From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #108 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, February 11 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 108 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- News Clips: This Just IN (NJC) ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: NJC Two great articles on war PC ["mike pritchard" ] HERE is another article on the WAR!!! [Thom Byrd ] Re: Circumcision, njc [Gerald Notaro ] Re: NJC Two great articles on war ["Lori Fye" ] Re: njc Em does Hollywood [] Re: njc Em does Hollywood [vince ] Re: crime and punishment [Freddyb4@aol.com] Re: Iraq [Freddyb4@aol.com] Re: News Clips: This Just IN (NJC) [Steve Polifka ] RE: definitive covers ["Maggie McNally" ] Oscar nominations NJC [] Re: Iraq (again) NJC (thanks Colin) [Freddyb4@aol.com] Re: Oscar nominations NJC ["Lavieri, Vince [185776]" ] All this talk about gluten NJC ["Jerry Notaro" ] Re: Today's Porridge Links - njc [ReckersL@ebrd.com] Re: Today's Porridge Links - njc [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: NJC Two great articles on war ["Lori Fye" ] 'Paprika Plains' lyrics ["Stephen Toogood" ] Re: NJC Two great articles on war [colin ] Joni tour - and another cover? [Steve Dulson ] Re: NJC Two great articles on war [sl.m@shaw.ca] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 00:28:03 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: News Clips: This Just IN (NJC) >Sorry I am still WAY behind on the list, but have been trying to catch up. Anyways just got off the phone with Les who is just out of his skin right now trying to get a new page UP for us where everyone can post pics of themselves clipped or not.< bravo! post of the month paz...rotflmao... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:42:07 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war PC >>Assassinate the mother!<< Doesn't sound very feminist, lesbian or pacifist to me, Susan. What? Oh, assassinate the motherfucker Saddam. OK, now I'm with you. See what happens when you take things out of context or don't read / see the bigger picture. ;-) mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 00:48:45 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: Circumcision, njc - now inoculations i think that the vacine wears off from years ago when they were commonly given...i have heard that there is a high incidence of sickness from the vacine which is why there is hesitation in giving them to the population as a whole...wow heather, that is very scary...i don't blaim you for being worried... heather>speaking of inoculations .... i received a small pox inoculation years ago. i was about 4 yrs old. i guess my mother thought she was doing the right thing. well, i almost died.< ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:06:08 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: missing digests NJC I haven't received digests 105 or 106. Last week I missed another one in the 90s. Wozzwithat? mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 02:50:32 -0800 (PST) From: Thom Byrd Subject: HERE is another article on the WAR!!! WAR!!! WHAT IS IT GOOD FOR!!!!!!!!!! ABSOLUTELY NUTHIN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! , and you do not have to say it again , I will scream it again for you , WAR !!!!! WHAT IS IT GOOD FOR !!!!!! ABSOLUTELY NUTHIN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Keep your pencil sharp, thom http://thombyrd.tripod.com/index.html Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:29:04 -0000 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Child abuse/child prostitution/children's rights (was circumcision) NJC Hello All... I am trying to patch a reply here that addresses several themes that are starting to emerge. May I start by giving you a link to www.barnardos.org.uk that will inform you of the current position in regard to minors who are abused through prostitution. May I also make the point that I work for this chartiy but anything I speak of personally here on the list is not a statement made on behalf of Barnardo's. I am a fundraiser for them and spend my time calling on schools colleges and universities trying to get the students to raise money for us. We need 2.2 million pounds a WEEK to support the 90,000 (YES NINETY THOUSAND) disadvantaged and vulenrable children who live in fear and poverty, are subjected to mental, physical and sexual abuse, who live with alcohol and drug dependant parents, or whose lives are lived on sink-hole estates where expectations are nil and those who rise above their backgrounds are treated with derision, or suspicion and become the target of the disaffected.... We also help unaccompanied refugee children, and also refugee families (regardless of the reasons they have come here) SArah, you raise the issue of Childrens Rights... THE UK has a Childrens Rights Act that covers many many aspects of children's lives. It is a comprehensive Act that also entitles children to legal representation and can be permitted(for example) to sue negligent health authorities who bungle their births and leave them with long term disabilities. Abuse through Prostitution......Yes Colin, you are right. The law as it stands deems that an under age child who is involved in selling sex (and this is never something they decide to do) is the one who is targetted for prosecution. When caught they are charged with being a "common prostitute"..... Some of these girls are only 12....They are the visible target on the street, they live in fear of their "pimp" so won't divulge who controls them, and the "punter" is usually cautioned for "kerb crawling". Barnardo's are campaigning to have those who use children for immoral earnings and those who pay for sex with children to be classed as sex offenders and prosecuted as such with the full weight of the law in that respect brought to bear on them (and that in many cases ends up being a 2 year sentance with 10 years on the sex offences register........derisory isn't it......) However a lot a child prostitution is HIDDEN. There are whole circles of adults