From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #257 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Sunday, June 16 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 257 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RT: 35 yrs in the biz [was Bowie & future] NJC [dsk ] Mac or PC for photos?, njc ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Re: Bowie and the future NJC (long) [Catherine McKay ] Re: Sad News for Weather Channel addicts (NJC) ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: down to you-njc ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: Mac or PC for photos?, njc [Jerry Notaro ] Re: joni songs, anyone? ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: Exes walking off (NJC) [Mags N Brei ] Re: joni songs, anyone? njc [Mags N Brei ] Re: Mac or PC for photos?, njc [dsk ] Re: down to you-njc ["mack watson-bush" ] alittle jc--- [LuvnMyWrld@aol.com] Re: Joni & touring [dsk ] Re: Joni & touring [AzeemAK@aol.com] [none] ["mack watson-bush" ] sorry ["mack watson-bush" ] Father's Day, njc ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" ] Re: Father's Day, njc [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: Joni & touring ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: Father's Day, njc [Mags N Brei ] You want a Father's day story? NJC NJC [Vince Lavieri ] re: Moon At the Window's first verse [BigWaltinSF@aol.com] Re: Moon At the Window's first verse ["Mark or Travis" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 03:46:09 -0400 From: dsk Subject: RT: 35 yrs in the biz [was Bowie & future] NJC Kate Bennett wrote: > > Azeem wrote "This reminds me that Richard Thompson has said several times that > playing live is how he makes his living; he barely makes a bean from records/CDs. > > hopefully he made some money from his song dimming of the day that bonnie > raitt recorded & which was recently in the sound track to divine secrets of > the ya ya sisterhood...at this point in his life with his amazing talent & > reputation, he is so very deserving of this! Several people have covered Dimming of the Day (Bonnie's is very nice, soulful) and RT's said he does make some money from songwriting. The version used in Ya Ya Sisterhood is the original Richard and Linda Thompson one with strings added, for some mysterious reason. It's a T Bone Burnett soundtrack so probably everyone connected with it is hoping it sells as well as his "O Brother" soundtrack did. Richard Thompson writes to the RTlist through a list member, Flip, who forwards questions from the list to RT and then forwards to the list what RT has to say. It's great reading his messages and at the same time knowing we can talk freely on the list. (Wouldn't it be fun if Joni "talked" to us that way once in a while? Remember that list of questions we all came up with a while ago?) Anyway, starting with Fairport Convention, this is RT's 35th year in the music business and he recently had some pointed things to say about it. In an earlier answer-and-question time he'd briefly mentioned that he didn't own any of his cds and had never made much money from them, which made people very curious, so he responded with this fuller explanation. Some of it has been talked about here, especially the radio situation, but I find it fascinating to get direct info from someone who's in the middle of it all. Flip has posted RT's response on his "Completists" website: http://people.zeelandnet.nl/flipfeij/interviews.6.htm RT even has a bit to say about the World Cup and cricket, which he loves. Yeah, I just have to say it... What a guy!!! Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 09:52:08 +0000 From: "Mike Pritchard" Subject: eating in barcelona NJC Here's a brief outline of where to eat in Barcelona if you have mind to come here. Bon profit! http://www.observer.co.uk/travel/story/0,6903,738145,00.html mike, looking for his VISA card... NP PMG - still life - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 06:13:27 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Mac or PC for photos?, njc Hey Paz, If I buy a Mac will you buy a turntable? :) After my 30 month old monitor died, and my PC won't accept memory in one of its sockets, I'm tempted to change sides. I don't know any happy photographers using PCs and conversely, don't know any UN happy photographers who are Mac users. I'm beginning to think I have an opportunity to make myself happy with my computer for a change. What a concept. Of course, I would have to figure out HOW to be happy but..... I'm willing to learn! What say ye all? Claud9? Mac or PC for Photoshop, CD-R burning, email and surfing? Lamadoo ps, Does anyone know complete details about Photoshop Elements? Like can I change the color balance of the shadows separately from the midtones like I can in 5.5? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 07:36:21 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Bowie and the future NJC (short) One thought I had was remembering how people said that books would no longer exist because they would be read on computers. That's a good & valid point, Debra. I've heard the same things, insert your own noun (books, newspapers, now movies) that "won't exist anymore because of computers. The simple truth is that even today only about 50-60% of the population has computers, and that number isn't growing very quickly at this point. Of that number, even a smaller portion are so into it that they are into all of the downloading/burning aspects. Will there be changes? Surely. Will CD's stop being sold as we know it? Not for a LONG while. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 11:01:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Off key, on purpose? - --- blckcrow@chorus.net wrote: > Whatever innovations with harmony she she may > or may not be undertaking in the song are > irrelevant, to my mind. Flat is flat--and this note > is *flat.