From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #96 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, February 28 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 096 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Yodelling (NJC per se!) [M.Russell@iaea.org] Today in History: February 28 [les@jmdl.com] Today's Articles: February 28 [les@jmdl.com] Re: Broadcasters Outraged over Proposed Reporting Rules NJC [RobSher50@] RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc ["Kate Bennett" ] the best of the grammys (njc) ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Broadcasters Outraged over Proposed Reporting Rules NJC ["Kakki" ] Joni wasn't present for the lifetime award ceremony [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc [chiaroscuro@SNET.Net] NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: AbFab (NJC) [chiaroscuro@snet.net] Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: AbFab (NJC) ["Sharon L. Buffington" ] Poem: Joni Mitchell [Deb Messling ] Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... ["Sharon L. Buffington" ] Re: alison putting out olympic flame NJC ["Sharon L. Buffington" ] Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Today's Articles: February 28 (Court & Spark) [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Joni question -- Joanie B., Joni J., Joni B. and Judy C. ["Timothy Sp] Re: was Broadcasters Outraged ... advice to artists NJC ["Brenda" ] Re: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc ["Brenda" ] Re: Grammy broadcast & observations(ljc) [Mike Friedman ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:00:54 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: Yodelling (NJC per se!) Anyone who likes yodelling should check out the Austrian group "Broadlahn". They take yodelling to a new and astonishing place - it's like the Joni music of yodelling - the add9sus4 chords vs. simple majors/minors. Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 03:20:43 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today in History: February 28 On February 28 in Joni Mitchell History: 1972: Joni performs at Music Hall in Boston 1996: Mitchell edges hot competition from the Eagles, Mariah Carey and Madonna to clinch the Best Pop Album category for Turbulent Indigo at the 38th annual Grammy Awards held at Los Angeles' Shrine Auditorium. Surprised and grateful in receipt, Mitchell thanks co-recipient Klein (from whom she is now separated), while her artwork for the album, created with Robbie Cavolina, is named Best Recording Package. - ------------------------ Search the "Today" database at http://www.jmdl.com/today ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 03:20:43 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Articles: February 28 On February 28 the following articles were published: 1974: "A Delicate Balance" - Rolling Stone (Review - Album, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/740228rs.cfm 1974: "Review of St Louis, MO Concert" - Rolling Stone (Review - Concert) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/740228rsx.cfm - ------------------------ http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 03:28:57 EST From: RobSher50@aol.com Subject: Re: Broadcasters Outraged over Proposed Reporting Rules NJC Dear Kate, You wrote: I think I only read the one in the Chicago Tribune. I'd love to see the other one if you have it. He seems to be a very nice and dedicated person. I agree. I had the fortune of jazz pianist George Duke listening to my demo. He said he really liked my voice, but could not take on any more artists right now. ( He's an Indie, I think) I'm getting that "we ain't got no money" feeling from many recording labels, both Indie and Major. I got the drift that things are tough right now. I also agree with your point about the RIAA. You tried to warn me a long time ago about the recording industry and referred me to Aimee Mann's website (for which I am still grateful). I've been a little like the wayward child with stars in her eyes. I have hopefully seen the error of my ways. This can be an ugly business, but it's where I have to be because I know this is what I was born to do. So now I am drinking in as much information as possible and trying to avoid the potential pitfalls. So true. I had a very bad experience with an A&R guy/Producer from a record label 20 odd years ago. It left a taste so bad in my mouth that I dropped out of the music scene completely. I was young and naive like your niece. I didn't know people could be so deceptive and cunning. I just wish I hadn't let that person cause me to shut music out of my life for 20 years. Big mistake. That's pretty heavy about your friend. I have an entertainment lawyer if I can ever pay her the retainer! But from what you are saying, not all of them are to be trusted either. I believe what you are saying about the more you sell, the more you owe. I watched a Behind the Music special with TLC and they broke down how you can sell millions of records and still end up broke. Kate, if I could just make a decent living at this, I think I could be happy. My dream is also to collaborate with as many artists as I have time on this earth for. Thanks very much for the insight. I am loving all of this and learning so much! Now I see how right you were from the very beginning. Sherelle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 00:38:17 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc You took the words right out of my brain...lol...my son, who was deep into rapping in his early years, was chosen to play the lead in Music Man in 6th grade...the teacher had always wanted to do the play but never attempted it before. When rap became popular she soon had many kids who could pull off that character... >>>The first rap song was the train sequence from "The Music Man" circa 1962. The whole cadence and everything is there, the train wheels taking the place of the drum machine.