From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #111 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Wednesday, March 13 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 111 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Today's Articles: March 12 [les@jmdl.com] Today in History: March 12 [les@jmdl.com] Blue Tapestry Concert ["Clive Brothers" ] Fwd: Re: WTC memorial (totally NJC) [Mags N Brei ] The Last Waltz ["William Waddell" ] Family of Tunings ["Laurent Olszer" ] Re: Blue Tapestry Concert NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: WTC memorial (totally NJC) [anne@sandstrom.com] Re: WTC memorial...emphasis on World (totally NJC) ["Brenda" ] Re: Grace Slick NJC [colin ] NJC RE: A couple of Joni films [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: WTC memorial (NJC) [colin ] Waking The Dead [Phyliss Ward ] where were you? njc ["mack watson-bush" ] grace slick njc ["mack watson-bush" ] Re: where were you? njc ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC [RobSher50@aol.com] Re: where were you? njc ["hell" ] Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC ["Dolphie Bush" ] Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC ["Kakki" ] Re: Bush (NJC, very much so!) [colin ] Re: where were you? njc [colin ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 03:12:03 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Articles: March 12 On March 12 the following article was published: 1967: "Interview with Ed Sciaky" - WMMR (Interview - Audio Transcription) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/670312wmmr.cfm - ------------------------ http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 03:12:03 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today in History: March 12 On March 12 in Joni Mitchell History: 1967: Joni is in Philadelphia and is interviewed by Ed Sciaky. More info: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/670312wmmr.cfm 1974: Joni performs at the Seattle Center Arena - ------------------------ Search the "Today" database at http://www.jmdl.com/today ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 08:50:39 +0000 From: "Clive Brothers" Subject: Blue Tapestry Concert Absolutely sublime Joni and Carole King.The best concert I've been to in years.While/Matthews/Allcock etc played over two hours of tributes to our great heroes.Songs such as:A Case Of You,Amelia,Coyote,BYT,Free Man In Paris,In France TKIMS,California,Raised on Robbery,Help Me,Little Green,You Turn MOIAR plus all the great CK classics. Wow,I'm still reeling from the ecstasy of it all.What a shame it's only a one month tour.I want to go again!Nobody in the 200-strong Oxford shire audience wanted to leave the club.We really rocked last night and the standard of musicianship was extraordinarily high.These guys really know there craft and played many different instruments.They're ex-Fairport/Jethro Tull/Albion CB etc.(personal friends with Richard Thompson).This was a trully wonderful night for a Joni nut like me. There are still some gigs left to play in England in March.Look at the website WhileandMatthews.co.uk. CBros _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 03:38:46 -0800 (PST) From: Mags N Brei Subject: Fwd: Re: WTC memorial (totally NJC) I sent this to Heather, and meant to send it to the whole list... > > > --- chiaroscuro@SNET.Net wrote: > > << > How do you think the US should commemorate this event? > > How should these attacks be remembered? > > I pose this question to the list because I respect the different > > viewpoints > > from the vast intellect here. > > > > Heather and everyone, > > As you know, Canadians have been deeply affected by this tragedy as > well. We all felt so helpless just sitting, watching, and feeling > with > you, for you, our American friends. Well, 'we' had to do something, > and > this is a part of what Canadians musicians did. Last fall I wrote a > post about the Tears of A Thousand Years project/CD, from the cover: > > "the proceeds of which go directly to various funds to assist > worldwide > efforts in helping those whose lives have been forever changed by the > tragic events of September 11th, 2001. This project was conceived and > produced by the Canadian Musicians September 11th Relief Foundation." > > For more info, please go to > > www.tearsofathousandyears.com > > The CD is for sale on this site and it is reasonable, especially when > you do the conversion from Canadian to US dollars. > > I had the privilege of attending the CD launch concert in November > and > it was awesome and moving and overwhelming. It all began with the > singing of the Star Spangled Banner, followed by the Canadian > National > anthem. Oh Canada indeed. > > Amazing that it only took a month to pull it together, CD and all. > Many > of my favourite Canadian musicians from across the country gathered > together to honour our southern sisters and brothers. It was obvious > how deeply moved everyone was. Lots of tears that night. And so many > interpretations of that terrible day. > > There are about seven unreleased songs, including 'Jamie' by Stan > Rogers, which is a beautiful, touching song, typical Stan style. I > met > Ariel Rogers after the concert and that in itself was a special > moment. > I know there are some Stan fans on the list, which is why I mention > this again. Well worth the price of the CD. > > I attended another fundraiser concert recently and