* > > Am I getting a little peevish here, or what??! ;-) > > The note in "Peoples' Parties" has always surprised > me, precisely because, as I would be the first to > point out, Joni's sense of pitch is usually so good. > As is, may I say with the proper amount of modesty, > my own. My problem is, I can't find my "Court & Spark" - whether I've just misplaced it, or the ex snaffled it, I'm not sure - he's not a big Joni fan and, as far as I know, the only one he really liked is "Both Sides Now" (the album, not the song.) So I can't even give it a new listen. However, I don't recall this being off-key - it never struck me as such. A bit odd maybe, because the end of that song blends in to the beginning of the next. There's a chord beginning the next track that works as a sort of modulating chord as "away" dies... away. Must go and find my copy of C&S... ______________________________________________________________________ Post your ad for free now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 11:08:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Bowie and the future NJC (long) > Kate Bennett wrote: > > > > I think its a great time to be an independent > artist, though it takes a lot > > of work. On the other hand there is so much > corporate consolidation going > > on, such as clear channel radio buying up radio > stations around the country > > and also performance venues. - --- dsk wrote: > Yes, but I think they'll do themselves in eventually > because no one will > pay any attention to their products, so, like a > chain store that expands > too much, too quickly, they'll collapse. Or be so > cumbersome the indies > can do an end run around them. I hope you're right - that's my feeling and my wish too, but what do I know? Was it Azeem who said that David Bowie makes most of his money from live appearances? And yet, didn't Joni say that touring actually COSTS her money? How does that work? I know there's more to it than the star's salary - there's the band (and the roadies); there's any special effects (a la Pink Floyd). What else? Somehow I imagine a Bowie show costing more than Joni one, so what's up with that? ______________________________________________________________________ Post your ad for free now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 11:23:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Bowie and the future NJC (short) - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > I've heard the > same things, insert your > own noun (books, newspapers, now movies) that "won't > exist anymore because of > computers. > The simple truth is that even today only about > 50-60% of the population has > computers, and that number isn't growing very > quickly at this point. Of that > number, even a smaller portion are so into it that > they are into all of the > downloading/burning aspects. > Will there be changes? Surely. Will CD's stop being > sold as we know it? Not > for a LONG while. > First of all, remember the paperless office? Ha!!! As a person who got into downloading music and burning CDs for a while (I'm over that now), I can tell you that my preference is to get the whole package, even if I pay for it. Somehow having the CD without having the inserts (esp. the ones that have the lyrics printed on them and so on) is kind of like getting the Readers Digest version of a novel - it just ain't complete. The price of these things is pretty steep, but then you have to compare it to other things - when you could pick up an LP for $5, for example, how much money were you making? Is forking out $20 (that's Canadian, I know it's cheaper in the US) a week for a CD, for example, a luxury? You can buy a couple of movie tickets, or maybe 3 on a matinee, for the same price. Honestly, I don't remember how that compares to, say, 20 years ago. All I know is, I'm making a lot more money than I did 20 years ago, but yet, I have less. What's my point? I had one when I started, but my kids are arguing with one another, and now I've lost it and it's time to bang some heads together. ______________________________________________________________________ Post your ad for free now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 11:48:23 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: Bowie and the future NJC (long) In a message dated 16/06/02 16:08:39 GMT Daylight Time, anima_rising@yahoo.ca writes: << Was it Azeem who said that David Bowie makes most of his money from live appearances? And yet, didn't Joni say that touring actually COSTS her money? How does that work? I know there's more to it than the star's salary - there's the band (and the roadies); there's any special effects (a la Pink Floyd). What else? Somehow I imagine a Bowie show costing more than Joni one, so what's up with that? >> Not Bowie, Catherine, but Richard Thompson - a very different kettle of fish! I think RT was particularly referring to his solo tours, where obviously overheads are low and the shows invariably sell out. Bowie tours must cost a fortune to put on - all the ones I've seen have involved a lot of stage lighting and sets, large bands, etc etc. It's true, too that RT will do OK from royalties, as quite a few of his songs have been covered, not just Dimming of the Day. About time some crappy Hollywood film uses one of his songs and makes him a mint. By the way, I was struggling to find a short "six degrees" route from Bowie to RT; I can do it in one step, but it's not easy! Any takers? Azeem in London NP: yet more sport - having watched Ireland's oh-so-close defeat (on penalties) by Spain, and Tim Henman's oh-so-predictable defeat by Lleyton Hewitt, I'm now on to the England v Sri Lanka in the cricket. What a veg! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 11:29:16 -0500 From: Subject: Exes walking off (NJC) Catherine writes: "My problem is, I can't find my "Court & Spark" - whether I've just misplaced it, or the ex snaffled it, I'm not sure - he's not a big Joni fan and, as far as I know, the only one he really liked is "Both Sides Now" (the album, not the song.)" Hmmm . . . (grinning wickedly): this could turn into a whole new thread, if we haven't already been there, and we may have. What favorite CD, vinyl, or tape did *your* ex walk off with--and exactly how did you get it back?? ;-) Mary P. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:04:30 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: Sad News for Weather Channel addicts (NJC) Kakki wrote: > Fellow addict, too, since its inception. Count me in. They have turned weather forecasting into a science all their own. Love the program and especially when Bill is forecasting. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 09:58:04 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: was Bowie and the future now Joni & touring > << Was it Azeem who said that David Bowie makes most of his money from live > appearances? And yet, didn't Joni say that touring actually COSTS her money? > How does that work? I know there's more to it than the star's salary - > there's the band (and the roadies); there's any special effects (a la Pink > Floyd). What else? Somehow I imagine a Bowie show costing more than Joni one, > so what's up with that? >> > > Not Bowie, Catherine, but Richard Thompson - a very different kettle of fish! > I think RT was particularly referring to his solo tours, where obviously > overheads are low and the shows invariably sell out. Hasn't RT stayed in circulation pretty much throughout his career as far as live performance is concerned? That's the feeling I'm getting from reading the interview that Debra so kindly posted the URL for. I would guess that he books into relatively small, more intimate venues and since he has a following that are used to seeing him on a fairly regular basis, as Azeem says, he sells these venues out. His fans get to see him often enough to keep them interested. Joni, on the other hand, hardly ever tours and when she does she's usually booked into large venues that don't do anything to enhance her style of music and performance. Therefore the costs are higher and when the venues don't sell out it ends up costing her. Her more recent touring was limited and in 98 she hooked up with Dylan and Van Morrison and as much as I love Joni, I know that it was Bob & Van that sold those concerts out, not Joni. The BSN tour was very limited as far cities played was concerned. Concord looked like it was pretty full when she was there. Did she sell out the other venues she played on the BSN tour? I think what it boils down to is that Joni doesn't like to tour. I'm not sure why she gets booked into the large arenas when she does tour. Maybe the accommodations and perks are better than what she'd get in smaller theatres and clubs and she's too used to her 'clean white linen and her fancy French cologne' so to speak. I think she would be much happier performing in a venue like what she designed for the PWWAM taping. She always seems more relaxed and open in an intimate setting. If she had a place like that to perform every now and then, could do a show and then go home afterwards I think she'd be perfectly happy with it. Of course, that doesn't give her exposure to anybody but the LA audiences. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:07:54 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Next year njc Sorry you guys but the Mavs are going to win next year. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:10:51 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: down to you-njc Never thought of it that way Kate. Thanks for the input. I have delved into a part of my shadow this week and though, at times, it has been a frighening expericence, overall I enjoyed it. mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:19:17 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Mac or PC for photos?, njc "Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)" wrote: > > What say ye all? Mac or PC for Photoshop, CD-R burning, email and > surfing? If you try Mac, you'll never go back! Jerry np: Ella Fitzgerald - Someone to Watch Over Me Happy Father's Day Jerry, still searching for his daddy ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:23:29 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: joni songs, anyone? Joni a bore? Surely it is about somebody else or Miss Simon is a jealous > type...and with good reason. Joni looks blows most peoples out of the > water. Just an opinion. > > Cat Joni a bore? I don't know her but her musical legacy is surely not boring. Guess it depends on whose being bored or not being bored. Subjective. As a matter of fact, where is Hell? Have never found Joni to be particularly attractive physically. Carly, on the other hand, is, in my opinion, very alluring and provocative in her looks so much so that when I watched her profile on one of those biography type stations I was pretty surprised at her background. She is very easy to look at and to listen to. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:23:33 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: joni songs, anyone? Joni a bore? Surely it is about somebody else or Miss Simon is a jealous > type...and with good reason. Joni looks blows most peoples out of the > water. Just an opinion. > > Cat Joni a bore? I don't know her but her musical legacy is surely not boring. Guess it depends on whose being bored or not being bored. Subjective. As a matter of fact, where is Hell? Have never found Joni to be particularly attractive physically. Carly, on the other hand, is, in my opinion, very alluring and provocative in her looks so much so that when I watched her profile on one of those biography type stations I was pretty surprised at her background. She is very easy to look at and to listen to. Mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 10:20:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Exes walking off (NJC) > our wonderful writerly Mary ponders: > > < thread, if we haven't already been there, and we may have. > > What favorite CD, vinyl, or tape did *your* ex walk off with--and > exactly how did you get it back?? ;-)>> Reminds me of the story I told here a couple of years ago Mary. My ex kept ALL of my CDs and vinyl...