From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #131 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Tuesday, March 20 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 131 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. Information on the 4th "Annual" New England JoniFest: http://www.jmdl.com/jfne2001.cfm The Joni Chat Room: http://www.jmdl.com/chat.cfm ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- paul iv njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: The other side - NJC ["hell" ] Timezones - NJC ["hell" ] Re: The other side NJC ["hell" ] Re: The other side NJC ["hell" ] RE: Timezones - NJC ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Metheny solo on S&L (VLJC) ["James L. Leonard" ] Living in and Understanding Communities [Gordon Mackie ] Re: NJC aerobics [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: The other side - NJC (md-2) [MDESTE1@aol.com] Pat Metheny ["Mike Hicks" ] Both Sides *No* video (DVD)? [Catherine McKay ] The other side NJC ["kerry" ] Re: still I sent up my prayer... (njc) [Artheobeat@aol.com] Re: Heads Up!!! (NJC) [Artheobeat@aol.com] Re: Edith and the Kingpin ["cassy" ] False alarm [Jennymac48@aol.com] hibernation;NJC ["Megan" ] Re: movies njc [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Edith and the Kingpin [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: The other side - NJC [Artheobeat@aol.com] Re: RIP Papa John Phillips (NJC) [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Angels of the Night - NJC [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Things You'd Like To Say At Work...(njc) [Catherine McKay ] Re: False alarm [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Lahm's new one [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] most removed from Joni [Jodcrazee@aol.com] Fwd: False alarm [Kammass@aol.com] Re: Edith and the Kingpin [Ian Cropton ] Re: Lahm's new one [Randy Remote ] Re: Fwd: False alarm ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] Re: Edith and the Kingpin [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: *Joni and smoking [Jerry Notaro ] Re: *Joni and smoking [susan+rick ] Re: *Joni and smoking ["Victor Johnson" ] Re: Edith and the Kingpin [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] mistaken identity [Jodcrazee@aol.com] byt remix favorite [christopher blake ] another joni cover by p.m. dawn? [jop ] Re: Edith and the Kingpin (NJC) [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: another joni cover by p.m. dawn? [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: *Joni and smoking [Ian Cropton ] Re: *Joni and smoking [Alison E ] Re: *Joni and smoking [catman ] Re: *Joni and smoking [catman ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 06:45:27 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: paul iv njc my subject line says it all, bob. wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 21:47:23 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: The other side - NJC F wrote: > Hello. I've been lurking around and thought I'd come out and introduce > myself. My husband introduced me to Joni and finally popped the question > when I got hooked on Hejira. Some of my other favorites are > > Tracy Chapman - New Beginning > Indigo Girls - Swamp Ophelia > Prince - Diamonds and Pearls > Lyle Lovett - Live in Texas > Willie Nelson - Milk Cow Blues Glad to see someone else loves the Indigo Girls as much as I do - I've almost completed my collection, just the two live albums to go. And the new one - "Retrospective" which instead of just being a collection of their best, includes two new songs, to lure us die-hard fans into spending more money (which of course, I will)! Congratulations on delurking - it's a good step to take - although be warned, once you start, it's hard to stop! Hell (in NZ) ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 21:57:00 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Timezones - NJC Found a great site today, which shows the time everywhere in the world at once! I thought it would be very useful for those listers using the chatroom. It takes a little while to load, but it's worth it. http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-world.htm Now when I log in at 9.50pm, I can see that it's 9.30am in Britain, and somewhere between 1.50am and 5:50am in USA/Canada, which explains why there's no one there! And for those that aren't sure, or didn't know, New Zealand is the little green country on the extreme right-bottom corner of the map (assuming you get the same map I do) and to the south-east of Australia! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 22:03:44 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: The other side NJC John wrote (in response to me): > > I also have a lot of Kiwi music which is pretty different from Joni, > > but no one here will have heard of it! > > I might have, Hell, I might have! OK, I'm always up for a challenge, what about: The Swingers The Crocodiles DD Smash Th'Dudes The Exponents Ardijah The Netherworld Dancing Toys The Warratahs (not the Super 12 rugby team!) Supergroove When The Cat's Away Dianne Swann (who incidentally reminds me a LOT of Jonatha Brooks, and vice versa) Your turn! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 22:13:00 +1200 From: "hell" Subject: Re: The other side NJC I wrote: > Dianne Swann (who incidentally reminds me a LOT of Jonatha Brooks, and vice > versa) When I MEANT to write, Jonatha Brooke. Sorry - slip of the fingers! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:30:10 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Timezones - NJC hell!!!!!! this is so cool!!!! you can even see argentina at the very bottom of south america!! what is that little island south of australia? is that tasmania? it's at the same latitude as buenos aires. thank you for the url, hell wallyk - -----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de hell Enviado el: Martes, 20 de Marzo de 2001 06:57 a.m. Para: JMDL Asunto: Timezones - NJC Found a great site today, which shows the time everywhere in the world at once! I thought it would be very useful for those listers using the chatroom. It takes a little while to load, but it's worth it. http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-world.htm http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 06:12:46 -0500 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Re: Metheny solo on S&L (VLJC) Hi Lama, > Yeah, in retrospect, it sorta reads as a slam. I really didn't mean it that way although it's obvious that I don't "get" Metheny. That's why I see his transcendent "Amelia" as revelatory and extra= ordinary (in the dictionary meaning that it's out of the ordinary.) I've tried "Off Ramp", "American Garage", and "80/81". I know these are highly regarded albums and I'm not denigrating them. They expose a lack in my "ear". > The albums you mention, and "S&L," for that matter, were all recorded during the first five years of Metheny's now 25-year old career. If those albums are all you've heard, it's easier for me to see why you might consider the "S&L" solo to be out of the ordinary, or a case in which Metheny was playing beyond his abilities.. You may want to pick up some later albums by the Pat Metheny Group, beginning with the double live "Travels." Proceed chronologically through "First Circle," "Still Life (Talking)," "Letter From Home," and "The Road To You." Metheny's abilities (and his artistic vision) grew at a dizzying rate through the '80s. He continued to record outside the Group during these years, and still does, playing great jazz with some of the music's brightest lights ... but it's in those five Group albums I believe you'll find the way to "get" Pat. Boston Jim NP: coffee percolator, drowning out a whispering MSNBC :-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:08:42 +0000 From: Gordon Mackie Subject: Living in and Understanding Communities I was thinking about 'communities' whilst reading the latest posting, especially the IVPAUL / Murphycopy exchange. Obviously I've missed some previous correspondence between these two , but I couldn't understand the strength of Bob's response to what seemed to me like a relatively minor point made by Paul. I feel very uneasy about stepping into this particular fray but what one person thinks as positive is another persons negative. Joan Anderson has made that point on a number of occasions 'Amelia' (People will tell you where they've gone, they'll tell you where to go, but till you get there yourself you never really know) or 'Shadows and Light' (The perils of benefactors, the blessings of parasites) to name two. To me it doesn't matter if the bottle is half empty or half full but more about whose owns and controls the bottle factory. Our wee community is no different from any other. Different views, different expressions, difference. Diversity. Self-determination. Pass the bottle.... I'll drink to that..(hic) Gordon (Ok, ok, I overdosed on the 19th century liberalism but you get the point. Long live the Republic!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:24:07 EST From: Kammass@aol.com Subject: Re: The Fonis!! hey chris is that birmingham, england? kammy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:46:29 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin In a message dated 3/19/01 11:11:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: > Makes me wonder if the Kingpin is really in control of the situation or if > it's more of a co-dependency. Are the bars in her head those of > incarceration? > > I always that line referred to her fear to move out of the situation. (her own self made prison) Rose in NJ rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:56:51 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: The other side - NJC <> What a great gauge to pick a mate! ;~) Welcome, F in Seattle! NP(Now Playing): Fleetwood Mac, "Never Going Back Again" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:57:36 -0000 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Edith and The Kingpin It is interesting how much our (my) initial interpretation of a song is based on what I've read in the media and (up to HOSL at least) the expectation that her songs were mainly self-confessional. In 'my' mental movie of the song Warren Beatty plays the role of The Kingpin and Joni plays Edith. I see the big Hollywood star - The Kingpin - arriving at a small town theatre to see Edith play a concert - he's met outside by models and photographers, with bodyguards holding back sophomore kids, all swooning, hyped up by his media playboy image (victims of typewriters). Then Edith's on stage, trying to concentrate (the band sounds like typewriters) and The Kingpin's in the front row staring at her intently - flirtatiously - but not really listening to the music, holding his hands together tightly, anticipating the night of love (lust) ahead. After the show, at the backstage party, everyone surrounds them - the centre of attention - the ring - Edith can see the model girls whispering and gossipping out of the corner of her eye as he 'purrs' his praise on her - as they are parted by the crush of the party - one by one - the model girls push forward to whisper stories of his legendary playboy exploits to her, with challenging, bitchy smiles. Meanwhile, in true playboy style, he's idly checking out the other women in the room. Later that night in the hotel room, lying in silence, staring at each other after making love, with just the sound of the rain, a distant plane and the room's central heating, and with her head still buzzing from the concert and their lovemaking, she says his crime - his reputation as a great lover - belongs - is justified. Well, it's one way of looking at it! PaulC EDITH AND THE KINGPIN The big man arrives Disco dancers greet him Plainclothes cops greet him Small town, big man, fresh lipstick glistening Sophomore