From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #65 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Thursday, February 8 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 065 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC ["hell" ] unreleased songs: the final answer ["Deb Messling" ] RE: Unreleased.... ["Deb Messling" ] RE: JM Article from '74 and HDCD?? ["Deb Messling" ] Re: unreleased songs, again [Gary Zack ] Re: unreleased songs, again ["cassy" ] Fwd: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... ["P. Henry" ] Turbulent [Rusty10113@aol.com] Sweet, sweet, SWEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [AsharaJM@aol.com] James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) [AsharaJM@aol.com] j.brooke - steady pull baddog njc [PMcfad@aol.com] Tull/Kate's B. day (NJC) [PMcfad@aol.com] Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) ["Kakki" ] Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC ["Neil E. Orts" ] Re: Kate's Web cast (NJC) [AsharaJM@aol.com] Fwd: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC ["Blair Fraipont" ] Talking Heads- NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... ["P. Henry" ] RE: those gosh-darn kids NJC ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: JM Article from '74 and HDCD?? NJC [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Talking Heads- NJC [Don Rowe ] Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC [Don Rowe ] Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) [AsharaJM@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 21:18:27 +1300 From: "hell" Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC Mike wrote: > Can anyone think of another album by another > group that you think is their all-time best? I thought this was a great thread idea, so I've had a look through my collection, and here are my picks (only those artists where I have enough albums to make a reasonably informed choice). Obviously it's what I think are the best (not necessarily my favourites, although most are), so don't flame me ;o): CSN - a tough choice, but I have to go with their first self-titled album CSNY - Deja Vu The Doors - LA Woman Fleetwood Mac (post Buckingham/Nicks' arrival): Rumours Indigo Girls - Rites Of Passage Janis Joplin - Pearl Carole King - another tough one, but probably the obvious choice, Tapestry Shona Laing - Shona Joni - VERY tough choice, but probably Hejira for the lyrical content, although Blue gets a nod there as well Stevie Nicks - Bella Donna (tough again!) Bonnie Raitt - took forever to decide, but Luck Of The Draw Stephen Stills - first self-titled album James Taylor - Mud Slide Slum & The Blue Horizon Neil Young - Harvest This was a tough list to compile! Not sure if anyone else will bother, but it was kinda fun! It's interesting that quite a few I've picked are the first or last albums made, I guess because they've either got lots of song choices when they first start out, and/or have honed their skills by the last. Others like Joni, Bonnie Raitt, Neil Young etc. were hard to pick because their styles etc. have changed/evolved over the years, so it's almost like comparing albums from different artists. All in all a challenging little exercise, using up time I should be using to cook dinner! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 06:22:56 -0500 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: unreleased songs: the final answer Jim J. told me that he got the lyrics for the web page from a reader who got the lead sheets from Siquomb in 1968. - ----------------------------------- Deb Messling "I like cats. They give the home a heartbeat." ~Joni Mitchell - ----------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 06:22:57 -0500 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: RE: Unreleased.... > -----Original Message----- > what would happen if I scanned the sheet music and > sent it to those who can read music who would be willing to > record their findings I think this would be a fantastic idea! In high school, I learned the bare basics of reading music in chorus, and I tried to play the unreleased songbook songs on the flutophone!! But I never succeeded in figuring any of them out. I imagine we would end up with just the basic melody and not Joni's chords, but it would be something. - ----------------------------------- Deb Messling "I like cats. They give the home a heartbeat." ~Joni Mitchell - ----------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 06:28:24 -0500 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: RE: JM Article from '74 and HDCD?? That Time article is great. My mother bought me a bottle of Chateau Margaux for Christmas that year, because it was Joni's favorite wine. I never liked the drawing on the cover, though. It didn't look like Joni to me. - ----------------------------------- Deb Messling "I like cats. They give the home a heartbeat." ~Joni Mitchell - ----------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 07:35:10 -0500 From: Gary Zack Subject: Re: unreleased songs, again Hi, The only unreleased songs with lyrics and music that I have access to are from the old Joni Mitchell songbook, which I believe was the first songbook released way back when. That songbook contained music and lyrics for Carnival in Kenora, Jeremy, A Melody In Your Name, Moon In The Mirror, Poor Sad Baby, Straw Flower Me, Who Has Seen The Wind, and Winter Lady. That was how I learned Winter Lady those many dim years ago, and have been singing the song for almost thirty years now! As far as the others, I too often wondered how Jim J. got the lyrics. I used to write to Siquomb Publishing also years ago, and they would send me lead sheets for a nominal fee. I may have a few others tucked away somewhere, but nothing that is already on the site. I do remember getting a copy of the lead sheet for "Play Little David" and also used to hear her sing that one early on in concert. But the songs mentioned above are in the old songbook called "The Music of Joni Mitchell" published in 1969. Best regards, Gary P.S. Bob, I promise to get that tape to you first thing Monday. Been a tough week, but I'll get on it this weekend for sure! Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: > > Hey Deb, > > I'm sorry to "hear" about the silence. I don't have hard information so I > stayed away, but my memory was that someone got lyrics by researching > copyrights. (Is that the right term?) > > Have you asked JJ or Gary Zack directly about this? > > Lama ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 07:52:06 -0500 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: unreleased songs, again Jim asked Deb: >>> Have you asked JJ or Gary Zack directly about this? <<< Gary (The fabulous protea man) will probably tell you himself that he went to the Library of Congress and researched there for references to Joni. He came up with songs and lyrics that had never been recorded and when he and I first met at the Clarkston BSN show he told me a little about the things he found there. I am not sure if this was the "source" of the information posted on the page but I wouldn't be surprised if some of that material came from him. Perhaps he will post a little about his adventures here on the list. Cassy NP: Video tape of the Bravo Profiles show on Herbie Hancock that aired last night. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 00:57:44 -0800 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Fwd: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... - --------- Forwarded Message --------- DATE: Wed, 07 Feb 2001 15:43:42 From: "P. Henry" To: JoniMitchellfans@yahoogroups.com scan of a small poster I just won on ebay... note that all the writing on it was done by Joni herself. :o) http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1502641&a=11453570&p=40349287 btw, I'm posting some pics (many of which I have you guys to thank for) at photopoint and it seems to work ok... check this out: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1502641&a=11348194 one neat thing is that you can upload 10 pics at a time. pat Who needs Cupid? Matchmaker.com is the place to meet somebody. FREE Two-week Trial Membership at http://www.matchmaker.com/home?rs=200015 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 08:28:16 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: unreleased songs, again <> Now you tell me!! I took vaction ALL week so I could hang out by my mailbox! ;~D You know I'm kidding, Gary...thanks for the update, and for being the cool guy you are. And Deb, this is NOT a tape of Siquomb doing all those songs that Gary mentioned! ;~) And I'm excited, I won my first E-bay auction, a Hoyt Axton LP (sealed) called "Pistol-Packin' Mama" that contains a cover of "For Free" (recorded as "He Played Real Good For Free). Lots of cool things hap'nin' in the wonderful world of covers...updates soon! Bob NP: Collective Soul, "Collection of Goods" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 08:34:11 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC > Can anyone think of another album by another > group that you think is their all-time best?>> Being the oddball/goofball I am, I'll throw some odd ones out here: Elvis Costello, "This Year's Model" XTC, "Black Sea" Nirvana, "Nevermind" Pearl Jam, "Ten" Doobie Brothers, "What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits" America, "Hat Trick" Tom Waits, "Blue Valentine" Dire Straits, "Making Movies" Brooooooce, "Born To Run" Loggins & Messina, "Mother Lode" Hole, "Celebrity Skin" ;~) AC/DC, "Back In Black" Bob NP: Phil Collins, "Both Sides of the Story" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 08:41:32 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: DJRD live??? <> Hi Jack! (I hope we never meet on an airplane as I'd get arrested for that greeting...) She did DJRD twice, at Madison Square Garden and at the Corel Centre in Kanata, Ontario. You can go to the Touring section at JM.com and get the entire setlists. Both shows are available, the MSG fits on an 80-min CD, the Corel show on (2) 74's. Both are great quality, from a performance standpoint I'd recommend the Kanata show as it was a highlight from that tour. But I'll be happy to make either or both for ya' if you want. And a tip o' the chapeau to Simon for sharing these recordings with us in the first place... Also, DJRD is available live from her '76 tour, she performs it as a medley with Coyote. It'll knock your sox off as well! Bob ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 08:42:31 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Paz NJC <> Are they sure it wasn't Steven Segall?? ;~) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 09:11:08 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... In a message dated 2/8/01 8:39:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, badwolff@angelfire.com writes: << btw, I'm posting some pics (many of which I have you guys to thank for) at photopoint and it seems to work ok... check this out: >> Thanks for sharing these Pat. I love the promo photo of her and Chuck as well as the one of her sleeping in the car in route to London. Wow, when you think about it, she has been traveling soooooo long. - -Rose ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 09:32:01 -0500 From: "Neil E. Orts" Subject: Re: Jonatha Pulled too far - NJC At 11:36 PM -0800 2/7/01, Scott Price wrote: >Although I pre-ordered the CD and DVD of "Steady Pull" I only received the >CD in today's mail. A note promised the DVD will be delayed a bit. Maybe by >the time it gets here I will be a little more accustomed to the new album. >It's going to take me a while to feel comfortable with this one. I don't recall what I've said about Jonatha recently, but I bought her Plumb on the recommendation of someone on the JMDL. I didn't like it at first. EVery couple of months, I'd put it on and just sort of wonder why I