<<< ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 00:38:21 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: the best of the grammys (njc) Did you notice that the Outkast guy stole Ashara's Joni wig! >>>So my nominee for the best of the Grammys is . . . Al Green's gold lame suit! Man, I would love to wear that to Jonifest. Bet it woudn't even need alterations. --Bob<<< ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 00:28:33 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Broadcasters Outraged over Proposed Reporting Rules NJC Sherelle, > I would love to come to California to play! My goal is to start playing coast > to coast within the next year and a half. If that happens, I can only owe it > to special people here on the Joni list whose actions speak louder than the > kindest words. I'm so excited and happy for you pursuing your music again! I really hope you can come to California - it would be fantastic to see and hear you here. Please keep us posted on your plans. > By the way, Kakki, your insight into the record industry has been so > wonderful! I feel like an apprentice trying to drink all of this knowledge > in! I love it! Oh thank you - my knowledge is just piecemeal but I have had a burning interest in music biz issues ever since I saw a number of friends get badly used and abused in it years ago. One friend who had it all - voice, musicianship and songwriting genius just stopped it all one day from the disillusionment. What a loss of a gift. I see changes coming, however, and I am hopeful - despite the big bumps and complications that are happening in that world right now. I'm cheering for you Sherelle and wishing you all the best! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 05:29:09 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: something wrong with list? Is there something wrong with the Joni list? I'm getting tons of NJC mail but almost no Joni. I saw a message from Rose about Joni presenting at the Grammies, but no follow-up. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- messling@enter.net - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 07:25:14 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Joni wasn't present for the lifetime award ceremony I got this AOL. Joni was in Toronto and was not present for the lifetime achievement awards, but here are some words on her behalf from whomever this person was who accepted the award for her. rose http://demand1.stream.aol.com/ramgen/aol/us/aolmusic/specials/2002/grammys/web /grammys_lifetime_achievement_bb8.rm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:27:38 -0500 From: chiaroscuro@SNET.Net Subject: Re: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc What about Blondie's "Rapture" ? What's the date on that one? When I think of early rap, that song comes to mind. Heather At 09:50 AM 2/27/02 -0800, Randy Remote wrote: >Rap's dirty little secret is that it was invented by white people. >The first rap song was the train sequence from "The Music Man" >circa 1962. The whole cadence and everything is there, the train >wheels taking the place of the drum machine. > >the invention of the Model T Ford made the trouble >made the people want to get, want to get >want to get up and go >seven eight nine twenty three miles to the county seat >yes, sir >yes, sir >now who's gonna patronize a two by four kinda store anymore? >RR ; ) > >Gil Lamont wrote: > > > To what degree does the history of rap predate the mid to late 1970s? > > > There's also Bob Dylan's "Subterranean Homesick Blues" from 1965, which I > > never connected as rap until I saw it performed as a rap song ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:32:48 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... Boy, what a totally embarrassing night for music. The Grammy's ranged from stomach-turning to enraging to out and out dull. Talk about your junk food for juveniles! I should have just turned it off after U2's opening performance of "Walk On", but then I would have missed Mary J. Blige's RIVETING performance! Definitely the moment of the night. Damn, that was real. Imagine what she could do with a GOOD song. Other than that, the best musical moment was George Thorogood's UPS commercial. Inspired. Jon Stewart was dreadful. The presenters had the professionalism of 3rd graders. At least Pam Anderson was honest as to why she was there... Dylan was fine, but please, no more close-ups. I enjoyed him a lot more when I was about 100 yards away. But it WAS very cool when the camera flashed where he was supposed to be and he was nowhere to be seen. He DID manage to at least rise above the nonsense. And nonsense it was. Bob, trying to clear my ears out by playing: John Mayer, "Great Indoors" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:35:13 -0500 From: chiaroscuro@snet.net Subject: Re: AbFab (NJC) That entire weight loss episode was hilarious!! Heather At 10:41 PM 2/27/02 -0800, Mark or Travis wrote: > > I love this show - can you tell?! And if we're re-enacting scenes, I get > > the sleep-jogging. God knows, I could use the exercise! > > > > Hell > >Can I play God in Eddy's dream sequence? I do a mean Marianne Faithful >impression! > >The morning sun touched lightly on >The eyes of Lucy Jordan.... > >(and besides some of you who were at Ashara's in 99 can attest that I look >stunning in a blonde wig) > >Mark E in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:49:38 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... Oh, I forgot to mention the entire Ralph Stanley/ Soggy Bottom Boys/ Alison-Emmylou-Gillian