From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #572 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe JMDL Digest Tuesday, October 31 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 572 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Trees (NJC and long again) ["Hell" ] Re: the soul of a tree - NJC ["Hell" ] Re: Storm NJC [mags ] Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC ["Hell" ] Re: the soul of a tree - NJC [mags ] Re: Favourite guitarists ["Hell" ] Pain in the Neck [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Nature & church NJC ["kerry" ] Re: Nature & church NJC [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: Nature & church NJC [mags ] Joni/guitar olympics [peves@marlboro.edu] Re: Joni/guitar olympics [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Re.Neil & Joni's Guitar play [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: people's parties (NJC) [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: Nature & church NJC [catman ] Nick Drake NJC [AzeemAK@aol.com] Today in Joni History - October 30 [Today in Joni History ] Neil young purchases ["Blair Fraipont" ] Back in 1974 ["Blair Fraipont" ] Re: Re.Neil & Joni's Guitar play ["Mike Hicks" ] Re: Back in 1974 (MD) [MDESTE1@aol.com] My Neck NJC [RoseMJoy@aol.com] Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC [FredNow@aol.com] Some questions about VideoTree #2 [AsharaJM@aol.com] War or SOB (Same Old Band) ["Michael Paz" ] Re: Some questions about VideoTree #2 NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Joni/guitar gods [dsk ] Treasure Trove o' Joni [Julian51469@aol.com] Seeing Stars NJC ["kerry" ] Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC ["Kakki" ] RE: My Neck NJC ["Wally Kairuz" ] =?iso-8859-1?Q?tal=EDa=2C_margarita_and_juanita_NJC?= ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Five Fave Guitarists NJC [Les Irvin ] Re: Five Fave Guitarists NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Five Fave Guitarists [JRMCo1@aol.com] Re: Five Fave Guitarists [Joseph Palis ] Re: talía, margarita and juanita NJC ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Back in 1974 (MD) ["Kakki" ] costumes for tonight [vjc] ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: So Neil can't play guitar solos, can Joni? [Steven Barton Subject: Re: Trees (NJC and long again) I seem to have started something with the tree theme! I'm still not used to seeing One Tree Hill treeless, and really, really annoyed that I didn't go up there the day it came down, since they were apparently giving away small branches to on-lookers - I could have carved a permanent reminder! Trees have always been really important to me. Growing up I lived next to a Scenic Reserve, with fully grown native trees 20 feet from the back door. NZ is sub-tropical, and most of our natives are evergreens - and include lots of tree ferns and palms. I spent hours and hours exploring the bush as a child, and had my favourite climbing trees as well. The puriri had big sprawling branches, and dense foliage you could get lost in - the twin totaras formed the base for a great tree-hut my brother built between them with railway sleepers - which is probably still intact after 25 years. I learnt which plants were edible, played with native crayfish in the creek (now an endangered species, unfortunately), which ones the native pigeons lived in (beautiful huge white and jade coloured birds, with a distinctive call). I remember my favourite spot was about a half-hour trek into the heart of the bush, where there was a natural clearing due to fallen trees. The undergrowth hadn't grown much, so you could lie in the sun amongst the huge trees and look straight up at the sky. Pretty amazing at the age of 7! My favourite Maori legend tells the story of Rata chopping down a tree for a canoe. He chose his tree to make a canoe to search for his long-lost father. He chopped it down but when he returned the next day, the tree was restored, so he chopped it down again. He did this for several days until he decided to hide in the trees to discover how the tree was being restored. He saw the wood-fairies, birds and insects working together to lift the tree, and replacing every piece of bark and wood. He came out of hiding and asked them why? They replied that he had neglected to ask permission of Tane, the God of the Forest. He explained why he needed the tree, and Tane granted his request. The fairies etc. then helped him fell and carve his canoe, and eventually he found his father and brought him back to his family. Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:19:35 +1300 From: "Hell" Subject: Re: the soul of a tree - NJC dean wrote: > don't we all > have a favorite plant or tree or stand of trees. surely without them we > would cease to exist. i know what my favorite plant is, although i still > hold my orchids a close second. CC, i'll put a green pin on the jmdl map if > you like, for your tree, and one in NZ for hell's tree Definitely - my favourite tree is a totara, which is a NZ native podocarp (conifer), and they can live as long as 800 years - one huge specimen still standing is believed to be 1800 years old. Incidentally, has anyone ever literally hugged a tree, preferably one that's warm from the sun? It needs to have the right sized truck, ie. not too wide, so you can get your arms around it. Call me weird (again) but it's definitely one of life's nicer experiences! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 05:31:42 -0600 From: mags Subject: Re: Storm NJC catman wrote: > It is pretty scary. The fruit tree in our garden is no more. Thank God it fell away from > the fencing. So far the fencing has stayed up. The house itself is okay too. > The dogs are not happy. > The reports reckon this will stop by lunch time. and now mags: high winds are terrifying. i remember speaking with Brian on the phone in the summer and looking out to see a darkened sky accompanied by a sudden and deafening stillness that made the hairs on the back of my neck stand on end. .... then things started whipping across the way horizontally...such an intense and out of nowhere gush of wind that was..yes it was a tornado...we get them here from time to time and I can always tell from the feeling in the air, like something is about to happen, something bad, along with an eerie hue of green against dark grey clouds. so glad the puppy boys are okay and that you and John can spend some time snuggled up against the wind. npimh: Nature's Way by Spirit. It's nature's way of telling you something's wrong It's nature's way of telling you in a song It's nature's way of receiving you It's nature's way of retrieving you It's nature's way of telling you Something's wrong It's nature's way of telling you, summer breeze It's nature's way of telling you, dying trees It's nature's way of receiving you It's nature's way of retrieving you It's nature's way of telling you Something's wrong It's nature's way, it's nature's way It's nature's way, it's nature's way take good care of each other, mags. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:35:09 +1300 From: "Hell" Subject: Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC Fred wrote: > This may be heresy to some, but Neil's songwriting has become less and less > interesting to me over the years. But this is true of a lot of writers from > back then, including C, S, and N. Not heresy, just opinion! I have the same opinion about Stephen Stills, who is one of my heroes. His early song-writing, eg. For What It's Worth, Word Game, Helplessly Hoping, was exceptional, but I'm afraid his lyrics have not improved with the years (unlike his guitar-playing which is still incredible). Compare the lyrics from Word Game (about apartheid in South Africa): Would you knock a man down if you don't like the cut of his clothes Could you put a man away if you don't want to hear what he knows Well it's happening right here, people dying of fear by the droves with the lyrics from Drivin' Thunder And I ain't too good with numbers And I've run out of fuel Here comes another corner baby Let me demonstrate my slide rule (slide rule) Obviously I've taken two extremes, and he is still capable of writing some good songs! Nash and Crosby have not "deteriorated" as much IMO, and Crosby in particular is still writing some good stuff. I guess it comes back to one of the other reasons I love Joni so much. The lyrics are as strong and meaningful as they were 30 years ago. Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 05:39:26 -0600 From: mags Subject: Re: the soul of a tree - NJC Hell wrote: > dean wrote: > > > don't we all > > have a favorite plant or tree or stand of trees. surely without them we > > would cease to exist. i know what my favorite plant is, although i still > > hold my orchids a close second. CC, i'll put a green pin on the jmdl map > if > > you like, for your tree, and one in NZ for hell's tree > > Definitely - my favourite tree is a totara, which is a NZ native podocarp > (conifer), and they can live as long as 800 years - one huge specimen still > standing is believed to be 1800 years old. > > Incidentally, has anyone ever literally hugged a tree, preferably one that's > warm from the sun? It needs to have the right sized truck, ie. not too > wide, so you can get your arms around it. Call me weird (again) but it's > definitely one of life's nicer experiences! > > Hell mags adds: yes Ive hugged a tree and know well the wonderful feeling that evokes. ah the memories....my daughter and I used to go hiking a lot when she was little and tree hugging was a ritual with us. I wonder if she remembers that? Not weird Helen...not one bit. (unless I am too..hmmmm ;)))) sitting here in the midst of insomnia hoping the spasm in my neck/back will ease. :( > > ____________________________ > "To have great poets, there must be > great audiences too." - Walt Whitman > > hell@ihug.co.nz > Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: > http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ - -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- _~O / /\_, ___/\ /_ - ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:41:23 +1300 From: "Hell" Subject: Re: Favourite guitarists Steve wrote: > My FAVE FIVE GUITAR PLAYERS OF ALL TIME ( well for today anyway) > > 1.Neil and Joni ( No kiddin, I can't separate them. Sychophant ! Do I > hear ) > 2.