From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #582 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk VideoTree sign-up: http://www.jmdl.com/trading Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com JMDL Digest Sunday, November 5 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 582 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. Sign up for VideoTree #2 now: http://www.jmdl.com/trading ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- painting with words? [jan gyn ] Top Five Light Shows ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: JM Discography, F & V CD's, Intellectuality of JM's lyrics [Nancy ] Re: Napster news, Audiophile's Corner, NJC ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: The intellectuality of Joni's lyrics (long) ["Kakki" ] Joni songs that have made me cry ["Cassie Fox" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 20:11:55 -0800 From: jan gyn Subject: painting with words? Yo bipeds (especially those indigenous to the SF Bay Area)- So I'm laying face down on my rug, trying to decide what to wear tonight, when my eye spies in the TV guide, 'Joni Mitchell: Painting With Words' at 11:30 PM 11/04 PBS. I'll have to miss it (and Xena), unfortunately. What is this? - -jan ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 09:23:46 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Top Five Light Shows 1. Pink Floyd 2. Pink Floyd 3. Pink Floyd 4. Pink Floyd 5. Pink Floyd I don't know how these guys make any money on the road. Every song has a unique effect. Opulent. Lama P.S. I wouldn't want every band's shows to be like a Pink Floyd show but they are head and shoulders above everyone else at what they do. :) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2000 22:30:30 +0000 From: Nancy Subject: Re: JM Discography, F & V CD's, Intellectuality of JM's lyrics Hi out there! Questions and comments: Is this a full listing of all JM's albums/CD's? > Subject: Joni's Discography, a reminder (from Jim) What type of music do these JMDLers have on their CD's? > Subject: Fred and Victor CDs for sale > > Okay Fred and Victor! I've looked at > www.cdnow.com and www.cdbaby.com where I've had success buying CDs made by > JMDLers Kate Bennett, David Lahm, and Bryan Thomas. Prey, tell. Where can > I purchase your discs? > > Jim L'Hommedieu I can't remember any specific JM songs that have caused me to cry, but I know that certain songs have lyrics that I certainly can relate to. And maybe something I hear now doesn't affect me the way it did 20 years ago. It depends on what's going on with me at the moment. Recently I nearly cried listening to "Just Because" by Mary Chapin Carpenter - I say *nearly* because I was at work and didn't want to have a crying fit there! (Haven't heard "10,000 Miles".) - --Nancy/IA > Subject: The intellectuality of Joni's lyrics > > The thread about "Songs that evoke emotions" has moved > me to finally write about this - to try to put into > words what I feel about Joni's songs. > There are certain songs that > are so beautiful and so moving that I can hardly sing > them all the way through without bursting into tears > (Dylan's Every Grain Of Sand is one of them), or that > make me cry every time I hear them (Mary > Chapin-Carpenter's 10,000 Miles), but there has never > been one Joni song that moved me like that.  ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 00:03:46 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Favorite Arrangers / Producers Jim, you really must listen to the early Basie band, before the arrangers took over. Try to find their stuff recorded between '36 and '39. A lot of the best was originally recorded on Decca. You will find classic, heroic solos by Buck Clayton, Sweets Edison, Dickie Wells Lester Young, Herschel Evans, Jack Washington and Basie. Vocals by Helen Humes and Jimmy Rushing. A privilege, in this huge universe, to be on the same hunk of rock and be able to hear this. Do you know how some people say (or used to) that they got chills up and down their spines to see the American flag pass by in a parade? That's how I feel when I listen to those old sides. David Lahm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 00:08:37 EST From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Re:5songs that evoke tearful emoting 1.Hold Me now, Thompson Twins ( i am a child of the 80's and this gets me nostalgic) 2.Welcome, John Coltrane 3.Watermelon in Easter Hay, Frank Zappa (one of the few electric guitar solos that can make me cry) 4.Who wants to live forever, Queen 5.The Last Song, Elton John love blair _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 00:14:33 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: The intellectuality of Joni's lyrics (long) Mark in Seattle wrote: > Hi Marian! Good to see you posting again! Yes, it is, Marian. I hope it means all's well with you and family and work and everything else now. > I've been thinking about this one ever since I read this post last > night. Joni affects me in a very different way, as well. > .... But mostly Joni makes me feel something entirely different from > whatever