From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2001 #20 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Saturday, January 13 2001 Volume 2001 : Number 020 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Posts of the Day (NJC) ["Kakki" ] Re: Joni's Presidential Performance ? now njc ["Kakki" ] Re: Ken Burns' Jazz (NJC) [Steven Barton ] Re: Stood up at the Fez/Mingus band NJC ["Kakki" ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) ["Kakki" ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [Siresorrow@aol.com] january 13!!!!!! (NJC) ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [Siresorrow@aol.com] inauguration protest info (nyc) ["Deb Messling" ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [catman ] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [catman ] Mother's day -- now cats NJC ["Greer, Ron" ] Re: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) [claud9ine ] Random thoughts on Magic/Religion & Politics [SJC] ["Greer, Ron" ] RE:Jungle Line Problem ["Blair Fraipont" ] Re: Random thoughts on Magic/Religion & Politics NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: inauguration protest info (njc) [Jerry Notaro ] Jonatha's "Steady Pull" NJC ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] Re: Peter Green & a Cat Story NJC [catman ] Re: HOSL [RK1THXguy@aol.com] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [Murphycopy@aol.com] Re: Politics and religion (NJC) [catman ] Off to Mary Graces in Davis for the Mini-fest [MDESTE1@aol.com] magical thinking NJC [CarltonCT@aol.com] new baby NJC [catman ] practical magic ["Martin Giles" ] Re: HOSL [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: harvey head - njc [Michael Paz ] RE: practical magic ["Eric Wilcox" ] [Fwd: [Fwd: - Humor]] [Vince Lavieri ] Re: John McVie (NJC) [Michael Paz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 00:41:42 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Posts of the Day (NJC) What great reading today! Absolutely the funniest and biggest LOL: Kelly for the cat in the dryer. I read this one holding my breath almost to hyperventilation and am so glad that the cat came out simply extra "fluffy!" Absolutely the most beautiful: Victor and Kate B. on magic and love and spirituality and more. Thank you - you said it all for me. It was a joy to read you all. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 00:53:55 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Joni's Presidential Performance ? now njc Evian wrote: > Unlike those crazy Americans Mick Fleetwood, John McVie, and Christine > McVie ;) Seriously, I don't think we HAVE any kind of big hooha when there is a > new Prime Minister -- or at least, one that gets any attention, or any > "big name" people. Sadly, we don't seem to pay any attention to our > "Stars" until they go south. Based on some of the old TV clips of Joni it seemed like she was rather circumspect regarding U.S. politics in the early days. I recall she made a comment on the Dick Cavett show seeming to sort of distance herself (in a respectful way) from the political controversies of the time such as Vietnam, in part because she was, first, a Canadian, and she seemed reticent to expound on U.S. issues at that time. Yet in that same show, she performed Fiddle and the Drum, an anti-war anthem. I can't recall Joni ever performing for a U.S. president, but she did participate in the McGovern (who ran on a primarily anti-war platform) campaign in '72. My feeling is that although she is Canadian first and always, she is also quite revered in the U.S., too, and I think that the U.S. considers her as much a national treasure as do her native Canadians. On another note, I think the synchronicity of you considering the name Kelly Dale for a baby daughter to be a kinda "whoa" moment but not creepy! Go for it! And you got me going with "Hypnotized," Evian - one of my all time favorite songs - sigh.... ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:26:16 +0100 From: "Marian" Subject: Re: Jungle Line TanyerSCO@aol.com wrote: >You know, I've been a Joni fan since college, about > 7 years now....But I've never been able to get into > HOSL and I can't figure out why...I think it's > because of Jungle Line. I just can't make it > through Jungle Line. I was a Joni fan for 30 years and I'm ashamed to say that I only "got" The Jungle Line at Ashara's 1998 Boston Jonifest. It helped that I was outside and it came over the big sound system that Chuck E had set up on the back porch. My reaction was "Wow! - What a great song!" Maybe you need a new sound system! ;^D But seriously, you should at least check out the poetry. It's some of her best. Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:23:22 -0800 From: Steven Barton Subject: Re: Ken Burns' Jazz (NJC) Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: > > Who's criticizing him? I'm with you! I wish he had been my music teacher > in middle school. Wow! If I had had Wynton teaching flutophone lessons, I > would never have been a computer nerd. >From one of the CSN lists: Craig wrote: I'll check it out, but am very leery of the film's "executive consultant", Messr. Marsalis. Today's Daily Herald, a north suburban Chicago newspaper had an interesting take on Marsalis: ...At best Burns makes a dubious decision to emphasize art and entertainment equally. Thus, a Louis Armstrong, who was both, is exalted over an equally brilliant but thornier, more difficult and less compromising artist like Charlie Parker. ...Likewise, the choice of Wynton Marsalis as the key expert on the music limits the documentary's scope, especially later on. Understand, Marsalis is a likeable presence, and he certainly knows his stuff, but in defining jazz he makes a disconcerting choice of words in Monday's debut: "It's an art form that can give us a painless way of understanding ourselves." Why painless? Not to turn jazz into sadomasochism, but I'd say the utter absence of pain is what makes much of Marsalis' music mere academic exercises, which is what is aggravating when he is granted top billing in that final episode over more impassioned players like Murray or Carter. