From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #410 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Sunday, October 6 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 410 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Gage's mother got married - njc [Catherine McKay ] Re: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the ["mac] Re: the war within ["mack watson-bush" ] October 6 (njc) ["darice murray-mckay" ] Fw: the war within njc ["kasey simpson" ] Fw: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the ["kase] Still Vital After All These Years [Chihuahua50@aol.com] Re: the war within(njc) ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: the war within(njc) ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: the war within(njc) ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the Capitol (NJC!) [Jenny Goodspeed ] Re: the war within(njc) ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: October 6 (njc) [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: October 6 (njc) [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: Still Vital After All These Years [Murphycopy@aol.com] Race NJC [colin ] Re: Diana Krall/Michael Brecker/James Taylor [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] calling all guitarists (njc) [anne@sandstrom.com] war and peace and the jmdl (njc) [Mags N Brei ] Re: Race NJC [Catherine McKay ] Re:All Hands on Deck: Iraq vote Imminent - 800 number to the Capitol (NJC!) [Susan Guzzi ] Re: Still Vital After All These Years [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Kennedy also said this: NJC ["Bree Mcdonough" ] NJC Sweet 16 & Pazfest [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 10:57:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Gage's mother got married - njc --- vince wrote: > I can't keep writing this over > and over again, I > can only do it once, [...] [Mike] > had the class to > select Neil Young's "Harvest Moon" as the wedding > couple's song - what > more can you want? You're right - that's a perfect song. I'm not a big fan of Neil's (mostly because of his voice, to be honest), but I absolutely love this particular song (even the way he sings it!) [...] >as > usual I was the local Pied Piper since all the kids > love me - kids and > dogs love me, if nothing else existed in the world > my life would be > perfect - but then I take time with each of the > kids, talking to them, > teaching them dance moves, having Pokemon card > packets in my pocket, and > this new card craze, can't spell it, but I had the > cards... Would that be Yugi-oh? (Are they into Bey Blades, or Bei Blades, or however that thing is spelled? I tried to tell my kids they're just tops or dreidels, but he wasn't buying that!) P.S. Thanks for the words to "The End". I like this one too. If it weren't for my 12-year-old, I'm not sure if I would have heard this one at all, but I think it's a great song. I also enjoy listening to some of Eminem's stuff, although I wish he'd tone down the swearing a bit ;) His song about his mama is pretty harrowing - talk about putting all your emotions out there. I like the music but I can't listen to that song much - the guy has some "issues with anger", that's for sure! ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:05:15 -0300 From: "Augusto Kestelboim" Subject: RE: a new Joni page (for me) Sorry, folks, this is not Spanish, it is Portuguese. Probably written in Brazil. I will try to translate and distribute. Please be aware that my Portuguese is as limited as my English! Try these too: http://www.geocities.com/musica_holm/joniabre.html http://www.geocities.com/to_candylane/pt1.html mailto:anapaulalaux@hotmail.com (page owner?) Augusto - -----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de vince Enviado el: Domingo, 06 de Octubre de 2002 10:30 a.m. Para: joni Asunto: a new Joni page (for me) "By the time we got to Woodstock we were half a million strong And everywhere there was song and celebration And I dreamed I saw the bombers riding shotgun in the sky And they were turning into butterflies above our nation..." - - Woodstock - Joni Mitchell 1969 - Looking for the lyrics quote, I came upon http://www.geocities.com/musica_holm/joni.html I wish I read Spanish better! Some fascinating commentary (as far as I can read) and great pictures, great other stuff, some of which I hadn't seen before! Anyone have any knowledge of this site, or can contact the owner of the site and make some contact? Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 08:07:56 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: the war within Please excuse the fragmenting of my responses. I'm currently on digest. Kasey said: To say this is retaliatory for his father is a childish and uninformed statement. This is precisely what Mr. Bush himself indicated this week. I agree with the "childish" and "uninformed" characterization of the statement, though. Victor said, I have been through hell but have never stopped believing in dreams and love and the power of music. I second that, Victor. I hope I've learned how to be tough and determined, without giving up on love. It can be done. I don't have the prescription for peace, but I know what some of the ingredients have to be. Kasey said, I wish love could stop wars. It can. Kasey, I'm afraid you've made your entrance by stumbling, with some undeserved slings and arrows aimed at people on the list. Would you like to come back in a bit more gently, please? lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 11:17:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: Fw: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to theCapitol (NJC! --- Victor Johnson wrote: > I am spreading what we had at > this fest to the rest of > the world. I begin working on it tomorrow. Why not today, Victor? ;) the notorious procrastinator, trying to shed a little levity on the situation) Indeed, why the rush to war? Tomorrow IS another day. And then again, there's the UN. What's the hurry, Bushman? Why Iraq? What are you trying to divert attention from? ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 11:38:48 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: the war within Anne, This started when I replied to a post to call Washington. At that time I was trying to start an informative debate and get all points of view in it. Brenda, evidently, was the only one to respond in kind. The 'slings and arrows' started with Susan, and Vince. I responded in kind. I would love to try this again, and have a mature intelligent discussion. However, I will not feel bad over defending my point of view. As for Bush eluding to finishing what his father started, could you please direct me to where you read/saw/or heard this. I would be interested in that type of comment. Kasey Please excuse the fragmenting of my responses. I'm currently on digest. Kasey said: To say this is retaliatory for his father is a childish and uninformed statement. This is precisely what Mr. Bush himself indicated this week. I agree with the "childish" and "uninformed" characterization of the statement, though. Victor said, I have been through hell but have never stopped believing in dreams and love and the power of music. I second that, Victor. I hope I've learned how to be tough and determined, without giving up on love. It can be done. I don't have the prescription for peace, but I know what some of the ingredients have to be. Kasey said, I wish love could stop wars. It can. Kasey, I'm afraid you've made your entrance by stumbling, with some undeserved slings and arrows aimed at people on the list. Would you like to come back in a bit more gently, please? lots of love AnneGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 10:53:23 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the Anne wrote: And, I have to agree that I read some antagonism into your post, Kasey, whether you meant it or not. I didn't read that or feel that. I simply read an opinion that was different. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 11:02:28 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: the war within To say this is retaliatory for his father > is a childish and uninformed statement. > > This is precisely what Mr. Bush himself indicated this > week. I agree with the "childish" and "uninformed" > characterization of the statement, though. I don't find the statement childish or uninformed. Those who had to live with his decisions here in Texas know he can be very childish, as we all can be at times. As for uninformed, information has nothing to do with it. Only he knows his inner feelings and motives on this and if it were the case, I doubt he would fill us in. Victor said, I have been through hell but have never > stopped believing in dreams and love and the power of > music. Nice sentiments but realistic, no. I believe in love, dreams, and the power of music as well but they have nothing to do, in my opinion, with the realities of politics or war. Kasey said, I wish love could stop wars. As we all do, I would hope, but again, not realistic as they do not love us and instead hope for our destruction. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 08:57:25 -0700 From: "darice murray-mckay" Subject: October 6 (njc) Since I never registered with the Birthday Fairy, I will say Happy Birthday to myself today. The short trip to LA was the best brithday present I have had in years. Darice ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:02:55 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: the war within njc Mack, Thank you for you input, I believe you've said it more eloquently than I. I don't believe Bush walks on water, I don't agree with him 100% of the time. But yes he does have more information than we do, and based on the little we have I am supporting him now. Love to my friend.....Kasey To say this is retaliatory for his father > is a childish and uninformed statement. > > This is precisely what Mr. Bush himself indicated this > week. I agree with the "childish" and "uninformed" > characterization of the statement, though. I don't find the statement childish or uninformed. Those who had to live with his decisions here in Texas know he can be very childish, as we all can be at times. As for uninformed, information has nothing to do with it. Only he knows his inner feelings and motives on this and if it were the case, I doubt he would fill us in. Victor said, I have been through hell but have never > stopped believing in dreams and love and the power of > music. Nice sentiments but realistic, no. I believe in love, dreams, and the power of music as well but they have nothing to do, in my opinion, with the realities of politics or war. Kasey said, I wish love could stop wars. As we all do, I would hope, but again, not realistic as they do not love us and instead hope for our destruction. MackGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:14:48 -0500 From: "kasey simpson" Subject: Fw: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the Anne, I have given my apology to Brenda. But you have indeed ask some very good questions. The weapons have been there, some may have even been funded by the US. Why now? Because repeated attempts to talk to Iraq to stop massing this weapons have failed. Repeated request have gone unanswered to permit the UN to inspect. Because Sadam will not comply with peace keeping forces. Now because all else has failed. Is it less likely under a new regime? Yes. Less likely, but not a guarantee. A new regime would be more likely to work with the UN, and peace keeping forces. Good questions Anne, these are what I ask myself before I decided to support Bush. Kasey Brenda, Your response said much of what I wanted to. And, I have to agree that I read some antagonism into your post, Kasey, whether you meant it or not. I'd be interested to hear from those who support a war against Iraq. I have a few specific questions: - - What specifically