(I was the one who walked out, with two year old Mimi on my hip, her diaper bag, a suitcase in the other hand, and that's it). My great escape, a journey of two thousand miles brought us back to Ontario. I didn't really care at the time about the 'things' I left... the good news was that we got away, we left with something much more precious. The only albums I ever saw again were Joni's, Blue, Court and Spark, Ladies of the Canyon and Clouds. That's all I was allowed to own because he absolutely couldnt stand Joni Mitchell. Imagine that. No bloody wonder I left. (that could segue nicely into another thread about partners who don't like Joni). Miranda brought my Joni albums back from her father's two years ago as an incredible Mother's Day surprise. I have NO idea how she got away with it. I was so totally blown away, I couldn't speak. She had them wrapped in one of my favourite scarves, inside my Dad's typewriter case so I had no clue what they were. Imagine my shock after oh...well..too many years for me to remember now since I'd last seen them. Big surprise, I burst into tears.It was like finding your dearest long lost friend. Because of all the miles and miles that Joni's music had seen me through, Miranda understood that. It was a gesture full of grace, the most thoughtful thing she could have done for me. Wise woman that Miranda. What can I say..the girl's got chutzpah. And then some. Mags np: In Your Eyes, Peter Gabriel ===== You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 10:27:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: joni songs, anyone? njc - --- mack watson-bush wrote: > > < particularly > attractive physically. >>> umm Mack. Have you checked out the inside cover of For The Roses lately? ;-) Mags ===== You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:54:44 -0400 From: dsk Subject: Re: Mac or PC for photos?, njc "Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)" wrote: > > What say ye all? Claud9? Mac or PC for Photoshop, CD-R burning, email and > surfing? Mac definitely! The new ones especially are made for multi-media, and very efficient about it compared to pcs. A friend recently bought one of the early iMacs for his son, and has ended up using it himself to do editing. He's been pleasantly surprised at how powerful that relatively inexpensive machine is. I expect his son will be getting another one. PCs I use for design work in offices are noisy and freezing all the time and really not happy doing much of anything, and especially not anything with images. My Mac at home just keeps impressing me. It's 4 years old, ancient for a computer, and I recently added more memory and a card to give me USB and firewire ports and can now add any of the newer peripherals. In other words, Macs are easily expandable and upgradeable and they just keep chugging along. > ps, Does anyone know complete details about Photoshop Elements? Like can I > change the color balance of the shadows separately from the midtones like I > can in 5.5? Yes, you can. Check this for details: http://www.adobe.com/web/tips/phselcolorcor/page2.html Debra Shea NP: Kirsty MacColl's Mambo de la Luna from Tropical Brainstorm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:24:28 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: down to you-njc > frighening expericence, typo alert. sorry. mack ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 14:22:02 EDT From: LuvnMyWrld@aol.com Subject: alittle jc--- Ok---don't laugh..... I want to buy a guitar...and learn....:) Maybe we can teach this 30 something dog a new trick....I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a first guitar?????? Brand, style....etc...and BTW...what kind of guitar does Joni play with most generally? Blessings and Peace, Kelly (the redhead from "Detroit") ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 14:27:29 -0400 From: dsk Subject: Re: Joni & touring Mark or Travis wrote: > > I think she would be much happier > performing in a venue like what she designed for the PWWAM taping. She > always seems more relaxed and open in an intimate setting. If she had a > place like that to perform every now and then, could do a show and then go > home afterwards I think she'd be perfectly happy with it. Of course, that > doesn't give her exposure to anybody but the LA audiences. What a wonderful idea! It would be like seeing her at Fez. If she did it routinely, even just once a month, people would buy tickets way in advance and plan an LA trip around seeing her in such a setting. I know I would. Such concerts would need to be simply done to make them cost-effective and easily arranged and for now she's going in the opposite direction. Another thing Richard Thompson has talked about is that he's had to figure out how to use only his acoustic guitar to get across all the parts a band played in his studio recordings, so it's still a full sound. If he can't do that with a song, he doesn't play it on a solo tour. His almost-constant solo touring really is his bread and butter and, as Mark suggested, is one reason he has so many dedicated fans. And he says he enjoys such up close and personal performing. I imagine Joni would, too, especially if it was an easy drive home. Hasn't she mentioned how much she enjoyed playing to small audiences? After the orchestra thing plays out, maybe that will be next. I hope so. Debra Shea NP: Still Kirsty, "Nao Experando" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 14:35:25 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni & touring In a message dated 16/06/02 19:27:38 GMT Daylight Time, dsk11@bellatlantic.net writes: << I imagine Joni would, too, especially if it was an easy drive home. Hasn't she mentioned how much she enjoyed playing to small audiences? After the orchestra thing plays out, maybe that will be next. I hope so. >> Please God, let the orchestra thing play itself out as soon as possible! I reckon - and I know this will sound heretical - that another move that might work well would be for Joni to find some fab guitarist who can play in Joni-style (styles, in fact), so that she can concentrate on singing when performing live. She sounds like a different person when she ditches the guitar on PWWAM. For all that I am in awe of her playing, it seems that with her voice fragile and less flexible than before, the distraction of playing simultaneously, especially given that her playing is so complex, is one distraction too many. Azeem in London NP: Shawn Colvin - Wichita Skyline, merging into Round Of Blues, from a superlative live compilation, for which I have Catherine Turley to thank - thanks again, Catherine! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:50:38 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: [none] Donna Binkley told me a while back that a road trip was needed so with that advice I headed off, again, to see what I could see. Drove by Fairy, Tx. Didn't know that existed. I thought about Bob and smiled and then dreamed about a fairy fest in fairy, tx. The weather this spring in Central Texas has been beautiful and has yet to become so hot as to be burdensome. Driving through the hills of Texas with Janis, on full volume, was wonderful. Arrived in Austin and decided to see what music and fun I could find on 6th Street. It was Friday night and it was crowded. The parking was practically non-existent and had to walk 7 or 8 blocks after finally finding a place. Too many preppies for my tastes and the area seems to have lost most, if not all, of that bohemian spirit I had long heard and read about. Still, every once in a while, one can get a taste of it. I traversed the streets and listened outside to the different groups performing, hoping one would catch my ear. There were many really heavy rock and roll bands playing, one so loud that the entire building was shaking as I stood there. Thought of Rosalie at that point and wished she was there as she likes that kind of thing. Finally, spied a small joint that stated no cover and that a blues band would be performing there later. Sounded good to me so entered and found a table in the corner. Piped blues were playing and after a couple of beers I was feeling pretty at home, especially with the graffiti laden walls and laid back ambience of the place. Dreamed that Janis would soon walk in. The performer was touted, by the outside sign, as John McVie. Had never heard of him. Saw a poster inside that read the name as John McVay. He started about an hour later. Pretty good they were with some good guitar playing. I enjoyed it for 30 minutes or so but not being a big fan of just guitar playing I waited for the bluesy vocals. Never came. Not what I would call blues. I am sure the knowledge base here knows more about him than I do. Great to hear him anyway. Then went in search for something more to what I was looking for but didn't find it. Did find that somehow I had lost all of my money while there on the streets. Don't know if pocket picked or what. Pretty disconcerting. Never has happened to me before. The next day while driving to East Texas, beautiful scenery, picked up a radio station. Pretty interesting to place the radio on scan, while driving through different areas, to see what one can find. This station was interviewing two musicians, whose names I can't remember. They were alternately performing. Kind of hillbilly but down home music. At first pretty impressed as the first one had a Nanci Griffith kind of style but he couldn't keep it up. Overall though, they were not half bad. The two said they had the No. 1 record in Denmark and they were performing somewhere close that night. The other then sang and said his album was called "Just Like This Train." I waited anxiously for a Joni mention but none came. I wondered if he thought he was original. East Texas is really beautiful. Had never been there before. Had planned on going to Port Arthur for the Janis memorial but not having any pocket money didn't think that was frugal so decided to come home. Lake Livingston is massive and longed to be on one of the boats way out in the middle of it. Got lost in the dark outside Waco while traveling home and spent hours trying to find my way out of the darkness. Thought about stopping for directions but couldn't do it. Don't they call that a man thing? Almost otherworldly, I drove on and felt as if I had fallen into the Twilight Zone. Occasionally, would see another car but they didn't have any people inside of them. Finally, out of the maze and home, just as a hugh thunderstorm hit. Great to go but great to come home too. Didn't hear one tune from Joni on the radio through all those hours on the road. mack mack watson-bush ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 14:05:31 -0500 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: sorry Sorry for the no joni content on that last one folks. mack watson-bush ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 15:22:00 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" Subject: Father's Day, njc Today is the day that Americans remember fathers. This came together today: My father's father taught him to sail. When my grandfather passed, my Dad inhereted a little of grandpa's money so he (now get this.....) bought a sailboat. Dad taught all four of his children to sail. Dad didn't see his older brother for decades at a time. After a particularly long stretch, when Uncle John turned about 75, John was back east visiting from California. My Dad drove 10 hours to spend two hours with him on Long Island, in their hometown. They went down to the public dock and looked at boats. Marinas have a sound. Wind will slap the vertical ropes (halyards) against aluminum masts, making a halting, semi-rhythmic tapping, a little like wind chimes. A little like a memory. Within a year, John was gone. Every time my father is in town, I drag him to the marina. We don't say much, we just kick the dirt around as we walk, look at boats, and listen to the halyards slapping aluminum masts. To others, it sounds just like a rope slapping a flagpole, but father and I know better. Lamadoo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:31:08 -0700 (PDT) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: Re: Father's Day, njc > To others, it sounds just like a rope slapping a flagpole, but father and I know better. I know that sound SO WELL! Oddly enough, my father, who passed away 7 years ago, owned a little sailboat, but never taught us four kids to sail. We learned at a public yacht club called Community Boating. It's where we met most of our lifelong friends. We've all sailed in national championships, and still sail when we can. Anyway, Dad was always proud of our sailing trophies. I think I'll raise a trophy glass with a burgee (flag) on it to Dad tonight. Here's to Dads - mariners and lanlubbers alike... lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:01:44 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Joni & touring It's clearly apparent that she enjoyed herself at the Much Music show in Toronto. Although it might have been the saki talking...... :) Lamadoo - --- dsk wrote: > Hasn't she mentioned how much she enjoyed playing to > small audiences? > After the orchestra thing plays out, maybe that will > be next. I hope so. LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 13:39:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Re: Father's Day, njc - --- "Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)" wrote: > Today is the day that Americans remember fathers. This came together > today: > > > > <<< we just kick the dirt around as we walk, look at boats, and > listen to > the halyards slapping aluminum masts. To others, it sounds just like > a rope > slapping a flagpole, but father and I know better.