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:27:54 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Stood up at the Fez/Mingus band NJC Synchronicity - I just got an email tonight from an old friend who was in Manhattan a week ago who said she saw the Mingus band and met Sue Mingus. She said that Sue apparently is often around with the band. I wonder if she was at the Fez Thursday night. My friend said that Sue told her she is still in contact with Joni, too. Kakki, in L.A. where the weather is just about as cold as Manhatten these days! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:32:54 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Politics and religion (long) (NJC) > We should quit blaming God for what we do. We should quit blaming God for what > humans do. Blaming God is the ultimate irresponsibility... practiced by people > of faith and people who question faith and people who mock faith. > Exactly right. As far as I am aware. no one was doing this in this thread tho I am aware people do this all the time. We, as human beings, are responsible for the this world. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:37:18 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: NJC Joni and the Church I satnd corrected then. I was under the impression that the beliefs I wrote about were common to all Xtians. I thought that the was basis of the faith. I certainly know that the Xtians I know would not consider people Xtian if they did not believe that Jesus died as payment for our sins, a payment demanded by God. I have to say I have not come across Xtians before who do not believe this. (except, as I said, JW's). So Xtian is a much looser term than I knew. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:44:18 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) I'm stil not convinced. I've lived in Calif. all my life and heard about Reagan's doing before he was the Governor and before he was the president. He was never, ever considered some wacko far right religious fanatic. In fact, as you probably know, he was a activist Democrat for something like 30-40 years before he switched to the Republican party. It was always well-known and well-reported that he was a prominent member of Bel Air Presbyterian church for decades. Presbyterians are very mainstream and not fundamentalists, especially in the Bel Air/Hollywood area. If he talked about the Apolcalypse, so what? I've also had many discussions with people about the Apolcalypse story, along with Nostradamus, UFOs, ghost stories and the like. I also read my horoscope if it is in a newspaper or magazine as do probably most people. It doesn't mean anything. I do recall reading about Nancy Reagan consulting an astrologer, but I recall the source as one of the tabloids, like the National Enquirer and possibly a Kitty Kelley book. As for James Watt, I do recall reading about people being concerned about him - but if he was such a wacko, why was he allowed to head up the Interior Dept. for so long? If Reagan was such a wacko, why did he win two terms in landslides? Because most of the American people were sleeping and too busy counting their money in the '80s? I didn't vote for Reagan, but thought he was a pretty genial guy and not the caricature that some like to portary him as now. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 05:39:16 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) In a message dated 1/12/01 7:28:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk writes: << As for beliefs being a choice. They are. It isn't an opinion it is a fact. >> 1. i'm not antagonized. i love you and you know that. 2. i want to see the facts that determine that my faith expression is belief and my sexuality is not. i'd like to see that explained. my whole premise on this issue is that you or anyone else can not know the secrets of my heart. and i'm so surprised about this. you tell me that your sexuality is the way you are and how you are born. and i believe you. totally. don't question it. admire you for your self understanding and your honesty. but i tell you that my faith is the way i am and how i was born, and you tell me it's not. it's belief. it's ....whatever. and i see a huge inconsistancy in that. you don't know my world. you don't know what goes on when i see the moon in the early hours or when i feel the salt breeze come across the marsh when the sky is black and the trees lurk in the shadows of life. or when i see the broken heart of a human. or someone frightend or lost. or the smile of child. these things lead me to worship. to call to the creator and say life is good. and that is my faith. when my heart speaks back to the one who knows me. and that happens all by itself. it just does it. i can't stop it. and it's always been that way. and it always will. it is who i am. it's how i was born. why must you tell me it's anything less. especially when i don't do the same to you. patrick np. fishpump ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 07:40:53 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) who doesn't love her? who isn't mesmerized by her musicianship and her intensity? she surfaces and sings for us and then she leaves us to wonder. HAPPY BIRTHDAY CLAUDIA!!!!!!!! sing for us for ever wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 05:48:37 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) In a message dated 1/13/01 12:10:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, SME BD writes: << but the implication that you made about homosexuals is both offensive and telling. >> to be judged for my faith is both offensive and telling. this is why i used the example i did. to put in perspective for others my experience. funny thing though....it's ok to do it george bush. but god damn, don't do to the gay men. that's sacralige. i wish we would be able to get to know each other stephen. i think we'd both be surprised by a lot of things. did you ever find that book i suggested to you specifically last year by bruce bauwer, the gay episcopalian i'm so fond of? his one book has altered my