From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #553 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, December 7 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 553 Sign up now for JoniFest 2003! http://www.jonifest.com ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Best movie of 2002 njc [frasere@intergate.ca] re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid ["mia ortlieb" ] Hits, Misses, Omissions [Little Bird ] Travelogue - Wow! [vince ] Re: THAT C&S SONG ["Adam Mulvey" ] Re: Best movie of 2002 njc ["Adam Mulvey" ] Re: THAT C&S SONG [Little Bird ] best movie of 2002 njc [Yael Harlap ] Re: Hits, Misses, Omissions [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking [Little Bird ] More thoughts on Joni in the park ["michael o'malley" ] Travelogue [Doug ] joni on the hit parade ["flopit" ] best movie of the year NJC ["William C. Burnworth/Tim Callaghan" ] no dedication to kilauren? [Nuriel Tobias ] Re: joni on the hit parade NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Bruce and Michael's remarks about the statue [Aerchak@aol.com] 15th century murder ballads njc [vince ] Re: travelogue bad reviews...? [Randy Remote ] Re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid [Randy Remote ] Re: Best movie of 2002 njc [Catherine McKay ] re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid now food njc [Catherine McKay ] ALL THE WAY THROUGH [] OF ALL TIME... [] Re: Joni in the park ["kakki" ] court and spark [Chorando6@aol.com] Re: OF ALL TIME... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: OF ALL TIME... [KJHSF@aol.com] RE: OF ALL TIME... ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: court and spark and Friends the film (music by Elton John and lyrics by Bernie Taupin) [Mags N Brei <] Re: court and spark ["chuty001" ] Re: Song of Sunny Saskatoon (njc). [BigWaltinSF@aol.com] Six Degrees Of Seperation (NJC) Was: Joni Compilation! ["Chris Marshall" ] Re: Travelogue Best and worst.... ["chuty001" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 09:20:52 -0800 From: frasere@intergate.ca Subject: Re: Best movie of 2002 njc Quoting kerry : > "I was talking to someone at work who had just seen "Frida" and he said he > thought it was the best movie of 2002. Any nominations for best movie of the year?" Hi Kerry! I loved the colour and lushness of Frida, and thought Hayeck did a splendid job in the lead role. Think my vote goes to Far From Heaven- VERY intense, remarkably well-done on all fronts and a brilliant job by Julianne Moore. Oscar material, definately! Best, Stephen in Vancouver ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 11:36:49 -0600 From: "mia ortlieb" Subject: re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid <> Actually, yes- but over time. 1. PIZZA - did not like until I turned 18 2. TACOS - did not like until my late 20's 3. ONIONS - did not like until my 30's 4. GREEN PEPPERS - just started liking them a year ago Now, If only I could start to like peanut butter, and become sick of chocolate :-) When "Taming the Tiger" first came out, I wasn't all that excited about it. I did not think it was very melodic. I kept revisiting it and now I absolutely cannot get enough! I think it is extremely melodic and I'm humming the tunes in the shower all the time! Come to think of it, my 2 fav Joni albums, FTR and DJRD took awhile before they became my favorites. Mia _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 17:46:48 -0000 From: "Adam Mulvey" Subject: Re: THAT C&S SONG njc > mtotzke@gosympatico.ca wrote:Here I go again, writing about HELP ME. (I had > used the "H" word as the "subject" and so those > posts got bounced.) Ah! So if you put 'help' in the subject line, the list thinks you want help, and doesn't process your email? I see! No wonder my post mysteriously disappeared. Blimey, this modern technology... Adam ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 09:52:48 -0800 (PST) From: Little Bird Subject: Hits, Misses, Omissions While I liked Hits & Misses, I always felt it was woefully incomplete, ignoring huge pockets of her work. So, after reading an online review of the pair of albums that backed up my sentiment, I decided to come up with a THIRD compilation CD called "Omissions" and burned it on a CDR, even made a snazzy cover for it in the style of the other two. So, we have Hits, Misses and Omissions. See what you think of my track listing... 1. Dreamland 2. Don't Interrupt the Sorrow 3. I Don't Know Where I Stand 4. Rainy Night House 5. Down to You 6. Cold Blue Steel And Sweet Fire 7. Night in the City 8. All I Want 9. The Hissing Of Summer Lawns 10. Blue Motel Room 11. Don Juan's Reckless Daughter 12. Lakota 13. The Only Joy In Town 14. The Sire Of Sorrow (Job's Sad Song) 15. Shadows And Light Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:54:46 -0500 From: vince Subject: Travelogue - Wow! A new opinion on Travelogue: last night I had a really fine date. The first album I played was T'log disk 2. The second album: Clark Carlton's album. The third album: Neil Young 's Harvest Moon. In between we saw 8 Mile (that is the Eminem content that you expect.) It all worked. It all worked very well. It all worked for good. So I must love T'log since it played a part in an evening such as I haven't had in a long, long, long time. So that is my foursome for success -- packing for Chicago - I may post a little bit more before I leave tomorrow but then I will be on a few days hiatus. Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:00:38 -0000 From: "Adam Mulvey" Subject: Re: THAT C&S SONG > >>I believe Help Me got all the way to #2 on the Canadian charts.