section, ALL of which was wonderful! And T-Bone Burnett's acceptance speech, when he noted that their record sold 5 million copies with virtually NO airplay should be a wake-up call, was also superb. My sentiments exactly, and sorta in tune with what we've been talking about. And I guess they had to pay Mariah Carey a huge sum NOT to perform! ;~) Bob, still cleaning the teeny-bop out of my ears with: Ryan Adams, "New York, New York" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:03:15 -0600 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: Re: AbFab (NJC) Dear Helen: I always have a good laugh over your Ab Fab posts. I have never seen Ab Fab. I do not believe we get it on Minnesota PBS or Wisconsin PBS. Any thoughts where I mights see them? Love and peace....Sharon hell wrote: > > Alison wrote: > > > LOL! so true! i enjoyed that transcript so much, but i > > feel sorry for the poor bastards that haven't seen the > > show, because the accents add so much to the language. > > i think we should have some sort of ab-fab-off at > > jonifest in woodstock. it will be so out of place and > > hilarious. we'll reennact our favorite scenes--i got > > dibs on eddie's father's funeral. > > alison e. in slc, sweetie! > > bonus quote: > > Saffy - 'I thought they didn't let people with drug > > convictions into America.' > > Patsy - 'It's not so much a conviction, darling. It's > > more of a strong belief.' > > OK, if we're going to have an AbFab quote competition, I have to throw these > in: > > Saffron has just convinced her mother to let her come to Marrakech. > > Eddie's response: "Well, but as your mother, I take no responsibility for > your well-being, all right. You come with us, you're on your own." > > Or this one, in full rant mode as she conducts her (and Patsy's) defense > after being arrested for numerous driving-related offences: > > Eddie: "Yes. Yes! Why, oh why, do we pay taxes, um? I mean, just to have > bloody parking restrictions and buggery-ugly traffic wardens, and > bollocky-pedestrian-bloody-crossings, and those bastard railings outside > shops, so you can't even get in them? I mean, I know they are there to stop > stupid people running into the street and killing themselves, but we're not > all stupid, we don't all need nursemaiding. I mean, why not just have a > 'Stupidity Tax', just tax the stupid people." > > Patsy (somewhat over-excited): "Let them die!" > > I love this show - can you tell?! And if we're re-enacting scenes, I get > the sleep-jogging. God knows, I could use the exercise! > > Hell > ____________________________ > "To have great poets, there must be > great audiences too." - Walt Whitman > > hell@ihug.co.nz > Hell's Personal Photo Page: > http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm > > Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: > http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:00:07 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: Poem: Joni Mitchell I've been trying to post this, but for some reason I'm not seeing it on the list. If this is a duplicate posting, please forgive me! Here is the poem "Joni Mitchell," by Joseph Hutchinson. I found it in the anthology Sweet Nothings, and it was reprinted from Puerto del Sol. Water falls white on the white washed stones, fingers light on piano or the spine of a lover. Sobs and exultations, the open mouths and eyes of astounded houses, doves dead in mid-air, a scatter of leaves like torn astrologies. With her voice full of swords and blossoms, salt and blond honey, voice like the ruffle of air off the tip of the heron's wing, she sings the scrawl of blood and the fiery scripture of nerves written under the skin. We've slept like mountains, but now drum and saxophone swim in our bodies, hook-jawed salmon that leap the black keys, dying for the drowned genital stars, their fine bones singing like tuning forks. And there are guitars overflowing like drunken goblets, shiny sea-turtles dragging inland, heavy with eggs. There are sparrows dreaming in the cradles of her wrists, and roses, and ashes, and oceans collapsing on empty beaches, sliding back helpless and rising again. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Deb Messling -^..^- messling@enter.net - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:17:03 -0600 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... Dear Bob: I could not agree more. Stewart was baaaad from the moment his clothes came off...to his opening his mouth about some group...bad taste. When Mathews sand The Space Between...I told my friends who were here for the whole miserable program "Bob from our Joni group does it soooo much better." Hey...call me a lesbian...but I can not get into music with boys grabbing what they hope is in their crotches. It was more than enough to watch it in the summer on the ballfield...but now... And those close ups of Dylan...his eyes did look like.... I did enjoy the tribute to Gershwin .... Love and Peace....Sharon SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > Boy, what a totally embarrassing night for music. The Grammy's ranged from stomach-turning to enraging to out and out dull. Talk about your junk food for juveniles! I should have just turned it off after U2's opening performance of "Walk On", but then I would have missed Mary J. Blige's RIVETING performance! Definitely the moment of the night. Damn, that was real. Imagine what she could do with a GOOD song. > > Other than that, the best musical moment was George Thorogood's UPS commercial. Inspired. > > Jon Stewart was dreadful. The presenters had the professionalism of 3rd graders. At least Pam Anderson was honest as to why she was there... > > Dylan was fine, but please, no more close-ups. I enjoyed him a lot more when I was about 100 