jive From victims of typewriters The band sounds like typewriters The big man he's not listening His eyes hold Edith His left hand holds his right What does that hand desire That he grips it so tight Edith in the ring The passed-over girls are conferring The man with the diamond ring is purring All claws for now withdrawn One by one they bring His renegade stories to her His crimes and his glories to her In challenge they look on Women he has wanted grow old too soon He tilts their tired faces Gently to the spoon Edith in his bed A plane in the rain is humming The wires in the walls are humming Some song-some mysterious song Bars in her head Beating frantic and snowblind Romantic and snowblind She says-his crime belongs Edith and the Kingpin Each with charm to sway Are staring eye to eye They dare not look away You know they dare not look away ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:09:30 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC aerobics < eight count (or 32 count) repeating beat, so if anyone can make a > suggestion here, I'd appreciate it!>> Don't think you'll find it with a Joni song per se, but I could recommend some covers that would easily fill the bill, BSN by Brother Love Canal being the most obvious... Bob NP: Fleetwood Mac, "Songbird" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:10:28 EST From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: The other side - NJC (md-2) If you guys think all this is hurting my feelings you are wrong. For i have innoculated myself against such blasphemy by listening to my collection of IVPAUL42 quotes on CD. I shall now don my Michael Paz mask and costume and go forth into the world where total strangers will shower me with love. And I will bring a big bottle of Harp beer with me for good luck. marcel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:09:50 -0500 From: "Mike Hicks" Subject: Pat Metheny If anyone out there questions Metheny's abilities just check out the album entitled New Chatauqua. It is magnificent. He's and artist who(m) has dabbled around with various artists and styles, but his talent has never waivered....in my book. Mike ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:34:00 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Both Sides *No* video (DVD)? I was browsing the CDNow.com site under Joni Mitchell and came across a DVD of "Both Sides Now" (they have it down as "Both Sides No".) Does anyone have any idea what this video is? Did they film any of the BSN tour? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:50:31 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: The other side NJC >>Propellerheads (One or Two)>> Do you have the one that has "History Repeating" with Shirley Bassey on vocals? What a great song!!!!! Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:41:28 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: still I sent up my prayer... (njc) My take. The only thing we can know for certain is that we, as individuals, have no personal 'real time' experience, nor documented 'hard evidence' with nor of the 'hereafter'. We may have had profound realizations, visions, epiphanies, friends with 'near death' experiences (or one of our own), or overwhelming 'faith' that we 'know' what comes next (or 'does not' come next as some choose to believe) based upon a 'belief system' to which we've been drawn (or in which we've been raised) and to which we've ultimately subscribed. But, when all is said and done - it is conjecture (sprinkled with faith) on a grand and significantly personal level. And, we should all be allowed our personal realities about what is, or is there, a 'hereafter' - and about who or what is god, or if god even 'is' - AND - we should be very careful to avoid the pride and arrogance involved in trying to champion any individual 'ism' as the universal truth. If for you it is the truth - then brother or sister - run with it to your heart's content (as John Lennon says "Whatever gets you through the night"). But please have the love and tolerance in your heart to understand that any exclusionary or segregationist 'belief system' (namely any system claiming to be absolutely 'right') you may have chosen to adopt - it is only your, or your group's 'reality' - and NOT a universal truth - no matter how large your group may or may not be, nor how old the 'belief system'. Remember, the history of the world shows that there have been more wars, vile social injustices, and unspeakable human atrocities carried out in the name of god and/or 'belief systems', than for almost any other cause around which we mortals choose to rally. When dealing with your fellow human, I feel it is a 'bottom line' imperative to think about and understand what John really meant when he said, "Imagine there's no heaven". If you can, then "all you need is love", and you'll get to your final destination (whatever you may personally believe that destination is or is not) as a truly inspired and 'holy' person. That's this one man's personal spiritual 'reality'. Not sellin' it so ya's doesn't gotta buy - just sharin' it fo free. Peace and love to you all, Artheo. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:45:13 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: Heads Up!!! (NJC) In a message dated 3/19/01 3:35:58 AM, jmichaelpaz@telocity.com writes: << Elton John, Ann and Nancy Wilson of Heart, and Beatles producer Sir George Martin will all take part in TNT's "All Star Tribute To Brian Wilson," set for March 29 at New York's Radio City Music Hall. >> Is March 29th also the day it will air on TV? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:48:28 -0500 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin SCJoniGuy@aol.com asked: > Bars in her head > Beating frantic and snowblind > Are the bars in her head those of incarceration? I just love the diversity of thinking on this list. For me, the bars in her head are music bars. I have a friend who is a really excellent trumptet player, during the days of coke-induced frenzy he would write music prolifically. On playback, when everyone was rested and straight, these pieces were full of long, sharp, staccatto type passages almost "frantic" in their phrasing and would make me feal uneasy. I always imagined Edith high on coke, music playing in her head and that music being much like my friends coked-out offerings. Regarding his crime belonging I felt that perhaps among those people who enjoyed the coke-high, the "Kingpin" (supplier) always "belonged." Also that the wires in the wall that were "humming" were those of the phone-tappers listening in for incriminating evidence. Just my take. Cassy NP: Pat Metheny, Dave Holland, Roy Haynes "Question and Answer" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:50:11 EST From: Jennymac48@aol.com Subject: False alarm More questions, maybe I need to read history but in Amelia, what does Joni mean by "it was just a false alarm"? Love Jenny ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:50:43 -0500 From: "Megan" Subject: hibernation;NJC Hi Deb, Soooo very , very glad to see you back, sweetie! I hope you're settling in well to your new digs & are feeling better. Hope you know we all love you & have been praying for you. I've been sort of semi-lurking myself, except for my private posts to my pals. I haven't had much time to respond because I've been going through a bad time myself in regards to some tough decisions I may have to make concerning my daughter Kelsey( Lindsey's twin), who's profoundly autistic & the schools have just about given up on. I know I'll get through it, but the next few months are gonna be rough.Thank God for my friends, both on & off the list who've supported me--especially Bob Muller, whose fabulous Joni CD's have fed my soul & helped me to get through this.Can't wait to meet you & everyone else @ the 'fest! Luv & hugs, Megan :~) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:58:56 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: movies njc catman wrote: > > Have yet to see Best In Show. Has anybody? I have had several people > tell me about it but have seen nothing of it, no adverts, no write ups, > nothing. It is supposed to be very funny. Very, very funny. As is his previous Waiting For Guffman. Both are must sees, but probably on video. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:59:14 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin In a message dated 3/18/01 11:39:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, Murphycopy@aol.com writes: > I know Edith Piaf had a tragic love life -- and who hasn't? -- but was she > ever involved with some kind of a kingpin? And, if I remember correctly, I > think she died because of some kind of substance abuse -- was it cocaine? > She died of cancer at the young age of 48, but yes she had a problem with alcohol and morphine. I believe that Joni was paying homage to Piaf. I found this interesting tidbit in my research: . At the age of nineteen, she was discovered by nightclub impressario Louis Lepli e, and because she had been singing a song about a sparrow, he christened her La Mt me Piaf, street slang for "Kid Sparrow." Patrons of Lepli e's club Gerny's were astonished by the power and richness of her voice, and by her diminutive size for she was only four feet ten inches tall and weighed probably not much more than eighty pounds. But, her initial success at Gerny's was cut short when Lepli e was murdered, probably over money and probably by some young toughs to whom he had been introduced by Piaf. Although she was cleared of any complicity in the murder, the scandal, and her reputation as a friend of most of Paris' pimps, prostitutes, and petty criminals, drove her out of Paris for a time and forced her to perform in provincial movie houses and bistros to keep from starving once again. He would often stay in houses of ill repute to stay warm. You can read a brief biography as well as sound clips here:http://soundprint.org/documentaries/more_info/piaf.phtml - -Rose rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:00:37 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: The other side - NJC In a message dated 3/19/01 4:50:04 AM, guitarzan@saber.net writes: << Chivas Chinga-Country Porn (w/ "Asshole From El Paso") >> That made me think of two more non-Joniesque albums I have loved over the years "Sold American" - Kinky Friedman & the Texas Jewboys and from deep in the heart of Ann Arbor... "Lost in the Ozone Again" - Commander Cody and the Lost Planet Airmen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:18:06 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: RIP Papa John Phillips (NJC) Kakki wrote: > John and Hell, > > That sounds like a great video! I was just writing to Rev Vince waxing > nostalgic about M&P memories. (Also said I was sorry for not noting that > Janis was at Monterey Pop!! ;-) I was around 12 when their hits started > coming, but could only afford to get a couple of their 45s. I just loved them and had all their albums. In fact, it was at that time that I got my first stereo, so I went out and bought If You Can Believe Your Eyes and Ears in stereo, even though I already had it in mono. The album cover had a sticker covering the toilet because they thought some might find it offensive. What a far cry from today. For you Cass fans, Dream a little dream [sound recording ] : the Cass Elliot collection it great. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:20:28 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin In a message dated 3/20/01 1:42:47 AM, Murphycopy@aol.com writes: << Plus, my mind is going >> Yes, my mind is going too - it's just that my body can no longer keep up! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:20:51 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin <> Wow, Rose...great research! Really strengthens my suspicion in Joni's use of the name "Edith". And I'm going out of my tree to hear Elvis C's version! I can HEAR him in my head singing "each with charm to sway..." I played around with Napster for the first time this weekend when I was at my sisters. Went searching for a lot of the Joni covers on the Tribute CD, but no luck. Did find LOTS of other cool stuff though..that Napster is pretty awesome technology! Bob NP: Fleetwood Mac, "Songbird" (demo version) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:32:00 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: RIP Papa John Phillips (NJC) In a message dated 3/20/01 3:35:52 AM, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: << my boyfriend at the time was a slavishly devoted fan >> EVERY guy in the 60's was a slavishly devoted fan - whether they liked the music or not. Did you ever take a good look at 'early' Michelle in a peasants blouse, bell bottomed hip huggers, and suede boots!! Ggrrrrrowwllll!!!! On a very serious and sentimental note, good-bye John. Madmen like you are far too few, and you will be missed! TIA, Artheo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:36:22 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Edith and The Kingpin This is a very interesting take, and it works. Not the way I pictured it at all but... it works! Didn't Joni once say [something like], "Never mind what it means to me - what does it mean to you?" there you go! - --- Paul Castle wrote: > It is interesting how much our (my) initial > interpretation of > a song is based on what I've read in the media and > (up > to HOSL at least) the expectation that her songs > were > mainly self-confessional. In 'my' mental movie of > the song > Warren Beatty plays the role of The Kingpin and Joni > plays Edith. Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 09:34:45 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Angels of the Night - NJC Michael Paz wrote: > Julius- > you have outdone yourself on this one pal. Great sleuth work! I can't wait > to hear your report.. > > Paz > > on 3/19/01 6:36 AM, JRMCo1@aol.com at JRMCo1@aol.com wrote: > > > Does anyone have knowledge of a book called _Angels of the Night: Popular > > Female Singers of Our Time_ (Oxford, 1986, 277 pages, hardcover) by Wilfrid > > Mellers? Do you have this one in your library's stacks, Deb Messling? :~) One of our libraries has it. I could ILL it and copy the pages and send it to you. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 15:16:59 -0000 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Edith & The Kingpin Catherine McKay anima_rising@yahoo.ca wrote > This is a very interesting take, and it works. Not > the way I pictured it at all but... it works! Didn't > Joni once say [something like], "Never mind what it > means to me - what does it mean to you?" there you > go! Thanks, Catherine. I thought, after I sent it, it would probably give Joni a good laugh! I'd really love to hear your 'mental movie'. PaulC ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:27:01 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Things You'd Like To Say At Work...(njc) - --- Brian Gross wrote: > Thanks to Mags for passing this one along to me > I'll start using these in the office on Monday :-) > > Brian > > Things You Can't Say At Work but Wished you Could > Very funny, but very sad - sounds just like my place of work, especially the one about hell with fluorescent lighting. Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:33:22 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Timezones - NJC - --- hell wrote: > Found a great site today, which shows the time > everywhere in the world at > once! I thought it would be very useful for those > listers using the > chatroom. It takes a little while to load, but it's > worth it. > > http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-world.htm This is great - this raises the art of clock-watching to a whole new level! Bored and frustrated at work these days... Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:01 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: False alarm <> Jenny, a lot of us old-timers here have batted this one around pretty good. I would challenge some of you newbies & recent de-lurkers to examine the lyrics and give us your take. I for one would love to read it! :~) Bob NP: Fleetwood Mac, "Blue Letter" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:51:20 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Lahm's new one Looks like Mr. Lahm has put out another excellent collection for us! I'm going to check with my local jazz shop and see if they have it on hand (they had the first one). I'm very excited to hear it!! Here's the songlist, obviously some tracks here INSPIRED by Joni as well...and an Aerosmith cover to boot!! (I'm joking, I'm assuming that it's a different 'Walk This Way') ;~D Buy it and listen to these fine 'Lahm Chops'... Bob David Lahm's "More Jazz Takes on Joni Mitchell" 1. Woodstock 2. Don Juan's Reckless Daughter 3. San Diego Holiday 4. Off Night Backstreet 5. Walk This Way 6. Silky Veils Of Ardor, The 7. In France, They Kiss On Main Street 8. Ladies Of The Canyon 9. Black Crow 10. Wayne Swirled 11. Vibeca 12. Woodstock - (radio version) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:59:25 EST From: Jodcrazee@aol.com Subject: most removed from Joni Tom Waits-all Portishead(sp?) Judy Garland-Carnegie Hall ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:14:45 EST From: Kammass@aol.com Subject: Fwd: False alarm Bob, I'm a newbie and not one to know lyrics. I went to the JM web site and read Amelia. IMO, Amelia is Joni's love ego and/or the personality in her who gets and gives all the love. Joni, or the narrator, is telling her that the love they thought was near, was "a false alarm".? That is how my unusual mind interpreted it? Does anyone else think this? Kammy Return-Path: Received: from rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (rly-ye05.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.202]) by air-ye04.