>> What a beautiful little story Lama, so very touching and generous of you to share. Thanks so much. By the way, I know the sound well. > Mags, who loves to be near the sea. ===== You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 18:09:22 -0400 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: You want a Father's day story? NJC NJC It was Father's day 1995, and I was staying the weekend at my then (and future) lover's house alone while he traveled north to be with his family. Around 6 pm a voice from beyond says to me, go rent videos. I say, what is this? Pete will be home soon and we won't have time to watch any video, he doesn;t like to watch them anyway, the video store is closed in our hick small town on a Sunday evening, and there is nothing I want to rent anyway. Voice booms in my head: Rent videos now. Again and again. Rent videos now. on father's day. Ok, I succumb, without knowing why, I go to the video story expecting it to be closed and it is open to my surprise, I find two movies that I kind of maybe wanted to watch and still wondering why the universe is thunderiung at me to rent videos on father's day, I go to the counter. The young girl store clerk looks at my computer records and sees my last name and asks, Are you Jeremy's father? I hadn't seen Jeremy but once since the late 80s, the bi-product of a vicious exwife and my being gay in a rural western Michigan county where gay parents always lose their children totally, since we are by definition unfit. A pain that endures. But I am used to the question and I say yes, I am Jeremy's father, and the store clerk says, how is he, and I say, to be polite and not get into the whole thing, "he's ok.' And the store clerk says, how is his son? It is every father's dream to learn that he has a grandson by being told by a video store clerk. I completed my purchase, drove around the block, returned to the store, and said, you gotta tell me. The video storclerk hesitated, not knowing what family hornet nest she had stepped into, but she game me some information. That is how I learned that Gage had been born several months before in February,, that my exwife insisted that I the pervert gay faggot not be told, and that Gage was healthy and had a wonderful mother named Amy. Happy Father's Day. I was stunned, in shock, the rest of the evening a blur, I sent a letter of love and congratulaions and money to Jeremy and Amy for something for Gage. (Never got an answer). And it hurt to know I had a grandson out there that I could not know and hold and love. When my ex discovered that I knew about Gage, she screamed at my son that I never be allowed to see Gage and Jeremy as always went with his mother, so much easier, so much less yelling that way,. It was a long, painful drive, many tears, back to Kalamazoo. When I visited Greenville, I would drive by where they lived, just to be as close to Gage as I could,. Two years six months later Jeremy has left Amy as he went a'whoring, not wanting to be tied down, and Amy raised Gage on her own and looked for me but could't find me, and one day after I returned to Greenville to live, Amy's aunt - unknown to me a long time friend - ran into an friend of mine and said, do you know where Vince is? I was at Amy's apartment meeting Gage within an hour. I called ahead, what toy could I bring as my first gift to my grandson, was told Tickle Me Elmo, and I bought every tickle me Elmo in the damn KMart to bring to my grandson. The rest is history. Gage is my best bud and I his, and we are super close, so much love between us. It means so much to see his smile when he sees me, when he hugs me, when we get along like two great friends rather than do the formal granparent/grandchild thing. Whatever voice that kept at me on that 1995 Father's day - rent videos now - that led me to knowledge of Gage and set the scene for our later coming together. Amy remembered the love that I expressed in my initial card to Jeremy, and when Jeremy dumped her, she figured, she ought to give this banned grandparent a shot since she thought I seemed like a good guy. Yesterday I spent the afternoon with Amy and her husband to be Mike, Gage's dad who serves in place of my wayward son, and Amy's father and his wife, and for the first time, experienced a sense of family with these people. Mike and I bonded, the other grandfather and I bonded, and it was so good. Life is bizarre. When i speak of God speaking to me, I know what that is about, for that voice that said, go rent videos now led to something that is the joy of my life today: my Gage. And it is the most unusual father Day story that I know; no ties, no tool set, just having my mind blown by a video stgore clerk, years of anguish over a grandson that i could not see, and then: together, and who close we are now. What joy Gage is. This has gone on too long and I am sorry for boring you all but it is father's day and I have no one to tell the story to, so you got selected to share in my little remembrance of what this day means to me. Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:02:04 EDT From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: Note to SCJoniGuy, medical update to all, and some Joni questions about her early stuff Bob, [Hey, Bob, hope you don't mind -- after writing this letter, I decided to emend it and just send it to the list, to answer so many caring inquiries from the list in one swoop -- saves time, and reduces the amount of typing, which is difficult for me lately.] Thank you muchly (and belatedly) for the Gift of the Magi lyrics -- I just this past week finally got around to watching Vol. 2, Part 2 of the tapes you sent weeks/months ago -- and got to see here The Way It Is for the first time ever! What a thrill that is, to hear a song of hers that you've heard *of*, but not *heard*!! And to *see* her singing Gift of the Magi! I truly think this is one of her more brilliant compositions, ever -- and scanning the lyrics, briefly -- did they change between the version I have one one of the CDs (Looking Out for Love, I believe) and the video from the CBC broadcast? I'll soon find out -- but thanks again, I was going crazy over some of the lines, playing the song over and over and not quite getting them. For Bob and everyone -- sorry I've been slow to get back to all of you who've written to me asking about my health. In short, they finally found my brain :-] -- no major horrors (i.e., no tumors, no massive plaques, no abscesses, etc.), but my left hemishpere has shrunk, which may partly explain my linguistic difficulties -- most linguistic facilities are in the left hemi of the brain -- and also explain why my right side is weaker than the left (assume y'all know about the right/left thingy between the brain and the body, right brain controlling the left body, and vice versa). No way to know exactly which of the toxins I've been exposed to in the last seven+ years may have contributed to this situation, and there's basically nothing I can do about it except grin and bear it -- as i tell everyone, I'm too pissy and Irish to give up a fight. Oddly, most of the time, I'm able to talk okay, and I'm amazed that my piano playing is no more diminished than it is -- the aim on my right hand is a little funky, but I still love playing, doing it in short bursts rather than in marathon sessions, like when i was young. One other question, to Bob and all who have the Looking out for Love CD, or possibly other early recordings: I also love Melody In Your Name, which comes right after Gift on the Looking Out CD -- the fact that she decides it's too low, tunes up, and in the process breaks a string (saying something like "Well, now i guess it's too high!") and discusses with the audience what to do about it (I'm unable to understand what's done so she can play the song - -- do you know?) makes it so human. She starts the song again a whole step higher, and then, for some reason, the ending is cut off (presumably damage to the original). Is there any other version of this song around? It's melodically similar to Magi, which may be why she played it right after Magi in the set (same tuning, but up one step? What's the name of that thing one puts across the frets to raise the key? I'm not a guitar player and can't remember...) If there *is* another un-truncated version of the song, I'd like to get my hands on it someday... Thanks so much for everything Bob (and everybody on the list!), and best to you and yours, Walt Breen ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:11:43 EDT From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: Ludwig's tune Jim Lamadoo wrote (several weeks ago): <> Hi, Jim, I've been away from the Jonilist for some time, but for some reason I took a glance at the one (Digest #239) with this quote. I think Ludwig's Tune is one of her masterpieces, and have been working on the simplified published version of the song on the piano (when no-one's around, i sing the vocals, but the less said the better). Like you, i can't wait to hear the version on the CD to come out -- when? In November? -- but who is the Vince you mention in your note? -- I got the above quote out of context. Just curious. Best, Walt ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 16:22:46 -0700 From: David Marine Subject: Betty Carter NJC If you are not familiar with Betty Carter, and like jazz singers, I strongly urge you to seek out some of her albums. Tyler's suggestions are great, and I would add another of her earlier albums, "I Can't Help It." While establishing herself on this lp as an extraordinarily unique and talented vocalist, her style is not as eccentric (or, fans might say, not as matured). The entire album is enjoyable and in parts it is transcendent; it's one of my favorites and has been for many years. David > I love Betty Carter. > Got to see her live once a couple of years before she > died. An amazing performer, wonderful voice. Not the > easiest music, it takes a few listens to 'get it'. > I would reccomend "Dropping Things", it's probably the > best of her later work. For earlier work, the live cd > "The Audience with Betty Carter" (Crappy title, > excellent disc) is a must-have. And, "Ray Charles and > Betty Carter", a duet album, is great as well. > > Tyler ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:58:06 EDT From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: re: Moon At the Window's first verse Hi, gang, I was writing to Sherelle a little while ago, and the song Moon At the Window came to mind -- does anyone know why, when Joni has sung the song publicly of late, she has elided the first verse, which I've always liked?: [It takes cheerful resignation Heart and humility That's all it takes A cheerful person told me Nobody's harder on me than me How could they be And nobody's harder on you than you] Instead, she begins with Betsy's blue She says -- "Tell me something good!:... Anybody know why she skips the first verse? Has she been asked? Does she now think the verse is stupid, or wrong, or too obvious -- or is it just a matter of shortening the song for performance perposes? Does anyone else care? :-) best to all, Walt ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 17:26:29 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Moon At the Window's first verse > Anybody know why she skips the first verse? Has she been asked? Does she > now think the verse is stupid, or wrong, or too obvious -- or is it just a > matter of shortening the song for performance perposes? Does anyone else > care? :-) Hi Walt. Good to hear from you! If I remember correctly, Joni restored that first verse when she sang 'Moon at the Window' at the Gorge in 1998. I think she also sings it in PWWAM. I wondered why she was skipping it as well. In the concert from the Gene Autrey museum I'm almost certain she omitted it. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 20:41:08 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Father's Day, njc <> Hey Lama, thanks for the story...my Dad was a Navy guy, and I think one of his dreams was to get a sailboat. At some point in the early 70's, he bought a simple 2-man sailboat at a K-Mart and the two of us would drive it up to Kerr Lake on the NC-VA line and put it in and float around. There was never much breeze, so we would just drift, exploring lagoons and such, sometimes talking, sometimes silent, just watching the clouds and catching rays. One day it was windy as hell. We almost didn't make the trip in the first place, and it took us about 5 tries to get the boat out where we could sail. It would flip and we'd have to right it. Anyway, we finally did, and we had a hell of a ride, me working the rudder, and him leaning way off the side to keep the boat from flipping. We were always passed my loud motorboats but it didn't matter. Cutting across the water with only nature & our wits was always more of a rush than pure speed. I still can see the big shit-eating grin he wore on his face that day. We always stopped at Alp's dairy bar on the way home, across from Kittrell College. I swore they made the best milkshakes ever, but they probably didn't. It was just a grand ending to what was a great day. I was lucky & blessed to have a wonderful father, who taught me how to sail as well as to appreciate a good Larry Hart lyric, a Richard Rodgers melody, an Ella Fitzgerald vocal, and a whole of other critically important stuff. Thanks, Pop Bob NP: Tanya Chua, "I Don't Know Where I Stand" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 20:51:56 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Note to SCJoniGuy, medical update to all, and some Joni questions about h... <> I dunno, Walt...I would imagine that you're probably the most knowledgeable person on the list regarding that song (having worked on it), so let US know! :~) I agree with your admiration of the song...(Mags, definitely one on the "inspired by literature" list) Like almost all of those early songs, there's such a musical purity that gets me every time. > <> None that I'm aware of, but my knowledge is limited. To make things more confusing, on the bootleg, it's identified as "Dawntreader"... < puts across the frets to raise the > key? I'm not a guitar player and can't remember...) >> I'm not either, Walt, but you mean a capo. Bob NP: Pat Kelly, "Both Sides Now" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 22:25:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Moon At the Window's first verse - --- Mark or Travis wrote: > > Anybody know why she skips the first verse? Has > she been asked? Does she > > now think the verse is stupid, or wrong, or too > obvious -- or is it just a > > matter of shortening the song for performance > perposes? Does anyone else > > care? :-) Er, maybe she just forgot the words? (You never know!) ______________________________________________________________________ Post your ad for free now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 22:36:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Father's Day, njc - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > < slapping a flagpole, but father and I know better.>> > > Hey Lama, thanks for the story...my Dad was a Navy > guy, and I think one of > his dreams was to get a sailboat. At some point in > the early 70's, he bought > a simple 2-man sailboat at a K-Mart and the two of > us would drive it up to > Kerr Lake on the NC-VA line and put it in and float > around. There was never > much breeze, so we would just drift, exploring > lagoons and such, sometimes > talking, sometimes silent, just watching the clouds > and catching rays. I agree. Great story and a good thread, given the day it is (still, at least here in good old eastern standard time.) My Dad got a sailboat too - this would have been in the 70s I guess, when most of us kids were teenagers. You could set out on a hot muggy summer evening and, by the time you got back on land, you'd have forgotten just how hot and humid it was, it was that cold out on Lake Ontario. We'd sail out from Bronte Harbour (near Oakville, west of Toronto - my family lived in Mississauga ON) and most of the time, there was no breeze at all. One night we were going to do a weekend thing - my Mum never wanted to come along, so it was just Dad and the girls. I guess my brother had moved north by this time. We set sail from Bronte heading east towards the Toronto Islands. There was no breeze - AT ALL - and my Dad was stubborn, or maybe optimistic. He didn't want to use the motor (just a little 2 hp thing to get us in and out of harbour if needed) and he kept insisting that he could feel a little breeze coming. We kept moving the sail about to catch a breeze, but it never happened. We had set out about 6 p.m. hoping to reach Toronto Islands by 8 or so. Around about 11 p.m., we pulled into Port Credit (a couple of miles from where we started, and quite a few from our intended destination.) We slept the night, then sailed back to Bronte. (We never did use the motor though.) That was the Big Sailing Adventure. As a rule, I didn't do much work on the boat. Too lazy and too chicken. Two of my sisters were more sailors than I was. I was OK just handling the rudder - the rest was too technical for me. It is my dream one day to have a sailboat (and to learn to sail it too). I don't understand why anyone would want one of those power motor boats - they're big and ugly, they stink and they make way too much noise. Sailing is so, hmm, civilized... and quiet. Thanks, Dad. ______________________________________________________________________ Post your ad for free now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #257 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?