they announced > that > ten thousand dollars have been raised from the sale of the Tears CD. > As > I said, all proceeds are sent directly to the various funds which are > assisting the cause. > > Mags, writing into the light of day. > > npimh: Heaven's Restaurant, Fireweed (beautiful harmonies, they are > noted as Canada's very own CSNY)from the Tears of a Thousand Years > project CD > > > > > ===== > You open my heart, you do. > Yes you do. > - JM > Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email! > http://mail.yahoo.com/ > ===== You open my heart, you do. Yes you do. - JM Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 05:44:38 -0600 From: "William Waddell" Subject: The Last Waltz Bob wrote (on The Last Waltz ); This is fab news! WtS _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 13:32:58 -0000 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: Family of Tunings Thanks to Sue's brilliant idea, I decided to reorganize my Joni tablatures by family of tunings. This saves so much time I would say it's the greatest thing since mouse traps. This french jazz singer I've began playing with has a voice and a range that is uncannily similar to Joni (whom she barely even heard of up to 1 month ago). So the time has come to get serious. Looking at the JMDL guitar search engine, I noticed some tablatures are made from the Hits/Misses versions. I never bought these CDs thinking these were the same versions as on the albums. Was I wrong? Sue, Marian, Howard, anybody pleaaaaase can you help me out with Dog Eat Dog's tuning/chords? Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 08:00:16 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Blue Tapestry Concert NJC Thanks for the review, Clive! If any recordings surface, I'd love to hear them. Bob NP: Joe Jackson, "San Francisco Fan" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 06:26:48 -0800 (PST) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: Re: WTC memorial (totally NJC) The 6 month anniversary has meant more to me than I even expected. And I found the documentary 9/11 to be literally stunning. I shook the whole time watching it. I think a memorial should include usable office and living space. I wish I were an architect so I could express my ideas better. But, I'd propose four buildings surrounding a center courtyard, each no taller than 55 stories. I'd probably lean towards having the buildings be a slight crescent shape. The walls of the buildings facing the street would be of normal constuction, except there would be a band of red brick, white granite, and blue marble about 2/3 of the way up each building. The walls facing the courtyard would be glass (somewhat like the John Hancock tower here in Boston.) In the courtyard itself would be two reflecting pools, side by side, 110 yards long. (I'm thinking of something like the reflecting pool at the Christian Science Center, also here in Boston. BTW, it's functional as well as pretty, because it's part of the cooling system.) The lobby of each building would contain a gallery, where exhibits would change every few months. Also, permanently installed in each building would be a work of art/craft to commemorate victims. For example, a "memory quilt" with the faces and names of victims sewn into it, that sort of thing - something hand done, and exquisitely beautiful. Each work of memorial art would contain 1/4 of the victims' names/faces. So, that's my $.02 worth... lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 06:46:05 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: WTC memorial...emphasis on World (totally NJC) On 11 Mar 2002 at 19:42, chiaroscuro@SNET.Net wrote: > >How do you think > the US should commemorate this event? How should these attacks be > remembered? My hope is that any memorial would recognize that there were not just Americans who died that day but people from other countries all over the world. Brenda n.p.: Wayne Shorter - "Dindi" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 07:12:38 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: Whitney's flatulence...Mariah Carey (njc) On 9 Mar 2002 at 22:08, BigWaltinSF@aol.com wrote: > Hey, Wally, > > In a message dated 3/4/02 6:40:47 PM, in the jmdl digest that I'm > finally getting to after two/three days in bed, you wrote: > > << [incidentally, who started the unbearable craze for this nasal, > unbearable kind of melisma? my guess is whitney houston when she raped > our ears and our brains with her version of ''i will always love > you''.] >> > > Yes!!! Oh, my friend and ambassador, how right and funny you are!!! > How I hated that song, and the tendency for all singers to flatulate > (or whatever) their melisma ever since then! I think we should lay the blame at the feet of Mariah Carey. Remember all the hand fluttering she did at the end of "Vision of Love" which was released in 1990? (And the "Emotions" album in 1991 was even worse IMO.) She opened the door for singers of all persuasions to oversing on pop records. In fact, Clive was well known for rejecting Whitney's recordings if she embellished too much because he thought pop radio wouldn't play it if it sounded too "gospel" or "black." And if you listen to Whitney's three solo albums before Mariah, you won't find much of it. However, "The Bodyguard" was after the two Mariah releases and I suppose the argument just didn't stick after that. And there was certainly a good deal competition