From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #416 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, October 9 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 416 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today's Library Links: October 9 [ljirvin@adelphia.net] Re: Hayseed Affectations njc [vince ] Re: M.S.B.'s "woodstock" [Bob.Muller@fluor.com] Re: M.S.C.'s "woodstock" + Number 1 [AzeemAK@aol.com] NJC Re: Hayseed Affectations [Bob.Muller@fluor.com] M.S.B.'s "woodstock" njc [vince ] Re: NJC Re: Hayseed Affectations [vince ] RE: in responds to war NJC ["Victor Johnson" ] njc soul ["Marianne Rizzo" ] new album ["Marianne Rizzo" ] johnny angel [Dave Cuneo ] Re: johnny angel [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Joni in Rolling Stone [Jerry Notaro ] bree/riverboat NJC ["kasey simpson" ] you know you're in . . . ["Marianne Rizzo" ] Fw: in responds to war NJC ["kasey simpson" ] Desert Island Discs ["michael o'malley" ] Fw: in responds to war NJC ["kasey simpson" ] Fw: njc soul ["kasey simpson" ] RE: I'll take NJC over one of the three great stimulants, thankyou. ["Hea] Re: Fw: in responds to war NJC [Bob.Muller@fluor.com] joni only - self absorption NJC [anne@sandstrom.com] RE: Painting... now njc ["Heather" ] Re: johnny angel [Bob.Muller@fluor.com] success ["Marianne Rizzo" ] RE: success ["Heather" ] Re: in responds to war NJC ["Brenda" ] Re: johnny angel [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: in response to war NJC ["Lori Fye" ] Re: johnny angel ["Steve Polifka" ] RE: success ["Lori Fye" ] Re: joni only - self absorption ["Lori Fye" ] Re: Joni's Birthday [Les Irvin ] Re: joni only - self absorption (njc) ["Bree Mcdonough" ] Re: bree/riverboat NJC ["Bree Mcdonough" ] "A Travelogue" song order ["c Karma" ] Re: Fw: in responds to war NJC/Brenda [colin ] Re: CMIRS [Susan McNamara ] Re: in responds to war NJC/Brenda ["Lori Fye" ] Fw: Fw: in responds to war NJC ["kasey simpson" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 03:10:26 -0400 From: ljirvin@adelphia.net Subject: Today's Library Links: October 9 On October 9 the following items were published: 1995: "Celebrity auction turns first page of book gathering" - Denver Post (News Item) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/951009dp.cfm 1998: "Taming the Tiger" - Lexington Herald-Leader (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/981009lhl.cfm 2000: "A Night with 'the real don Juan'" - Sustained Action Website (News Item) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/001009sa.cfm - -------- Can you type? http://www.jmdl.com/typing/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 06:42:46 -0400 From: vince Subject: Re: Hayseed Affectations njc "jeff t." wrote: > Do you suppose, Vince, that I have enough time on my hands to hunt down any > ol' arcane reference? Well I don't. But I did. Twelve articles later and > I'm newly versed in one apocryphal tale. McCarthyism, evangelism, and > moralism...whoa! It sure was easy to keep the kids in line at soccer > practice today, thanks to you. See what opera can do for you? :-) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 07:35:58 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: M.S.B.'s "woodstock" <> Yes, that was one of the earliest ones we snagged, when the project was virginal and I had NO IDEA that 3 years later I'd be compiling a volume 39!! But it's been an enjoyable journey... Speaking of Volume 2, I've re-mastered the whole thing, got better source recordings (BIG thanks to Hell for the Jacqui Fitzgerald LP!!) and removed the "contributions", consolidating those on another 2-CD set. So now, Volume 2 fits on 3 cd's, there is no "disc 4". And there ARE some really nice tracks in this collection, if you want to check out what's on them go to: http://www.jmdl.com/covers/byvolume.cfm Bob NP: David Crosby & co., "Loser #1" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 07:47:21 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: M.S.C.'s "woodstock" + Number 1 Just wanted to weigh in on this version of Woodstock, which is close to my heart as it's possibly the first Joni song I ever heard. I think it's lovely, and the melody really suits Iain Matthews's voice. I much prefer it to CSN's version. As for Number 1, I've never liked it, couldn't hear a tune in there. CMIARS is a pretty weak album by her standards. I do prefer the sound of it to that of DED, even though the latter has MUCH better songs. If the songs on DED had the more organic production of CMIARS, I dare say I'd enjoy it more. Azeem in London np: Christine Collister - I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For - wow! a fabulous version, the penultimate song from Into The Light. The last is even better, an unspeakably gorgeous take on Paul Simon's Quiet, which all the many PS fans on this list NEED to hear! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 07:45:43 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: NJC Re: Hayseed Affectations <> This is wonderful news, as I already have enough jobs! :~) I forget about searching the archives, yet another cool feature of the site. As for the Sweet Bird thread, when I signed on back in January '98, that was one of the first things I read, and believe me, I was plenty intimidated! Oh, and just so you know...I sorta lead a double life. Besides my SCJoniguy address, you'll hear from me from this one too. But maybe you've already figured that one out from the archives! ;~) Bob NP: Crosby, "Wayfaring Stranger" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:52:16 -0400 From: vince Subject: M.S.B.'s "woodstock" njc Bob.Muller@fluor.com wrote: > Speaking of Volume 2, I've re-mastered the whole thing, Personally, I will wait for the remix, on a gold cd. Vince ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:57:03 -0400 From: vince Subject: Re: NJC Re: Hayseed Affectations <> Jeff, any reference to Bob's ass will only excite some of the more salacious members of the JMDL and the recent thread on that subject was more than enough for us purer minded folk. Please refrain from further reference. :-) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 8:11:38 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: RE: in responds to war NJC Kasey says- Making light of the fest? Maybe I did, if so it wasn't intentional. The point that was sooooo missed, was what was at the fest was at the fest, it cannot be bottled and sent around the world. And I... This is where you are wrong...what was at the fest lives on even now and is not just an isolated moment frozen in time...it continues to live on this list and in little gatherings and however else we incorporate it into our lives...you are right that it cannot be bottled up as it is in each one of us but it does exist around the world and it travels from England to Spain to Holland to New Zealand to Austria....all over the world. It exists NOW! It continues to grow and become stronger all the time. If it ever was in a bottle, the bottle was opened a long time ago and the genie has been set free finally, after being trapped in tbe bottle for millions of years but now she is free and we celebrate her freedom all the time...It never stops (just like the Energizer bunny ..hahaha) but keeps going and going and going and going...."THe secret of life is enjoying the passage of time" James Taylor said and I have to agree with him...Do you think we're going let the threat of war destroy all of this? THe answer is that it cannot be destroyed and it lives it lives it lives! Victor, with a couple of hours to kill before hitting the studio! - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:16:11 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: njc soul >For surly >ones as >loving and accepting as you would have enjoyed an intellectual >debate, rather >than >a war of words, meant to cut ones soul out. yeah, I was feeling this Ouch too in this debate for the last few days just that. . . none of the harsh words felt any good. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:22:35 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: new album Hi, When is the exact date the new Joni album (somehow I still like calling them albums) coming out? Does this mean I can find it in record stores then? Marianne MPIMheart "give me the beat. . to free my soul . . . I want to get lost in your rock 'n roll. . . . . I want you to know I believe in you so. . . " _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 08:33:52 -0400 From: Dave Cuneo Subject: johnny angel Ciao joniphiles, " I was never quite sure what that line was and 'Johnny Angel' just sounded silly to me. Do you know how this fits into the song and why Joni put it there? I've seen the video and I still can't figure it out." dave: I have no idea! I'm sure someone else on the list might know or have a better guess. BTW, I received a copy of Joni's video "Refuge of the Roads" yesterday and was playing some of it last night (thaks Bob Muller!). Am I crazy or does it seem like Joni cannot open her mouth all the way - it looks like, and sounds, like she is singing through almost clenched teeth. Does this have anything to do with her dental problems that I have read about here on the list in the past? Or is it my imagination? dave. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:45:45 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: johnny angel Dave Cuneo wrote: > Ciao joniphiles, > > " I was never quite sure what that line was and 'Johnny Angel' > just sounded silly to me. Do you know how this fits into the song and why > Joni put it there? I've seen the video and I still can't figure it out." > > dave: I have no idea! I'm sure someone else on the list might know or > have a better guess. While it doesn't address the Johnny Angel question, there is a wonderful essay on the song at http://www.jonimitchell.com/EssayBeat.html. My take is that Joni brilliantly juxtaposes the horror and realities of war that her generation faced with the golden innocence of a time when Johnny Angel seemed all a girl would think about. Joni often refers to that time in her youth, a time of Sandra Dee, teased up kind of hair, poodle skirts, and big Cadillacs. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:54:37 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni in Rolling Stone Catherine McKay wrote: > > You've said it all. What more is there to say? (I > don't know if I'd lump Mary J. Blige in with the other > two, but my own personal jury is still out on that > count.) Mary J. is the real deal. The other two are a raw deal. Jerry np: Eminem - Goodbye to Hollywood ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 08:51:25 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: bree/riverboat NJC Bree, At least your responds was openly off the mark!:) No we didn't win, but we had a great time. Sorry you couldn't make, maybe next time. I look forward to talking with you again sometime. Kasey But Kasey..did you like the riverboat and did you win?!! :-O Bree a war of words, meant to cut ones soul out. The Simpson family says you are >welcome. > Kasey Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : >http://explorer.msn.com _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.comGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:59:40 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: you know you're in . . . >When I first joined and >noticed NP: Dylan or Ryan Adams etc., at the end of some of the > posts..I thought Hmmm, they listen to somebody else besides Joni. > I remember even > being kind of disappointed as crazy as this might sound. I really >did.. >which is dumb, of course, because yeah..I listen to quite a few other >artists besides Joni. Anybody else think this or just me? >Bree Yeah, I had that same crazy feeling. :) Marianne _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 08:58:35 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: in responds to war NJC Victor, I respect your thoughts, and feelings on this but I disagree. If you've set the 'genie' free tell her she needs to fix a few things. She is living inside you (as in all those at the fest) and not freely about the world. I'm sorry that I am not making this point well, but I wasn't there, and I don't believe in genies. Kasey Kasey says- Making light of the fest? Maybe I did, if so it wasn't intentional. The point that was sooooo missed, was what was at the fest was at the fest, it cannot be bottled and sent around the world. And I... This is where you are wrong...what was at the fest lives on even now and is not just an isolated moment frozen in time...it continues to live on this list and in little gatherings and however else we incorporate it into our lives...you are right that it cannot be bottled up as it is in each one of us but it does exist around the world and it travels from England to Spain to Holland to New Zealand to Austria....all over the world. It exists NOW! It continues to grow and become stronger all the time. If it ever was in a bottle, the bottle was opened a long time ago and the genie has been set free finally, after being trapped in tbe bottle for millions of years but now she is free and we celebrate her freedom all the time...It never stops (just like the Energizer bunny ..hahaha) but keeps going and going and going and going...."THe secret of life is enjoying the passage of time" James Taylor said and I have to agree with him...Do you think we're going let the threat of war destroy all of this? THe answer is that it cannot be destroyed and it lives it lives it lives! Victor, with a couple of hours to kill before hitting the studio! - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnsonGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 08:58:44 -0400 From: "michael o'malley" Subject: Desert Island Discs Just surfing through CBC Jazz links the other night, and I came across these little Joni mentions in the ``desert Island discs`` section of Ross Porter's ``After Hours``. He asked several jazz musicians to list their all-time faves. Surprisingly, Hejira and Court & Spark turned up on two of the lists - Patricia Barber's and Jane Bunnett's, respectively. Although Joni is not generally considered a jazz artist, per se - it's interesting to see jazz musicians' picks. You can catch this at : http://cbc.ca/afterhours/stranded.html Cheers! Michaelo in Quebec NP: Gabriela - Detras del sol ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:05:58 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: in responds to war NJC Debra, Once again I feel we just disagree on the content of some of the post. If you feel I started this, than that is your belief. In several post I did direct people to information. In several post I tried to clarify points I made. I'm not defending these words, take them as you will. No one has said 'don't support Bush' but then if you do you must be a war monger, or sarcastic, etc....etc.... Kasey kasey simpson wrote: > > It seems that me (or my opinions) are worse than that of Saddam. For surly > ones as > loving and accepting as you would have enjoyed an intellectual debate, rather > than > a war of words, meant to cut ones soul out. Kasey, This is very very weird, considering you're the one that started with the sarcastic remarks and insulting people's actions and beliefs when people didn't automatically agree with you. So, do YOU want an intellectual debate? There's no proof that you do. People asked you questions in the recent posts in order to learn more about your view and better understand some of the general statements you've made, and your only response is this tirade. Has anyone told you NOT to support Bush? What in the world has made you this angry? Debra SheaGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:09:58 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: njc soul Marianne, It's funny you should say 'the last few days' as I was out of town and not posting in the last few days. Thank you. Kasey yeah, I was feeling this Ouch too in this debate for the last few days just that. . . none of the harsh words felt any good. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.comGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:21:13 -0400 From: "Heather" Subject: RE: I'll take NJC over one of the three great stimulants, thankyou. LOL Colin!! This made my day! Best- Heather - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of colin Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 8:01 PM To: johnirving Cc: joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: I'll take NJC over one of the three great stimulants, thankyou. > I mean imagine it's judgement day and the world coming to the end, and we will be too busy discussing what Joni meant by fay or fey or boom boom pachyderm or whatever to notice till the screen pops. 'I've been reading my joni list. anything interesting happen in the world today? hello? hello? Hello? anyone there?' ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:33:19 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: Fw: in responds to war NJC <> And I think there's probably a happy medium...I have attended several fests and have interfaced with these fine folks for awhile now, and I can indeed confirm that it IS life-changing. But you're right Kasey, it doesn't change the world we live in, just as war won't change the world we live in. What it DOES change is the way we move through the world, which is ultimately the only thing we can really change anyway. Bob PS: Vince, this is as close to a political post as I'm gettin'! ;~) - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:35:04 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: joni only - self absorption NJC Welcome Jeff T.!!! Loved your first post - please post more often! lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:42:45 -0400 From: "Heather" Subject: RE: Painting... now njc Dear Catherine-Bob, I don't think there are enough Bob's either. Sincerely, Heather-Bob - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Murphycopy@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 12:55 AM To: anima_rising@yahoo.ca; RADJSHARP@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: Painting... now njc Catherine writes: << There aren't enough Bobs on this list. >> As we say around Boston, "I BEG TO DIFFAH!" Always lovely to hear from you, Catherine. Try to keep posting more often . . . And you go, girl! --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:41:06 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: johnny angel <> And I have always heard "Charlie Angel" which further supports your point, Jerry..."Charlie" being the name that was used in Vietnam, although I forget whether we called them that or they called us that. The "Killer Kyle" story was one that Joni sat on for a LONG time. It's based on her conversations with a soldier back when she was touring in the Carolinas and was one of the few to play Fort Bragg in Fayetteville, NC (nicknamed Fayette-Nam). The same guy is the subject of "There's a man who sends me medals, he is bleeding from the war". Bob NP: Kevin Mahogany, "Blues In The Dark" - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 11:19:58 -0400 From: "Marianne Rizzo" Subject: success > All of which makes me wonder and put forth to the list this > question: > > what makes a musician/artist "successful"?? Is Joni "successful" in > your opinion? > > i welcome your thoughts. > > Mags Mags, My first thought is that "successful" to me is having passion and creativity and then working with it (WORK)...... . . . .doesn't matter if the tree falls and no one hears it. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:34:51 -0400 From: "Heather" Subject: RE: success I think Marianne may be alluding to this .... successfulness is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. IMO, I think many creative people do not think they are successful. I think that they think there is always something else to achieve ... something else they feel they need to do... to create. Hmmm ...are we using successful here as a finite term? Heather - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Marianne Rizzo Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 11:20 AM To: joni@smoe.org Subject: success > All of which makes me wonder and put forth to the list this > question: > > what makes a musician/artist "successful"?? Is Joni "successful" in > your opinion? > > i welcome your thoughts. > > Mags Mags, My first thought is that "successful" to me is having passion and creativity and then working with it (WORK)...... . . . .doesn't matter if the tree falls and no one hears it. Marianne _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 08:32:59 -0700 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: in responds to war NJC On 8 Oct 2002 at 22:01, kasey simpson wrote: > Majority against......latest poll > 62% for not against. Well, there's all kinds of poll data. What does that 62% number mean exactly? And in answer to what question? And when was it taken? Here is some interesting data from Gallup: Only 47% of Americans will unequivocally support the President authorizing an invasion of Iraq. 49% believe the U.S. has not done all it can diplomatically to resolve the situation while 46% believe it has. Only 38% favor the U.S. going it alone (this is from Sept 20-22, things certainly could have changed). Support for the war diminishes with the number of casualties: 51% support if there are 100 casualties, 46% if that number increases to 1000 and 33% if it increases to 5000. There's lot's more interesting data to be found here: http://www.gallup.com/poll/releases/pr021008.asp Taking poll data for what it is, one can still draw the conclusion that there is no simple for or against. (Just as the war itself is not the same as the resolution that will receive a vote on Thursday.) It seems that most people in the U.S. do not support unilateral invasion and that there is not majority support without reservations. But if there is a multilateral effort or a UN sanctioned effort, support is nearly 80%. To me this is an important point. Most Americans do not want to bail on the UN and hopefully, ultimately the unilateralist, domination stance of certain members of the Bush administration will lose traction. > It seems that me (or my opinions) are worse than that of > Saddam. C'mon, Kasey. I don't think anyone has written anything even close to this. At least not on list. And if it has happened off list, the offender owes you a mighty a apology, with days of self-flagellation. In the literal sense. (See, we're not all against violence. : ) After all, Saddam is a homocidal, demonic, maniacal, psychotic, evil, tyrannical despot. I've been watching the Senate debates on the resolution and if I have to hear one more politician preface their point with yet another verbose description of Saddam's lunacy, I'm gonna scream. It's like there's some keyword list of "evil" terminology floating around Washington. To quote Buffy - "Alright, I get it. You're evil". > For surly ones as loving and accepting as you would have > enjoyed an intellectual debate, rather than a war of words, meant to > cut ones soul out. The Simpson family says you are welcome. No offense, Kasey but this is a bit of a cop out and I for one won't let you off that easy. There are people here willing to engage in an intellectual debate, so let's not throw out the proverbial baby with the slings & arrows bathwater. If you really want to debate issues, I'm here. And on the JMDLPC list for when it heats up! : ) Brenda n.p.: Gov't Mule - "Monkey Hill" - ------------------------------ Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:44:47 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: johnny angel One of the many Bobs wrote: > And I have always heard "Charlie Angel" which further supports your point, > Jerry..."Charlie" being the name that was used in Vietnam, although I > forget whether we called them that or they called us that. > I think this is Joni being clever with her words again. I always hear "Johnny Angel" probably because my older sister played the Shelley Fabares hit over and over when I was a kid. You could be right Bob, it might be Charlie. It does make sense with the Vietnam situation. Joni probably muffles the word to keep us thinking. ( Kakki, next time you run into Joni, please ask her what she's singing :~) ) JimBob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:47:32 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: in response to war NJC I couldn't stand it any longer ... and I couldn't help myself ... I HAD to change "responds" to "response." Lori, missing Paul I. a little bit ; ) ~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:51:12 -0500 From: "Steve Polifka" Subject: Re: johnny angel Joni's singing of 'Johnny Angel' almost sounds like the Shelley Fabares song, IMHO. Steve - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Cc: ; Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 10:44 AM Subject: Re: johnny angel > One of the many Bobs wrote: > > > And I have always heard "Charlie Angel" which further supports your point, > > Jerry..."Charlie" being the name that was used in Vietnam, although I > > forget whether we called them that or they called us that. > > > > I think this is Joni being clever with her words again. I always hear > "Johnny Angel" probably because my older sister played the Shelley Fabares > hit over and over when I was a kid. You could be right Bob, it might be > Charlie. It does make sense with the Vietnam situation. Joni probably > muffles the word to keep us thinking. ( Kakki, next time you run into Joni, > please ask her what she's singing :~) ) > > JimBob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:56:19 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: RE: success > what makes a musician/artist "successful"?? Is Joni "successful" in > your opinion? Joni is successful, imo. Also