From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest)
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Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #104
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JMDL Digest         Wednesday, March 6 2002         Volume 2002 : Number 104



The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be
found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news,
a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more.

The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains
interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more.
==========

TOPICS and authors in this Digest:
--------
  Today in History: March 5                                    [les@jmdl.com]
  Spirit Of The Forest                                    [SCJoniGuy@aol.com]
  Re: Chitlins & The Glossary NJC                         [SCJoniGuy@aol.com]
  Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)  [Jerry Notaro <notaro@]
  Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)  [Gary Zack <garyzack@a]
  Re: Judy Collins & Dylan njc         [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: funny Dylan NJC                  [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: Up to Me NJC                     [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: Thanks from a lurker !!            [Randy Remote <guitarzan@saber.net>]
  Re: Thanks from a lurker !! NJC                         [SCJoniGuy@aol.com]
  Re: Up to Me NJC                 ["James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>]
  Joni mention in NY Times, ref.  Abbey Lincoln  ["Timothy Spong" <tim_spong]
  Re: Up to Me SJC                 ["James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>]
  Re: Up to Me NJC                     [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: Up to Me SJC                     [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: Am I still here?  plus some answers re ladies and BAFTAs (NJC)  [colin]
  Methany/Map of world NJC                    [colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>]
  Re: Up to Me SJC                 ["James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>]
  Re: Up to Me NJC                     [Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>]
  Re: Debut albums NJC          ["Blair Fraipont" <donjuansrd80@hotmail.com>]
  her former self njc      ["mack watson-bush" <courtandspark@earthlink.net>]
  Joni News on EW.COM                                   [mann@chicagonet.net]
  Re: her former self njc                          ["hell" <hell@ihug.co.nz>]
  Re: her former self njc                     [colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>]
  Re: her former self njc                     [colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>]
  Re: her former self njc                          ["hell" <hell@ihug.co.nz>]
  Inner Strength (njc)                    ["Kakki" <KakkiB@worldnet.att.net>]
  Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)  ["Mark or Travis" <mar]
  A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black  Case!!!  [BigWa]
  Re: Motherload O' Joni - (Real Good For Free)  [Mark Domyancich <mark@jmdl]
  Re: Joni mention in NY Times, ref.  Abbey Lincoln          [Dflahm@aol.com]
  Re: Up to Me NJC                       [Randy Remote <guitarzan@saber.net>]
  Re: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black Case!!!  [Ra]
  Re: Bob vs. Joni, 50% JC   ["Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" <jlamadoo@fuse.net>]
  A message from rose joy                       [rosemjoy@aol.com (rose joy)]
  Re: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black Case!!!  [Bi]
  RE: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black   Case!!!  []

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 03:02:17 -0500
From: les@jmdl.com
Subject: Today in History: March 5

On March 5 in Joni Mitchell History:

1974: Joni performs at the Anaheim Convention Center in Anaheim, California
More info: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/7403lat.cfm

1989: From Wally's bio page: An all-star group gathered in Britain [today] to record "The Spirit of the Forest" single, with proceeds going to the Earth Love Fund for the preservation of the Brazilian rainforests. At the end of the month, recording on the single continued in New York City and it was there that Joni added her one line about saving the birds and the monkeys. Some of the other musicians and singers involved in the project were Chris Rea, XTC, Bonnie Raitt, Ringo Starr, Olivia Newton-John, Thomas Dolby, and Kate Bush. A video of "The Spirit of the Forest" was released to video outlets on June 2 to coincide with United Nations Day.


1991: The album "Night Ride Home" is released


- ------------------------
Search the "Today" database at http://www.jmdl.com/today

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 08:30:23 EST
From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com
Subject: Spirit Of The Forest

<<Joni added her one line about saving the birds and the monkeys.>>

But not just birds...Kookaburra! That's actually a fun little song, better than most of the multi-celebrity things. And I love that Joni AND XTC are on the same track.

Has anybody seen that video?

Bob

NP: Hole, "Playing Your Song"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 08:33:46 EST
From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com
Subject: Re: Chitlins & The Glossary NJC

<<Very cool article, Bob.  Thanks for posting the URL.>>

You're very welcome, Mark - I learned a lot from it myself. I may go ahead and pick up that book as I have so much more to learn about Jimi.

Bob

NP: Hole, "Petals"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 08:40:45 -0500
From: Jerry Notaro <notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu>
Subject: Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)

Great comments Mark. BTW, Judy did have some vocal chord problems mid career
which did cause her to go flat sometimes. She even contemplated quitting "the
business." Instead, she went into very intense vocal study, and still studies
with a vocal teacher in NYC. The result is that high, clear, bell like tone of
hers which is even better now than 40 years ago.