is the rationale for the U.S. making the first strike? - - What is the overriding reason for war now? (Why war? Why now?) (The weapons didn't appear last week. They've been there for years.) - - If you feel there is danger of Saddam Hussein using weapons of mass destruction, do you think the danger is less likely under a different regime? I personally find the push for war ludicrous. The fact that so many are willing to listen to a president who reduces foreign policy to personal vendetta says something about where we are right now. Yes, the U.S. and the world were terribly wronged on September 11. But I hope we are a nation of laws, and those laws preclude action such as that which is being proposed in Washington. I hope for peace and eventual understanding. lots of love AnneGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:20:08 EDT From: Chihuahua50@aol.com Subject: Still Vital After All These Years There was a point in time, somewhere in the late 70s, when I thought of Joni, James Taylor, Jackson Browne, Joan Armatrading, Rickie Lee Jones, Gordon Lightfoot, and Bob Dylan as all inhabiting more or less the same space in my own personal singer/songwriter hierarchy. Dylan and Joni have always been a step above everybody else for me, but they were at least all in the same ballpark during the late 70s. For example, look at the albums that each of these artists put out in that time period. These are, in my opinion, some of the best albums of their careers. 1976 - Hejira (JM) 1975 - Gorilla (Taylor) 1974 - Late for the Sky (Browne) 1976 - Joan Armatrading (3rd album) 1979 - Rickie Lee Jones (Debut album) 1976 - Summertime Dream (Lightfoot) 1975 - Blood on the Tracks (Dylan) I have followed all of their careers for the last 25 years and have most of their CDs. The difference between Joni and the rest of these musicians, for me, however, is that Joni's work continues to change and grow and much of her new work, not all of it, is as good and as intense, as the old work. I recently bought Jackson Browne's new CD, Naked Ride Home. I think it was the title that hooked me as much as anything. I guess I was looking for some kind of connection to Night Ride Home. I was afraid I'd end up buying it, listening to it a couple of times, and then filing it away. I was right. It's not terrible. It just sounds like what he did 25 years ago and so far there hasn't been a single song that I really wanted to hear again. It doesn't even approach the intensity of his early work. I have the same reaction to all the artists listed above. I didn't even buy James Taylor's last CD. I'm sure it's very nice, professionally done, and I've heard a few tracks and saw a video of one song, and it all sounds like everything else he's done for the last 10 or 15 years. Joni, on the other hand, continues to do different things, go down different paths. Her music on Taming the Tiger sounds different from everything else she's ever done. Both Sides Now sounds different from everything else. I love the new versions of her songs on Both Sides Now. I do wish she had not done the covers. I guess there must be something very compelling about doing an album of covers/standards. Everybody has done it from Carly Simon to Willie Nelson to Dylan.. I understand her love for the songs and I understand that the songs were meant to show the arc of a love affair. We all have songs we grew up listening to that were important to us. I just don't understand why she chose to record the covers and release them on album. One of the things that has always drawn me to Joni is her solitary approach to music. From her very first album she wrote the songs, sang the songs, played the instruments, did the album cover art, and produced it all. I guess that's why when I read about somebody like Norah Jones and listen to her CD my response is, "Very nice. But she's no Joni Mitchell." But that's okay. The covers on Both Sides Now were still interesting. It was new and different, and there were still moments of intensity that equaled her best work. A friend of mine who got off the Joni Mitchell bandwagon years ago asked me after Both Sides Now was released, "Why should I listen to Joni Mitchell try to sing At Last when I can listen to Etta James really sing it?" She has a certain point and I guess this is where you separate someone who just likes Joni from someone like me who would buy a CD of Joni singing the phone book. Her voice, even after all these years, and all those cigarettes, still intrigues and mesmerizes me. The first time I heard Joni sing Both Sides Now was Atlanta in 1998. It was a moment I will never forget. Was it just her performance, or was it the experience of having the past 30 years turned inside out right before my eyes? Can you separate the two? I don't think so. It was the closest thing to time travel I will proably ever experience. I felt the last 30 years collapse and turn inside out and then I was back in 1998. Infinity. A little yin/yang for ya folks. She was the driver and it was a magical ride she was taking us on, a travelogue. That is why I'm looking forward to Travelogue so much. I'm hoping for more moments like that and more moments that I haven't even thought of. I'm looking for memories about songs and places and times that I have forgotten that I think these new versions of old songs will reveal. So maybe in a way Both Sides Now, the CD, was a way for Joni to say, "See, these were my songs. These were the songs that were important to me as a child, and these are the songs that take me back in time." Maybe Travelogue is her way or providing that same experience for those of us who grew up with Joni's songs as our important songs. I hope Travelogue will not be her last album. I hope she will live a long time and keep sending out these gifts. I think she is capable of that. She has done it far longer than most of her peers. And I think she still has plenty to say. One thing she has now that she didn't have 30 years ago is a sense