yards away. But it WAS very cool when the camera flashed where he was supposed to be and he was nowhere to be seen. He DID manage to at least rise above the nonsense. > > And nonsense it was. > > Bob, trying to clear my ears out by playing: > > John Mayer, "Great Indoors" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:19:48 -0600 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > Oh, I forgot to mention the entire Ralph Stanley/ Soggy Bottom Boys/ Alison-Emmylou-Gillian section, ALL of which was wonderful! Yes...Bob...this WAS the very best. I forgot it in my zeal to down the Grammys. S ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 06:10:12 -0800 (PST) From: anne@sandstrom.com Subject: Re: alison putting out olympic flame NJC Eva Cassidy. So, drop everything and buy her album Songbird today. Right now! The whole album - actually all of her work - is that good. lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:15:45 -0500 From: Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... Nonsense perhaps, but I liked some of Jon Stewarts jokes and we had fun laughing at the proceedings in general... I thought there were some other nice musical moments Joshua Bell was amazing on the violin, I enjoyed the duet with Nelly Furtado and Steve Vai, And India Arie performing her song "Video".. Did anyone else notice that during Alicia Key's performance, it sounded like someone had left a metronome on or was that supposed to be a drum track? Victor ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:25:39 -0600 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: Re: alison putting out olympic flame NJC Dear Anne: Her CD is wonderful. I first heard it last String when a friend made a copy of her Songbird tape. Stings, Field's of Gold and Cassidy's interpretation of Over The Rainbow remain among my favorites. I am so sorry she was lost to the world at such an early age. Love and Peace...Sharon anne@sandstrom.com wrote: > > Eva Cassidy. > > So, drop everything and buy her album Songbird today. > Right now! The whole album - actually all of her work - > is that good. > > lots of love > Anne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 06:42:25 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: AbFab (NJC) If you get either Comedy Central or BBC America, they run AbFab. I have just really started watching it during the last season and I'm an addict now. Every time I run across it I have to tune in! Hilarious! Mark E in Seattle > Dear Helen: > > I always have a good laugh over your Ab Fab posts. I have never seen Ab > Fab. I do not believe we get it on Minnesota PBS or Wisconsin PBS. Any > thoughts where I mights see them? > > Love and peace....Sharon > > hell wrote: > > > > Alison wrote: > > > > > LOL! so true! i enjoyed that transcript so much, but i > > > feel sorry for the poor bastards that haven't seen the > > > show, because the accents add so much to the language. > > > i think we should have some sort of ab-fab-off at > > > jonifest in woodstock. it will be so out of place and > > > hilarious. we'll reennact our favorite scenes--i got > > > dibs on eddie's father's funeral. > > > alison e. in slc, sweetie! > > > bonus quote: > > > Saffy - 'I thought they didn't let people with drug > > > convictions into America.' > > > Patsy - 'It's not so much a conviction, darling. It's > > > more of a strong belief.' > > > > OK, if we're going to have an AbFab quote competition, I have to throw these > > in: > > > > Saffron has just convinced her mother to let her come to Marrakech. > > > > Eddie's response: "Well, but as your mother, I take no responsibility for > > your well-being, all right. You come with us, you're on your own." > > > > Or this one, in full rant mode as she conducts her (and Patsy's) defense > > after being arrested for numerous driving-related offences: > > > > Eddie: "Yes. Yes! Why, oh why, do we pay taxes, um? I mean, just to have > > bloody parking restrictions and buggery-ugly traffic wardens, and > > bollocky-pedestrian-bloody-crossings, and those bastard railings outside > > shops, so you can't even get in them? I mean, I know they are there to stop > > stupid people running into the street and killing themselves, but we're not > > all stupid, we don't all need nursemaiding. I mean, why not just have a > > 'Stupidity Tax', just tax the stupid people." > > > > Patsy (somewhat over-excited): "Let them die!" > > > > I love this show - can you tell?! And if we're re-enacting scenes, I get > > the sleep-jogging. God knows, I could use the exercise! > > > > Hell > > ____________________________ > > "To have great poets, there must be > > great audiences too." - Walt Whitman > > > > hell@ihug.co.nz > > Hell's Personal Photo Page: > > http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm > > > > Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: > > http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:51:06 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > Boy, what a totally embarrassing night for music. The Grammy's ranged from stomach-turning to enraging to out and out dull. Talk about your junk food for juveniles! I should have just turned it off after U2's opening performance of "Walk On"... > Imagine what she could do with a GOOD song.... > > > Jon Stewart was dreadful. The presenters had the professionalism of 3rd graders. .. > Dylan was fine, but please, no more close-ups. I enjoyed him a lot more when I was about 100 yards away. ... > > And nonsense it was..... > > Bob, trying to clear my ears out....... But tell us, Bob. How did you REALLY feel about the Grammy's????? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:03:40 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: AbFab (NJC) In a message dated 2/28/2002 9:43:16 AM Eastern Standard Time, mark.travis@gte.net writes: > If you get either Comedy Central or BBC America, they run AbFab I've also seen it at the video stores for rentals (in case you don't get Comedy Central) Jimmy, who loves AbFab so much I named my new puppy Saffy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 07:19:04 -0800 From: "Stephen Epstein" Subject: joni on front page of National Post A nice coloured pic of Joni on the front page of today's National Post with the caption: "Grammy Awards pay homage to Prairie songstress Joni Mitchell" Go to www.nationalpost.com and scroll down to Arts and Life to read the article- unfortunately no pic on the web :-( Best to all Stephen in Vancouver Wishing he didn't watch the Grammy's last night! _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:20:30 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC So glad Joni wasn't there... <> Like everything else, I continually set my sights too high. Looks like I gave up too quick. I went to bed right before Joshua Bell, and missed all the performances that Victor raved about. :~( Including India.Arie, who I would have wanted to hear. And was that REALLY Billy Joel in Mike Myers "Fat Bastard" costume? ;~) I'll give him credit though for duetting with Tony Bennett & holding his own. But I digress...anyway, maybe the suits will realize that record sales are down because the SHIT they're pushing is just that...shit. (yeah, right...) And how about that whole 'downloading is killing music' bullshit speech? That was even dumber than that N'Synch number!! Bob NP: Ryan Adams, "Nobody Girl" (winner of the coveted "Bobby" for song of the year!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:16:30 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Today's Articles: February 28 (Court & Spark) 1974: "A Delicate Balance" - Rolling Stone (Review - Album, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/740228rs.cfm This is a GREAT synopsis of Court & Spark...Mark in Seattle, this article touches on lots of the C&S issues we discussed way back. And also brings up another good topic - Joni's relation to & use of water in her work. Might be worth some further discussion...Landau certainly says it better than I did. Bob NP: Ryan, "The Bar Is A Beautiful Place" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:35:43 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: Re: Polka, was Yodelling (NJC ) ok, i'm not a polka fan of any kind.... BUT-- an exboyfriend of mine was obsessed with Brave Combo. they sort of combine polka with rock and jazz and lots of other influences. they really do kick ass polka, especially live. think bela fleck's bluegrass jazz fusion, but for polka. wow, that sounds weird... what can i say. he was a professional jazz guitarist, and the only man i've ever dated who owned HOSL. alison e. in slc np: wfuv. ps: for any vagina monologue/eve ensler fans, she'll be on talk of the nation later today. (NPR) - --- Kakki <> wrote: > I saw this today and thought of some of you all ;-D > Yes, the Grammys really > does have this category of awards...... > > Best Polka Album > > We Are Not the Enemy: Kick Ass Polka > Brave Combo Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:38:59 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Today's Articles: February 28 (Court & Spark) SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > 1974: "A Delicate Balance" - Rolling Stone > (Review - Album, with photographs) > http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/740228rs.cfm > > This is a GREAT synopsis of Court & Spark...Mark in Seattle, this article touches on lots of the C&S issues we discussed way back. And also brings up another good topic - Joni's relation to & use of water in her work. It is a great read, Bob. But all I could say was My God, was it really 28 years ago? And then wonder about all those people I was close with then. We must have put this record on every night for a year when we got together. Jerry NP: Laura Nyro - Lu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:44:29 EST From: BRYAN8847@aol.com Subject: Grammy broadcast & observations Well, the Lifetime Achievement honorees got about 10-15 seconds each, even less than I'd estimated. That aside, I thought it was a total bummer that they used BYT (in addition to BSN) as the musical background for Joni's segment. They certainly could have used something more musically substantial, rather than further strengthening the general public's conception of Joni as "that taxi song singer," which is exactly what an acquaintance of mine said recently (he dropped a notch or two in my esteem when he said that! I tried to educate him.) Joni should be given the Legend Award, Grammy's highest honor. It in not awarded every year. While Ms. Keys is apparently talented and her album may deserve notice, I can't help but get a little hot under the collar when a newcomer wins as many Grammys in one night as Joni has won in her entire career! Bryan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:00:31 -0500 From: "blonde in the bleachers" Subject: Re: Grammy broadcast & observations(ljc) Is it just my imagination or do the Grammy's get worse every year? The lifetime achievement award recipients were usurped by the head of the recording academies comments on illegal downloading of music. Give me a break! It seemed he was doing this much more for the benefit of the recording labels as opposed to the actual artists who make the music. You could hear people booing him and those kids that he used as an experiment they must have felt like the biggest asses in the place! About Alicia Keyes winning 5 Grammy's, another young black woman several years ago won 5 awards and hasn't been heard from since. Her name? Lauren Hill. So take heart