From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #244 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, June 5 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 244 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. Information on the 4th "Annual" New England JoniFest: http://www.jmdl.com/jfne2001.cfm The Joni Chat Room: http://www.jmdl.com/chat.cfm ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242NJC [catman ] NJCRe: NY Fest, Feminist, Egotists, Capitalists, Rapists, etc.Whew ! :-) [catman ] Little things that drive you mad - njc ["Greer, Ron" ] RE: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 ["Donna J. Binkley" ] Re: NY Fest, Feminist, Egotists, Capitalists, Rapists, etc. Whew ! :-) [S] RE: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 absolutely njc [Catherine McKay ] Re: NJC [catman ] Re: The very first Jonifest in Germany [catman ] Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2001 NJC [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2001 NJC [Kammass@aol.com] Harbourfront(JC) [Lisa Kowalski ] Chicago JMDL Get Together(NJC) [Scott and Jody ] Re: Harbourfront(JC) [Jerry Notaro ] Today's Joni Articles: June 04 [les@jmdl.com] Today's Joni Articles: June 04 [les@jmdl.com] Excellent News!!! (njc) ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: Today's Joni Articles: June 04 [Les Irvin ] Joni and Rufus ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] Post polio syndrome [Steve Dulson ] Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) [AsharaJM@aol.com] Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) [Stacey4882@aol.com] Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: NJC from Hunter Thompson ["Brenda J. Walker" ] Addicting NJC [Scott Price ] Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) [mags ] Re: Harbourfront(JC) [Catherine McKay ] Re: Harbourfront(JC) [Catherine McKay ] Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) [Catherine McKay ] RE: NJC from Hunter Thompson ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Today's Joni Articles: June 5 [les@jmdl.com] Today in Joni History: June 5 [les@jmdl.com] Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) ["hell" ] Re: Cute Stevie quote about Joni NJC ["hell" ] Music on sale - NJC ["hell" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 08:50:46 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242NJC Stacey4882@aol.com wrote: > << Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 23:44:53 +0100 > From: catman > Subject: Re: Genital Mutilation - absolutely NJC > > I think most people do realise there is a difference in severity [between > circumcision and female genital mutilation]. However both are wrong and one > is not less wrong than the other. >> > > With all due respect, how can you say "one is not less wrong than the other?" > Men who are circumcized are able to have full, healthy sex lives. Women who > suffer genital mutilation suffer pain throughout their lives and are unable > to enjoy sex. "Wrong" does have degrees. I don't agree. Wrong is wrong. This is not the same as saying severity of effect is the same. It is rather like saying sexual molestaion is wrong but actual penetration is more wrong. To mutilate a child, regardless of the outcome, is wrong. oh, and 'men who are cricumcised' is not the point. the point is children being circumcised, defensless and choiceless. > > > (Personally, I am undecided about whether circumcision is acceptable or not. > On a related note, I will share that once, on a first date and over dinner, > the guy made sure I knew that no son of his would ever be circumsized. Yes, > he was rather an intense fellow.) > > - Stacey - -- bw colin BRO GC, 950i 940,864, 260, 890,Silver 830 and 270, Passap 6000 Duo80 colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 08:55:03 +0100 From: catman Subject: NJCRe: NY Fest, Feminist, Egotists, Capitalists, Rapists, etc.Whew ! :-) Bobsart48@aol.com wrote: > Finally after a week I have a chance to post a few comments about last week's > NY fest at Judy's Chelsea in NY. I had other plans cancelled, and late in the > week realized I really ought to go and meet some JMDL'ers, so I got in touch > with David Lahm by e-mail, confessed my lateness to and ignorance of the > party plans, etc, but he extended a warm welcome anyway, and I was starting > to feel I would be right at home, and sure, I could bring my guitar even > though I wasn't prepared to play anything formal. I figured it was really > nice of him to go out and rent space in Manhattan for a gathering like this, > so that we could all get together and meet each other and play some on an > informal basis, etc. He must have thought it was pretty cute, and figured > he'd play along with my naivete' by not telling me JC's was his place. So, I > find out when I get there Saturday afternoon, and right off the bat I get to > listen to him play a few songs and oops - no wonder it's his place (or is it > really Judy's - I know they're in this together, but in my family I have > limited rights of ownership) - he's a real musician ! And David's real nice, > and asks me if I plan to play, and I say not really, but if someone wants to > sing California I'll try to put on a JT style accompaniment that I started to > figure out last night, if the timing is right or whatever. So, for the next > six hours I get to meet a bunch of JMDL'ers in person (my first such group - > it was exciting for me to meet you all - especially David, Rose, Sue, > Nikki, Kay (?), Debra and Roberto - another musical talent). I also have the > honor to meet Judy, who has a few opinions of her own, I gather :-), and who > wasn't too interested in the fact that I was a Joni Mitchell fan, but warmed > right up when I mentioned I had enjoyed seeing Peter Allen in a cabaret about > 25 years ago - and then proceeded to remind me where I had seen him (at a > place called Reno Sweeney's, in NY). "How'd you know that" I asked, and she > smiled sweetly (but with perhaps just the slightest hint of deserved > condescension) and replied "well, I am in the business". ;-) And, I really > enjoyed all the music, as well. And at