between the two singers at the time. Brenda n.p.: Wayne Shorter - "More Than Human" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 13:12:49 -0600 From: "Mark Tatum" Subject: Joni in AP English (part one of a long post in two parts) Hi. I'm a lurker on the Joni-only list, but I wanted to tell you about a little project I undertook recently to acquaint some high school students with Joni. There is a teacher at the high school where my wife teaches who teaches Advanced Placement English to seniors. She taught my son and is an excellent teacher, so I decided to see if she would like to teach a lesson on song lyrics as poetry and use some of Joni's lyrics as the focus. I put together a lesson plan and gave it to her, and she gladly agreed to use it. The first part of the lesson was done by the class as a whole. They were given some biographical info on Joni first because I'm sure the great majority would have no idea who she was. They also got a handout with definitions of a dozen poetic devices, including the usual simile and metaphor, but also apostrophe and metonymy. Finally, they got a copy of the lyrics to "The Last Time I Saw Richard", and they were asked to find examples of various poetic devices in the lyrics and to answer a couple of questions about the song. Then they listened to the song to see how Joni put the words to music. In the next part of the lesson, the class was divided into four groups, and each group was given a different song on which to work. The four songs were "Furry Sings the Blues", "Little Green", "Cold Blue Steel and Sweet Fire", and "Amelia". As before, they looked for poetic devices and answered questions about the song. However, each group also got a sealed envelope that they were not to open until after they had answered all the questions. I put some interested info in each envelope to shed further light on the song. Then they were asked to reconsider their answers and answer a couple of additional questions. For example, on Furry I first had asked if they thought the song was purely fictional or not and why. Then, in the envelope I gave them info on Furry Lewis and his complaint about Joni putting him in her song. They were then asked if they thought his complaint was valid or not and w! hy, and t thought the bronze statue of W.C. Handy or Joni's song about Furry was the better way of "immortalizing" each musician. (end of part one) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 11:28:39 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: WTC memorial...emphasis on World (totally NJC) Brenda wrote: > On 11 Mar 2002 at 19:42, chiaroscuro@SNET.Net wrote: > > > > >How do you think > > the US should commemorate this event? How should these attacks be > > remembered? > > My hope is that any memorial would recognize that there were not just Americans who > died that day but people from other countries all over the world. I agree. Suffering is suffering, and unneccesary death is a terrible tragedy that happens every day, all over the world. Any memorial that doesn't recognize that implies that American lives are somehow more precious than others. We need to do more soul-searching regarding our largest export (weapons), the profit mongers behind it, and whether a violent world is what we really want. RR ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 13:38:48 -0600 From: "Mark Tatum" Subject: Joni in AP English (part two of long post) In the last part of the lesson, each group was asked to make a short presentation to the class on that group's song. The rest of the class got a copy of the lyrics so they could follow along in the discussion. Finally, after each presentation, the song was played. That was the first time anyone in the class had heard the song. After the song was played, the students could comment on the song. How did it go? Well, although I was not present during either of the two 90-minute periods that the lesson took up, I heard some very good things about it. As you might expect, it took a little while for Joni to win them over. They did not warm up immediately to her singing and apparently weren't too taken with it on "The Last Time I Saw Richard". I think we all would agree that she often can be a "hard listen" at first, and I think that would especially be true considering what they are used to listening to these days. However, I thought that breaking them into groups to study her songs and then make a presentation would give them some "ownership" in their song and get them to take a deeper look. That seems to have worked because by the end there were several who made comments on how much they enjoyed it. The two favorites were Little Green and Furry. I hear that in the group studying Little Green, one of the boys indicated he didn't care for studying the song lyrics as poetry, but his girlfriend, who also was in that group, told him in no uncertain terms that she did not agree, and for him not to try to force his opinion on the rest of the group! I don't know if any of them will follow up by listening to Joni's music, but I think they had a good time and learned something about poetry and about her. The teacher intends to use the lesson again next year. I'm just glad I didn't suggest that they watch the Grammy Awards to see her get the "Lifetime Achievement Award". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:49:12 +0000 From: pyramus@lineone.net Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Blue=20Tapestry?