life. he understands me. and i him. and nothing is offensive or telling in our understanding of each other. patrick np. heat pump and fish pump ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 06:39:28 -0500 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: inauguration protest info (nyc) Thanks for the many emails of support about the Washington march. For those who said you wish you could be there, be aware that there will be LOCAL marches around the country on January 20 - not all the action in is Washington. For info on local organzing, try the following sites: http://www.geocities.com/countercoup/local.htm http://www.votermarch.org/local.htm The rest of you, watch C-SPAN on the 20th! My husband will have an RIP Democracy sign and I will have a sign saying Hi, JMDL! (not really but maybe I should) - ----------------------------------- Deb Messling "I like cats. They give the home a heartbeat." ~Joni Mitchell - ----------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:39:33 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) Siresorrow@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 1/12/01 7:28:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, > colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk writes: > > << As for beliefs being a choice. They are. It isn't an opinion it is a fact. > >> > > 1. i'm not antagonized. i love you and you know that. > > 2. i want to see the facts that determine that my faith expression is belief > and my sexuality is not. i'd like to see that explained. I have explained and you have chosen to interpret what i wrote as belittling your faith. You cannot compare your beliefs with homosexuailty and I find it disturbing that you do. Like many people, you find the idea that your beliefs are choseny by you to be frightening and unacceptable. But it is the way things are. To say you were born with your faith is abdicating your responsibility for your what you believe. I do believe you were born as a spirit in a physical body. You are aware of that. But we not born with consiou knowledge of this which leads to faith. For as long as I can remember I did not believe in death, that physical death was the end. I still believe that. I also hvae my own beliefs about the whys and wherefores and the implications of this. However, I also accpet that I may be wrong in my understanding. I use the best thinking i can come up with today to formulate what i find acceptable to my conscience and what i don't. So do you. For this I am repsonsible and I believe you are too, even if you don't. The inplication of what you say about your faith is that YOU are right and therefotre that seems no different to the others who insist they are right. That feeling you have(I know the feeling you write of) that you are a part of God, that God touches you is real. I do not doubt that. BUT our belief system surrounding that feeling is just that-how we have interpreted that feeling. If you had been brought up within a diffrent culture or time, you would interpret it differently, because your experience and meaning structures would be different. Take what we call time-past, present, and future. we know there was a yesterday, a today and a tomorrow, just as we know we live and breathe. yet time is a function of our brian, the way our brain makes sense of our world. Past present and future is not separate but all now. A concept not understandable by a brian stuck in linear time. Also we as humans all live in different worlds. None of us sees the world in the same way as we all have different experience and we all creat meaning and interpret our experience differently. hence the conflict we suffer. If we understood that p[eople who think differently and see things diffferently are not necessarily bad, we would be on our way to changing things. If we understood that 'bad' people are the way they are because of fear and ignorance we might better be able to change them by edcuation and love(the anidote to fear is love). It is people's fear of homosexuality(since you mentioned it) is what causes the conflict. Homosexuality is as natural as having red hair or being left handed. However, people fear it because people fear that which is different and what they do not understand. Some say they are repulsed by it. yet they do not stop to consider that we may find heteroseaul sex repulsive! There is no difference betwen homosexaul love and heterosexual love. Both can be very powerful and fulfilling. People who insist they are not homophobic yet believe homsosexuality is wrong are full of self deciet. Equally so those who say it is wrong because of their religious belief, but they are just not accepting responsibilty for their own bigtry and are just apssing the buck. In the long run, we are all accountable for our beliefs and our actions. NOTHING goes unrewarded. Ther can be no cause without an effect. To think otherwise is foolish. I believe that is a natural law. I do not believe God punishes anybody, least of all for their sins. No, we are punished BY our sins. A good example to explain this: a Jewish woman came to see me. She was greatly distressed. She hadn't seen her daughter for many years and wanted my help to reunite with her. Howver, the reason the woman didn't see her daughter was because her daughter had married a black non jew and had therefore been banished from the family. The mother expected the dsaughter to come back to family without her children and her husband. This womans suffering was her punishment for her sin. God doesn't need to punish us! Much of our sins(erros) are intentional and the result of ignorance. This does not stop the results. Cause and effect. always. No escaping that. I believe when we are released from the physical world, we carry on as we are. We will find ourselves in the surroundings we are fitted for. If those surroundings are unpleasant and dark, it is because this is where our spiritual development has got us. We can change that by changing oursleves, by reaching out toward the light. Or we can stay there, blaming everyone else, turning our backs to the light. The choice is always