From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2003 #94 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, February 5 2003 Volume 2003 : Number 094 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?)njc [Randy Remote ] Re: Steely Dan NJC [Randy Remote ] Re: NJC For Fred [sl.m@shaw.ca] RE: Song choices for altos - any suggestions? njc [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC [dsk ] Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC [colin ] JoniFest 2003 [Les Irvin ] Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?) -SJCNJC [colin ] Re: Queen of England NJC [colin ] NJC "The Church" ["Kate Bennett" ] NJC Song choices for altos - any suggestions? njc ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?) NJC [sl.m@shaw.ca] Re: Queen of England NJC [sl.m@shaw.ca] Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC [dsk ] Re: Queen of England NJC ["Lucy Hone" ] Jackson Browne on Austin City Limits NJC [BRIANASYMES@aol.com] some definitive articles (NJC) ["ron" ] Re: condeming NJC [dsk ] Re: Vinyl vs CD JMDL Digest V2003 #91 ["Eryl B Davies" ] Re: Sheepish looks NJC [sl.m@shaw.ca] NDE NJC [colin ] Re: NJC "The Church" ["mike pritchard" ] Re: condeming NJC [colin ] Re: Queen of England NJC [colin ] Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC [colin ] Re: Queen of England NJC [sl.m@shaw.ca] Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC [coli] Re: Queen of England NJC ["Lucy Hone" ] RE: Re Jackson Browne NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Sheepish looks NJC [colin ] Re: Queen of England NJC [colin ] Re: Queen of England NJC [colin ] Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC ["Cynt] Re: NJC "The Church" [sl.m@shaw.ca] Re: Queen of England NJC [sl.m@shaw.ca] Re: Queen of England NJC [colin ] Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC [coli] RE: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC ["Jim ] Re: NJC LP's v CD ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Joni 45's ? [BRIANASYMES@aol.com] Conditional recommendation: a movie called "The Hours", njc ["Jim L'Homme] Re: Joni 45's ? [Gary Zack ] Re: Joni 45's ? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: NJC LP's v CD [AzeemAK@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 11:26:25 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?)njc Suzanne MarcAurele wrote: > Thanks for the bond girl ad > Silly- my natural predeliction toward something higher than the base > instinct alone questions; where pray tell is the mail counterpart to this > ad - ie have we ads influencing the impressionable minds of young males to > be "ken-like"? Pick up any Rolling Stone. Got to go shave & wax my chest...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 11:28:48 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Steely Dan NJC I am a fan of Piano Jazz, and listen to it regularly, so thanks for the heads up. Generally her show is one on one with another piano player, I'm guessing it's Fagan that is the guest? Rather than the whole band. RR Mark Tatum wrote: > I'm on the Joni-only digest, so this may be old news, but I recall that > several jmdlers are Dan fans too. On 2/11/03 NPR will have Steely Dan > on Marian McPartland's Jazz Piano, and on 5/6/03 Steely Dan will release > a new album entitled "Everything Must Go". ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 13:49:19 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: NJC For Fred Catherine, I agree, but I don't think the ant/grasshopper story is about immigrants, just about different types of people/insects. As I said, it was sent by a British farmer friend of mine who has very particular views about hardworking farmers versus the rest of the population - immigrant or indigenous, he makes no distinction - thinks we're ALL lazy good-for-nothing wretches. ;-) There was a bad story in Canada about welfare fraud which shocked me. You probably know it - the pregnant 41-year-old woman, convicted of welfare fraud because she was receiving welfare payments and then applied for a student loan so she could go to university. Sentenced to have the overpayment deducted from her already very meagre monthly payments AND house arrest, allowed to leave her home (from memory) only 3 times a week for an hour each time, or thereabouts. She was allowed to go out more often if she needed to, but only with advance written permission. This woman had suffered from depression in the past and this was known. Nonethless, she was left unable to leave her home, with virtually no money, 8 months pregnant with her first child, no partner, in a small, shabby appartment in Toronto, I believe, last August, which was sweltering. And she killed herself. I was surprised at the response of Canada's two national newspapers. I expected there to be an uproar during or after her inquest, but there was virtually nothing. Canada's two biggest women columnists, at least in the nationals, Margaret Wente in the Globe and Mail said it was basically the woman's own fault, and Chrissie Blatchford in the National Post said well, she killed herself, what does that have to do with the welfare system? And that was that or, if there was more, I didn't see it. I found it shocking, and particularly so because she was "cheating" in order to go to university to do a degree in social work, so she was trying to "better" herself and get a job. It wasn't as if she was spending the extra money on heroin or lipsticks, though even if she had been, she didn't deserve a death sentence. Sarah At 7:26 AM -0500 02/05/2003, Catherine McKay wrote: >While I agree that there are definitely a lot of >welfare cheaters, I also feel that there are certain >people who are just helpless and who may simply be >incapable of finding and keeping work; and a great many more who have fallen on hard times. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 14:53:03 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: RE: Song choices for altos - any suggestions? njc Wallybear wrote: >can you speak german? or at least do the phonetics? the perfect song for your range is mahler's ich bin der welt abhanden gekommen< Or Catherine, how about using a sexy accent a la Marlene Dietrich, and sing "Fallink in love Again" or "Boys in the Backroom" :~) and tell them I'm having the same, Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 15:10:08 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC Hi Anne, Sounds like you have lots of experience in this so I have some questions for you. I react differently to different types of products that contain flour and I can't figure out if it's the wheat, the yeast (I've come to HATE the smell of the bread aisle at the grocery store), or the gluten, which is what makes flour gummy, yes? Or, maybe they are all present all the time. No, I don't think matzo or wasa breads have yeast, and having one English muffin feels ok, but one sandwich with bread and I wish I hadn't. So, what's the difference? You can see how easily I get confused. One question is, does following a gluten free diet mean staying away from every bit of wheat, in whatever form it's been turned into? That does sound difficult. It's put into everything. Do you ever use rice flour? The only ingredient listed on the bag I got recently is "white rice" so I used it to make a gravy. It turned out to be a bland gravy but there are probably ways around that. And, of course, there's still the "loaded with carbs" issue to keep in mind. And another question is what caused you to go to a gluten-free diet? Or, in other words, what were your symptoms that were relieved by your change in diet? (Personal question I know, a private reply is fine if you'd like.) I ask only because I'm trying to sort out what exactly causes me to feel so out of sorts physically sometimes... yeast, wheat, dairy products, eggs? And I've read recently that people can have an intolerance even for chicken, so there's another possibility. How did you find out that gluten wasn't good for you? Doctors and even a nutritionist I met with recently don't want to investigate any possible food intolerances. I wonder if an allergist would be more helpful. Thanks, Anne, for whatever advice you can offer. Sending you best wishes, Debra Shea anne@sandstrom.com wrote: > > I'm not sure who started this thread, but I've been > following a gluten free diet for about 14 years. And I > eat very well, thank you very much! (a little too well, > based on the scale this morning LOL!) As far as cooking > GF, you can't go wrong with the basics - fruits and > veggies, grilled chicken, beef or fish (no breading of > course!) and rice (not pilaf) or potatoes. Paz's famous > shrimp recipe is GF and is to die for! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 20:28:44 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC dsk wrote: >Hi Anne, > > >One question is, does following a gluten free diet mean staying away >from every bit of wheat, in whatever form it's been turned into? That >does sound difficult. It's put into everything. > > > I thinkpeople differ int heir allergy to gluten. If I eat bread for eg, i get the runs and bloated as well as headacge etc However, there is a little flour in some of the foods I eat and I don't get symtpoms. bw colin(not anne!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 13:29:34 -0700 From: Les Irvin Subject: JoniFest 2003 Hey there once and future Festivarians... As you know, JoniFest 2003 is coming up in August. As anyone who's attended in the past will tell you, this is the highlight of any Joniphile's year, except, I guess, if you've actually got to meet Joni during that particular year :-). Every year the number of attendees grows and the available sleeping space shrinks (who sleeps anyway though?). Plan ahead - like *now* - if you want to reserve yourself a spot. Our gracious host, Ashara, puts her neck and her pocketbook on the line each year by booking the resort ahead of time. She can be made to feel not-quite-so-alone by you getting your deposit in today! It's easier than ever to do, simply go here: http://www.jonifest.com and locate the PayPal link. One simple click does it, you need not even login to the JoniFest page to make a payment. If you owe a deposit... if you are going but haven't yet signed up... if you are thinking of going... head on over to the link and check it out. Thanks, Les NP: Pierre Bensusan "The Return From Fingal" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 20:32:23 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?) -SJCNJC Suzanne MarcAurele wrote: > >So to whomever it was ( i have forgotten the slight already) who said I have >mental problems I can only reply - from the looks of things there are >millions of them! > you are so right there, Suzanne. There a re plenty of people around with 'mental problems'. And it shouldn't be a sahme. > >Enjoy me sweets! >S. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 20:33:57 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC Lucy Hone wrote: > > >>>COLIN WROTE TO ME.... >>> >>> >>It'll be off to the Tower with you my girl! >> >>Ah but Colin you WOULD come and see me in the tower, wouldn't you??? and >> >> >all the others too I think... > > of course I would. Have you seen those gaurds? The tights and jackets? mmmmm..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 20:35:41 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > LOL, Lucy I love the accent - perfect! But tell me, have you actually > MET the royal family???? (or seen them?) > > never saw Princess Di. I did lots of times. But let the dead rest in peace. and besides, I value my privacy...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:40:54 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: NJC "The Church" >>which is going to increase whent hisw ar gets going.....<< freudian slip colin? (his war) ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:41:07 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: NJC Song choices for altos - any suggestions? njc i wonder how stevie wonders' songs might fit your voice...i watched american idol last night & my 2 top choices sang a stevie w song... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:41:04 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC i have seen 2 people in my family members drop a good amount weight & reduce their (bad) cholesterol by doing that high protein, no carb diet... they could eat fats (like bacon) but not sweets of any sort (including fruits & juices)...once they did the strict diet & got to where they wanted, they were able to let up & eat carbs & juice, etc. in moderation... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:41:06 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: NJC For Fred >>I would rather take the chance on giving something to the real cheaters who don't deserve it than cut off someone who is deserving - and I think we're getting better at finding the frauds anyway<< me too catherine...now if they could only do the same for white color fraud which cheats in far bigger amounts than the poor but it is SO much easier to go after the poor as they can't afford lawyers, etc...btw, the majority of the people who are on welfare are CHILDREN... ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 14:41:03 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: On Sows and Souses(SP?) NJC Nice post Colin. Sarah At 8:32 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: >Suzanne MarcAurele wrote: > >> >>So to whomever it was ( i have forgotten the slight already) who said I have >>mental problems I can only reply - from the looks of things there are >>millions of them! >> >you are so right there, Suzanne. There a re plenty of people around >with 'mental problems'. And it shouldn't be a sahme. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 14:42:35 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC Colin, that's too much of a tease! You met her lots of times? You have to tell!! Sarah At 8:35 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: >>never saw Princess Di. > >I did lots of times. But let the dead rest in peace. and besides, I >value my privacy...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 15:44:51 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC colin wrote: > > I thinkpeople differ int heir allergy to gluten. If I eat bread for eg, > i get the runs and bloated as well as headacge etc > However, there is a little flour in some of the foods I eat and I don't > get symtpoms. > bw > colin(not anne!) The message is in colinese, so obviously (not anne!). So I have a question then for you, is gluten something that is in all wheat, as in, one of the characteristics of wheat? Yeast can be added, yes? But maybe gluten is just wheatness. ? Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 20:53:33 -0000 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Lucy Hone" ; Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 8:16 PM Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC > LOL, Lucy I love the accent - perfect! But tell me, have you > actually MET the royal family???? (or seen them?) > > I have three encounters: HUGE EDIT... > That's it for me. Have never seen the Queen and never saw Princess > Di. I did go to Kensington Palace on the day she died, which was an > incredible experience. > Sarah > Me and the royal family.... Met Prince Philip at Cowes Week at the Royal Yacht Squadron (its a sailing club).... Very embarassing as I was desparate for the loo and had gone through some roped off bit to find a one... Got stopped from going any further by two policemen (plain clothes) who held me back me until Phil had emerged from the loo. Phil stopped to ask what was happening and so I explained and he said to the police men "oh she can use that one, I have finished with it."... so I did (the seat was warm!!!! EEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWW but no smells!!!) that was in 1970.. I was 13. Princess Di I met at a party just a few weeks before she was known as being anything to do with Charles. Her Brother had been in the same college at Cambridge with the cousin of a friend and we had gone to a party in Cambridge. She was there, as was her brother and she was such a quiet little thing but a total man magnet.I have to say I only recognised her after she got engaged) the party was some time in 1980 maybe early 81 it was a bit hazy then but there were some wonderfully gorgeous men I remember that I was really shocked that she died. 36 and snuffed out... just like that...... have uneasy feelings about all of that whole business but we do have to let it go as it will change nothing. You may have gathered I am not a royalist but I did have some hope for the future of Wills being king with her as his mother..... OK, time for me to shut up for now... Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 16:13:13 -0500 From: BRIANASYMES@aol.com Subject: Jackson Browne on Austin City Limits NJC You know that song "I don't get around much any more" I do have a wood stove to feed a large garden and a 4 year old Amelia that keeps me home. But I catch ACL most every Friday night at 11:00 recently JB played very layed back his latest and greatest hits and then I saw Darryl Hannah photographed in an Issue of "Out" magazine it's funny how couple of pepols keep poppin into my ons life . The latest performer on ACL was Pat Metheny it struck me thst he was one of the artists that started grunge fashion. Pat wore something that he bought at Sears 5 years ago. I finally just closed my eyes and turned up the sound . Meanwhile on Jonatha's web site a little flaming is going on, about a venue in New York charging $35 for tickets. Her Husband / manager put his E-finger into the list to add his two dollars. NP: Keeping in the customer satisfied / Bridge over troubled waters, Simon $ Garfinkel O my goodness its actually sunny her in Oregon! Brian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2000 03:34:00 +0200 From: "ron" Subject: some definitive articles (NJC) hi in view of the topics of discussion lately some relevant research & findings !!!! don t go there if you get offended !!!! sex & gender: http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/archivesex.html includes catholic condoms, lesbians straight cats, paedophiles & closet straights politics & war