who abuse children and pay the "controlling adult"...often a parent.....for sex with them. It is a sorry tale which has its roots in "cycles of abuse".. the children, if not helped over this point (and they are of little interest to these type of adults once they grow up) do have very altereted perception of what constitutes a healthy reatlionship and their lives are indeed blighted and twisted by the corruption of their understanding of "loving parents or caring adults"... It is an enormous subject. You are right, Laurent and Murphy/BOB and Colin that those who are abused do not always go on to abuse. Those who do abuse children are, for the main part (about 89%) however, people who have had some form of abuse visited on them that stunts their ability to form adult relationships and they are "more comfortable" with children.......by whom they do not feel threatened. Their own abusing behaviour may often start when they are, themselves, children and we( Barnardo's) have several projects that work with these children and their families to try and avert the abuse continuing.... this is long arduous work and is a question of allowing the family to heal and to deal with its own skeletons and bad memories from the past. All the counsellors are in constant couselling themselves to avoid the build up of stress..and some of the case histories are horrendous.. But how do we, as nations expect to deal with our own separate tragedy of child abuse, and it IS a tragedy for all involved? International agencies deal with the underdeveloped nations and the problems caused by WAR (and we are heading into another one in what is an oil rich, but poverty ridden country) famine, economic sanction and the fall of paternal stewardship by countries such as the UK (I am not defending, nor expounding colonialism here, but the human rights issues in ex-colonies beggar belief.....that is an entirely different theme to discuss). The UK has an overstretched and understaffed Social Services. We have the highest teenage pregnancy rate in Europe, Our Police force is in dissarray, our National Health service has more administrators than nursing and doctoring staff, our education system is overburdened by petty beurocracy so that 10% of teaching time is taken up with having to write reports on anything the government wants them to produce as "MEASURES".....Oh the list of things that are wrong here is endless...... and Charities such as Barnardo's (and several other admirable ones) have to be relied upon to look after the children and young people whose parents are unable to cope. Sometimes I am ashamed to call my self English as this country has become a cess pool where money is king and only those who HAVE are listened to. Is it any wonder that for successive generations children have had a hard time, and they become struggling parents... when there is so much that is wrong? Society is sick and falling apart and all we ever seem to do is stand by and moan.. What I like about my day job is I know my efforts do make a difference to the lives of the kids we help. I feel I am indeed lucky on that score....but what makes me shudder is that there are thousands more out there just waiting to be heard...that I cannot deal with..... How we deal with the mess that our country and every other developed country is a subject for wideranging debate and will spring up fors and againsts depending on which side of the line you are. I think this is what bugs me about political and religious debate...... it is all about making the particular point rather than actually achieving anything. Children matter, how we look after them matters, deciding to have children should not be a lifestyle choice but a matter of the deepest consideration. In the discussion of Joni's own painful decision to have Kilauren adopted it seemed to degenerate into semantics... what was at issue was the future of a child... "Little Green, have a happy ending..". and is that not what we all want for our children? A happy ending...... Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 12:25:49 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Child abuse/child prostitution/children's rights (was circumcision) NJC Lucy Hone wrote: > >Abuse through Prostitution......Yes Colin, you are right. The law as it >stands deems that an under age child who is involved in selling sex (and >this is never something they decide to do) is the one who is targetted for >prosecution. When caught they are charged with being a "common >prostitute"..... Some of these girls are only 12.... > I am grateful for the fact you have wiritten this. I just want to point out the there aremany boys abused in this way too. >do have very altereted perception of what constitutes a healthy reatlionship >and their lives are indeed blighted and twisted by the corruption of their >understanding of "loving parents or caring adults"... It is an enormous >subject. > again you are right. However, given the right understanding love and support, by both lay people and professionals, this situation can be alleviated to a certain degree. i don't believe it can be completey, not form my experience anyway. > >You are right, Laurent and Murphy/BOB and Colin that those who are abused do >not always go on to abuse. > Laurent was saying the opposite. i undestand that many people have this false understanding so am not labelling anyone has bad for holding this erroneous view. Education, education, education. > Those who do abuse children are, for the main >part (about 89%) however, people who have had some form of abuse visited on >them that stunts their ability to form adult relationships and they are >"more comfortable" with children.......hey are, themselves, >children and we( Baby whom they do not feel threatened. > > > > > > >Children matter, how we look after them matters, deciding to have children >should not be a lifestyle choice but a matter of the deepest consideration. > > Cidren ned to be put at the top of the list of priorities. thank you Lucy. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:51:40 -0500 From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Klein and Joni In a message dated 2/10/2003 9:22:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, littlebird3333@yahoo.com writes: > Ahh! This is ourtrageous! Sire of Sorrow, Two Grey > Rooms, Passion Play, Turbulent Indigo, the list goes > on and on. They've produced some wonderful songs > together. You missed my point, Andrew...I wasn't talking about co-production, I was talking about the *compositions* they did together, which are: From DED: Tax Free Fiction From CMIARS: Lakota Tea Leaf Prophecy Snakes And Ladders Reocurring Dream From NRH: Nothing Can Be Done You'll notice that none of the songs you mention (outstanding compositions all) credit Klein as a contributor. Of the above that I've listed, in my opinion Lakota is the only one that holds a candle to Mitchell's own compositions. Joni herself stated that their writing styles were not compatible, and I don't think it's any small coincidence that NRH, hailed by many as a return to form after the abysmal CMIARS, trimmed the Klein compositions down to one, arguably the weakest track on the record. Of course, just my opinion... Bob NP: Joe Henry, "Rough & Tumble" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 12:58:10 -0000 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Re: Child abuse/child prostitution/children's rights (was circumcision)NJC COLIN.wrote............ > > I am grateful for the fact you have wiritten this. I just want to point > out the there aremany boys abused in this way too. My reply Thank you Colin............ you are right I have missed making the poiint that our work is not just with girls but boys as well.. GO TO THE SITE AND SEE THE POSTERS... Our youngest male client is 9 I believe.... our work with young men is enormous and misunderstood. Homophobia, ignorance and "shame" prevent a lot of people either supporting our work or seeking our help.. Also, with young men they are often more independant and live lives that allow them a degree of freedom from control.. Accepting that order and control are important to a better life, is hard for them as within those frameworks ( whether care homes, home life or in school) they have been abused. BEing FREE, so to speak, allows them some autonomy. the risks they run, though through selling sex are horrendous and far reaching.. My own attitude to homeless young people, those who use drugs, are obviously selling sex and those who are openly dealing drugs has changed dramatically since working for Barnardo's as behind each seemingly overt and anti-social behaviour is someone who needs help.... If you do go to www.barnardos.org.uk and please do....... you will see our work under "NO SON OF MINE" and "WHOSE DAUGHTER NEXT" these are important documents and pieces of work... Colin also wrote > again you are right. However, given the right understanding love and > support, by both lay people and professionals, this situation can be > alleviated to a certain degree. i don't believe it can be completey, not > form my experience anyway. My reply.... Our work redresses that abuse and goes into overdrive on damage limitation for their own future.... Our strap lineof "Giving children back their future" recognises the importance of giving children hope and a future to look forward to.... WE need to alter our perceptions of what the issues are rather than always taking the "moral" high-ground with todays children. helping them to enjoy life and realise they are all future citizens of this world and are of the utmost importance, is part of returning this society to some semblance of the word..... civilised..... We ignore the part they play in our world at our peril... AS we sow, so shall we reap... Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 05:19:50 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war > Geez, can't we chuckle at our individual and group personality > variations here? No. > Isn't that what kind people or a group of friends talking to each > other face to face do? No. > Can't we just be people here sometimes No. > or must we all be consumed with battling for our side all the time? Yes. JUST KIDDING!!! Let's ALL study war no more. Happy Tuesday, Lori ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 05:21:58 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: missing digests NJC > I haven't received digests 105 or 106. Last week I missed another one > in the 90s. Wozzwithat? Dunno. It happens sometimes. But here's at least one remedy: visit http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni to read all past digests. Lori ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:21:39 -0500 From: Gerald Notaro Subject: Re: Circumcision, njc Well it just so happens with all the Michael Jackson stories swirling I did hear on a newscast a psychologist say it was about 14%. That makes it far from most. Jerry Laurent Olszer wrote: >>I don't mean to jump on you while everyone else is taking you to task for >>your religious belief in circumcision, Laurent, but are you saying that >>"most" victims of child abuse become child abusers? I don't think that's >>true, although I am not sure. Do you know something I don't know? >> >> --Bob > > > Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. I don't have 1st hand knowledge about > this, but I've heard it all over for years. I thought it was common > knowledge, I guess not. > Please don't jump on me for generalizing, there are exceptions to every > rule. > > Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 05:32:20 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war > Then again you have to believe the Congressional Record is the true > recordation of what U.S. representatives have done. Maybe I'm headed for joining the local militia or something, but I don't trust much of anything that comes from our government, regardless of who's running the show. As far as I'm concerned, the Congressional Record can be manipulated as much as the "Holy Bible" has been. > As I explained already, I was just laughing at Sarah labeling a > couple of her links as "opinion". Nothing more - no hidden agenda. Fair enough. I understand and accept that, Kakki. > We apparently have a lot of enemies out there right now. We always have. Always. > I'm on the side of the defense in this one. As am I. DEFENSE. I'm not, however, on the side of engaging in offense, which is what we're about to do. You want to defend? Reappropriate military spending for better radar/satellite observation, better intelligence (although I would say trim those agencies down to only the truly intelligent individuals), and have aircraft/missiles/whatever READY to go WHEN we are attacked. We can't go running all over the globe bombing everyone who MIGHT have some shit hidden beneath their land. We're fixin' to stir up a mighty big hornet's nest ... Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 13:36:09 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Child abuse/child prostitution/children's rights (was circumcision)NJC Lucy Hone wrote: > >My reply.... > >Our work redresses that abuse and goes into overdrive on damage limitation >for their own future.... Our strap lineof "Giving children back their >future" recognises the importance of giving children hope and a future to >look forward to.... > and thank God for that. the earlier the recovery starts, the better, and the more can be corrected. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:52:17 -0600 From: twoshoes@sasktel.net Subject: woodstock versions I am putting together a sampling of all my Joni CDs for a friend who is not familiar with her music (ha! when she hears so many familiar songs, she'll say "Oh yeah! I didn't know Joni did that song!"). What a trip it has been, and how I imagine my friend running to the music store to purchase her first Joni CDs after realizing what she's been missing all these years. First, I limited myself to only three songs off each CD. That was damn near impossible, because I love more than three songs on each, that's for sure. But over the course of a day or two of listening to the CDs in their original order of release, it's been such a reminder of how much Joni's voice and style have changed since her early days. And those early days -- wow, that voice! It makes my spine tingle sometimes, it is SO high and clear and bell-like and yet full and rich. Her voice is breathtakingly beautiful. Anyway, thought I'd weigh in with my opinion that the version of Woodstock on the Shadows and Light CD is the best one. Not that I really believe that there is anyone on this list who doesn't own Turbulent Indigo or hasn't seen the photo of Joni holding her Van Gogh self-portrait, but just in case ... I am posting it later today at http://xoetc.antville.org. Kate du Nord ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:55:58 -0500 From: vince Subject: njc Em does Hollywood The Eminem fan club is accepting congratulations for the Oscar nomination for 8 Mile for best song - and Y Tu Mama Tambien got screwed by only getting one nomination, Best Original Screenplay, it deserved more. Vince ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 21:59:58 +0800 (PHT) From: Subject: Re: njc Em does Hollywood > The Eminem fan club is accepting congratulations for the Oscar > nomination for 8 Mile for best song - I am one with you on this one, Vince! So glad it got at least a nomination. > and Y Tu Mama Tambien got screwed by only getting one nomination, Best > Original Screenplay, it deserved more. Although I prefer either Pedro Almodovar's HABLE CON ELLA or Zhang Yimou's HERO as best foreign language film, I agree that Y TU MAMA TAMBIEN deserved more nominations. But as you may know already, Mexico's entry for the Best Foreign Language film in the Oscar derby is EL CRIMEN DE PADRE AMARO (The Crimes of Padre Amaro) and not Y TU MAMA TAMBIEN. Either film stars Gael Garcia Bernal. Joseph in Manila (with humidity so thick its almost solid) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:21:06 -0500 From: vince Subject: Re: njc Em does Hollywood http://www.oscars.com/nominees/nomineelist.html >>Em's publicist wrote: The Eminem fan club is accepting congratulations for the Oscar >>nomination for 8 Mile for best song - >> >> >jpalis@kssp.upd.edu.ph replied: >I am one with you on this one, Vince! So glad it got at least a nomination. > >vince added "and Y Tu Mama Tambien got screwed by only getting one nomination, Best >Original Screenplay, it deserved more. > > > >Joseph commented: Although I prefer either Pedro Almodovar's HABLE CON ELLA or Zhang Yimou's >HERO as best foreign language film, I agree that Y TU MAMA TAMBIEN >deserved more nominations. But as you may know already, Mexico's entry for >the Best Foreign Language film in the Oscar derby is EL CRIMEN DE PADRE >AMARO (The Crimes of Padre Amaro) and not Y TU MAMA TAMBIEN. Either film >stars Gael Garcia Bernal. > Gael Barcia Bernal is a hell of an actor. Almodovar got nominated for best director but his film didn't get the nod if I read the list right - I have heard only good things about EL CRIMEN DE PADRE AMARO and got the book last month but haven't started it yet. Vince ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:30:31 EST From: Freddyb4@aol.com Subject: Re: crime and punishment Hi to all - Caught part of a discussion about the treatment of prisoners, but they do have a choice, to commit a crime or not, or do they ? Police here in the UK have admitted that they no longer investigate burgleries, 90% of which are drug related, they'll visit your home, but it's down to you to sort things out with your insurance company, although they did warn me to be very careful, because the thieves will know that within a short time the stolen items will be replaced, and they often come back. Young offenders receive no punishment, unless there's violence involved. 