bought it. About a year after purchasing it, I put it on and something clicked. Suddenly, I couldn't stop listening to it. Suddenly, I had to own everything she's ever done. By contrast, i immediately loved TEn Cent Wings. I don't know if I'd "gotten" her idiom so it was more accessible to me or if it was simply more to my usual tastes. I don't know. Anyway, your comments on it make me anticipate it more. I guess I should have pre-ordered it . . . Actually, now that I think about it, I had similar experience with Joni. She wasn't immediately accessibe to me. The people who remember where they were when they first heard her are odd to me because it took a while for me to get into her, too. In fact, I think that's a pattern for me. The folks I like best are the ones who don't make sense to me immediately. Still, there must be something there that makes me go back and try again. . . maybe I should give nSync another try . . . - -Neil not ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Neil E. Orts * Director/Student Services * Okay, you're a visionary. I'm a visionary. Office of Graduate Studies * Everyone here is a visionary. But what do University of Texas Austin * you do for a living? Main 101 -- 512/232-3626 * neo@mail.utexas.edu * from a cartoon by Eli Stein fax: 512/475-8851 * in the Chronicle for Higher Education ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 10:32:42 EST From: Rusty10113@aol.com Subject: Turbulent Hi gang.. just gotta say, I'm rediscovering Turbulent Indigo, specifically Borderline and the title song... bliss to me is a big cup o' java, joni in my headphones and a day off! greetings to all.. M ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:01:26 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Sweet, sweet, SWEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I tried to send this yesterday, but it never showed up in my mailbox, so apologies if you receive this twice. - --------------------------------------------- I received a "live" tape of Fonimitchell, and I am on my second listen. WOW!!!!!!!!!! These guys are good!! I love their interpretations, harmonies, and instrumental mixes. THANK YOU, Clive! Anyone wanting a copy of this, please send a blank cassette tape with a self- addressed, STAMPED return envelope, and I will be happy to make you a copy. Please send a note in it stating what you want, along with your e-mail address. Overseas listers can probably get it from Clive directly? Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA 01983 Hugs, Ashara {*REALLY* enjoying this!} ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:11:40 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) Kakki wrote (*quite* a looooooong time ago!): << There was an article about the Taylor family that I read a few years ago where I recall JT saying something to the effect that it was a sort of "myth" that he spent time in a hospital for psychological/drugproblems and that his parents were just eccentric and had far-out ideas and felt it would be worthwhile for all of the kids to spend a year in the hospital whether they needed it or not. It said that his borthers and sister also spent time there. Sounds pretty abusive to me, and if true, may account or some of the "demons." {snip} However, I also recall that "Cold Blue Steel" is supposed to be about his heroin problem, so maybe he did struggle with it on and off.>> Kakki, please don't take this at all personally, but I would really like to set the record straight about this. Here is what was said on 60 Minutes II, several months ago in an interview by Bob Simon with James Taylor. For this purpose, I am only quoting the part that is relevant: Bob Simon: His writing habits began early, but not easily. James Taylor started writing songs during a stay at a psychiatric hospital, MacLean, outside Boston. His parents committed him there when he was just 17, after he was diagnosed: suicidal. James Taylor: It was a rough passage for me. My family was kind enough and smart enough to sort of put me in a nut house for a while, which was really a great thing. It allowed me to think of myself as different and to realize that I had to find my own way. And this basically sort of gave me time out and protection, real protection. A locked ward is real protection. BS: It saved your life? JT: (nodding) It saved my life. I believe it. BS: And after graduating from high school at MacLean, he set out for New York City to play in a Rock and Roll band. Only 18, he was hooked on heroin within a year. (To JT:) Your dad had to come get you. JT: Yeah. He didn't have an awful lot to do with me as I was growing up. We didn't communicate a whole lot, and he was sort of distant, but I think he heard it somehow in my voice when I called him up, and he just said, "Stay right there. What's your address? Just hold on. I'll be right there." And within 24 hours he had rented a car and driven up. He knew that it was important that he come and bail me out. I wasn't in good shape. BS: At it's worse, did you think you were going to die? Ever? JT: Did I think it was life-threatening? Yeah. I should of... I overdosed a number of times, maybe 5 times. I should of... I really should have been dead at least 3 times. I should... I should have gone down. Later on in the interview, Bob Simon went on to say, "He finally kicked his drug habit in 1983." IMHO, it sounds like James Taylor's parents were not abusive for sending him to a hospital, but rather saved his life, and there doesn't seem to be any "maybes" about his heroin problem. Thanks, Kakki for bringing this up, as maybe some others here read the same article, and perhaps this way, the misinformation won't spread any further. Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:14:39 EST From: PMcfad@aol.com Subject: j.brooke - steady pull baddog njc someone posted about ordering steady pull from an 800 number for bad dog. i called there today and it's an answering machine and they want you to leave your credit card info on the answering machine. ok, so i just went back to microsoft and re looked at the post,(DRB-digest related behavior) and the writer was..."Christopher J. Treacy" so now chris, you're cc'd on this post. so the quesiton is did you leave your info on the answering machine? i'm ok leaving a lot of information on voice mail, but my credit card on an answering machine makes me nervous. maybe i' should wait a few hours if it's west coast and try to catch a human, unless that's the way it is all the time. patrick np. nrh-third song ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:27:30 EST From: PMcfad@aol.com Subject: Tull/Kate's B. day (NJC) jesus steve, not only are you anally retentive, but you were always that way if you were able to keep track back as far as 1969. how did you manage not to lose those records with all the moving around people did in the 70's in a pre computer era? and by the way, the other night i couldn't sleep and on court tv they were showing footage from the trial that went on between the widow and ex wife of jerry garcia. the piece i saw had phil lesh in the witness stand and he was asked to recall an event from the 70's and he looked really serious and said, judge, i'm sorry....but there's about a ten year span from that time that i've totally lost track of. and the judge smiled. now see....if only he had kept notes! patrick np. slouching toward bethlehem steve wrote: Now, if all you music sluts were anally-retentive music sluts like me, you would have written this stuff down. :) The only time I saw Tull: 1 Jethro Tull Convention Center Anaheim 8/9/69 4 Beverly, Mario, Susie C., Dennis, Etc. I gave them a 4 out of 5. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 08:43:01 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) Thanks, Ashara for more input. The story James provides in the 60 Minutes II transcript comports more closely with the original story most of all us remember hearing back in the 70s. I recall the earlier article I mentioned being more generally about the Simon family, rather than James specifically (although it did purport to quote him on this subject), and I think it appeared in Vanity Fair. However, here is a link to another article from MOJO, where James again seems to be downplaying it a bit http://www.james-taylor.com/text/mojo9-97.txt Here is an excerpt: "Meanwhile Taylor began to undergo some personal reversals - mainly escalating bouts of depression - dropping out of the Milton Academy Boarding School in Massachucetts. 'Probably typical adolescent stuff,' says James, 'but people around me put me into a mental hospital for about nine months.' (Sister Kate and brother Livingston would also spend short intervals at McLean Hospital, where Ray Charles had once gone to detox.) Sprung by a pal named Dave Barry, Taylor fled with his record collection....." This interview also states that he kicked his "remaining addictions" to "alcohol and methodone" in 1985. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 09:04:44 -0800 (PST) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC - --- SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > > Can anyone think of another album by another > > group that you think is their all-time best?>> Sure, this is easy! ;-) "Love Over Gold" -- Dire Straits "Fear Of Music" -- Talking Heads "Porcelain" -- Julia Fordham "Nothing Like The Sun" -- Sting "Raised on Radio" -- Journey "Walkabout" -- The Fixx "Born To Run" -- Springsteen "Songs In The Key Of Life" -- Stevie Wonder "Steppin' Out" -- Joe Jackson "Fandango" -- ZZ Top "The Koln Concert" -- Keith Jarrett So many more ... so little time! Don Rowe ===== Visit me anytime at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 12:12:36 -0500 From: "Stephen Epstein" Subject: Folk Alliance Hello all! Please excuse the NJC content- I wished to get this out to as many as possible. Anyone who is coming to Vancouver for the Folk Alliance next week and would like to get together, please mail me off list. It would be a pleasure to put some faces to names. And there will be a special lister from Argentina in town, as well!! Best regards, Stephen in Vancouver ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:23:55 -0500 From: "Neil E. Orts" Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC At 9:04 AM -0800 2/8/01, Don Rowe wrote: >"Nothing Like The Sun" -- Sting no no no. "The Soul Cages" (but NLtS is a close second so it's easy to understand the mistake.) :) - -Neil contrary ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Neil E. Orts * Director/Student Services * Okay, you're a visionary. I'm a visionary. Office of Graduate Studies * Everyone here is a visionary. But what do University of Texas Austin * you do for a living? Main 101 -- 512/232-3626 * neo@mail.utexas.edu * from a cartoon by Eli Stein fax: 512/475-8851 * in the Chronicle for Higher Education ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 12:53:52 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: JM Article from '74 and HDCD?? NJC Hi Nancy, If a CD is labeled HDCD it means that the CD is of high quality. The HDCD process came along after some of the bugs in the CD creation process were worked out. For example, I believe that all of Joni's HDCD releases were created from the original 2 track tape. (In the old days of CDs, the record companies often used dubs of dubs called production masters to create the original CD.) You can play a HDCD on any CD player and it will sound great. If your stereo costs as much as a car, you may hear some additional benefits if your HDCD is played back on a player with HDCD decoding. Hope this helps, Lama ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 13:08:29 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: Kate's Web cast (NJC) FINALLY!!! I got to see Kate in the rebroadcast of her webcast! How very, very cool. Technology has really gotten amazing. OK, who is in charge of the webcast from the