feeling or feelings bring tears to my eyes. In part I feel a > kind of respect and awe for the amazing excellence of their > composition and expression. Of course there's more than that but that > is part of it. Joni's voice is like an old friend to me. It's > comforting. I feel the same way about Billie Holiday. Billie doesn't > make me cry either. They both tap into very deep emotions but they > don't make old wounds hurt. They soothe. They heal. They inspire. A couple of years ago a coworker and I were talking about concerts. I was about to see Joni and Bob and she was excited about seeing Gloria Estefan, her favorite, and I asked her what she liked so much about Gloria's music. "She makes me dance" was her answer and she asked me why Joni was my favorite and I said, "she makes me think" (an answer that surprised even me). I sure didn't win her over to Joni with that one. In fact she got that wrinkle between the eyebrows people get when they've heard something they can't comprehend. What fun is thinking compared to dancing, after all? And, I wondered then, is that really why I've been listening to Joni for years? Now that I'm being so viscerally captured by other music lately, plus Marian's question, and I wonder again what it is about Joni's music that holds me. The only song of hers that makes me cry almost every time is Amelia, although River has gotten to me too sometimes (and I've been known to snuffle at commercials). Hearing Joni's other songs is a mostly cerebral experience, as Marian describes it. They sound good, yes, but while listening I think about how I feel, about the images she's painting with the lyrics, about how one sound of an instrument or a word plays against another, about the complexity of what she's created. Sometimes a sound, usually the way her voice catches, will emotionally grab me, but mostly her work makes me think about feelings, rather than actually having those feelings. Sounds rather boring, and yet I've been listening for decades now. Hmmm. There was an article in the NYTimes magazine months ago about grief and Mark's words "They soothe. They heal. They inspire" makes me think of it. The author, a priest, writes: "I suspect that today we are not supposed to expect that much of life. We are supposed to settle for less. What, then, do we expect of grief counselors? To help us suppress these embarrassing expectations of the heart? Is consolation after all a lowering of expectations? If anything, I am consoled by the Book of Job, which derides those who tried to explain Job's suffering to him. God does not seek to console him; He just shows up, and this is enough. It was not explanations Job wanted, but solidarity, compassion, love." Joni in her music just shows up, full of high expectations, suffering deeply from losses, expressing great joy sometimes, and offering no explanations at all, only descriptions of her experience, and that is enough. The companionship is healing, so maybe then there's no need to cry any more. But the need for healing is never ending, even in the best of times, so I keep listening, with my eyes dry but heart very much involved I now realize. What a surprise. > Enough. Sorry for the bandwidth. > > Mark in Seattle No apology needed. It was a beautiful post Mark. Debra Shea NP: PJ Harvey's latest one with a Joni-sounding title but music that sounds like Patti Smith/Lou Reed. "The Whores Hustle and the Hustlers Whore" followed by "This Mess We're In" are worth the price of the cd. Wow. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 00:19:46 -0500 From: dsk Subject: For Nick Drake fans NJC There's a rather long article about him in GQ magazine, November issue. Might be old news to long-time fans but I found it interesting and there's a nice picture. Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 10:22:16 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Napster news, Audiophile's Corner, NJC I read last week in Stereophile, that the German BMG record conglomerate has negotiated a proposal with Napster. Under the terms, Napster will write an mp3 distribution 'store' for BMG. BMG will provide professionally-made mp3s which will still sound like little pieces of digital detritus. Incidently, the future of high-fidelity (I mean superior quality sound for blue bloods who care) is in two new formats called SACD (Sony and Phillips) and DVD-Audio (backed by everyone else). Very few titles on SACD and virtually none in DVD-Audio. While it's technically possible to make discs that DVD-Audio players as well as garden-variety players can use, they'll be more expensive to manufacture- so they don't stand a snowball's chance in the marketplace, imho. Haven't heard the new formats but they say that they have the lush sound and amazing soundstage of ultra-quality LP reproduction. The really affluent can now hear their CDs in an enhanced mode using very expensive converters that provide up-sampling. This is like the audio equivalent of an enhanced photo. Haven't heard it but they say it's better. Personally, I think that THIS is the future of high-end audio because there are very few of us and I don't