= On Sunday night I had the distinct pleasure of attending the Blue Tapestry concert in East Grinstead, U.K. For those who don't know, Blue Tapestry is the name of a nationwide tour presently undertaken by the folk duo While and Matthews, celebrating the music of Joni Mitchell and Carole King. I think Paul Castle mentioned this on the list a few weeks ago. Thanks Paul. Were you there? See here for an explanation of the tour and band list. http://www.mattwhile.fsnet.co.uk/Blue_Tapestryx.html Sundays concert was held at the Chequer Mead Arts Centre, East Grinstead (my home town) in the south of England. The music space is an auditorium with stalls and circle. It's intimate without being being cramped; plenty of leg room! Sound wise it was marvellous, although with the high ceiling I rather wished I had got a circle seat instead of the stalls, but nevermind. Here's the playlist: I Feel the Earth Move (Carole KIng) Help Me It's Too Late (CK) Amelia Beautiful (CK) You Turn Me On (I'm a Radio) Little Green So Far Away (CK) California Carey Free Man in Paris Interval In France They Kiss on Main Street Home Again (CK) Coyote Will You Still Love me Tomorrow (CK) Case of You Raised on Robbery Tapestry (CK) Smackwater Jack (CK) You Make Me Feel Like a Natural Woman (CK) Where you Lead (CK) Encore Big Yellow Taxi You've Got a Friend (CK) If you have the time I urge you to go and see them. Trust me these guys are a lot of fun, extemely accomplished and very true to Joni and Carole. There are still plenty of dates left around the country and they have added some more in The Netherlands. See here for the updated tour schedule. http://www.mattwhile.fsnet.co.uk/Tour_Datesx.html Incidentally, the website states that there will be an album later in the year. Let's hope so. ~Kevin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 15:53:05 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in AP English (part one of a long post in two parts) In a message dated 3/12/2002 2:06:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, MTatum@mail.lasccoa.state.la.us writes: > Hi. I'm a lurker on the Joni-only list, but I wanted to tell you about a > little project I undertook recently to acquaint some high school students > with Joni. Hi Mark, and thanks for delurking. What an excellent project to take on. I wish more teachers would use Joni's lyrics (or even other songwriters) for educating students. I know I would have enjoyed poetry a lot more if the teachers would have used song lyrics. I would really like to know how the group who had "Cold Blue Steel and Sweet Fire" presented that discussion. Actually, I would like to know how *each* group interpreted the lyrics to their assigned song. What a fun project. Thanks for sharing! Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 15:53:52 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: A couple of Joni films Was wondering if anyone can provide some information on the following Joni-movie questions: - - A 1986 Jean Luc-Godard made for TV film, "Grandeur et Dicadence D'Un Petit Commerce De Cinema" has some JC, either a Joni song or something. Anybody know anything about this flick? - -A 1985 film called "Fantastic All-Electric Music Movie" lists Joni as a cast member. I'm assuming it's a performance piece as the other "cast" members include Jim Croce, Stan Kenton, The Kinks, & Melanie. ANy knowledge on THIS one? I'll do some info-hunting on my end, just wondering if anybody's heard of these... Bob NP: Joe Jackson, "Target" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 16:17:17 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: RE: A couple of Joni films Thanks, Wally...I saw that link, was wondering what "Original" music meant. It's probably just a song off one of her records, but if it's not, and it is indeed some original music, then I'm TREMBLING with excitement! Bob NP: Joe Jackson, "A Slow Song" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 19:00:58 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: A couple of Joni films oh no, not godard. it is surely something from one her albums, although now i am CONSUMED by DOUBT and ANXIETY. wally - -----Mensaje original----- De: SCJoniGuy@aol.com [mailto:SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Enviado el: Martes, 12 de Marzo de 2002 06:17 p.m. Para: wallykai@fibertel.com.ar CC: joni@smoe.org Asunto: RE: A couple of Joni films Thanks, Wally...I saw that link, was wondering what "Original" music meant. It's probably just a song off one of her records, but if it's not, and it is indeed some original music, then I'm TREMBLING with excitement! Bob NP: Joe Jackson, "A Slow Song" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 22:10:37 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Grace Slick NJC Blair Fraipont wrote: > Wow, What a tribute to a singer. See, to me, I had never met anyone > who was really into Grace Slick, I have only one album of hers, Dreams. I love it. I think it is deleted now. i have tried for years to get to cd but to no avail. i have 2 copies on vynl. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 17:05:53 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC RE: A couple of Joni films <> As am I!! I may not sleep until I KNOW! (Of course, I've lived most of my life consumed by doubt & anxiety, so why should NOW be any different?);~D Bob NP: Shawn Colvin, "The Chain" (GREAT cover!