From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #21 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, January 13 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 021 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: lyrics, ac/dc, ramirez njc ["hell" ] Energy: Good News, NJC ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: practical magic njc ["Victor Johnson" ] No Humor [Vince Lavieri ] Re: HOSL [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re:The Ghostly Garden ["Megan" ] Re: No Humor NJC [dsk ] [none] ["Dave and Beth Fairall" ] Re: practical magic ["Diane Evans" ] Re: the Fez/Mingus band (vljc) [dsk ] Re: The Party (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Re: List Members On the Road, (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Re: Willie Cover [Michael Paz ] Chocolat [dsk ] Re: Joni on egreetings [Michael Paz ] Fwd: Politics and religion (NJC) [SMEBD@aol.com] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [SMEBD@aol.com] RE: The Party (NJC) ["Dave and Beth Fairall" ] Re: The Party (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Miss Paved Paradise ["Gerald" ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [Randy Remote ] politics and our rigidity [Yael Harlap ] Earthquake in C.A. (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Re: Off to Mary Graces in Davis for the Mini-fest [Michael Paz ] Re: politics and our rigidity [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Earthquake in C.A. (NJC) ["Kakki" ] Re: politics and our rigidity [Yael Harlap ] mary grace has a party (NJC) ["Wally Kairuz" ] miss paved paradise and bob muller ["Wally Kairuz" Subject: Re: lyrics, ac/dc, ramirez njc Evian wrote: > Just curious -- wasn' it just that Ramirez's AC/DC hat was left at a > crime scene and that is what the press made a big deal out of? And all > this may be answered since I am responding to last night's digest... oh, > one of these days I will get the nerve to go "Real time!" It's true that Ramirez left an AC/DC cap at one of the crime scenes. But once the police learnt his identity, they interviewed several of his old school-friends and they told them that he had been almost obsessed by heavy metal music, particularly that with so-called "satanic" lyrics. From the Crime Library website (www.crimelibrary.com): "Another interest grew from, say boyhood friends, the sort of music he listened to - that which glorified cultist practices. He seemed preoccupied with Satanism and stories about black magic, demons and dragons. While his mother sent him to Bible studies, hoping he'd learn the Christian ways of life, Richard took the lessons to heart - but learned them in reverse. That is, after class he would go to the library and read up on Satan and the fallen angels, the characters that his teachers merely skipped over while exemplifying Jesus Christ and the twelve apostles." This suggests that his satanic beliefs grew straight from the music he listened to. Of course he could have developed these beliefs without the music, but it certainly made the ideas more accessible. Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://www.nbls.co.nz ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:59:12 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Energy: Good News, NJC Hey, energy news bullets: * I heard that in Iceland, they have an abundance of geo-thermal and hydro-electric power so their future is very different: They are going to use these fuel sources to power portable fuel cells (essentially a hydrogen/oxygen battery) to run "cars". Viola! No fossil fuels. The catch: There are very few people there to use the abundant natural energy sources. Iceland is blessed. * Honda is "selling" an electric car. I have never, ever seen one on the street but it's a glimmer of the future. (But then I remember in 1972 when we were all told that a conversion to "The Metric System" was imminent in the US. Funny thing was- there's was no financial incentive to design a 4 liter milk bottle to replace the gallon ones, buy new tooling to mold a metric design, redesign new milk crates to hold the 'better' metric design, etc.) * NASA recently put up a huge, huge solar array for the new International Space Station. The array consists of , "almost an acre of solar panels". (http://www.shuttlepresskit.com/ISS_OVR/index.htm ) This is good news because it means that someone just paid for a lot of research into solar cells. (Let's just hope that the Russians contributed manpower and not computers to the new venture.) * Three counties in Northern Kentucky are performing mandatory tailpipe testing now. My 12 year old Volvo passed on Wednesday. The Feds try to implement tailpipe testing in areas with "dirty" air. It turns out that the "bad guys" are uhm.... people who have access to bulk fuel bought for farming. (Those 30 year old tractors run on leaded fuel.) The incentive is that the farm fuel is cheap, cheap, cheap because farmers don't pay road-use taxes. So the un-scrupulous punch the filler neck restrictor into their gas tank and pump in leaded, tractor fuel. Since airborne lead causes cancer, the Feds would prefer that it's not used for cars. Tailpipe testing catches these modified filler necks and forces users to mend their ways. The future is uncertain though because typically, in the Midwest, the populace doesn't want tailpipe testing. It costs $20 / year and who wants an "extra" cost? Let someone ELSE clean up the air, right? Amazingly though, we LOVE to tax ourselves to buy new football and baseball stadiums for the exclusive use of privately-held entertainment franchises. Anyway, apologies if this is old news to everyone. Peace, Lama ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:58:15 -0500 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: Re: practical magic njc Practical Magic also features Nick Drake "Black Dog", a