From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2002 #65 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Friday, February 8 2002 Volume 2002 : Number 065 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- (sjc)BeRN's Joni comment... [BigWaltinSF@aol.com] RE: (njc) Re: Mongolian Stir-fry ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Who's the Wolf, and Where is Lindsay? [colin ] Re: shelley/bolognini NJC [colin ] Re: the queen's english - NJC [colin ] Re: reading posts with a accent....your accent NJC [colin ] Re: Janis NJC [colin ] Re: Reading music [FredNow@aol.com] Re: reincarnation NJC [colin ] Re: NP: Buddy/Julie Miller, "The River's Gonna Run" (njc) / uncut magazine samplers [M.Russ] Re: Australian/New Zealand accents (NJC) ["hell" ] Re: dingoes and accents NJC ["hell" ] Re: RP NJC ["hell" ] Re: (njc) Dingoes and Kiwis and Bears, Oh My!!! ["hell" ] RE: RP NJC ["Wally Kairuz" ] The Wolf That Lives In Lindsey ["Ron Greer" ] Re: Lithograph entitled "Joni Mitchell" NJC [long] [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Janis Movie NJC ["kerry" ] Re: reading posts with an accent, NJC ["Laurent Olszer" ] Madonna Inn (SJC) [CoyoteRick@aol.com] Re: Madonna Inn (NJC) [AsharaJM@aol.com] Re: Best of Covers (a question) [Gil Lamont ] Re: Harlan Ellison (NJC) [Gil Lamont ] Re: reading posts with a accent....your accent NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: accents NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: accents NJC [Gil Lamont ] RE: accents NJC [Gil Lamont ] RRe: dingoes and accents NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: Johnny Guitar NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: Apology NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: Graham Nash's B'day party NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: the queen's english - NJC [Gil Lamont ] Re: Best of Covers (a question) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] (njc) Re: Mongolian Stir-fry [Gil Lamont ] Re: Best of Covers (a question) [Gil Lamont ] RE: accents NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] ryan adams can do no wrong NJC [Alison E ] RE: accents NJC [Alison E ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 03:20:33 EST From: BigWaltinSF@aol.com Subject: (sjc)BeRN's Joni comment... Hi, all, Richard G. wrote: <> Right you are. I'm looking into a place recommeded by a friend for a quieter venue for a weekend getogether sometime soon. (Quieter, so we can really talk, get to know each other -- or maybe play/sing, if we want to do that.) And if and when Robert and i move into his mom's house, we'll always have such a place. I love that quote from BeRN! Look forward to listening to her CD -- already heard Sacha Sacket's cd last night -- but I'm getting ahead of myself -- too tired to write any more now, but I'll give a more or less complete report tomorrow. G'nite to all, Walt ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 05:20:29 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: (njc) Re: Mongolian Stir-fry there's one on davie street, vancouver's gay street. it's an all-you-can-eat kind of place. they filed for bankruptcy and they all had to go back to mongolia after i left that night. wally, voracious - -----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de BigWaltinSF@aol.com Enviado el: Viernes, 08 de Febrero de 2002 04:46 a.m. Para: bree_mcdonough@hotmail.com; colin@tantra-apso.com; joni@smoe.org Asunto: (njc) Re: Mongolian Stir-fry Bree and Colin, That (what Bree described, with the choose-our-own-ingreidents-and-watch-it-being-made) sounds exactly like the Mongolian BBQ place in the big mall in downtown Providence, RI. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 03:23:37 -0500 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Articles: February 8 On February 8 the following articles were published: 1998: "Joni Chic" - Sunday Telegraph (Appreciation, with photographs) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/980208st.cfm 2000: "Both Sides Now" - Dallas Morning News (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/000208dmn.cfm 2000: "Joni Mitchell plays favorites on new album" - Chicago Sun Times (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/000208cst.cfm 2000: "Joni's giggly voice gone" - Philadelphia Daily News (Review - Album) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/000208pdn.cfm - ------------------------ http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 08:57:42 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: dingoes and accents NJC > Accents sound a lot > better in your own head than they do spoken aloud. > John and I were talking about this the other night. not about accents but how our own voices sound different to us in our heads. I have been surprised to discover that to other opeople I have quite a deep speaking voice. to me it sounds high. John has a very deep voice-really deep-to the extetent that he is difficult to hear at times. Doesn't help that his voice his quiet. We were also talkign about singing. I was amzed to hear him tell me I have a good singing voice. I didn't think so. He said yes you have but the reason you have difficulty singing is ebacuse all your singers are female and their songs are written in the key for their voices and not yours! I never knew that. So I asked if I could sing them then if they were in a different key or 'trsansposed' was a word he ued which althought he explained what that meant, I don't get it. So i said, well I can't simng Bridge Over Troubled Water and that was written by a man(men?). Again he explained that it was becasue of the way it was written and that this song probably could not be changed in key because it would ruin the song. The key is integral to some songs, it seems. Noew I can sing a long to most of Tracy Chap,mans songs so obvuiosly her key is about what mine would be. