From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #574 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, December 4 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 574 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: (njc) Modern-day Witch Hunt [colin ] Re: distress, njc [colin ] "covering" (NJC) [M.Russell@iaea.org] Re: Clapton and Harrison,(continued), Long , njc [FredNow@aol.com] Re: Kurt Elling and critics (njc) ["Kakki" ] Re: "covering" (NJC) ["Kakki" ] RE: "covering" (NJC) [M.Russell@iaea.org] Re: Clapton and Harrison,(continued), Long , njc [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: "covering" (NJC) [colin ] re: Announcing...Covers Volume 24!! [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: "covering" (NJC) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] RE: "covering" (NJC) [M.Russell@iaea.org] Abbey Road and George Harrison(njc) ["Johnson Victor" ] Joni in London [Steve Dulson ] Re: Joni in London [Jerry Notaro ] Re: 100 Greatest Women of Music sjc [Michael Yarbrough ] Air Time SJC [LXROSS@ctrl.co.uk] Re: Kurt Elling and critics (njc) [FredNow@aol.com] Jeff Bisch - The Debut CD is now available. ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: (njc&long)Warning: Brame's Appointment & "Taliban" in the USA [Randy] Re: Zappa on critics (njc) [Murphycopy@aol.com] new BAD virus to watch out for NJC [Alison E ] Re: new BAD virus to watch out for NJC ["mack watson-bush" ] James Taylor bio reviewed (NJC) [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: "covering" (NJC) [Michael Paz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 09:07:16 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: (njc) Modern-day Witch Hunt > Please pray, or think good thoughts, or whatever you do, for the sanity of > the world today. sending out good vibes, i whatever way is really important. Butthe wrold today is really no different to the world of yesterday. dreadful things have always happened. juts we here about them now. > > > concerned, > > walt - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 09:15:17 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: distress, njc My heart hurts for you Mack and my anger demands more than I will allow it. You have given such a good example of what it means to be homesexual in a homophobic society. Not that it helps you one bit, but we left a big city, London, because of years of harrassment(bricks thru windows, wrecked car, assaults etc) and now we live a small inward rural community and no one bothers us at all. my love praye5rs and strength to you colin-who wishes he could hug you and take this shit away. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 10:15:25 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: "covering" (NJC) I really liked what Fred wrote because it made me feel a little better about something that I have been feeling sensitive about for awhile now. "Cover" was not in my musical vocabulary until a couple of years after joining JMDL. Since learning what this term means, I have become aware of what seems to be an element of disdain among some (many?) JMDLers for anyone who doesn't "cover" Joni's music "creatively" and this awareness has led to a sense of discomfort about performing Joni's music anymore anywhere. In all the years that I played guitar and sang Joni's songs, it never occurred to me to try to elaborate on or make changes to her beautiful (and IMO, perfect) music. I was never trying to "be" or "become" Joni by singing her songs (I don't have her vocal chords and I would never dream of dressing up in a blonde wig and wearing a beret! :^D). For me, it has always been just a great pleasure to try to recreate her beautiful guitar sounds and sing along in my own voice. For me, singing/performing is a meditative process - an opportunity to get beyond myself to convey the message/meaning of whatever song as best I can - and I have always felt a sense of peace and healing in that process, especially with Joni's music. Each time I sing a song is a new chance to do it better than ever before. It is not a competitive thing or an imitative thing, but a process - a personal process that I sometimes share if I perform for someone. Something that really bugs me here is all the comparison that goes on. This artist is better than that one, that artist is trying to be like so and so, and on and on. I think it is true that all of us cannot avoid being influenced by all of the events/things/people/songs that we grow up with, but we each have our own unique interpretation and expression, and I think that we all deserve to be respected and valued if we are trying to bring beauty into the world in however limited a fashion. Rickie Lee Jones has a solid base of people who think she is the best musician who ever walked the face of the earth, just as most people here feel that way about Joni, and other people I know feel that way about Natalie Merchant, Jewel, Brittany Spears, Madonna, Bob Dylan, etc. Marian Vienna On Mon, 3 Dec 2001 23:58:31 EST Fred wrote: > SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: >>17. Keith Jarrett - All I Want: Surprisingly, nothing very creative here >>from piano virtuouso Jarrett. One of his earlier recordings, it's pretty >>enough and gets the job done and that's about it. > There's much more here than meets the ear. Creativity, in covers, > can be a highly overrated commodity; too many covers are too damn > "creative," by which I mean that the "creativity" supersedes the song. > Yeah, a radical reworking can sometimes work, but often all a song > needs is the firm stamp of the cover artist's own voice. With Jarrett it's > the latter; the thing is, that stamp is somewhat masked by the fact that > the song itself lays squarely on the broad intersection of Joni's and > Jarrett's melodic/harmonic language. I think that's a big part of why > he played it: to demonstrate the hipness of Joni's music, just as it is, > with no further "hipping it up." He recognized a kinship in her music and > celebrates by just "singing" her song in his voice, which shares so many > characteristics with hers. Also, few jazz musicians at that time were > investigating the current popular songs as alternative jazz vehicles to > decades of Gershwin, Porter, etc. - - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 04:51:44 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: Clapton and Harrison,(continued), Long , njc "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lama\)" wrote: >Gen Xers might be interested to know that Eric (god) (slowhand) Clapton >bent his guitar at such Beatle gems as "While My Guitar Gently Weeps", and lots >of amazing stuff on "Abbey Road". After reading about the making of "Abbey >Road", seeing McCartney doing the medley with a band, and seeing him talk >about it on the Anthology video, I'm thinking that Paul was the third guitar >in the medley but I don't know for sure. (Previously, I'd heard that it >was Lennon's guitar but John was preoccupied during Abbey Road, while Mac was >there every day.) >What I remember, is that God's own producer, George Martin, and Mac edited >together a composite guitar solo for the final track "The End". >And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love (drums) you make. >(generic Beatle-ly choir), then the coda is the sure, slow, stinging, >soaring player who brought us the best part of "Layla". Not McCartney, >not Harrison, but Clapton. >pppsss If I got my Abbey Road details wrong, who will correct me now that >md is gone? Hey, Lama ... I'd not read of Clapton playing on any Beatles' tracks other than "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" ... what's your source of info? Several sources I've seen agree that the round robin guitar solo on "The End" is McCartney (somewhat raw but fluid, bluesy), Harrison (more melodic, pointed, a thinner, typically Harrison sound), and Lennon (very raw, primitive chugging), in that order. I won't insist this is definitive, and might entertain that what I thought was McCartney was actually Clapton, as well as the majestic slow solo at the end ("equal to the love you make"), which I always assumed was Harrison emulating his friend Clapton. I'm going to listen again tomorrow with this in mind, see what my ears tell me. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 02:26:26 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Kurt Elling and critics (njc) Fred, I just shook my head when I read that he had received reviews like this - wonders never cease. "Selling out?" How wacky! Geesh. It kind of sounds like some of the critics Joni has had to hear at times when she had a different way of expressing herself. He basically seemed to be the same Kurt to me the other night - he's accentuating a few more very beautiful love songs this time around - but he still did his trademark rants and scats, too! I think he's probably just way out ahead of those critics. Harrumph! Kakki Fred wrote: > I've actually read a few negative reviews from some idiot critics > (redundant?) who just don't get it, saying things like "sell out" and "where > are the wild-man rants and scats?" What exactly is the problem with taking a > diversion, showing range, having something different to say, something more > quiet and gentle? Are we to believe that to be intimate is selling out? And > just because he has made albums before with wild-man rants and scats, is he > then obligated to do so every time out? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 02:30:37 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: "covering" (NJC) Marian, All I can say (and always have maintained) is that you have "covered" a number of Joni songs better than Joni herself and I think she would agree with that! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 12:50:34 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) Oh, Kakki - thank you for the very nice compliment! I feel that I can do a whole lot better, though. I don't mean better than Joni, because I think that's not possible, but better than myself in any previous time. To do better involves total abandonment in the music - a loss of sense of self. The closest I ever came to feeling like I was out of the way ("in the zone"?) was singing Wolf in Topsfield. I don't know what happened then, but I felt that what came out during most of that song was better than anything that had ever before happened to me during a performance or practicing. The perception of the result is an individual experience, though - two different people might have two different perceptions, and musical taste is so individual that one person might not like the result at all, while the other person would think it was nice. I felt good about Wolf that time, but other people might not have liked it, or maybe they don't like the way I sing. I feel that people are entitled to their musical tastes. I have a very dear sister - we are very close in opinion about most things, but she just doesn't "get" Joni at all. It's strange, but I accept it. Losing a sense of self in the process of making music is easier when not singing because there's less going on. I know a lot of short, relatively easy but beautiful piano pieces that I like to play. Each time I play one of them, the result is a little different. Sometimes something magical happens and the song comes out more beautiful than ever before. This is a very exciting event to me and makes all the previous attempts worthwhile. Marian On 04 December 2001 11:31, Kakki [SMTP:KakkiB@worldnet.att.net] wrote: > Marian, > > All I can say (and always have maintained) is that you have "covered" a > number of Joni songs better than Joni herself and I think she would agree > with that! > > Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 07:35:23 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Clapton and Harrison,(continued), Long , njc In a message dated 12/4/01 12:15:21 AM Eastern Standard Time, jlamadoo@fuse.net writes: > and Eric brings out the "Badge"-like ringing, > chiming, > bell-like tone. > (It doesn't sound like any other guitar part on the album.) > > I think you might be correct on this one Lamma. George acknowledges Clapton for playing many guitar parts on the All Things Must Pass album. He stated that at the time they weren't "allowed" by their record companies to acknowledge their presence on each other's albums. He maintained that Clapton hadn't had credit for thirty years! Who knows how many more? I haven't listened to Abbey Road in god knows how long. I have it on vinyl, but my turntable isn't hooked up. I'll have to add this one to my wish list, as it was the End. FYI, I read somewhere that Lennon had been involved in a car accident and would not be in attendance for 10 days after the recording sessions began. ~rose it was thirty years ago today............ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 12:38:21 +0000 From: colin Subject: Re: "covering" (NJC) > Something that really bugs me here is all the comparison that goes on. This > artist is better than that one, that artist is trying to be like so and so, > and on and on. I think it is true that all of us cannot avoid being > influenced by all of the events/things/people/songs that we grow up with, > but we each have our own unique interpretation and expression, and I think > that we all deserve to be respected and valued if we are trying to bring > beauty into the world in however limited a fashion. Rickie Lee Jones has a > solid base of people who think she is the best musician who ever walked the > face of the earth, just as most people here feel that way about Joni, and > other people I know feel that way about Natalie Merchant, Jewel, Brittany > Spears, Madonna, Bob Dylan, etc. i agree with you tho i don't think joni is the BEST. Nor do I think Carly is the BEST nor DAR nor Tracy nor Janis nor any of the people whose music enriches my life. they are all different and each have their own contribution to make to life. It is as silly as comparimng human beings as better or worse than one another. No one is here by accident. each has her/his role to play, whether or not we appreciate or undertsand it. Comaprisons are not much good in this arena. > > > Marian > Vienna > > On Mon, 3 Dec 2001 23:58:31 EST Fred wrote: > > > SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > >>17. Keith Jarrett - All I Want: Surprisingly, nothing very creative here > >>from piano virtuouso Jarrett. One of his earlier recordings, it's pretty > >>enough and gets the job done and that's about it. > > > There's much more here than meets the ear. Creativity, in covers, > > can be a highly overrated commodity; too many covers are too damn > > "creative," by which I mean that the "creativity" supersedes the song. > > Yeah, a radical reworking can sometimes work, but often all a song > > needs is the firm stamp of the cover artist's own voice. With Jarrett it's > > > the latter; the thing is, that stamp is somewhat masked by the fact that > > the song itself lays squarely on the broad intersection of Joni's and > > Jarrett's melodic/harmonic language. I think that's a big part of why > > he played it: to demonstrate the hipness of Joni's music, just as it is, > > with no further "hipping it up." He recognized a kinship in her music and > > celebrates by just "singing" her song in his voice, which shares so many > > characteristics with hers. Also, few jazz musicians at that time were > > investigating the current popular songs as alternative jazz vehicles to > > decades of Gershwin, Porter, etc. > > - -Fred - -- bw colin DAK,BRO GC, 950i, 940,860,864,890, 260,Silver 830,860, 580 and 270, Passap 6000, Duo80. colin@tantra-apso.com http://www.tantra-apso.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 07:46:23 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: re: Announcing...Covers Volume 24!! Wow, another wonderful covers CD Bob! Although I've been waaaaaay to busy at work the past month, I can still listen to music. It's still amazing that these covers keep getting better and better, and to think that I thought the project had peaked with Jim Nabors :~) This particular CD is jam packed with some great songs. Tim Spong, thanks for the Bruce Anthony tracks. I *love* the way he combines "Dry Cleaner from Des Moines" with "If I Were a Richman" (very cool arrangement) The Lilac Time performing "BYT" ?. I've never heard of them, but they kind of remind me of The Brady kids all grown up. I'm sure The Lilac Time sings "It's a Sunshine Day" somewhere on that album :~) I'm not familiar with Hal Frazier either, but enjoy his version of BSN. Kind of like Cher an octave lower (if you can imagine that) Louis van Dyke/Rogier van Otterloo - Both Sides Now. This has to be one of my favorite arrangements of the most covered Joni song. Very romantic. The entire CD is great, and I continue to be thankful to Bob and all his hard work. Thanks to all the contributors too! I urge everyone to contact Bob or Uncle John for this great stocking stuffer. Oh, and also a BIG thanks to Bob for copies of the 2001 Jonifest. It brings back some great memories, and it still amazes me how talented so many of you are. Steve Polifka, great job on the artwork. AND Kay Ashley, I could listen to your song "Holy Man" over and over. Okay, got to get to the office. Miss you guys! Jimmy p.s. Wally K., I'm still here for you. You get a level 10 for straight acting :~) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 08:18:48 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: "covering" (NJC) <> I think you may be a bit over-sensitive on this issue, Marian...I've obviously been pretty tuned in to discussion about covers here, and I can't recall anyone expressing "disdain" over a lack of creativity...I admit, I take a special delight in hearing a singer or band take one of Joni's compositions where it's never been before, or simply being creative in their song choice. But I think there's a value in them all! When I hear your beautiful singing & playing, I hear your intense & sincere love of Joni's singing and guitar styling that shines through every time! I loved Jarrett's take on "All I Want", it just surprised me that for an artist who is sometimes given to extensive improvisation, he plays this one fairly straight up, and in less than 3 minutes. I also very much appreciated what Fred added to the discussion regarding the track. My main purpose in assembling this collection was to stimulate discussion about Joni's compositions and the interpretations of others. It's always disappointing to me that it so seldom takes place. And thankfully I was there when you were channelling Joni and playing "The Wolf That Lives In Lindsay"! I got chills, and still do whenever I hear it. There is always weighty artisitc value in performing and recording Joni's compositions, whether you're honoring her arrangements and tablature or re-inventing the composition in an innovative way. Bob NP: David Byrne, "you & eye" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 14:42:28 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) I hope I didn't sound like I was picking on you, Bob. I didn't mean to. I'm not sure where this perception of disdain comes from exactly. Maybe I am being over-sensitive. I have been thinking a