http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/feature101.html#terror includes the lowdown on bush's brain double (btw - max the gorilla became an instant celebrity here after after blikseming (not a typing mistake - lets see who can figure that one out) a criminal who tried to hide out in his cage) the complete lyrics to celine dions latest song (as well as the next one, and the last one, and the one before that.....) http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/feature1.html religion http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/archivegod.html baptists attract tornadoes, & politics http://www.comedyclub.co.za/feature/archivepol.html ron np - luscious jackson - space diva ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 16:26:40 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: condeming NJC colin wrote: > > evry person alive has a belief system. It iis how we itnerect with life. > Those beliefs are not alwsy 'good' and I and everyone else do comdemn them. > > The belief that people of a different race to one's own are infferior. > The belief that poeple of a different gender are inferior. > The belief that poeple of a different sexuality are inferior. > The belief that it is okay to have sex with children. > The belief that is okay to hit children. > The belief that people are born wicked and must be saved. > The belief that God made woman inferior to man . > The belif that it is okay to indoctinate children into a particular > religious belief. > The belief thatis okay to mutilate children in the name or held > belifs(circumscision of male and female children) > The belief that those who think differently from us are evil. > > I condemn ALL of those beliefs. I don't comdemn the people that hold > them as I believe all people can change. Colin, There are many things being said here and it's hard to sort it all out. First of all, the word, "condemn"... as David pointed out, maybe what you (and others) mean by that is "strong disagreement". I usually take it as a harsh judgment meaning, "complete dismissal", as in there's nothing of worth to it, it is wrong in every way. I can't tell exactly what you mean when you use that word. Secondly, I can't tell if you're talking about individuals or a huge group of people. In any huge group there will be differences of opinion, so I'm against assuming that everyone in any group is exactly the same. And, thirdly, as with everything anyone writes, there is a lot of your own personal experience in this list, and it's not clear what you consider to be "objective" and what is part of your own emotional history. I can make some guesses, but I'd rather not. That doesn't mean I expect or seek any kind of explanation about your specifics, just that it's important to keep the personal aspect in mind whenever anyone makes such broad statements as you've made. And your claim that "everyone else" sees things as you do is questionable also. I see from a later message you've already addressed that. So, at first glance I agreed with your list. After thinking about it, I wondered about these things. Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 21:29:34 -0000 From: "Eryl B Davies" Subject: Re: Vinyl vs CD JMDL Digest V2003 #91 From Randy Remote's post >When it was remastered for HDCD, they eliminated those tracks. If they just remastered they couldn't eliminate tracks. It would be like trying to take eggs out of cake. What they probably did was to use a computer and a noise removal program like Sonic Solutions "No Noize", "CEDAR" or Sonic foundry's "Sound Forge" to mathematically remove the noise. When used carefully these programmes can perform wonders on old masters. Indeed many classical labels even use them on modern masters to remove microphone and desk noise arising from distant miking and highly dynamic source material. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 21:49:58 -0000 From: "Eryl B Davies" Subject: Re: Sheepish looks JMDL Digest V2003 #92 Fred's joke reminds me of the posh woman who went into a Welsh butcher's shop to buy a sheep's head. "I hope that's an English sheep's head" she said Turning to his assistant, the butcher says to him "Go round the back and take the brains out of that will you?" Eryl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 22:51:36 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re Jackson Browne NJC >>I have heard that he (Jackson Browne ) is particularly fond of Barcelona, so he will probably be in good form. I have seen him in concert several times in the past three years and if you like his music, which I do, it is a great show. Jane<< He actually has a house here in the Gracia barrio. He's playing in a hall more suited to a rock band but I'm not sure of the line up. I'll try to make it. Thanks to all for the advice. Mike in barcelona ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 16:06:18 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: Sheepish looks NJC LOL LOL Good one. ;-) Sarah At 9:49 PM +0000 02/05/2003, Eryl B Davies wrote: >Fred's joke reminds me of the posh woman who went into a Welsh butcher's shop >to buy a sheep's head. >"I hope that's an English sheep's head" she said >Turning to his assistant, the butcher says to him "Go round the back and take >the brains out of that will you?" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:18:15 +0000 From: colin Subject: NDE NJC I ahve just finished watching a doc on BBC2 about NDE's. There were two cases where it has been proved that the people were DEAD, no brain function, when they had their experience. One was a woman who had a major anurism in her brain stem and was given up for dead. However, she went to a nuerosurgeon in phoenix who thought he could help her and stop the bleed. During the surgery, she was not just deadin the sense her haert was stopped, but alsos all brain function. She later reproted the going into the light etc but, and this is the importnat bit, she reported what happened in the op room! There is NO WAY she could have seen or heard anything because she was dead, brain and all yet she did. She heard the thing the man used to open her head. She said it was alike a toothbrush. She could not have known that. She also heard one of the drs saying they could not get into the vein in her leg-too small. Now she did not know they would open her leg veins also and certainly couldn;t have heard this anyway. Another case involved a young woman who was blind. Really blind, her eyes did not function. She was dead form a car accident. She came bnack. She was able to describe things she SAW' yet she had never seen before and cetainly could not see at the time, not juts because her eys ewere useless but because her brain was not functioning. Of course we had Dr Susan Blackmore on, she is always dragged out for these programs, to tell us that it is crap, that theses experiences are merely the brains last ditch attpmt to comofrot us, and that all we are doing is forming ideas and not turth.unlike her theory of course, that isn't an idea, is it now? These two cases are proof beyond doubt that these experirnces happened whilst their was no brain function at all so the rbain was not creating anything, nothing, no last ditch attepmt at anyhting, it was completely stopped. There are two drs here and one in holland that are studying this right now, using cardiac arrest survivors. They felel that the'last ditch attempt to comfort' idea is not correct. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 23:34:35 +0100 From: "mike pritchard" Subject: Re: NJC "The Church" >>Here you can come from any place in the World or beyond, never pay a penny into the system, and like the terrorist recently caught, who were planning to poison as many as they could, you will be housed and given enough money to buy clothes and spend your days down the pub. But if you are like me, and after 36 years of paying in you should lose your job, if your kids are grown up you get #54 a week, and if you want to pay your mortgage, you're told you will have to go out and rob a store or mug a granny, but the illegal immigrants have already done that, they must think we are the dumbest people on Earth << Tell me Fred, where exactly are the 'spongers' / 'freeloaders' from, the ones from 'beyond the world', I mean? It's a long time since I was unfortunate to read a quote so distasteful as the above. It expresses the kind of racist mentality I detested in the UK and which led me to leave it. It also coincides with what I mentioned yesterday about the film 'Liam' and the situation in which fascism can arise, in the case of 'Liam' against Jewish and Irish people, and in your rant, against illegal immigrants who, as everyone knows, are all, every man jack of them, planning to poison all the good people who have worked all their lives and never harmed anyone. I'm sorry you feel bad about the hand fate has dealt you, but taking it out on 'these people' is not the answer. Sarah added: >>Hi Fred, your post reminds me of this post I was sent yesterday. Not sure I agree with the politics of it entirely (it was sent by a farmer friend of mine who has very particular views), but it made me laugh anyway.<< A racist analogy/fable (The Ant and the Grasshopper) is maybe just a fable or analogy but the racism is there all the same. What could Fred have added to his comments to make you sure if you agree with the politics of it entirely? Or maybe you're too delicate to say outright that you don't agree with him. Or maybe you were referring to the Farmer's post; your sentence is ambiguous here. Either way, unlike Sarah, I fail to see anything funny about racist crap, whether thinly disguised or blatantly obvious. mike in barcelona Before I am accused of having no sense of humour, let me say that I do, but what was written above is simply not funny, it is offensive. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:36:05 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: condeming NJC dsk wrote: >colin wrote: > > >>evry person alive has a belief system. It iis how we itnerect with life. >>Those beliefs are not alwsy 'good' and I and everyone else do comdemn them. >> >>The belief that people of a different race to one's own are infferior. >>The belief that poeple of a different gender are inferior. >>The belief that poeple of a different sexuality are inferior. >>The belief that it is okay to have sex with children. >>The belief that is okay to hit children. >>The belief that people are born wicked and must be saved. >>The belief that God made woman inferior to man . >>The belif that it is okay to indoctinate children into a particular >>religious belief. >>The belief thatis okay to mutilate children in the name or held >>belifs(circumscision of male and female children) >>The belief that those who think differently from us are evil. >> >>I condemn ALL of those beliefs. I don't comdemn the people that hold >>them as I believe all people can change. >> >> > >Colin, > >There are many things being said here and it's hard to sort it all out. > >First of all, the word, "condemn"... as David pointed out, maybe what >you (and others) mean by that is "strong disagreement". > i was thinking about this earlier and anticiapted it might be asked. To me codemn means something is bad or worng. Or rather if I codmen an idea, it is because I think it is wrong and harmful. In other words I make a judgement about ideas. Either my own or those of others. > I usually take >it as a harsh judgment meaning, "complete dismissal", as in there's >nothing of worth to it, it is wrong in every way. > That is what I mean too. > I can't tell exactly >what you mean when you use that word. > >Secondly, I can't tell if you're talking about individuals or a huge >group of people. In any huge group there will be differences of opinion, >so I'm against assuming that everyone in any group is exactly the same. > We all make judgements abotu people's ideas and if we think those ideas are wrong, we have condemned them. Tho I am talking about ideas that HARM. I am not talking about people's ideas of what is good art or a good good book etc. I can disagree with them but not condemn them. > >And, thirdly, as with everything anyone writes, there is a lot of your >own personal experience in this list, and it's