<< As far as I can tell, the highest it got was number 17: http://www.webfitz.com/lyrics/Charts/1974/Ch197405.html What do you mean, get a life? ;-) Adam ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:09:32 -0000 From: "Adam Mulvey" Subject: Re: Best movie of 2002 njc > Any nominations for best movie of the year? > > Kerry No marks for credibilty, but I'm afraid my vote goes to Spiderman. Very silly, hugely enjoyable, and Kirsten Dunst. My case resteth. Adam ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 10:13:45 -0800 (PST) From: Little Bird Subject: Re: THAT C&S SONG Help Me: As far as I can tell, the highest it got was number 17 Curses! Foiled again! I got the #2 stat from some star-bio on Joni in a local newspaper a few years ago. I may have misread it, or it might have been that Court & Spark was at one time the # 2 album in Canada - I don't know. It was by far her most commercially successful record, though - in Canada or anywhere. - -Andrew Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:50:57 -0500 From: Yael Harlap Subject: best movie of 2002 njc kerry wrote: >I was talking to someone at work who had just seen "Frida" and he said he >thought it was the best movie of 2002. While I enjoyed it, I disagreed, but >then I couldn't think of any that were better. (Of course, I can't even >remember which videos I rented last week!) > >Any nominations for best movie of the year? yes yes yes!! two nominations from me: - -far from heaven (this is the best movie i've seen in quite a long time) - -spirited away (also amazing - if you can see it in the original japanese with english subtitles - ie: on DVD - i recommend it!) >NP - Crowded House - Fall at Your Feet ooooh, love love this band and this song. neil finn is a genius - i saw him perform in Los angeles in november and i want more. recent NPs for me: - -lynn miles - -george harrison (have i already said this lately?) - -yael ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 13:24:48 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Hits, Misses, Omissions In a message dated 12/07/2002 12:53:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, littlebird3333@yahoo.com writes: > See what you think of my track listing... > > It's certainly a fine list...always tough for me to think objectively about lists like that though, because Joni's got so many great songs it would fill up about 20 cd's - matter of fact they do! :~) How about "I Think I Understand"? That's one of my favorites, an absolutely beautiful song with a strong lyric, and seems to "omitted" most of the time. "Today I am not prey to dark uncertainty..." wow, one of the most faith-inducing lines out there. Much like "The Dawntreader" is rendered so nicely on T'log, I would have liked to see more of these older songs be more fleshed out as well. Fiddle & The Drum is of course brilliant as acapella and perhaps most effective in that style, but it would also work with some orchestration. I listened to Clouds yesterday, and it always strikes me how good those songs are (Roses Blue & Songs to Aging Children being the exceptions for me, I think) but some are in such a stark "frame" they could be better appreciated in a more ornate fashion. Christine Sullivan's cover of "I Think I Understand" proves me right I would say. Bob, still without power at In-law's house... NP: Blue Mountain, "Wicked Ways" 11.24.00 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 10:26:18 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking **** > > I always thought Joni was the lady with the hole in > her stocking (Didn't it feeeeeeeeel good? Didn't it > feel GOOD!") Also identified with that as I almost > always have a hole in my stocking. > I've always thought so too, Catherine. Especially coupled with the line from 'The Boho Dance' 'A camera pans the cocktail hour/behind a blind of potted palms/And finds a lady in a Paris dress/with runs in her nylons'. I've always felt that one was Joni too. Her free spirited nature doesn't get too hung up about things like holes or runs in her stockings, even though she does like to dress up in designer gowns. Just one of the many dualities of Our Lady. I've always heard 'I've seen some hard, hot blazes come down to smoke & ash' and yes, it is a great line from a wonderful song. I've always felt that the line 'we love our lovin'/but not like we love our freedom' was the perfect summation of the confusion wrought by the sexual revolution of the 60s & 70s. Alas, as Joni has said in more recent years, there is no such thing as 'free love'. C&S was my first Joni and it was life-changing as far as my appreciation of music and lyrics is concerned. I couldn't believe that someone I had never met could verbalize so many of my own thoughts and feelings so articulately and so beautifully. That record is etched on my brain cells, every note & every word. It is as close to a perfect marriage of art and pop culture as you can get. It is fitted together like a piece of intricate machinery and runs like clock work from beginning to end. The in-depth analysis and musical exploration of 'Hejira' and 'Mingus' were yet to come. But C&S has an abundance of rewards for the discriminating listener. It may sound lighter than the later albums but there is plenty of depth there. I'm like Muller on this one. Once I hear those opening piano chords, I'm hooked in for the ride. The way 'People's Parties' segues smoothly into 'The Same Situation', the string quartet on 'Down to You', the weary yet sympathetic analysis of the 'Trouble Child', the raucous playfulness of 'Raised On Robbery' and the more sophisticated playfulness of Annie Ross's 'Twisted' - I love every bit of it! Mark E in Seattle C&S lover ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 13:31:34 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Hammerskins? NJC In a message dated 12/07/2002 9:08:33 AM Eastern Standard Time, anne@sandstrom.com writes: > The day we tell people what to say > and think is the day we should really be ashamed. I suppose ultimately you're right in a utopian sort of way...I just wish we could draw the line with this hate-mongering. I guess too that I just get sick of all the confederate flag bullsh*t I see here in South Carolina on a daily basis, with the "heritage, not hate" bumperstickers etc. In most cases it's thinly veiled (or blatant) racism and I just tire of the rhetoric, especially when local politics becomes consumed by this discussion and ignores things that matter like education and such. And