lot about writing music. I seem to be able to do the music part, but words have generally eluded me. Maybe I haven't tried hard enough to find them. Also, I realize I am very shy about sharing my own bits and pieces of songs without words - so much so that I have burst into tears on more than one occasion trying to sing them for someone. It is so much easier to sing other people's songs than to dig into my soul for my own songs (there's the fear that I won't find anything) or to bear my soul by singing the bits and pieces I do have for other people. Anyway, thank you for your reassurance and compliments about my playing/singing. It's comforting to know that you appreciate what I do. Marian On 04 December 2001 14:19, SCJoniGuy@aol.com [SMTP:SCJoniGuy@aol.com] wrote: << I think you may be a bit over-sensitive on this issue, Marian...I've obviously been pretty tuned in to discussion about covers here, and I can't recall anyone expressing "disdain" over a lack of creativity...I admit, I take a special delight in hearing a singer or band take one of Joni's compositions where it's never been before, or simply being creative in their song choice. But I think there's a value in them all! When I hear your beautiful singing & playing, I hear your intense & sincere love of Joni's singing and guitar styling that shines through every time! >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 8:44:7 -0800 From: "Johnson Victor" Subject: Abbey Road and George Harrison(njc) I received this from another list: In Ian McDonald'sbook:Revolution In The Head where he describes each Beatle song he saysthis about the End. "before three two bar guitar solos in rotating sequence from McCartney,Harrison(sounding remarkedly like Eric Clapton) and Lennon" Also in Mark Lewisohn's book The Beatles Recording Sessions which is basedon the official Abbey Road Studio Session Notes it lists only the Beatlesfor the sessions in which this was recorded. In Harry Castleman and Walter J. Podrazik's book All Together Now, theBeatles First Complete Discography no other musicians are listed for thissong but are listed for other songs such as Clapton on While My GuitarGently Weeps and Billy Preston on Get Back. Then from Lennon himself in Jann Wenner's book Lennon Remembers when Wennersays "you said that you can make the guitar speak, in which songs do youfeel you"ve done that?" Then Lennon says "I Found Out. I think it's nice. It drives along. I don'tknow, ask EricClapton, he thinks I can play" After a few remarks abouttechnical guitarists Lennon says "There's a nice bit I played on AbbeyRoad. Paul gave each of us a piece, a little break where Paul plays, Georgeplays andI play. When you listen to it you know..." Wenner asks " Which is that?" Lennon continues "There's one bit, one of those where it stops, on CarryThat Weight and then suddenly it goes boom boom boom on the drums and weall take turns to play. I'm the third one on it. I have a definite style ofplaying, always had. But I was overshadowed. They call George the invisiblesinger, I'm the invisible guitarist" --- Johnson Victor--- waytoblu@mindspring.com--- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 08:58:21 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) <> No, I didn't think that at all, Marian. You're my friend and also one of the dearest people I've ever met. <<- so much so that I have burst into tears on more than one occasion trying to sing them for someone.>> That emotional connection you have with the music is what makes it so wonderful, Marian. Whether it's a Dylan song or a Joni song, or one of *your own* which I'm now DYING to hear! :~) Bob NP: Burning Spear, "Throw Down Your Arms" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 15:19:56 +0100 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) On 04 December 2001 14:58, SCJoniGuy@aol.com [SMTP:SCJoniGuy@aol.com] wrote: > ... or one of *your own* which I'm now DYING to hear! :~) Well, maybe I will feel brave enough by next August to sing a few of my bits and pieces for you. I'm going to work on them - maybe even find some lyrics. I'm not sure they will be ready enough to sing on the stage, but I promise you a private listen if there's time and space for that. Marian ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 09:27:51 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) <> Awesome! But no crying...I couldn't bear it! LOL! Bob NP: Gregg Cagno, "talkin' bout the boat" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 09:27:50 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: RE: "covering" (NJC) <> Awesome! But no crying...I couldn't bear it! LOL! Bob NP: Gregg Cagno, "talkin' bout the boat" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 09:29:07 -0500 From: Emily Gray Tedrowe Subject: shameless, but sort of relevant NJC hi everyone: i (proudly) announce that my first published piece of fiction is now up on an internet 'zine...if you are interested, it's at www.womenwriters.net -- it's a short story called called "Birth Day" and it is the "featured fiction" of the issue. relevant? only because there are a number of music references in the piece, primarily a running theme about the Beatles, so... feeling shy about making this public BUT happy AND glad to do my (small) part in honoring george harrison AND thankful for the bandwidth (someday one of you technical computer people will have to explain to me what that means), all best, emily ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 07:38:12 -0800 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Joni in London Sunday's LA Times had a story about Joni's current sessions in London being filmed...I'd post it but I'm swamped...it might be online. - -- ######################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 10:46:58 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Joni in London Steve Dulson wrote: > Sunday's LA Times had a story about Joni's current sessions > in London being filmed...I'd post it but I'm swamped...it > might be online. Here is the link to the story: http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/printedition/calendar/la-000095830dec02.story Jerry the Cybrarian ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 07:48:18 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Yarbrough Subject: Re: 100 Greatest Women of Music sjc Polly Harvey is PJ Harvey, an immensely talented rock singer-songwriter with at least