From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #227 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, April 9 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 227 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc ["theodore" ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc ["kakki" ] Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma ["kakki" ] Re: JMDL Digest V2003 #225 [Randy Remote ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc ["kakki" ] A Case of U..rine [Gordon Mackie ] WTF?!! ["o" ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc [Catherine McKay ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc & now a little Joni [SCJoniGu] Re: FW: blue ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma ["Donna Binkley" ] pinkos, commies and faggots oh my! njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: pinkos, commies and faggots oh my! njc [colin ] Re: onlyJMDL "choices" [Wiloboy@aol.com] Re: Down to you and tidbits [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Down to you and tidbits [Murphycopy@aol.com] Refuge Tour [Merk54@aol.com] Re: Refuge Tour [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Down to you and tidbits [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Bowling for JONI [KJHSF@aol.com] Re: Down to you and tidbits [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: Bowling for JONI [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: Down to you and tidbits ["Maggie McNally" ] Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc ["mack watson-bush" ] a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song [anne@sandstrom.] Re: a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song ["Donna Bink] Re: a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song ["mack watso] Re: Down to you and tidbits ["J.David Sapp" ] Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma [Catherine McKay Subject: RE: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc My dad had 8 tracks. The Best of Sam Cooke. Donovan's greatest lp, Janis Pearl, Isaac Hayes Shaft, Jesus Christ Superstar, Sister had Bee Gees, and a weird cover band doing sgt. Peppers, I had Ted Nugent Double Live Gonzo, Kiss Alive, Disco Duck single ... the first single I ever got was given to me by the baby sitter. Bill Withers Lean On Me. We had a 5th Dimension record. As sister got older she started getting into weak assed shit like Ritchie blackmore, didn't last long, as we soon had The Doors, The Who. I remember I bought her Who's Next for her birthday I hid it in the yard and left a string of clues to direct her to it, one of the clues was on the bottom of the pool in the deep end, she had to dive in to get it. I remember the radio, "go ahead and hate your neighbor, go ahead and cheat a friend, do it in the name of heaven, you can justify it in the end." "what do you get when you fall in love." "I found your diary underneath a tree." "baby I'm amazed at the way I love you all the time(I still smell chlorine when I hear that song, it was the first summer we had the pool and the radio was constantly on the deck) "if you could read my mind love, what a tale my thoughts would tell, just like an old time movie, about a ghost in a wishing well." "isn't she lovely less than one minute old, I never thought true love would be making one as lovely as she(who says kids to inspire you to write kick assed music)." "if you took all the crap I learned in high school its no wonder I can think at all." "having my baby, what a lovely way of saying how much you love me." "you walked in to the party like you were walking onto a yacht." "knock three times on the window means I love you." "going where the sun keeps shining, shining down like rain, going where the weather suits my clothes." "making love in the afternoon with Cecilia up in my bedroom." "little willy willy won't go home, but you can't push willy round willy won't go." Of course my favorite song that came through the sun dryed 4 inch paper cone of the portable by the pool "Imagine there's no heaven, its easy if you try, no hell below us, above us only sky, imagine all the people, living life in peace, yooooohoooohooohoohoo, you could say I'm a dreamer, but, I'm not the only one, I hope one day you'll join us and the world will live as one." I remember being like being 8 or 9 and thinking one day I will join them, hell motherlovin yeah. I remember the first time I got stoned sitting by the pool while my parent's were gone with my sister and her nicely developing bikini clad best friend I was 13 I think. I hung my head back and looked up at the bright electric afternoon sky, after about twenty minutes I started to panic cause I didn't think I could lift my head back up. My sister thought this was so funny her knees buckled underneath her and she rolled on the ground convulsing in laughter. This still happens to her and is not a result of pot use, when she starts to laugh at things she loses it, you can see her trying to gain composure but she falls right off her chair. Oh well. I remember the year later trying mushrooms for the first time in that very same back yard with the usual suspects. All of a sudden each plant and bush gained a sphere of influence that I had to spend time experiencing, one universe to the next, each bottlebrush shared its story and when I felt I understood I moved on. I remember drinking beers in the bathroom with my sister's best friend, the amazing feel of nylon brushing nipples ... wake up ... See drugs are good! Ted - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of Bree Mcdonough Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 11:26 PM To: anima_rising@yahoo.ca; PassScribe@aol.com; AsharaJM@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc Catherine I really enjoyed your post. Too funny! What is it about elevators where one feels they must be mute once they step inside? Bree NP: Melissa Manchester..Love Havin You Around >Here's the kind of stuff my Dad used to play on the >hi-fi stereo when I was a kid: >- military stuff (marching music; pipes and drums >stuff) - Sunday seemed to be military music day at our >house, and Sundays were the days I perfected my >eye-rolling technique >- Herb Alpert (I don't know if Dad actually liked him >that much, but he had bought one LP that he seemed to >like, so every Christmas and birthday after that for a >while, guess what we kids gave him?) >- Broadway musicals. > >As an adult, I love most of the Broadway stuff. While >Maria would sing, "I feel pretty", I would practice >singing, "I feel shitty." Herb Alpert has a certain >kitschy charm, but you have to be half-drunk and >possibly eating Mexican food to appreciate it. The >only pipes and drums heard in my house are when Joni >sings Chelsea Morning. > >Like it or not, what parents listen to is heard by the >kids and assimilated one way or another, finally >manifesting itself when, years later, it comes back to >haunt us when we find ourselves inexplicably humming >along to "The Lonely Bull" as we're staring at the >numbers on some must-avoid-eye-contact-or-die elevator >ride. > > >===== >Catherine >Toronto > >______________________________________________________________________ >Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 00:03:43 -0700 From: "theodore" Subject: FW: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma I've held a job or two despite my best efforts. Of course the other thing you could do is give them obsolete, slower machines so they will lag behind production and have higher turnover. In all seriousness I would dissolve the cubicle concept in favor of an open space with shared workstations that are occupied on a first come first serve basis. Supplies would be kept in lockers not desks, so instead of a floor of separate cubbies you have an open space with stations for common tasks. Managers would not have offices but a kiosk or station where training, reinforcement, and sharing occur as need arises or individuals find free time. If you want to occupy the well lit workstations that provide a view be the first to get to the company logistic taskforce open campus early or stay late. Call it a command hub, the bridge. Huh? Not a bad idea to move to an environment that encourages a sense of team, nurtures group unity and forces the flow of information. Plus it's a bad idea to have a floor full of little personal spaces. Encourages isolation, tension, mistrust and a false sense of the ownership of computer terminals, hording of rare, or scarce supplies, fosters a management of individuals as discrete units unaware of the true purpose of group success, organizational efficiency and positive feelings needed for humans to fool themselves into thinking their careers are rewarding and worthwhile. What do you think, should I be a consultant, the new dilbert free enterprise environment. I'll give seminars! Ted - -----Original Message----- From: KJHSF@aol.com [mailto:KJHSF@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 10:56 PM To: theodore@buckfush.org Subject: Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma In a message dated 4/8/2003 8:57:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, theodore@buckfush.org writes: Only move employees to the exterior spaces right before they get canned, no one will want to switch! FUCKING BRILLIANT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 00:18:32 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc Geez, *I* had some of these albums on 8 tracks - oh my creaking bones ;-) Also only had Hissing and DJRD on 8-track for a time. My parents played mostly Louis Armstrong, Louie Prima and Keely Smith, Quincy Jones, Sinatra, Andrews Sisters, Julie Andrews and James Galway. And sometimes my dad snuck off with my Beatles Hard Day's Night and Norwegian Wood albums which he thought were brilliant. I don't know how this all may have brought me to Joni except that I was indulged with a little record player and 45s of my own at a young age. The habit started very early ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 00:21:13 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2003 #225 I didn't say Ginsberg was arrested. He did say, however, "I'm a member of NAMBLA because I love boys too -- everybody does, who has a little humanity." NAMBLA (The North American Man/Boy Love Association, based in NY) has, as the cornerstone of it's philosophy, the idea that it is okay for men to have sex with boys, even pre- puberty. They're open about it and Ginsberg was open about being a member. Seems clear enough. As far as influencing Dylan, I suppose he did, but I would say Woody Gutherie and Ramblin' Jack Elliot were bigger influences. I'm not aware that Joni was influenced by the Beats directly, though through others like Dylan, sure. Would Dylan or Joni exist without Kerouac & Ginsberg? How do you stop a baby being born? RR "pot is fun" - Allen Ginsberg David Marine wrote: > Hey Randy: > > Ginsberg's limited writings on NAMBLA focus on free speech. He was > never accused of -- nor indicted for -- having sex with a minor. He was > a seminal poet and essayist, and one of the most important poets, > writers, and thinkers of his time. I doubt Dylan or Joni would exist > without him and Kerouac. > > Best, > > David > > On Tuesday, April 8, 2003, at 06:45 PM, JMDL Digest wrote: > > > Kate Bennett wrote: > > > >> from the website: > >> > >> "Kerouac, Ginsberg and Burroughs found inspiration in jazz music and > >> the > >> culture that surrounded it. > > > > Not without their dark side-Burroughs was a devoted junkie who > > shot his wife in the head. Ginsberg was an advocate for sex with > > children. > > They're not my heroes. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 00:25:21 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma Good ideas, but I personally think everyone should have offices or at least a semi-private and comfortable working area. You spend 8 hours+ a day, 5+ days a week there and a company should pay the extra money to make it as inviting as possible. I think egalitarian is a state of mind and attitude and putting people into impersonal pens or one big wide open pen is not entirely humanistic. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 00:38:11 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2003 #225 sorry I forgot the NJC ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 01:25:18 -0700 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc Before the auditors get me: > Beatles Hard Day's Night and Norwegian Wood albums which he thought were brilliant. Should say Rubber Soul album - fave song was Norwegian Wood. Kakki, recovering from too much fun partying with JMDLer Lori (and Timo) from France the past few days ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 02:19:35 -0700 From: David Marine Subject: Ginsberg NJC On Wednesday, April 9, 2003, at 12:21 AM, Randy Remote wrote: > I didn't say Ginsberg was arrested. He did say, however, > "I'm a member of NAMBLA because I love boys too -- > everybody does, who has a little humanity." Is this not true? > NAMBLA (The North American Man/Boy Love Association, > based in NY) has, as the cornerstone of it's philosophy, the > idea that it is okay for men to have sex with boys, even pre- > puberty. They're open about it and Ginsberg was open about > being a member. Seems clear enough. It's not that simple. Again, read his essay on NAMBLA and the reasons for his membership. Ginsberg was advocating free speech. > > "pot is fun" - Allen Ginsberg > Not only fun, but sacred. Peace, David ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:34:10 +0100 From: Gordon Mackie Subject: A Case of U..rine Hi All Been in lurk mode for ages and been deleting posts left right and centre....so if this has been covered ignore me ! I see people like Diana Krall's Case of You and I do too. Loved the version she did on the Joni tribute and also on her Live in Paris dvd. I always loved the original Blue version and in the back of my mind alawys wondered why Joni was always so precise about saying 'you are in my blood' ...I now know! The spoiler for for Diana's version is that she sings 'you're in my blood like holy wine which sounds like she's singing 'urine'. Sorry Dr Freud, but that is what it makes me thing. Am I loosing it altogether ...well, hell yes ! Gordon PS Anyone know how to get a pal copy of the Joni American masters thingy...or am I barking at the wrong fish Mr Fielding ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:51:26 +0100 From: "o" Subject: WTF?!! Surely this warrants removal from the list? Suzanne, you sound deranged. I can't believe a person with hateful, bigoted opinions like that could like Joni Mitchell - you're sullying her good name, woman!!! Think loving thoughts and get help, fast! Peace (you need it), Owen >- -----Original Message----- >From: Suzanne MarcAurele [mailto:smarcaurele@digitalproquo.com] >Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 7:24 PM >To: theodore >Subject: RE: UN Reports Congo Killing Spree - 966 Killed & Yet the >Anti-American Smear Campaign Goes On Unabated-NJC >one more thing "theo" maybe we should just bend over like some of us do >every time the situation warrants a choice betwixt sustaining >civilization >or returning to something shall we say Medeival - I wish all pinko >commie >faggots would spend the rest of their lives in real humanitarian work in >the >midst of those hell hole macho paradises and when their assholes get >sore >from dysentery or bending over too much not only will they beg to come >home >to this great country but they may go straight and learn what life >really is >all about ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 06:55:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc --- Bree Mcdonough > What is it about > elevators where one feels they must be mute once > they step inside? I'm sure it's the personal space thing. You're supposed to step into a box with a bunch of strangers. What do you do? First everyone adjusts where they're standing so they're all at equal distances from one another. Then, as more people step into the box, the distances shorten and people get nervous - hell, you might have to touch a stranger! What next? Pretend they're not there, or you're not there. Stare up, stare down, don't look at anyone. Check out the numbers at the top to see if your floor is coming up (you might miss it.) One of my cats does that when she's stressed and can't escape - she just turns her back on everything and sits there not moving with her head slightly down. She probably thinks if she can't see anyone, they can't see her either - Inviso-Cat! ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 08:23:16 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: MacMath > Mark E in Seattle wrote > (can you imagine 'Brad's Dad's Mercury'?) > Yes, but I think that Joni the (alliteration and rhyming) Junkie would have stood pat with Brad's Dad's Cadillac :~) Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 08:32:21 EDT From: Bobsart48@aol.com Subject: Re: JT and JM Bob Murphy wrote: > Regarding "Blue," here's another scenario: Maybe it was written to Graham > after Joni had started seeing the troubled, drug addicted James. ("Hell's > the > hippest way to go, I don't think so, but I'm gonna take a look around it > though . . . Blue, I love you") Works for me! I like this. Still, I wonder about the line "crown and anchor me, or let me sail away ?" It conflicts with her statements in WOHAM. More like trasferrance. Also, others suggested that the JT was more casual. I'll buy "more troubled", but my sense of the material from FTR is that it was more than casual. Unless I am missing the boat re: Cold Blue Steel, Lesson in Survival, FTR, See you Sometime and Blond in the Bleachers. Bobsart ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 08:36:13 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: A Case of U..rine In a message dated 4/9/2003 4:34:10 AM Eastern Standard Time, gordon.mackie@strath.ac.uk writes: > PS Anyone know how to get a pal copy of the Joni American > masters > thingy... Gordon, I can have a PAL copy made from the version I have. The guy I use charges $25 for the service, plus add in the cost of the blank (about $2 for a premium grade), shipping ($6 or so airmail from the US to the UK). I have a Paypal account so as long as you have a credit card you can reimburse me easily for the costs. Hope that helps; let me know if you're interested. Bob NP: "A Case of You" Wantaugh, NY 7/24/83 (synchronicity, eh?) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 05:41:52 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc > My parents played ... in my very early years: the Andrew Sisters, the Lennon Sisters (no relation to John), the Ventures, and albums by people who played the Hammond organ and the xylophone. We also sang along with Mitch Miller, at least until he became involved with Leslie Uggams. And my mom had one Joan Baez album (Joan's first, I think, on Vanguard records -- I still have it), that she may have bought through Columbia house by mistake. Because John Lennon made that remark about The Beatles being more popular than Jesus Christ, their records were forbidden in my house. It amazing that I was allowed to go to the drive-in theater to see "Help!" with my older cousin -- Dad must not have known. Much later, when I was in high school, my father assaulted me with Jim Reeves at full volume on Sunday mornings. And Roy Clarke. It's a wonder I came out of that house as a normal person. (Or did I??) : ) Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 14:08:07 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: Ginsberg NJC > It's not that simple. Again, read his essay on NAMBLA and the reasons > for his membership. Ginsberg was advocating free speech. > If advocating free speech also advocates the promotion of fucking children then fuck it. some people need to get their heads out of their arses. memebership of such an organisation is advocating all it stands for no matter the attempts to explain it away. As usual, people's ideas are considered more important the the health and well being of our children. This group is for peadophiles and memeber is advocating the abuse of children, just by being a member. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 09:09:50 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc My parents played ... Frank Sinatra, Sammy Davis, Nat King Cole, Jo Stafford, Beethoven, Grieg, Oscar Peterson, Milt Buckner, Lionel Hampton, Louis Prima and Keely Smith........ > > And my mom had >one Joan Baez album (Joan's first, I think, on Vanguard records -- I >still have it), that she may have bought through Columbia house by >mistake. > Farewell, Angelina was one of the first albums I ever bought. > >Because John Lennon made that remark about The Beatles being more >popular than Jesus Christ, their records were forbidden in my house. >It amazing that I was allowed to go to the drive-in theater to >see "Help!" with my older cousin -- Dad must not have known. > My mother loved John Lennon. She has always thought Imagine was one of the best songs ever written. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 09:35:11 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc In a message dated 4/9/2003 8:09:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > My mother loved John Lennon. She has always thought Imagine > was one of > the best songs ever written. I can go you one better than that, Jerry...my GRANDMOTHER'S favorite song was "Because" from Abbey Road! We used to listen to that record together and she would just cry and comment on that song being the "most beautiful song she ever heard". My Dad was a big Lennon-McCartney fan, and I remember him always chiming in to defend the music of "our generation" with Beatles examples. I enjoyed raiding his record collection and finding lots of gems...some of his broadway soundtracks, like West Side Story, Pipe Dream, Subways Are For Sleeping...his big band stuff (Glenn Miller, Harry James, Benny Goodman) also thrilled me. More than the actual music itself, my Dad taught me to be passionate about the music that you really love. That was the best gift he ever gave me. I enjoyed watching WOHAM with him last week, and when the Laurel Canyon clips came on, he commented that Mama Cass was the finest singer that's ever been. Bob NP: "Underneath The Streetlights" 7/24/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 09:41:31 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc Subways Are for Sleeping was the first Broadway album I owned. I later worked with Phyllis Newman, who won a Tony Award for that show, and she was a joy. The show was The Madwoman of Central Park and she was so much better and nicer than her television game show persona would leave you to believe. I don't know, Bob. All those show tune albums that your dad and you owned. Straight DNA gone awry! Jerry SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: >I enjoyed raiding his record collection and finding lots of gems...some of his broadway soundtracks, like West Side Story, Pipe Dream, Subways Are For Sleeping...his big band stuff (Glenn Miller, Harry James, Benny Goodman) also thrilled me. > >More than the actual music itself, my Dad taught me to be passionate about the music that you really love. That was the best gift he ever gave me. I enjoyed watching WOHAM with him last week, and when the Laurel Canyon clips came on, he commented that Mama Cass was the finest singer that's ever been. > >Bob > >NP: "Underneath The Streetlights" 7/24/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 06:55:28 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: FW: blue theodore wrote: > Those were different times. All I'm saying is I've been in love with > someone who the entire time was hedging their bets. Lesson learned. > You know I was not in the woman's shoes. A girl that looked like Joni > did back then could have married anyone. I just think she used Chuck > to get her past a period where she needed to gather her courage to go > it alone. I don't think she ever wanted to raise the kid anyway. Its > ok I