8 years ago a friend of my daughters called Dougie was thrown out by his Mum, and was hanging around our house, once we knew the story he moved in, and we tried to sort things out. He was with us for 6 weeks, we got him to return to school, bought him shoes and school uniform, social services didn't compensate us for that expence, but they did tell us that it had been worked out that it costs a #1,000 a week to keep a displaced young person housed. We eventually got him to return home, but Dougie already had a string of minor convictions, was he a villian ? no, honestly he was a great kid, 15 years old, but on a downward spiral. The social worker explained that they do not punish these youngsters because most grow out of it, I disagreed with that idea, but then who am I. Dougie left school but continued to get into trouble, stealing from supermarkets and cars, each time he was given one more chance, he got involved in drugs and ended up in prison, what a waste of a life. I understand there are a group of young people who are thinking of claiming damages from Police and Social Services for failing them, what they are saying is punishment might have stopped them before things got out of hand, the soft approach made them feel safe, they knew nothing would happen to them. And you can see this on TV, in the faces of young offenders as they walk free from Court, smirking and laughing, knowing they have got away with it again. Capital punishment is dangerous, the Courts have been wrong too many times, corporal punishment isn't the answer, but it will stop some from reoffending, and victims of crime will have the satisfaction of knowing those who chose to violate their lives have been punished. There is some suggestion that violence and crime could be genetic, what do we do if it's proved ? Dougie I must say had a bad start in life, he never knew his father, he hanged himself in the woods near his home when Dougie was a baby. He also had a mother, who when I met her, spoke well only of David her older son, Dougie was always trouble. Did she ruin Dougies life, did she blame him for the death of her husband? We can meddle with laws and individuals rights all we like, but life will always deal someone a crap hand Bye Fred " Take yor time, think a lot, think of everything you've got," " For you may still be here tomorrow, but your dreams may not" Father and Son Cat Stevens ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:31:32 EST From: Freddyb4@aol.com Subject: Re: Iraq ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:31:46 -0600 From: Steve Polifka Subject: Re: News Clips: This Just IN (NJC) Now Mikey, Is this HARD core, or SOFT porn??? Steve At 11:25 PM 2/10/03 -0800, you wrote: >Sorry I am still WAY behind on the list, but have been trying to catch up. >Anyways just got off the phone with Les who is just out of his skin right >now trying to get a new page UP for us where everyone can post pics of >themselves clipped or not. You girls can participate too if you like as >there will be No discrimination regarding sex, colour, creed, or the usual >OR unusual things. This is gonna be really a lot of fun trying to guess who >is who altho most of you might guess Smurph because he has showed so many of >you in the past. Please do not procrastinate, but send your clipped pics to >pics to les@willieismysoreheismysorrow.org OR non clips to >les@boomboompacederm.org >The results should be stunning to say the least and there will be a month >for us to tab the results of the who do you think is who thing (or something >like that). > >Be well all, > >Michael (off to take my pic and email to Les's new JMDL gallery) > > Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:42:28 -0500 From: "Maggie McNally" Subject: RE: Hell fecking yeah!!(njc) Hey Victor, It sounds like you are in a new, good phase of your life. Whole Foods is here in greater Boston (under the name Bread & Circus, a local, pioneering chain of whole foods supermarkets that they bought out some years ago) and we LOVE it. Not only is the food consistently fresh and of high quality, but the staff are always pleasant, personable and knowledgable. Sounds like you'll fit right in! Congrats on you new home - sounds fabulous. Maggie > -----Original Message----- > From: waytoblu [mailto:waytoblu@mindspring.com] > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 6:22 PM > To: joni@smoe.org > Subject: Hell fecking yeah!!(njc) > > > I just moved into my new apartment this weekend in > Decatur...get this-- everything is brand new... floors, > cabinets, appliances (it even has a high tech dishwasher), > huge walk-in closet, laundry room down the hall. > > None of the rooms are square....the walls and ceiling all > have interesting angles and curves...the man who designed > this house was a genius. He died last year, before the house > was completely finished and his family completed the > construction and decided to rent out apartments which were > originally intended for visiting family members. > > The craziest thing is they are only charging a little more > than half of what they could be charging. I'm still not > convinced that I actually live there(it seems too nice-I'm > used to living in rundown old houses so this is a nice > change...very fortuitous.) I start working at a brand new > Whole Foods Market in March (coincidence?) > > Victor...exicited to be able to pick up more than one channel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:50:33 -0500 From: "Maggie McNally" Subject: RE: definitive covers I remember her answering this in an interview included on one of the tape trees. If I remember correctly (now on thin ice, as it has been a very long time), it is computer generated (VG-8?) and she felt that it was the "same as" actually playing the oboe. I recall feeling that it was disrespectful to those who had put in the many long hours it takes to learn to play that instrument - but then she has that celebrated arrogance, doesn't she? Maggie > -----Original Message----- > From: Kate Bennett [mailto:kate@katebennett.com] > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 10:02 PM > To: joni@smoe.org > Subject: Re: definitive covers > > > >>>I found it interesting that on NRH (which I have on > vinyl), in "Nothing > Can > be Done", the music was by LARRY KLEIN (words by Joni). And > on "The Only > Joy in Town," Joni plays OBOE. Who knew?