Bryan, obviously if Joni doesn't seem to give enough thought to be at the Grammy's then why should we care if she wins 1 or 100 Grammy's. Also did Bob Dylan look like a stuffed wax dummy with a lot of bad make-up on or is it just my imagination? >From: BRYAN8847@aol.com >Reply-To: BRYAN8847@aol.com >To: joni@smoe.org >Subject: Grammy broadcast & observations >Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:44:29 EST > >Well, the Lifetime Achievement honorees got about 10-15 seconds each, even >less than I'd estimated. That aside, I thought it was a total bummer that >they used BYT (in addition to BSN) as the musical background for Joni's >segment. They certainly could have used something more musically substantial, >rather than further strengthening the general public's conception of Joni as >"that taxi song singer," which is exactly what an acquaintance of mine said >recently (he dropped a notch or two in my esteem when he said that! I tried >to educate him.) > >Joni should be given the Legend Award, Grammy's highest honor. It in not >awarded every year. > >While Ms. Keys is apparently talented and her album may deserve notice, I >can't help but get a little hot under the collar when a newcomer wins as many >Grammys in one night as Joni has won in her entire career! > >Bryan - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:07:43 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc Randy Remote wrote: >Rap's dirty little secret is that it was invented by white people. >The first rap song was the train sequence from "The Music Man" >circa 1962. The whole cadence and everything is there, the train >wheels taking the place of the drum machine. The Music Man premiered on Broadway in December 1957, after six years of work and 40 drafts. "Rock Island" is the train song, and that was in the show at the premiere. Given that the musical is Willson's reminiscences of being 10 years old in 1912, chances are even the "rap" song is based on earlier models. So rap is probably at least as old as rock'n'roll?! Gil ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:10:34 -0500 From: "Janine Sherman" Subject: Joan/Grammies Was JOAN at the Grammies? Thanks anyone, Janine - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 17:32:20 From: "Timothy Spong" Subject: Re: Joni question -- Joanie B., Joni J., Joni B. and Judy C. Lama, Marian in Vienna and all jmdlers, On Wed, 27 Feb. 2002, "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" wrote (in Re: Joni question on The Weakest Link): > >You'd be surprised! You'd get "oh, that Baez woman. What's it? Joni >Baez! No, it can't be her! She didn't write. It must be that one who >wrote 'Both Sides Now'. You know, Joni Collins!" > >Relishing Joni trivia at 4 AM. Tsk, tsk. >Lama > .... which was in response to what Marian in Vienna wrote on Tue., 26 Feb. 2002 (or, maybe, earlier on the 27th): >Last night on the British version of The Weakest Link, one of the questions >was something like: > >"Roberta Anderson, composer of a number of songs which were popular during >the 60's and 70's, is better known as Joni ........." > >I thought the question was too easy! What other women singers have a first >name of Joni??? > >Marian >Vienna > ... about which, I comment: Joan Baez, whose discussion-group "listserv" similar to this one I subscribe to, DID write some of the songs she has recorded, including one of her best-known, "Diamonds and Rust." I don't know how many of her '60s and '70s recordings are her own compositions. And on the "*joan-list," people often refer to Joan as "Joanie," indistinguishable from "Joni" when spoken, as on the TV show. Two other singers with the name Joni: Joni James, who was referred to on this list several months ago, whom I erroneously identified as a blonde -- checking my catalogs of reissued recordings reveals that Ms. James is a brunette -- she recorded largely country music, and may have been most popular in the 1950s, but apparently is still active today; and Joni Bishop, someone whom I heard and saw perform (and liked) at the Second Story Coffeehouse in the public library in Denton, Md., in December 1999 (I think) - -- Ms. Bishop, while hardly an international household name, I don't think is local to the Delmarva Peninsula, but, rather, is a working musician who tours regionally, perhaps nationally. I believe Ms. Bishop writes some of her own songs but has not been performing as long as since the '60s; Ms. James may or may not write songs. And for casual music fans to confuse Judy Collins and Joni Mitchell is not all that far-fetched. Judy has recorded at least four Joni songs, including "Both Sides(,) Now," "Chelsea Morning" and "Michael from Mountains." Both have long blond hair and play guitar and piano. The names are similarly Anglo-Saxon, have the same number of syllables, the same accent pattern and almost the same number of letters. Judy's ancestry is English and Irish; Joni's ancestry is Irish and ???? Both became popular in the 1960s. Judy is mainly known as an interpretive singer, but may be underrated as a songwriter. While she has not written as many as Joni nor pushed musical boundaries, Judy's songs are well-crafted and afford an enjoyable listening experience and, one for one, compare favorably to whatever Joni has written in a similar vein (in my not-so-humble opinion). Tim Spong Dover, Del., U.S.A. _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:38:13 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: was Broadcasters Outraged ... advice to artists NJC On 28 Feb 2002 at 3:28, RobSher50@aol.com wrote: > So true. I had a very bad experience with an A&R guy/Producer from a > record label 20 odd years ago. It left a taste so bad in my mouth that > I dropped out of the music scene completely. I did A&R