of history and hindsight. That could make for some powerful writing. But, if she doesn't make any new music, the music she has made in the last 30 years will get me through the next 30. Frank ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:26:24 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: the war within(njc) > Victor said, I have been through hell but have never > > stopped believing in dreams and love and the power of > > music. > > Nice sentiments but realistic, no. I believe in love, dreams, and the power > of music as well but they have nothing to do, in my opinion, with the > realities of politics or war. Love, dreams, and the power of music are real as well. I'm not speaking of sentiments nor am I being sentimental. Politics and war, in my opinion, have nothing to do with the realities of love and music. I've come to believe in these last couple of years that reality is whatever you dream...you create your own reality...I've experienced this is my own life and the lives of others. In the past couple of years I've been pushed to the brink, I've endured much pain and suffering and I am still struggling just to survive and despite all that I'm going into the studio tomorrow to begin working on a new album...into which I am going to pour everything that has grown and blossomed and continues to grow in this community...and I don't even begin to understand what Anne has gone through...she continues to be a shining and glowing inspiration to me...In Tolkien's Lord of the Rings, it wasn't war that destroyed the evil. No these are not sentiments but deep beliefs that rest in the very core of your being. Victor - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 11:39:01 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: the war within(njc) Victor wrote: Love, dreams, and the power of music are real as well. I'm not speaking of > sentiments nor am I being sentimental. Politics and war, in my opinion, > have nothing to do with the realities of love and music. Well put Victor but we were talking about politics and war, not love and music and it was you that bridged the two together. No these are not sentiments > but deep beliefs that rest in the very core of your being And I salute you for them. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:53:33 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: the war within(njc) > Victor wrote: > > > Love, dreams, and the power of music are real as well. I'm not speaking of > > sentiments nor am I being sentimental. Politics and war, in my opinion, > > have nothing to do with the realities of love and music. > > Well put Victor but we were talking about politics and war, not love and > music and it was you that bridged the two together. And maybe there needs to be more of that...bridging things together...when it comes to it, everything is connected. The smallest ripple in a tiny stream can have quite an effect somewhere far off...It is only in our minds that we divide things and create different versions of reality... Victor, off for some Sunday scrabble NP: Jimi Hendrix "Freedom" - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 10:08:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Jenny Goodspeed Subject: Re: Fw: All Hands on Deck: Iraq Vote Imminent - 800 number to the Capitol (NJC!) Brenda, thanks so much for your informative post questionning the White Houses' push to go to war. I have been reluctant to join in this debate, but I thought, I'd jump in with some random facts and questions and try to contribute to the informed debate that Kasey, was asking for. Brenda asked...how are we going to pay for this rebuilding after Saddam is gone? Given the current and former ties between the present administration and the oil/energy industry, I think they've got rebuilding a post-war Iraq covered. Some misc. historical info...After the Gulf War...During Cheney's tenure as Halliburton CEO, through foreign subsidiaries and affiliates, Halliburton became the biggest oil contractor for Iraq, selling more than $73 million in goods and services to Saddam Hussein's regime (as reported by the London Financial Times). For a Washington Post article on the subject see...http://gwbush.com/spots/postpage.html Also interesting...during his five years as CEO, Cheney nearly doubled the size of Halliburton's government contracts, totaling a whopping $2.3 billion. He convinced the Export-Import Bank of the U.S. to lend Halliburton and oil companies another $1.5 billion, backed by U.S. taxpayers. but I digress... I have yet to see the evidence that proves an attack on Iraq is an integral part to fighting the war on terrorism - or anything that links Saddam to al-Qaida. Kasey, any chance you can point me to articles that cover this? I'd be interested in reading them. (Please note: this is a serious request - I feel like I have to make it clear that I'm not being sarcastic - given the nature of recent posts). A report released by CIA officials on Friday said that Saddam's ability to produce and store chemical weapons is probably less than it was before the Gulf War. It is clear that Saddam if left unchecked would continue to build a chemical and biological weapons arsenal and probably nuclear as well. But, as someone else asked, why war now? Why war without U.N. backing or support from other nations in the world? I am suspicious of the White House motives because their public relations efforts have attempted to piggy back a war with Iraq on the events of Sept 11th. And I am not able to follow their logic. In fact, I sometimes wonder if they believe the general public desires or is even capable of logical and rational thought. Is there evidence now that links Saddam with Islamic fundamentalists? He has been repressing Islamic fundamentalism in his own country for years. I seriously don't understand. The cynic in me wonders if this is related to November elections. I mean how could it possibly be? And yet, why else the push for a strike in October? Scary