<< > > i sure didn't know that...was it real oboe (very difficult to > just pick up & > play from what i understand) or could it be that it was > keyboard sampled > oboe? > > ******************************************** > Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com > Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs > Over the Moon- > "bringing the melancholy world of twilight > to life almost like magic" All Music Guide > ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 22:59:29 +0800 (PHT) From: Subject: Oscar nominations NJC > Gael Barcia Bernal is a hell of an actor. He sure is. He was also memorable in AMORES PERROS. A truly gifted actor. Damn, I wish I look like him. And as soon as the nominations were announced, its quite glaring who were the people they omitted. Like Patricia Clarkson in FAR FROM HEAVEN, or Toni Collette and Miranda Richardson in THE HOURS. And the omission of Richard Gere as Best Actor must hurt. And no musical score nod for THE PIANIST? Who scored it? David Helfgott? How can anyone omit the nomination for Francois Ozon's 8 WOMEN in the Foreign Language category? Or a cinematography nod to THE LORD OF THE RINGS: THE TWO TOWERS? And an Oscar nomination isn't complete with the classy Cate Blanchett nod, don't you think? I am glad Philip Glass' score for THE HOURS were nominated, and my personal favorite Thomas Newman for his introspective piano solos in THE ROAD TO PERDITION (I knew there's someone other than me who thought them very very melodic). And I am happy for John C. Reilly's non-bravura but effective turn in CHICAGO. And for Nicole Kidman. And a screenplay nod for Alfonso Cuaron's Y TU MAMA TAMBIEN. And Pedro Almodovar's Best Director nom. It must be the black and white "enter-the-vagina" scene that did it. I'm glad either way. But Queen Latifah? Not quite Judi-Dench-steal-the-movie-in-8-minutes turn. And a screenplay nod for Charlie Kauffman for ADAPTATION? That's too much support for real-life Kaufman's in-joke that its almost a joke. I am just awaiting Eminem's performance at the Oscars. Joseph in Manila (must be due to the humidity or impending war) > Almodovar got nominated for best director but his film didn't get the > nod if I read the list right - I have heard only good things about EL > CRIMEN DE PADRE AMARO and got the book last month but haven't started it > yet. > > Vince ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:07:57 EST From: Freddyb4@aol.com Subject: Re: Iraq (again) NJC (thanks Colin) Good to see most agree in holding back from all out War. As long as the inspectors are there, and Saddam is under pressure, then he is no danger. If he throws the inspectors out, then he deserves what he gets. I hope it doesn't come down to costs, the troops are there, "all dressed up with nowhere to go" lets attack now !! Can't afford to hang around. There will be very little opposition should troops move in, the people of Iraq, including the most of the army, don't want war, and will be glad to be free of Saddam. The danger is that Saddam has something rigged up to take as many of his people down with him, and our troops, and what will replace him.??? Yes this has a lot to do with OIL, but the Arab World need it as much as we do, when it comes to World resources, sand and camels do not yeild a great return ( I know there is more to the Arab World than that) Why is it when a democratic organization like Nato or the UN have a difference of opinion, people start talking of being let down, or decieved, it all sounds so childish "If you don't let me score a goal I'll take my ball home" I see it as a healthy sign, if people are prepared to stand up and be counted, and say what they believe, rather than rubber stamp everything the big boys want. Maybe George and Tony know something we don't, they both appear very nervous, time will tell. "You don't look different but you have changed, " "I'm looking through you, you're not the same !!" BEATLES ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:21:48 -0500 From: "Lavieri, Vince [185776]" Subject: Re: Oscar nominations NJC Our man in Manilla writes: "And a screenplay nod for Charlie Kauffman for ADAPTATION? That's too much support for real-life Kaufman's in-joke that its almost a joke." The dude in Michigan responds: like to see Charlie Kauffman win just to see who picks up the Oscar... when the nomination was announced, it was done with a smirk, but I think the joke has gone on long enough - not that I am going to spoil the punchline for those who have yet to be surprised by who Charlie Kauffman really is... :-) and J continues: I am just awaiting Eminem's performance at the Oscars. and V replies: aren't we all -- you know the academy is going to wimp out major league and give it to U2 for the forgettable GONY song (which hardly sounds like 19th century NY to me and was a pure sell out to post 9-11 commercialism) or Paul Simon's even more forgettable schlock from the Wild Thornberrys - I love Simon's work but that song is insipid ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:41:38 -0500 (EST) From: waytoblu Subject: Re: Tiddly-Winks (njc) Still around I must say this digest has been off the point of it for some time. What exactly is "it"? Victor NPIMH: Jefferson Airplane "Bless it's Pointed Little Head" (see...the digest has been on the point ;>) ) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:06:50 -0500 From: "Jerry Notaro" Subject: All this talk about gluten NJC Celiac disease often goes undiagnosed, study finds February 11, 2003 BY JIM RITTER HEALTH REPORTER Mark Achler didn't know his body wasn't designed to consume a long list of common foods and drinks, ranging from bread to beer. Achler has celiac disease, a reaction to eating a protein called gluten found in wheat, barley, rye and many processed foods. He blamed his fatigue and bloating on the stress of his job and two kids. He finally was tested for celiac disease after doctors diagnosed the disorder in his 2-year-old daughter, Sarah, who had been losing weight. "Once I went on a gluten-free diet, I felt great," he said. Doctors often fail to diagnose