Jerry

Mark or Travis wrote:

> Maybe it's the way it's been recorded in more recent years.  Driving home
> tonight I was listening to disk 2 of 'Forever' and heard one of the songs
> that was newly written & recorded at the time of this compilation called
> 'Walls (We Are Not Forgotten)'.  Her voice rings through strong & clear on
> this song and is very powerful.  But there's something about the way it's
> recorded that seems to soften the sound of it and I've noticed this on
> several of her later songs.  And no offense to Mack, but when 'Hard Times
> For Lovers' was a hit on the radio it used to drive me nuts because she
> sounded flat half the time and I thought 'boy, she's really lost it!'  But
> now I'm wondering if it was the way it was recorded.  The newer version of
> 'Chelsea Morning' is another one where the voice seems lost in a fog inside
> an echo chamber or some damn thing.  She has a beautiful voice and I don't
> see any need to soften it or obscure it in a blurry, echo-ey haze of sound.
> The early recordings that have less production really showcase that voice.
> But she's also proven she can front some fairly heavy production and still
> sound great like on 'First Boy I Loved' or 'Albatross'.  Anyway I'm really
> enjoying exploring her body of work.  I'm developing a great deal of respect
> and admiration for her.  She chose wonderful songs to sing and sang them
> with beauty & conviction.  And some of her writing's not bad either.
>
> Mark E in Seattle

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 09:19:09 -0500
From: Gary Zack <garyzack@ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)

Thanks for that info Mark!  I'm not up on Joan Baez
material, and of course, had never heard of "Love Song To A
Stranger" by Joni Mitchell, so the person must have been
talking about Joan Baez!!  It was an interesting rumor I had
heard, but I don't know that it was true.
And the person who told me that obviously had his/her Joan's
mixed up.
I can't even remember who told me that story now, it's been
so long ago. 

Thanks again, do you know what album that song appears on? 
I'd like to hear it. 

Gary


Mark or Travis wrote:
> 
> I once heard a
> > rumor when I lived in California that Judy took one of
> > Joni's songs called "Love Song To A Stranger" and wrote the
> > notes of the song backward to create "Secret Gardens!!"
> > Rumor only of course, but I found it fascinating at that
> > time!
> 
> I take it you're talking about Joanie Baez here.  'Love Song To A Stranger'
> is one of her original songs.  And not a bad one, either.
> 
> Mark E in Seattle

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 08:23:04 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: Judy Collins & Dylan njc

Mark E. in Seattle wrote:

>Ok, now that you've given me some excellent input on where to go with Judy
>(I found 'Wildflowers' and 'Recollections' yesterday at Circuit City and
>bought them both), can I maybe get some suggestions about which Dylan to buy
>next?  I'm thinking 'Highway 61 Revisited'.  What else?  Suggestions please?

Highway 61 Revisited was the album before Blonde on Blonde. A classic. If 
you liked that "thin mercury sound" on Blonde on Blonde, you'll probably 
like Highway 61 Revisited. Too bad the gold disc is OP, because the 
remastering is so much better than the current Sony version. You won't know 
the difference.

Other Dylan albums that fall into the Buy Them Now category include John 
Wesley Harding, a stripped down set of songs now classic, including All 
Along the Watchtower in its acoustic glory. Slow Train Coming is the first 
of the "gospel trilogy" and arguably has Bob's most committed singing. 
Desire is the follow-up to Blood on the Tracks and, while not up to the 
level of that masterpiece, has some wonderful songs, such as Hurricane, and 
some very personal songs, such as Sara, and a few that may take a while to 
settle into.

For a great overview, with a goodly number of otherwise unreleased tracks, 
get Biograph, a 3-CD set that can be found Cheap.

Gil
NP Big Yellow Taxi mixes.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 08:49:37 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: funny Dylan NJC

emily wrote:

A long and great post about Dylan, concluding with

>ps: my friend told me that "another side of bob dylan"
>was recorded in one night, which i find amazing every
>time i listen to that record.

He had the help of a bottle or two of Beaujolais!

Any number of Dylan albums were recorded quickly. Planet Waves took three 
nights over about a week. John Wesley Harding was recorded in about three 
days (each session 2-3 weeks apart).  So was Bringing It All Back Home 
(three consecutive days).

Often the first take was the last, so the session players had to watch 
carefully when Bob showed them the chords.