not clear what you >consider to be "objective" > nothing. It is not possible for people to be objective. > and what is part of your own emotional >history. > evrything we ALL are is based upon our persoanl history. That is how people function. We each create emaning form our experience. We don't all create the same emanings, we are all different, our contsrtucts are different, our experinces are different. > I can make some guesses, but I'd rather not. That doesn't mean >I expect or seek any kind of explanation about your specifics, just that >it's important to keep the personal aspect in mind whenever anyone makes >such broad statements as you've made. > this is bordering on being offenisve to me. although I am now not sure what exactly you are writing about. Is it the list of beliefs or the fact I said that we ALL condemn? The first is a list of beliefs I believe to to be harmful, and I condem those beliefs. The second is something all humans do. I have seen you do it lots of times, I ahve done it lots of times, I have seen others do it lots of times. Really, it doesn;'t matter if you agree with my list or not, it wouldn''t change anything. I would never condmen YOU, but I would condemn an idea you held if I felt it to be harmful. > > >Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:42:11 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC oh I simply couldn't....wouldn't want to be in the News Of The World. Why do oyu think I now live quietly in the country? sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > Colin, that's too much of a tease! You met her lots of times? You > have to tell!! > > Sarah > > At 8:35 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: > >>> never saw Princess Di. >> >> >> I did lots of times. But let the dead rest in peace. and besides, I >> value my privacy...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:42:53 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: NJC Gluten free cooking NJC dsk wrote: > >So I have a question then for you, is gluten something that is in all >wheat, > yes > as in, one of the characteristics of wheat? > yes > Yeast can be added, >yes? > yes > But maybe gluten is just wheatness. ? > yes > >Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 16:50:24 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC LOL Colin, you're not hinting that you're looking for someone to give you ten million for those letters now, are you? Remember, she trusted you. . . Sarah At 10:42 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: >oh I simply couldn't....wouldn't want to be in the News Of The >World. Why do oyu think I now live quietly in the country? > >sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > >>Colin, that's too much of a tease! You met her lots of times? You >>have to tell!! >> >>Sarah >> >>At 8:35 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: >> >>>>never saw Princess Di. >>> >>> >>>I did lots of times. But let the dead rest in peace. and besides, >>>I value my privacy...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:52:15 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC it is importnat to undersatand that LOW crab does not mean NO crab!!!!! Event he strictest, ie. Atkins, and then only druing the first two weeks, hovrs around 20gams of crabs a day. Maintenence would be 50-60grams a day but it will differ form person to person. Yes the cholesterol thing you mention happens to lots of lo carbers-it goes down or at least the HDL does, which is the bad one. Kate Bennett wrote: >i have seen 2 people in my family members drop a good amount weight & reduce >their (bad) cholesterol by doing that high protein, no carb diet... they >could eat fats (like bacon) but not sweets of any sort (including fruits & >juices)...once they did the strict diet & got to where they wanted, they >were able to let up & eat carbs & juice, etc. in moderation... > >******************************************** >Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com >Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs >Over the Moon- >"bringing the melancholy world of twilight >to life almost like magic" All Music Guide >******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 22:54:04 -0000 From: "Lucy Hone" Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC COLIN.........YOU are a very naughty boy, YOU KNOW IT, AND YOU JUST LOVE THE ATTENTION..Oh I shall pinch your bottom and I won't give it back!!! I think you were possibly in royal service..... and that is my feeling.. A mate of mine was in the RPS (Royal protection Squad) and I have loads of cards from Sandringham, and Balmoral when he was doing close personal protection stuff.. so he met them lost of times too and has his own tales to tell!!! he went on Royal Tours and all sorts of things like that but Never spoke of it really (NOT MUCH :~0) Whatever your association with them you keep it to your self then! Sarah and I will just NOT ASK YOU ABOUT IT WILL WE SARAH>>>>> Lucy - ----- Original Message ----- From: "colin" To: Cc: "colin" ; "Lucy Hone" ; Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 10:42 PM Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC > oh I simply couldn't....wouldn't want to be in the News Of The World. > Why do oyu think I now live quietly in the country? > > sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > > > Colin, that's too much of a tease! You met her lots of times? You > > have to tell!! > > > > Sarah > > > > At 8:35 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: > > > >>> never saw Princess Di. > >> > >> > >> I did lots of times. But let the dead rest in peace. and besides, I > >> value my privacy...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 14:56:22 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: Re Jackson Browne NJC i'd heard he (recently?) bought a place in spain....maybe you also will run into him in the local health food store! better NOT mention joni! lol... as i understand it, he will be touring with his band to suppport his recently released cd....one of my favorite concerts ever was a jackson browne concert where he played many new songs live that i had never heard before...he always has a kickass band! mike >>He actually has a house here in the Gracia barrio. He's playing in a hall more suited to a rock band but I'm not sure of the line up. I'll try to make it. Thanks to all for the advice.