New England Labor Day Jonifest 2001?? ("If" I have it, of course!) ;-) Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 13:15:06 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Fwd: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) I'm forwarding this for Ashara, it obviously didn't make it to the list. Must be that Mercury retrograde Wally was talking about. - -Rose Return-path: From: AsharaJM@aol.com Full-name: AsharaJM Message-ID: <8f.6a234e4.27b43b0f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 13:10:23 EST Subject: Fwd: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) To: RoseMJoy@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 352 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Return-path: From: AsharaJM@aol.com Full-name: AsharaJM Message-ID: <85.6a11827.27b41f3c@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:11:40 EST Subject: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) To: joni@smoe.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Disposition: Inline X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 352 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Kakki wrote (*quite* a looooooong time ago!): << There was an article about the Taylor family that I read a few years ago where I recall JT saying something to the effect that it was a sort of "myth" that he spent time in a hospital for psychological/drugproblems and that his parents were just eccentric and had far-out ideas and felt it would be worthwhile for all of the kids to spend a year in the hospital whether they needed it or not. It said that his borthers and sister also spent time there. Sounds pretty abusive to me, and if true, may account or some of the "demons." {snip} However, I also recall that "Cold Blue Steel" is supposed to be about his heroin problem, so maybe he did struggle with it on and off.>> Kakki, please don't take this at all personally, but I would really like to set the record straight about this. Here is what was said on 60 Minutes II, several months ago in an interview by Bob Simon with James Taylor. For this purpose, I am only quoting the part that is relevant: Bob Simon: His writing habits began early, but not easily. James Taylor started writing songs during a stay at a psychiatric hospital, MacLean, outside Boston. His parents committed him there when he was just 17, after he was diagnosed: suicidal. James Taylor: It was a rough passage for me. My family was kind enough and smart enough to sort of put me in a nut house for a while, which was really a great thing. It allowed me to think of myself as different and to realize that I had to find my own way. And this basically sort of gave me time out and protection, real protection. A locked ward is real protection. BS: It saved your life? JT: (nodding) It saved my life. I believe it. BS: And after graduating from high school at MacLean, he set out for New York City to play in a Rock and Roll band. Only 18, he was hooked on heroin within a year. (To JT:) Your dad had to come get you. JT: Yeah. He didn't have an awful lot to do with me as I was growing up. We didn't communicate a whole lot, and he was sort of distant, but I think he heard it somehow in my voice when I called him up, and he just said, "Stay right there. What's your address? Just hold on. I'll be right there." And within 24 hours he had rented a car and driven up. He knew that it was important that he come and bail me out. I wasn't in good shape. BS: At it's worse, did you think you were going to die? Ever? JT: Did I think it was life-threatening? Yeah. I should of... I overdosed a number of times, maybe 5 times. I should of... I really should have been dead at least 3 times. I should... I should have gone down. Later on in the interview, Bob Simon went on to say, "He finally kicked his drug habit in 1983." IMHO, it sounds like James Taylor's parents were not abusive for sending him to a hospital, but rather saved his life, and there doesn't seem to be any "maybes" about his heroin problem. Thanks, Kakki for bringing this up, as maybe some others here read the same article, and perhaps this way, the misinformation won't spread any further. Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 13:27:58 -0500 From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC Frank Zappa and the MOthers, "Weasels Ripped My Flesh" Captain Beefheart, Trout Mask Replica R.E.M, "Murmur" tied with "AUtomatic for the People" Talking Heads, "Fear of Music" The Cure, "Disintegration" Tom Waits, "Rain Dogs" Marvin Gaye, "whats going on" Funkadelic, "ONe nation under a Groove" Jackson Browne, "Late for the SKy" Kraftwerk, "Trans Europe Express" blair >Elvis Costello, "This Year's Model" >XTC, "Black Sea" >Nirvana, "Nevermind" >Pearl Jam, "Ten" >Doobie Brothers, "What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits" >America, "Hat Trick" >Tom Waits, "Blue Valentine" >Dire Straits, "Making Movies" >Brooooooce, "Born To Run" >Loggins & Messina, "Mother Lode" >Hole, "Celebrity Skin" ;~) >AC/DC, "Back In Black" > >Bob > >NP: Phil Collins, "Both Sides of the Story" _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 10:38:53 -0800 From: jan gyn Subject: Re: Paz NJC At 08:42 AM 2/8/01 -0500, SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: ><about your boxing gigs?