:26:57 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: media moguls (njc) U.S. political content Thanks Anne, for posting this. > If they do so, ALL media will be controlled by a > handful of corporations. It could result in all your > news being controlled by one corporation. And that would be AOL. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:44:13 +0100 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Was cinnamon rolls, now Apple turnovers and NJC Oh I used to make the most wonderful honey and cinnamon bread with fat sultanas in it that popped when you bit the bread..even worse was to toast the slices and then smother them in butter and just die for the taste...... But I have a thing for APPLE pies, Apple crumbles, tarte tatin, Apple Charlotte, OH you name it if it has apples in it I am your girl.... When pregnant with my first child I bought a pack of six apple and fresh cream turnovers ( a sort of triangle of fresh and crispy flaky pastry coated with wonderful sugar and stuffed with apple and fresh dairy cream...NOT Pumped up stuff but wonderful whipped fresh cream) I was pregnant (this is important to remember) and decided I would have "MY" turnover on the way home in the car as I was sooooo hungry... then I hit a traffic jam and became soooo concerned that the cream would go off I ate another one to "test!" that was fine, but this then left only 4. I was not sure if my step-son liked them so ate his, leaving three. I then remembered that my stepdaughter was on a diet so ate hers, leaving 2. Knowing my husband (now ex) would think I was mean not to have bought enough for everyone I ate his and that left one... so I took it home and said to him ... "hey look I bought you an apple turnover...eat it quick as it may go off".... and in the one act of total kindness he ever showed me he said "Oh hey, feed the baby...you have it" ........ so I did!!!!!! STill love them but never buy them nowadays....... COME ON YOU MUST HAVE STORIES LIKE THIS..... Lucy And everyone of them was wonderful....... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:01:33 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: Was cinnamon rolls, now Apple turnovers and NJC In a message dated 4/16/2003 11:42:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time, lulu.hone@virgin.net writes: > STill love them but never buy them nowadays....... > COME ON YOU MUST HAVE STORIES LIKE THIS..... > Lucy > And everyone of them was wonderful....... > Well, that was a touching story. I don't have anything nearly as charming to recall. Well, I once got stuck in a 90 minute traffic jam on the Bay Bridge coming back to my apartment with groceries in the backseat. I cut into a frozen Sarah Lee cheesecake with my car keys and ate it with my fingers. My first very rainy, foggy, depressing winter in San Francisco, I gained 20 pounds eating Godiva Double Chocolate Ice Cream because I thought it said "Go Diva." Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:04:43 -0400 From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP I read online that Little Eva has died at the age of 59 in North Carolina. She is best remembered for the King/Goffen hit "Locomotion," one of my favorite oldies. - --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:13:32 EDT From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: OVA njc In a message dated 4/16/2003 10:16:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, theodore@buckfush.org writes: > Lama guy made me do it, > I might accept this excuse from a small child, but adults own responsibility for their actions. Ted, you are the one that typed the words into the keyboard, as did Lama and Heather. I am genuinely appalled at all three. Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 09:20:02 -0700 From: "theodore" Subject: RE: I's A Muggin -- NJC A lot of art is derivative, the classic painters or whatever covered the same material, saints, kings. There were aspects that were formulaic such as the renaissance window to the world. Landscape painters used a lens to fix their scenes. The impressionist school used the composition of photography in painting, the scene leaks off the borders. What I love about Andy is he made the process of creating his pieces into art. Plus he took things like the famous soup can and made them into statements not only about what is art, but, pop culture as art. That's why it really isn't important that Andy didn't paint Marilyn. It's not a portrait it's a statement about a pop star, and, about how these images are used and reused, and, I believe the beauty he sees in them. Another aspect of Warhol is its produced with new patrons in mind. Not governments, or, royalty, not really even the captains of industry this is art that he can stamp out as posters, greeting cards, shirts, that screens and prints well for magazine reproduction. It is designed to question what we think of as art and where we see it. Warhol worked in Film too, just another way to take advantage of the same shift in patronage. That's why it's kind of funny and ironic when people will say oh he just stamps these out to make cash, fair enough, you can say that of any artist, without a patron