celiac disease partly because it has been considered rare. But a study published Monday found the disorder affects 1 in 133 Americans. Since only about 1 in every 4,700 Americans has been diagnosed, that means about 97 percent of cases go undetected, researchers said. "The degree of awareness in the medical community is very poor," said University of Chicago researcher Dr. Stefano Guandalini, a co-author of the study. The study was headed by University of Maryland researchers and included the U. of C. and other centers. It was published in the Archives of Internal Medicine and funded, in part, by celiac patients and companies that make celiac screening tests. The study is the largest of its kind in the United States. To determine the prevalence of the disease, researchers took blood samples from 13,145 people. If a subject tested positive, researchers confirmed the diagnosis with a biopsy of the small intestine. The study found that 1 of 22 people who have close relatives with celiac also have the disease. Among those with no family history or other risk factors, 1 in 133 have the disease. Celiac disease damages the lining of the small intestine so food isn't property absorbed. Symptoms include bloating, weight loss, weakness, fatigue, unusually foul smelling stool, anemia, gas and delayed growth. There's indirect evidence celiac disease can lead to Type 1 diabetes and osteoporosis. But it's not easy to avoid gluten. Guandalini said that among those who try, about 30 percent quit the gluten-free diet, 30 percent cheat occasionally and only 40 percent stick to it rigorously. Achler and his daughter, who live in Deerfield, are among those disciplined enough to stick to the diet. Achler said he misses eating such foods as spaghetti, bread and beer. "But there are a lot worse things in life," he said. Sarah, now 14, said she wonders what it would be like to eat pizza and other foods her friends enjoy. But she knows that if she eats gluten, she will spend the next three hours doubled up with abdominal pain. For more information, call the U. of C. Celiac Disease Program, (773) 702-7593. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:09:40 EST From: Freddyb4@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC "battered husbands" In a TV programme some years ago on violence in the home, it soon became clear that women are every bit as aggressive as men, but physically a womans punch is not as damaging as a mans, so they use mental violence, both sexes use words to attack, but some women are very good at it, and of course they also wait for their opportunity. You had the Bobbit ? case in the US, where she cut of her husbands penis while he slept. Here in the UK this programme found several victims, one had boiling water poured over him while he slept, another woke up and found his wife stabbing him. Some of these women admitted they were hell to live with, and wondered why their husbands stayed, men seldom report the crime. One poor chap in his 30's was single, had a nice home, and took a girl home with him, but after a few days she kept coming around, so he made it clear he didn't want to continue the relationship, she was trying to move in. Just when he thought it was all over, he came home to find her in his house, she had keys cut, and when he tried to get her out she became very violent and in the end he hit her. He called the Police and minutes after they arrived he was under arrest for defending himself in his own home, he spent 3 days in jail, they always believe the womens side of the story. I happen to think women are wonderful, just glad I never met up with a bad one. Oh by the way, I was at a birthday party around the time my wife and I were splitting up, lot's of old friends there, and a girl called Sally Bull, grabbed hold of me and dragged me onto the dance floor, Sally was a great girl, when we were lost in the crowd and the loud music she began to question me, whats wrong with you and Pearl (my wife) I said I'd given up trying to understand, nothings wrong, yet everything is wrong, and Sally said "Slap her" ( what ! I said) "Slap her, let her know you care" ????? Stupid, or is it?? people in violent relationships do seem to keep going back for more, could it be there is something they like about it ? Fred " I really love it when you call me names" Joan Armatrading ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:09:56 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Klein and Joni - njc Bob Muller writes: << From DED: Tax Free Fiction From CMIARS: Lakota Tea Leaf Prophecy Snakes And Ladders Reocurring Dream From NRH: Nothing Can Be Done >> You're RIGHT, Bob! With a couple of exceptions, this reads like a list of my least-favorite Joni songs. Now can we get back to discussing circumcision? --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:13:12 -0700 From: Les Irvin Subject: Missing digests and Hotmail NJC At 2/11/2003 02:06 AM, mike pritchard wrote: >I haven't received digests 105 or 106. Last week I missed another one in the >90s. Wozzwithat? All you Hotmail users are in the same boat. That service has been rejecting messages like crazy lately. No idea why. Missing digests can always be picked up here: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Les ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:29:37 -0000 From: ReckersL@ebrd.com Subject: Re: Today's Porridge Links - njc Bob Murphy wrote: Lieve laments: << Master Murphy is turning Mean and Making Me Miserable!!! (SNIP) And then you really put the knife in, asking me where I learned English. Oooooh, that hurts! >> I am sorry, Lieve, but I am not known as "the nice Bob" for many reasons. I'll tell you what, get your check in for NE Jonifest today and you can brush up on your English when you get to the US! Already done, dear! I'm one of Ashara's lucky 19! But how travelling from London to the US is going to help me brush up my English is beyond me! Now I know you are not known as "the nice Bob" - in fact I would say you are known as "not the nice Bob" or sometimes even as "the not-nice Bob", but did you have to be