<< ******************************************** Kate Bennett: www.katebennett.com Sponsored by Polysonics/Atlantis Sound Labs Over the Moon- "bringing the melancholy world of twilight to life almost like magic" All Music Guide ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:55:38 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Sheepish looks NJC man in a pub in the Aussie outback(or wales),he is a stranger in town. Suddenly all hellbreaks lose and then mena in the pub all run out,jostling eachother. The man grabs one of the men and asks what was the matter. oh the sheep have been rounded up. so why the rush? he asks. 'you don't want an ugly one do you?' ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:56:27 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > LOL Colin, you're not hinting that you're looking for someone to > give you ten million for those letters now, are you? Remember, she > trusted you. . . > > Sarah > > > > what letters? It was the pho...oh shit nevr mind..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:57:42 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC Lucy Hone wrote: > >I think you were possibly in royal service..... > you certainly could put it that wya...... > >Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 16:51:18 -0600 From: "Cynthia Vickery" Subject: Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC <> i haven't hovered around 20 gams of crabs since i went to that yummy seafood buffet at the casino in new orleans. yummy!! crab legs! ;o) cindy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 16:57:42 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: NJC "The Church" Mike, as I said, I don't think the grasshopper/ant story was referring to race - had I thought that, I wouldn't have sent it out (and wouldn't have been sent it in the first place). I think the ant story is about people who see themselves as having worked all their lives to support a welfare state that they feel doesn't support them when they need it (e.g. govt taking their houses to pay for their places in old people's home etc). These were the politics that I was saying I wasn't sure I agreed with. Sarah At 11:34 PM +0100 02/05/2003, mike pritchard wrote: >What could Fred have added to his comments to make you sure if you >agree with the politics of it entirely? Or maybe you're too delicate >to say outright that you don't agree with him. Or maybe you were >referring to the Farmer's post; your sentence is ambiguous here. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 17:02:46 -0700 From: sl.m@shaw.ca Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC That poor woman was badly let down by everyone, wasn't she? Yes all right Lucy, I won't ask again. . . ;-) But Colin, is that photo on your computer by any chance? Sarah At 10:56 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: >what letters? It was the pho...oh shit nevr mind..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 23:14:51 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Queen of England NJC sl.m@shaw.ca wrote: > That poor woman was badly let down by everyone, wasn't she? Yes all > right Lucy, I won't ask again. . . ;-) > > But Colin, is that photo on your computer by any chance? now thta would be really silly wouldn't it? seriously, I have never met her. John has several times, and he has met the rest of them too. I know it is daft, i never met her, but is till find it hard to think of her as dead. btw, don't you think Harry is very unlike any of the royals:? > > > Sarah > > At 10:56 PM +0000 02/05/2003, colin wrote: > >> what letters? It was the pho...oh shit nevr mind..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 23:17:12 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC you know, I cnanot handwrite either. At school they gave up trying to teach me. I just think far too quickly for my hands. I can all finger type, and accurately, but i can't type afst enough to keep up with myself so i always ened up going back to two fi gers. In nevr handwrite because not even i can read it. Cynthia Vickery wrote: ><> > >i haven't hovered around 20 gams of crabs since i went to that >yummy seafood buffet at the casino in new orleans. >yummy!! crab legs! >;o) > > >cindy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 19:11:48 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: RE: NJC some of the foods I actually like & a few more I don't NJC On an English muffin, I put a cholesterol-lowering butter substitute called "Benecol", Grey Poupon mustard, freshly ground black pepper, & oregano. Seriously. Lama Sara recommends: >>> I make a salad dressing for steamed veggies, probably not to everyone's taste, but it's a very small amount of extra virgin olive oil, a lot of balsamic vinegar, quite a lot of sweetener (I use Sugar Twin as it has no aspartame) and mustard. That takes the edge of the veggies. ;-)>>> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 19:24:03 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Re: NJC LP's v CD Freddy said, >>>"I knew someone who worked for Nimbus records He pointed out, if the *room it's in* is not right it doesn't matter how much you spend on a system.">>> That's my next move: the room. My present room is the best I've ever had. I got out the tape measure to confirm what I already knew and it DID prove out. Sara asked what makes a room sound good. Short version: avoid a cube. Worst: 8' ceiling with an 8' width and 8' length. Get the speakers out of the corners. Put them on dining room chairs, 3 feet (one metre) out from each wall and see if you like the improvement. You'll hear less "boominess" but you will hear the bassists' fret board and you don't have to strain to understand lyrics. Who knew! If you have stereo, you must sit right down the middle unless you have special (omni-directional) speakers. My