Murph's point is good too...most of the time when these groups come out they just make themselves look stupid. Bob NPIMH, Bruce Cockburn "If I Had a Rocket Launcher" :~) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 10:41:17 -0800 (PST) From: Little Bird Subject: Just Like This Train Just Like This Train is one of my favourites from C&S. I think it's one of her most joyful songs. She really captures the lazy feeling of shuffling cars in train yards and the mood of happy travel, unlike the restless journeys of Hejira and DJRD. While she does seem to be escaping some kind of pain, she's found happiness in a crowded waiting room of a train station. My favourite verse: "Well, I've got this berth and this roll-down blind/I've got this fold-up sink/And these rocks and these cactuses going by/And a bottle of German wine to drink [then comes that boozy cord that fleshes out the effects of German wine on our wayward blond]/Settle down into the clickety-clack with the clouds and the stars to read/Dreamin' of the pleasure I'm gonna have/Watchin' your hairline recede, my vain darlin'" What an image! What a fantastic gathering of thoughts, feelings, scenery and moods, all brought to life by that serpentine voice and the lazy drawl of the music. Gorgeous song, gorgeous album...(The Travelogue version of Just Like This Train does nothing for me, unfortunately - the orchestra kills the subtleties.) - -Andrew Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 13:43:42 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking In a message dated 12/07/2002 1:27:33 PM Eastern Standard Time, mark.travis@gte.net writes: > . I'm like Muller on this one. Whoo-Hoo! I love it when we agree! :~) And further to Joni as "album writer", that's a very good point, BUT I have no problem hearing Joni on shuffle mode, with the exceptions being Shadows & Light, Miles of Aisles, and Court & Spark. It just sounds disjointed hearing some of those songs separated from their adjoining twins! I'm also pretty sure that Joni is the dancing lady with the hole in her stocking...gawd she can't stand up without moving, which is a good thing. When I saw her in '98 I thought her "dancing" while she played her guitar was very hypnotizing & sensual. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 10:48:28 -0800 (PST) From: Little Bird Subject: Re: Lady with the hole in her stocking >>>When I saw her in '98 I thought her "dancing" while she played her guitar was very hypnotizing & sensual.>>> So did I. I couldn't believe how sexy it was. She was swiveling her hips in tiny circular motions, tapping her feet, tossing her hair and effortlessly letting her fingers dance across the strings of her VG8. It WAS mezmerizing. Stationary but never still. - -Andrew Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 13:55:59 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Just Like This Train In a message dated 12/07/2002 1:39:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, littlebird3333@yahoo.com writes: > Dreamin' of the pleasure I'm gonna have/Watchin' your hairline recede, my > vain darlin'" > And when she adds the playful mocking laughter after the first part in her concerts, and in some cases changes "darlin'" to "baldy" which is just funny as all getout to me (and may be another poke at Sweet Baby James for all of you keeping score). And I would be remiss in my duties as the "Cover Colonel" if I didn't thank Susan (not the Guzzi one) for alerting me to the first ever (that *I* know of) officially released cover of JLTT! Andrew Hardin does it, in fact his CD takes its title from it...so I'm not gonna mess with telling what the name of the cd is! :~) Haven't heard it yet but I'm excited to. I need to flush that Manilow out. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:58:42 -0000 From: "Paul Headon" Subject: Travelogue Best and worst.... Hi I am really enjoying travelogue my 3 favourites are 1 Dawnteader A really great atmospheric filling out of a simpler early song 2 Cheroke louise Great just Great even better than the exvellent earlier version 3 You dream flat tires swings so well Least Favourite 1 Woodstock a heavy , almost leaden, version of such a song of great 70's optimism. Other peoples views on their best and worst perhaps..... Best wishes, Paul Headon Wales - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.426 / Virus Database: 239 - Release Date: 02/12/2002 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 14:41:55 -0500 From: "michael o'malley" Subject: More thoughts on Joni in the park Came to me in my sleep this morning around 6 am. About the "to be or not to be`` smoking issue. A compromise that could please everyone! Why not just have Joan's right arm draped along the back of the bench with her middle and index fingers close enough to hold a cig, without actually having a bronze one in place?. A bronze cigarette would be very tacky, I say, and people would probably stroke it for good luck! For those die-hards who insist on seeing a cigarette in her hands (and I fully understand, while not sharing that opinion), they could light one up and put a real one in place. It could be our little (perverse) joke...kinda like the way those people in Seattle dress up their bronze pedestrians in winter. And speaking of clothes, I see Joni wearing a shallow-brimmed hat (small enough to expose some of her face, but large enough to keep snow and pidgeon poop off it!) and long sleeves and slacks. Can't imagine a silk chiffon dress in minus 30 weather! I would also nix the idea of showing her playing music or singing or any movement, for that matter, as modern sculptural attempts to arrest motion in time often look amateurish at best (I think we lost that art - - portraying motion, sometime after the Renaissance). IMHO, it would be more dignified to have her just sitting there, lost in her thoughts, pondering one of those bridges over the river, maybe the Broadway Bridge, where she played with Cherokee Louise as a young girl. Michael in Quebec ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 22:35:13 -0800 From: "flopit" Subject: Note to Smurph, and everybody at jmdl (njc worth mentioning) hi walt wrote >>>>>>>>Oh, I was alerted to the release date of Travelogue by a local jmdl lurker who lives near me, and I forced myself up, into the shower, and all the way to Virgin Records to get it -- my longest trip on my own in weeks. I was shaking by the time i got home, but BOY WAS IT WORTH IT!!!!! I wept through the whole thing on the first listen. (Robert sort of shook his head: "Why are you *crying*??") Laughing and crying, it's the same release, or so i hear. Joni lets me cry, at the moment. Most of the time I put up a good, cheerful front. I'm sure the list has been crawling with opinions and reviews, and when I next have the energy, I'll see what everybody else thinks, and add my own 20000 cents then. Okay, a few comments now: I can live without Circle Game hi walt good to hear from you again,,,, i always look out for your posts & ive been missin them lately. i may never have met you, but you put so much of yourself in your posts, i feel like i know you really, really well. prayin' for you ron np lee clayton - a little cocaine ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 14:28:57 -0600 From: "J.David Sapp" Subject: re:Travelogue - Wow! Her delivery of "Leave behind your streets he said and come here to me" makes me weak in the knees. She also changed the lyric "I have brought some dreams to share" to "I have brought my dreams to share". And we all know one of the dreams is of baby. Its nice to see her claim her dream. peace, david (still T'logging and lovin' it) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 15:17:21 -0500 From: Doug Subject: Travelogue I liked it when I first listenad to it and I'm lovin' it more every day. A few thoughts: Songs I could do without: Circle Game - tooo slloooww; Woodstock - not one of her best songs IMO. Song I am glad was included: The Dawntreader - Mr. Mendoza was a bit too busy but I love that song. Song I wish was included: River - my fave. C'mon Joni trash that VG-8 and sit down at the piano again! And now my shocking confession: The last JM album I bought was HOSL back in '75, so, many songs on TLOG are new to me. The "new" songs I like best are: Amelia, Refuge and Hejira. I guess I'll have to get the Hejira CD, an overlooked gem on my part. Doug ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:39:50 -0800 From: "flopit" Subject: joni on the hit parade hi just did a bit of research - joni never made it into the charts here!!! the only covers that did were: (the numbers in yellow are the highest position reached: MATTHEWS SOUTHERN COMFORT (UK) 13 Nov 70 3 12 WOODSTOCK written by Joni MITCHELL (1) (-) Total songs: 1 Total weeks: 12 Steve LONSDALE (SA) 04 Sep 70 17 5 BOTH SIDES NOW (-) (-) Total songs: 1 Total weeks: 5 http://cd.co.za/legends/60s/staccatos_index.htm (sorry bob - dont think ill be able to track this one down...) anybody wanting to catch up on some south african music go here: www.samp3.com ron np - steve earl - my old friend the blues - live in washington ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 14:59:5 -0600 From: "William C. Burnworth/Tim Callaghan" Subject: best movie of the year NJC 8 Women! love and happy holidaze everyone...William William Burnworth/Tim CallaghanCastalian Springcspringj@earthlink.net ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 16:14:26 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: Bruce and Michael's remarks about the statue Aerchak@aol.com wrote: > > Recently two members, Bruce and Michael, wrote comments individually > regarding the artistic integrity of the statue. Their comments deserve > notice. Figurative memorials can be awful. Art by committee is frightening. > A great artist must do the work and should have creative reign to do so. I > think it's more about finding the artist than designing the statue, folks. > The artist will do that, yes? Maybe so, but artists do not work in a vacuum. And I always think it's fun to toss ideas around, especially among people who've known Joni for so long. And when $50,000 or more is spent commissioning an art work (as opposed to buying an already existing one), there's going to be a lot of discussion about it, not necessarily here, but definitely between the givers and the doers. That itself can be a creative undertaking. Art making always involves a lot of uncertainty and dialogue, whether it's a person working alone and having an internal discussion with the materials, or being involved with donors or a committee and having outward discussions also. I guess not everyone can tolerate that chaos or sustain interest in it. To me it's all part of the creative process. Considering what a long-term, challenging project this is, it's hard for me to understand why anyone would attempt to shut down the brainstorming about it so early on. It's just as well, though. I have my own chaotic projects to get on with, and since I've gotten recent calls from two people wanting to sell my art (whoo-hoo!), it's time to pay attention to that. I look forward to seeing how the Joni statue, or whatever, turns out, and knowing me, I'll probably be throwing in some opinions along the way whether people are interested or not. Now, if I could only listen to T'log long enough to figure out exactly what I feel about it... Debra Shea NPIMH: Joni singing "Unchained Melody" in T'log. Her singing there is truly beautiful. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 16:18:49 EST From: Aerchak@aol.com Subject: Re: Bruce and Michael's remarks about the statue Who in hell is "attempting to shut down the brainstorming about it so early on"? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 16:49:21 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: Bruce and Michael's remarks about the statue Aerchak@aol.com wrote: > > Who in hell is "attempting to shut down the brainstorming about it so early > on"? Good grief, back off! Take a chill pill. First it was your out-of-the-blue anger at discussing smoking in the context of Joni's statue, and then it's "the artist will do that" comment. That, among other posts, definitely sends out an "end of discussion" message. And, yes, I do agree that Bruce's and Michael's comments deserve notice. I happen to disagree with the "all figurative statues are awful" assumption and think it shuts down some possibilities way too early in the process, but probably many people agree completely with them and with you. So what? Is it all really something to start cursing about? I don't think so. Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 13:54:12 -0800 (PST) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Re: Travelogue Best and worst.... I'm afraid theres no worst section in my mind. Theres only good better and the best. i think the job that was done on slouching towards bethlehem and jobs sad song and otis and marlena is outstanding. it seems like larry and joni have improved their production when it comes to producing an orchestra. on bsn it sounded a bit brass and flat. here it's rich and warm and full of surprises. you're right about the dawntreader, though no harp can ever replace joni's guitar. oy, joni's guitar. I blame it all on her painting. if her fingers and hands are realy so weak, how can she paint so much but at the same time claim she can't play the guitar? damn those brushes! but i disagree with you on woodstock. even the first version has this sense of loss and sadness. and don't you just love listening to ludwigs tune now that it sounds realy beethovenish? in general, joni has finaly realised that that smoking-singing-vibrato was realy too much on bsn, and you can hear her here even grasping for air every now and then and shortning words in order to avoid the vibrato.sometimes it even sounds as if she's half singing half talking. i also think that joni has done her best in order to avoid tributing the songs and making them sound fresh, and there is something very fresh about this album, not at all a swan song. i wish i could hear it now but it's late night here so i'll wait till the morning comes. love, nuriel - --- "Paul Headon" wrote: >Hi > >I am really enjoying travelogue my 3 favourites are >1 Dawnteader A really great atmospheric filling out of a simpler early >song >2 Cheroke louise Great just Great even better than the exvellent earlier >version >3 You dream flat tires swings so well > >Least Favourite >1 Woodstock a heavy , almost leaden, version of such a song of great 70's >optimism. > >Other peoples views on their best and worst perhaps..... > > >Best wishes, > >Paul Headon >Wales > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.426 / Virus Database: 239 - Release Date: 02/12/2002 _____________________________________________________________ Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com _____________________________________________________________ Select your own custom email address for FREE! Get you@yourchoice.com w/No Ads, 6MB, POP & more! http://www.everyone.net/selectmail?campaign=tag ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 14:03:03 -0800 (PST) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: no dedication to kilauren? how come? _____________________________________________________________ Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com _____________________________________________________________ Select your own custom email address for FREE! Get you@yourchoice.com w/No Ads, 6MB, POP & more! http://www.everyone.net/selectmail?campaign=tag ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 17:19:45 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: joni on the hit parade NJC In a message dated 12/07/2002 3:49:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, flopit@mweb.co.za writes: > (sorry bob - dont think ill be able to track this one down...) > > That's OK Ron...you've identified it for me...that's 75% of the battle! Thanks for the great support you've given the project. I guess Des & Dawn's Circle Game didn't make any waves there? :~) Bob NP: Beth Orton, "Mount Washington", Chicago 06.04.02 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 17:29:20 EST From: Aerchak@aol.com Subject: Re: Bruce and Michael's remarks about the statue Hell is cursing? Give me a break. Usually I would have said fuck. I'm not angry and was never angry. I'm from Jersey. I'm a Jersey girl. That's how we talk. That's how we act. That's how I express myself. It has nothing to do with anger. I'm going to go smoke cigarettes now. I'm not initiating any personal messages to people's homes. I have responded to people who have written to me, most very nice I might add. But a couple (only 2) of you have written to me directly and have been quite snotty and I have responded in turn. I see no need for that. Maybe this is not for me. Seems not. It's kind of weird. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 17:29:51 -0500 From: vince Subject: 15th century murder ballads njc Bono (of U2) on Eminem: "Brilliant lyricist and writer who is in the tradition of [the French poet] Rimbaud and the 15th Century murder ballads." http://metromix.com/top/1,1419,M-Metromix-Events-bono!ArticleDetail-19468,00.html anyone have a clue what 15th century murder ballads? Rimbaud I know - Leonardo DiCaprio played him charmingly obnoxious and in one nice scene, naked) in the film Total Eclipse but a 15th century murder ballad escapes me -- Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 14:31:45 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: travelogue bad reviews...? Nuriel Tobias wrote: > Did joni get bad reviews on travelogue? what did the bastards had to say this time? Actually, most of the published reviews (I've seen a dozen or more) have been positive or at least supportive. Only 2 or 3 panned it completely. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 14:38:53 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid For me, most of the Joni's albums have either grabbed me or not right away. Everything after WTRF I pretty much never play, although I've tried. Some of DED I like. mia ortlieb wrote: > < thanks...." ? > Would eating more of it make you like it better?