thought. (see a side article on Karl Rove on p. 36 in Time magazine this past week - for an interesting look into Bush's chief strategist - and the impact Bush's focus on Iraq has had on Republican campaigns.) Do they want to destabilize the region and gain more control of oil production? I know it is cliche for liberals to cry "Oil" in these situations, but in this case, I don't think it is unreasonable given the administration's relationships with the energy industry. Maybe reading the reports Brenda pointed to will help illuminate this situation more. If you made it this far, thanks for reading. Jenny Brenda wrote:On 5 Oct 2002 at 21:01, kasey simpson wrote: > And just how would you "fiercely" defend that right? I do support > Bush on this. That choice is not some need to kick a-- rather a > resignation that some people can not be "talked" with. You had a > weekend of love and peace. I've had a lifetime of freedom in a > country that has had to fight many wars. Why not get a group of JM > listers and fly to Iraq? Play Sadam JM, and tell him you want peace. > Then if he listens, and you come back alive, then call Washington and > tell them how easy it is. I would prefer peace, I would prefer love, > but history has shown us that is not always possible. I will place the > call, and let them know I support Bush, > Kasey > I'm feeling some antagonism in your response and I'm not sure why.....You quoted me so I take it your comment was addressed to me. I'm glad that you will place your call. That's why I wrote my email to begin with, to encourage anyone on the list who supports the war. It is democracy in action. I can fiercely defend the right without fighting. By being a citizen who participates in democratic and political processes and who speaks for a diversity of views and fully supports the expression of those views with the conviction of my belief in democracy, I feel that I am fiercely defending that right. By doing what I can in my work to lobby for media diversity, I'm defending that right. It's not fierce by its action; it's fierce by its conviction. I believe in democracy. I agree that some people cannot be talked with. I am not anti-war. However this war is NOT a defense of democracy. It is about domination. If you doubt that, read the "Defense Planning for Guidance" documents produced by the Office of the Secretary of Defense in 1992 (Cheney) and 2002 (Rumsfeld - basically Cheney by proxy) and the "Defense Strategy for the 1990's" also written by Cheney. I also recommend reading Rumsfeld's "Transforming the Military" published in the May/June issue of Foreign Affairs. This war is not another front in the war on terrorism; it is the culmination of a plan many years old. And as some Senate members asked this week during their remarks on the resolution, how are we going to pay for this war? In his radio address, President Bush pledged US support for rebuilding Iraq after a conflict. Nevermind the fact that he ran on a platform of not engaging in nation building - something that I know my fellow Republicans in my district considered important, how are we going to pay for this rebuilding after Saddam is gone? What will this mean for our relationships with our allies? Will we lose the support of countries (like Egypt) which have been critical in the war on terrorism? Are we giving nations with which we have tenuous relations at best (like China) or with which we've had hostile relations in the near past (like Russia) an issue on which to unite against us? Will most of the free world think that we are the bully on the block who needs to be stopped? Our President is taking a position that is not only in opposition to the UN security council (and permanent members China, Russia and France) but also undermines the UN generally. As I hear from my friends in Washington, even the multilateralists in the Bush administration think that this is unwise. What do you mean "a weekend of love and peace?" If you're talking about the fest, I didn't go, so I'm not sure what that has to do with what I wrote or the war on Iraq. This is not simply an issue of war or peace and I don't see how it can be reduced to those terms. Especially when the balance and security of a volatile region of the world (and the lives of millions of people who live there) are at stake. Our national security is dependent upon global security. Will a war in Iraq destabilize the region and thereby lead to reduced global security? Until the answer to that question is no, I'm against it - not because I'm a peacenik, but because I'm a pragmatist. Brenda n.p.: Dexter Gordon - "Darn That Dream" - ------------------------------ Coincidence is God's way of remaining anonymous. Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos, & more faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 18:42:54 +0100 From: colin Subject: Re: the war within(njc) If we truly want peace, the place to start is within ourselves. The reason we don't have peace is because we use violent means to try and make others peaceful. (that and forcing our world view on others) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 13:45:50 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: the war within(njc) > If we truly want peace, the place to start is within ourselves. > The reason we don't have peace is because we use violent means to try and make > others peaceful. > (that and forcing our world view on others) I heard an excerpt from an India Arie interview this morning. I met her a couple of times in Atlanta before she became a big star. I think she is so down to earth. But I really like this quote below and think it so true...everything begins within ourselves... "But, I've drawn a conclusion, it's all and illusion confusions the name of the game A misconception, a vast deception Something's gotta change Don't be offended this is all my opinion ain't nothing that I'm sayin law This is a true confession of a life learned lesson I was sent here to share