life was rough. I love Andy Warhol's "Trash." That movie really says a lot about popular culture and the disposable lives we lead. Don Delillo's book "Underworld" kind of the same thing, this undercurrent of cultural detritus. There are Anthropologists that the production of kitsch, little tiny cheaply produced bits of cultural information can be some of the most revealing, since their nature is to transfer the desired cultural content over wide areas and to be recognized immediately. If we can understand them they say a lot. This would not be just a sign, like, the little recycle triangle, this would be something like a little chocolate santa wrapper, those tiny made in china plastic flags, y'all like to wave so much. Ok, ok, what did the gynecologist say when ..... no, no, no ... ok so I ask this ... wacka wacka wacka, Ted "Mr.Entertainment" Friedman "candy says, I've come to hate my body, and all that it requires in this world ... I want to watch bluebirds fly, over my shoulder, I want to watch them pass me by, maybe when I'm older. What do you think I'd see. If I could walk away from me." VU Candy Says - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of Murphycopy@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 7:35 AM To: waytoblu@mindspring.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: I's A Muggin -- NJC Victor writes: << When is it plagiarism? For me? If you take someone else's work, like a copywritten logo for example, duplicate it, maybe put a "wash" over it, and call it a Warhol original. >> Most of what we think of as "Warhol's art" began with other sources. For example, he never took the original "Marilyn" photo, but used it two days after her death and turned it into a kind of American Mona Lisa. He used someone else's photograph to make a much greater work of art. And it did it over and over again. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:36:45 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: OVA njc oh please, ashara, don't be cross, dear! heather's post was so silly and funny. and it is so NOT like heather to send something like that. i admit ted's was way over the top but he's new to the list and he probably BELIEVED that he was REALLY expected to join in with stories about OV's. my bet is he never realized he was being taunted. i know you, mags and bob muller are right about there being a limit to almost everything, but don't be mad at us for too long because i miss your dimples when your smile. please please please love, wally ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 09:43:48 -0700 From: "theodore" Subject: RE: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP Hell yeah! C'mon, jump back! I really think you've got the knack! That's what I love about rock music, I know Joni is a different trip, but, Sam Cooke can say "whoa la ta ta, whoa la ta ta, la ta ta, all night long," and that's all he needs to say. My favorite Kink's lyric, "oh baby, now it's alright." "a wop bop a loo bop a wop bam boom." I think because with the earlier rock and roll, the beat and the fact that it was rock and roll, was controversial and new enough. That is not to say that there are not deeply profound rock and roll lyrics from that era. "got a tombstone head and a graveyard mind, just 22 and I don't mind dying." Now let's talk about who influenced Bob Dylan, "I was downtown shouting like a southern diplomat..." I look like a farmer, but, I'm a lover. You can't judge a book by looking at it's cover, Ted - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of Murphycopy@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 9:05 AM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP I read online that Little Eva has died at the age of 59 in North Carolina. She is best remembered for the King/Goffen hit "Locomotion," one of my favorite oldies. - --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:01:04 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: A Mighty Wind (NJC) A bunch of us (including Kakki!) went to a preview of this last night. It is wonderful - I thought it was much funnier than "Guffman" or "Best in Show". - -- ######################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:05:37 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC -- Little Eva, RIP In a message dated 4/16/2003 11:04:43 AM Eastern Standard Time, Murphycopy writes: > I read online that Little Eva has died at the age of 59 in North Carolina. She is best remembered for the King/Goffen > hit "Locomotion," one of my favorite oldies. A great tune, also done to good effect by Grand Funk. Eva Boyd was Goffin/King's babysitter, and a friend of Carole's said that she was so good that she could even write her babysitter a hit. So she did. At least that's the legend. Bob NP: Joni & Morrisey interview 1996 PS: No truth to the rumor that she is now going to referred to as "Dead Eva" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:13:44 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc >I listened to some of the songs and read most of the lyrics from them and they seem purposely mediocre...unchallenging, uninteresting. I respect a person's choice to try and have more mass appeal, I just miss the stellar kind of writing that we find on "The Honesty Room" and "Mortal City".