>> > > Actually, yes- but over time. > > 1. PIZZA - did not like until I turned 18 > 2. TACOS - did not like until my late 20's > 3. ONIONS - did not like until my 30's > 4. GREEN PEPPERS - just started liking them a year ago > > Now, If only I could start to like peanut butter, and become sick of > chocolate :-) > > When "Taming the Tiger" first came out, I wasn't all that excited about it. > I did not think it was very melodic. I kept revisiting it and now I > absolutely cannot get enough! I think it is extremely melodic and I'm > humming the tunes in the shower all the time! Come to think of it, my 2 fav > Joni albums, FTR and DJRD took awhile before they became my favorites. > > Mia > > _________________________________________________________________ > Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:13:41 -0000 From: "Stephen Toogood" Subject: Joni compilation! Okay so this isn't really a list of omissions, misses or hits(or maybe it's all 3), but just a minidisc I've done of some(you'd need a few minidiscs)of my favourate Joni songs which I feel show all sides of her music. I did this last weekend thinking this could never be relesed because it doesn't have 'Big Yellow Taxi' or 'Help Me' (love those songs btw) on it. Anyway here it is. For The Music... 1. Free Man In Paris 2. Night In The City 3. For Free 4. Smokin' 5. Moon At The Window 6. Harry's House/Centerpiece 7. Jericho (live MOI) 8. Turbulent Indigo 9. The Wolf That Lives In Lindsey 10. I Think I Understand 11. Cherokee Louise 12. The Silky Veils Of Ardor 13. A Bird That Whistles 14. A Case Of you 15. For The Roses 16. No Apologies 17. Amelia 18. Urge For Going 19. God Must Be a Boogie Man (Trav. Vers.) I've done it in this order because I feel that it flows well which I think is important. Like to know what anyone thinks. Trav. is sounding better and better and better and... Steve P.S. For people in the UK who have not seen 'Six Degrees Of Seperation' you have to. It's on BBC2 tonight at 12:15. I always get tearey eyed at the end. Such an exellent film. N.P: 'Sweet Bird' Joni . ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:51:59 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Best movie of 2002 njc --- FMYFL@aol.com wrote: > Kerry asks : > > > Any nominations for best movie of the year? > > > > > > I still haven't gone to the movies since that > horrible experience I had when > I saw "Planet of the Apes" last year. (or POTA for > Catherine) :~) Well, at least we both agree about POTA POTA POTA - it was a POTA Crap! (IMO. Of course. As always. Who am I? God or something?) ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:54:53 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: re: Travelogue - thumbs down I'm afraid now food njc --- mia ortlieb wrote: > < "uh...no > thanks...." ? > Would eating more of it make you like it better?>> > > Actually, yes- but over time. > > 1. PIZZA - did not like until I turned 18 > 2. TACOS - did not like until my late 20's > 3. ONIONS - did not like until my 30's > 4. GREEN PEPPERS - just started liking them a year > ago > > Now, If only I could start to like peanut butter, > and become sick of > chocolate :-) I was one of those cranky kids too. Wouldn't eat anything with tomato sauce on it, which ruled out pizza, spaghetti or anything Italian. Wouldn't eat Chinese food either until my teens. I don't think you need peanut butter, so don't worry about it. We all need chocolate though. ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:56:33 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: THAT C&S SONG njc --- Adam Mulvey wrote: > > mtotzke@gosympatico.ca wrote:Here I go again, > writing about HELP ME. (I > had > > used the "H" word as the "subject" and so those > > posts got bounced.) > > Ah! So if you put 'help' in the subject line, the > list thinks you want help, > and doesn't process your email? I see! No wonder > my post mysteriously > disappeared. Blimey, this modern technology... > I find that really bizarre. If it thinks you want help, what does it do with your message? Where does it go? ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:22:21 -0500 From: Subject: ALL THE WAY THROUGH It's interesting how we listen to Joni, isn't it? There are certain albums I tend always to play all the way through -- B, FTR, C&S, THOSL, H, TI -- because they feel like one solid suberb "dream." I'd say the same for DJRD, but I sometimes skip PAPRIKA -- which I have to be in the right mood for. And MINGUS? I fast-forward to avoid the ending of WOLF (I think it's a wonderfully mysterious song but that cacaphony drives me crazy). NRH? I'm afraid I can't listen to WINDFALL. BSN? DON'T GO TO STRANGERS and SOMETIMES I'm happy don't do it for me -- as songs. Though TTT is deeply flawed (for me), nothing can beat (with the help of fast forward) the run of LOVE PUTS ON, CRAZY CRIES, STAY IN TOUCH, FACE LIFT) -- Joni at her most personal, singing some of her most tender lyrics. AND now T'LOG? I have to admit that I skip the following, if I'm not in the right mood: SLOUCHING, LUDWIG, JOB, TRAIN, SEX KILLS, BORDERLINE. If I am in the right mood, however, I like the sheer drama -- and audacity! -- of the first three. If there's a God in heaven, Joni is writing again. We want more. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:51:16 -0500 From: Subject: OF ALL TIME... What's your favourite Joni Mitchell song/performance of all time? Mine is Coyote. Least favourite? Mine is Tax Free. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 17:00:06 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Joni in the park Michael wrote: This is an EXCELLENT idea!! > I think we should get Anjelica Huston's husband, Robert Graham, to do the > statue. They are both close friends of Joni's, and Graham is one of the great > Mexican/American sculptors working today. This is an EXCELLENT idea and I'd bet he would love to be the one to do the statue since they are friends. I live in downtown L.A. and a number of his works large and small pop up here and there along the street, in fountains and in gardens. His art is incredible. The huge doors of the cathedral are awesome, plus several of his works are inside, including angel sconces with various bird wings. He does both realistic and abstract sculpture. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 20:10:11 EST From: Chorando6@aol.com Subject: court and spark hi all, I wanted to ask anyone if they know Elton johns sountrack to a film called 'Friends' and if they do...do they notice any similarities between it and Court and Spark. I can't exactly pin-point what makes them feel similar but to me something does. It's quite intriguing and if i were forced to an analysis i would say firstly its the instumentation and arrangements, but more than that and in some way less than that, cos i'm now about to be very vague indeed, they both have the same summery feel. They both sparkle in the same way.Eltons album is somewhat twee but there's something there that when i listen to one it reminds me of the other and when i listen to the other it reminds me of the other...one or should that be one without Other...whatever! Let me know if you know.xx Clive ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 20:12:46 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: OF ALL TIME... In a message dated 12/07/2002 7:52:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, mtotzke@gosympatico.ca writes: > What's your favourite Joni Mitchell > song/performance of all time? Hejira> > > Least favourite? > > Dancing Clown > Bob NP: Paul Westerberg, "I Will Dare" Chicago 8.9.02 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 20:19:26 EST From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: OF ALL TIME... In a message dated 12/7/2002 7:51:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, mtotzke@gosympatico.ca writes: > What's your favourite Joni Mitchell > song/performance of all time? > Hejira on Hejira--If I had to pick just one favorite. Down To You and Amelia are right up there, too, but don't get me started. Least Favorite? Dancin' Clown. I don't think Joni ever gives a bad performance, necessarily. I'm sure it's the best she could do with a song that's just not very likeable. Ken ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 22:21:38 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: OF ALL TIME... - - In a message dated 12/07/2002 7:52:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, mtotzke@gosympatico.ca writes: > What's your favourite Joni Mitchell everything she wrote before the shadows and light album > Least favourite? almost everything she wrote after the shadows and light album wallyK, np: elektra, eva marton ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 17:55:59 -0800 (PST) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: court and spark and Friends the film (music by Elton John and lyrics by Bernie Taupin) from the Philadelphia Evening Bulletin sometime in the warmer climes of 1971... I quote this little review of the film "Friends": "Friends"- An improbable but touching story of teenage runaways, a French girl and an English boy, who set up housekeeping in the Camargue, a wild and beautiful section of southern France, and try to cope with the realities of being lovers with household responsibilities. (R) and from the jacket of the vinyl, which by the way, all songs are by Elton John and Bernie Taupin and Paul Buckmaster, copyright 1970 by Dick James Music Ltd London ***the song itself could be the theme song of the JMDL*** Friends, by Elton John and Bernie Taupin I hope the day will be a lighter highway For friends are found on every road Can you ever think of any better way For the lost and weary travellers to go? Chorus Making friends for the world to see Let the people know you've got what you need With a friend at hand you will see the light If your friends are there then everything's alright It seems to me a crime that we should age These fragile times should never slip us by A time you never can or shall erase As friends together watch their childhood fly Chorus again. ********** I can certainly see why you think of Court and Spark when you listen to the arrangements on this album. Brian and I found the video in a store in Hamilton Ontario and watched it again for the first time in over thirty years. btw, he still his ticket stub and it cost $2.25 to see it!!! MagsnBrei Chorando6@aol.com wrote:hi all, I wanted to ask anyone if they know Elton johns sountrack to a film called 'Friends' and if they do...do they notice any similarities between it and Court and Spark. I can't exactly pin-point what makes them feel similar but to me something does. It's quite intriguing and if i were forced to an analysis i would say firstly its the instumentation and arrangements, but more than that and in some way less than that, cos i'm now about to be very vague indeed, they both have the same summery feel. They both sparkle in the same way.Eltons album is somewhat twee but there's something there that when i listen to one it reminds me of the other and when i listen to the other it reminds me of the other...one or should that be one without Other...whatever! Let me know if you know.xx Clive You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 21:01:28 -0500 From: "chuty001" Subject: Re: court and spark I still have a copy of the friends sound track, though never noticed the similarities. I'll have to try these back to back when I get some free time. The song Honey roll is one of my favourites. DF - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2002 8:10 PM Subject: court and spark > hi all, > > I wanted to ask anyone if they know Elton johns sountrack to a film called > 'Friends' and if they do...do they notice any similarities between it and > Court and Spark. I can't exactly pin-point what makes them feel similar but > to me something does. It's quite intriguing and if i were forced to an > analysis i would say firstly its the instumentation and arrangements, but > more than that and in some way less than that, cos i'm now about to be very > vague indeed, they both have the same summery feel. They both sparkle in the > same way.Eltons album is somewhat twee but there's something there that when > i listen to one it reminds me of the other and when i listen to the other it > reminds me of the other...one or should that be one without > Other...whatever! Let me know if you know.xx Clive ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 20:59:37 EST From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: Re: Song of Sunny Saskatoon (njc). In response to a message in which I mentioned I was thinking of moving to Saskatoon, magsnbrei@yahoo.com writes: << if you want cold, Saskatoon is the place to be. Saskatchewan is one of the few provinces that I havent been to, however, Ive heard nice things about it.