ours. I am sure you have come across people that are miserable and cannot be helped because they refuse to change. Basically if you are a misrable old sod before death, you will be the same after death, regardless of how many times you wnet to church or what you profess to believe! It is our TRUE natures that dictates our lot, not what we give lip service to. To a lesser extent, the life we lead here is also according to our beiefs and nature. If we think the world is an evil place, full of suffering and evil scary people, we won't see the glory in it. If we believe the opposite to the exclusion of the dark side, we will be foolish and at great risk and also we will be 'sinful' because we will allow this darkness to continue because we refuse to see it! Tuirning a blind eye is a mistake. The difference between a perosn who awakes to face the day with dread and the one awakes to face the day with hope is one of belief. It is really that simple. Sermon over ;-) take care colin > > > my whole premise on this issue is that you or anyone else can not know the > secrets of my heart. and i'm so surprised about this. you tell me that your > sexuality is the way you are and how you are born. and i believe you. > totally. don't question it. admire you for your self understanding and your > honesty. > > but i tell you that my faith is the way i am and how i was born, and you tell > me it's not. it's belief. it's ....whatever. > > and i see a huge inconsistancy in that. you don't know my world. you don't > know what goes on when i see the moon in the early hours or when i feel the > salt breeze come across the marsh when the sky is black and the trees lurk in > the shadows of life. or when i see the broken heart of a human. or someone > frightend or lost. or the smile of child. > > these things lead me to worship. to call to the creator and say life is > good. and that is my faith. when my heart speaks back to the one who knows > me. and that happens all by itself. it just does it. i can't stop it. and > it's always been that way. and it always will. it is who i am. it's how i > was born. > > why must you tell me it's anything less. especially when i don't do the same > to you. > > patrick > np. fishpump - -- bw colin colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:47:25 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) > Much of our sins(erros) are intentional and the result of ignorance. oops-the correct owrd was UNintentional ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:30:41 +0200 From: "Greer, Ron" Subject: Mother's day -- now cats NJC >Evian wrote >everywhere, and my wife comes into the bathroom and bellows "OMG, she >looks like she's a victim of some oil spill!" And this is what she >looked like EXACTLY! I mean, the poor thing looked like something you a couple of years back, i was draining oil out of my motorbike. when i finished, i left the (open topped) oil drum on the work bench in the garage & went inside for supper. predictably, around 15 minutes later, there was a huge crash, followed by an almighty yowling, screaming noise. quite predictably, one of my cats (6 at that stage ) had jumped up onto the bench, found an unexpected obstacle, hooked his claws over the edge, and flipped the entire drum of oil over himself. (and the garage floor - which concerned my dad more) hand washing a oil drenched, panicked, extremely tough, and combat experienced, tomcat ranks as on of my lifes least pleasant experiences....... ron ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 08:28:53 -0500 From: claud9ine Subject: Re: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) Dear Sweet Wally... You brought such a tremendously big smile to my face with your message this morning .... my immediate response -- I wished I could give you a big hug... how about at least a cyber HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUG ;-) Smiling this morning, by the way, was a bit of a challenge as I partied way too long last night and feel slightly hung over. Old age and wisdom do not necessarily go hand in hand ;-) Thank you again for your thoughtfulness and for making my checking the list (which I faithfully do several times a day) such a special surprise. Even though I am not a big poster (uuh that sounds funny) I am a diehard reader. A BIG HELLO to all my other friends as well ... I miss you all... when can we be together again? Last night I talked with friends about NO and Ashara's Fest and had everyone wrapped up with my enthusiasm and love for Joni and all the wonderful people I have met through the list. If it is meant to be, I will sing WITH YOU and for you again!!!!! Just name the time and the place ;-) big hugs!!!!! claud > From: "Wally Kairuz" > Reply-To: "Wally Kairuz" > Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 07:40:53 -0300 > To: , "Claudsansoucie@Hotmail. Com" > Subject: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) > > who doesn't love her? > who isn't mesmerized by her musicianship and her intensity? > > she surfaces and sings for us and then she leaves us to wonder. > > HAPPY BIRTHDAY CLAUDIA!!!!!!!! > > sing for us > for ever > > wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:06:05 +0200 From: "Greer, Ron" Subject: Random thoughts on Magic/Religion & Politics [SJC] hi >kate bennet wrote >I love & am inspired by many of Jesus's teachings, as well as Buddha, Lao >Tsu, & many others. > >I have no respect for any belief that says it is the only way or tries to >reform others. I get really uncomfortable listening to preachers or >ministers or new age spiritual teachers who exude an attitude as if they >have some special connection with god or knowledge which they are imparting >to those who they presume to be, what, less connected or knowledgeable? My can i disagree here, without being offensive? im not too sure here how you could possibly love/be inspired by jesus teachings, when the basic cornerstone of those teachings were that he is/was the *only* way to god - a point he repeatedly emphasised. it is not an easy teaching to accept, or understand, and one which i still have major trouble