wit ya'll So get in where you fit in go on and shine Free your mind, nows the time Put your salt on the shelf Go head and love yourself Cuz everything's gonna be all right" from India Arie "Video" NP: India Arie "Brown Skin" - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 14:07:45 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: October 6 (njc) Darice writes: << Since I never registered with the Birthday Fairy, I will say Happy Birthday to myself today. >> Happy birthday, Darice! You must still be thrilled from your trip to the LA house of Blues and the Joni sighting. As far as birthday announcements go, it is unclear whether the Birthday Fairy is still on the job. I think I half remember a post in which he resigned. Jimmy, the Deputy BF, does not want the job, and I, the Birthday Gnome (just a temp!), am not interested in the job because the pay sucks! Catherine McCay suggest that we all announce our own birthdays, as you have done, Darice. Unless someone flies forward to fill Wally's gossamer wings, I think we should make our own announcements -- or avoid the subject all together! -- depending upon how we feel when our birthdays roll around. (I am not looking forward to my next one, but the alternative -- death -- is even more unacceptable!) Have a great day, --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 14:12:05 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: October 6 (njc) Happy Birthday Darice!!! ~rose in nj heading on out to see BS ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 14:24:01 EDT From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Still Vital After All These Years Frank writes: << I just don't understand why she chose to record the covers and release them on album. >> Great post, Frank! As for why Joni recorded the first album of covers (BSN), the wise-ass answer is . . . because she could! But I also think that Joni is at least intrigued, and maybe even delighted, by the way her voice sounds now. Herbie Hancock, the Chieftains and others certainly like her grown-up, cigarette voice and seek her out to cover her own work and songs other people wrote. I love the way her voice sounds now, and I hope she keeps singing even if she never writes another song. (Although I am sure she will continue to write. I have faith!) I love the way you closed your post, Frank: << But, if she doesn't make any new music, the music she has made in the last 30 years will get me through the next 30. >> And I agree! --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 19:42:25 +0100 From: colin Subject: Race NJC We had a wonderful day today. Spent the day with a lot of Afghans and other middle easterns. We took Kevin, one of my Lhasa Apso, and Tilly, my mini longhaired dachs. they thouroughly enjoyed themselves. They had a good sniff of the Afghans and others but didn't find anything wrong with them at all. Yes, this was at a race track and the Afghans etc were there to race. Tilly had 3 races with a Pomeranian. She has a good time and went like a bomb. Kevin had to race on his own in case the Afghans etc thought he was the 'hare'. Anywa, Kevin couldn't get enough of it. He got very worked up and just pelted hell for leather along after the hare. unlike all the others who raced along the track, Kevin used his brain and got up where the hare was and ran right ebhind it. It was a hoot and the crowds thought my two were hilarious. definately going again. - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80,Creation 6 colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 14:54:11 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Diana Krall/Michael Brecker/James Taylor > **I would like to read a review of DK's cover from others including our > Kover King** > You rang? ;~) What's to say about this one that hasn't been said? Diana does a SUPERB job of taking one of Joni's signature songs and making it her own. The first time I heard it was when I was watching the TNT tribute with my son, and I had been teary-eyed on and off the whole time. Well, this one really opened up the floodgates! Diana totally invests herself emotionally into it. One of the great ones! Bob NP: Danzig & Wooley, "The Priest" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 11:58:41 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: calling all guitarists (njc) I'm making a compilation CD or some of the guitar pieces I enjoy. There are three that are so difficult that they seem almost incomprehensible to me. So, what are your top 3 most difficult/challenging guitar pieces? 1. Stream - Tim Reynolds 2. First Ride - Don Ross 3. We the People - Ellen McIlwaine. Some of my other favorites are: Nice Feeling - Pierre Bensusan Solo Flight - Patty Larkin Little Martha - Greg Allman (Allman Brothers) Mood for a Day - Steve Howe (Yes) Rickover's Dream - Michael Hedges I've probably missed a bunch, but those are some of them anyway. btw, does anyone have the chords/tab for Greg Greenway's Free At Last? Thanks! lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:46:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: war and peace and the jmdl (njc) I posted this off list to Kasey initially and I have decided to post it to the "big" list too, for reasons which I hope become obvious as you read. Mostly I want to raise awareness or a reminder or something to that effect, what this list has come to mean to me and to the countless others whose lives are truly touched, changed, altered, affected by the community of loving souls who join hearts and hands with a view to living into the place of peace and love we often philosophize about. This is in no way meant to be disrespectful to Kasey either. I feel that she may be grappling with her opinions which have been informed by her world, her experience(s) which are different than mine perhaps, and yet no less important to her as she struggles to see other's ideas, visions, wisdom. here is what i wrote to Kasey off list: in my opinion, the world