for five years. We're not all bad! ; ) However, I will say that when you get interest from a company it is very important to find out what their motives are and what the individual's motives are and what your potential success will mean for them. > That's pretty heavy about your friend. I have an entertainment lawyer > if I can ever pay her the retainer! But from what you are saying, not > all of them are to be trusted either. Again, you have to know what the lawyer's motives are, who else they work for and what other deals they may have on the table which might effect yours - meaning will they make concessions in your deal to try get something favorable in another deal with the same party. I believe what you are saying > about the more you sell, the more you owe. I watched a Behind the > Music special with TLC and they broke down how you can sell millions > of records and still end up broke. TLC had a production deal; they were like employees. They were subcontractors of a subcontractor. They had to split their royalties (which were at a low, new artist rate) 50/50 with Pebbles and Pebbles recouped some items that a label would never get away with recouping. And then they split the balance three ways. Nightmare. I believe that the key thing for artists to understand when dealing with labels is that there are at least three profit-loss statements. One is what the labels tell you they've spent. The second is what the labels actually spent. (Those two get reconciled by audit.) And the third is the artist's. The artist has to understand that the label can get to profit faster than the artist will because they have a huge share of the profit compared to the expense that comes out of that profit. The artist's share of the profit is small compared to what get's charged back to them. So if an artist does not make an effort to keep the recoupable costs low and watch like a hawk what gets charged as recoupable, they will constantly be in deficit. (And hold on to your publishing. Owning the song is where the money is at.) Brenda n.p.: KCRW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:50:14 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: origins of rap.... njc On 28 Feb 2002 at 9:07, Gil Lamont wrote: > Randy Remote wrote: > > >Rap's dirty little secret is that it was invented by white people. > >The first rap song was the train sequence from "The Music Man" circa > >1962. The whole cadence and everything is there, the train wheels > >taking the place of the drum machine. > > The Music Man premiered on Broadway in December 1957, after six years > of work and 40 drafts. "Rock Island" is the train song, and that was > in the show at the premiere. > > Given that the musical is Willson's reminiscences of being 10 years > old in 1912, chances are even the "rap" song is based on earlier > models. > > So rap is probably at least as old as rock'n'roll?! I think you'd have to go back at least to the early '50's when music was being played over sound systems in Jamaica and the announcers who talked over the music and became known as toasters. No one was really commercially interested, so I suppose it's unlikely that there are any recordings of that. There's a direct line from that to the Bronx and Jamaican born DJ Cool Herc who essentially invented turntablism. Brenda n.p.: KCRW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:58:19 -0800 From: "Brenda" Subject: Re: RAP, racism & hip hop culture njc On 28 Feb 2002 at 8:27, chiaroscuro@SNET.Net wrote: > What about Blondie's "Rapture" ? What's the date on that one? When I > think of early rap, that song comes to mind. > 1980. It was likely the success of "Rapper's Delight" in 1979 on independent Sugar Hill Records, that cleared the way for a major label artist to release a "rap" song. Brenda ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:08:57 -0800 From: Mike Friedman Subject: Re: Grammy broadcast & observations(ljc) Have you listened to Alicia Keys' album? It's really quite something. She's very very talented. She wrote the whole thing, arranged it, recorded it herself, plays piano, sings, and she's beautiful too (and I'm a fag!) When I first bought it it wasn't quite my usual Joni, Shawn Colvin, Bonnie Raitt, Emmylou Harris type of thing but I've been won over....Give it a listen. She's a huge cut above most of the dreck that's out there. As for Dylan, he's looked like a stuffed wax dummy of himself for 20 years. :-) On Thursday, February 28, 2002, at 09:00 AM, blonde in the bleachers wrote: > Is it just my imagination or do the Grammy's get worse every year? The > lifetime achievement award recipients were usurped by the head of the > recording academies comments on illegal downloading of music. Give me a > break! It seemed he was doing this much more for the benefit of the > recording labels as opposed to the actual artists who make the music. > You could hear people booing him and those kids that he used as an > experiment they must have felt like the biggest asses in the place! > > About Alicia Keyes winning 5 Grammy's, another young black woman several > years ago won 5 awards and hasn't been heard from since. Her name? > Lauren > Hill. So take heart Bryan, obviously if Joni doesn't seem to give enough > thought to be at the Grammy's then why should we care if she wins 1 or > 100 Grammy's. Also did Bob Dylan look like a stuffed wax dummy with a > lot of bad make-up on or is it just my imagination? > >> From: BRYAN8847@aol.com >Reply-To: BRYAN8847@aol.com >To: joni@smoe.org >> Subject: Grammy broadcast & observations >Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 > 11:44:29 EST > >Well, the Lifetime Achievement honorees got about 10-15 > seconds each, even >less than I'd estimated. That aside, I thought it > was > a total bummer