From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #447 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, October 29 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 447 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #446 [Kardinel@aol.com] 1987 Benefit [Steve Dulson ] laura ["walterphil" ] FW: Joniphobic? ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] RE: Joniphobic?, njc now ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Krishnamurti(Thanks Joni!) [Relayer211@aol.com] PazFest, a recommendation!, njc ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] hastings again. njc ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] njc, Linda R. ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Re: PazFest, a recommendation!, njc ["kakki" ] Re: njc, Linda R. ["kakki" ] Re: Judy, Linda, Billie, Tori NJC ["Mark or Travis" Subject: 1987 Benefit >>Joni performed at the "Cowboys for Indians and Justice for Leonard >>Peltier" benefit in front of an estimated 9,000 people at the Pacific >>Amphitheatre in Costa Mesa, California. >I was there.... >After Joni's show there were some fans outside (any JMDLers?) Yep. :) - -- ######################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:13:05 -0500 (EST) From: "walterphil" Subject: laura i have been enjoying everyone's comments on other female singers my 2 faves are joni, of course, and laura nyro. i'm sure you all realize joni readily admits laura as an influence. particularly her piano playing. virtually all of laura albums are excellent, but her best is "new york tendaberry," ( 11 perfect new york songs with enough melodies to fill 3 albums), "eli and the 13th cofession," (sounds like anyone elses greatest hits!) "nested"( a more mature laura, less screaming and more rich rich melodies and warm piano playing) & her last, "angel in the dark." (a maginificent triumph over death. a fantastic culmination of a rich and varied career--and a killer version of "walk on by" to boot). The saddest part of her dying so young was that her voice was as rich and beautiful as ever. michelle kort's new book "soul picnic" is a must. joni is quoted a few times. i believe laura's later day views on the music business paralleled joni's. but she kept plugging on, giving concerts and making records. i'm surprised i have never read any quotes from joni after laura died. i wonder if they new each other? xxx walt The most personalized portal on the Web! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:14:05 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: FW: Joniphobic? Thanks very much, Jerry. You're right. It's a hot issue, like race. It's incendiary. I was unsure if I could post about it without throwing gasoline on the topic. This uncertainty was especially acute 'cause one of the rules seems to be I *shouldn't* talk about it. As you can see, your response is doubly assuring. Thanks for that. Jim > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jerry Notaro [mailto:notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu] > > Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 2:20 PM > > To: 'Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)'; joni@smoe.org > > Subject: RE: Joniphobic? > > > > > > Good post, Jim. It's a complicated issue, like racism. I'm gay and very > > sensitive to homophobia, and felt Joni's comment attested to > > homophobia or, > > at the very least, misinformation) in the world, not her own. > Others, both > > straight and gay, either agreed or disagreed. I've met you and > would never > > consider you homophobic, nor anyone else I've ever met through the list. > > That doesn't mean someone might make a casual remark that someone > > might take > > as insensitive or homophobic. But I'm a big believer in intent. > > And if there > > is no purposeful intent to hurt then I don't believe there is > homophobia. > > > > Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:17:35 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: RE: Joniphobic?, njc now Wow, cool. Thanks, Patrick. Now, I can tell Anna that I'm off the hook! Lama > From: patrick leader [mailto:pleader@nyc.rr.com] > > hey lama, > > as a card-carrying member of the gay mafia, i can assure you, we rescinded > that part of the code many years ago. > > you and i have been on this list for over five years, and i wanted to make > sure that everyone on the list knows this: i've always appreciated your > approach to thinking about and discussing homosexuality. you've been > open-minded as we've communicated some of our gripes, and when we've had > disputes with some homophobes (and there have been more than a few here). > > the comment about straight guys never commenting on other men's looks made > me laugh, and reminded me of a moment from a will and grace > episode. it was > the hour-long thanksgiving flashback a couple of years ago, and will, then > in college, was asking his roommate "do these pants make my butt > look fat?" > till the roommate had to enforce the code. very funny. > > patrick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:19:40 -0500 From: Relayer211@aol.com Subject: Krishnamurti(Thanks Joni!) I was browsing in the "Eastern philosophy" section of my local bookstore.I came across books by Krishnamurti.I knew nothing about him,but I remembered the quote from Joni about him(in the JM companion.the 1994 Mojo interview)I looked through about 4 or 5 books by and about him and was very intrigued.I found his ideas quite fascinating.I bought the book "Krishnamurti:On Fear",which is one of those books that I just strongly,intuitivly relate to... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:43:32 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: PazFest, a recommendation!, njc Wow. I opened up the PazFest, 2 CD set late last week and wow, is it fun. Michael himself does a fantastic, carefully-rehearsed, and lovingly-created, full-band set. He's got Joni's rhythm thang down, like Marian, that's for sure! His drummer has a light, jazzy touch to the brush work that I really love. (Blade-like, okay?) Brian Stoltz, of the Funky Meters, does a wonderfully incendiary, guitar-god solo on "Hejira". [[Aside to Paz: I recognize Beth Patterson's name (bouzouki) and Brian Stoltz's name (guitar). Which one was your drummer: Kevin Aucoin or Sam Price? Where can I get more of this talented and sensitve drummer? And Beth's solo?!?! Woah! It's *SO WONDERFUL* TO HAVE THIS DOCUMENT AFTER ALL THIS TIME!!! I called her "a monster" to her face in '00 and now I will always remember why! Thank you so much for bringing this out! I don't even CARE that you made me wait 2 years, you miserble procrastinator! All is forgiven, bud. :) ]] Besides all that, what's it like to have the first live tracks from Bryan's band? Is it pretty nice to crank up the Bryan Thomas Band's "Black Crow" to lease-breaking levels and rock out? To use a 70's high school expression.... "OH HELL YEAH-SSSSS!!" Please don't miss these discs, friends. np: PazFest on the big stereo, while I type from dead center, 5 feet out...... Is this heaven? Completely stoned on music, my exclusive drug of choice, Lama PS By the way, you *ALL* owe me thanks for staying on Paz, ribbing him mercilessly (even under the guise of Joni herself, don't forget), and even running the risk of pissing him off, to do the thankless legal stuff of getting permissions necessary to give these wonderful tracks the breath to live again- to help burned kids- and give joy again, and again. You're welcome. :) Kakki, do you suppose this is how Elliot Roberts felt when FTR began circulating? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 21:51:52 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: PazFest, a recommendation!, njc In a message dated 10/28/2002 8:44:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, jlamadoo@fuse.net writes: > PS By the way, you *ALL* owe me thanks for staying on Paz, ribbing him > mercilessly (even under the guise of Joni herself, don't forget), and even > running the risk of pissing him off, to do the thankless legal stuff of > getting permissions necessary to give these wonderful tracks the breath to > live again- to help burned kids- and give joy again, and again. > I'll happily tell you thanks, Lama! I appreciate all your efforts. Also cool was walking into Tower Records down on the French Quarter this weekend and immediately seeing the display for it. I'm assuming the pics which are blown up on the display rack are mostly yours. Bob NP: Patti Witten, "Winners & Losers" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 21:57:02 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: onlyJMDL Digest V2002 #316 In a message dated 10/26/2002 7:14:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, Jennymac48@aol.com writes: > Hey Bob Muller! Do you have Joni's 1994 KSCW's gig on CD? I want to hear > this! > Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, JennyMac...but the answer is YES, I do have this radio appearance, a funny and enjoyable interview and Joni unplugged in the radio studio playing: Sunny Sunday Crazy Cries of Love Sex Kills Moon At The Window Facelift Just Like This Train Bob NP: Patti Witten, "Blue Blanket" (awesome song!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:35:02 EST From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2002 #446 - Maids & Golden Apples NJC Mark, did you say you were an owner of "Maids and Golden Apples" or a PROUD owner of "Maids and Golden Apples"? I would recommend this CD very highly -- it's a reissue of Judy's first two albums. Real, honest-to-goodness folk music, before it became "folk-rock." And speaking of vocal ranges, in this very early work, Judy very often sang at the bottom of her range, adding to high seriousness of the songs. She jokes about that now though obviously she still has a great love of this music. I believe the 3rd & 4th JC albums are next to be reissued. Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:00:51 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Joni in Rolling Stone, njc Well, yeah. It's hard to feel sorry for someone who's in the Songwriter's Hall Of Fame, has a star in front of Gruman's Chinese Theater, is in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, is always listed among the most influencial guitar players (in spite of having a "slow" left hand!) and let's see..... am I leaving anything out???..... oh, yeah, someone who owns a retreat in the woods in Canada *AND* a home in freckin' Bel Air. Poor Joni. Things must be so HARD for her. Maybe we should hold a telethon? Naw...... Lama >> I'm running behind the times as usual, and for all I know this has been discussed already, but tonight I finally had time to sit down and read the Rolling Stone women issue. Now don't kill me, but if I have to hear one more time about how screwed over Joni has been by the business, I'm going to poke my eyes out. I wish she'd quit talking about it every interview -- it's either that, or something about how dismal today's music is. It just makes me cringe, because in every article, she's coming across as bitter and cold, with none of the witty, kind Joan we all know and love. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:10:38 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Joni's voice on STAS vs. next few; "Moon ... Harsh Mistress"; Playboy poll But I would say that while Joni's high register is certainly in full > evidence on STAS, she does go for some lower notes on this record that she > doesn't seem to approach on Clouds. Matter of fact, I didn't get this > record until the late 90's, and the IMMEDIATE thing that I noticed were the > low notes like right off the bat when she sings "painted the pastel walls > BROWN" on IHAK. What about 'Tin Angel', the very first cut? Those "varnished weeds in window jars" sounds close to the depth of those pastel walls to my ears. Or the first lines of 'I Think I Understand'? "Daylight falls upon the path/the forest falls behind." Joni does go into her upper register on STAS but for some reason it doesn't sound as thin or screechy as some of LOTC and Blue. I don't know if it's how she sang or how it was recorded but the voice is much more soothing, softer sounding somehow on STAS. To me, anyway. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:13:02 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Joni's voice on STAS vs. next few; The range of notes is somewhat lower, but it is the quality of her tone and timbre that I like so much better. > Jenny Thank you, Jenny. This is exactly what I was trying to say. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:28:53 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's voice on STAS vs. next few; "Moon ... Harsh Mistress"; Playboy p... In a message dated 10/28/2002 11:09:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, mark.travis@gte.net writes: > What about 'Tin Angel', the very first cut? Those "varnished weeds in > window jars" sounds close to the depth of those pastel walls to my ears. > Or > the first lines of 'I Think I Understand'? "Daylight falls upon the > path/the forest falls behind." > Yep, I'll buy that, Mark...good point. And I DO love both of those songs too...Think I Understand is one my favorites of hers. Bob NP: Laura, "You Don't Love Me When I Cry" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:49:14 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in Rolling Stone, njc Lama opines: << It's hard to feel sorry for someone who's in the Songwriter's Hall Of Fame, has a star in front of Gruman's Chinese Theater, is in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, is always listed among the most influencial guitar players (in spite of having a "slow" left hand!) and let's see..... am I leaving anything out???..... oh, yeah, someone who owns a retreat in the woods in Canada *AND* a home in freckin' Bel Air. >> Oh, Grasshopper . . . you have so much to learn about what SIQUOMB values in this circle game. As always, she remains a lonely painter -- even as power, ideals and beauty fade in everyone's hands. Rolling stones mean less than their fleeting shadows to her. Stars on the ground collect dirt and spit. Halls of fame give only hallow, meaningless echoes. Real estate, however, is always a wise investment. Hold no telethons, dear Grasshopper. Hold only your tongue. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:53:49 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC More birthdays... Well, it's still the 28th here, but in Denmark it's the 29th, so let me be the first to wish a BIG HAPPY BIRTHDAY to the Danish songbird who won our hearts at Jonifest, that "Queen of Femininity"...;~) Christina Friis-Nielsen!!! (aka the voice of 'Big Yellow Taxi') Hope the day is all-around wonderful for you Christina! Bob, with sincere apologies to the proper fairies & gnomes who usually do this kind of thing... NP: Laura Nyro, "Gibsom Street" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 00:02:08 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: RE: Joni in Rolling Stone, njc You teach wisely, o' wise one. Yet another grasshopper has brought his Agave to the keyboard and has lost face. A wise southern woman once observed, "Tara. it's the only thing that lasts." Reconnected me, you have, to the things that last. I have learned much, master. Lama ps, but I'm not at your feet, Murphy! > From: Murphycopy@aol.com [mailto:Murphycopy@aol.com] > Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 11:49 PM > To: jlamadoo@fuse.net; joni@smoe.org > Subject: Re: Joni in Rolling Stone, njc > Lama drunkenly opined: > > << It's hard to feel sorry for someone who's in the Songwriter's Hall Of > Fame, has a star in front of Gruman's Chinese Theater, is in the Rock and > Roll Hall of Fame, is always listed among the most influencial > guitar players > (in spite of having a "slow" left hand!) and let's see..... am I leaving > anything out???..... oh, yeah, someone who owns a retreat in the woods in > Canada *AND* a home in freckin' Bel Air. >> > > Oh, Grasshopper . . . you have so much to learn about what > SIQUOMB values in > this circle game. > > As always, she remains a lonely painter -- even as power, ideals > and beauty > fade in everyone's hands. Rolling stones mean less than their fleeting > shadows to her. Stars on the ground collect dirt and spit. Halls > of fame give > only hallow, meaningless echoes. Real estate, however, is always a wise > investment. > > Hold no telethons, dear Grasshopper. Hold only your tongue. > > --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:40:34 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: Mondlock & Sharp (was Art's new thread) NJC Paul C. wrote: > Her dad, Randy http://www.randysharp.ws/about.htm has written > songs for Linda Ronstadt, Jennifer Warnes, Edgar Winter and just > about every country act you've ever heard. Randy Sharp was also the president of the board of the National Academy of Songwriters during the time when Joni won their award. He is still on the board of the (now merged) NAS/Songwriters Guild of America. He conducts many songwriting workshop all across the U.S. A few years back a songwriter friend tried to get me to come to the regularly scheduled ones here in Hollywood. Argh. Wish I could have had the time...... Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:42:40 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: art's cd njc Kate wrote: >i especially love the opening lines of 'the thread': > > at the corner of 53rd & the summer of 62 > the first time i felt the tug > of what i call the thread of you... Ahhhh, me, too! It's so nice to be knocked over so well by lyrics every now and then ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 00:21:09 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: hastings again. njc mack, oh mack, no. Lush Life? Get Closer? Private Eyes? One To One? No, mack. These are not bargains. I don't care if you find them under a freckin' bus *SEAT* these are not bargains! (I've borrowed Running Water's habit of bringing the Agave to the keyboard so I guess it shows.) You want bargains? Go to www.columbiahouse.com , sign your sorry ass up and buy some MUSIC! If you don't have a membership already, suspend thinking and grab some freebies! Okay, nearly freebies. If you're already a member, raid that mindless corporate Sony/Columbia House monster/idiot for these incredible bargains immediately! 1. Two grownups known as Ella (frickin') Fitgerald and Louis (frickin') Armstrong doin' funny, beautiful, acomplished yet casual duets on something called something like "The Best of Ella and Louis". 2. "Birth Of The Cool" by Miles (fricken') Davis. 3. "Ultimate Charlie Parker". No comment needed. (By the way, I'm already a paid-up member and bought #2 and #3 for a total, including shipping, of.... wait for it.... $10.56.) If you have to buy a full-priced CD, buy the brand new James Taylor (if you like jt) called "October Road". My memory's a little fuzzy right now, but I think I recall that they're offering crucial jazz titles like "Take Five" (Dave Brubeck Quartet) and "Kind Of Blue" (Miles Davis) in remastered versions at give-away prices. The selection is amazing and you might as well make those (few) extra years of experience work FOR you instead of against you by selecting the primo stuff, mack. With apologies to Michael Timmins, life is too short to settle for "B sides". Lama ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 00:25:19 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: njc, Linda R. Attention, class. Here's some Monkees trivia. What's the significance of the song "Different Drum"? Class? Class? Lama Kakki said, I have the album Different Drum and >'Long, Long Time' is on it. Was it remade for 'Silk Purse?' to which Will said, Diferent Drum the album is a compilation album of early material including the title track DD. It originally was released on Silk Purse(funny album cover). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:50:53 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: PazFest, a recommendation!, njc Lama wrote: > I opened up the PazFest, 2 CD set late last week and wow, is it fun. I couldn't believe you waited so long to reconnect with your favorite monster Beth Patterson - who I will always think of as your New Orleans girlfriend ;-) > You're welcome. :) Kakki, do you suppose this is how Elliot Roberts felt > when FTR began circulating? Oh Hell yeah!! By the way, Kevin Aucoin is the drummer on Paz's set and also played at Atty Mays during J-Fest 2001. Last I knew he was also manager of the Tower Records in Nawlins where SCBob saw the big blow-up poster of YOUR photos! Whoo Ooooo!! Let's make Paz do it all again! Kakki, still swooning and smiling too much about Pazfest to write a review just yet ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:54:34 -0800 From: "kakki" Subject: Re: njc, Linda R. Lama asked: > Attention, class. Here's some Monkees trivia. What's the significance of > the song "Different Drum"? Class? Class? The "smart" Monkee wrote it ;-) - Mr. Nesmith > Kakki said, > I have the album Different Drum and > >'Long, Long Time' is on it. Was it remade for 'Silk Purse?' Actually, someone else wrote this part, but I do have the 45 single of Different Drum! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:17:04 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Judy, Linda, Billie, Tori NJC > >I think Linda (along with most every singer in C&W) owes a lot to >Patsy. > > Linda loves Patsy but what ever you do, don't call her a C& W singer. I didn't and didn't mean to imply that. That's why I didn't say 'most every *other* singer in C&W.' Linda is far too diverse to be pigeon-holed as country even though she can sing the hell out of a country song. > > >I'm saying that the slim, doe-eyed, Cinderella-ensnared-by-drugs >character > >that she played wasn't much like the real Billie Holiday. > > I think Billie Holiday herself has much to blame for all the inaccuracies > because she rarly told the truth about her own life. > Her autobiografy is well know to be riddled with more fantasy than fact. It > was not till really recent probing into records that we found out the truths > about her life. Some things found out about her life as a baby and small > child she may not have even been aware of herself. Very true. Her supposed 'autobiography' is where the name of the movie came from, 'Lady Sings the Blues.' I've read opinions that William Dufty was responsible for the glaring inaccuracies and I've also read that Billie herself often stretched the truth when talking about her past. It seems pretty evident that she really didn't care whether the book told the truth or not as long as it made her some money. Like Judy Garland, in spite of what she was paid, Billie seemed to be always hard up for cash. Up until not too many years ago, the date of her birth was not even known for certain. Donald Clarke managed to locate her birth certificate for his book 'Wishing on the Moon'. He also uncovered a lot of previously unknown information about her early years in Baltimore. He drew from interviews of people who knew her back then, a lot of them collected by a woman named Linda Lipnack Kuehl who unfortunately died before she could write the biography she was preparing for. She interviewed a *lot* of people - jazz musicians who worked with Billie, people who knew her from childhood - really extensive interviewing and research. Her life parralel that of > another great interpretive singer. The main difference is that Janis Joplin > wanted everything to be know(after she was dead). Buried Alive in the Blues > is a great read even if you don't like Janis. I remember cringing through > the chapters. I think Janis expected to die young. I think I read that book but it's been a few years. I love Janis. Cliched as it is, I do think of her as a fiercely bright light that burnt itself out much, much too soon. But oh what music she left us! > > >I bought a Judy Collins cd a while back called 'Maids and Golden >Apples' > > Mark, did you say you were an owner of "Maids and Golden Apples" or a PROUD > owner of "Maids and Golden Apples"? > I NEED to hear you say the right way! Please!?!? > Will Ok, ok, I am the PROUD owner of 'Maids and Golden Apples'. Many years ago I bought the vinyl 'So Early in the Spring' and my favorite songs were actually the traditional ones. It took 20 or so years and belonging to this discussion list for 5 or 6 years before I finally broke down and bought some more Judy Collins. Now I am a definite admirer. Mark E. in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 01:20:07 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in Rolling Stone, njc Lama writes: << I have learned much, master. >> That's fortuitous, Grasshopper. Sometimes a straight man must learn to stand on his knees before he climbs. Enjoy! --Bob ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #447 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)