From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #394 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, September 11 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 394 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni to perform at John Lennon Tribute [dsk ] RE: To the cult-A Jonifest loveletter (review) ["patrick leader" ] Re: [Fwd: Your skirt is up over your head] [Catherine McKay ] RE: [Fwd: Your skirt is up over your head] njc ["jlamadoo, home account" ] Be kind ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Be kind ["Kakki" ] Re: Be kind [Michael Paz ] reckless and careless ["Sharon L. Buffington" ] two-way street NJC ["Bree Mcdonough" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:25:37 -0400 From: dsk Subject: Re: Joni to perform at John Lennon Tribute Victor Johnson wrote: > > I got the impression from reading this article that Joni is not performing > but that they had listed her as someone who had already had a tribute > concert. Yeah, Victor, now that I look closer you're exactly right. Darn. Well, now I can stop wondering what song Joni would be singing. Couldn't imagine her singing any of Lennon's tunes. She seems so grounded in reality and I think of Lennon's music apart from the Beatles as being much airier and full of fantasy. Still wondering what Lou Reed will sing, which leads me to picturing him being at Joni's tribute. That would have been interesting... how about him singing Nathan LaFraneer? He'd make it so scary no one would go in a cab again. Or him doing Slouching Toward Bethlehem, with guitar sounds instead of the booms of Joni's version. Or going against what's expected and doing a bouncy Joni tune, like In France They Kiss on Main Street, or Solid Love. Nah, forget that. He could probably do a great version of A Strange Boy, probably in a very chant-like way. Debra Shea NP: John Cale's Hallelujah in the promo for tv show Third Watch. I love that song and am so glad lots of people are hearing it. It makes me wonder what Joni song could be used in a similar way so more people would hear her, and be smitten, of course... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:34:11 -0400 From: "patrick leader" Subject: RE: To the cult-A Jonifest loveletter (review) hey stephanie: the tori moments we shared were more highlights of this fest. as for this: >So tell me where is that Tori/Joni/Tear In Your Hand/Case of You >comparison you were talking about. I would love to read it, and no I will never forget...I'm >an obsessed Tori fan. > i'm bummed. i can't find the original post (and i was proud of it: i worked on it!) and briefly searching i haven't been able to find it. i'll keep looking... patrick jfp - monica groop - grieg songs ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 18:44:55 -0700 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Re: Joni to perform at John Lennon Tribute dsk wrote: > Victor Johnson wrote: > > > > I got the impression from reading this article that Joni is not performing > > but that they had listed her as someone who had already had a tribute > > concert. ooops! sorry again. I read it wrong too. I come out of lurkdom only to boo boo. go figure > Well, now I can stop wondering what song Joni would be singing. Couldn't > imagine her singing any of Lennon's tunes. I was picturing "Imagine", just 'cuz of the reference in "Impossible Dreamer". And to think now she actually is putting "some fiddles on it" as she says John suggested to her when they met. - -- Phyliss, still lurking after all these years mailto:pward@datacourse.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:39:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: marcel njc - --- Dolphie Bush wrote: > reading the postings with a general feelng of > indifference but then read the > last one and Marcel, your comment that telling > someone that it looks like they > lost weight because you used to think they were fat > is really stupid. mack I agree. It doesn't make sense at all. Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:43:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: [Fwd: Your skirt is up over your head] Amen, Sister! I just don't get it. - --- AsharaJM@aol.com wrote: > I have never had anything but positive interactions > with you, and that is the > side I know from a personal standpoint. However, I > cannot sit back and say > that your continue rude and insulting posts to > others don't bother me. They > do. Very, very much. I have no room in my > understanding why someone who is > *able* to be kind chooses not to. It *is* a choice. > For whatever reason, you > have chosen to be very civil and nice to me. Of > course, we will not always > agree with each other here, but I believe every > single person on this list > deserves respect and kindness. PLEASE Marcel, stop > the insulting and nasty > remarks. Frankly, it doesn't accomplish anything > except to make *you* look > bad. I invite you to let the list see the side I > have seen of you, and let > the "insulting side" go. > > In the spirit of peace, > Ashara Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 23:21:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: [Jonifest2001] Divine intervention? - --- "Lori R. Fye" wrote: > > Telling my Mary about the weekend, I had to admit > that the whole thing > sounds a little "kumbayah-ish" when trying to > explain it to someone who > hasn't attended -- and especially to someone who > isn't a member of the > JMDL. But spending such quality time with people > from this list is an > incredible, FUN experience! I look forward to doing > it again next year > (and I hereby volunteer for whatever needs doing). I agree - it is VERY difficult trying to explain the phenomenon of Jonifest to anyone who isn't on the list. It sounds cultish when you try to explain it to others - it even sounds cultish to me, and I was there, so I know it isn't! Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 23:26:55 -0400 From: "patrick leader" Subject: marcel (njc) dear ashara: I am absolutely >heartsick that >some people I really care for did not feel they could attend the >fest because >of you, Marcel. i didn't tell you, but i was so close to not coming to this, my fourth nejonifest, ashara... heather will vouch. the number one reason was because marcel was attending... i couldn't believe that after all the bitter abuse marcel has dripped on jonilisters this year, he was still welcome at a gathering... i think that was a mistake. i know you weren't as close to the list this year, maybe havn't seen the horrible exchanges that marcel's fucking awful behaviour has caused... i hope you don't know about his consistent private posting of abusive emails to women on this list, women who have said quite publicly "marcel, if you can't say it in public, don't post to me". marcel is a cyber-rapist. his private emails to women who've disagreed with him publicly have been beyond acceptable. harrasive. his private posts are hostile acts, just as you've seen in the message that debra forwarded. i'm proud that i managed to avoid him for a couple of days, ashamed that i shook hands with him when he departed jonifest, glad i washed my hand afterward and appalled that this person still pays no price for his actions. his poor benighted wife, who had to wonder why so many festers avoided her (who wants to say 'your husband's an asshole'?) had a worse time of it. MARCEL, DON'T POST PRIVATELY IN RESPONSE TO THIS. this probably won't work with marcel. chris marshall is going to deal with the guidelines of marcel's isp. god bless chris... - ------- it shouldn't be this difficult, being a member of jmdl.com. no one has ever done more to fuck up this community than marcel d'este patrick np - silence > >I have never had anything but positive interactions with you, and >that is the >side I know from a personal standpoint. However, I cannot sit back and say >that your continue rude and insulting posts to others don't bother >me. They >do. Very, very much. I have no room in my understanding why someone who is >*able* to be kind chooses not to. It *is* a choice. For whatever >reason, you >have chosen to be very civil and nice to me. Of course, we will not always >agree with each other here, but I believe every single person on this list >deserves respect and kindness. PLEASE Marcel, stop the insulting and nasty >remarks. Frankly, it doesn't accomplish anything except to make *you* look >bad. I invite you to let the list see the side I have seen of you, and let >the "insulting side" go. > >In the spirit of peace, >Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 23:37:35 -0400 From: "jlamadoo, home account" Subject: RE: [Fwd: Your skirt is up over your head] njc Enough's enough, Marcel. If I recall correctly, it says right in the FAQ / Intro to JMDL that you can NOT send unsolicited emails to listers against their will. In Newburyport I saw you transformed into an angelic, blissed out fan by Joni's early songs. At first I couldn't believe it but I captured it on film. I'm appealling to your sweet, sentimental side. No more barbs. No more apologies. It's stopping time. Give it up, bud. The down side would be horrible and permenant. (Remember Chris G.'s experience? He is a nice guy at heart too, but he's gone. And gone for good.) Writing to folks off list is wrong. Stop now or you'll get unsubbed forever. Jim L'Hommedieu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 20:30:54 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Be kind It just breaks my heart to think that someone did not attend jonifest because of someone else...Marcel you are so different in person then you are in some of your emails...this too breaks my heart...I am striving to find kind yet truthful words. Surely this is possible. To speak our minds yet to remain kind to the individual we disagree with... ******************************************** Kate Bennett www.katebennett.com sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 20:47:37 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Be kind The title says it all. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 23:56:25 -0700 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Be kind Brothers and sisters! This is the way (Thank you Kate) to address this issue. Name calling does nothing, but reduce the situation further (as in some earlier emails). I truly understand everyones frustration in the matter because I know Mark (who THINKS he's Marcel) and none of the names fit what I am hearing tonight. I think it's not time to bring out the hammers and the boards and the nails, but the olive branches and flowers to share. Love Paz NP-If You Can-Jack Neilson so long for now you know I'll see you in a dream... JN on 9/10/01 8:30 PM, Kate Bennett at kate@katebennett.com wrote: > It just breaks my heart to think that someone did not attend jonifest > because of someone else...Marcel you are so different in person then you are > in some of your emails...this too breaks my heart...I am striving to find > kind yet truthful words. Surely this is possible. To speak our minds yet to > remain kind to the individual we disagree with... > > ******************************************** > Kate Bennett > www.katebennett.com > sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com > Discover the Indies at Taylor Guitars: > http://www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/bennett.html > ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 23:59:17 -0500 From: "Sharon L. Buffington" Subject: reckless and careless I am thinking about the word careless...when reading posts from Patrick, Chris, Ashara, and Debra concerning their feelings about Marcel...I once again feel that Marcel has posted Debra with careless disregard for the spirit of respect and dignity. When I meet someone who makes a sexist or racist remark that raises my hackles, I say to them "You seem like too nice a person to make a statement such as that". This has been very effective in opening up communication and dialogue. I am of the belief that we should always allow a person to back away from something negative they have done with grace. However, once the person has been afforded the opportunity to do this and refuses then it becomes increasingly difficult to believe they can make that change. And it is here that I look at the word careless...because it means to care less. Marcel stated in pertinent part to Debra, " This may be beyond your sense of "compliment" after all Comradette a compliment to you is a red star on your beanie for how many people you turned into the secret police." I ask you all how much more can Marcel care less? When I initially joined the Joni list I was dismayed over the sarcastic and venomous comments Marcel made to Debra. I was upset that Debra did not want to come to the fest because of Marcel. I knew this before I went to the Fest and I put that aside while I listened to Marcel play his guitar and sing for us. But all the while I was there I could not forget history. I am new to this list and lack the experience and respect of other listers. However, listers such as Debra, Ashara, Patrick, Chris, and Colin do have your respect and their opinions should be given much weight. Peace........Sharon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:41:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Nuriel Tobias Subject: Talk to the hand 1. listening to the new dylan and finding it artificial and very cold. 2. a canadian cat painter called me last night and asked me why no one at the jmdl is interested in talking about her. 3. so joni is not going to appear at the tribute to lennon? best news this week. nelly furtado? beck? moby? mark anthony? i don't think so. 4. never saw any photo of kilauren and not gonna wait till her mother paints her. can someone direct me to her photo? 5. something i wanted to ask all of you for some time now: is - music the food of love - or is - love the food of music? i'm not joking. i find it a very JC one. 6. i think it's time for all for us to quit everything and go back to painting. _____________________________________________________________ Free email, web pages, news, entertainment, weather and MORE! Check out -------------------------------> http://wowmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 22:45:27 -0700 From: "Bree Mcdonough" Subject: two-way street NJC Being new to the list, several weeks now,I feel that I maybe shouldn't make a comment about the unkindness of one of the members. I read and enjoyed the posts of the members that attended the Jonifest. I don't know all the circumstances, but maybe this particular member felt ostracised and is now retaliating? When someone is hurt so badly they usually disguise this hurt with anger. They sometimes don't even realize it themselves. Reading the posts after the Jonifest the love that was there came across in everyone's words. Is it possible that one of the attendees was given the cold shoulder? Just asking? Didn't feel welcome? In my last post I told about my six-year relationship that had ended. My partner, who I thought would be for life, left me. (still very heartbroken over this) Again, thanks to all the listers who sent me song suggestions to listen to of Joni's. They have been a big help! If you think about it, there really isn't that much time between the cradle and the grave. Kind of scary. We should look inward first then it's okay to check outwardly. Bree _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #394 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?