three classic albums to her credit already, and two other very good ones. (Unless you ask Bob M.). To my mind no other artist to emerge in the last decade has produced as much consistently challenging and enjoyable work. She's destined to become a legend on Joni's par. If I remember correctly Q's lists of these sorts are usually reader-voted, which obviously tilts things in favor of more recent and younger artists. Considering that bias, I think Joni's relatively high placement--and Laura Nyro's appearing at all--are things to be very grateful for. - --Michael NP: Jill Scott, _Experience_ (AWESOME!!!) - --- Bree Mcdonough wrote: > >1. Polly Harvey > > I'm not enlightened. Who is Polly Harvey? And i'm > skeptical of this list. > Why isn't joni first? > > >8. Joni Mitchell > ) > >24. Britney Spears > A joke right? > >33. Carole King > What was the criteria? Britney before Carole?? > The no-talent is even > on the list, but before Carole?? > >54. Anne & Nancy Wilson (Heart)?>55. Bonnie Raitt > >56. Tina Turner > >57. Joan Armatrading > > >93. Laura Nyro > > How soon people forget. What an insult!! > > Bree > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ===== ____________________________________________________ "I'm just a little bit heiress, a little bit Irish, A little bit Tower of Pisa whenever I see ya, So please be kind if I'm a mess." - --Rufus Wainwright, "Cigarettes and Chocolate Milk" Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 07:48:59 -0800 (PST) From: rosemjoy@aol.com Subject: A Trip to the Past With Joni Mitchell From: Rose Joy Is this the article Steve? - -------------------- A Trip to the Past With Joni Mitchell - -------------------- By STEVE HOCHMAN December 2 2001 Filmmaker Allison Anders paid homage to one of the female titans of '60s and '70s pop music with her 1996 movie "Grace of My Heart," loosely based in part on the life of Carole King. Now Anders is making a film about one of the other woman pillars of that time: Joni Mitchell. The singer-songwriter has hired Anders to make a documentary of her recording new versions of some of her songs with a full orchestra. The sessions and shooting began last week at Air Lyndhurst, George Martin's London studio complex. "I've talked with Joni at length about what we want to do, and what's so exciting for me is the idea of her revisiting her old material," Anders says. "She just did 'Circle Game' with the full orchestra, and while the original is youthful with just her and the acoustic guitar, now she's singing alto and has all that experience to put into it." The film, like the album tentatively titled "Circle Game," will center on the performances with conductor Vince Mendoza and 77 members of the London Symphony Orchestra, but will use the new versions of the old songs (including "Woodstock," "Amelia" and "Judgment of the Moon and Stars") as entries into explorations of Mitchell's life and art. Anders plans to supplement the performance footage with interviews, examinations of Mitchell's paintings and a look at her family life after she was reunited a few years ago with the daughter she had given up for adoption shortly after birth. "The film will look at all the changes that have happened in her life since these songs were written," Anders says, "not the least of which is being reunited with her daughter and grandchildren." Anders is finding plenty to relate to in the subject matter, both in her experiences as a woman in the arts and the steps made by her daughter, singer-songwriter Tiffany Anders, who debuted last year with an album produced by Polly Jean Harvey. "There's so much I've learned from [Mitchell's] experiences," Anders says. "As a woman, even though I work in a different medium, there's a lot of the same stuff. She says, 'Well, for a while I was called chick music.' Imagine--Joni Mitchell dismissed as chick music! And now I read an article about chick books, so here we go again." This is the second time Anders and Mitchell have teamed to look at the past. For the "Grace" soundtrack, Mitchell wrote the song "Man From Mars" in the style of her early work.* TUNING IN UNKNOWNS: Unsigned pop music acts lost a visible outlet when "Farmclub.com," the television venture of the multimedia music development enterprise headed by music executives Jimmy Iovine and Doug Morris, went off the air earlier this year. But now new artists are getting a substitute. "X-11," a showcase for unknowns, is starting production in L.A. with plans to debut on KCBS as a late-night weekend show starting Jan. 12. Like "Farmclub.com," the show will feature established acts and unknowns, but in a more straightforward setting than its glitzy predecessor's. The show is an outgrowth of Live Unsigned, a company that produces video performance presentations for unsigned acts and helps shop the artists to major record companies. "We find unsigned musicians across the country, screen them and bring them to our production facility in Burbank to record a live music video," co-founder James Hill says. "We then provide them with a DVD of their performances and build a Web presence for them on our Web site. So the next step was to have our own show and that's where we created 'X-11"' (X for Generation X, 11 for louder than 10). Although Hill and partner DeWayne Barron hardly have the credentials of, say, Iovine and Morris, they have impressed some in the music business. "These guys are really close to the street," says Mio Vukovic, vice president of A&R for Warner Bros. and Reprise Records. "There's no filter between them and the stuff they get, but in my business, if you don't know guys like them, then you're not doing your job. They've brought a few artists to me, a couple of which I'm watching closely." * DESIGNATED DRIVERS, PLEASE: How fast can you drive from L.A. to Las Vegas? OK, how fast can you do it early New Year's morning with an increased CHP presence? Even then there should be plenty of time to see all of star DJ Paul Oakenfold's midnight set at the Hollywood Boulevard street party being planned for the turn of 2002 and make it to Vegas' House of Blues for the big coming-out event for English dance music promoter Ministry of Sound, starring ... Paul Oakenfold. Of course, Oakenfold will have a private jet for the trip, but it will be doable by car given that doors for the Vegas event don't even open until 3 a.m., with closing time scheduled for noon. "Maybe we should offer some prize or