so ACCENTIST ? The only way out of this terrible conflict, I believe, is via Wally, the international accents expert. I'm so happy to hear he can make it for the fest and I suggest we let him be the judge of who's got to brush up on what - - OK? Porridge to all, Lieve. ______________________________________________________________ This message may contain privileged information. If you have received this message by mistake, please keep it confidential and return it to the sender. Although we have taken steps to minimise the risk of transmitting software viruses, the EBRD accepts no liability for any loss or damage caused by computer viruses and would advise you to carry out your own virus checks. The contents of this e-mail do not necessarily represent the views of the EBRD. ______________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:52:53 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Today's Porridge Links - njc Lieve writes: << The only way out of this terrible conflict, I believe, is via Wally, the international accents expert. I'm so happy to hear he can make it for the fest and I suggest we let him be the judge of who's got to brush up on what - OK? >> Lieve, Wally's credibility is SHOT! Last I heard he was trying to get two dollars off his Full Moon deposit by showing his willy! XO, --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:45:54 -0800 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war Sarah: > I'm in favour of the war (so long as there's an intention to fight it > with minimal loss of life, Colin: > as long as it is not your loved ones or you? Excellent point, Colin. Would everyone who would PERSONALLY ship out to go to war against Iraq please raise their hand? Lori, 1 of only 3 known veterans on this list ~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:10:27 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: joni is a sheep (or ram)! NJC I was born December 1953, making me a snake and a centaur/archer. Comments? mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:24:23 -0000 From: "Stephen Toogood" Subject: 'Paprika Plains' lyrics I was just looking though the DJRD booklet for the CD and noticed the extra lyrics for 'Paprika Plains'. I can't believe she left all that out! Quite dark with a definate Native American Indian theme. I like the instrumental part but surely she could have used thse lyrics in the song. Can you imagine that? 'Paprika Plains' being over 20 minutes long! STEVE NP: 'Land Of Souvenirs' by Patti Witten (love it) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:27:21 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war Lori Fye wrote: >Sarah: > > >>I'm in favour of the war (so long as there's an intention to fight it >>with minimal loss of life, >> >> > >Colin: > > >>as long as it is not your loved ones or you? >> >> > > >Excellent point, Colin. Would everyone who would PERSONALLY ship out >to go to war against Iraq please raise their hand? > I was thinking of the people of Iraq. If we were in similar cuircumstances, would we thinkit is worth the killing of our friends and neighbours and familyto achieve an aim? 'minimal loss of life' is not minimal to those involved. The expression also smacks of racism or something similar because to think such a thing we have to de humanise those people. > >Lori, >1 of only 3 known veterans >on this list > >~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:32:29 -0800 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Joni tour - and another cover? Just a reminder, I'm still looking for sites people would like to visit on the Joni tour at JonifestLA. Any ideas appreciated! At Folk Alliance in Nashville last weekend I was given a sampler CD by Terry Gonda, on which she covers BSN. Have this one, Mr. Muller? - -- ######################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 13:48:08 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: NJC Two great articles on war Colin, there's an interesting article in Newsweek, I believe the Feb 17 edition, about how the U.S. intends to use electromagnetic bombs (E-bombs) on the first night of the war. These let out an electronic pulse that disables all electronic equipment. Cars will stop working, phone lines will melt, computers will stop, lights will go out. The idea is to isolate Saddam's command-and-control centre from his army and from the Iraqi people. The Americans then intend to use psy-ops to persuade the Iraqi people and army to surrender immediately, not to fight. There will be an appeal directly to them from the Americans. The army will be told no-one wants to kill them, because a professional army will be needed to keep law and order in the new Iraq. They will be asked to lay down their arms, with a guarantee of good treatment. Using spy satellites, E-bombs, and SAS and Special Marine forces on the ground, the Americans/Brits will try to disable all Iraqi weapons-of-mass-destruction before they can be deployed. (This is one of the problems they have with telling Blix where these weapons are - they don't want Saddam to keep moving them, because they currently know where the main targets are). Army commanders are saying we will see a new type of warfare, and that the last Gulf War was the last of the old-fashioned type of war. As I see it, they are hoping it will be as high-tech and as bloodless as possible - a war against infrastructure, rather than against people. If that is the case - and I accept it's an IF - the outcome should be very good: a new regime for Iraq with minimal (and possibly no) loss of life apart from Saddam's inner circle. I accept what you say Coln - "minimal" loss of life is 100 per cent to the person involved. Sarah At 7:27 PM +0000 02/11/2003, colin wrote: >I was thinking of the people of Iraq. If we were in similar >cuircumstances, would we thinkit is worth the killing of our friends >and neighbours and familyto achieve an aim? 'minimal loss of life' >is not minimal to those involved. ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #108 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)