Gil

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 09:06:48 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: Up to Me NJC

(Boston) Jim wrote:

>Roger's "Cardiff Rose" LP was a direct outgrowth of that traveling minstrel
>show, and it's one of my favorites of his solo albums. He included a brand
>new Dylan song on it, too - "Up To Me" - which was about to become "Tangled
>Up In Blue" on Dylan's "Blood On The Tracks." Dylan's own version of "Up To
>Me" (an early outtake from BOTT) can be heard on the "Biograph" box set.

Jim, did I read you right? Is McGuinn's version of "Up to Me" truly an 
early draft of "Tangled Up in Blue"? Because the final versions of either 
song are poles apart, and the extant earlier (and even later) versions of 
"Tangled Up in Blue" betray no connection to "Up to Me". Please clarify.

Gil

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 09:20:44 -0800
From: Randy Remote <guitarzan@saber.net>
Subject: Re: Thanks from a lurker !!

Howdy Paul!
Nice to have you on board-wonder if you are our first
Welshman? How did you get into Joni?

Paul Headon wrote:

> I would just like to thank all contributers to this list for keeping this
> lurker, and rare contributer, well and truly amused!
>
> Thanks, yours in Joni,
>
> Paul Headon.
> Wales

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 12:40:14 EST
From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com
Subject: Re: Thanks from a lurker !! NJC

<<Nice to have you on board-wonder if you are our first
Welshman? >>

If my memory serves me right, Jeff Hankins is also Welsh. Jeff is a neat guy and has been contributed some great stuff for the covers project! Thanks again Jeff!

And to add further Welsh content, a Welsh folk outfit (from Pontypridd) called The Triban recorded an early cover of Night In The City!

Bob

NP: Michael Holland, "Trash"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 12:44:20 -0500
From: "James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Up to Me NJC

Gil asked:
> Jim, did I read you right? Is McGuinn's version of "Up to Me" truly an
early draft of "Tangled Up in Blue"? Because the final versions of either
song are poles apart, and the extant earlier (and even later) versions of
"Tangled Up in Blue" betray no connection to "Up to Me". Please clarify. >

Oops! I'm so sorry. You are quite right, Gil, and I apologize for not
double-checking my memory before sending that post.

Instead of "Tangled Up In Blue," I should have written "You're Gonna Make Me
Lonesome When You Go." Dylan set aside "Up To Me" during the sessions for
"Blood On The Tracks," preferring to use the melody and the chord structure,
albeit with some revisions, as his vehicle for his lyrics to YGMMLWYG. He
was still writing the album as he was recording it, as is evident by
examining the outtakes and the session chronology.

A fascinating and worthwhile excerise is to listen to the BOTT outtakes (for
example) while reading the corresponding chapters in Paul Williams'
excellent "Bob Dylan: Performing Artist, Vol. 1." I'm currently in the
middle of a comprehensive study of Dylan's career to date, using the
Williams books as my guides. He writes wonderfully in terms of how specific
performances (including studio takes) move him or not, personally speaking,
and gets deeply into the various outtakes and concert performances which are
available to collectors. I began last summer with "The Minnesota Tapes"
(1961), and am now in the middle of Dylan's overtly Christian period (1980,
at present), listening to the unreleased songs recorded for what was to have
been the follow-up to the album "Saved."

Best,
(Boston) Jim

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 18:01:57 
From: "Timothy Spong" <tim_spong@hotmail.com>
Subject: Joni mention in NY Times, ref.  Abbey Lincoln

In Section 2, Arts and Leisure, of the Sunday, March 2, New York Times, on 
page 31, are two side-by-side articles about Abbey Lincoln. In one, "Abbey 
Lincoln, Maker of Her Own Genre," by Lara Pellegrinelli, is the following:

"Rather than being measured against Kern, Gershwin or a contemporary like 
Michel Legrand, she is better served by comparisons to other female 
songwriters who blossomed in the late 60's and early 70's like Nina Simone, 
Joni Mitchell and Dory Previn."

Tim Spong
Dover, Del., U.S.A.

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: 
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 13:44:23 -0500
From: "James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Up to Me SJC

From: James L. Leonard <jll@tampabay.rr.com>

> Instead of "Tangled Up In Blue," I should have written "You're Gonna Make
Me Lonesome When You Go." Dylan set aside "Up To Me" during the sessions for
"Blood On The Tracks," preferring to use the melody and the chord structure,
albeit with some revisions, as his vehicle for his lyrics to YGMMLWYG>

Oops, again! Make that "Shelter From The Storm." I just listened to "Up To
Me" again, and it's "Shelter From The Storm" I'm hearing (for sure)!