believe that buying new discs is very attractive. I mean, would you pay double for a DVD-Audio disc that you couldn't play in the car or in your home Mac or your office PC? Audiophile's Corner is an exclusive feature of JMDL, usually using info stolen from (I mean credited to) Stereophile Magazine, and a news group called rec.audio.high-end. It is intended for the exclusive use of JMDLers. Any re-broadcast must be approved in writing by the National Football League. Unless I'm still very full of sh*t indeed. Jim ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 10:33:28 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Spoiler:politics(NJC)..... USA Politics A local example. As I understand it, Congress is trying to put together a spending bill. Amazingly, a Cincinnati company, Chiquita, has "persuaded" a local Congressman to insert a provision allowing Chiquita (which contols every bananna sold in the US) the right to control new competition in the banana import business. A New York paper (NY Times?) broke the story and it's made news here. So the rider will probably, rightfully, get peeled and discarded. :) bananna humor! I'm SO funny! Kakki said: > the U.S. system has not only built-in checks and balances, but also > a multitude of "watchdog" and advocacy groups that are always right on any > Govenmental actions that may be going in the wrong direction. Lama ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2000 11:12:59 -0500 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Favorite Arrangers / Producers, NJC, 100% Jazz Content David L., Thanks for the tip about early Basie! I found some samples on the downbeat web page and guess what? I listened to portions of two tracks with a vocalist and said, "Man, I KNOW that voice! He sang 'Hello Little Girl' on Duke Ellington's "Jazz Party"!" So I looked him up on my copy of Jazz Party and it was Jimmy Rushing. How cool to know that I can recognize folks from other recordings in a "foreign" genre! I mean, I'm becoming a jazz fan now. My ear for singers, such as it is, transfers directly. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 00:31:05 -0600 From: evian Subject: 5 songs that invoke emotion njc 5 Songs that invoke emotions for me (non joni songs, of course): 1.) U2 -- The Unforgettable Fire (my totally all-time favorite song ever) 2.) Mary Chapin Carpenter -- John Doe #43 (or whatever number it is, I never remember) 3.) FM -- Landslide (balled like a baby when I saw Stevie perform this one) 4.) Adam Pascal/RENT Cast -- One Song Glory 5.) Hole -- Malibu 6.) Carly Simon -- Like a River (Can't even sing along to it because the lyrics always catch in my throat) There are millions more, but these always make me all chocked up like some blubbering idiot! Evian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 22:46:39 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: The intellectuality of Joni's lyrics (long) Mark wrote: >> Of course there's more than that but that > > is part of it. Joni's voice is like an old friend to me. It's > > comforting. I feel the same way about Billie Holiday. Billie doesn't > > make me cry either. They both tap into very deep emotions but they > > don't make old wounds hurt. They soothe. They heal. They inspire. And Debra wrote: > Joni in her music just shows up, full of high expectations, suffering > deeply from losses, expressing great joy sometimes, and offering no > explanations at all, only descriptions of her experience, and that is > enough. The companionship is healing, so maybe then there's no need to > cry any more. Wow, there it is. These are two of the most beautiful and brilliant insights into Joni's music that I've ever read. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 23:15:17 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Songs that evoke emotions Joni songs - The only two Joni songs that immediately mainlined straight into my heart and made me cry were her new versions of Case of You and Both Sides Now. For me the tears did not come so much from the songs themselves or from my own personal connection to them, but rather because I got this overwhelming feeling that Joni was singing her whole life in them. It's difficult to explain but I felt this all at once mix of joy, pride, poignancy, sentimentality, admiration and thankfulness that she and her spirit have endured and survived. Other NJC songs - I'll Follow The Sun - The Beatles Prisoner in Disguise - Linda Ronstadt Galveston - Jimmy Webb newer version Friends - Elton John Ribbon In The Sky - Stevie Wonder (oh big time) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 07:39:06 GMT From: "Cassie Fox" Subject: Joni songs that have made me cry joni song thst have made me cry A case of you River Hejira Both sides now Roses Blue Cactus Tree I Don't Know where I stand Cherokee Louise Just Like thIs Train Trouble Child _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #582 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list by clicking here: mailto:joni@smoe.org Unsubscribe by clicking here: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe ------- Siquomb, isn't she?