own brother has always put one speaker in the dining room and the other in the living room. Sheesh! It ain't stereo. It ain't mono. It's a new thing entirely that I like to call "stupid". That will get you started down the slippery slope. :) Lama ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 19:25:49 -0500 From: BRIANASYMES@aol.com Subject: Joni 45's ? First a joni monent I was bringing my high school daughter home from school when Joni's woodstock from LOTC came on the radio so I sang and whistled thru it and then I said to Isabel you know the Counting Crows just covered this on there latest CD and its played in the movie Two Weeks Notice, then the next song came on of course it was The CC's version and at the end of it Isabel said Dad I like joni's singing it better. I like the laugh at the end. So my question is how many 45's did Joni issue I sort of remember seeing one or two at the high school dance parties usally her songs were played as a interlude for couples to sneak of to dark corners, I do remember very slow dancing to For Free. The 45's are not listed on the jmdl or the JM site. NP Misty Sarah Vaughan / Quincy Jones ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 19:40:16 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Conditional recommendation: a movie called "The Hours", njc Speaking of Meryl Streep, she's wonderful, as always, in "The Hours". So was Julianne Moore. I totally believed them both but the real surprise for me was Nicole Kidman. She's often been tagged "vacuous" but wow, is she believable as a woman with TOO MUCH on her mind! I think what she gave in "The Hours" is a masterful performance completely worthy of Oscar's attention. Sheesh! I'm writing like a critic. "Completely worthy of Oscar's attention." Somebody shut me up. The recommendation is conditional in that I don't recommend it to anyone who a.) has a handgun at home, b.) a full bottle of sleeping pills, b.) has been drinking Jack Daniels, or c.) has a history of depression. To me, as someone with 35 years of depression under my 47 year-old belt, it "reads" like a commercial for suicide. Kids, don't try this at home. Keep a journal. Write to me. Go to a professional, but don't try this at home. These are actors. This is not real. All the best, Lama ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 19:50:35 -0800 From: Gary Zack Subject: Re: Joni 45's ? Hi Brian, I know that I have a few of Joni's 45s but don't know them all off the bat. But I do remember that probably the most sought after single Joni released was "You Turn Me On I'm A Radio" which had the first ever officially recorded studio version of Joni doing "Urge For Going.", which was never released officially on one of her albums. I remember having several copies, as Asylum's vinyl (especially on 45) was not the best - ticks and pops from a brand new 45. I may have 6 or 7 of them now, and they're all "flawed" in the tick/pop sense; was glad to see her release it on the "Hits" CD. A beautiful young recording! I'm pretty sure there was "Help Me"/Free Man In Paris and I believe one was "Raised On Robbery"/People's Parties; and "Good Friends"/Smokin' (Empty Try Another). I'm sure there are more, "Carey/?", "Both Sides Now"/?. etc. Best regards, Gary BRIANASYMES@aol.com wrote: >First a joni monent >I was bringing my high school daughter home from school when Joni's woodstock from LOTC came on the radio so I sang and whistled thru it and then I said to Isabel you know the Counting Crows just covered this on there latest CD and its played in the movie Two Weeks Notice, then the next song came on of course it was The CC's version and at the end of it Isabel said Dad I like joni's singing it better. I like the laugh at the end. >So my question is how many 45's did Joni issue I sort of remember seeing one or two at the high school dance parties usally her songs were played as a interlude for couples to sneak of to dark corners, I do remember very slow dancing to For Free. The 45's are not listed on the jmdl or the JM site. >NP Misty Sarah Vaughan / Quincy Jones ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 19:58:45 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni 45's ? In a message dated 2/5/2003 7:27:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, BRIANASYMES@aol.com writes: > The 45's are not listed on the jmdl or the JM site. > Quite true, Bryan...JM.com is sorely lacking a proper discography, which is a shame. It's not like there could be more Joni 45's coming out any day now! ;~) Besides the 45's, Joni put out a couple of EP's and now has a cd-single or two under her belt. There ARE a couple of websites that take a pretty good stab at getting their arms around Joni's 45's. If you go to www.GEMM.com and search for Joni Mitchell, you'll of course get a long list of stuff (lots of vinyl for you vinyl junkies out there) and it'll pretty much show you most of her singles. For a long time (before the issue of "Hits") it was the ONLY way you could get her recording of "Urge For Going" as it was the B-side to "You Turn Me On I'm A Radio". Now...if the subject is documenting Joni *covers*...we're all over dat! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 20:03:26 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC LP's v CD The old wisdom in the days of 10-song, 5-per-side LPs was that if you have 5 good songs, you seed them 1,2,5,6,10 (George Martin said that, so it must be true, except that of course he usually had more than 5 good songs). That's something that's changed with the advent of CDs, I'd imagine, though to what I do not know. Anyway, I was listening to the Pretenders' first album earlier today, and found myself wondering if there has ever been a more badly sequenced album. There are 12 songs on this wonderful album, among them 5 classics: Stop Your Sobbing, Kid, Private Life, Brass In Pocket and Lovers Of Today. Where do they come on the record? They are the first 5 songs on Side 2!! What were they thinking of?? Azeem in London ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2003 #94 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)