Okay, red-faced, I'll shut up now. :-)

(Boston) Jim

P.S. My original point about McGuinn having learned "Up To Me" and the early
version of Joni's "Dreamland" while touring with them in the Rolling Thunder
Revue - and then cutting them for his "Cardiff Rose" LP - still stands,
however.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 10:52:05 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: Up to Me NJC

Jim wrote:
>Gil asked:
> > Jim, did I read you right? Is McGuinn's version of "Up to Me" truly an
>early draft of "Tangled Up in Blue"? Because the final versions of either
>song are poles apart, and the extant earlier (and even later) versions of
>"Tangled Up in Blue" betray no connection to "Up to Me". Please clarify. >
>
>Oops! I'm so sorry. You are quite right, Gil, and I apologize for not
>double-checking my memory before sending that post.
>
>Instead of "Tangled Up In Blue," I should have written "You're Gonna Make Me
>Lonesome When You Go." Dylan set aside "Up To Me" during the sessions for
>"Blood On The Tracks," preferring to use the melody and the chord structure,
>albeit with some revisions, as his vehicle for his lyrics to YGMMLWYG. He
>was still writing the album as he was recording it, as is evident by
>examining the outtakes and the session chronology.

Almost right. See my reply to your next post.

>A fascinating and worthwhile excerise is to listen to the BOTT outtakes (for
>example) while reading the corresponding chapters in Paul Williams'
>excellent "Bob Dylan: Performing Artist, Vol. 1."

Small-World Dept.: I proofread Volume 1, and I'm quoted on the back of the 
dust jacket of the first edition.

>I'm currently in the
>middle of a comprehensive study of Dylan's career to date, using the
>Williams books as my guides. He writes wonderfully in terms of how specific
>performances (including studio takes) move him or not, personally speaking,
>and gets deeply into the various outtakes and concert performances which are
>available to collectors.

He has (or, perhaps, had) more of the same in Crawdaddy, which was still 
published a year or so ago. However, I was annoyed by his analysis of 
Dylan's 5-night stay at wherever it was in L.A. a few years ago. Few of us 
can afford that privilege, although of course now almost all of it is 
available if you hunt a bit.

>I began last summer with "The Minnesota Tapes"
>(1961), and am now in the middle of Dylan's overtly Christian period (1980,
>at present), listening to the unreleased songs recorded for what was to have
>been the follow-up to the album "Saved."

The boot entitled "Between Saved and Shot" has some revealing stuff.

Gil
NP Lead Balloon, from Taming the Tiger

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 10:58:27 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: Up to Me SJC

(Boston) Jim wrote:

> > Instead of "Tangled Up In Blue," I should have written "You're Gonna Make
>Me Lonesome When You Go." Dylan set aside "Up To Me" during the sessions for
>"Blood On The Tracks," preferring to use the melody and the chord structure,
>albeit with some revisions, as his vehicle for his lyrics to YGMMLWYG>
>
>Oops, again! Make that "Shelter From The Storm." I just listened to "Up To
>Me" again, and it's "Shelter From The Storm" I'm hearing (for sure)!
>
>Okay, red-faced, I'll shut up now. :-)

So close, Jim. Perhaps you're thinking of "Call Letter Blues" on THE 
BOOTLEG SERIES, which is a note for note replicant of "Meet Me in the Morning."

>P.S. My original point about McGuinn having learned "Up To Me" and the early
>version of Joni's "Dreamland" while touring with them in the Rolling Thunder
>Revue - and then cutting them for his "Cardiff Rose" LP - still stands,
>however.

Earlier versions of songs -- or tracking the provenance of the versions 
covered by somebody else -- are always revealing of the work process, which 
is usually fascinating. Some artists perform unfinished songs in concert, 
and years later when we buy the albums we seem to have missed something.

I don't know where I'm going with this, but I'd like to point out that 
McGuinn obviously had access to the original basement tapes acetate, but 
that Joan Baez did not, since her version of "You Ain't Goin' Nowhere" uses 
the published lyrics. Similarly, every cover of "All Along the Watchtower" 
follows Hendrix, not Dylan ("outside in the cold distance"/"outside in the 
distance").

Gil

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 19:04:53 +0000
From: colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>
Subject: Re: Am I still here?  plus some answers re ladies and BAFTAs (NJC)

>   I don't need a title, that's condescending.  Maybe you
> understand the feeling if you imagine someone calling you a "lord".

I see term lady in this context as in 'ladies and gentlemen' so lord is not the
male of lady. And yes people do still refer to men as gentlemen. i do!
sometimes......

>
>   And why on earth have people like Paul McCartney accepted
> the title "sir"?  I'm really disappointed.

yes that was very surprising as he was always so anti establishement.