grasping. unfortunately all too many *christians* ( i consider myself a backslider - not a christian, 'cause i dont live the life anymore) seem to have absolutely no problem with grabbing this point, and with absolutely no grasp of the implications, use it to abuse and insult other people, without any of the compassion, love or pain with which jesus said it. i do not get his stand on the point as being a cold, heartless way of saying that everyone else is wrong, and deserves no love, respect, or compassion, but as a love inspired, heartfelt & compassionate plea/statement/presentation of an unpleasant, but unalterable truth. joni (of course) got this vital distinction between christians and christ right on the nail in the magdalene laundries These bloodless brides of Jesus, If they had just once glimpsed their groom, Then they'd know, and they'd drop the stones Concealed behind their rosaries. They wilt the grass they walk upon. They leech the light out of a room. They'd like to drive us down the drain At the Magdalene laundries. substitute "magdalene laundries" with pretty much any churches name - it still works, unfortunately. the bible also did a pretty good job - says that gods name is mocked among the non-believers, because of the "believers" on the subject of religion and politics. i find it absolutely impossible to believe that *any* person can possibly have christian beliefs and be successful in the dirty business of politics. i have to conclude that it is only a show to get votes - but not personally knowing the people - i suppose ill never know for sure. ron np - emmylou harris - tragedy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:20:10 +0200 From: "Greer, Ron" Subject: Joni Inspired Book?? hi sorry if this came up before. i was at the library this morning, looking for books. i noticed a book with the title "coyote" and idly wondered whether it had anything at all to do with jonis song - a long shot, but i checked anyway. sure enough - the book was a love story about a character nicknamed "coyote" after the joni song. started reading it - a promising start, with a nicely ironic description of one of the characters wrecking her car when the song came on the radio, then bemoaning the fact that the owner of the other car didnt get the irony ; ) from there it seems to have just gone downhill into trendy romance slush - i somehow dont think im going to get much further. there have been a couple of other references to joni, but none with the promise of the opening scene. unfortunately, with all the excitement of finally getting hold of emmylou's "red dirt girl" (wonderful!!! all the beauty of "wrecking ball" but with more emmylou & less danial lanois. and it is about time she did some songwriting - anyone who could be - even partly - responsible for boulder to birmingham has to have some serious songwriting talent!!) i forgot the authors name. ron np - emmylou harris - bang the drum slowly ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:04:46 -0500 From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: RE:Jungle Line Problem Yes, i have had a similar experience.. For example with Court and Spark, i used to skip right over Down to You and Just like this Train.. i DONt know why,, i did and then over this summer (atleast 2-3 years since i first bought Court and Spark) i started listening to them and got obsessed! I understand about HOSL though, it does have a different sound. ANd for some reason, i usually listen to HOSL in the summer time... probably because i bought it in the summer of 97. But, i looked at the inner gatefold sleeve of Joni in the pool, and i said, "that looks fun, I love to swim and i like jOni mitchell" So, when ever summer rolls around and the pool opens at my house, i dig up HOSL and put it on and i just lay in the sun and swim in the cool water. songs like Edith and The Kingpin with its carressing woodwinds and eased tempo, just set me adrift in the pool.. blair :) NP: John Coltrane "tranesonic" _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:16:29 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Random thoughts on Magic/Religion & Politics NJC << the bible also did a pretty good job - says that gods name is mocked among the non-believers, because of the "believers">> I wish that the gospels and teachings of Christ had been seperated from the other books in the Bible. Although the other books were "inspired by God", they're not necessarily doctrine to live our lives by. Likewise the writings of Paul in the New Testament may be God-inspired but it doesn't take a theologian to see that his condemnations of women and homosexuals are not "Christlike". Yet because the text is placed in the same book as the teachings of Christ, many Christians put it all on the same plane. I read all those non-gospel portions of the Bible, and try to read it in that context, as a study of God's covenant with Man, and not as a guide to behavior. By the same token, I think that John Irving's "A Prayer For Owen Meany" is inspired by God as much as the canon of the Bible! In some ways I thought the whole "WWJD" was a little corny, but then again it helps I think to use the life and teachings of Jesus Christ as a litmus test as opposed to other portions of the book. << on the subject of religion and politics. i find it absolutely impossible to believe that *any* person can possibly have christian beliefs and be successful in the dirty business of politics. >> It has to be emphasized that Christianity is a journey and not a destination. While calling myself a Christian, I have done some things that I'm not proud of. Doesn't mean I'm a hypocrite, but it means that I serve a loving and forgiving God who blesses me and encourages me to overcome my faults. In church every Sunday, we sing "Jesus Loves Me" to bring the kids back into the sanctuary from Children's Church. It sometimes makes we tear up when I consider that Jesus Loves Me, after all the hateful deceitful wrongful things I have done. It is that love that inspires me & makes me a better person and brings me to reflect the same to others. End of