free admission if someone goes from one show to the other," says Chris Stephenson, president and chief executive of Ministry of Sound's new North American operation, which after several tours and record releases is launching its full-scale operation on this side of the Atlantic. Oakenfold isn't the only major DJ making L.A. the first of two New Year's stops. Paul Van Dyk is starting at Giant's big event at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Following him may not be as feasible as trailing Oakenfold. Van Dyk's second stop is in Phoenix--a good eight hours away. * SMALL FACES: Sting will make a guest appearance Monday at trumpeter Chris Botti's concert at the El Rey Theatre, being taped for a DirecTV special scheduled to air in February. Sting will join Botti, who plays in his band and has just released his own "Night Sessions" album, to sing the Frank Sinatra-associated "In the Wee Small Hours." Shawn Colvin is also set to sing with Botti on one song.... Last April, Neil Finn was joined by Eddie Vedder, Johnny Marr, Radiohead's Phil Selway and Ed O'Brien, Lisa Germano and Finn's brother Tim during a residency at St. James' Theatre in the Finns' native Auckland, New Zealand. A 17-song CD and 25-song DVD culled from those shows will be released Feb. 26 in the U.S. by Nettwerk America. Both discs are titled "7 Worlds Collide." In April, Nettwerk will also release the former Crowded House leader's solo album, "One Nil," which features contributions by Wendy & Lisa, Sheryl Crow and Germano.... Fat Possum Records, home of the revival of north Mississippi country blues, is reaching to city blues, signing longtime star Solomon Burke. Plans are for an album in the classic Muscle Shoals style to be released in late spring or early summer.... A little NYC punk history will be available with two CDs of vintage Richard Hell & the Voidoids coming in the spring from Matador Records. The first will reissue what had been a cassette-only live set from the ROIR label, while the second will be previously unreleased material, mostly live from London in 1977 plus some tracks from New York club CBGB's in 1978, including one featuring a guest performance by Elvis Costello. For information about reprinting this article, go to http://www.lats.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 11:11:26 -0800 From: "Johnson Victor" Subject: RE: shameless, but sort of relevant NJC > thankful for the bandwidth (someday one of you technical > computer people will have to explain to me what that means), It simply means the size of the band...Parliament has a pretty big bandwidth but then someone like the Indigo Girls would have a pretty small bandwidth. Hope this helps! Victor :~} - --- Johnson Victor - --- waytoblu@mindspring.com - --- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 11:27:44 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: PJ...PU! NJC <<(Unless you ask Bob M.). >> Her last record (Stories From The City, Stories From the Sea) was VERY good! Made lots of "best" lists, including my own! I have never heard "Dry" but that is supposedly a classic. "Rid of Me" is SO awful (we're talking one of the most unlistenable records ever made here) that it made me avoid her like the plague. Thanks to Deb Shea, I now realize that at least she has potential. <> Well, time will tell I suppose! She can't hold a candle to Ani, but there we go comparing again! ;~) Bob NP: cane141, "we should get together" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 09:04:32 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Yarbrough Subject: Re: PJ...PU! NJC - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > Her last record (Stories From The City, Stories From > the Sea) was VERY good! Made lots of "best" lists, > including my own! > > I have never heard "Dry" but that is supposedly a > classic. These two and _To Bring You My Love_ are the ones I deem classic. Each of them is unimpeachable to my ears. > She can't hold a > candle to Ani, but there we go comparing again! ;~) Oh puleeaze!! :-) I dig me some Ani, and she's definitely one of the best guitar players I've ever heard, but her songwriting veers into triteness and self-conscious punnery too often to compare to the sheer majestry PJ has maintained throughout so many sonic styles. Ani is great, but PJ is something ineffably better IMO. - --Michael NP: Maxwell, _Now_ ===== ____________________________________________________ "I'm just a little bit heiress, a little bit Irish, A little bit Tower of Pisa whenever I see ya, So please be kind if I'm a mess." - --Rufus Wainwright, "Cigarettes and Chocolate Milk" Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 17:11:30 -0000 From: LXROSS@ctrl.co.uk Subject: Air Time SJC Here is a URL for Air Studios where the recent Joni recordings are taking place......it's quite a place. > http://www.airstudios.com/tour/index.shtml > Les (London) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 12:50:18 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: Kurt Elling and critics (njc) In a message dated 12/4/01 4:31:43 AM, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: >He basically seemed to be the same Kurt to me >the other night - he's accentuating a few more very beautiful love songs >this time around - but he still did his trademark rants and scats, too! The new album is straight singing all through, no rants, no scat. That's what fostered these critics' objections; they assume he's denying that part of his self in order to pander to a potentially larger audience. But they're wrong. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 10:07:13 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Jeff Bisch - The Debut CD is now available. A message from Jeff: Hi everyone, Its finally here! 40-watt stars the debut CD. All original songs, and some really great players. Please check it out and get all the details at the shiny new website www.jeffbisch.com or at www.cdbaby.com/jbisch. Think stocking-stuffer. Thanks and warm wishes, Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 10:52:57 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Address Book Trick for Email Viruses! A friend sent me this & wanted to pass it on as it sounds like a simple deterrent (in addition to staying current on your virus protection & live updates). Here is is: This tip won't prevent YOU from getting any viruses (you have to scan those attachments yourself before opening them to do that), but it will stop those viruses from latching onto your address book and sending itself out to others. To avoid spreading computer viruses, create a contact in your email address book (make sure to use the tilde character ~, or other non-alpha character): first name: ~illegal last name: address email address: ~alert-virus This contact will then show up as your first contact. If a virus attempts to do a "send all" on your contact list, your PC will put up an error message saying that: "The Message could not be sent. One or more recipients do not have an e-mail address. Please check your Address Book and make sure all the recipients have a valid e-mail address." You click on OK and the offending (virus) message would not have been sent to anyone. Of course no changes have been made to your original contacts list. The offending (virus) message may then be automatically stored in your "Drafts" or "Outbox" folder. Go in there and delete the offending message. The problem is solved and the virus is not spread. Try this and pass on to your email contacts. The more people that use this technique, the less vulnerable we will be to viruses that spread in this manner! I hope this will help everyone who is interested. ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 11:28:08 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Clapton and Harrison,(continued), Long , njc Quite simply, the only Beatles tune Clapton played on was "While My Guitar Gently Weeps". The solos at the end of Abbey Road are by George, Paul, and John, alternating 3 bars each. I forget which order they played it but it is pretty obvious from listening to it. John's playing is primal and bluesy, George's is certainly the most accomplished, Paul's is reminiscent of his work on his first solo LP. RR "Jim L'Hommedieu (Lama)" wrote: > Gen Xers might be interested to know that Eric (god) (slowhand) Clapton bent > his guitar at such Beatle gems as "While My Guitar Gently Weeps", and lots > of amazing stuff on "Abbey Road". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 12:04:45 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Zappa on critics (njc) Murphycopy@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/3/01 1:23:37 PM, FredNow@aol.com writes: > > << I've actually read a few negative reviews from some idiot critics > (redundant?) who just don't get it >> > > "Rock Journalism is people who can't write interviewing people who can't talk > for people who can't read" > > --Frank Zappa Shouldn't that be 'people who can't speak' ? Unless they are interviewing mutes.... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 12:08:56 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: (njc&long)Warning: Brame's Appointment & "Taliban" in the USA Shocking, or typical, but it's actually better for the opposition in a way that he appoints someone so easily discredited as a whacko. Better a wolf in wolf's clothing that disguised under a sheepskin. (Clinton, for instance). At least you know what you're dealing with. RR BigWaltinSF@aol.com wrote: > Hi, all, > > Sorry about the length of this and my not fixing the formatting, but my hands > were shaking already before I read it, and then... -- Scary reading indeed. > -- Walt > > Subject: ALERT: bigot and homophobe appointment being considered for NLRB > > > > >BUSH PREPARED TO NOMINATE 'BIBLICAL LAW' ACTIVIST J. > > ROBERT BRAME TO NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS > >BOARD ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 16:08:23 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Zappa on critics (njc) Regarding this quotation, guitarzan@saber.net writes: << "Rock Journalism is people who can't write interviewing people who can't talk > for people who can't read" > > --Frank Zappa guitarzan@saber.net writes: Shouldn't that be 'people who can't speak' ? Unless they are interviewing mutes.... >> No, the "people who can't read" part refers to the people who are buying Rolling Stone and other rock periodicals. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 13:35:22 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: new BAD virus to watch out for NJC hi guys, i wanted to give you a quick heads up on a brand spanking new pc virus that just hit someone at my company. its called worm_gone.a it is truly evil. makes the badtrans virus look like a day at the park. for more info, go here: http://www.antivirus.com/pc-cillin/vinfo/virusencyclo/default5.asp?VName=WORM_GONE.A&VSect=T alison e. in slc Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 15:45:26 -0600 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: new BAD virus to watch out for NJC thanks alison mack > hi guys, i wanted to give you a quick heads up on a > brand spanking new pc virus that just hit someone at > my company. > > its called worm_gone.a > > it is truly evil. makes the badtrans virus look like a > day at the park. > for more info, go here: > > http://www.antivirus.com/pc-cillin/vinfo/virusencyclo/default5.asp?VName=WOR M_GONE.A&VSect=T > > alison e. in slc > Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. > http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 15:59:10 -0600 From: "mack watson-bush" Subject: Re: abundance Bree, your post brought back memories. I went to a conservative barbeque area a few years back with some college chums. The people there thought they were quite high brow. They had a band that played exclusive country music but when the night was closing down they were playing albums, etc. I lamented to one of the friends about the music and how it was weighing me down, despite my inebriated state. She took my Barry White tape to the men doing the music and they played it. We all danced to it but the rest of the crowd just stared at us like we were from outer space. "can't get enough of your love" damn, now that is music in this book. mack > I completely understand!! Well, you know when you love someone you want the > rest of the world to know just how great this person is. You want to share > and spread the "news".....so in a public place all the better. > I paid the DJ a few bucks on the side to sneak some Joni in at My niece's > wedding reception a few weeks ago. I was on freakin cloud 9 when Help Me > blasted out. (the jack helped too) My niece came on to the dance floor and > eased her way over to me and winked,whispered in my ear.."amazing > coincidence how Joni "shows