>
>
>
> But I think it's a bit "rich" to call US citizens isolated, Colin, if you
> don't realise that people in the UK are just as isolated!

I don't agree. Not only has it been my experience with much interaction with
Americans but also what is ee and hear int he media. Their own citizens, here in
the media say so! Howewver, it is a HUGE country, so not too surprising.

>  When was the last
> time we discussed the Cannes or Berlin film prizes?  As a Belgian living in
> England, I don't even know who the Belgian prime minister is any more,
> because I live on a diet of BBC (radio 4) info and their focus is very very
> Anglo-Saxon!

Okay but there are MANY tv and radio stations. Loads. And loads of newspapers.
So if Radio 4 is your only sourvce of info then it will be loaded and biased to
UK issues.

>
>
> Anyway, the people on this list are great,

I quite agree!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 19:11:24 +0000
From: colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>
Subject: Methany/Map of world NJC

Thaought you Pat Methany fans might like to know that he composed the
soundtrack(and I assume played) for A Map of The World, a film with
Sigourney Weaver and Julianne Moore. I enjoyed the film, although enjoy
is probablt no the right word considering the subject matter.

However, no matter how hard I try I just cannot seem to warm to
Sigourney. I thought she was best as the bitch in Working Girl. In this
she was not a bitch, far from it, but I still found it very difficult to
feel for her. she confuses me. to me she comes across as unfeeling,
cold. No matter what i have seen her in. I saw recently in heartbreakers
too and thought she was miscast in that too, tho she wasn;'t very
pelasant but not very funny either!

- --
bw
colin
DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270,
Passap 6000, Duo80.

colin@tantra-apso.com
http://www.tantra-apso.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 14:12:34 -0500
From: "James L. Leonard" <jll@tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Up to Me SJC

> So close, Jim. Perhaps you're thinking of "Call Letter Blues" on THE
BOOTLEG SERIES, which is a note for note replicant of "Meet Me in the
Morning." >

I do remember that! It may even be the same backing track altogether, if I'm
recollecting correctly (this time).

(Man, I've listened to *so* much Bob in the past 8 months!)

But, really ... check out "Up To Me" on "Biograph" and think "Shelter From
The Storm." I'll bet you agree that UTM was set aside in favor of using the
melody and chord structure for the latter lyrics. I regret not pointing to
the correct song in the first place.

And Gil ... before I let you go ... I'm delighted and impressed to have met
the proofreader of Volume 1 of Williams' "Performing Artist" series. I'm
sure you're proud of your involvement, as I would be. (I don't remember
seeing a single typo, either!) You were absolutely right about "Between
Saved and Shot," by the way ... that's the boot I'm listening to now.

If I have some questions as I continue to explore Dylan's career in depth,
may I call on you from time to time?

Very glad I posted, and thanks for indulging me,
(Boston) Jim

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 11:31:22 -0800
From: Gil Lamont <glamont@api4animals.org>
Subject: Re: Up to Me NJC

(Boston) Jim wrote:


> > So close, Jim. Perhaps you're thinking of "Call Letter Blues" on THE
>BOOTLEG SERIES, which is a note for note replicant of "Meet Me in the
>Morning." >
>
>I do remember that! It may even be the same backing track altogether, if I'm
>recollecting correctly (this time).

Apparently "Meet Me in the Morning" *was* dubbed over a "Call Letter Blues" 
backing track (but not the one on THE BOOTLEG SERIES).

>(Man, I've listened to *so* much Bob in the past 8 months!)
>
>But, really ... check out "Up To Me" on "Biograph" and think "Shelter From
>The Storm." I'll bet you agree that UTM was set aside in favor of using the
>melody and chord structure for the latter lyrics. I regret not pointing to
>the correct song in the first place.

Per Clinton Heylin:

That Dylan was considering an altogether more downbeat final note seems 
borne out by the recording dates for "Up to Me." Originally recorded as a 
solo acoustic performance at the very first BLOOD ON THE TRACKS session, 
Dylan only returned to the song at the last session, having finally figured 
out a vocal delivery that conveyed all the lexicons of remorse he might be 
feeling (the version cut on the sixteenth has very few vocal idiosyncracies 
- -- he even pronounces "identity" like anyone else would). The lyrics to "Up 
to Me" fit previous patterns of Dylan closers -- "If we never meet again, 
baby remember me ..." Its musical motifs are also largely a continuation of 
BLOOD ON THE TRACKS's penultimate song, "Shelter from the Storm." However, 
Dylan decided to stick with "Buckets of Rain," featuring some of his most 
controlled picking, to conclude one of his most musical albums.