imo, what makes a musician/artist/individual "successful" is doing with their lives what they love to do, whether it makes them any money or not. If doing what they love makes them money - or otherwise provides them a livelihood - so much the better for them. But happiness, in addition to being the best facelift, is the true measure of success for me. Lori, watching rooftops in Bethesda ~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 09:12:43 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: joni only - self absorption Bree wrote: > I thought Hmmm, they listen to somebody else besides Joni. I > remember even being kind of disappointed > Anybody else think this or just me? Not me. If I'd found out that Joni is ALL that people here were listening to, I would've thought it obsessive, frightening, at the very least somewhat nerdy (albeit in a cool sort of way). If not for the members of this list and their willingness to share what else they're listening to, I would probably still not know of Jonatha Brooke*, let alone have seen her at a delightful venue with Brian G. I've learned SO MUCH about ALL KINDS of music by hanging out here. Thanks, everyone. Lori * P.S. - Terry M - where are you, woman? ~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 10:39:05 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Re: Joni's Birthday At 10/8/2002 10:06 PM, Jimmy wrote: >We all know that Joni's birthday is just around the corner. We've had some >wonderful birthday cards sent to her that I've seen for the past 4 years. >Last year, Steve Polifka made a lovely card representing JoniMitchell.com and >the JMDL. I hope some of the great graphic artist on the list can come up >with something. We have to let her know how much we still love her. And we need to get going on this real soon. Is there anyone out there who has an idea for a birthday card? Any graphic artists who wants to take a stab at this? Thanks, Les ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 12:42:55 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: joni only - self absorption (njc) That was just my intial reaction. I have since loved to see what people are listening to. I have been turned on to various artists that I might not have been inroduced to otherwise since joining the list. I'm always thrilled finding someone new. David Crosby and Judy Collins will be in my city for a concert together in a couple of weeks at Music hall. Has anyone on the list seen their show? I'm thinking about going? I've seen Mr.Crosby with Stills and Nash two times over the years. Never..Judy Collins. Bree >For me, the talk about so many artists old and new made it all even more >fantastic! It's been like reading a long, ongoing book with new twists and >information surfacing all the time. Better than reading the AMG All Music >Guide! Then again, I am (along with Muller, Paz, Darice, Rick and many >others) a charter member of the Official JMDL Music Slut chapter ;-) > >Kakki _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 12:42:02 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: in responds to war NJC/Brenda Brenda, I find you utterly engaging! You are so bright and informed. You are correct about polls. Any poll can prove any point if you word the questions correctly. Very good. Please do not miss read this as sarcastic for I am being sincere here. As for the remark about Saddam, the meaning was that I find some more accepting of his views than mine. To be fair no one (yet anyway) has compared me to him. I'm still trying to wade through the list of new information listed, so I will get to the poll link later. Thanks for your post. Kasey PS: The bath water was just full of dirty slings and arrows so I had to throw it out:) On 8 Oct 2002 at 22:01, kasey simpson wrote: > Majority against......latest poll > 62% for not against. Well, there's all kinds of poll data. What does that 62% number mean exactly? And in answer to what question? And when was it taken? Here is some interesting data from Gallup: Only 47% of Americans will unequivocally support the President authorizing an invasion of Iraq. 49% believe the U.S. has not done all it can diplomatically to resolve the situation while 46% believe it has. Only 38% favor the U.S. going it alone (this is from Sept 20-22, things certainly could have changed). Support for the war diminishes with the number of casualties: 51% support if there are 100 casualties, 46% if that number increases to 1000 and 33% if it increases to 5000. There's lot's more interesting data to be found here: http://www.gallup.com/poll/releases/pr021008.asp Taking poll data for what it is, one can still draw the conclusion that there is no simple for or against. (Just as the war itself is not the same as the resolution that will receive a vote on Thursday.) It seems that most people in the U.S. do not support unilateral invasion and that there is not majority support without reservations. But if there is a multilateral effort or a UN sanctioned effort, support is nearly 80%. To me this is an important point. Most Americans do not want to bail on the UN and hopefully, ultimately the unilateralist, domination stance of certain members of the Bush