>> Hey, Mags -- I actually have been considering Saskatoon, partly because of the you-know-who connection, it's a big-enough town, it's described as "a progressive prairie town" in one of my guides, it's relatively inexpensive, one guide book said (without laughing, so I assume it may be true) that it's the sunniest province (right, when it's -40 in December or +90 in July, it's sunny), and it's so much fun to say: [In a bar back in my home state of RI: Stranger: Where you from? Me: Well, originally, here, but now I live in Saskatoon. Stranger: Where??!! Me: It's in one of those big provinces in the west of Canada -- Saskatchewan. Stranger: Get out of town. Me: Honestly, I live in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Stranger (standing up, ominously): I mean it -- get out of town.] And so on. In all seriousness, Mags -- well, you must know this -- people in the lower 48 can be astonishingly ignorant of the Great White North. One summer in the late '80's (again, in RI) a friend of mine from Calgary, a fellow grad student, didn't want to drive all the way back just for 3 months, and I got his car for the summer. After a week of explaining to almost everyone on the East Side of Providence that no, the car was not from Alabama or Alaska, I got a break -- or that is, someone else did: my close friend and assistant in the program I was running (she had to live in a dorm with international students and run constant errands) broke her ankle badly, and I had an excuse to give someone else the car. This friend is exotically beautiful, and when questioned about the car's origin, she just shook her head with a shy half-smile and murmured "no English"; this would have gotten me murdered. I should say that I am guilty of similar confusion in the e-world -- I just had to ask someone who write me a lovely note what the heck country "za" means in an e-address. <> Assume away. All joking aside, I do dream of living somewhere else that I can actually afford; and I'm seriously unhappy with the current government here in the US (that being one motivation, you'd think I'd want to deeply study the government of Canada. Ha! As an American, I'm ahead of the game just knowing the geography, sort of; I'm pretty sure Canada's a democracy, but I'm extremely vague as to what if any ties it has to Great Britain; and the Prime Minister is Jean Chretien, which I find an amusing name). So I do think of Vancouver/Victoria, Calgary, Saskatoon, and the Atlantic Provinces. But first I have to handle the medical problems, and here (San Francisco, if anyone reading this has gotten confused; I have) is pretty much where I have to be to continue getting medical care, at least for now. But I can dream: (To music:) Saskatoon I'll be there soon Manitoba, I'll be right ovuh... big hugs, Mags (and everybody -- I always write too much, and then get lazy and send it to all the list), Walt ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 02:29:50 -0000 From: "Chris Marshall" Subject: Six Degrees Of Seperation (NJC) Was: Joni Compilation! Stephen Toogood wrote:- > P.S. For people in the UK who have not seen 'Six Degrees Of > Seperation' you have to. It's on BBC2 tonight at 12:15. I > always get tearey eyed at the end. Such an exellent film. Being at a loose end, with a friend over, and a certain amount of red wine in attendance, I sat down to watch this film. And I'm so glad I did: at turns funny, farcical, sad, touching and mysterious. Kept me guessing most of the way through. Because I'm Pisces, and we Pisceans want it *now*, I was therefore slightly dissatisfied by the ending, purely because it leaves so many loose ends, so may tales untold, unfinshed. On the other hand, it does give me things to think about, to wonder about. Drawing on the assembled knowledge here present, was this film a book beforehand, and if so, who by? Is the book worth reading? Is it significantly different? (Without any spoilers, please!) Cheers, - --Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 21:34:28 -0500 From: "chuty001" Subject: Re: Travelogue Best and worst.... Slouching is the one that has been grabbing me since I first played it. I've had a hard time getting into Woodstock. I've always loved Joni's use of guitar. The interplay of her voice with the guitar and I'm kind of missing that on Woodstock.I will get past this bias at some point I'm sure and actually here what she's trying to do. DF - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Headon" To: "JMDL" Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2002 1:58 PM Subject: Travelogue Best and worst.... > Hi > > I am really enjoying travelogue my 3 favourites are > 1 Dawnteader A really great atmospheric filling out of a simpler early > song > 2 Cheroke louise Great just Great even better than the exvellent earlier > version > 3 You dream flat tires swings so well > > Least Favourite > 1 Woodstock a heavy , almost leaden, version of such a song of great 70's > optimism. > > Other peoples views on their best and worst perhaps..... > > > Best wishes, > > Paul Headon > Wales > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.426 / Virus Database: 239 - Release Date: 02/12/2002 ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #553 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? 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