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 22:26:21 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: WTC memorial (NJC) > It's chilling enough to see the broken New York skyline as it > is today without the memory of this horrible attack lighting up the skies > over lower Manhattan for decades to come. I see your point. however, this idea does appeal to me. It makes me think of all those souls, radiant, light, leaving here and moving on. > As it is, anyone who witnessed the > destruction of the towers in real life or on TV will never forget it anyway. I have heard people say that they rememeber clearly the day Kennedy was shot, The Bay of Pigs crisis and the Moon Landings. I remeber none of those. I recall vividly Sept 11th. i know exactlly what I was doing. I had just taken a break from my knitting. Swithced on the tv and channle hopped. The first channel was shwoing some disater novie. So so was the next channel. then the next. and the next. My stomach lurched and I realised I was not watching a disater movie. My heart clenched, my throat went dry and my mind couldn't comphrehend fully. i kept hoping I was dreaming. I sat there for the next 2 days. literally. Couldn't do anything else but the essentials. the horror experinced by those people in the planes. The nighmare for those in the towers. and worse for those whose loved ones were int he plance and towers. what awful awful pain was now let loose. Up until that day, i had lost the fear i had grown up with of the world coming to end. Up until then i thought we had finally begun to sort the shit out and were heading towards peace. up till then i thought we had a chance. Up till then i had lost this silly idea that I would not grow old. The events since have only increased my pessimism. However, if the worst comes, then we too will rise like that beam of light and will be at peace....... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 14:41:51 -0800 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Waking The Dead Sorry if this has been mentioned before but if it was, I missed it. The movie "Waking The Dead" (available on DVD) actually opens with Joni singing the first verse of ACOY. Then, half way through they play another verse. It is a story of intense love and politics. Just an ok movie but the music blew my mind! - -- Phyliss mailto:phyliss@goldenfigclay.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 18:53:12 -0600 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: where were you? njc Colin, that is very interesting. I remember the day Kennedy was shot. I was playing on equipment on the playground. I don't remember the Bay of Pigs crisis. I do remember the moon landings, it was such a big deal. The reason I write Colin to lead this off is that I learned of the Sept. 11 attack when I turned on the computer, went to the JMDL, and there was a post from Colin telling us that it had happened. It will forever be etched in my mind that way. mack ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 19:18:07 -0600 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: grace slick njc Grace Slick. To me, Grace epitomizes the 60's. What is was and how it made me feel. I was a small boy but she was California, the movement, the electricity that was resonating throughout the country. I adored her. She was a hero and someone to be looked up to, even though I didn't know why I felt that way. I love her voice, her delivery, and her essence. Someone wrote that they felt as if the tune "we built this city" was insipid. Maybe so but I loved it, at least the video version with the disc jockey inside of it. I loved it because it made me feel a part of San Francisco and took me back to those feelings of the 60's, which I cannot even explain but those who were there, regardless of location, know what I write of. And there are so many here who were actually there, in the midst of it all. Glorious and I am so happy to be amidst them. I adore the flick Heaven and Earth by Oliver Stone. The scene when they arrive back in California and it is the 60's. Ah, that brings it all back. The excitement, the furor, the indecision, the protests, the troops, Martin Luther King, Kent State, Vietnam every night on the television and the daily body count, Nixon, and Janis. Ah, Janis. Each time I hear Grace Slick, I am there again. mack ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 18:22:50 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: where were you? njc The reason > I write Colin to lead this off is that I learned of the Sept. 11 attack when I > turned on the computer, went to the JMDL, and there was a post from Colin > telling us that it had happened. It will forever be etched in my mind that > way. > > mack That's exactly what happened to me as well, Mack. Got up that morning opened email & at first didn't believe it. Then I turned on the tv and my stomach turned over 4 or 5 times. And in regard to this thread, Les, I owe you and the list an apology. After installing Windows XP we had trouble with the computer and Travis ended up having to start from scratch, reconstructing everything once or twice. In the process, all of my email files went to the Land of Lost Data and the 9/11 posts I was saving for Les to archive on the JMDL site went with them. Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 21:49:31 EST From: RobSher50@aol.com Subject: Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC Dear Kakki, I am absolutely, extremely proud of you for placing as a finalist in that competition! There were literally hundreds of thousands of entries and it was quite the deal at that time. What you did was quite an accomplishment! All together now... Yayyyyy... Kakki! Sherelle In a message dated 03/11/2002 6:40:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: > Sherelle, > > I've been keeping my mouth shut on the Kim Carnes but now you've brought me > out! I also entered a song in the American Song Festival the year she won! > I was a finalist in the lyric competition and was very happy with that but > kind of turned my nose up at Kim and thought she was no Joni! ;-) > > Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 15:54:16 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: where were you? njc Mack wrote: > I learned of the Sept. 11 attack when I turned on the computer, > went to the JMDL, and there was a post from Colin telling us > that it had happened. It will forever be etched in my mind that > way. I'll never forget the day of the attacks. I was on my way home from the US (Jonifest), on what was probably one of the last United Airlines flights still in the air. We arrived back in Auckland about 6am NZ time, which was around 9-10am NYC time (from memory). As we taxied in to the terminal, an announcement was made that there had been a "world event" and we should stay seated until they could inform us. United Airlines staff and police boarded the plane, and we were told of the terrorist attacks, and that this flight (which was due to carry on to Australia) was immediately grounded, and we should depart the aircraft as quickly as possible. Initially we were told that the Empire State building had been levelled, and it wasn't until we reached the first television inside the terminal that we saw what had actually happened. The passengers on the flight were mainly American, and in complete shock (along with the rest of us), and the staff were completely distraught - many would have lost friends in the hijacked planes. It was also fairly disturbing to realise that we were in the air when it all happened. I'd also flown from Washington DC to LA on the "same" flight as was hijacked, but 4 days earlier, and had been driving around Manhattan with Lori and William a week before. Not a day I'll quickly forget. Hell P.S. I wasn't born when Kennedy was shot, and I was only 3 for the Apollo 11 landing - I was probably more interested in my teddy bear than Neil Armstrong! ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 21:03:19 -0600 From: "Dolphie Bush" Subject: Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC Yea Kakki. Yea Kakki. Yea Kakki. mack .. Yayyyyy... Kakki! > > Sherelle > > In a message dated 03/11/2002 6:40:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, > KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: > > > > Sherelle, > > > > I've been keeping my mouth shut on the Kim Carnes but now you've brought me > > out! I also entered a song in the American Song Festival the year she won! > > I was a finalist in the lyric competition and was very happy with that but > > kind of turned my nose up at Kim and thought she was no Joni! ;-) > > > > Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 22:12:18 -0500 From: chiaroscuro@SNET.Net Subject: Re: WTC memorial (NJC) Thank you to those of you who took time to reflect and address your feelings on this matter. Who's to say what the final memorial will look like. The ephemeral state of the beams of light is poignant to which I thought Colin's statement " those souls, radiant, light, leaving here and moving on" was well said. To the contrary, I have heard others say that it reminded them of the Nuremberg Rally of 1936 with A. Speers beams of light as classical columns into the night. Not a memory to be linked with 9/11 in my opinion. Many others I spoke with lean towards what Bob said about a simplistic, straightforward memorial such as the Vietnam Memorial. Yes, as far as I know there are 2 freestanding sculptures ... one honoring soldiers and the other honoring the nurses serving in that war ... both in brass that flank either end of the wall. I think this was to appease those who could not come to terms with the abstractness of Maya Lin's design. That is part of the point with memorials. How do we memorialize this event to ' everyone' ? Americans and foreigners, as Brenda pointed out? Then again, there are the other two sites .... the Pentagon and the countryside in Pennsylvania. How do we incorporate those sites into the memorial ... or do we? When Kakki mentioned the lights and the power of lights in Las Vagas, I remember some students of mine commenting about light pollution. I guess that did not come to my mind. Then I ask myself " should it have?" I like what Anne tried to do. Trying to depict what she thought was representative of a memorial to 9/11. This is part of the process. What represents what and to whom and when (ie - for future generations)? I think there are many folks, like Kakki, who's minds are " still kind of a blank on it ". Mine included. The wound is still too fresh. So what's my point? Only to keep discussing our emotions and resolve. Thanks for reading, Heather At 10:26 PM 3/12/02 +0000, colin wrote: > > It's chilling enough to see the broken New York skyline as it > > is today without the memory of this horrible attack lighting up the skies > > over lower Manhattan for decades