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:01:43 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Who's the Wolf, and Where is Lindsay? > I agree with Anne's and Wally's interpretations, but the line "girls in > chilly blouses" perhaps she means they were flimsy, very thin. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:04:25 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: shelley/bolognini NJC > I also got a kick out of her as > Nanna Mary on Roseanne. Yes she was excellent. Bette Midler did wicked impersonation of her, doing the Poseidon Adventure, in one of her shows. Here in the UK shje has akways been very popular and considered a 'big star' along with Bette and Joan etc > > > Mark E. - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:06:08 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: the queen's english - NJC > Got to hand it to the old girl. She knows her English. not bad for a German! > > > --Bob - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:08:25 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: reading posts with a accent....your accent NJC Wally Kairuz wrote: > oh puh-leeeeze, girl! i heard your english! you have more glottal stops glottal stops? explain. > than > the bbc would EVAH tolerate. sloan square you ain't. :-) definately not Sloan Square. that isn't BBC english"! That is upper class-more like the Royals. > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de colin > Enviado el: Jueves, 07 de Febrero de 2002 09:42 p.m. > Para: Dolphie Bush > CC: joni > Asunto: Re: reading posts with a accent....your accent NJC > > > After reading Colin's > > post I put his English accent, whatever variation of that might be and, > > BBC English so they say! I guess some would say it is posh. - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 04:11:46 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: Lithograph entitled "Joni Mitchell" NJC [long] Hi Bob, It's always tricky pricing art, and pretty much impossible without seeing the actual work in person, but here goes... in bits and pieces... Your description of it as a "lithograph/etching" is confusing since lithography and etching are two very different techniques. I guess both ways of printing could be done on the same piece of paper, but that would be very odd, so if you could clarify what kind of print it is that would help in figuring out a reasonable price. If it's an etching, the image will probably be rather small, 8x10-ish or smaller, and the rectangle of the drawing will be recessed in the paper, and it would be rather expensive since etching is such a laborious process. Lithographs can be much bigger and the paper will be flat. If it's an "original" or "hand-pulled" lithograph then that is more expensive than one that is mass produced on huge commercial printing presses, which is what most "lithographs" are these days. A notation on the bottom in pencil with numbers like 1/75, or 80/200, indicate which number of print it is and the total number printed; it's written after the print is pulled off the plate and approved by the artist. Sometimes the notation will be AP for artist's proof; there's usually a few of those test run prints. I don't think they're any more valuable than one of the numbered prints, but I may be wrong about that. In theory, every print is equal since each has been approved by the artist. After the set of prints is done, the plates are destroyed (depending on the integrity of the artist; watch out for Salvador Dali prints; he signed blank sheets of paper). I don't think there's any such number notation for mass produced prints and they can run into the thousands (think posters on heavier paper). So, the smaller the number of prints the more expensive each piece will be. To make it even more complicated these days, some artists are doing digital printing on sophisticated copy machines, and the print you're wondering about may be something like that (giclie prints I think they're called). That's such new technology it's not certain those prints will last; worry is that the colors will fade, so any such print is not something to spend a huge amount of money on now. In general, pricing's based on the fame of the artist (the internet is great for finding out about that), how many pieces were printed (most important if they are hand-pulled; not very important otherwise), to some extent the size of the work, and what similar work by other artists is selling for. You can look on the internet for similar images and get an idea of the going price. Did you get one of the Joni prints from the Joni/Dylan tour? How does the print you're wondering about compare to that in size and quality? I think they were selling for $150 and from what I've seen anywhere from $75 to about $300 seems usual for a mass-produced print. The higher price often reflects the middle-man's mark-up. As far as the signatures go... in this case, I don't know if they add to the value of this particular piece of art, especially since they're on the back and to protect the print it needs to be framed under glass and so the signatures won't be seen. If they come through the image, they would even be detrimental. The signatures may be valuable as autographs separate from the art. I don't know anything about the autograph market. It would be interesting to know how that particular print came to have all those signatures on it. The bottom line with any piece of art is if you love it and can afford it, then buy it. Even with well-known artists it's not always a sure thing that the price will increase, so it's not usually helpful to plan on that. However, since it's Joni, unless it looks like that peanut portrait on the scavenger cd I saw recently, there's a good chance the print will become more valuable over time because there will always be some die-hard Joni fans around. Hope this helps. I'm curious now about this print. Have