>> >Are they sure it wasn't Steven Segall?? ;~) Song to a Seagal! - -jan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 14:14:37 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Talking Heads- NJC <> That's funny, this is the second time this was mentioned as a fave by these guys (and girl), and I think it's the WORST one they did, or at least a tie with "Talking Heads '77". OK, it's got "Life During Wartime", which totally rocks, but some of those other songs border on unlistenable... Mind you, I respect your opinions and all this is pure opinion...I'm just looking for the opportunity to expand my mind on this record. Why does this one do it for you? Bob, who would've said "Little Creatures" or "Stop Making Sense" NP: Shawn, "something to believe in" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 11:25:36 -0800 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... hi rose, yeah, she really has and it makes me feel restless inside when I think of her... that it doesn't seem that she's found what she's looking for in all these years... so many of us have found so much in her words and her music... life lessons, as it were... it seems somehow unjust that she's given me so much and seems to have gained for herself so little... makes me think of: "I am on a lonely road and I am traveling Traveling, traveling, traveling Looking for something, what can it be..." ...in which I learned perhaps the greatest lesson of all... "...I love you when I forget about me" pat NP: All I Want... http://members.wbs.net/homepages/b/a/d/badwolff/badwolff.html - -- On Thu, 8 Feb 2001 09:11:08 RoseMJoy wrote: >badwolff@angelfire.com writes: ><< btw, I'm posting some pics (many of which I have you guys to thank for) at photopoint and it seems to work ok... check this out: >> >Thanks for sharing these Pat. I love the promo photo of her and Chuck as well as the one of her sleeping in the car in route to London. Wow, when you think about it, she has been traveling soooooo long. - -Rose > Who needs Cupid? Matchmaker.com is the place to meet somebody. FREE Two-week Trial Membership at http://www.matchmaker.com/home?rs=200015 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:12:33 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: LA in the 70's - NJC (was riding the train through Saskatoon) Yes, that is a great story about Stills & Hendrix... I look at those photos with such envy!!! The thing that gets me is that I was sooooo close (time & place wise), I just didn't know about that scene at the time, not they would have let me in!!! Especially if Peter Sellers was turned away! Kakki were you in LA then? Did you know about all that stuff or maybe it was in hindsight we have learned of all these get togethers, via Henry Diltz photos, etc. I was up in Santa Barbara, on the mountain, doing a similar musical thing though, we just weren't rich or famous! And in those days, SB was light years away from LA it seemed....(though I do have a friend who grew up here who told me that once she had a big party & a very obnoxious Jim Morrison showed up at her door...) hell said, "the parties that John and Michelle Phillips used to have in LA (I think it was Laurel Canyon, but that may have been Cass Elliot)" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 11:53:25 -0800 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Thirsty Boots... THIRSTY BOOTS Eric Anderson You've long been on the open road. You've been standing in the rain. From the dirty words and muddy cells, your clothes are dark and stained, But the dirty words and muddy cells will soon be judged insane. So only stop to rest yourself and you'll be off again. Chorus: So take off your thirsty boots and stay for awhile. You're feet are hot and weary, come a dusty mile, And maybe I can make you laugh. Maybe I can try. Looking for the evening and the morning in your eyes. Then tell me of the one's you've seen as far as you can see. Across the plains from field to town a-marchin' to be free, And of the rusted prison gates that tumble by degree Like laughin' children, one by one, they look like you and me. Who needs Cupid? Matchmaker.com is the place to meet somebody. FREE Two-week Trial Membership at http://www.matchmaker.com/home?rs=200015 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:33:14 -0800 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: RE: those gosh-darn kids NJC It sounds like a great class! The combination of letting them bring in their music & playing music that you choose is wonderful. I think that many kids I know develop their musical tastes beyond the MTV fare because of influences such as yours, as well as what their parents play or the music they are exposed to if they are learning an instrument or in musical plays etc. Diane said, "The flip side of this is that I play a diverse range of music for them on other days of the week. Their responses are always interesting. When I play Joni I hear from quite a few that their moms listen to "that CD." (A reluctant acceptance?) The music they tend to respond best to are Lorena McKennett, Beatles, world music compilations, and Japanese Kodo drummers. " ******************************************** Kate Bennett sponsored by Polysonics www.polysonics.com hear the music at: www.taylorguitars.com/artists/awp/indies/ www.katebennett.com www.cdbaby.com/katebennett www.amazon.com ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 15:04:20 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: JM Article from '74 and HDCD?? NJC Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: > Hi Nancy, > > If a CD is labeled HDCD it means that the CD is of high quality. > > The HDCD process came along after some of the bugs in the CD creation > process were worked out. For example, I believe that all of Joni's HDCD > releases were created from the original 2 track tape. (In the old days of > CDs, the record companies often used dubs of dubs called production masters > to create the original CD.) > > You can play a HDCD on any CD player and it will sound great. > > If your stereo costs as much as a car, you may hear some additional benefits > if your HDCD is played back on a player with HDCD decoding. Just to add to Jim's audiophile comments, most DVD players have HDCD decoders built in. I've got a great home system and have played them on both my cd and dvd player and notice little difference. BUT, there is a big difference between the hdcd cd's and non HDCD cd's. The difference, in my humble opinion, is in the remastering, more than the decoding. I personally think getting the 24 gold discs are a very good investment for your favorite recordings. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 15:39:08 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: RE: those gosh-darn kids NJC Speaking of those gosh darn kids, this week's Newsweek has a photo of Robert Downey Jr. on the cover with the words "Addiction Problems" (or some such). My son pointed at those words and looked at me saying "Joni Mitchell!!" I had to laugh! A smartass chip off the old block(head)! Bob NP: The Connells, "Eyes On The Ground" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 15:48:58 EST From: Rusty10113@aol.com Subject: Re: [JoniMitchellfans] C&S memories... I love that line , too... I have to remember it I love you when I forget about me... whew! M ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 12:33:56 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) > I'm forwarding this for Ashara, it obviously didn't make it to the list. Must > be that Mercury retrograde Wally was talking about. Rose, That's weird - I received Ashara's original post sent to the list at 8:15 this a.m. That Mercury retrograde also must have caused me to mistakenly refer to an article about the "Simon" family instead of the "Taylor" family in my reply to Ashara. Or maybe it was just too early in the morning for my brain ;-) I'll hunt through my old VF's to see if I can find the article - it was well-written. After reading Taylor's apparently disparate recollections on his hospitalization over the years, I tend to think that he has either been misquoted, taken out of context or may be doing his own "spin" depending on the audience he is addressing, e.g., a downplayed spin on the drug aspect to the trendy hip readers of MOJO or VF, but more candidness to the mainstream, middle-America audience of 60 Minutes II. Just MHO. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 13:05:45 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: LA in the 70's - NJC (was riding the train through Saskatoon) Kate wrote: > I look at those photos with such envy!!! The thing that gets me is that I > was sooooo close (time & place wise), I just didn't know about that scene at > the time, not they would have let me in!!! Especially if Peter Sellers was > turned away! > Kakki were you in LA then? Did you know about all that stuff or maybe it was > in hindsight we have learned of all these get togethers, via Henry Diltz > photos, etc. Yes - I'm a native who lived my early years in Westwood, but in the 60s, I lived about 25 miles south by the beach and was too young to drive a car, or otherwise get up to the scene ;-) However, a bit of it still reached my neighborhood - I remember when Stills was dating a sister of a friend in '66 and how we all drooled over that, I was friends with a couple of Sonny Bono's cousins, had friends whose parents were connected with the Herb Alpert, A&M and the record biz, the Byrds and Buffalo Springfield played at the local high school, and the local radio stations KFWB, KHJ and KRLA plied us daily with the latest happenings on the scene. It was a fantastic time, even if one was a bit removed by age or distance - it was still close enough to live it not so vicariously! Plus in those days, as Steve Dulson can tell you, it was so easy and downright cheap to see the top acts around L.A. and also out in its suburbs. There was a place near my home where you could see just about anyone for a couple bucks. Another friend lived in Laurel Canyon for a bit with one of his former college professors. My friend was trying to get an extension of his draft deferment at the time and has told me of going to the Canyon store, running into Joni there and having a great chat with her about all kinds of topics of the day. My biggest "argh, I missed it" story, though, was when I was visiting an old family friend who was terminally ill about 10 years ago. He had been a childhood actor and was later a fairly famous movie director. He also had written songs for TV and film and he asked me that night to play something on his piano. So I said to him "you won't know this, but it's a favorite of mine" and started playing. He immediately said "Joni Mitchell - Song to a Seagull." I was stunned - he was about 70 years old at the time. I asked him how he knew that and he said "because she played it for me once on this very piano at one of my parties." He lived in Laurel Canyon the same time as Joni but I'd never imagined a friend of my parents would have been included in the "scene" ! > I was up in Santa Barbara, on the mountain, doing a similar musical thing > though, we just weren't rich or famous! And in those days, SB was light > years away from LA it seemed....(though I do have a friend who grew up here > who told me that once she had a big party & a very obnoxious Jim Morrison > showed up at her door...) There was a group of guys who lived in one of the canyons near me. They were all musicians and artists and my friends and I would go there and have jam sessions with them whenever we could. They were always playing Joni and their own incredible original music. Their parties were legend in my area and I was always having this fantasy-wish that one day Joni would somehow show up at one of them!! > hell said, "the parties that John and Michelle Phillips used to have in LA (I think it was > Laurel Canyon, but that may have been Cass Elliot)" Cass was the one who lived there and I think she was the main "den mother" of the gang ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 13:36:33 -0800 (PST) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC > no no no. "The Soul Cages" (but NLtS is a close > second so it's easy to > understand the mistake.) "They Dance Alone": Guitars -- Mark Knopfler & Eric Clapton. The defense rests! ;-) Don Rowe ===== Visit me anytime at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 16:39:26 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) In a message dated 2/8/01 3:52:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: << That's weird - I