very haunting song. Victor Johnson http://www.cdbaby.com/victorjohnson "Just beyond the morning falls the river of your dreams, Escaping from the day these wild creatures run away." Victor Johnson ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:33:56 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: No Humor I tried to send something titled "Humor" that has pictures and that cannot make it through the JMDL in that format; I guess I thus sent everyone computer gobbly gook. Sorry! To explain the funny pictures would be unhumorous so I apologise for wasting your time. As Emily Litella would say, "Never mind." (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:20:50 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: HOSL << The 'of-the-moment, 'non-nostalgic' experience of listening to HOSL today, in 2001, is proof that HOSL is among the small handful, if not Joni's 'ultimate' timeless masterpiece...Rob >> Great post, Rob. In the book "Rock - 100 Essential CD's", they pick HOSL as the ONE Joni to own as well. The sampled Burundi drums in Jungleline were off-putting yet very addictive for me. I remember I'd never heard anything like that before, and Joni was a pioneer in terms of introducing African sounds into rock music. HOSL is one of the few Joni's I almost HAVE to listen to in it's entirety as opposed to being 'shuffled' in the CD player. Bob NP: Doobies, "Without You" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:15:18 -0500 From: "Megan" Subject: Re:The Ghostly Garden Bob, Thanks for forwarding Sheldon's explanation of the 'ghostly garden';after reading everyone's posts on this thread, I had a vague idea that it could be the flip side of the Woodstock 'garden', but not possessing his poetic heart & mind, was unable to articulate it.This is one of the many reasons I love coming to the list--to experience other's eloquent illuminations on Joni's poetry. BW--Megan >to me,yes, it does mean the world >but more specifically the concrete urban world >of modern man that grows and grows unheeded >like a cancerous tumor fed by greed, ignorance and >indifference and is not self-sustaining but rather >feeds on the other garden, the garden of the natural >world or the mythological eden that i believe she's >referring to in 'woodstock'.the ghostly garden is >the residue of the devils bargain that humankind is >snagged in and that seems to be hurling us toward >certain self-annihilation.this theme runs throughout >mitchell's work.i'm thinking of the obvious"they >pave paradise and put up a parking lot" or that line >from 'furry sings the blues',"history falls to >parking lots and shopping malls" and the song 'sex >kills'really expands on this theme"this massive mess >we're in".there are myriad examples i could draw >from throughout her body of work as i'm sure you well >know.the ghostly garden grows.it reminds me of >t.s. elliots "the waste land". its beyond just a >question of ecology, the ecology seems to me but a >symptom of a greater collective dis-ease or trick that >we've all fallen for.it can seem a bit overwhelming >and depressing if one really looks at it hard. i >think that's why i'm so drawn to her work.she has >been a relentless and profound observer of our sad >state of affairs for decades but i also love the side >of her that's "alive, alive i wanna get up and jive, >wreck my stockings in a juke box dive". she's a >haunting prophet and an irrepressable and hopeful >dancer in one. always shaking things up and waking us >up. well, i've got a regular essay going here and i >could go on and on."talk to me, talk to me" >in closing i would add that the ghostly garden could >be a bit of a metaphor for the accumulated lived >experience of the speaker in the song. the ghostly >garden of experience and memory grows and grows and >grows. i think what makes a great poem is that it >works on many different levels>>> ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:36:12 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: No Humor NJC Hi Rev, The message and pictures came through on my trusty Mac.... LOL!!!! So rude!!!! Very funny!!! Looks like poster material to me. Debra Shea Vince Lavieri wrote: > I tried to send something titled "Humor" that has pictures and that > cannot make it through the JMDL in that format; I guess I thus sent > everyone computer gobbly gook. Sorry! To explain the funny pictures > would be unhumorous so I apologise for wasting your time. As Emily > Litella would say, "Never mind." > > (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:41:13 -0600 From: "Dave and Beth Fairall" Subject: [none] Paz said, Hey Paz, I have a gig next Saturday at West 24th, in Georgetown, which is owned by Mary Matlan / James Carville, well-known political operatives. She's the conservative pundit who will have a role in the Bush administration, and is featured on the CNN show Crossfire. Carville is of course Clinton's former Campaign Manager. Don't know if Carville will be there, cause it's an Inaugural Ball, aptly named the Alternative Ball, for incoming White House staffers, campaign workers, and some Republican Congressman. They hired a funk band, and want us to really cut loose. Unlike typical Inaugural events, which are notoriously stuffy, this one should be rather raucous. Being the diehard liberal, I'm torn but curious, and after all, $$ is bipartisan. I don't know whether dubya will post, but it can't be ruled out, wouldn't that be something? Wonder whether he'll have a brewski? I'll report back. Dave Fairall ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:08:14 -0500 From: "Diane Evans" Subject: Re: practical magic Martin, Aside from the music, the movie stars Sandra Bullock and -- omigosh, can't remember her name, but she's married to Tom Cruise. It's about present day witches (sisters) who suffer the torments of love, with a special family curse to deal with. Light humor, light plot, light twist. Couple of great scenes. Likeable film, but not remarkable. Diane >From: "Martin Giles" >Reply-To: "Martin Giles" >To: "joni digest" >Subject: practical magic >Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:02:10 -0000 > >Hi folks > >Just delurking to ask a question. > >A friend of mine said that he'd seen a movie on Sky the other night called >Practical Magic, which had various tunes in the background as a soundtrack. >He doesn't know Joni very well, but was sure that he recognised her singing >on at least one of the songs. Looking at the credits at the end, he did see >her name there. > >Does anyone know anything about this movie. What song/s did Joni sing? > >atb, >Martin. In London. > >NP Refuge Of The Roads. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:26:07 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: the Fez/Mingus band (vljc) Sue Mingus was there last Thursday. The band members seem to have a lot of affection for her judging from the way she was coaxed (well, kind of coaxed, although it also seemed planned) to the front to announce that "we" (i.e., the band) will be performing at a new restaurant called City Hall and inviting all of us to go listen to them there (may be a permanent gig, maybe not). From that announcement it's clear she's very much part of the band, and I would think is usually with them whenever they perform. From somewhere I have the notion that she keeps "tight reins" on the band so they don't stray from Mingus's vision. She seemed like a very no-nonsense person, gracious but not a warm presence (based solely on the bit I saw of her which admittedly isn't much), and is also a blonde, which made me wonder if Mingus liked that about Joni too. Oh, yeah, I know, there was his great appreciation of Joni's musical abilities, but other things can play into one's appreciation. Sue Mingus also has well defined cheekbones, yeah, kinda like Joni's. It was interesting seeing her; I'd heard of her but had no idea what she was like (not that I'd ever had a burning desire to know, but it was interesting seeing her anyway). Debra Shea NP: Chocolat soundtrack, "Minor Swing". On the cd it just says "music by Rachel Portman" even though this tune is Django Reinhardt, and there's also some Erik Satie in the movie. How can it all be "by Rachel Portman"? Just wondering how it can be that the original creators are not getting credit for this on the cd, even though they are listed in the credits at the end of the movie. Kakki wrote: > Synchronicity - I just got an email tonight from an old friend who was in > Manhattan a week ago who said she saw the Mingus band and met Sue Mingus. > She said that Sue apparently is often around with the band. I wonder if she > was at the Fez Thursday night. My friend said that Sue told her she is > still in contact with Joni, too. > > Kakki, in L.A. where the weather is just about as cold as Manhatten these > days! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:25:19 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: The Party (NJC) Party On (for the party) Dave. Ha-ha. What a kick. I would love to meet Dubya in person. I mest Clinton here in New Orleans and felt that amazing charisma up close. He has the most amazing eyes that look right into yours when he is talking to you. Pretty powerful. The only other prez I met was Lyndon (we were on a first name basis) when he came down to Honduras. I was young and that was pretty boring for me at the time. Best of luck on the gig! Paz NP-I Love It When You Call Me Names-Joan Armatrading on 1/13/01 4:41 PM, Dave and Beth Fairall at davebeth@bellatlantic.net wrote: > Paz said, > of my universe. I did a gig here in New Orleans when Bush (dad) won the > nomination and while I was opposed to him in a major way I was still able to > the gig cause it was "just another". To my credit, we set all the stuff up > went thru all the body cavity scans of the service etc. and then he never > showed up for some reason. So we packed up all our shit and went home with a > paycheck anyway> > > Hey Paz, > I have a gig next Saturday at West 24th, in Georgetown, which is owned by > Mary Matlan / James Carville, well-known political operatives. She's the > conservative pundit who will have a role in the Bush administration, and is > featured on the CNN show Crossfire. Carville is of course Clinton's former > Campaign Manager. Don't know if Carville will be there, cause it's an > Inaugural Ball, aptly named the Alternative Ball, for incoming White House > staffers, campaign workers, and some Republican Congressman. They hired a > funk band, and want us to really cut loose. Unlike typical Inaugural events, > which are notoriously stuffy, this one should be rather raucous. > Being the diehard liberal, I'm torn but curious, and after all, $$ is > bipartisan. > I don't know whether dubya will post, but it can't be ruled out, wouldn't > that be something? > Wonder whether he'll have a brewski? > > I'll report back. > > Dave Fairall ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:29:33 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: List Members On the Road, (NJC) WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! I wanna be there. I can't stand it when there are JMDL gatherings and I am not there. I hope you guys have a wonderful time tonight jamming with the Mixons and Marcel the Terrible (ten bucks sez he has his Michael Paz mask on). He wants to be me when he grows up. Turn the web cam on you guys so we can watch. Love Paz p.s. We want a full report on the Taylor Ham!!!!! NP-Jolie Louise-Daniel Lanois on 1/12/01 4:16 AM, MGVal@aol.com at MGVal@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 01/11/2001 4:03:58 PM Pacific Standard Time, > RoseMJoy@aol.com writes: > > << Oh I wish I could have had more advance notice. I would have loved to have > joined you guys! Nikki who usually joins me in these outings is on her way > to > sunny California right now. >> > > Can we amend that to rainy California? After 3 or 4 missed phone calls, I > successfully retrieved the traveling Nikki from the Sacramento Airport. Once > she "showed me the ham," I let her in the car and brought her home. > > I shall eschew my usual morning romp with the vacuum cleaner in honor of my > houseguest who is sleeping peacefully on my 11 year old's bottom bunk amongst > 3 dozen stuffed animals and serenaded by nonstop 'Ny'Synch. > > Meeting and hosting list members is a really special treat. They feel like > family, (and yet never seem to have the same: "you slashed my Davey Jones > poster" issues that can crop up in blood family), and are just a delight to > be around. > > MG - gearing up to write out a nice to-do list for Nikki. (shhh!) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:38:42 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: practical magic Diane Evans wrote: > Aside from the music, the movie stars Sandra Bullock and -- omigosh, can't > remember her name, but she's married to Tom Cruise. It's about present day > witches (sisters) who suffer the torments of love, with a special family > curse to deal with. Light humor, light plot, light twist. Couple of great > scenes. Likeable film, but not remarkable. > > Diane > > and Martin in London asked: > >Does anyone know anything about this movie. What song/s did Joni sing? The other actress is Nicole Kidman. Very enjoyable movie. There's one dancing scene that's especially funny. And from what I recall, not having seen the movie in a long time, the only Joni song is "a case of you" on the car radio with Nicole's character driving and singing along poorly. Touching and funny too. Debra Shea NP: Chocolat soundtrack still, "The Story of Grandmere". Very lively, something's gonna happen music, with violins and lots of breathy South American flutes. I love that sound. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:39:35 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Willie Cover on 1/12/01 9:38 AM, SCJoniGuy@aol.com at SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: > I had the pleasure of singing "Amelia" with Paz on guitar at Jonifest 2000 > and although I am straight, I left the lyrics as Joni wrote them, and that > one pretty much works as a 'man-to-man' song. Of course Bob failed to mention that are stage name is Butch and Butcher. And what a fine job he did of singing that one too. Am sitting hre with dad beside me at the puter reading email, thinking about the west coast parties, and we just finsihed checking out some of the pics of jonifests. Life is pretty damn good (cept for this f-ing toothache) Cheers jmdl land. Paz NP-You'll Be Satisfied-the subdudes ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:52:07 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Chocolat dsk wrote: > NP: Chocolat soundtrack still, "The Story of Grandmere". Very lively, > something's gonna happen music, with violins and lots of breathy South American > flutes. I love that sound. Correction to my NP.... that lively music is "Vianne sets up shop." Has anyone else seen Chocolat yet? Has it opened throughout the country or is it just here in NY? Am I the only one completely smitten by this movie? Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:51:19 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Joni on egreetings Keep those cards and letters coming. This was cool. Paz NP-I've Got You Under My Skin-Diana Krall on 1/12/01 3:56 PM, Rosemjoy@aol.com at Rosemjoy@aol.com wrote: > Rosemjoy@aol.com has sent you an Egreetings.com(r) flash animation! > > To view your card, simply click the following Web address > any time over the next three weeks: > > http://www.egreetings.com/v/fhwMwJ54sP > > > > > If you need further help, visit our Help pages at > http://www.egreetings.com/pg/help > > ---------------- > E-greetings is a registered trademark and Egreetings is a trademark of > Egreetings Network, Inc. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:56:49 EST From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Politics and religion (NJC) Return-path: From: SMEBD@aol.com Full-name: SME BD Message-ID: <12.75fd4e6.279252fd@aol.com> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:55:25 EST Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) To: Siresorrow@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Disposition: Inline X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 149 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain In a message dated 1/13/01 5:48:37 AM Eastern Standard Time, Siresorrow writes: > < used the example i did. to put in perspective for others my experience.>> As I said in my original post, you certainly are entitled to your religious beliefs. And likewise, Clark. What I found offensive, telling, and frightening, about your bringing homosexuality into the discussion is just the fact that you felt compelled to do so. Many, not all, conservatives tend to use homosexuality as the benchmark for evil, depravity, and immorality. With many conservatives, anything they don't like gets compared to homosexuality. Why is it that conservatives believe that homosexuality is the argument to rally behind? I judge George W. Bush because of his beliefs. He is pro-life. I am pro-choice. He believes in the death penalty. I don't. His choice for Attorney General leaves questions in the minds of many--me included--who believe he will not stand up for civil rights. <> I reject Bush because of his beliefs. Not because he is heterosexual. Why reject or judge me because I am gay? What is it about homosexuality that is so threatening? We don't recruit. In fact, we are generally raised by straight parents. :-) <> I'd more than welcome the opportunity. <> I mean no disrespect by this, but the gay Episcopalian, or gay Jew, or gay Muslim, or gay whatever religious type, holds no interest for me. You are certainly entitled to your beliefs and I will defend your right. It is wonderful that you found something/someone who has brought meaning into your life. What I don't understand about many conservatives/religious types (and I am not saying that all conservatives are religious, nor am I saying that you fall into this category) is the fact that they want to impose their beliefs on others. They tend to want to limit the freedom of others (the abortion issue, for example). Liberals tend to want to open up choices for all. And you never hear of a liberal who insists that a woman have an abortion. Yet the right wants to tell her not to. Where is the respect for the view of the left? Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:04:25 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) on 1/12/01 6:20 PM, Randy Remote at guitarzan@saber.net wrote: > He was known as the 'teflon president' because > nothing could stick to him dispite well documented criminal > activity such as the October surprise and the Iran Contra > guns-for-drugs situation. and CIA man George Bush (daddy) was up to his ass in this one along with Ollie and the gang. Word in Honduras was that they brought a ton of the shit thru there on it's way to the US. Alot of it made it's way into the noses of many folks in Honduras as well. And the money went to fund that groovy little war against the Sandinistas. As it turns out they may not have been the worse for better. Paz(I've been sucked in1) NP-When You Hold Me Tight-John Hiatt ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:05:15 EST From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) In a message dated 1/13/01 6:02:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, Siresorrow@aol.com writes: > 2. i want to see the facts that determine that my faith expression is > belief > and my sexuality is not. i'd like to see that explained. > Hi Patrick, I'm going to jump in here. If faith is instinctual, how do you explain converts? Faith is influenced by facts, by experiences--the fact that man has the capacity to question is what bares out that faith or belief is a choice. This is how one's beliefs can, and do, change over time. Haven't some of your beliefs (even in faith) changed in the course of your lifetime? I know mine have. Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:20:49 -0600 From: "Dave and Beth Fairall" Subject: RE: The Party (NJC) Paz, Being from, or residing in N'Awlins, I'll bet you know Eric Struthers, former Neville Bros. guitarist? He and I were buds in college, and played together on and off for years. He's in Nashville now, and I'm in Baltimore. But anyway, went to JazzFest a couple of years ago, and I was really impressed with the quality of the local bands there. Best times were had late late night at the Maple Leaf and Howlin WolF... waayy post Jazz Fest, super jams. In particular, I really dug a band called Smilin Myron, great live, but their CD doesn't knock me out. The non-stop partying might have had something to do w/ it too. Wonder whether Joni will ever make another appearance at the Fest, heard she had a tough time w/ her new axe last trip. Thanks, Dave Fairall ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:53:13 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: The Party (NJC) on 1/13/01 6:20 PM, Dave and Beth Fairall at davebeth@bellatlantic.net wrote: > Paz, > Being from, or residing in N'Awlins, I'll bet you know Eric Struthers, > former Neville Bros. guitarist? He and I were buds in college, and played > together on and off for years. He's in Nashville now, and I'm in Baltimore. > But anyway, went to JazzFest a couple of years ago, and I was really > impressed with the quality of the local bands there. Best times were had > late late night at the Maple Leaf and Howlin WolF... waayy post Jazz Fest, > super jams. In particular, I really dug a band called Smilin Myron, great > live, but their CD doesn't knock me out. > The non-stop partying might have had something to do w/ it too. > Wonder whether Joni will ever make another appearance at the Fest, heard she > had a tough time w/ her new axe last trip. > > Thanks, > Dave Fairall > Eric Struthers is a very good friend. We did alot of gigs together with the Brothers. Haven't seen him since he moved back to Nashvegas though. We are very blessed to have some amazing musicians of all types in New Orleans. You should make another trip in soon. Joni's performance here was her first with the VG-8 and it was a little rough for her (and Gary the programmer from Roland at the time). The audience didn't get it and were also pissed she wasn't playing her flower child songs. A crowd of about 30,000 quickly turned into 5,000 (which was find with me, we could see and hear better). Paz ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:04:12 -0600 From: "Gerald" Subject: Miss Paved Paradise Hello all! I've taken Michael Paz's suggestion and uploaded my mp3 file, Miss Paved Paradise, to the Joni Mitchell Fans egroups site. Didn't know I could do that before Michael suggested it. I created Miss Paved Paradise one Sunday afternoon when I decided to check out one of the programs that came with my sound card - a program called, Mixman Studio. I was experimenting with the program, and had thoroughly amused myself by the end of the afternoon. The voice is my own voice in altered pitches. There was nothing preconceived, and I never thought I'd be saving work, let alone uploading it to the net. Hopefully, you'll be amused. Gerald Hillman PS: "It has a good beat, and you can dance to it." ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:09:49 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) The Reagans and Astrology from: http://www.parascope.com/articles/0497/reagan02.htm Fear for Ron's life leads her to Joan Quigley Ronald and Nancy Reagan have a long history of involvement with astrologers and psychics. As movie stars in 1950s Hollywood, they were close friends with celebrity astrologer Carroll Righter, and became a fixture at his glamourous monthly "zodiac parties." Nancy's friend Merv Griffin told her about an astrologer he'd had on his talk show named Joan Quigley. For the first happy months after the landslide election, Nancy apparently had little or no contact with Quigley. But all that changed on March 30, 1981. John Hinckley, Jr.'s assassination attempt nearly drew the curtains on the Reagan presidency. "After March 30, 1981, I wasn't about to take any chances," Nancy wrote in her memoirs. Donald Regan would eventually blow Quigley's cover. After being fired from his chief of staff post, Regan lashed back with a tell-all memoir, which revealed -- among other things -- the truth about Nancy's astrologer. Months later Nancy made her only extensive public statement on the Quigley affair, in the pages of [her memiors] My Turn. "While I was never certain that Joan's astrological advice was helping to protect Ronnie, the fact is that nothing like March 30 ever happened again," Nancy wrote, thoroughly hedging her bets. "Was astrology one of those reasons? I don't really believe it was, but I don't really believe it wasn't. But I know this: It didn't hurt, and I'm not sorry I did it." In response to the critics who decried Quigley's advice as an atrocity and branded the First Lady a superstitious laughing-stock, Nancy offered the following rebuttal: "It didn't seem to matter that nothing other than Ronnie's schedule was affected by astrology. Or that tens of millions of Americans really believed in astrology. Or that almost every newspaper that ridiculed me for taking astrology seriously also featured a daily horoscope column." Quigley wrote a book in 1990: What Does Joan Say?: My Seven Years As White House Astrologer To Nancy And Ronald Reagan Her homepage says: "Joan Quigley, presidential astrologer" and "Everything in the cosmos is interrelated. That's why astrology works" http://www.joanquigley.net/flashindex.html Reagan, the Apocalypse, and Fundamentalism from: http://www.surfingtheapocalypse.com/apocult.html "We don't have to protect the environment, The Second Coming is at hand." - -James Watt, Interior Secretary under President Ronald W. Reagan from: http://www.csicop.org/si/9901/apocalypse.html Even President Ronald Reagan was quoted as saying in the 1980s: "You know, I turn back to your ancient prophets in the Old Testament and the signs foretelling Armageddon, and I find myself considering if we're the generation that is going to see that come about. I don't know if you noted any of those prophecies lately but, believe me, they certainly describe the times we're going through." from: http://www.fountain.btinternet.co.uk/koresh/apoc.html According to Lindsey in [the 25 million selling book] The Late Great Planet Earth, the Bible prophesies a nuclear war in the Middle-East caused by a military alliance between Soviet Russia, Iran and Africa. This is taken from a text in Ezekiel 38:2 which refers to "Magog", "Rosh", "Mesech" and "Tupal" (it is argued that Magog and Rosh are tribal ancestors of the modern Russian people, Mesech=Moscow, Tupal=Tobolsk etc). Reagans Legal Secretary said Reagan had read and repeatedly discussed The Late Great Planet Earth while Governor of California (p.182). Reagan himself said "these prophecies certainly describe the times we are going through" (p.182). Reagans Secretary of the Interior, James Watt, said "I dont know how many future generations we can count on until the Lord returns" (p.182), Reagans Secretary of Defence Casper Weinberger said "I have read the Book of Revelation and, yes, I believe the world is going to end - -by an act of God, I hope - but every day I think that time is running out" (p.273). from: http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/f/fitzgerald-blue.html Though some associated him only with Hollywood, Reagan was in fact supremely well equipped to preach this national revival. His mother, Nelle, became a convert to born-again Christianity at the turn of the century, and until he left college he was thoroughly immersed in his mother's evangelical church. In all the levity about Star Wars that followed a speech he gave on March 8, 1983, when he called the Soviet Union the "evil empire," it was generally forgotten that Reagan was talking to the National Association of Evangelicals, and that, as the clergymen understood him, he was speaking about evil. This was not the first time he had applied the word to the Soviet Union. In a speech at West Point in May 1981, for example, he had referred to the assembled cadets as a "chain holding back an evil force." Yet the phrase "evil empire" had a much more precise theological significance. To conservative evangelicals, such as those in his audience, the phrase would trip-wire the whole eschatology of Armageddon. According to fundamentalist doctrine, derived from the Book of Ezekiel, the Book of Revelations and other sources, the evil empire will appear in the end-times under the leadership of the Anti-Christ; after a seven-year period of tribulations, Christ and his saints will fight the evil empire and confederated nations in a great battle on the field of Armageddon in Israel, and their victory will usher in the thousand-year reign of Christ on earth. The evangelical clergymen would not have been surprised that Reagan identified the Soviet Union as that empire, for ever since the Bolshevik revolution, fundamentalists had identified Russia as the Biblical "Ros," where the Beast would appear. from Reagan's own homepage a passage from that speech:: http://www.ronaldreagan.com/sp_6.html Yes, let us pray for the salvation of all of those who