administration will lose traction. > It seems that me (or my opinions) are worse than that of > Saddam. C'mon, Kasey. I don't think anyone has written anything even close to this. At least not on list. And if it has happened off list, the offender owes you a mighty a apology, with days of self-flagellation. In the literal sense. (See, we're not all against violence. : ) After all, Saddam is a homocidal, demonic, maniacal, psychotic, evil, tyrannical despot. I've been watching the Senate debates on the resolution and if I have to hear one more politician preface their point with yet another verbose description of Saddam's lunacy, I'm gonna scream. It's like there's some keyword list of "evil" terminology floating around Washington. To quote Buffy - "Alright, I get it. You're evil". > For surly ones as loving and accepting as you would have > enjoyed an intellectual debate, rather than a war of words, meant to > cut ones soul out. The Simpson family says you are welcome. No offense, Kasey but this is a bit of a cop out and I for one won't let you off that easy. There are people here willing to engage in an intellectual debate, so let's not throw out the proverbial baby with the slings & arrows bathwater. If you really want to debate issues, I'm here. And on the JMDLPC list for when it heats up! : ) Brenda n.p.: Gov't Mule - "Monkey Hill" - ------------------------------ Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous.Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 12:50:11 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Re: bree/riverboat NJC You curmudgeon you!! Sorry about the loss..and everything. Bree > Bree, > At least your responds was openly off the mark!:) >No we didn't win, but we had a great time. Sorry you >couldn't make, maybe next time. I look forward to >talking with you again sometime. >Kasey > > >But Kasey..did you like the riverboat and did you win?!! :-O > >Bree > > > >a war of words, meant to cut ones soul out. The Simpson family says you >are > >welcome. > > Kasey Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : > >http://explorer.msn.com > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.comGet >more >from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 17:14:17 +0000 From: "c Karma" Subject: "A Travelogue" song order Still an analogue mind in a digital world, I made a cassette tape (egad!) of the songs which will appear on "A Travelogue" in the order given on JoniMitchell.com. I was attempting to discern if there was a thread of continuity or a song cycle arc present by virtue of the lyrical content. I couldn't find one, but as in the case of all poetry, what speaks to me (or doesn't) may not (or, may) to another. If this is in fact the order of the songs as they will appear, some of the choices seem uncharacteristically obvious ("Refuge Of The Roads" to "Hejira") while others might be considered incongruous ("Otis and Marlena" to "Amelia"). The only conclusion I can derive from this (perhaps pointless) exercise is that the orchestral arrangements of some of these songs are likely to be MARKEDLY DIFFERENT from the versions previously recorded, which would mitigate seeming conflicts of pace and content based on this program of existing versions. I think this collection is going to be mind expansive in terms of how listeners can hear a song they've known for years for the first time. Like Joni, Vince and Larry did with "Both Sides Now", both the arrangements and vocal readings for these songs will likely place them in a whole new perspective while referencing the ones of old. Her inclusion of "Love" and "Slouching Toward Bethlehem" are grand gestures in illustrating her interpretive talents. I can't wait. CC PS: I'm sure everyone will have an opinion on the songs included in the collection, some of which we've already read. OK, here's MY only question: "Otis and Marlena?" Other than a new arrangement blowing my mind and all my preconceptions away, I would have traded any of ten other songs to take its place here. While I acknowledge Joni's topical "while Muslims hold up Washington" as having presaged the Iran hostage crisis even, I hope she didn't include the song here to remind us of that fact. Miss Cleo, she aint! "Fiction of the this is this and that is that, aaah!" -- JM _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 18:25:29 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: Fw: in responds to war NJC/Brenda > As for the remark about > Saddam, the meaning was that I find some more accepting > of his views than mine. Holy pig! Saddam wrote here to tell us of his views and I missed it. Shit. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 13:37:13 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: Re: CMIRS > Someone wrote: "At the bottom of the heap is CMIAR. This is terrible, >in my opinion, and >not worth the money I spent on it." I really love CMIAR, especially Snakes and Ladders, if just for the line "to kiss her he has to shave." :-) suemc - -- "Heart and humor and humility will lighten up your heavy load ... " - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 10:46:06 -0700 From: "Lori Fye" Subject: Re: in responds to war NJC/Brenda response. response response response response RESPONSE! without a "d" and WITH another "e"!!! : ) Lori ~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 13:47:32 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Rod Stewart's new CD NJC Following Joni, Carli, Linda and many others, I read that Rod Stewart will be releasing a CD of standards, "It Had to Be You.....The Great American Song Book". I can't say I'm much of a Rod Stewart fan, but it will be interesting to hear his rendition of "Everytime We Say Goodbye" (w/Dave Koz), "I'll Be Seeing You", or "It had to Be You" (w/Michael Brecker). I wonder if like Joni, his follow up project will be doing orchestral arrangements to "Maggie May", "Do Ya Think I'm Sexy" or "Hot Legs" :~) Jimmy (no relation to Rod) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:08:26 EDT From: KJHSF@aol.com Subject: Re: CMIRS Snakes and Ladders has some brilliant moments, I agree. I think it's Joni at her best when she takes pot shots at people and issues without losing her lyrical abiltity to turn a phrase or her incredible gift for metaphor. "the perfect air-brushed angel, stapled into all his brain cells (like a centerfold)" or "how the seasons steal away--first you're green, then you're grey." Of course, Number One is still my favorite on that disc and I would kill to hear the acoustic version you all have spoken about! Where DED fails for me is when Joni strikes out at issues but doesn't push her lyrical twists, her play with vocabulary and her irony of word selection. I like my Joni verbose, witty, hawk-like in her observations, and so much of DED is whittled down to phrases that seem too short IMHO. Ken N/P-Deb Talan, forgiven (Who sounds so much like early Jonatha/the Story that it's spooky) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 13:59:48 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluor.com Subject: Re: "A Travelogue" song order <> I'm sure that was an interesting exercise, CC...I try to play some of these in my head based on the "sound" of BSN, and some like "Love & "Slouching" are easy to hear and they already sound great in my mind's ear. But you're right, unless Joni performs a meliodomy* on it, O&M is gonna be a draggy dirge. I hope for the worst, because if it is a stinker than it's what I expected, and if it's a jewel it's a "beautiful surprise"! ;~) Not that I don't like O&M - I do. I just don't think it's right for this kind of treatment...of course I would hate to be the one to tell Joni that, I would chicken out fer sher! Bob, chicken squawkin, buk buk buk BUUUUK! NP: The New York Rock & Soul Revue, "Groovin'" * a word that I just made up - it means "performing surgery on a musical piece to add a rhythm or melody that wasn't present originally. Not to be confused with "meliectomy" which takes rhythm & melody away! :~) - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:39:12 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: Fw: in responds to war NJC Victor, You are insightful. How eloquently put. I'm not a follower of Rene' Deckard (spelling wrong) but he made some very strong points for creating our own worlds. Maybe one day the genie inside me will come out. I do enjoy reading your post. Thank you. Kasey Actually, if you think about it, this whole debate that has been going on exists only in our heads and is not roaming freely around the whole world. So where does that leave us? The thing is, everything you feel, think, experience exists inside of you. From there you decide how to interact with the rest of the world. I haven't been in your head but, all your beliefs and feelings, they exist inside of you as well, and are not freely about the world either. Victor - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnsonGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:46:23 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: Fw: in responds to war NJC Bob, You are right. There must be a medium. Some times people (myself included) get tunnel vision and only see the right in their side. I am truly happy for anyone that has had the experiences you have at your fest. Again I wish every one could have that, but not every one wants it. That is why some where between the love and hate comes the medium. I won't ask you to ever post on politics:) Kasey <> And I think there's probably a happy medium...I have attended several fests and have interfaced with these fine folks for awhile now, and I can indeed confirm that it IS life-changing. But you're right Kasey, it doesn't change the world we live in, just as war won't change the world we live in. What it DOES change is the way we move through the world, which is ultimately the only thing we can really change anyway. Bob PS: Vince, this is as close to a political post as I'm gettin'! ;~) - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any use, review, retransmission, dissemination, distribution, reproduction or any action taken in reliance upon this message is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the company. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --------------------------Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #416 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)