>And Gil ... before I let you go ... I'm delighted and impressed to have met
>the proofreader of Volume 1 of Williams' "Performing Artist" series. I'm
>sure you're proud of your involvement, as I would be. (I don't remember
>seeing a single typo, either!)

I just threw that in there to throw you off-balance. I'm prouder having 
gotten a free copy of the book out of it.

>You were absolutely right about "Between
>Saved and Shot," by the way ... that's the boot I'm listening to now.
>
>If I have some questions as I continue to explore Dylan's career in depth,
>may I call on you from time to time?

Of course you may, although you might want to off-list, as this might turn 
into the Dylan NJC group if we carry this on too far.

Gil

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 14:32:23 -0500
From: "Blair Fraipont" <donjuansrd80@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Debut albums NJC

     Yes that is what I meant.
      Blair>
>
>"Endreducing" ... is that an exercise program to slim one's butt? (insert
>emoticon here)
>
>I think you may have meant "Endtroducing."
>
>-Fred


_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 14:40:57 -0600
From: "mack watson-bush" <courtandspark@earthlink.net>
Subject: her former self njc

I got a kick and also an angry thought from this headline that I read in the
online daily fix from E.  Usually don't even read it but thought I would skim
it today.  Actress and former lesbian Anne Heche.........

Who wrote this?  This is the kind of crap that allows suppression of
homosexuals.  She cannot be a former lesbian.  She either is or she isn't.
This kind of writing only adds to the untruth that homosexuals, or anyone
else, CHOOSE their orientation.


mack

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 14:39:19 -0600
From: mann@chicagonet.net
Subject: Joni News on EW.COM

FYI:  Entertainment Weekly is spreading the news!
Just rec'd  in my email:

Todays EW News

      Hear & Now Allison Anders to direct a Joni Mitchell docu

   http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,214129~4~0~,00.html

Laura

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:53:12 +1300
From: "hell" <hell@ihug.co.nz>
Subject: Re: her former self njc

Mack wrote:

> I got a kick and also an angry thought from this headline that I read in
the
> online daily fix from E.  Usually don't even read it but thought I would
skim
> it today.  Actress and former lesbian Anne Heche.........
>
> Who wrote this?  This is the kind of crap that allows suppression of
> homosexuals.  She cannot be a former lesbian.  She either is or she isn't.
> This kind of writing only adds to the untruth that homosexuals, or anyone
> else, CHOOSE their orientation.

I don't know, I think the term "actress" is stretching it a bit too.... ;o)

As far as her sexual orientation, I don't think the words "former" or
"lesbian" apply in this case - "confused" would be a better word.

Seriously, I agree with you.  You either are, or you're not - no choice
involved.

Hell
____________________________
"To have great poets, there must be
great audiences too." - Walt Whitman

hell@ihug.co.nz
Hell's Personal Photo Page:
http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm

Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at:
http://www.nbls.co.nz

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 23:23:54 +0000
From: colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>
Subject: Re: her former self njc

mack watson-bush wrote:

> I got a kick and also an angry thought from this headline that I read in the
> online daily fix from E.  Usually don't even read it but thought I would skim
> it today.  Actress and former lesbian Anne Heche.........
>
> Who wrote this?  This is the kind of crap that allows suppression of
> homosexuals.  She cannot be a former lesbian.  She either is or she isn't.
> This kind of writing only adds to the untruth that homosexuals, or anyone
> else, CHOOSE their orientation.

Of course homesexuals choose to be attracted emotionally and physically to their
own sex just as we are to the opposite sex. But just to be different we only act
upon the former.
Heterosexuals are turned on too by their own sex. Why heteromen are constantly
rampant and both sexes do it for them but for some strange reason, they choose to
only act upon it with women. The same for hetero women but they act it out with
men.
Now don't you think this is silly? What on earth do you think stops hetero men
getting it off with other men? And heterowomen with other women? CHOICE of
course!!!! I hear hetero's say all the time how much they fancy the man next door
but 'i choose my wife' or vice versa.

all very clear.

Oh and Anne heche could be a gformer lesbian. After all Michael Jackson used to
be a different.......

>
>
> mack

- --
bw
colin
DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000,
Duo80.

colin@tantra-apso.com
http://www.tantra-apso.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 23:24:39 +0000
From: colin <colin@tantra-apso.com>
Subject: Re: her former self njc

> As far as her sexual orientation, I don't think the words "former" or
> "lesbian" apply in this case - "confused" would be a better word.
>
> Seriously, I agree with you.  You either are, or you're not - no choice
> involved.

Are bi-sexuals confused?