don't hold it against her. > > She wanted to make love to the MacMath dude, she didn't want the > pregnancy. I think this one's a lost cause, dearest Mags. Love, Mark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 09:59:26 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc & now a little Joni In a message dated 4/9/2003 8:41:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > I later > worked with Phyllis Newman, who won a Tony Award for that show, And bringing it back to Joni, Phyliss did a cover of "Both Sides Now" which we have and issued a while back. Speaking of The Beatles, she also does a cover of "Your Mother Should Know" on that same LP that is SO BAD it has to be heard to be believed. Bob NP: "Free Man In Paris" Norman, OK 6/29/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 07:08:19 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: FW: blue Uh-oh. That was meant to be a private post. Sorry folks. Mark E in Seattle (oh we're still on the air! oh have I got my boot in my mouth!) Mark or Travis wrote: > theodore wrote: >> Those were different times. All I'm saying is I've been in love with >> someone who the entire time was hedging their bets. Lesson learned. >> You know I was not in the woman's shoes. A girl that looked like Joni >> did back then could have married anyone. I just think she used Chuck >> to get her past a period where she needed to gather her courage to go >> it alone. I don't think she ever wanted to raise the kid anyway. Its >> ok I don't hold it against her. >> >> She wanted to make love to the MacMath dude, she didn't want the >> pregnancy. > > I think this one's a lost cause, dearest Mags. > > Love, > Mark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 10:59:22 -0500 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma What about giving the window offices to those with the most seniority. db This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 09:08:21 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma > What about giving the window offices to those with the most > seniority. Nope, no can do. Seniority is out, "egalitarianism" is in. (Yeah, right. How many of you have ever worked at a non-profit where seniority and/or ego wasn't the order of the day??) Thanks, though. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 17:18:13 +0100 From: "sarah c" Subject: cohen - the priest I also thought that The Priest was about Leonard Cohen, and Rainy Night aswell, in fact most of the male references in Ladies of the Canyon, no? Would be interested to hear if true or not - can't remember where I read it initially. It's so true what someone else wrote about almost 90% of art being created by loves lost, won, fought for etc. It always reminds me of a great quote by Stephen Fry about the fact that "without wine, beauty, art, music and love, life is safe, but not really worth bothering about". so true! sarah - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. More info here. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:20:56 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: pinkos, commies and faggots oh my! njc strongly put though not very original. maybe you should let your ass be ripped open by the school-of-the-americas, CIA funded military that raped so many pinko commie faggots in my country during the 70's to understand pinkos, commies and faggots. maybe you've been sitting on your opinions for too long and a good, sustained, energetic plunge into the hole where your head seems to be -- to the rhythm of your favorite sousa march -- may unclog your arteries for a while. wallyK >- -----Original Message----- >From: Suzanne MarcAurele [mailto:smarcaurele@digitalproquo.com] >Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 7:24 PM >To: theodore >Subject: RE: UN Reports Congo Killing Spree - 966 Killed & Yet the >Anti-American Smear Campaign Goes On Unabated-NJC > I wish all pinko >commie >faggots would spend the rest of their lives in real humanitarian work in >the >midst of those hell hole macho paradises and when their assholes get >sore >from dysentery or bending over too much not only will they beg to come >home >to this great country but they may go straight and learn what life >really is >all about ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 10:32:19 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: remembering Laura Nyro (njc) Has it really been 5 years since Laura left us? I'm shedding a few tears for her today. Oddly enough, I met with my ovarian cancer support group this morning. We talked some about death and grieving for those who have succumbed to the disease. Bless you, wherever you are, Laura. lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 12:59:04 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: Re: Blue, and Hejira Bob - I think after all these years you have answered the question. Bravo. peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 18:48:32 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: pinkos, commies and faggots oh my! njc What abrilliant reply! LOL! Wally Kairuz wrote: >strongly put though not very original. maybe you should let your ass be >ripped open by the school-of-the-americas, CIA funded military that raped so >many pinko commie faggots in my country during the 70's to understand >pinkos, commies and faggots. maybe you've been sitting on your opinions for >too long and a good, sustained, energetic plunge into the hole where your >head seems to be -- to the rhythm of your favorite sousa march -- may unclog >your arteries for a while. >wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 13:20:03 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits I agree Bob. I also think it would not have worked thematically but don't know if I can say why. And while we're talking about T'log I've loved it since the beginning so this may be biased - but I was listening to it on random mode with TI, WTRF, NRH, and HEJIRA. I have to say that if great singing is defined as expressive storytelling - her singing has never been better than T'log. Listening to it on random was very educational. Your NP's for several days have been following the refuge tour. Is there a method to your madness? peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 14:26:51 -0400 From: Wiloboy@aol.com Subject: Re: onlyJMDL "choices" > >I don't understand why there is always this choice between > staying with a guy and following her muse.