that >they used BYT (in addition to BSN) as the musical > background for Joni's >segment. They certainly could have used something > more musically substantial, >rather than further strengthening the > general public's conception of Joni as >"that taxi song singer," which > is > exactly what an acquaintance of mine said >recently (he dropped a notch > or two in my esteem when he said that! I tried >to educate him.) > >Joni > should be given the Legend Award, Grammy's highest honor. It in not >> awarded every year. > >While Ms. Keys is apparently talented and her > album may deserve notice, I >can't help but get a little hot under the > collar when a newcomer wins as many >Grammys in one night as Joni has > won > in her entire career! > >Bryan > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:24:23 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: NJC Re: Grammy broadcast & observations(ljc) <> But what was up with all that crap on her eyelids? I thought she sang with her eyes closed because she was so "into" the music, come to find out she just didn't have the strength to lift those laden lids with all the weight! Next thing you know, she's missing from her piano bench...well, I figured she'd been strung up by her feet and they were using her eyes as a disco ball, but no, she was doing the tango with some guy who looked like Michael Paz with quivering thighs. Only I knew it wasn't Mikey cuz his thighs haven't quivered like that in a long time. (Did that tango thing REALLY happen or did I fall asleep on the sofa and dream it?) Anyway, Keys' record is OK. Not great, but not bad. 20 years from now people will still be recording Joni & Dylan songs while Alicia's grammy-winning project is making mulch in a landfill. Bob NP: Neil Finn, Roddy Frame, Graham Gouldman, "Heart Full of Soul" (now THIS rocks!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:25:23 -0600 From: "Sybil Skelton" Subject: Re: Today in History: February 26 >On February 26 in Joni Mitchell History: > >1976: Bob Dylan makes a surprise appearance at Joni's concert in Austin, >Texas, where he duets with Joni on "Both Sides Now" and performs "Girl From >North Country" by himself. > Ah, the painful memories!! I was at that concert with a friend who was a student at the university there, and WE LEFT EARLY. We figured she was done with encores and we wanted to beat the rush out the door. It wasn't until the next day when we ran into some other folks who were carrying on that we found out about Dylan's appearance. Oh, the pain. Sybil (needless to say, I have never since left a concert until the house lights come up and the roadies are loading the equipment) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:49:46 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: Broadcasters Outraged over Proposed Reporting Rules NJC Sherelle, You DO have the talent & if you feel its what you were born to do it, you have to follow that road! Have you considered finding a way to finance your own recording, even if its a spare one...which is often very effective (look at Patty Griffin...amazing voice, okay guitar chops...but the passion in her recording makes it one of my favorite cds...much more than her second highly produced one)...just you & your songs & your instrument or someone else playing with you that can support your singing well. Just make sure you professional master it to give it that professional edge... >>> This can be an ugly business, but it's where I have to be because I know this is what I was born to do. <<< Also start gigging as much as possible. That is how you build your audience & performance chops...that is what the label wants my niece to do before they commit to her....they want her to have a lot of gig experience...not just the songwriting talent. Plus that leads you into meeting other musicians with connections, etc. Maybe that could lead you to a showcase for some smaller labels who could offer you a deal that would include bookings, marketing & distribution...Then you are on your way making a living! It is a lot of work though at first, you have to do it yourself until you find someone to help you....even just finding a good booking agent would be fabulous! Because you would be getting the gigs... >> Kate, if I could just make a decent living at this, I think I could be happy. My dream is also to collaborate with as many artists as I have time on this earth for. <<< Love, Kate PS I will look for that other article with Brian in it...yes, he is a sweet & very hardworking guy...doing it for all the right reasons...he stays with us when he comes through SB on his westcoast JPF tours. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 19:42:38 -0000 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: Larry Klein Over the years I've listened to a few albums by miscellaneaous artist where the bass happened to be Larry Klein. I thought the bass was nice but nothing outstanding. I just re-listened to the first Tracy Chapman and it dawned on me how Larry's playing was an essential component of the sound on the album, and hence IMHO a substantial part of Tracy's success. Obviously this is not a scoop. Does anybody feel this way about this album? Is there a special connection between Larry and Tracy that would explain the simbiosis/synergy? Unrelated, but I've met a young woman in the studio who's a singing teacher. She doesn't smoke so her voice is in the BLUE register. She didn't know about Joni so I made her a CD and she came to the last rehearsal to perform Woodstock. What an orgasm (no less) after all these years to be able to do it with a good female voice! We're working on Black Crow next.... Laurent ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #96 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?