up" when your around." > > Still trying to convert her, > > Bree > > > >hearing joni unexpected is like a drug. > >hearing joni in public, when someone else put her on . . . fills my body > >and > >soul. > > > >hearing joni unexpected is like swirling with patterns of flowers and, oh. > >. > >. > > > >I am just free associating here. > >Y'all know what I am talking about? > > > >Hi everyone!!!!!! > > > >Marianne > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 17:58:14 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: James Taylor bio reviewed (NJC) For a review of the new James Taylor biography by Timothy White, go here: http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/338/living/Novel_approach_to_James_Taylor_st ory+.shtml ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 19:34:09 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: "covering" (NJC) Marian I too love just playing the songs the way they are and while my ability restrains me from being able to do them on guitar or piano exactly the way I may want to, I do my best to be true to the arrangment. Vocally I tend to channel what I have heard the artists do from their various performances and so my annunciations may be very similar I still sing in my voice. Many people have told me when I "cover" a song I sound like that person. I recall playing in Kakki's living room and having Dulson remark as such that I "sound" like Nash or Croz or whoever and to me it is very flattering to have someone appreciate that. If I ever had to play for Joni I would be a little uncomfortable due to my lack of originality in my attempts to play the songs (not to mention being nervous as a whore in church), but it is the only way that I know how to do it at this point and the only way I really wanna do it. It is one of the reasons that the fests have become so important to me because the people seem to really enjoy it no matter what I do. I truly wish I could write good songs but i feel like the ones I have written are for me or whoever I wrote them for and they are always centered around love or a lack of or whatever. Last night I sang When The Stars go Blue by Ryan Adams and of course I think i sound like Michael Paz trying to sound like Ryan Adams trying to sound like Roy Orbison, but i LOVE it. Thanks Fred and Marian for opening this can of worms and look forward to hearing more on the topic. Love Paz NP-Paper Moon-Whiskeytown (just cam in the mail and I still love this guy for whatever reason. Thanks Les and all who posted on Ryan Adams. OH MY GAWD it just switched to What The Devil Wanted and this is SO different and kinda Beatley. on 12/4/01 1:15 AM, M.Russell@iaea.org at M.Russell@iaea.org wrote: > I really liked what Fred wrote because it made me feel a little better about > something that I have been feeling sensitive about for awhile now. > > "Cover" was not in my musical vocabulary until a couple of years after > joining JMDL. Since learning what this term means, I have become aware of > what seems to be an element of disdain among some (many?) JMDLers for anyone > who doesn't "cover" Joni's music "creatively" and this awareness has led to > a sense of discomfort about performing Joni's music anymore anywhere. > > In all the years that I played guitar and sang Joni's songs, it never > occurred to me to try to elaborate on or make changes to her beautiful (and > IMO, perfect) music. I was never trying to "be" or "become" Joni by singing > her songs (I don't have her vocal chords and I would never dream of dressing > up in a blonde wig and wearing a beret! :^D). For me, it has always been > just a great pleasure to try to recreate her beautiful guitar sounds and > sing along in my own voice. For me, singing/performing is a meditative > process - an opportunity to get beyond myself to convey the message/meaning > of whatever song as best I can - and I have always felt a sense of peace and > healing in that process, especially with Joni's music. Each time I sing a > song is a new chance to do it better than ever before. It is not a > competitive thing or an imitative thing, but a process - a personal process > that I sometimes share if I perform for someone. > > Something that really bugs me here is all the comparison that goes on. This > artist is better than that one, that artist is trying to be like so and so, > and on and on. I think it is true that all of us cannot avoid being > influenced by all of the events/things/people/songs that we grow up with, > but we each have our own unique interpretation and expression, and I think > that we all deserve to be respected and valued if we are trying to bring > beauty into the world in however limited a fashion. Rickie Lee Jones has a > solid base of people who think she is the best musician who ever walked the > face of the earth, just as most people here feel that way about Joni, and > other people I know feel that way about Natalie Merchant, Jewel, Brittany > Spears, Madonna, Bob Dylan, etc. > > Marian > Vienna > > On Mon, 3 Dec 2001 23:58:31 EST Fred wrote: > >> SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > >>> 17. Keith Jarrett - All I Want: Surprisingly, nothing very creative here >>> from piano virtuouso Jarrett. One of his earlier recordings, it's pretty >>> enough and gets the job done and that's about it. > >> There's much more here than meets the ear. Creativity, in covers, >> can be a highly overrated commodity; too many covers are too damn >> "creative," by which I mean that the "creativity" supersedes the song. >> Yeah, a radical reworking can sometimes work, but often all a song >> needs is the firm stamp of the cover artist's own voice. With Jarrett it's > >> the latter; the thing is, that stamp is somewhat masked by the fact that >> the song itself lays squarely on the broad intersection of Joni's and >> Jarrett's melodic/harmonic language. I think that's a big part of why >> he played it: to demonstrate the hipness of Joni's music, just as it is, >> with no further "hipping it up." He recognized a kinship in her music and >> celebrates by just "singing" her song in his voice, which shares so many >> characteristics with hers. Also, few jazz musicians at that time were >> investigating the current popular songs as alternative jazz vehicles to >> decades of Gershwin, Porter, etc. > > - -Fred ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #574 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?