< Regarding the early relationships (especially Nash) it seems to me Joni's marriage & divorce from Chuck Mitchell was certainly fresh on her mind, it hadn't been that long before she "got out of that" and then there's this quote from Joan "My grandmothers both were frustrated musicians in different ways. My paternal grandmother came from Norway, and the story has it that the last time she cried in her life she was 14, and she was crying because she knew she would never have a piano. And she became a stoic. She had a miserable, nasty life. She had 11 kids and married a mean, poor drunk, but she never wept through all the hardship in all her adult life that anyone knows of. My maternal grandmother, on the other hand, was a classical musician who came East when the Prairies opened up by train. She was Scottish-French, and they brought an organ in for her and a gramophone. She was a poet and musician, but she still kicked the kitchen door off its hinges out of her frustration at being trapped in the role of a housewife. Maybe Joni just gets that trapped feeling. I'm sure she felt that way as a child with Polio, looking out the window at the world going by. I don't think she ever wanted to be in that "trapped" place again. Or at least that early in her career. We certainly have benefited from her decisions! ...And then again there may be a little truth to what Ted said too! Wil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 14:28:11 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits In a message dated 4/9/2003 1:20:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, davidsapp@peoplepc.com writes: > Listening to it > on random was very educational. That's a good idea...I tend to get realy bogged down listening to T'log all the way through, so I'll try stirring it into a mix and see if that helps. > > Your NP's for several days have been following the refuge > tour. Is there a > method to your madness? Well, here at work I play through my collection in A-B-C order...I got to Joni and decided to play through all the stuff I have, and I'm enjoying it a lot. Lots of nice moments I'd forgotten about. Since I have my Joni arranged chronologically, all the 83's are playing through. Almost done, about 6 more shows to go. The Refuge tour was a LONG tour, by anyone's standards. From February rehearsals to the end of July she and her band rocked literally around the world. And although they did pretty much the same show every night, they always mixed up the setlists to keep it interesting for themselves I'm sure. You can definitely tell that they (and the crowd) was much more into it some nights more than others. She should definitely get back to Europe as it's evident that she is well-loved there. I didn't see her on this tour...she pretty much skipped the Southeast. But I'd love to hear from those of y'all that saw her on this tour and what you remember!! Bob NP: "Banquet", Boston, MA 7/20/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:43:34 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits Mr. Muller writes: << NP: "Banquet", Boston, MA 7/20/83 >> Yikes, Bob! Isn't this the infamous Boston concert during which she walked off stage? Man, am I glad I skipped that one. (Not so sure I would have ever forgiven her lack of professionalism.) I had been talking up Joni to a friend at the time and he went to this concert. After that he never wanted to hear her name again! --Bob NPIMH: The pinko-commie-faggot anthem I've always meant to write ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:56:01 EDT From: Merk54@aol.com Subject: Refuge Tour Bob, At the time, one of the biggest standouts for me was the rocked up version of Banquet. It caught me totally off guard, and was blown away by. I also thought she should have released a version of this as a single. I haven't heard it quite a while, so I don't if it holds up to repeated listens, but it sure struck me at the time. Nothing else really stands out, other than missing Jaco terribly. Jack ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 15:41:01 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Refuge Tour In a message dated 4/9/2003 1:56:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, Merk54 writes: I haven't > heard it quite a while, so I don't if it holds up to repeated listens, but it > sure struck me at the time. I would say that it does...the electrification and pumped up rhythm adds to the edgy lyric. Of course, I love the original version, but this one is one of the better transitions to Refuge's musical stylings. Nothing else really stands > out, other than > missing Jaco terribly. True, but I'm not sure that he would've fit in with this tour, which was very much more rock-oriented and structured for the most part. Seems like it was anyway. Bob NP: "Woodstock", Boston '83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 15:44:50 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits In a message dated 4/9/2003 1:43:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, Murphycopy writes: > Isn't this the infamous Boston concert during which she > walked > off stage? That's the one...our Boston Jim was there, maybe some others. She still did 18 songs, a tad shorter than the 20-25 she did at most of the other venues. Bob NP: "Coyote", Holmdel, NJ 7/16/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:47:53 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Bowling for JONI In a message dated 4/9/2003 2:29:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: > I didn't see her on this tour...she pretty much skipped the Southeast. But > I'd love to hear from those of y'all that saw her on this tour and what you > remember!! > > Unfortunately, I wasn't into Joni when she was still touring extensively. :( But, friends of mine said that the saw her concert in Cleveland during this time, and afterward happened to be at a bowling alley bowling right next to Joni, Larry and bandmates. Such luck! Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:48:08 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits Muller writes: << She still did 18 songs, a tad shorter than the 20-25 she did at most of the other venues. >> 18 songs! That's quite a lot. The way the legend has grown locally, you'd think she did about half a song. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 15:57:02 -0400 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Bowling for JONI In a message dated 4/9/2003 2:47:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, KJHSF writes: > But, friends of mine said that the saw her concert in Cleveland during this time, and afterward happened to be at a > bowling alley bowling right next to Joni, Larry and bandmates. How surreal & cool would THAT be!? It must have been the drummer's idea; "Vinnie Coluitta" sounds like a champion bowler to me! ;~) Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 16:02:22 -0400 From: "Maggie McNally" Subject: RE: Down to you and tidbits I was there, and it was a much better concert than "local lore" would suggest. Yes, she walked off, but she came back on and it was a very good show. But then again, I was as big a fan then as I am now, so perhaps I was more willing to forgive the whole thing than a non-fan skeptic. You think? Maggie -----Original Message----- From: Murphycopy@aol.com [mailto:Murphycopy@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 3:48 PM To: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits Muller writes: << She still did 18 songs, a tad shorter than the 20-25 she did at most of the other venues. >> 18 songs! That's quite a lot. The way the legend has grown locally, you'd think she did about half a song. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:08:58 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: Our kids getting hooked on Joni now njc Of course the closest thing to children I will ever have is my neices and nephews. I did my best to get them to understand Joni without success. Just weren't interested. One nephew did like Jewel but he wasn't too thrilled when I referred to her as the synthetic version of Joni Mitchell, which was my lead in to intoduce her to him. Something like a cloning experience that went very, very wrong. Remember Alien 4? I was successful in turning my neices onto 60's and 70's r and b though and they all like Janis. Then again, how could they not? Dissing Janis was simply not accepted. As for my parents, they listened to nothing. Nothing. They weren't the type. There was always work to be done. My dad did always like the tune "lean on me" by Bill Withers and would comment on it each time it played during that particular summer while we were hoeing cotton in the Texas heat. My older siblings were my greatest influences. Kay was all country and I have a great love for that music that was then known as country and western. She was country when country wasn't cool, to borrow a line. Older brother Paul I didn't care for and got nothing from him. Marnita turned me on to Janis, her greatest accomplishment in this discussion. She also led me to fall for the 60's rock that is now timeless and incomparable. Cathy was a true bubblegummer and gave me an understanding and appreciation for the easy and light. Fruitgum Co., Association, etc. Johnny is the one that led me to my greatest love, that r and b sound. I do believe being a fag was the greatest influence. Took me longer to find Joni than most. Well worth the wait. I can officially say it now after multiple listenings. I don't like Mingus. Find it very weak and painful to listen to, as in akin to pulling a tooth or nails upon the chalkboard. Maybe with time Joni can save it for me but not likely she will get much of a chance. mack ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 13:10:42 -0700 From: "theodore" Subject: RE: Down to you and tidbits When my band did live sets we did 13 songs 45 minutes, 11 and 2 encores and we're talking 2 1/2 - 3 minute songs. 18 songs is more than they paid for. I remember seeing TSOL they did 4 songs and left because people wouldn't stop fighting. I had waited a year to see them. I had a great idea. I think Joni should cap off her career by working with a guy like Paul Oakenfold. Then she would be five years ahead of her time and performing live to 30000 kids at all night underground parties. Plus if she can bring her vocals and lyrical talent to techno it would be mind blowing magical and really bring us closer to the motherlovin' garden. Ted - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com] On Behalf Of SCJoniGuy@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 12:45 PM To: Murphycopy@aol.com Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits In a message dated 4/9/2003 1:43:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, Murphycopy writes: > Isn't this the infamous Boston concert during which she > walked > off stage? That's the one...our Boston Jim was there, maybe some others. She still did 18 songs, a tad shorter than the 20-25 she did at most of the other venues. Bob NP: "Coyote", Holmdel, NJ 7/16/83 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 13:17:25 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song There have been a few unkind things said on the list in the last day or so. I thought as a contrast I'd like to offer a little smile to everyone. Many of you have a special place in my heart. I think of my Joni friends from around the world and smile. And is it me, or is Joni much more prevalent since AM? On Monday, I heard "Help Me" in a major department store (followed by some Shawn Colvin), then went to the food store and heard BYT, went to the car and heard Carey, did one more errand, got