sermon Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:23:45 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: january 13!!!!!! (NJC) In a message dated 1/13/01 5:55:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, wallykai@fibertel.com.ar writes: << who doesn't love her? who isn't mesmerized by her musicianship and her intensity? >> Nobody!!! Happy F*cking Birthday Claudia!!!! You sound great on the JoniFest CD's Les sent me. I really think that you should put out a CD. I mean that. We can't wait to hear you play again for us. Looking forward to JoniFest2001. Surface once in a while, will you please? Much love, Rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:31:41 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: inauguration protest info (njc) Deb Messling wrote: > Thanks for the many emails of support about the Washington march. My > husband will have an RIP > Democracy sign and I will have a sign saying Hi, JMDL! (not really but maybe > I should) Be sure to wear your Hello Marcel tee-shirt! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:32:34 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Despatches from the North West Frontier (almost) njc Hi folks, I've been following the discussions, sort of - I haven't downloaded the digests that have appeared as attachments, so I've missed a lot, but what the hell, I've more important things to do! My cousin's wedding is tomorrow, and there could be as many as 200 people there. I was roped into dancing yesterday, in front of a similar number of people, although fortunately not on my own - only men, though, as the sexes do not mix on the dance floor. I went to Murree today, which is a spectacular drive through mountains, although the town itself is nothing to write home about. The town is 7,500 feet above sea level, which is more than twice the height of the highest mountain in England! No Joni in Urdu yet, although I can report that MTV India is just as tacky and vacuous as it is everywhere else in the world :-) Bye for now, Azeem in Rawalpindi ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:42:20 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Random thoughts on Magic/Religion & Politics [SJC] > im not too sure here how you could possibly love/be inspired by jesus > teachings, when the basic cornerstone of those teachings were that he is/was > the *only* way to god - a point he repeatedly emphasised. You have a point. That is the way many people have interpreted His words. The translaters of course put their interpretations on things. There are many different Bibles and they don't all say the same thing. Different translations, different interpretations, different people, different beliefs. Jesus taught that God dwells within us, that we did not need an intermediary, that heaven was within, that we are God. At the same time he also said that the only way to the Father is thru Him. The latter statment makes a nonsense of this first few. Was jesus confused? Or maybe it is the translaters? Or even the readers, heaven forbid. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:08:23 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Peter Green & a Cat Story NJC Hi- I saw Peter Green on one of the induction ceremonies for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. (He didn't look that great.) I think he's still been doing some recording, though. Isn't Fleetwood's autobiography interesting? I never knew they were all coked up while recording Rumors! Since we're sharing horrid stories about cats, I have one too. This happened many years ago.....My girlfriend at the time had just changed the oil in my car (she was a butch one!) Anyway, she left the bucket of oil in my front hallway and of course my cat jumped in it! We called the vet to ask what to do and they said to give her a bath in peanut oil, of all things. This involved frantically going to the grocery store because I didn't happen to have any in the house. :>) I had to bathe her several times to get the oil out and she was howling up a storm the whole time. I can't believe the people downstairs didn't call the humane society! She recovered from the incident, but left little oil slick stains wherever she slept for the rest of the day!!!! Kerry NP-Billie Holiday-"You're My Thrill" on sonicnet: how cosmic! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:58:49 -0500 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: Jonatha's "Steady Pull" NJC Hey there Jonatha fans, WWW.JonathaBrooke.com is now accepting orders for the new release "Steady Pull" which isn't due in stores until Feb. 13th, but will be shipped to you early if you order now.Also, a video for the single "Linger" is available for download. Honestly, I haven't adjusted to the sound of the single yet, but I'm sure all will fall into place. By the way, in this season of new releases, the new Patty Griffin CD is due out very soon as well. Jonatha, Shawn, and Patty...that's the good shit that's comin'! - -Chris NP: Edie Carey "The Falling Places" (check out www.folkweb.com; they've got so many indie goodies!`) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:25:42 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Peter Green & a Cat Story NJC kerry wrote: peanut oil, of all things. This involved frantically going to the grocery store because I didn't happen to have any in the house. :>) I'll be blowed. I just looked in my cupboard. No peanut oil! What could I be thinking...... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 13:14:34 EST From: RK1THXguy@aol.com Subject: Re: HOSL In a message dated 1/13/01 1:22:23 AM, les@jmdl.com writes: << HOSL has been my fave of all of Joni's work >> **I feel HOSL is perhaps her most sensual and intimate work, certainly her first really mature work. I purchased it the day it was released (many years ago), and I remember the very first time I played it. It was like a soul drug, illicit and forbidden, and the sensuality just oozed and dripped from it! "He bought her a diamond for her throat" (notice: throat not neck) "There's a heatwave burning in her master's voice, and the hissing of summer lawns." There is a tone of helplessness in that song - but my god the sense of smoldering desire and captive sexuality is overwhelming. And the seduction in "Edith and the Kingpin" is fascinating, a little sad, but so damned alluring - "staring eye to eye, they dare not look away". I was already very fond and respectful of Joni's work - but when I finished playing HOSL through that first time - I was transformed into a JM devotee. I loved her previous show of her mind and her heart - the intellectual and ethereal nature of Joni's prior work, but on HOSL, she exposed her flesh. I loved it! It was truly "burning in a ritual of sound and time", and Joni had become, without a doubt, "coy and bitchy, wild and fine!" That inside jacket picture of Joni languishing in that "blue pool in the squinting sun", still gives me rushes. I felt Joni Mitchell the 'woman' for the first time that evening - I felt her on my skin and in my bones - in my fantasies - in my soul. I knew we would grow old together - and we are. BLUE was her first spark of emerging brilliance, C&S her first big commercial success - but HOSL is, for me, her first 'masterwork' - her embarkation to mature experience and wisdom. Everytime I listen to it I hear the genius, the depth, the authenticity of emotion, and the urgency of passion. It may also be Joni's voice at its most beautiful, captured on recording for all time. A strange aside - Prince (I'm not a fan but find his work curious) considers HOSL one of the greatest albums of all time. I can't say I disagree. If I had to give away every JM album I have, and could keep only one, by which to know and to feel Joni - the one I would fight to keep is HOSL! If it were released today, for the first time, it would still be pertinent, compelling, luscious, plaintive, lustful, real, and brilliant (both in its concept and craftsmanship). All these attributes can't necessarily be applied to every JM album - though I certainly enjoy them all. The 'of-the-moment, 'non-nostalgic' experience of listening to HOSE today, in 2001, is proof that HOSE is among the small handful, if not Join's 'ultimate' timeless masterpiece...Rob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 13:23:02 EST From: Murphycopy@aol.com Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) In a message dated 1/13/01 4:57:34 AM, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: << I do recall reading about Nancy Reagan consulting an astrologer, but I recall the source as one of the tabloids, like the National Enquirer and possibly a Kitty Kelley book. >> Actually, the source for this story was Donald Regan, Reagan's Chief of Staff. --Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:30:43 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Politics and religion (NJC) > Actually, actually I think you just bugged Lori who hates that word, actually! > the source for this story was Donald Regan, Reagan's Chief of > Staff. > > --Bob - -- bw colin colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 14:30:27 EST From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Off to Mary Graces in Davis for the Mini-fest Putting the politics very much aside for the trip up to Davis in Northern California where I understand they still have a little Yamaha generator providing the town with electriciy (but not taking any chances and bringing a candle and my acoustic guitar) and looking forward to meeting a small group of Listers. Im picking up Russ B on the way who I understand has a nice suprise for those who are there that Im sworn to secrecy not to divulge. If any of you out there still want to come you need to email MG or go through the recent digests for the directions Nikki provided. Unfortunately I can only go there for today since I had an important commitment for Sunday but thats OK. One day of fun will have to do. Ill post a little synopsis of the days festivities to share with you all when I get back. marcel deste. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 14:56:13 EST From: CarltonCT@aol.com Subject: magical thinking NJC Escaping the conseqences of one's actions and a hope that God will set things right or intervene is exactly what I mean by magical thinking. - - Clark ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:05:51 +0000 From: catman Subject: new baby NJC Have a pic to send to those intetrested in the puppies. This is one of Martha's at 5 wks and 5dys. - -- bw colin colin@tantra.fsbusiness.co.uk http://www.geocities.com/tantra_apso/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:02:10 -0000 From: "Martin Giles" Subject: practical magic Hi folks Just delurking to ask a question. A friend of mine said that he'd seen a movie on Sky the other night called Practical Magic, which had various tunes in the background as a soundtrack. He doesn't know Joni very well, but was sure that he recognised her singing on at least one of the songs. Looking at the credits at the end, he did see her name there. Does anyone know anything about this movie. What song/s did Joni sing? atb, Martin. In London. NP Refuge Of The Roads. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:14:09 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: HOSL In a message dated 1/13/01 1:29:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, RK1THXguy@aol.com writes: << I feel HOSL is perhaps her most sensual and intimate work, certainly her first really mature work. I purchased it the day it was released (many years ago), and I remember the very first time I played it. >> I agree with you Rob. I had just repurchased this CD about a month ago. I was dying to listen to it. I love Don't Interrupt the Sorrow and Shades of Scarlet Conquering. AMOF I love it all, including Jungle Line. I remember when this album was released. It gave me the courage to leave an unhappy marriage and a 18 (mostly empty room) Victorian mansion. I packed up my kid, a few of my belongings and headed for the mountains in my VW bus. I have to admit, I do miss the house though. Rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:32:19 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: harvey head - njc