>
>
> Hell
> ____________________________
> "To have great poets, there must be
> great audiences too." - Walt Whitman
>
> hell@ihug.co.nz
> Hell's Personal Photo Page:
> http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm
>
> Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at:
> http://www.nbls.co.nz

- --
bw
colin
DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000,
Duo80.

colin@tantra-apso.com
http://www.tantra-apso.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 13:25:53 +1300
From: "hell" <hell@ihug.co.nz>
Subject: Re: her former self njc

Colin wrote:

> > As far as her sexual orientation, I don't think the words "former" or
> > "lesbian" apply in this case - "confused" would be a better word.
> >
> > Seriously, I agree with you.  You either are, or you're not - no choice
> > involved.
>
> Are bi-sexuals confused?

I wasn't aware that we were talking generally, Colin - this comment was
specifically made about Anne Heche, not the world in general.  And I stick
to what I said, which is only my own personal opinion - I think she IS
confused, bisexuality doesn't come into it.

But since you ask, no, I don't think bisexuals are confused but identifying
as a bisexual (in my opinion) does mean having a choice, as opposed to being
gay/lesbian where you identify with one gender (your own), and one gender
only.  I don't want to start yet another discussion on the whole
gay/lesbian/bisexual debate, so this will be my last words on the subject!

Hell
____________________________
"To have great poets, there must be
great audiences too." - Walt Whitman

hell@ihug.co.nz
Hell's Personal Photo Page:
http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm

Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at:
http://www.nbls.co.nz

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:13:50 -0800
From: "Kakki" <KakkiB@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Inner Strength (njc)

INNER STRENGTH

 If you can start the day without caffeine or pep
pills, If you can be cheerful, ignoring aches and
pains, If you can resist complaining and boring people with your troubles,
If you can eat the same food everyday and be grateful for it, If you can
understand when loved ones are too busy to give you time, If you an overlook
people taking things out on you when, If
through no fault of yours, something goes wrong, If you can take criticism
and blame without resentment, If you can face the world without lies and
deceit, If you can conquer tension without medical help, If you
can always sleep without the aid of drugs, Then, You are probably the family
dog.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:11:51 -0800
From: "Mark or Travis" <mark.travis@gte.net>
Subject: Re: List members' comments on Judy Blue Eyes (SJC)

> Thanks again, do you know what album that song appears on?
> I'd like to hear it.
>

I couldn't remember the album that 'Love Song to a Stranger' was on so I
went to CDNow to see if I could find it.  Apparently it's no longer in print
so I just went & dug it out of my vinyl.  The song originally appeared on
'Come From the Shadows'.  You can find it on one or two 'Best of'
collections on cd.  There was also 'Love Song to a Stranger Part II' on
'From Every Stage', a different song that references the first one.

Mark E in Seattle

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 22:45:11 EST
From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com
Subject: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black  Case!!!

Hi, Bob (Muller, aka SCJoniGuy) and all,

Still thrilled with all the new discoveries from your recent mailing (and my 
life is in chaos at the moment, so the glow of contentment they provide is 
especially well-timed and appreciated), but the best one, I discovered by 
accident (caught it as I was dozing off -- it wasn't written on the CD 
cover).  Most of the jmdl veterans surely know about this strikingly 
different version of one of Joni's best.   It was hidden at the tail end of a 
CD (and as i said, not marked).  In any case, for those of us who are more 
recent members, check out these lyrics to an (early?/work in progress?) 
version of A Case Of You:

Just before our ship got lost, you said,
"I am as constant as the Northern Star" 
"You're silly as a northern fish," says I,
"If you want me I'll be at the bar."
On the back of a cartoon coaster pad
That didn't make me laugh at all
I drew a map of Canada
Oh, Canada!
And I charted our last squall.

[Love all the nautical references!!! -- W]

(Chorus is more or less the same as the "standard" version.)

Oh, I am a lonely painter
I live in a box of paints
I'm frightened by the devil
And scared to death by saints.

(Continues the same as standard until the last line of this verse:)

Part of you pours out of me
In black and red design.

[W -- Why black and red?  Black is the color of notes written out, I suppose, 
and red is the color of blood -- but is there a nautical reference here, too?]

(The rest of the song is pretty much the same as the standard again.)

In addition to the changes in lyrics, some of the melody is changed, e.g., 
the line
"That didn't make me laugh at all..."
sort of drops down lower, more melancholy to my ears, than in the standard 
"in the blue TV screen light"

What can I say -- this is the kind of thing a joniphile lives for -- thank 
you, Bob!