to come. > >I see your point. however, this idea does appeal to me. It makes me think >of all >those souls, radiant, light, leaving here and moving on. > > > As it is, anyone who witnessed the > > destruction of the towers in real life or on TV will never forget it > anyway. > >I have heard people say that they rememeber clearly the day Kennedy was >shot, The >Bay of Pigs crisis and the Moon Landings. I remeber none of those. > >I recall vividly Sept 11th. i know exactlly what I was doing. I had just >taken a >break from my knitting. Swithced on the tv and channle hopped. The first >channel >was shwoing some disater novie. So so was the next channel. then the next. and >the next. My stomach lurched and I realised I was not watching a disater >movie. >My heart clenched, my throat went dry and my mind couldn't comphrehend >fully. i >kept hoping I was dreaming. I sat there for the next 2 days. literally. >Couldn't >do anything else but the essentials. >the horror experinced by those people in the planes. The nighmare for those in >the towers. and worse for those whose loved ones were int he plance and >towers. >what awful awful pain was now let loose. >Up until that day, i had lost the fear i had grown up with of the world >coming to >end. Up until then i thought we had finally begun to sort the shit out and >were >heading towards peace. up till then i thought we had a chance. Up till >then i had >lost this silly idea that I would not grow old. The events since have only >increased my pessimism. > >However, if the worst comes, then we too will rise like that beam of light and >will be at peace....... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 20:03:05 -0800 (PST) From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Bush (NJC, very much so!) Colin, Well yes, maybe. If you're saying it's a shame for everyone, and there are no winners, then yeah, I agree. If on the other hand, you're implying that Devil America has killed more souls than it had a right to; if you're saying that somehow Devil America should have stopped when it hit the magic number (when retaliation was achieved), then no, I don't agree. For reasons why retaliation doesn't work, look at the West Bank. I don't know if your count of casualties in Afghanistan includes the dead American servicemen. It should. They are the ONLY heros. Those guys are ridding the world of terrorists who are willing to kill schoolchildren merely because they represent a foreign lifestyle. If Winston Churchill were alive today, he'd be 100% behind the American troops. Our President Kennedy once said, "If we cannot end now our differences, at least we can help make the world safe for diversity." A very old JMDLer used to close every post with this: "Tolerance, tolerance, tolerance" Lama P.S. Perhaps more to the point, Colin, is this quote. Do you remember the singer? "The place where I come from the people don't grow on trees (except for some of the boys) and you can't treat people like meat without being ** brought down** to your knees now and then, (now bay-beee)." - -- The author formerly known as Catman wrote: >>being the 6 month anniversary today, the news is all about Sept 11th. The death toll is down to under 2,800 or so with just under 200 missing. The death toll of men, women and children, in Afghanistan is 3800. Just.>> Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 22:49:36 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Kim Carnes in Atlanta; NJC Awww, shucks ;-) I honestly did not know it was such a big contest back then until Sherelle just filled me in. I was young and green and it was a big deal to scrape up the $10 entry fee at the time. Didn't mean to diss Kim - it was just a little sour grapes on my part at the time ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 07:31:10 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Bush (NJC, very much so!) Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: > Colin, > > Well yes, maybe. If you're saying it's a shame for > everyone, and there are no winners, then yeah, I > agree. what i said was quite clear. I gave the amounts killed. No comment. How you interpret is up to you. I didn;t mention 'devil america'. Stupid if I did as this involves the UK. And you wonder why i feel the US can be insular! > > > If on the other hand, you're implying that Devil > America has killed more souls than it had a right to; > if you're saying that somehow Devil America should > have stopped when it hit the magic number (when > retaliation was achieved), then no, I don't agree. I don't think any should have been killed. > > terrorists who are willing to > kill schoolchildren merely because they represent a > foreign lifestyle. 3800 men women and children killed by us and uk bombs. The attacks are not about 'foreign lifestyles'though it seems it suits people to think so. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2002 07:33:56 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: where were you? njc mack watson-bush wrote: > Colin, that is very interesting. I remember the day Kennedy was shot. I was > playing on equipment on the playground. I don't remember the Bay of Pigs > crisis. I do remember the moon landings, it was such a big deal. I do recall the very first flight, test, of Concorde. Flew over our house. Everyone came out to watch it. ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #111 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?