didnt get worse after the 60's .. the world has been at war or potentialy at war for many, many years before that.Love has been around, as part of human life for longer than we know. the powerful element about love is that it fortifies us as people, as humans who care, individually and together, as a community . You may not realize how much the jmdlers reach out to one another all in the name of love and peace and help those in need financially, spiritually, and through physical need for those who have faced serious illness. It is the unfailing, repeated, giving for the sake of giving that i have shared in, felt, been a part of, been on the receiving end of that is evidence enough for me that love and peace can and do work in this world. The friendships and relationships formed here are life altering. They just are. Violence and war are not the only part of life/ the world today..just because the media chooses to flaunt it, does not mean it is all there is or should be. Just because we havent found a way with peace prevailing does not mean we should stop looking or hoping to find that way. I still believe in peace as the alternative way. Love is a healer on small scales as well as big ones. And if we as a community live into that notion of love, and choose loving peaceable ways, in small ways, then, much like the ripples in water where even the tiniest stone has fallen, the effects move out from the centre and are long lasting. they become part of that main stream within which we all thrive. Mags, always seeking peace and love. ===== You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 15:50:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Race NJC --- colin wrote: > We had a wonderful day today. Spent the day with a > lot of Afghans and > other middle easterns. > We took Kevin, one of my Lhasa Apso, and Tilly, my > mini longhaired > dachs. they thouroughly enjoyed themselves. Colin, you crack me up. Even though you've talked about your dogs many times, I always think you're talking about people at first - then I start to wonder just what kind of weird people you're hanging out with! ===== Catherine Toronto ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 13:05:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Susan Guzzi Subject: Re:All Hands on Deck: Iraq vote Imminent - 800 number to the Capitol (NJC!) First of all I want to thank the Simpson family for the air that I breathe! You know very little about what you speak Kasey. You know nothing about my family history or 800 other people here and their families or lineage. Your bourgeouisie attitutde astounds me. You need to take that deep breath, cause for me, it means not rushing into a tirade that I know nothing about, but taking the time to try and articulate an opinion. Of which I have said here often, I may not be the best at articulating, but it doesn't make my opinion wrong. You are very naive, Kasey, speaking of my being childish, which I think you are indeed being here. For myself, I call it being passionate about, peace, love, TOLERANCE, understanding and HUMANITY! I feel sorry you, you have all this hate and anger and venom inside you. Why, if people would like to try and find a better way ... a more humane solution, should this tick you off so? Unless you yourself are a bitter, violent warmonger? I for one want to thank Victor for his sweet sentiment full of hope. Yes we may be dreamers, but we're not the only ones. I think you're gonna find that out here. And Vince, my dear fellow White Sox fan and friend, thank you for your much more knowledgeable and controlled response than i am able to give at this point. But of course I will choose to talk and argue it out here rather than resort to less civilzed means. Many thanks to my sisters, Mags and Anne, for their beautiful and again much more controlled posts as well. How can it be so wrong to continue to try for a peaceful nonviolent solution? One war is won and another is always on the horizon. Violence begets violence. It hasn't really worked throughout history. Why not give peace a chance? It may be in the end that action was or is needed, but we can always keep working towards peace. I have tried to be calmer about this Kasey. I am trying not to make it personal ... that's more your style, I see. You came out swinging and getting personal with me and my friends here. So just know there was plenty I did not send in this post, I feel you needed that verbal spanking. But for the sake of my family here, I will not let that happen. And there are many different kinds of patriots Kasey. Questioning authority is not a sin. Finally, the words of JFK: We are not here to curse the darknessm but to light the candle that can guide us through the darkness to a sane and safer future. (This one I may be paraphrasing a bit) Some people see things as they are and ask why, I see things as they could be and ask - why not? Peace Susan Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 17:31:22 -0700 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: October 6 (njc) HAPPY BIRTHDAY Darice! Libras rule!!!!!! By the way, India Arie is a Libra as well... Victor, back from intense scrabble games... - --- Victor Johnson - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com "Roses wait for the springtime, They sleep beneath the ground. They hear March winds a callin' For the sun to come around."vlj Visit http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 19:44:18 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Still Vital After All These Years **The first time I heard Joni sing Both Sides Now was Atlanta in 1998. It was a moment I will never forget. ** Thanks for a great post Frank! I'm glad to see someone else puts "Gorilla" up there as one of JT's best. Like Joni, he did some incredible work in the decade, and Gorilla (and In The Pocket) hold their own with his best imo. I was also there when Joni came out that night in Atlanta and started into BSN. It was a very emotional moment because we had all been communicating about the tour and I knew this was not one she had done before. Of course, the fact that it was also her birthday, and the fact that we got to meet her later made it an unbelievable evening of a lifetime! Thanks for sharing your thoughts on Joni's path, not always where some of us would have her go but why should she start doing that now? ;~) Bob NP: Jack Nielsen, "Blue Boy" (speaking of unbelievable!!