Pat Thanks for the response. I am going to get these discs again and lock myself away with headphones on and give it another whack. Everybody tells me I would probably like these guys. Later. Michael NP-Sweet Presence-Diane Reeves on 1/10/01 11:07 AM, Siresorrow@aol.com at Siresorrow@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 1/10/01 10:19:03 AM Eastern Standard Time, > jmichaelpaz@telocity.com writes: > > << Still can NOT find anything by Radiohead that I like. >> > > i've been thinking about this today as i've been listening to some > rayjoheyaad. here is what i like in their sound. first, the guy's voice is > really edgy and cool. then, and perhaps most significant is this digitally > perfect clear sound they have. like they make a new environment for the > music to be heard in. and it's very powerful. it doesn't feel artificial to > me even though it is compared to say a martin D28 and a singer. but it is > really really powerful. magnetic. like a big wave that you catch and ride > till the song is over. > so i'm trying to identify a quality that i've seen now twice in new music. > if i tried to translate into past sounds, i'd suggest ...rush....maybe some > pink floyd...like specifically ..welcome to the machine. you know how that > has that brum brum brum brum brum driving sound to it that never > deviates....that's the kind of thing i'm talking about only not really > because it still is not the same as radiohead. > > so that's what i get out of it. but i could easily see how people on this > list would not like radiohead. i'm almost more surprised that some do and > most surprised that i'm liking them. i've always thought of myself as more > organic. so what do i know? > ciao. patrick > np. dm banter on luther college ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:32:00 -0600 From: "Eric Wilcox" Subject: RE: practical magic If I'm not mistaken, "A Case of You" is used on the soundtrack. eric - --- eric wilcox edwilcox@students.wisc.edu "It is absurd to divide people into good and bad. People are either charming or tedious." -Oscar Wilde - --- - -----Original Message----- From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of Martin Giles Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 2:02 PM To: joni digest Subject: practical magic Hi folks Just delurking to ask a question. A friend of mine said that he'd seen a movie on Sky the other night called Practical Magic, which had various tunes in the background as a soundtrack. He doesn't know Joni very well, but was sure that he recognised her singing on at least one of the songs. Looking at the credits at the end, he did see her name there. Does anyone know anything about this movie. What song/s did Joni sing? atb, Martin. In London. NP Refuge Of The Roads. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:20:47 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: [Fwd: [Fwd: - Humor]] Received: from tobago.pathwaynet.com ([216.46.203.46]) by uruguay.pathwaynet.com with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 14HYOM-0008JB-00 for revrvl@pathwaynet.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:39:18 -0500 Received: from ip-d82ec0a4.arc2.gvl.pathwaynet.com ([216.46.192.164] helo=pathwaynet.com) by tobago.pathwaynet.com with esmtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 14HYO0-0007DI-00 for revrvl@pathwaynet.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:38:57 -0500 Message-ID: <3A60CE31.95B43AAC@pathwaynet.com> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:52:55 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Reply-To: revrvl@pathwaynet.com Organization: American Apostolic Catholic Church X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Bp. Vince Lavieri" Subject: [Fwd: - Humor] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-PATHWAY: SMTP/S FROM TOBAGO X-PATHWAY: LOCAL DELIVERY ON URUGUAY TO revrvl X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Received: from [63.76.2.3] (helo=smtp.adbmich.org) by uruguay.pathwaynet.com with smtp (Exim 3.15 #1) id 14HUTf-0000L9-00; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:28:31 -0500 Received: from video_svr.sado.org ([63.76.2.65]) by smtp.adbmich.org ; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:30:02 -0500 From: "Mary Hickey" To: forum@sado.org (SADO FORUM Mailing List) Subject: [SADO FORUM] - Humor Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:11:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Importance: Normal Reply-To: forum@sado.org Sender: forum@sado.org Message-ID: <97940700201@smtp.adbmich.org> X-PATHWAY: LOCAL DELIVERY ON URUGUAY TO revrvl X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/related by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was multipart/alternative Im sorry, but I just couldnt resist passing this one along! Mary Hickey [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of image001.jpg] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 16:23:31 -0800 From: Michael Paz Subject: Re: John McVie (NJC) on 1/11/01 2:19 PM, Kakki at KakkiB@worldnet.att.net wrote: > I was just kidding around yesterday with regard to people throwing out their > albums because of a musician's political beliefs (although some people do > feel strongly about doing this - I've heard there are some on the Van list > that are ready to denounce him because he is performing for Bush). It don't > matter to me - music is my ultimate "political belief" ;-) Kakki- Music is my ultimate political belief as well besides being the centre of my universe. I did a gig here in New Orleans when Bush (dad) won the nomination and while I was opposed to him in a major way I was still able to the gig cause it was "just another". To my credit, we set all the stuff up went thru all the body cavity scans of the service etc. and then he never showed up for some reason. So we packed up all our shit and went home with a paycheck anyway. Paz NP-Traid-CSNY/4-Way Street-My SonicNetRadioStation-Michael Paz ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2001 #20 **************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?