Fondly,

Walt

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:48:28 -0600
From: Mark Domyancich <mark@jmdl.com>
Subject: Re: Motherload O' Joni - (Real Good For Free)

You guys should know that MP3 is a lossy compression scheme - i.e, 
the encoding process removes certain frequencies to reduce the file 
size. That's why they are so small. The quality will be noticebly 
poorer than the uncompressed soundfile. You should also not trade 
these discs with people because of these reasons.

Mark
NP-Jack Johnson, Latitude 32 Radio Show, Drink The Water

At 5:30 PM -0800 3/5/02, Julian Parker-Burns wrote:
>Hello All,
>I'm gonna make an offer you can't (or will be really
>hard to) refuse if you are a newbe with access to a
>burner and or a computer....In the spirit of all of
>the great folks who have given me these and other
>incredible rare Joni recordings...I have compiled two
>CDs of 160kb MP3s of my favorite unreleased Joni
>Mitchell recordings (live and otherwise):
<snip>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 23:09:42 EST
From: Dflahm@aol.com
Subject: Re: Joni mention in NY Times, ref.  Abbey Lincoln

Nina Simone, Dory Previn and Abbey Lincoln are all respectable talents as 
songwriters, but to suggest that they reach the same level as Joni Mitchell 
is, IMO,
simply ludicrous.

                                                                              
       DAVID LAHM

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:14:55 -0800
From: Randy Remote <guitarzan@saber.net>
Subject: Re: Up to Me NJC

Gil Lamont wrote:

> Jim wrote:
> >A fascinating and worthwhile excerise is to listen to the BOTT outtakes (for
> >example) while reading the corresponding chapters in Paul Williams'
> >excellent "Bob Dylan: Performing Artist, Vol. 1."
>
> Small-World Dept.: I proofread Volume 1, and I'm quoted on the back of the
> dust jacket of the first edition.

More small world-I sat with Paul, who is a friend of a friend, at one
of the Warfield shows during Dylan's 'coming out' as a Christian
doing the Slow Train shows in '80. He wrote a slim volume called
"Dylan-What Happened?" afterwards.  I also played guitar on an EP
for his then-love, Sachiko.
Is Crawdaddy still alive?
RR

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:16:56 -0800
From: Randy Remote <guitarzan@saber.net>
Subject: Re: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black Case!!!

BigWaltinSF@aol.com wrote:

> Part of you pours out of me
> In black and red design.
>
> [W -- Why black and red?  Black is the color of notes written out, I suppose,
> and red is the color of blood -- but is there a nautical reference here, too?]

Black and red (dark red) are Scorpio colors.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 23:20:46 -0500
From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" <jlamadoo@fuse.net>
Subject: Re: Bob vs. Joni, 50% JC

Oh, sure.  By all means, Mister Dylan is a word-meister of the first order.
And in my view he kicked the doors down for everyone else to write about
more varied topics.

(Can anyone imagine hearing Shawn Colvin's song about arson on the radio
without someone breaking down the barriers first?)

As a pioneer, he enriched my musical life and the lives of scores of my
heroes enormously.  Yes, by all means let's celebrate Bobby along with all
the other fine songwriters.

But if we're gonna judge him on his chops as a musician alone?  Or as a
singer, alone?  Or rate him according to the daring with which he selected
accompanists?



I love him, but................




........ he's no Joni Mitchell.








Lama

(who's very satisfied with himself for praising Joni on her own discussion
list.  How very.... predictable.)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 23:08:28 -0500 (EST)
From: rosemjoy@aol.com (rose joy)
Subject: A message from rose joy

Hello JMDL,

rose joy thought you would be interested in this article from EW.com:

Hear 
http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,214129~4~0~,00.html

Comments: More news on the "Blue Movie"
Check out the cartoon illustration of Joni, YIKES!
http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,214129~4~0~,00.html

- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
To sign up for our daily updates on the latest entertainment news and reviews, go to EW.com: 
http://monitor.ew.com/ew/registration/registration_signup.asp

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 23:23:42 EST
From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com
Subject: Re: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black Case!!!

In a message dated 3/5/02 8:17:29 PM, guitarzan@saber.net writes:

<< Black and red (dark red) are Scorpio colors. >>

Interesting -- I didn't know that -- So... do we know whom she was talking 
to/about in CoY and whether he was a Scorpio?

Thanks for the input,

Walt

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 04:49:48 -0300
From: "Wally Kairuz" <wallykai@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: RE: A Hidden Treasure -- A different, nautical, red-and-black   Case!!!

walt,
i have never heard this version. where did you find it????? did you know
that there is also an alternative version of 'all i want'?
wally

------------------------------

End of JMDL Digest V2002 #104
*****************************

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