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:59:11 -0500 Received: from smoe.org (jane.smoe.org [216.200.102.14]) by rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:59:00 1900 Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) with SMTP id KAA14809; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:45:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.10); Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:45:53 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) id KAA14735 for joni-outgoing; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/daemon-mode-jane) with ESMTP id KAA14714 for ; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:45 -0500 (EST) From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Received: from SCJoniGuy@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id p.4d.8f9376e (15864); Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from web25.aolmail.aol.com (web25.aolmail.aol.com [205.188.222.1]) by air-id06.mx.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 10:44:01 EST Subject: Re: False alarm To: Cc: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) Message-ID: <4d.8f9376e.27e8d4c1@aol.com> Sender: owner-joni@jmdl.com Reply-To: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Unsubscribe: mailto:onlyjoni-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/onlyjoni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Precedence: bulk <> Jenny, a lot of us old-timers here have batted this one around pretty good. I would challenge some of you newbies & recent de-lurkers to examine the lyrics and give us your take. I for one would love to read it! :~) Bob NP: Fleetwood Mac, "Blue Letter" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:27:50 -0800 (PST) From: Ian Cropton Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin Thanks all for some fascinating ideas about what or who this fine song is about. I had assumed (and I thought I had read somewhere) that it was about people Joni knew in L.A. - but the little grey cells can't remember any more than that now. The Edith Piaf connection seems odd to me. Has Joni ever mentioned an interest in Piaf's life or singing? Cheers, Ian Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 08:29:18 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Lahm's new one SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > Looks like Mr. Lahm has put out another excellent collection for us! David Lahm's "More Jazz Takes on Joni Mitchell" > > 10. Wayne Swirled Party on, Wayne. Party on, Lahm. Can't wait to hear it. CDnow has it listed, and also has audio samples of the songs. "In sometimes startlingly deconstructionist mode, Lahm captures [Mitchell's] musical and emotional complexity." - JazzTimes ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:40:43 -0500 (EST) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: Re: Fwd: False alarm On Tue, 20 Mar 2001 Kammass@aol.com wrote: > Bob, I'm a newbie and not one to know lyrics. I went to the JM web site and > read Amelia. IMO, Amelia is Joni's love ego and/or the personality in her > who gets and gives all the love. Joni, or the narrator, is telling her that > the love they thought was near, was "a false alarm".? That is how my unusual > mind interpreted it? Does anyone else think this? That's always been my interpretation. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:43:51 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: Re: False alarm In a message dated 3/20/01 3:59:11 PM, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: << Amelia, what does Joni mean by "it was just a false alarm"? Jenny, a lot of us old-timers here have batted this one around pretty good. I would challenge some of you newbies & recent de-lurkers to examine the lyrics and give us your take. I for one would love to read it! >> Pretty simple. As you know, Hejira was written in a period of Joni healing from a broken relationship. False alarm is a metaphor for a relationship that Joni originally thought 'rang' true - but alas, a false alarm. The fourth verse says it all. Joni is reflecting on her past man and her choice to help 'hide the hurt' in this journey, and reflecting on a fellow journeyer, Amelia Erhardt, whose image was conjured up as Joni viewed the vapor trails while riding alone across the country (as Amelia was alone) - Joni mixes her musings, and from the place of a wounded heart, feeling this momentary kinship with Amelia as 'fellow solitary traveler' - Joni confides in the conjured Amelia that her love affair ultimately proved to be a false alarm. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:57:43 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin <> Yes indeedy, Ian...on the 1983 "My Top 12" BBC radio show, she played Edith's "LesTrois Cloches" and spoke of the strong influence Piaf had on her singing. In many other interviews Joni mentions her connection to Piaf. That's what made me think of the "Edith" connection... Bob NP: The Mike Flowers Pops, "The In Crowd" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 13:06:47 EST From: Artheobeat@aol.com Subject: *Joni and smoking This may be, for you old-timers, worn territory. But, I have often wondered why Joni feels it so necessary to ingrain the fact that she smokes so indelibly into her public persona. It has always struck as ironic that someone, who is capable of such wisdom and fortitude, and celebrates in verse her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life struggles - finds it so compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so potentially self destructive. Any thoughts? TIA, Artheo NP - "Smoke, Smoke, Smoke (That Cigarette)", by: Commander Cody & the Lost Planet Airmen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 13:06:15 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin Edith Piaf had a long affair with France's famous heavyweight boxing champion Marcel Cerdan. A movie was made of their relationship called Edith and Marcel. Here is a summary of the movie: The world's most popular entertainer and Europe's greatest boxer: the film puts the love affair of these two national heroes against a backdrop of the end of World War II, hotel suites in New York, transatlantic plane flights, Cerdan's loss of the world middleweight title to Jake Lamotta, and Piaf's gift for tragic love songs. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 13:26:12 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin In a message dated 3/20/01 1:13:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: > Yes indeedy, Ian...on the 1983 "My Top 12" BBC radio show, she played > Edith's "LesTrois Cloches" and spoke of the strong influence Piaf had on > her singing. > > In many other interviews Joni mentions her connection to Piaf. That's what > made me think of the "Edith" connection... > Very interesting Bob. Are there any recordings of these interviews. I'd be interested in hearing them. In my research on Piaf, I learned she often dressed in black. She rose every day at dusk and sang, rehearsed, performed, ate and drank until dawn, then slept all day and began to create and unravel again as the sun went down. Nearly every song Piaf sang was a moment of her life from the streets of Paris. She would tell her composer and musician lovers a story, or describe a feeling or show them a gesture. And they would put music and words to her pain and passion, giving her back her own musical autobiography. rosemjoy@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 13:39:04 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking Artheobeat@aol.com wrote: > This may be, for you old-timers, worn territory. But, I have often wondered > why Joni feels it so necessary to ingrain the fact that she smokes so > indelibly into her public persona. It has always struck as ironic that > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and fortitude, and celebrates in verse > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life struggles - finds it so > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so potentially self > destructive. Any thoughts? It's part of her rebellious nature I'd say. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:02:50 -0800 From: susan+rick Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking On 3/20/01 10:06 AM, Artheobeat@aol.com wrote > It has always struck as ironic that > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and fortitude, and celebrates in verse > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life struggles - finds it so > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so potentially self > destructive. Any thoughts? From an interview Joni did on Canadian TV: Interviewer: asks a question about Joni's smoking and how it appears to the people who see her doing it. Joni: To all the young people watching, don't do what I do. To all the older people, mind your own business. From the horse's mouth Ranger Rick (who never smoked a puff in his life, not tobacco anyway) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 14:09:45 -0500 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking It has always struck as ironic that > > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and fortitude, and celebrates in verse > > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life struggles - finds it so > > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so potentially self > > destructive. Any thoughts? Maybe it provides her with some sort of balance. For someone who is so incredibly creative, perhaps it serves as a release somehow, as some equal and opposite energy. But then again, she's only human and has the same needs and cravings as anyone else. Maybe its her "tragic flaw". Victor Victor Johnson http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson "Just beyond the morning falls the river of your dreams, Escaping from the day these wild creatures run away." Victor Johnson ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 14:11:09 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin <> But of course, Rosalita! ;~) This was made available to JMDLer's as part of Tape Tree #5. It's available as a 90-minute tape, I've since transferred it to (2) CD's. The contents are as follows: Joni Mitchell: "My Top 12" BBC Radio 1, London, England May 29, 1983 Disc One 1. Introduction/Interview 2. Edith Piaf, LesTrois Cloches 3. Interview 4. Joni Mitchell, Speechless 5. Interview 6. Little Richard, Lucille 7. Interview 8. Lambert, Hendricks & Ross, Cloudburst 9. Interview 10. Bob Dylan, Memphis Blues Again 11. Interview 12. Laura Nyro, Captain For Dark Mornings 13. Interview 14. Miles Davis, Nefertiti Disc Two 1. Interview 2. Burundi Drums (drum track / ‘Jungle Line’) 3. Steely Dan, Gaucho 4. Interview 5. Stevie Wonder, That Girl 6. Interview 7. Billie Holiday, You’ve Changed 8. Interview 9. Peter Gabriel, I Have The Touch 10. Interview 11. Stravinsky, Rites of Spring (Introduction) The highlight of the show imo is the piece that Joni introduces as "Speechless". It would later evolve into what we now know as "Two Grey Rooms"... Bob NP: John Fogerty & The Blue Ridge Rangers, "Jambalaya" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 14:33:36 EST From: Jodcrazee@aol.com Subject: mistaken identity I just finished reading Stacy Ludwig's book "Joni Mitchell Companian{sp?