night, there are real patrons as well > as us JMDL'ers, and near the end David nudges Alison up there to sing > California and then tells her that I am going to accompany her on the guitar > (pretty sneaky - I assume Alison thinks David's going to put some pretty > piano line on the song). Anyway, Alison sings the song so well it distracts > me, and I miss about half the notes, I think :-( - yeah, that must have been > why ;-) - but everyone seems to agree with me about what a nice job Alison > did, so there is applause at the end anyway. Alison - if there is a next > time, I promise to get it all right, now that I have finished learning it. > Anyway, you were terrific. > > Which brings me to the other stuff. Sue McNamara (of JMDL guitar TAB creator > fame - great job there by you, Sue, and by the other tab posters - and > "doesn't it feel good" ;-) to get a little public recognition for the really > wonderful job you have done), in an earlier post, said > > "As far as Joni is concerned, if she had said I am not a feminist, I'm a > humanist, it might not have hurt so much, but as much as I love the > woman, Joni is a Joni-ist. Her goal was/is to further the art, so > that didn't leave too much time to support other women (read > competition). Her philosophies seem very power-oriented (in an > individualistic way [dogeatdog]). David Crosby said she was as shy > as Mussolini and Dylan called her a man!! :-) ha ha. She is > definitely not a feminist (in my opinion). " > > Well, I agree and yet I disagree. Joni does appear to be an egoist (there's > that label thing again), by which I mean she has a big ego, and that is not > in my mind's eye a negative. It is, rather, a necessary evil of sorts (sort > of like captialism, in my opinion). It is a driver (not the only one, of > course) of performance, creativity and excellence, but it can be destructive > if allowed to get out of control and dominate. And she knows it. She has > confessed over and over of her wrestling with it, of her struggle for higher > achievement, etc. etc. Need I quote the lines ? I don't think I have to for > this list. However, is that necessarily mutually exclusive with being a > feminist ? Again, this may depend on definitions and semantics, but I don't > think so. Surely the self anointed leaders of the feminist movement have been > egoists - or worse, in my opinion - and talk about a philosophy oriented > toward power ! If feminism is "the doctrine advocating social, political and > all other rights of women equal to those of men" (Random House Unabridged), > then Joni probably is a feminist if that term is defined as 1) one who agrees > with or morally supports the doctrine. If to be a feminist 2) one must be > politically active in support of the doctrine, or must agree with political > extensions of the doctrine - such as separate as well as equal, or better > than equal, or entitled to affirmative action to impose some sort of supposed > statistical equality, or entitled to preferential treatment in the job market > because of such status - then I suppose she is not. When she said she is not, > I suspect she was applying the second definition to the term, rather than the > first. And I suspect that you may have been, too. Anyway, I prefer the first > definition, myself, so that I can pretend to think of myself as a feminist, > despite my aversion to and disassociation with many aspects of the second > definition. Anyway, we all agree that ongoing atrocities against women are > abhorrent - but we seem to be not sufficiently motivated to collectively take > action against it. Is this cowardly or wise ? This may be a more difficult > question than it appears on its face. Is it worth waging war over ? Will > there be more pain, or less in the short run ? In the long run ? That Yeat's > poem variant "Slouching" haunts - 'the best lack conviction, given some time > to think, and the worst are full of passion without mercy". > > Speaking of which, Colin, I agree with you that sex offenders, and others > whose crimes are of such a type that recitivism is likely to be the norm > rather than the exception, need to be locked up and kept away from the rest > of us (not to mention from their earlier victims, if they are still alive). > And there is no reason for you to feel conflicted about this. The criminals > put the rest of us in a position where we must choose from the lesser of two > evils - 1) to allow the perpetrators to go unpunished and/or continue to > terrorize the rest of us, or 2) debase our spirits by locking them up, or > executing them in certain cases, acts we also find abhorrent. Well, I for > one do not think this is a difficult choice. Just a rotten one. its called 'being between a rock and a hrad place'! I agree with what you wrote. The ideal of being able to be forgiving, lvong etc to all is a noble one but first and foremost must always be the protection of the young and vulnerable. Unfortunately, not uppermost in most people's minds. > The answer is > simple - stop committing atrocious crimes. And like you said - be a good > parent. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:19:58 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: NJCRe: NY Fest, Feminist, Egotists, Capitalists, Rapists,etc.Whew ! :-) sorry tohave repeated the whole of your posyt again. I thought I had deleted it. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 08:35:17 -0400 From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Re: Cute Stevie quote about Joni NJC I'd Say the one Stevie song that really does it for me is "Storm" from the TUsk album. Whenever I hear that one, I just become jello and get soaked in by the song. Blair >From: "Nikki Johnson" >Reply-To: "Nikki Johnson" >To: >Subject: Cute Stevie quote about Joni >Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 00:08:46 -0400 > >My good friend Theresa saw this quote and sent it to me so I thought I'd >pass it along cause it was pretty cool:-) >Love Nikki > >"I hope that my music makes people feel the way I used to feel when I >went home with a record that I loved," Nicks says. "My favorite >example of that is Joni Mitchell's 'Court & Spark.' I heard that >record as I was joining Fleetwood Mac, so for me, it _was_ the >beginning of Fleetwood Mac. For days, I just lay on the floor & sang >along with her & tried to learn how she phrases & how she gets all >those words into one sentence, & I got such joy from that. When I hear >one of those songs today, I just have to sit down, because I'm still >so knocked out. That's how I hope my music affects people." >Stevie Nicks > > > >"Dream on but don't imagine they'll all come true...Vienna waits for you" ~ >Billy Joel _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 16:32:45 +0200 From: "Greer, Ron" Subject: [none] >circumcision is an accepted surgical procedure and a ritual, holy act - >at least in the eyes of most people, who as you've pointed out do not >share your view of it as abuse. we have a number of deaths here each year as a result of the ritual circumcision. it is seen as a rite of passage into adulthood, and is performed by a sangoma (witchdoctor) on a number of people at once, using the same knife, without cleaning the (blunt) knife. although it is said to be without anaesthetic, a mixture of herbs which supposedly kills the pain is in fact applied. unfortunately, no antiseptic is traditionally used. previously efforts were made to stop the practice, which led to great resistance, and the ritual being performed in secret. nowadays, more effort is being made to upgrade the ritual by supply of sterile, sharp knives/scalpels, and antiseptic to apply afterwards. >someone saying they could not imagine a jazz version > of Conversation. Ever since then it has been in my in view of the latest topics, perhaps it could be redone as "he comes for circumcision i comfort him these times" ??????????????????? ron ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 17:15:18 +0200 From: "Greer, Ron" Subject: Little things that drive you mad - njc hi catherine >He was going through our CDs picking out the ones that >he would like to take with him when he leaves. Among >these are some Jane Siberry and (God forbid) Joni!!! >and here I am getting angry inside about this when I i got round a pretty similar problem by letting my ex have the cds, then borrowing them back after a month or 2. theyre still in my cd rack (3years later) incidentally we now get on better than we ever did, before or during our marriage. probably got something to do with only seeing each other once a month & not making any demands on each other......... ron ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 11:29:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 - --- Stacey4882@aol.com wrote: > << Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 23:44:53 +0100 > From: catman > Subject: Re: Genital Mutilation - absolutely NJC > > I think most people do realise there is a > difference in severity [between > circumcision and female genital mutilation]. However > both are wrong and one > is not less wrong than the other. >> > > With all due respect, how can you say "one is not > less wrong than the other?" > Men who are circumcized are able to have full, > healthy sex lives. Women who > suffer genital mutilation suffer pain throughout > their lives and are unable > to enjoy sex. "Wrong" does have degrees. > > (Personally, I am undecided about whether > circumcision is acceptable or not. > On a related note, I will share that once, on a > first date and over dinner, > the guy made sure I knew that no son of his would > ever be circumsized. Yes, > he was rather an intense fellow.) > One of the reasons people do/used to have their baby boys circumcised relates to medical opinion. It goes in and out of style, or medical expertise/opinion, whether or not circumcision is "good" medical practice for hygenic reasons. When my son was born, we did have him circumcised partly for this reason and partly because my husband was circumcised. I wasn't crazy about the idea (why hurt a newborn if it's not necessary? they don't even use a local anaesthetic! if men weren't meant to have foreskins, why are they born with them, and so on?) but I figured this was a "guy thing" and what did I know about it? If I had to do it over again, I am quite sure I would not have done it. Strangely enough, our health insurance used to cover this as a medical procedure, but it was delisted a few years ago "unless medically necessary" (which would mean the boy or man would probably have to have recurring infections). When they did cover it, it was based on medical opinion and recommendation. Same thing when they delisted it. Plus, delisting it saved the health plan some bucks. Female "circumcision" involves a lot more though than cutting off a piece of skin and is often done in extremely unhygenic conditions. It's usually done at puberty and, in addition to excising the clitoris, the girl's labia are sewn up (among other things). The girl/woman ends up having extreme difficulty with urination/menstruation and of course childbirth and can often end up with horrible infections, not to mention constant pain. The purpose of it is to keep the woman faithful to her husband because sexual intercourse is so painful, she wouldn't even dream of having sex with another man (let alone her husband). As I say, if I had to do it over, I wouldn't have had my son circumcised, but female genital mutilation is quite a different thing. (This is a pretty yicky thread.) Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 10:32:02 -0500 From: "Donna J. Binkley" Subject: RE: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 How did we get from Paprika Plains to genital mutiliation is what i'd like to know. db - -----Original Message----- From: les@jmdl.com [mailto:les@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Catherine McKay Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 10:29 AM To: Stacey4882@aol.com; joni@smoe.org Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 - --- Stacey4882@aol.com wrote: > << Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2001 23:44:53 +0100 > From: catman > Subject: Re: Genital Mutilation - absolutely NJC > > I think most people do realise there is a > difference in severity [between > circumcision and female genital mutilation]. However > both are wrong and one > is not less wrong than the other. >> > > With all due respect, how can you say "one is not > less wrong than the other?" > Men who are circumcized are able to have full, > healthy sex lives. Women who > suffer genital mutilation suffer pain throughout > their lives and are unable > to enjoy sex. "Wrong" does have degrees. > > (Personally, I am undecided about whether > circumcision is acceptable or not. > On a related note, I will share that once, on a > first date and over dinner, > the guy made sure I knew that no son of his would > ever be circumsized. Yes, > he was rather an intense fellow.) > One of the reasons people do/used to have their baby boys circumcised relates to medical opinion. It goes in and out of style, or medical expertise/opinion, whether or not circumcision is "good" medical practice for hygenic reasons. When my son was born, we did have him circumcised partly for this reason and partly because my husband was circumcised. I wasn't crazy about the idea (why hurt a newborn if it's not necessary? they don't even use a local anaesthetic! if men weren't meant to have foreskins, why are they born with them, and so on?) but I figured this was a "guy thing" and what did I know about it? If I had to do it over again, I am quite sure I would not have done it. Strangely enough, our health insurance used to cover this as a medical procedure, but it was delisted a few years ago "unless medically necessary" (which would mean the boy or man would probably have to have recurring infections). When they did cover it, it was based on medical opinion and recommendation. Same thing when they delisted it. Plus, delisting it saved the health plan some bucks. Female "circumcision" involves a lot more though than cutting off a piece of skin and is often done in extremely unhygenic conditions. It's usually done at puberty and, in addition to excising the clitoris, the girl's labia are sewn up (among other things). The girl/woman ends up having extreme difficulty with urination/menstruation and of course childbirth and can often end up with horrible infections, not to mention constant pain. The purpose of it is to keep the woman faithful to her husband because sexual intercourse is so painful, she wouldn't even dream of having sex with another man (let alone her husband). As I say, if I had to do it over, I wouldn't have had my son circumcised, but female genital mutilation is quite a different thing. (This is a pretty yicky thread.) Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:00:19 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: Re: NY Fest, Feminist, Egotists, Capitalists, Rapists, etc. Whew ! :-) Hi Bob: Thanks for the kudos on the Guitar site. A team effort there that I am very proud of (with Mark Domyancich, Marian Russell, and Howard Wright-tabbers extraordinaire). When I first thought of the idea I didn't realize that 5 years later we would still be striving to finish her catalog. The woman is a Guitar Goddess. But back to this feminist thing. I agree with you about the egoist thing, which relates to the capitalist thing (which Joni obviously subscribes to also) which in turn brings us to the liberal thing (liberal in the sense of founding fathers of the Constitution FREEDOM...which I think she has accepted as an expatriate [plus artists thrive on freedom of expression). So when you get to the item number 2 (the political action leg of the idea) this pounds against the three political ideas we have just mentioned. Now I could probably write a Ph.D. thesis on just this dynamic but let's just agree that as a supreme role model of a successful talented female in a male-dominated business, Joni walks the walk. In my opinion, human rights violations, be they against women or men, should be elevated beyond political agendas. These are heinous crimes which no civilization should tolerate. So this is why I think Friedan was right that the focus should be humans in general and not just woman. Pray for the world friends, we are still evolving. take care, suemc ____________________ /____________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue McNamara || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake" - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:05:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: RE: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 absolutely njc - --- "Donna J. Binkley" wrote: > How did we get from Paprika Plains to genital > mutiliation is what i'd like > to know. db > Who knows? It's just one of those weird things that happens in conversations (electronic or otherwise). I was trying to stay right out of that one, but obviously I got sucked into it eventually. Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:35:24 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) In a message dated 6/4/01 1:16:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Stacey4882@aol.com writes: << Stacey (coming out of a long period of lurking, brought to sociability thanks to David Lahm's wonderful Jonifest....) >> Stacey, great to have you back with us. For any newbies out there, Stacey wrote "The Joni Mitchell Companion" - a great book , which I've enjoyed reading twice! So what's your next project Stacey? How about "The JMDL and Circumcision Companion" book ? :~) Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 18:50:40 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Helga_L=F6ltgen?= Subject: The very first Jonifest in Germany has come to an end. And although it was a very intimate one: IT WAS GREAT! Thank you once again Karin and Gvtz and Doris for welcoming me down at Iserlohn, for your hospitality, for your kindness and warmth. For making me feel at home.. Unfortunately Karin and I - the Joni ones - can4t make it this year, but hopefully next year, and we4re looking forward to meeting not only Wally, Garret, Steve from IoS, John van T., Colin (bw), Alison , Marian, Ashara, Kakki, Kate B. and.........., but all the others who like to get in touch and celebrate and simply have a good time. And finally, can you help us, we tried to "translate": reel to reel (from Coyote), is it an idiom/slang for reality? Please give us your interpretation, your thoughts: Indigo94@12move.de Love and best wishes Helga from Germany (AND ALL YOU GERMANS - what about you, there must be hundreds (thousands) of ...., and Hans G|tlinger, where do you come from, and the one on the members profile list, who wrote sth about a Jonifest in Germany?) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 10:57:52 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Re: The very first Jonifest in Germany At 10:50 AM 6/4/2001, Helga Lvltgen wrote: >And finally, can you help us, we tried to "translate": reel to reel (from >Coyote), is it an idiom/slang for reality? Helga - Thanks for the report on the German JoniFest! Sounded like fun. "Reel to Reel" is one of the many terms that is defined in the Glossary section on the JMDL website. Find it here: http://www.jmdl.com/glossary/index.cfm. Les NP: Los Lobos ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 18:22:19 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: NJC > >circumcision is an accepted surgical procedure and a ritual, holy > act - > >at least in the eyes of most people, who as you've pointed out do > not > >share your view of it as abuse. I have no idea who wrote the above-i think the list isn't churning out all the mail again. > > Circumcison as surgical procedure, when absolutley necessary, like when the foreskin is too tight, tho this can be alleviated with a slit rather than the full topping, is acceptable. To describe is as 'holy' is beyond the pale. I understand it is difficult to to go against the accepted practices one has been brought up with but it is one of the things adulthood is about-thinking and ditching that which is negative. The abusive way women are treated by some religions/cultures is also considered holy/culturally acceptable/a divine decreee and any number of rationalizations. Perhaps one of the worst rationales I have come across is men having their sons curcumcised because they were themselves circumcised. I find it strange that people are so willing to condemn abuse that affects women on the one hand and yet ignore or make light of abuse that affects men. Like the ridiculous situaytion with breast cancer awareness and the suggestion that if it were a male disease it would take priority in respect of research etc. Yet prostate cancer kills many more men than breast cancer kills women and is hardly even spoken about. It is so sad that things need to be split in this, this us and them attitude. Cancer and abuse affects men and women, girls andd boys. and therfore should be dealt with on that basis. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 18:27:42 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: The very first Jonifest in Germany > Unfortunately Karin and I - the Joni ones - can4t make it this year, but > hopefully next year, and we4re looking forward to meeting > not only Wally, Garret, Steve from IoS, John van T., Colin (bw), Alison , > Marian, Ashara, Kakki, Kate B. and.........., It would be good to meet you too Helga but I will not be at the US jonifest this year. The stingy bastards wouldn't pay for me to come. Seriously, i couldn't go with work commitments and all my dogs. tho I suppose i could fly out just for two days but as I said, they are a stingy lot. Mind you, i think more than a few would pay me not to come, especially with my foreskin. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 18:28:45 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) Without going downstairs and looking, is this the book of all the lryics? FMYFL@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/4/01 1:16:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > Stacey4882@aol.com writes: > > << Stacey (coming out of a long period of lurking, brought to sociability > thanks to David Lahm's wonderful Jonifest....) > >> > > Stacey, great to have you back with us. For any newbies out there, Stacey > wrote "The Joni Mitchell Companion" - a great book , which I've enjoyed > reading twice! So what's your next project Stacey? How about "The JMDL and > Circumcision Companion" book ? :~) > > Jimmy - -- bw colin BRO GC, 950i 940,864, 260, 890,Silver 830 and 270, Passap 6000 Duo80 colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 14:07:52 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) In a message dated 6/4/01 1:36:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk writes: > Without going downstairs and looking, is this the book of all the lryics? > > No Catman, it's a book of interviews, articles and reviews, etc. rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 14:28:06 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 NJC In a message dated 6/4/01 11:40:42 AM Eastern Daylight Time, anima_rising@yahoo.ca writes: << > I think most people do realise there is a > difference in severity [between > circumcision and female genital mutilation]. However > both are wrong and one > is not less wrong than the other. >> >> Without getting into an argument about the ridiculousness of the above statement, I will merely plead with all of you involved to remember to tag it NJC so I do not have to read anymore of this stupidity. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 14:55:40 EDT From: Kammass@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 NJC i agree totally with IVPAUL42, and could someone tell me how to change to only get Joni Content email from the list. i would really appreciate it. that one needs to be added to the newbie top 10. My delete button is getting worn out. Thanks Kammy from Alabammy Np-nothing -birds chirping, computer humming, baby sleeping Kammy needing a little less in her life. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 14:41:06 From: Lisa Kowalski Subject: Harbourfront(JC) I've ordered tickets to the Joni Tribute in Toronto! Yeah! and I was wondering if someone could let me know what hotels are close to the Harbourfront? and whoever else is going;where are you staying and can we meet up for drinks or dinner or something? It would be great to meet other Joni people and hang out and see some of Toronto(I've never been and am very excited to be going!) Lisa K. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 14:20:43 -0500 From: Scott and Jody Subject: Chicago JMDL Get Together(NJC) Hi Everyone! Jonifests are everywhere these days :~D Recently CA, NYC and Germany. Btw - Thanks for the reports from everyone :~) Aside from the Midwestern minifest in Milwaukee that Kerry and Steve are hosting this June 16th, I also want to mention Sunday, June 24th. Sue Cameron from Mich. is going to be in town. Anyone interested in getting together for dinner that evening, please email me privately. Thanks, jody ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 15:26:58 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Harbourfront(JC) Lisa Kowalski wrote: > I've ordered tickets to the Joni Tribute in Toronto! Yeah! and I was > wondering if someone could let me know what hotels are close to the > Harbourfront? and whoever else is going;where are you staying and can we > meet up for drinks or dinner or something? It would be great to meet other > Joni people and hang out and see some of Toronto(I've never been and am > very excited to be going!) The hotels in that area are among the most expensive in the city, though the exchange rate is very good. Try staying in Yorkville area, Joni's old stomping ground. It isn't far and is much more diverse and interesting. Jerry NP: Rufus Wainwright - Evil Angel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:44:41 -0600 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Joni Articles: June 04 On June 04 these Joni articles were published: 1988: "Idol Talk" - New Musical Express (http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/880604nme.cfm)1998: "Here's to Mitchell, Beatty for avoiding compromising positions" - San Diego Union-Tribune (http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/980604sdu.cfm) - ------------------------ The Article database currently has 592 titles: http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 13:50:34 -0600 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Joni Articles: June 04 On June 04 these Joni articles were published: 1988: "Idol Talk" - New Musical Express (http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/880604nme.cfm)1998: "Here's to Mitchell, Beatty for avoiding compromising positions" - San Diego Union-Tribune (http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/980604sdu.cfm) - ------------------------ The Article database currently has 592 titles: http://www.jmdl.com/articles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 15:53:28 -0400 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Excellent News!!! (njc) We just received notice today that Holley's cd, Sunnytime Soup, won the Dr.Toy award, a very prestigous award in children's toys/multimedia etc...This will potentially provide exposure to thousands, millions, of people and is a great big feather to wear in her cap. For any of you who know Holley and would like to send any congratulations, her email address is holleyrivers@mindspring.com . cheers, Victor Victor Johnson http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson "Just beyond the morning falls the river of your dreams, Escaping from the day these wild creatures run away." Victor Johnson ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 14:06:00 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Re: Today's Joni Articles: June 04 Joniphiles - Sorry for the multiple postings... I'm tweaking a new feature for the list and, as you can see, its still got a few bugs! Les NP: NPR hourly news ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 16:40:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: Joni and Rufus From The Rolling Stone rave review of Rufus Wainwright's new cd Poses: Great pop albums are successful evocations of a type of life: it must be a life lived by more than one person, but it doesn't matter if it is a small handful (the circle of trannies and drug connections described by Lou Reed's Transformer) or thousands (the post-hippie women who understood Joni Mitchell's Blue on the deepest frequencies.) Poses achieves this for the life of the Chelsea Boy. Those are some awesome comparisons. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 14:45:44 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Post polio syndrome CNN has a story on what Joni might be facing at: http://www.cnn.com/2001/HEALTH/conditions/06/04/post.polio/index.html - -- ######################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://www.scdh.org "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 19:10:08 EDT From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen asleep on the job! Today is Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in wishing him a VERY HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! Hugs, Ashara {who is really the Birthday Fairy's biggest supporter!} ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 19:23:11 EDT From: Stacey4882@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2001 #242 (NJC) In a message dated 6/4/01 12:35:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, FMY FL writes: << Stacey, great to have you back with us. For any newbies out there, Stacey wrote "The Joni Mitchell Companion" - a great book , which I've enjoyed reading twice! So what's your next project Stacey? How about "The JMDL and Circumcision Companion" book ? :~) Jimmy >> (hee hee heee) Thanks for the welcome back and for the plug, Jimmy! No new book planned right now--though a reprint of the book is in the works, minus most of the major typos and other, even more cringe-ful errors. Thank goodness! (Advice: Never work with a publishing company that's being bought and sold several times in the period of as many months. Makes for sloppy work. Just buy a crystal ball and plan ahead!) By the way, through the jmdl digest (and working on the JM Companion), I discovered that David Lahm lives in the building NEXT DOOR to me. Aren't I lucky? - - Stacey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 19:29:09 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) In a message dated 6/4/01 7:20:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AsharaJM@aol.com writes: > Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen asleep on the job! Today > is > Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in wishing him a VERY > HAPPY > BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! > > Deputy Birthday Fairy Jimmy stepping in: H A P P Y B I R T H D A Y A Z E E M! We all hope you are having the time of your life today. side note: Wally K. stayed up so late last night partying, and he is still not awake :~) D.B.F. Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 19:44:04 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) In a message dated 6/4/01 7:20:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AsharaJM@aol.com writes: > Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen asleep on the job! Today > is > Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in wishing him a VERY > HAPPY > BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! > > Wake up Wally or we'll have to put Deputy Fife back on the payroll ;~) HAPPY BIRTHDAY AZEEM!!!!!! Miss Crump rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 16:43:01 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: NJC from Hunter Thompson FYI...Thompson's original quote was about television. However, "music" seems to slide in there quite nicely. "The TV business is uglier than most things. It is normally perceived as some kind of cruel and shallow money trench through the heart of the journalism industry, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs, for no good reason." For more, check this out: http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/science/urbanlegends/library/weekly/aa011001a.htm Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: > > During my (grossly under-paying) day job, we do promotions for radio > stations. One of the station managers sent this quote to our COO (who > embodies the *REASON* I'm underpaid). Dr. Thompson is most widely known as > the Rolling Stone gonzo journalist who embraced guns, Harleys, politics, > cigarette holders, and drugs before they were cool. > > * * * * * * > > "The music business is a > cruel and shallow money trench, > a long plastic hallway > where thieves and pimps run free, > and good men die like dogs. > There's also a negative side." > > -- Hunter S. Thompson > > * * * * * * > > Favorite scene from "Where The Buffalo Roam" about Thompson: > > Thompson covering then President Nixon, settles into the press plane. His > seat mate is a severely stressed-out journalist with a headache. Thompson, > shaking pills out of his pocket, recommends "a blue one". > > "Really, is it okay?" asks his seatmate. > > "Oh, yah. It's okay. I'm a doctor," says Hunter, who holds a PhD in Poly > Sci. > > "Are you sure?" asks his seatmate, gulping down the still unidentified pill. > > Thompson deadpans: > "Oh, sure. I've never had any complaints....... Not from the *blue* ones." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 16:58:11 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: Glen Phillips (singer from Toad) njc Kate Bennett wrote: > > Brenda,>>> n.p. Glen Phillips - Men Just Leave<<< > > He's a local boy. He tries out his solo stuff here a lot. He just did a show > with Nickel Creek. It was wonderful....How do you like the record? I like it quite a bit actually. He has a great way of telling stories that are light-hearted ("Drive By") yet he calls up a certain melancholy that feels very genuine and earnest ("My Own Town" and "Darkest Hour"). He's not the most versatile vocalist but he uses his vocabulary very well and is a very good lyricist, I think. (For those who don't know him, he was the lead singer of Toad the Wet Sprocket.) Sorry it took a minute to respond to this, but I was just starting to get into the record. Brenda n.p. - k.d. lang - "My Old Addiction" (which is possibly her best vocal performance on record IMO) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 21:18:09 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) uh oh....... birthday fairy apologizes but birthday fairy did not know -- birthday fairy's brain cells are rather tired of living in birthdays fairy's brain, by the way. brain cells on strike since last saturday. appalling. H A P P Y B I R T H D A Y D E A R A Z E E M !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! birthday fairy holding talks with brain cell union leaders all weekend. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 18:03:14 -0700 From: Scott Price Subject: Addicting NJC At 04:58 PM 6/4/01 -0700, Brenda J. Walker wrote: >n.p. - k.d. lang - "My Old Addiction" (which is possibly her best vocal >performance on record IMO) Agreed her presentation on this track is stunning! Ever wonder how a singer conveys yearning? This is it. Scott ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 21:08:23 -0400 From: mags Subject: Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) RoseMJoy@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/4/01 7:20:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AsharaJM@aol.com > writes: > > > Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen asleep on the job! Today > > is > > Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in wishing him a VERY > > HAPPY > > BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > Wake up Wally or we'll have to put Deputy Fife back on the payroll ;~) > HAPPY BIRTHDAY AZEEM!!!!!! > > Miss Crump > > *** > and miss magnolia and the breimann join in the birthday celebration song.... happy and joyful birthday to you Azeem. magsnbrei*** - -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- _~O / /\_, ___/\ /_ - ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 22:50:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Harbourfront(JC) - --- Jerry Notaro wrote: > Lisa Kowalski wrote: > > > I've ordered tickets to the Joni Tribute in > Toronto! Yeah! and I was > > wondering if someone could let me know what hotels > are close to the > > Harbourfront? and whoever else is going;where are > you staying and can we > > meet up for drinks or dinner or something? It > would be great to meet other > > Joni people and hang out and see some of > Toronto(I've never been and am > > very excited to be going!) > > The hotels in that area are among the most expensive > in the city, though the > exchange rate is very good. Try staying in Yorkville > area, Joni's old > stomping ground. It isn't far and is much more > diverse and interesting. > Jerry, I don't know when you were last in Toronto, but the Yorkville of today is nothing like it was when Joni was there. It's Trendy Town and very expensive. There is a certain amount of atmosphere if you've got the cash for it, but it's TrendyTown atmosphere, not the genuine thing. I have no idea what people consider reasonable hotel-wise, but generally, Toronto is pretty expensive (probably less so than New York or LA, but I don't travel, so I don't really know.) Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 22:51:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Harbourfront(JC) - --- Lisa Kowalski wrote: > I've ordered tickets to the Joni Tribute in > Toronto! Yeah! and I was > wondering if someone could let me know what hotels > are close to the > Harbourfront? and whoever else is going;where are > you staying and can we > meet up for drinks or dinner or something? It would > be great to meet other > Joni people and hang out and see some of > Toronto(I've never been and am > very excited to be going!) > I'd be interested in drinks or dinner, but won't be attending the event (can't afford it). lucky for me, I live here, so I don't need to worry about hotel rates and so on. Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 22:52:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) - --- AsharaJM@aol.com wrote: > Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen > asleep on the job! Today is > Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in > wishing him a VERY HAPPY > BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! > > Hugs, > Ashara {who is really the Birthday Fairy's biggest supporter!} Damn that Birthday Fairy anyway! Happy Birthday, Azeem - and many more! Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2001 23:27:19 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: RE: NJC from Hunter Thompson Wow! I'm a dupe of an urban legend! I thought I had conquered them all by now. I guess not. Did I tell you about my "friend's" experience with Neiman-Marcus when he asked for the recipe of their chocolate chip cookies?................ Great catch Brenda. Thanks. Lama > -----Original Message----- > From: Brenda J. Walker > FYI...Thompson's original quote was about television. However, "music" > seems to slide in there quite nicely. > http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/science/urbanlegends/library/week ly/aa011001a.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 00:00:36 -0400 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today's Joni Articles: June 5 On June 5 this article about Joni was published: 2000: "Camden Concert" - Philadelphia Inquirer (Review - Concert) http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/000605pi.cfm - ------------------------ The JMDL Article Database currently has 592 titles: http://www.jmdl.com/articles Contributions always welcome! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2001 00:00:36 -0400 From: les@jmdl.com Subject: Today in Joni History: June 5 On June 5 in Joni Mitchell History: 1988: Joni is interviewed for the "Sunday" show in Australia 1993: Joni performs at the Troubadours of Folk Festival at UCLA. More info: http://www.jonimitchell.com/TroubadoursFest93.html - ------------------------ Do you know a date or month specific Joni fact? Email it to les@jmdl.com and I'll add it to the database. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 16:42:12 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Birthday Fairy..... (NJC) Ashara wrote: > Looks like our esteemed Birthday Fairy has fallen asleep on the job! Today is > Azeem's birthday!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please join me in wishing him a VERY HAPPY > BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!! Our Birthday Fairy better be careful, or he'll get his wings pulled off! Happy Birthday, Azeem! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 16:41:10 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Cute Stevie quote about Joni NJC Blair wrote: > I'd Say the one Stevie song that really does it for me is "Storm" > from the TUsk album. Whenever I hear that one, I just become jello and get > soaked in by the song. I definitely agree on Storm, but I would add two more (but the same song). The version she does of Landslide on Live, and also the version on The Dance. The version on The Dance has to be seen to be believed. Her interaction with Lindsay Buckingham on this song is amazing - I suspect there's a great deal of feeling between them still. It's pretty evident on other songs on this video too. Hell - still Shangri-La-less, but hoping to rectify this situation very soon! ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 16:48:57 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Music on sale - NJC If anyone's interested, the following site has all used CDs on sale at the moment, for USD$7.99. They have lots of Joni, so no excuses for anyone not to round out their collection. They also have more Shona Laing (a Kiwi singer-songwriter, and second only to Joni in my view) than any NZ site, so they get my vote! And overseas buyers who spend more than USD$50, get free shipping anywhere in the world. I haven't actually bought anything from them as yet, so I can't give you any info. on reliability or speed of delivery. Anyone else? http://www.djangomusic.com/ Hell P.S. They also have a contest to win a DVD player - more incentive to sign up! ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Hell's Personal Photo Page: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/main/personal.htm Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #244 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?