you seen it? And are you thinking to buy it? Debra Shea SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > Wonder if any of the art cono-sewers out there can help me estimate the worth of this Joni item: > > It's a lithograph/etching portrait of Joni and is signed by the artist (Cynthia Marsh) as well as signed (on the back) by: > > Joni > Joel Bernstein > Norman Seeff > Glen Christensen > > Any help would be appreciated. And no, this is not an item in MY possession! ;~) > > Bob ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 09:59:46 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: reincarnation NJC I liked everything colin said in his post. I also think we've all been here before and I agree with colin that the fortunes/misfortunes that we all experience have nothing to do with reward/retribution for past good/bad behavior, but with learning. I'm not sure exactly what we're all supposed to be learning, but I believe that the things we experience usually provide choices - to love or not, to be patient or not, to be kind or not, to help or not, to be gentle or not, to give or not. Perhaps some of us do choose really hard life situations, but not as punishment for past actions. I feel a sense of admiration for people who have chosen great suffering in this life - I think they must have very strong spirits to take on such great difficulties. I think living on the earth is being in hell because we are separated from the knowledge of our true nature (which I believe is divine and beautiful) and from the knowledge of our oneness with all creation. Life here is hell because really bad things happen here - natural disasters, physical hardships (poverty, disability, illness), lonliness, and evil perpetrated by human beings. The only thing we can be absolutely sure about on earth, outside of our own thoughts and behavior, is that nothing on earth will last forever and everything will change. I always remember the catholic priest on Ash Wednesday crossing my head with ashes while saying "thou art dust and unto dust thou shalt return" - grim but true. I am really struggling now with all of this - that I can't control the future - that disaster could strike at any moment - it's very depressing. I'm not sure why I'm in this mental state. I ask myself the question "What can I control?" and the only answer I find is that the only things I can totally control are my thoughts and my actions in this present moment. Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:11:10 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: accents NJC > i was exposed to a lot of prejudice against american > english in my youth. i think this must have been a general thing as I was too. Americans were characterised as loud, bad mannerd people who didn't know how to eat properly, i.e. no table manners. All beacuse they ate with just a fork. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:14:51 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Janis NJC Susan Guzzi wrote: > Ahh Colin but you are falling under my spell, slowly falling in with > the lesbians. Before you know it you'll be tossing all your eyeliner, > masscarra and cha cha heels out! Then you'll want to get to know us > really well before - you know. You are being recruited and there's not > a damned thing you can do to stop yourself - or me! HAHAHAHAHAHAA! > Oh God no! I must get to knees and pray before this wickedness strangles my soul. btw what are cha cha heels? (makes me think of Rita Moreno for some reason). ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 04:18:53 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: Reading music In a message dated 2/4/02 8:54:27 AM, sharonbuffington@mediaone.net writes: >I can only imagine that it would be a great bother having to take the time to >write down words and notes as I went along...while having a song raging >in my head. I may want nothing more than to play it...sing it..feel it. The only thing that matters is the inspiration of the music that results, not the path taken. Mozart wrote on paper away from an instrument; it was no great bother for him because music is in the head, not in the fingers. That's how Beethoven could write after going deaf, because the music was inside his head. They both were able to "play it ... sing it ... feel it" no less fully. I write at the piano, without paper at first, until the song has a clear shape in my head, then I commit to paper in order to refine and polish, and so that others may read it quickly in order to play it. I "play it ... sing it ... feel it" no less fully. Is it a great bother to write or type words when one is communicating via wri tten word? No, for most of us it's second nature, we don't even think about it (although often we should). For folks who have learned to write music on paper it's the same -- it's fluent and doesn't impede creativity at all. Being musically literate also means having access to the inner workings of whole worlds of great ideas, just as being literate in language does. I think there is a misperception that the intellect and left-brained activity are antithetical to art. Nothing could be further from the truth ... there is great magic in the mind and when applied to the song of the heart, so to speak, great art is possible. It's a kind of romantic myth to think that art is the result only of feeling. Finally, I really don't have any dogmatic notion that everyone *must* learn to read and write music ... like I said, whatever works for the best music possible. My only peeve is with the idea that literacy in music somehow detracts from its truth. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:31:33 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: reincarnation NJC > I think they must have very > strong spirits to take on such great difficulties. I think living on the > earth is being in hell because we are separated from the knowledge of our > true nature (which I believe is divine and beautiful) and from the knowledge > of our oneness with all creation. Heaven and Hell are states of mind. It is all down to choice of thoughts. Or our beliefs if you like. I certainly know that for me all that brought into light from that awful darkness was the change in my thought. (with an lot of help of course). When I think back, there is a definate demarcation before and after. Before is dark and swirling and after is light and free. > The > only thing we can be absolutely sure about on earth, outside of our own > thoughts and behavior, is that nothing on earth will last forever and > everything will change. One of the religions I grew up with believes that Heaven will be here on earth. That all pain will cease, that wild animals will be tame, that there will be on natral disasters etc. Never mind the fact that the sun will burn out etc one day! Oh and of the 3 religions I grew up, all believed that evolution eas a wicked lie anfd that fossils etc were put there by Stan to trick us. > I always remember the catholic priest on Ash > Wednesday crossing my head with ashes while saying "thou art dust and unto > dust thou shalt return" - grim but true. Not really true. our bodies will return to dust. we will not because we ner were dust. > I am really struggling now with > all of this - that I can't control the future - that disaster could strike > at any moment - it's very depressing. I'm not sure why I'm in this mental > state. Iyt's called a mid life crisis! No I am not being rude! It is very common. We become of our own moratlity if a way we never have before. I have conflicting feelimngs about it all too. I used to hate life and longed to leave it. Now I love life and want to have lots morew of it. ageing is the pits and death even worse fromt he purely physical point of view. I went to my friend Joy's funeral on monday. I stared quite while at her coffin, imaginign her body just lying there and thinking how awful it was. yet the other part of me was happy and knew she was there watching, feeling sad because her daughter was so distraught, and knwoing that she herself was free and more alive than any of us. > I ask myself the question "What can I control?" and the only answer > I find is that the only things I can totally control are my thoughts and my > actions in this present moment. and that is what we are supposed to learn, i think. We reallt cannot control others or events. So much of our pain is casued by trying to control others. by trying to force our meaning structures onto others. war, war, war. Until we all learn otherwise. Many fool themesleves that they are being oh so good and 'holy' by trying to force their religion onto others when alk they are doing is trying to get others to think as they do. I used to very confused by the Happy Clappies and their conviction . Till i understood about meaning structures and ideas. Of course they appear happy and in fact because they have convinced themselves of their absolute rightness. much the same as I am in the manic phase of my illness. The same feelings were engenderd at the Nuremburg Rallies and such like. Marion-you are doing okay and feeling the way you do is normal. many people when struck with this desperately look for something to hold it all together instead of just going with it and becoming more humand and strong. Love you for that. bw colin > > > Marian > Vienna - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 10:54:02 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: NP: Buddy/Julie Miller, "The River's Gonna Run" (njc) / uncut magazine samplers On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 17:04:44 +0200 "Ron Greer" wrote: >>>>NP: Buddy/Julie Miller, "The River's Gonna Run" > i got this track on an "uncut" magazine sampler (december issue) - > is the rest of the album as good as this track??? I heard a cut from the Buddy/Julie Miller CD on that radio (WFUV?) that interviewed Sue McNamara last fall and liked it so much that I ordered the CD. It's a great CD!!! A lot of really good tracks!!! Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 23:41:53 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Australian/New Zealand accents (NJC) Gil wrote: > Good on ya, mate! ;-) > > According to my Far Side Of-the-Wall Calendar, February 6 was Waitangi Day > in your neck of the woods. What's up with that? Nic to see you've picked up a good Kiwi colloquialism there, mate! Warning - gross simplification: February 6 (Waitangi Day) is the anniversary of the signing of the Treaty of Waitangi (kind of like Independence Day in the US), where lots of Maori chiefs signed over their land to the British. It's now in hot dispute, and the Maori tribes are demanding their land back. I say they should give back the guns and blankets (and tuberculosis and influenza and measles) first. Hell P.S. Extracting the michael, obviously - I don't really want to get into another debate about the wrong-doings of my British ancestors! ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 23:45:33 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: dingoes and accents NJC Catherine wrote: > Yes, it always sounds just a bit off. Likewise, Mel > Gibson trying to sound American. It's not quite > there. He's not nearly as bad as some others - like the NZ extras in Xena and Hercules, trying to speak with American accents! And he was at least born in the USA, and didn't leave until he was about 12 (I think) so he should be better at it than most! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 23:48:38 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: RP NJC Wally wrote: > RP is ''received pronunciation'', the particular variety of english that for > many years was a requirement of BBC speakers. it is basically educated > southern british english or public school english without traces of regional > varieties. it has become increasingly rare. one of the marks of true RP is > the absence of glottal stops. however, because of RP's association with the > ''establishment'', many young or more progressive RP speakers started adding > glottal stops to their speech patterns, especially in the 80's after lady di > and john major used them in public. another example of how much RP has > changed over time is the pronunciation of ''girl''. in her very lively > enquiry into ''aristocratic'' english [her own variety, by the way] called > noblesse oblige [published in 1955], nancy mitford complained about the > tendency of young people to rhyme ''girl'' with ''pearl'' rather than with > ''pal''. i don't think there's one RP speaker left in the world that would > meet mitford's criterion today! I've got a great book by Nancy Mitford's sister, Jessica (called Hons and Rebels) which describes much of their up-bringing. It doesn't surprised me that Nancy was so particular about accents, when you read what their father was like! A sordid little family history, with another sister infatuated with Adolf Hitler! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 23:54:58 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: (njc) Dingoes and Kiwis and Bears, Oh My!!! Walt wrote: > Sometimes I can't tell when you're joking. Um, in case no one got this back > to you, it was called "A Cry In The Dark", and I *think* it was set in > Australia, not New Zealand. (I don't know Hell, but I imagine she may have > been the one to correct you by now -- I'm several digests behind at the > moment.) I always liked to call the movie "Dingoes Ite Moy Bye-bye!", badly > imitating the accent. This should be explained to those not in the know (and Bob is joking). Bob Muller started the whole thing at Jonifest 2001, trying to imitate my accent by saying "The dingo ate my baby!" Unfortunately I'm not Australian, and Bob sounded more like he should be wandering the Yorkshire moors, than throwing a few shrimps on the barbie (sorry Bob, but you have to be told!) The "joke" has now become ingrained in JMDL culture (much to my dismay) and I'm forever branded as "the dingo woman". God damn it. The joke IS wearing thin, trust me! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 08:05:03 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: RP NJC oh i loved that book, hell!!!!!!!!! jessica wrote also ''the american way of death'', a great study on the american funeral business. i worship nancy and jessica mitford. there's a new book out on the mitford girls, by the way, but it doesn't seem to be very good. here's a link http://query.nytimes.com/search/full-page?res=9C02EED7153BF931A15752C0A9649C 8B63 have you read the novels of nancy mitford? oh how i wish she were more appreciated! NANCY RULES!!!!!!! wally, i should be going to bed, really. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hell wrote I've got a great book by Nancy Mitford's sister, Jessica (called Hons and Rebels) which describes much of their up-bringing. It doesn't surprised me that Nancy was so particular about accents, when you read what their father was like! A sordid little family history, with another sister infatuated with Adolf Hitler! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 14:22:50 +0200 From: "Ron Greer" Subject: The Wolf That Lives In Lindsey hi i understood "the blizzards come and go" to refer to a state of confusion. kind of all white & swirling, & confusing, and limited vision. kind of how i also understood "the stab and glare and buckshot, of the heavy heavy snow, it comes and goes" to mean the confusing feelings when the inner wolf is having an "episode". as far as "girls in chilly blouses" - it just always struck me that it was referring to prostitutes parading around in skimpy tops even on the coldest of evenings. i guess this is a result of the prostitutes near where i used to stay in cape town. even on the coldest of nights, when i was huddled(no - not a typo for cuddled :-)) up inside my car, on my way home from work, id see these girls dressed only in panties & a tee-shirt, flashing the cars as they drove by, and really wonder how the hell they survived... ron ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 08:05:57 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Lithograph entitled "Joni Mitchell" NJC [long] << Hope this helps. I'm curious now about this print. Have you seen it? And are you thinking to buy it? >> No...a lady has it, and doesn't know anything about Joni or any or the other folks. She went to jm.com, and by some weird quirk got my address, so she inquired. So rather than tell her I couldn't help her, I threw myself on the mercy of the JMDL. And you guys really came through! She has been appreciative of the details I've forwarded thus far, and I know she'll appreciate your info as well. A big THANKS to you on her behalf, Bob NP: Ryan Adams (aka 'the man who can do no wrong) "Don't Ask For The Water" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 07:28:58 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Janis Movie NJC Fred wrote: > Bottom line: very true. > > However, the best thing I ever heard Melissa Ethridge (of whom I am not > especially a fan) sing was "Take Another Little Piece of My Heart" at > Woodstock 2 ... when she let out the a capella scream towards the end of the > song, I got the gooseflesh real good. She's no Janis, no one is, but if a > movie is to be made, Melissa just might do justice. Then Hell wrote: >This thought occurred to me too. I am a fan of Melissa Etheridge, and have >most of her albums. She would definitely be the one to carry off the voice >(I'm only speaking of singers I know), but I'm not so sure of her acting >ability. I've seen her do cameos (as herself) in a couple of shows, and she >wasn't bad, but this is a much bigger ask. >While I agree that no one can really do Janis justice - if someone said I >had to name someone, Melissa would be the one. Melissa and her partner, Julie did have plans to make a "Janis" movie years ago. I remember Melissa saying that they had better hurry up and get it done because she would be getting too old to play her. I'm sure plans have fallen through with their unfortunate break-up! (btw, I heard her do "Piece of my Heart" at a concert too, and it was fantastic!) Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 14:41:45 -0000 From: "Laurent Olszer" Subject: Re: reading posts with an accent, NJC > Bree asked: > > >> Sooo,Colin,John,Wolf,Hell,Laurent(French?)Willie do you guys ever read > >our > >posts with an american accent? > > To me, all you guys speak english with a french accent. Laurent ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 14:35:17 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: (njc) Dingoes and Kiwis and Bears, Oh My!!! > I'm forever branded as "the dingo woman". wouldn't "the indigo woman" be more apt? :-) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 14:37:56 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: Australian/New Zealand accents (NJC) > another debate about the wrong-doings of my British ancestors! there is nothing to debate. Britain did terrible things all over! amazing what stroppy little islanders can do. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 11:23:12 EST From: CoyoteRick@aol.com Subject: Madonna Inn (SJC) Stephen Reports: "Singer-songwriter Graham Nash celebrated his 60th birthday with friends and relatives amid a sea of pink. More than 150 guests attended Saturday's off-beat party at the Madonna Inn, including Stephen Stills and David Crosby, who wore a pink bunny costume." As usual, I am a few days late for the party. I travel to San Luis Obispo often, and I was just there for a Gas Company staff meeting (we have a large operating base up there). Night before last, I was at the Madonna Inn, as usual, for dinner (they have good, old-fashioned white linen food there -- famous for their filets) . A little JMDL bird had told me of the "pink party" that took place on Saturday night. Annually, I host Brad's big birthday dinner at the Madonna Inn since his birthday falls at the same time as our annual big car show (held in conjunction with the SF gay car club) which is also held in San Luis Obispo. Since we have been there every year for ten years, and he was doing it there five years before me, we've gotten to know the managers quite well. So, I asked questions, but the staff were all told they couldn't speak about the party. But, it was WILD, I was told, among some other insignificant, glossy details. After some prodding, one of my SLO pals told me he did see JM and she looked to have a great time, very chatty. That's all he would say, except that she spent the night (but wouldn't divulge which theme room she chose). If you ever make it up the California Coast -- I highly recommend the Dining Room for dinner -- if there are six of you, ask for the gold booth. If you are bucks up, stay there. My favorite is the Cave Room. Guys, you have to go to the men's room, if nothing else. Some TV show just rated it one of the best public bathrooms in the world. It's such a campy place -- and the scary thing is the owners really think it's beautiful. Well, if you like pink. The old gas station, now a gourmet shop, looks to be inspired by Bedrock architecture. The MI is one of my favorite places in California. No regrets, Coyote Rick Casa Alegre Hollywood, California "Only fools are afraid to be burned by fire..." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 11:52:26 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: Madonna Inn (NJC) Boy, this brings back memories!! I stayed at the Madonna Inn in the early 80's (in the Caveroom, Coyote!) when I was in CA on business. I took some extra time to see a bit of California, and ended up there one night. Thanks for the url, Kakki! :-) Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:10:38 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Best of Covers (a question) Jimmy wrote: >WHAT ABOUT JONI COVERS CD #4?????? > >I don't know where Bob's brain is today. Nuriel, all you need it to get >Covers #4 and it pretty much sums up the best of > >There's Doris Day singing "BSN" >And there's Leonard Nimoy singing "BSN" >Also it has Anne Murray singing "BSN" >Included is Jim Nabors singing "BSN" >A wonderful renditon of Claudine Longet singing "BSN" >Oh, and let's not forget my personal favorite, Jim Nabors singing "BSN" > >How Bob forgot about these, I'll never know. I guess he hasn't gotten over >Kathryn Grayson singing, yes you guessed it "BSN" :~D > >You know I'm kidding Mr. Muller. Does this truly mean there's no CD of renditions of "BSN"? Bums. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:21:02 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Harlan Ellison (NJC) Darice: >Gil, >Did you say Harlan Ellison?!?!?!!?!? Yup, that cute 5'5" guy. Hard to believe he's 68 this year. >Dangerous Visions?!!?!?!!? That's the one. >I can still remember reading Carcinoma Angels ( and how relevant it was 30 >years later when my husband, who owed a Harley) was diagnosed with cancer. Don't forget "Carcinoma Angels" was written by Stormin' Norman Spinrad, now residing in France. >I also remember Harlan saying that DV #3 was "sitting under his desk"; >this was in 1973 or 4. In the 1980s Harlan hired me to help him get DV #3 out of his office. At that time, Volume 1 was spread along the top of the railing that surrounds the open area of his upstairs office. (Below the open area is the main floor and his pool table.) I spent weeks going through the stories, even retranslated a story from the French -- then realized Harlan wasn't going to get past his writer's block on the introductions. Many of the stories were withdrawn by their authors and published elsewhere. Too bad. When I saw it, DVD #3 couldn't possibly fit under Harlan's desk. Too many words. (Nice illustrations by the redoubtable Tim Kirk, though.) >Even more memories..... Even more cans of worms to open ... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:28:55 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: reading posts with a accent....your accent NJC John van Tiel wrote: >I never forget >that my 19th century literature professor in Durham, Bleach (nomen est omen), >said to me when I told him that I majored in American literature: "Isn't that >a contradiction in terms?" Geocentrist! Obviously he never read Mark Twain. >Accents are handy, though. In America, I can aways speak fluent Dutch and >frighten the hell out of everyone (Claudia: "Dutch is not a language, it's a >throat disease"). And in Britain it's great to confuse people by speaking >perfect Queen's English without any accent. My moment of Zen: In America it's impossible to speak perfect Queen's English without any accent. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:51:23 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: accents NJC Mack wrote: >Gil, I will have to disagree with you on this one. I grew up close to >Happy, Texas and did not find Mr. Northam's accent very true to form. Easy there, Tex. Was Northam's character from Texas? Just because he visited the town doesn't mean he had to talk the talk, so to speak. >The >entire movie was ridiculously silly. In Happy, Texas, they would not put up >with a couple of homosexuals for more than a few moments and the movies >premise that they were somehow accepted is not true. Sure, there may be >homosexuals performing the stereotypical tasks in towns like these but they >don't come out and say they are queer. If so, not very loud. And if they >do, they don't last long. The Texas Panhandle is the bastion of the >Baptist, church of Christ, and Methodist churches. They don't tolerate this >kind of thing. a. It was a movie. b. It was filmed in California. All of it. >I wasn't privy to the town's public stance on this movie but >I would bet money that the majority of the town was mortified by the movie >and its content. I'll bet you're right. Maybe the producers should have added a disclaimer that the movie town bore no similarity to the Texas town. >\ One thing I have noticed in movies is that there seems to be a real >problem for actors in distinguishing between a Texas accent and a Southern >accent. They are not the same and many sound like Scarlett O'Hara as they >try to sound Texan. Yes, they're not the same. Thanks to Uncle Sugar I lived a couple of years in Georgia (Joe-ja). My brother spent the last of his life living in Austin. My Southern wasn't much like his Texan. Did the rest of the actors sound remotely Texan to you. What was that accent Steve Zahn had? All of this begs the question, where is Bob Easton now that we need him more than ever? And while we're at it, does Texas have regional accents, as does California? And can you hear the difference in accents between Georgia and Tennessee, N'Orleans and No'th Ca'lina? Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:54:55 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: accents NJC colin wrote: >In fact, American women seem to have deepr voices than British ones. Let me see here. Jennifer Tilly : Joan Greenwood. Hmm. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 09:59:22 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: accents NJC Bob wrote: >And why are there no captions on "English" movies? (Or movies made >anywhere in the British Isles for that matter.) Did anyone in the US >understand a word of "Trainspotting?" Posh/BBC I understand. But regional >accents from the UK -- forget it. Most DVDs are subtitled in English or close-captioned for the hearing-impaired, so you could watch, say, THE FULL MONTY with that option and not miss a golden word. Otherwise you have to make friends with someone from England who can give you a line-by-line translation. Or you need subtitles until your ear gets used to it, as in THE HARDER THEY COME. Gil who had to use closed-captioning to understand Jar-Jar Binks ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:03:19 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: RE: accents NJC Wally Kairuz wrote: >here's what i don't understand: >NZ >aussie The DVD of MAD MAX offers the original Aussie soundtrack *and* the dubbed American soundtrack. The rest of us might find this important. ;-) >any british variety except RP [or BBC as you call it] Even Beatles films? Those Liverpudlians ... >kenneth mars in young frankenstein He was hilarious. Of course, the townspeople couldn't understand him either. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:12:54 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: RRe: dingoes and accents NJC Catherine McKay wrote: >Canadians don't say "about". The word simply doesn't >exist in Canada. Only in its spoken form. Or as my Canadian friend Barry tells me, "Unlike you Americans we pronounce all the vowels." >And then there's Ahnold Schwartzenegger, who always >has a Scottish or English-sounding name. How >believable is that? I like the "McCain" tv show in The Simpsons, where McCain *always* has that Ahnult accent. Anyone recall that scene from The Magic Christian, where Jeremy Slate reads a commercial, and Sir Guy Grand (Peter Sellers) says, "Now do it with an American accent." Jeremy: "That *was* an American accent." Sir Guy: "Good lord! What on earth is going on over there?"? Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:15:27 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Johnny Guitar NJC Mark E. wrote: >The only other movie with Mercedes McCambridge that I can think of at the >moment is 'Giant'. She was Rock Hudson's sister, Luz. She gets killed >early in the movie when she gets thrown by Liz Taylor's horse. And she's the voice of the devil in The Exorcist. imdb.com list 30 movies, tv movies, and tv series she's done. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:19:45 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Apology NJC Catherine wrote: > >...Of course, now that you labelled *that* post njc, >the joni-onlies won't see it anyway. (haha - they >gots no sense of humour - njc is where the fun >happens.) But if I *hadn't* labeled that post njc I would have committed another breach of etiquette. Do you mean that the non-NJCers, for whom the post would have meaning, never read my apology and so I've wasted horrendous amounts of bandwidth? This is Catch-22, if ever I saw it. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:26:00 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Graham Nash's B'day party NJC Kakki wrote: >This is such a crack-up. Good to hear the 60 year olds from the 60s are >still having wild fun. The Madonna Inn is a long-time infamously >campy-kitschy establishment in the wilds of Central California filled with >garish theme rooms. Here's the website where you can check out their rooms >http://www.madonnainn.com/tour/index.asp Having stayed at the Madonna Inn I can confidently report that everything you've heard about the place is true and then some. I may have stayed in the Bridal Falls room (or something rock-lined, it was a long time ago), and friends in the Barrel o' Fun. Not shown on the website is the Men's Room, where you get to pee into a waterfall. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:29:13 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: the queen's english - NJC Bob wrote: >Finally, July arrived >and old QE II herself came to Boston, stepped up to the lectern at Old City >Hall and said something like, "I'd like to congratulate the American people >on the occasion of their bicentenary." > >DOH! > >"Bicentennial" is an adjective and "bicentenary" is the noun -- and about 200 >million of us had been using the word "bicentennial" incorrectly! (Most of us >still do use it incorrectly. I see "bicentennial" used as a noun all the >time, even in places such as the NY Times.) > >Got to hand it to the old girl. She knows her English. LOL! My favorite Bad American English is "Drive Safe" and its variants. Makes the editor in me want to respond "Speak Grammatic!" Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 13:34:57 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Best of Covers (a question) Gil, Volume 4 really does have the songs that Jimmy mentioned. To see the full rundown of what's on each CD, point yourself to: http://www.jmdl.com/covers/byvolume.cfm And of course, if you're interested in copies of any of these, I'm happy to dupe for blanks & postage. Bob NP: Stephanie Morrison, "Today" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:40:53 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: (njc) Re: Mongolian Stir-fry walt wrote: >That (what Bree described, with the >choose-our-own-ingreidents-and-watch-it-being-made) sounds exactly like the >Mongolian BBQ place in the big mall in downtown Providence, RI. And we >probably have at least one of 'em here in San Fran, where you are also >invited anytime, Colin. But I hear if you go to the one in Ulaan Bator, you >gotta bring your own yurt. Dashing in with the cold bucket of reality ... Last week my wife and I provided dinner to a couple of missionary girls, one of whom is from Ulaanbaatar. She's never heard of (U.S.-style) Mongolian BBQ. (She's also learning to trust salads, there being a paucity of greens in Mongolia.) For similar reasons, there may be no chop suey restaurants in China. Gil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 10:49:42 -0800 From: Gil Lamont Subject: Re: Best of Covers (a question) Bob wrote: >Volume 4 really does have the songs that Jimmy mentioned. To see the full >rundown of what's on each CD, point yourself to: > >http://www.jmdl.com/covers/byvolume.cfm Well hush ma mouf. This is being stupidly clever on my part. >And of course, if you're interested in copies of any of these, I'm happy to >dupe for blanks & postage. Are you kidding! I may want 'em all! Gil chagrined, humbled, and grateful ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 12:49:11 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: accents NJC how about richard thompson? we are going to see him tonight & everytime i go to his concerts i am blown away by his talent but only understand a very little of what he is actually saying... ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 12:47:17 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: ryan adams can do no wrong NJC bob--commenting on your comment from earlier... i am sitting here listening to some older ryan adams/whiskeytown stuff, and his voice on sounds REMARKABLY like paul westerberg. like, its a good thing he went solo, cause this stuff is all very directly descended of the replacements. i mean its good, really good, but not very original or unique, per se. whaddya think about that? alison e. in slc, a big replacements fan, and who believes they are the one of the most underrated and undervalued AND influential bands in rock n' roll. man. Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2002 12:49:25 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: RE: accents NJC lucky you! make sure you scream out "kenny g". he does a fantastically funny song about kenny g. i love richard thompson live, it's one of the best shows you can experience. alison e. in slc np: whiskeytown, factory girl - --- Kate Bennett wrote: > how about richard thompson? we are going to see him > tonight & everytime i go > to his concerts i am blown away by his talent but > only understand a very > little of what he is actually saying... Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2002 #65 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?