< i haven't heard her new release but appreciate your opinion jenny- i do trust your take on this & somehow it doesn't suprise me...it seems that after all this time dar is suddenly getting more attention (her cds are prominently displayed in the new release section at borders which suprised me)...isn't it weird that pleasing the masses means being mediocre & that brings in the bucks...i know, i'm preaching to the choir here... www.katebennett.com "Lyrically, it's a work of art overall. Brilliant writing, absolutely." Indie-music.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:18:26 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) Got a great review from Gene S. this morning on the Today Show. I loved Waiting for Guffman, but was bored with Best In Show. But never with Parker Posey. Jerry Steve Dulson wrote: > A bunch of us (including Kakki!) went to a preview of this > last night. It is wonderful - I thought it was much funnier > than "Guffman" or "Best in Show". ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:21:56 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: When I Was a Boy (Dar Williams) njc I am not very familiar with much of Dar's work. I have one of her Cd's and there is a tune called "The End of Sumer" which I find amazing. Like Joni's "Down to You" it is one of those songs where the sound of the music itself instantly communicates the subject therein. By this, I mean that if you played the track without vocals, the chords and the melody evoke that sense of the turning of the season into fall and the melancholy that she is writing about. It's really brilliant. I haven't heard "When I Was A Boy", but my guess is that it does the same thing. Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:32:38 -0400 From: "chuty001" Subject: Re: OVA njc i admit ted's was way over the top but he's new to the > list and he probably BELIEVED that he was REALLY expected to join in with > stories about OV's. my bet is he never realized he was being taunted. > i know you, mags and bob muller are right about there being a limit to > almost everything, but don't be mad at us for too long because i miss your > dimples when your smile. > please please please > love, > wally > I'm with wally on this. I'm sure Ted didn't mean to offend anyone. Over the top yes but this can be a very difficult group to get a response from unless the subject relates to being gay, lesbian or James Taylor. I've wrote and deleted many myself just wanting to say "hey I'm here too"(had to get some me me in there). I hope Ted continues to post because in general I really enjoy them. It was a total set up in the first place and he blindly walked into it. So for me an apology will do thank you. Have a nice day Chuck ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:29:57 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) In a message dated 4/16/2003 1:20:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > Got a great review from Gene S. this morning on the Today Show. I loved > Waiting for Guffman, but was bored with Best In Show. But never with > Parker Posey You know, I posted about A Mighty Wind weeks ago, and no one picked up on it. You were all too busy talking about man boy love and vaginas. I hate when that happens!!! (just kidding) I imagine this movie will be a riot, particularly to those of us who have an interest in folk music. The crew that does these mock-documentaries is brilliant. And, if you like Parker Posey, check out the DVD of Guffman with the additional footage of Parker auditioning for the musical. It is priceless! Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:32:49 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) In a message dated 4/16/2003 12:18:26 PM Eastern Standard Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > But never with > Parker Posey. Ain't it the truth! I agree with you on all counts. And remarkable in that Posey is not comfortable with the improvisational style of these films (no script, just a general direction of where the scene should go). The "busy bee" scene was worth the price of admission. And, for what it's worth, Guest NAILED the Eastern NC accent perfectly, and it's not an easy one to do. Still, easier than that damned NZ one! :~) Bob NP: Harlem in Havana ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:38:25 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: A Mighty Wind (NJC) Parker Posey She is great in 'Party Girl.' mack ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 18:57:23 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: Was cinnamon rolls, now Apple turnovers and NJC Lucy Hone wrote: > >I was pregnant (this is important to remember) and decided I would have "MY" >turnover on the way home in the car as I was sooooo hungry... then I hit a >traffic jam and became soooo concerned that the cream would go off I ate >another one to "test!" that was fine, but this then left only 4. I was not >sure if my step-son liked them so ate his, leaving three. I then remembered >that my stepdaughter was on a diet so ate hers, leaving 2. Knowing my husband >(now ex) would think I was mean not to have bought enough for everyone I ate >his and that left one... so I took it home and said to him ... "hey look I >bought you an apple turnover...eat it quick as it may go off".... and in the >one act of total kindness he ever showed me he said "Oh hey, feed the >baby...you have it" ........ so I did!!!!!! > ypu wicked woamn you1 That was very funny and although never been preganant, can really see that happening to any foody! > >STill love them but never buy them nowadays....... > >COME ON YOU MUST HAVE STORIES LIKE THIS..... > >Lucy > > >And everyone of them was wonderful....... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:02:37 -0700 From: Scott Price Subject: RE: Dar Williams njc >Kate wrote: it seems that after all this time dar is suddenly getting more >attention (her cds are prominently displayed in the new release section at >borders which suprised me)...isn't it weird that pleasing the masses means >being mediocre & that brings in the bucks... Before dismissing the product as "mediocre" and alluding to a "sell out" by Dar Williams I think you should at least listen to a few songs, and maybe get a little background information. Dar was given the opportunity to sign with a major label, but chose to stick with tiny Razor and Tie because they have never asked her to modify in any way the music she creates. This autonomy is of paramount importance to Dar Williams and is *the* reason she didn't sign with the big boys. This is an artist who said "no thanks" when Walmart came calling. The fact that her CDs are "prominently displayed" is a testament to her manager Ron Fierstein and his staff at AGF who have successfully elevated Dar's recognition factor from an indie artist working out of her car to a singer-songwriter whose honest and intellectual approach to her craft is only now being appreciated by a larger circle of listeners. "The Beauty of the Rain," Dar's latest album, like all her previous releases, is a reflection of the artist and the people and the places in her life. Dar's move to New York City, her recent marriage, and her laissez-faire label have all contributed to an emotionally happy state of affairs. This joy is reflected in the new album. The additional layers of instrumentation are often cited as a move to gain a broader audience (re: John Lennon to Joni--"put some fiddles on it") but I see it more as a progression of the music. Just as Joni started with a sparse guitar accompaniment and gradually added more and more instrumentation, so has Dar recruited Stefan Lessard, John Medeski, Chris Botti, Alison Krauss, Bela Fleck, and others to add their touches to the new album. When Joni Mitchell albums, and Dar Williams albums, are in featured locations at Borders and Virgin and other mass marketers, it gives me hope that maybe, just maybe, there are a few corporate execs as well as consumers who care about the quality of the music. Sometimes everyone gets it right. Scott ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 14:12:38 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: Now, how is it Nambla & Joni are related?? >And in reference to Lori's well-timed reminder about why we should be here >in the first place, and since you have ALL 39 volumes of the covers series, >what are some of your favorite BSN's? (Of course anyone can chime in...) > >It's hard to beat Lydia van Dam's for a quiet one, and I love Jason > >Faulkner's rowdy one. I'm still deciding on this one. From I believe it's covers 38..(I don't have it available from where I'm typing this) there is a guy that does an incredible version of People's Parties? I can't recall his name right now. He really makes it come alive..I meant to share this with you awhile ago. Your query gave me the opportunity. Bree >Bob > >NP: "Love's Cries/Crazy Cries Of Love" KSCA 10/25/94 _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 14:21:20 -0400 From: "chuty001" Subject: Re: OVA njc - ----- Original Message ----- From: "chuty001" To: "chuty001" Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 2:20 PM Subject: Re: OVA njc > > > I'm with wally on this. I'm sure Ted didn't mean to offend anyone. Over > the > > top yes but this can be a very difficult group to get a response from > unless > > the subject relates to being gay, lesbian or James Taylor. I've wrote and > > deleted many myself just wanting to say "hey I'm here too"(had to get some > > me me in there). I hope Ted continues to post because in general I really > > enjoy them. It was a total set up in the first place and he blindly walked > > into it. So for me an apology will do thank you. > > > > Have a nice day > > Chuck It seems I didn't make it clear enough as to what I meant here. I found the OVA post offensive like many others here did and I expect Ted will make a group apology that I will except. Chuck ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 14:23:31 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Now, how is it Nambla & Joni are related?? In a message dated 4/16/2003 1:12:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, bree_mcdonough@hotmail.com writes: > there is a guy that does an > incredible version of People's Parties? I can't recall his > name right now. I don't know the name of the vocalist, but the name of the band is "Panic Painters". This was a recording we just lucked into, very obscure, a fan from outside the list sent me the mp3. Thanks too to Les who's configured the "Joni Undercover" section to allow anyone to contact me, it's been a big help in tracking down some obscure recordings, even though about once a week I get asked "When is 'A Case Of Joni' coming out?" Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 11:35:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: RE: Dar Williams njc Kate didn't dismiss anything. She was just responding to my note about missing the type of writing Dar did for her earlier albums. The Beauty of the Rain is a fine album and Dar stands out among her peers. But I believe the complexity -- both lyrically and musically (and I'm talking about melody line, chord progressions - not instrumentation)-- reflected in her earlier albums has been softened to appeal to a wider audience. And personally I'm bummed about that, simply because The Honesty Room and Mortal City in particular are two of my most favorite albums ever. Really, they changed my life. This is not "selling out". But she has made artistic choices that I believe are easier for a larger audience "to get". Like I said, no shame in that. She is striking a great balance between building an audience and keeping true to her vision. Scott said>This is an artist who said "no thanks" when Walmart came calling. Actually at the time that album came out I remember her saying the CD was "banned" by Walmart because it containted the song "Bought and Sold". At any rate, her albums are available at Walmart now. Jenny - --- Scott Price wrote: > >Kate wrote: it seems that after all this time dar > is suddenly getting more > >attention (her cds are prominently displayed in the > new release section at > >borders which suprised me)...isn't it weird that > pleasing the masses means > >being mediocre & that brings in the bucks... > > > Before dismissing the product as "mediocre" and > alluding to a "sell out" by > Dar Williams I think you should at least listen to a > few songs, and maybe > get a little background information. > > Dar was given the opportunity to sign with a major > label, but chose to > stick with tiny Razor and Tie because they have > never asked her to modify > in any way the music she creates. This autonomy is > of paramount importance > to Dar Williams and is *the* reason she didn't sign > with the big boys. This > is an artist who said "no thanks" when Walmart came > calling. The fact that > her CDs are "prominently displayed" is a testament > to her manager Ron > Fierstein and his staff at AGF who have successfully > elevated Dar's > recognition factor from an indie artist working out > of her car to a > singer-songwriter whose honest and intellectual > approach to her craft is > only now being appreciated by a larger circle of > listeners. > > "The Beauty of the Rain," Dar's latest album, like > all her previous > releases, is a reflection of the artist and the > people and the places in > her life. Dar's move to New York City, her recent > marriage, and her > laissez-faire label have all contributed to an > emotionally happy state of > affairs. This joy is reflected in the new album. The > additional layers of > instrumentation are often cited as a move to gain a > broader audience (re: > John Lennon to Joni--"put some fiddles on it") but I > see it more as a > progression of the music. Just as Joni started with > a sparse guitar > accompaniment and gradually added more and more > instrumentation, so has Dar > recruited Stefan Lessard, John Medeski, Chris Botti, > Alison Krauss, Bela > Fleck, and others to add their touches to the new > album. > > When Joni Mitchell albums, and Dar Williams albums, > are in featured > locations at Borders and Virgin and other mass > marketers, it gives me hope > that maybe, just maybe, there are a few corporate > execs as well as > consumers who care about the quality of the music. > Sometimes everyone gets > it right. > > Scott ===== "Now I used to think that I was cool running around on fossil fuel, until I saw what I was doing was driving down the road to ruin..." JT The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo http://search.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 14:54:31 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC Re: OVA njc In a message dated 4/16/2003 1:21:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, chuty001@hotmail.com writes: > I expect Ted will make a > group apology that I will except. He did...almost immediately, so that was cool. And you meant to say "accept" and not "except", but NO apology needed. ;~) Bob NP: Joni & Chris Douridas, "Morning Becomes Eclectic" '98 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 21:23:07 +0200 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: Gertrude Stein of music NJC for sure >>and with whom I can debate whether Michael Holding or Dennis Lillee is the greatest fast bowler of my lifetime.