received Ashara's original post sent to the list at 8:15 this a.m. >> Ashara, Bob Murphy and I didn't receive the original post. Must be an AOHell thing again. - -Rose ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 15:58:05 -0500 From: "Neil E. Orts" Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC At 1:36 PM -0800 2/8/01, Don Rowe wrote: >> no no no. "The Soul Cages" (but NLtS is a close >> second so it's easy to >> understand the mistake.) > >"They Dance Alone": Guitars -- Mark Knopfler & Eric >Clapton. Oh I see, when we say best album, we really mean one song with superstar guests. I thought we were talking about overall merits of the album. :) >The defense rests! ;-) The defense needs to be more vigilent. >:^] - -Neil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Neil E. Orts * Director/Student Services * Okay, you're a visionary. I'm a visionary. Office of Graduate Studies * Everyone here is a visionary. But what do University of Texas Austin * you do for a living? Main 101 -- 512/232-3626 * neo@mail.utexas.edu * from a cartoon by Eli Stein fax: 512/475-8851 * in the Chronicle for Higher Education ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 14:08:20 +0000 From: Catherine Turley Subject: Re: Talking Heads- NJC SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > <> > > That's funny, this is the second time this was mentioned as a fave by these guys (and girl), and I think it's the WORST one they did, or at least a tie with "Talking Heads '77". > > . Why does this one do it for you? Lawsy lawsy! (as my grandma Bess used to say). Fear of Music! One of those albums burned into my brain. Edgy. Rhythmic. Full of ideas. Beautifully surreal. Funny. This album just spoke to me as a chronically sleep deprived study-geek undergrad. Another reason it looms so large amongst my musical best beloveds: remember Air Supply? They were unescapable on the very conservative and culturally timid campus I attended. Fear of Music in the walk man just made them go away . . . Catherine T. , watching the snow melt in Seattle NP: Paco Peqa, Misa Flamenca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 14:14:10 -0800 (PST) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Talking Heads- NJC Well, for me, it was pretty much a toss-up between FOM and "Remain In Light." RIL was too obvious, seeing as it contains their biggest hit. Fear, on the other hand, cuts right to the core of what the Heads were all about ... it's as if Byrne/Eno and Co. found a way to take a photograph of a paranoid psychosis ... with lyrics that make even simple, mundane items like paper seem like some mortal threat to one's sanity. If you find Fear a bit hard to listen to -- I would say Byrne hit his intended target DEAD center. Tina Weymouth's deep subsonics (I Zimra in partucular) are just not to be believed, and the supporting instrumentation is as gutsy and innovative as anything I've ever heard. It's all wrapped up in production that, to this day, sounds fresh and interesting -- and I always think a great album should "age" well. I'm also putting Fear on top because, even with Remain in Light, the band became more and more progressively "watered down" ... by the time we got to "Little Creatures", the Heads were just another somewhat quirky pop band. Not so the group that put out Fear of Music. Just my dos pesos! Don Rowe ===== Visit me anytime at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 14:17:03 -0800 (PST) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Best Albums (was Grace and Joni) - NJC Well, the rest of it ain't bad ... just thought I'd point out one jewel in a crown that's slightly more ornate than Soul Cages -- which I also love, by the way! It's kind of a Hejira vs. For the Roses thing, only with a guy bass player as the lead singer! ;-) Don Rowe ===== Visit me anytime at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 21:05:34 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: NJC Del Shannon This may be remembered only by us in west Michigan - Del Shannon was born in Grand Rapids and grew up in Coopersville, both about 30 miles from me in Greenville, Michigan... 11 years ago today, Del Shannon commited suicide and we've been playing 'Runaway' and 'Hats off to Larry' and etc etc etc a lot out here today... Hats off to Del, who gave us a lot of great music (is there a better rock and roll song than Runaway?). (the Rev) Vince, NPIMH Del Shannon's cover of 'The Big Hurt' http://www.delshannon.com/delbio.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 22:04:01 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Re: James Taylor- setting the record straight (NJC) Kakki wrote: > That's weird - I received Ashara's original post sent to the list at 8:15 > this a.m. >> And I was going to write, "Whoa! How is that possible? I didn't send it off until 11:11." And then I put what is left of the brain cells back in my head, and realized that of course you are on the west coast, Kakki, and I am on the east. {Duh!!} Anyway...*most* strange that several of us didn't receive the message, and I sent another post TWICE, and it still hasn't shown up yet. :-( This really must have something to do with Mercury being retrograde! > I'll hunt through my old VF's to see if I can find the article - > it was well-written. After reading Taylor's apparently disparate > recollections on his hospitalization over the years, I tend to think that he > has either been misquoted, taken out of context or may be doing his own > "spin" depending on the audience he is addressing, e.g., a downplayed spin > on the drug aspect to the trendy hip readers of MOJO or VF, but more > candidness to the mainstream, middle-America audience of 60 Minutes II.>> I would love to read the article, Kakki. I thought the url you sent with the last post was great! I love reading about JT! Thanks for sending it. Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #65 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?