back in the car and heard Taming the Tiger, switched to a different station and heard Counting Crows' BYT! Life isn't always good, but it's wonderful to be able to savor those Joni moments! If Joni sees increased interest in her catalog, maybe she'll consider doing a sequel to the special???? I wonder, how does one become a candidate for Kennedy Center Honors? Oh and I finally took out my guitar and sang some Joni the other night. I did The Circle Game, and had a real sense of the song not being finished. So I came up with an additional verse. (Please don't be too harsh...) Decades fly so fast it makes us dizzy Our children now have children of their own Dragonflies and cartwheels fill our memories Still we sing the songs that make us feel like home lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 15:25:26 -0500 From: "Donna Binkley" Subject: Re: a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song Dear Ann, I think your new verse is beautiful. It brought tears to my eyes. Thanks for sharing it, i needed that! Peace, people. love donna >>> 4/9/2003 3:17:25 PM >>> There have been a few unkind things said on the list in the last day or so. I thought as a contrast I'd like to offer a little smile to everyone. Many of you have a special place in my heart. I think of my Joni friends from around the world and smile. And is it me, or is Joni much more prevalent since AM? On Monday, I heard "Help Me" in a major department store (followed by some Shawn Colvin), then went to the food store and heard BYT, went to the car and heard Carey, did one more errand, got back in the car and heard Taming the Tiger, switched to a different station and heard Counting Crows' BYT! Life isn't always good, but it's wonderful to be able to savor those Joni moments! If Joni sees increased interest in her catalog, maybe she'll consider doing a sequel to the special???? I wonder, how does one become a candidate for Kennedy Center Honors? Oh and I finally took out my guitar and sang some Joni the other night. I did The Circle Game, and had a real sense of the song not being finished. So I came up with an additional verse. (Please don't be too harsh...) Decades fly so fast it makes us dizzy Our children now have children of their own Dragonflies and cartwheels fill our memories Still we sing the songs that make us feel like home lots of love Anne This message has been scanned by the E250. This message has been scanned by the E250. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:29:18 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: a smile, Joni everywhere, new verse for an old Joni song Anne wrote: And is it me, or is Joni much more prevalent since AM? I don't know about that but I hope that she never turns up on a commercial. So many lovely, classic tunes are ending up there. What a waste but realize they need the cash. mack np:carole king-fantasy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 15:45:10 -0500 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: Re: Down to you and tidbits sorry if this is a doubled post - but apparently it didn't get received.: I agree Bob. I also think it would not have worked thematically but don't know if I can say why. And while we're talking about T'log I've loved it since the beginning so this may be biased - but I was listening to it on random mode with TI, WTRF, NRH, and HEJIRA. I have to say that if great singing is defined as expressive storytelling - her singing has never been better than T'log. Listening to it on random was very educational. Your NP's for several days have been following the refuge tour. Is there a method to your madness? peace, david peace, david ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 17:13:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: FW: (NJC) Another work dilemma --- Lori Fye wrote: > > What about giving the window offices to those with > the most > > seniority. > > Nope, no can do. Seniority is out, "egalitarianism" > is in. > > (Yeah, right. How many of you have ever worked at a > non-profit where > seniority and/or ego wasn't the order of the day??) > I've never worked anywhere where seniority and/or ego weren't the order of the day. They can talk all they want about egalitarianism - it ain't gonna happen. It isn't human nature. Someone's going to be in charge, whether they have the title or not. It can happen on the sly, or it can happen because some people would rather be followers and just let other people take charge. Not being in charge has its advantages - it means nothing is ever your fault, but you get paid every week just the same. FWIW, if you're going to try to be fair about it, and having a window seat is all that important, give the people with the crappiest, most boring jobs the window seats. The big cheeses are probably always out at meetings anyway. Once people have been sitting at a certain spot, they start "owning" it anyway & don't want to move (we tried this in my office and it never turns out the way you expect it might.) I once had a boss who tried to switch my co-worker and me every six months because the co-worker had the window seat and I had the other one. I declined and she thought I was a wimp. I wasn't a wimp. I was just settled where I was. I think my boss just had it in for my co-worker who had started a day earlier than I did and so go the window seat. My supervisor claimed she was trying to be "fair" about the window but the truth is, I really didn't give a rat's ass. The other thing you could do is draw lots. First name drawn picks the seat they want, and so on. You can't assume everyone wants a window seat. Some people can't take the glare if the sun is shining in. And so on. Or, get offices in a round building where everyone gets a window (elevators and utility things in the hub of the wheel.) If you want to be really fair about it, make it a round, revolving building so everyone gets their fair share of daylight and view. (heh-heh.) ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #227 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)