<< Azeem, remember this gem: "The bowler's Holding the batsman's Willie" mike in barcelona np Album for Anna Magdalena Bach - Ludovica Mosca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 15:50:54 -0400 From: "Suze Cameron" Subject: RE: NJC -- Little OVA, RIP Sorry, I couldn't resist. Apologies to all that I may have just offended, those who I have offended in the past, and those that I will offend in August. Happy hump day Heather, see what you started? Go and stand in the corner, if your OV will fit. Suze n.p. Stay in Touch, American Masters ____________________________________________________________ Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail! http://login.mail.lycos.com/r/referral?aid=27005 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 15:49:13 -0400 From: Doug Subject: Re: ****JONI AND JAMES**** NNC (no nambla content) Seriously, I don't mind the sexuallity talk the way I did the war talk Cactustree78@aol.com wrote: >I got a gift this weekend of Joni and James at the Royal Albert Hall...Ive never heard this before and I was amazed at the quality of the sound...Im not a huge fan of James but after hearing this I may get a cd...Does anyone know if they were dating at the time of this show..They have some really "cute" banter...Its cool to hear James trying to keep up with our Joan..Besides all of the great Joni songs on there I am in love with this James Taylor song "You can close Your Eyes"..sung with Joni...They sound magical together...Did they perform together regularly??She remarks on the cd that they should be a duo..Talk about a "supergroup"...If ACOY is supposed to be about James it musta been heartbreaking for her to sing it with him on the guitar and Joan on the Appalachian Dulcimer..(its so cute that she adds the appalachian)This was a great gift.. my friend said that Joni sent it to him from her personal collection but hes full of sh**..But a great friend indeed ;) I reccomend ! >this highly I know that alot of you may have it but if not try and find it..Its really really good....Hope you all have a fine day...***KEV*** > > > Hey! When I got my copy, she told me it was an extra-special gift just for me. :) Kevin, have you got the "Second Fret Sets"? The sound is very good & lots of banter. I'm curious about some of Joni's very early songs: A Melody In Your Name Jeremy Moon In The Mirror Strawflower Me The Fishbowl Who Has Seen The Wind Do recordings exist of any of these? Doug ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:09:20 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: ****JONI AND JAMES**** NNC (no nambla content) In a message dated 4/16/2003 2:49:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, dmeek@falls.igs.net writes: > I'm curious about some of Joni's very early songs: > A Melody In Your Name this recording exists on the "Looking Out For Love" Bootleg. (Well, about 90% of it does...it cuts out) It's a beautiful song. > Jeremy > Moon In The Mirror > Strawflower Me > Who Has Seen The Wind I've not heard these either, and would love to! > The Fishbowl This was a poem, she does a recital of it during the '94 "Just Ice" appearance. The complete video for that is available on the vid trees, and the audio is available on CD. Bob NP: "Moon At The Window", San Jose, CA 5/19/98 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 13:28:36 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: Dar Williams njc >Before dismissing the product as "mediocre" and alluding to a "sell out" by Dar Williams I think you should at least listen to a few songs, and maybe get a little background information.< miscommunication alert! scott, i am sorry if i confused you with my post...i was not referring to dar when i wrote "isn't it weird that pleasing the masses means being mediocre & that brings in the bucks" nor did i allude to her selling out... the fact that i was suprised that her cds were in borders was nothing other than that- suprise (& i should have said happiness for i am a big fan as my previous post stated) i was suprised that she was being given that kind of placement because that usually belongs to big label artists...its great her management is working hard (& spending the money (because it costs $$$$ for that kind of placement) to support dar- i agree with you- she deserves it... to clarify, my comment was meant as a general one- meaning the trend that embraces formulaic compositions & uninteresting lyrics as 'hit songs' meaning songs that bring in money for the artist & the record company... thanks for your post, you sound like a big dar fan as well... btw, dar & i share a spot on an NPR broadcast about houseconcerts!!!!... dar gives a great interview about when she was starting out & the segment opens with one of my songs (you can hear jeff's wonderful harmonica!) which was taped live at a house concert series last year...here's the link if anyone is interested (move the marker to about 20 minutes to get directly to the house concert segment): http://www.marketplace.org/shows/2002/04/12_house_concert_mpp.html www.katebennett.com "Lyrically, it's a work of art overall. Brilliant writing, absolutely." Indie-music.com ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #246 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)