live in that totalitarian darkness -pray they will discover the joy of knowing God. But until they do, let us be aware that while they preach the supremacy of the state, declare its omnipotence over individual man, and predict its eventual domination of all peoples on the earth, they are the focus of evil in the modern world. [Me]:These were the people with their finger on the button Kakki wrote: > I'm stil not convinced. I've lived in Calif. all my life and heard about > Reagan's doing before he was the Governor and before he was the president. > He was never, ever considered some wacko far right religious fanatic. In > fact, as you probably know, he was a activist Democrat for something like > 30-40 years before he switched to the Republican party. It was always > well-known and well-reported that he was a prominent member of Bel Air > Presbyterian church for decades. Presbyterians are very mainstream and not > fundamentalists, especially in the Bel Air/Hollywood area. If he talked > about the Apolcalypse, so what? I've also had many discussions with people > about the Apolcalypse story, along with Nostradamus, UFOs, ghost stories and > the like. I also read my horoscope if it is in a newspaper or magazine as > do probably most people. It doesn't mean anything. I do recall reading > about Nancy Reagan consulting an astrologer, but I recall the source as one > of the tabloids, like the National Enquirer and possibly a Kitty Kelley > book. As for James Watt, I do recall reading about people being concerned > about him - but if he was such a wacko, why was he allowed to head up the > Interior Dept. for so long? If Reagan was such a wacko, why did he win two > terms in landslides? Because most of the American people were sleeping and > too busy counting their money in the '80s? Yes. Because he had professionals working for him. Because he was an actor playing a part. Because we are gullible. Because we have a narrow range of choices, ie Tweedledee or Tweedledum to choose from. Because most of our leaders come from the same pool of super rich elites. And some of them are crazy! RR > I didn't vote for Reagan, but > thought he was a pretty genial guy and not the caricature that some like to > portary him as now. > Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:18:39 -0500 From: Yael Harlap Subject: politics and our rigidity Kakki wrote, about Reagan and religion: >I'm still not convinced. In some ways I think that is the problem - not with Kakki per se (this is no attack on you, Kakki!) - most of the articulate and vocal people (whether civil or downright rude) about politics and social issues on this list - and I include myself in this philosophical wondering - seem like we are not open or willing to accept information that makes us reconsider our positions. I am taking a stats class right now (I am a doctoral student) and the first day the professor expounded at length on the importance of a theory being falsifiable. If a theory is not falsifiable, then it is not really worth taking the effort to consider, since nothing can ever come of it. If people are not ever willing to consider any information or evidence valid if it contradicts their beliefs/opinions, there really isn't any point having a conversation, is there? To throw out anything that comes from a conservative mouthpiece, without even considering it as a possibility. To scorn anything that comes from a liberal listmember or a left-leaning newspaper. Both of these behaviors are rather ridiculous, if you really get down to it, and I have engaged in that type of behavior myself... and I have seen it on this list *constantly*, more than anywhere else I have ever been (in life or on the 'net). Skepticism is a healthy response - and I'm not sure how to bridge the chasm between skepticism and flexible thinking, but somehow I feel like some of the back and forth... I don't know. I'm going to try to keep my mind more open to the possibilities, I think. - -Yael ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:18:41 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Earthquake in C.A. (NJC) Just got a phone call from my friend Susan in LA, whoc alerted me to earthquake (7.6) in my home land. Apparently it was off the coast of El Salvador out in the Pacific. Just got off the phone with my sister in law who says the family is all ok in San Pedro Sula Honduras (north coast western carribean), but they felt it and said it was pretty scary. Thanks God my dad is here with me and my sister and her family are in Miami tonight. I called up Dr. Heiman to see if he had heard cause International Hospital for Children has been working with some clinics and other organizations in El Salvador and we may be responding to their call for help. My thoughts and prayers go out to those people tonight. Paz NP-Candela-Buena Visat Social Club ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:28:39 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Off to Mary Graces in Davis for the Mini-fest WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! And to think she has a Taylor Ham too. Paz NP-The Chosen-Yellowjackets on 1/13/01 11:30 AM, MDESTE1@aol.com at MDESTE1@aol.com wrote: > Putting the politics very much aside for the trip up to Davis in Northern > California where I understand they still have a little Yamaha generator > providing the town with electriciy (but not taking any chances and bringing a > candle and my acoustic guitar) and looking forward to meeting a small group > of Listers. Im picking up Russ B on the way who I understand has a nice > suprise for those who are there that Im sworn to secrecy not to divulge. If > any of you out there still want to come you need to email MG or go through > the recent digests for the directions Nikki provided. Unfortunately I can > only go there for today since I had an important commitment for Sunday but > thats OK. One day of fun will have to do. Ill post a little synopsis of the > days festivities to share with you all when I get back. marcel deste. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:41:28 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: Miss Paved Paradise on 1/13/01 6:04 PM, Gerald at geraldh@mb.sympatico.ca wrote: > Hello all! > > I've taken Michael Paz's suggestion and uploaded my mp3 file, Miss Paved > Paradise, to the Joni Mitchell Fans egroups site. Didn't know I could do > that before Michael suggested it. > > I created Miss Paved Paradise one Sunday afternoon when I decided to check > out one of the programs that came with my sound card - a program called, > Mixman Studio. I was experimenting with the program, and had thoroughly > amused myself by the end of the afternoon. The voice is my own voice in > altered pitches. There was nothing preconceived, and I never thought I'd be > saving work, let alone uploading it to the net. Hopefully, you'll be amused. > > Gerald Hillman > PS: "It has a good beat, and you can dance to it." ;-) > Hi Gerald- Just got it awhile ago and it's really funny. Thanks for sharing it with us. BTW who the hell is Joni Mitchell anyways. Paz NP-Yes It Is-Beatles ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:40:48 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: politics and our rigidity In a message dated 1/13/01 9:21:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, yharlap@channelsinternet.com writes: << I am taking a stats class right now (I am a doctoral student) and the first day the professor expounded at length on the importance of a theory being falsifiable. If a theory is not falsifiable, then it is not really worth taking the effort to consider, since nothing can ever come of it.>> It seems to me that there is little more distant from politics than statistics. As a professional journalist for more than 20 years, I can tell you that in politics more than any other field, information is only as good as its source. In politics, there are very few things that can be called a "fact," and even those few facts can be put in a false context to make them, like statistics, to appear to mean exactly the opposite of what they really are. <> There is nothing healthier than skepticism as an initial response to anything that challenges your belief system. The problem is not skepticism, but outright dismissal. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:53:46 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Earthquake in C.A. (NJC) We just this second had an earthquake here in L.A. as I was reading your post. Pretty strong one. Kakki, going to turn on the radio ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 22:01:22 -0500 From: Yael Harlap Subject: Re: politics and our rigidity Paul said: >As a professional journalist for more than 20 years, I can tell you that in >politics more than any other field, information is only as good as its >source. In politics, there are very few things that can be called a "fact," >and even those few facts can be put in a false context to make them, like >statistics, to appear to mean exactly the opposite of what they really are. I totally agree with this - I did not intend what I wrote to come off as naively sing-songing that we should believe everything anyone says. There is virtually no such thing as a hard "fact" as far as I am concerned. And it is important to be a skeptic, but, as Paul said, the problem comes in when people dismiss information without evaluating it. - -Yael ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 00:36:21 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: mary grace has a party (NJC) rumor has it that the party at mg's is kicking up major earthquakes all along those awful faults folks have on the west coast!!!! beware! mary grace, for god's sake, don't shimmy!!!! nikki, take it easy, girl... people need their cities!!!!! is russ B there? i have a message for him, but i'll tell him personally before the year is through. i have the white t-shirt on, though... i command you all to make me green with envy and foam at the mouth. marcel, sing cactus tree!!!!!!!! i should be there. i should've been there two years ago, in fact, but he west coast doesn't seem to want me. god bless taylor ham!! love, wally K ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 00:42:35 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: miss paved paradise and bob muller hi gerald, how can one access this site????? i'd love to hear the song. and how does one upload the files? it would be a great way to get material for bob muller's covers projects without the hassles of snail-mailing! love, wally - ----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de Gerald Enviado el: S?bado, 13 de Enero de 2001 11:04 p.m. Para: Joni Asunto: Miss Paved Paradise Hello all! I've taken Michael Paz's suggestion and uploaded my mp3 file, Miss Paved Paradise, to the Joni Mitchell Fans egroups site. Didn't know I could do that before Michael suggested it. I created Miss Paved Paradise one Sunday afternoon when I decided to check out one of the programs that came with my sound card - a program called, Mixman Studio. I was experimenting with the program, and had thoroughly amused myself by the end of the afternoon. The voice is my own voice in altered pitches. There was nothing preconceived, and I never thought I'd be saving work, let alone uploading it to the net. Hopefully, you'll be amused. Gerald Hillman PS: "It has a good beat, and you can dance to it." ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 00:52:58 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: do they have telephones in davis? (NJC) what's mary grace's phone number? area codes, please? wallyK ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #21 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?