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 19:55:50 -0400 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: Kennedy also said this: NJC "This nation is prepared to present its case against the Soviet threat to peace, and our own proposals for a peaceful world, at any time and in any forum -in the Organization of American States, in the United Nations,or in any other meeting that could be useful-WITHOUT LIMITING OUR FREEDOM OF ACTION." John Kennedy..Cuban Missile Crisis...1962 Like Kennedy, Bush went before the U.N. ......like Kennedy, we will take action whether Russia, China, France is aboard or not. I look at it as great if they join us...or get out of the way!! Bush is making his case tomorrow night from my fare city, Cincinnati. (Cincinnati being the representative of the heartland) Reading the newspapers today I see where this speech will give us some cold hard facts, I'm hoping this is the case. I do not believe Bush is pushing this for payback..avenging his father. Nor do I believe it is for oil....ego... or because of the shaking economy....for purposes of boosting the Dow a little. No..I think there is probably a very real, CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER. I think Bush is an honorable man...you may not like his politics but I have no doubts about his truthfulness. His veracity I do not question. Do I think we should follow a president blindly? Absolutely not!! But at the same time I think that there are times we need to unite and give our support. At least give a listen. Anyone that knows me knows how much I love Joni Mitchell!! I put on Woodstock sometimes and just get the most peaceful..loving thoughts....I lose track of time..space. her music just does this to me. The sentiments of Woodstock are glorious........but Joni said she DREAMED she saw the bombers turn into butterflies. But then I see that evil madman's face.....that gassed his own people. Who takes pleasure and watching the suffering of others. His former mistress told of his pleasure in watching people blindfolded, hands tied behind their backs..lined up before a firing squad. This is how he got his jollies in the evening watching the days events on video. There is a thing in this world that sometimes we just have to come up against...and turning the other cheek will not work: PURE RAW EVIL! I don't know if Saddam has the capabilities NOW to do major harm to us? The big question is do we have time to wait and find out? Bree _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 20:14:15 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Counting Crows BYT Cover Shit I missed sweet sixteen sometime. Was that a hand out I missed at the NE Fest or was this the Mini Fest last week?? Love Paz on 10/4/02 9:12 AM, Cynthia Vickery at cvickery@danielrealty.com wrote: > > and now me - > if you haven't already begged or cajoled Bob for his "Sweet 16" > covers compilation, do so immediately!!!! > > bob - you truly outdid yourself with this one!! > > > cindy ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 20:46:02 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Graham show - Joni and related content - LONG Kakki As usual thanks for the report. I was waiting around the other evening martini shaker in hand and ready to chat on the phone with you and Darice. You better start doing some good drugs so that you are not so tired. May I suggest my latest concoction of Geritol and Red Bull with a Twist. It's kind of a old mans speed ball. Love Michael on 10/3/02 7:21 PM, kakki at kakkib@vzavenue.net wrote: > I'm still exhausted but will try to hit some of the high points. It really Met some other interesting people and Darice will have > more to tell. It was really, really fun for these old girls ;-) > > Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 20:54:55 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: October 6 (njc) Happy Fecking Birthday girl. Glad you treated yourself to some good company this weekend and music and I wish I could have been there partying with ya'll. Love Paz on 10/6/02 8:57 AM, darice murray-mckay at darice@mindspring.com wrote: > Since I never registered with the Birthday Fairy, I will say Happy Birthday to > myself today. > The short trip to LA was the best brithday present I have had in years. > Darice ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 22:26:40 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC Sweet 16 & Pazfest **Shit I missed sweet sixteen sometime. Was that a hand out I missed at the NE Fest or was this the Mini Fest last week??** Well, we were listening to it and passing it around during *daylight* hours, maybe that's how you missed out. But have no fear, just keep an eye on that mailbox. I've been digging Pazfest ALL weekend long! Such good, good music...and I love how Beth Patterson refers to you as "Michael Michael, love cycle"...sorta like an earlier incarnation of the "Lord of Masculinity"! :~) Anyway, I was cleaning the house yesterday, and thanks to Pazfest (cranked WAY up) I not only got it all done, I was totally enjoying myself. Except when the MIGHTY 11:11 electrified Hejira came on, then I had to stop and just absorb it. One of the more truly magical musical moments I've ever heard. When do we get the David Lahm & Jason Marsalis? I'm lovin' this 2-cd masterpiece, but after all you know I'm a slut and a greedy bastard! :~D Bob ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #410 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she? (http://www.siquomb.com/siquomb.cfm)