} four decades of commentary. There is a photo of Bonnie Raitt and Rickie Lee Jones at the first Farm Aid and the caption reads 'Joni Mitchell with Bonnie Raitt at Farm Aid' Not only is this incorrect but you talk about stepping on some toes. While RLJ is very hostile towards any comparison to Joni, Joni just sits back and points out the 'kill mommy syndrome' I found it all tragic considering they both top my list and I just thought I would share the interisting error. np RLJ 'Ghostyhead' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 11:45:58 -0800 (PST) From: christopher blake Subject: byt remix favorite i'm new but am wondering if i am alone trying to discern my favorite byt remix from that "friends" re-mix cd featuring (i believe)7 mixes of the tune. just figured i would throw that out there... - -peace christopher Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 16:12:24 +0200 From: jop Subject: another joni cover by p.m. dawn? i saw on billboard dance chart a couple of weeks ago 'night in the city' by p.m. dawn. i remember that they have sampled joni's tracks on their albums (at least 'i had a king' in 1993) but this looks like a new title... - --jussi ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 15:18:31 EST From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Edith and the Kingpin (NJC) I really appreciate everyone's input on EATK. It's one of my favorite songs, but I never bothered to read the lyrics very carefully. You see, I always thought it was "Edith Ann, the Kingpin", and I pictured Lily Tomlin sitting in a big rocking chair dressed as a drug lord. :~) I did at least tag this NJC, and that's the truth ....tttthhhhhhhhh Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 15:20:44 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: another joni cover by p.m. dawn? Hi Jussi! Yes, this one will be on the Joni tribute CD...in the meantime, I've got a copy of it and I'm going to put it on Volume 16! Thanks for keeping a lookout! If you see anything by local Finnish artists, that would be a GREAT help! :~) Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:24:20 -0800 (PST) From: Ian Cropton Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking OK I'll bite. I've smoked tobacco and marijuana for much of my adult life, and have done my fair share of alcohol abuse. I hardly drink at all these days, and haven't smoked tobacco for about a year. I've come to recognise that I'm an addictive personality, and tend to go over the top when I get into a new interest. Its only within the last year or so after coming frighteningly close to losing my wife to my addictions that I have started to make a real effort to pace myself. We know that Joni was no stranger to drugs in her younger days. I can easily believe that she chooses to continue to use tobacco simply because she knows she would need something stronger to fill the void if she were to give it up. Cheers, Ian - --- Artheobeat@aol.com wrote: > This may be, for you old-timers, worn territory. > But, I have often wondered > why Joni feels it so necessary to ingrain the fact > that she smokes so > indelibly into her public persona. It has always > struck as ironic that > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and > fortitude, and celebrates in verse > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life > struggles - finds it so > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so > potentially self > destructive. Any thoughts? > TIA, Artheo > NP - "Smoke, Smoke, Smoke (That Cigarette)", by: > Commander Cody & the Lost > Planet Airmen Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 12:37:21 -0800 (PST) From: Alison E Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking from the brilliantly funny writer fran lebowitz: "smoking: it's the last great form of social rebellion." or, it's viciously addictive. either way, i'm guilty. alison e. in nyc - --- Artheobeat@aol.com wrote: > This may be, for you old-timers, worn territory. > But, I have often wondered > why Joni feels it so necessary to ingrain the fact > that she smokes so > indelibly into her public persona. It has always > struck as ironic that > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and > fortitude, and celebrates in verse > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life > struggles - finds it so > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so > potentially self > destructive. Any thoughts? > TIA, Artheo > NP - "Smoke, Smoke, Smoke (That Cigarette)", by: > Commander Cody & the Lost > Planet Airmen Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 20:39:46 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking I imagine it is because she is sick and tired of people not minding their own business and preaching at her! My grandafther was forced to give up smoking at age 86 by his mean daughter(who smoked). He dropped dead 3 months later. I just found out that 66 people per week are killed on UK roads. 78 are killed in UK accidents in the home! If only people spent so much time worrying about the shit in our soil, our air and our food as they did about people smoking! Especially when these same people drive or fly or use other motorised forms of transport. Smoking is a huge red herring and people have fallen for it hook, line and sinker. Artheobeat@aol.com wrote: > This may be, for you old-timers, worn territory. But, I have often wondered > why Joni feels it so necessary to ingrain the fact that she smokes so > indelibly into her public persona. It has always struck as ironic that > someone, who is capable of such wisdom and fortitude, and celebrates in verse > her phoenix-like ascensions from numerous life struggles - finds it so > compelling to advertise a personal habit that is so potentially self > destructive. Any thoughts? > TIA, Artheo > NP - "Smoke, Smoke, Smoke (That Cigarette)", by: Commander Cody & the Lost > Planet Airmen - -- bw colin colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2001 20:40:49 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: *Joni and smoking > Interviewer: asks a question about Joni's smoking and how it appears to the > people who see her doing it. > Joni: To all the young people watching, don't do what I do. To all the older > people, mind your own business. EXACTLY. Go Joni! > > > >From the horse's mouth > Ranger Rick (who never smoked a puff in his life, not tobacco anyway) - -- bw colin colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #131 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?