(This way I get to name 6 ) Stevie Ray Vaughan > 3.Rory Gallagher > 4.Peter Green ( as was) > 5.Dickie Betts and Duane ( OK, so it's my thread)Warren was cool too. Which is a cool thread, so I thought I'd play along! It's hard to separate different styles, and/or acoustic and electric, so I'm just going to lump them all in together - or at least try! Like Steve, this is the list for tonight at 11.39pm! 1. Stephen Stills - great on electric, and even better on acoustic. 2. Bonnie Raitt 3. Joni (she had to be there somewhere) 4. Carlos Santana 5. Lindsay Buckingham I could easily think of 10 more, and the list would change accordingly, but I'm trying to keep to the rules! Hell ____________________________ "To have great poets, there must be great audiences too." - Walt Whitman hell@ihug.co.nz Visit the NBLs (Natural Born Losers) at: http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hell/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 07:41:51 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Pain in the Neck In a message dated 10/30/00 5:53:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, pholden@iprimus.ca writes: > sitting here in the midst of insomnia hoping the spasm in my neck/back will > ease. :( > > > > Hell I can relate to that. My neck pain has been going on for well over a week now. I've been taking muscle relaxants and percocet, but still the pain persists. I had surgery for this type of thing 10 years ago. Turns out it was a herniated disc in the cervical spine. My surgeon (Dr. Barry) is in Bethlehem, PA now. Now what's a damsel in distress to do? I see another neurosurgeon today at noon. It doesn't look too good guys. I can hear those words already. Rose who needs some good vibes sent her way :~( ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 07:39:56 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Nature & church NJC >>No wonder the hills and groves were God's first temples, and the more they are cut down and hewn into cathedrals and churches, the farther off and dimmer seems the Lord himself. - - - John Muir >> Rose, Thank you for sharing this quote. It really struck a chord with me. About 20 years ago, when I was in college, some friends and I took a road trip up to Lake Superior. It was a beautiful Sunday morning and as we stood there with the waves crashing to the shore I said, "We forgot to go to church today," and my friend said, "This IS church." I've believed that ever since. I have always felt more spiritual and alive in nature than in any church building. Take care, Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:46:27 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re: Nature & church NJC Kerry wrote: I have always felt more spiritual and alive in nature than in any church building. I have always felt this way too. When I'm feeling really down and low, there's a special place I go to recharge my batteries. We can hardly call the mountains we have here in NJ mountains at all, actually they are just hills. There is this magical pine forest that I like to go to and just sit and take in the beauty that surrounds me. They are located in the Watchung Mountain Indian Reservation. I have a lot of history there. Rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 09:01:23 -0600 From: mags Subject: Re: Nature & church NJC kerry wrote: > >>No wonder the hills and groves were God's first temples, and the more > they are cut down and hewn into cathedrals and churches, the > farther off and dimmer seems the Lord himself. > - - John Muir >> > > Rose, > Thank you for sharing this quote. It really struck a chord with me. About > 20 years ago, when I was in college, some friends and I took a road trip up > to Lake Superior. It was a beautiful Sunday morning and as we stood there > with the waves crashing to the shore I said, "We forgot to go to church > today," and my friend said, "This IS church." I've believed that ever > since. I have always felt more spiritual and alive in nature than in any > church building. > > Take care, > Kerry and mags, inspired by both posts shares: Yes, thank you Rose for sharing this quote. And Kerry, I know exactly what you mean about touching and being touched by the spirit of nature. I have a special place I like to visit up in the Caledon called the Clay Hills....some know it as the badlands which i always thought was rather an odd name for such a powerful and beauteous place. The colour of earth there is a gorgeous, deep red (clay) with some deep green streaks throughout...reminds me of the marriage of copper and oxygen. The sensuous shapes are long and smooth, flowing down hill like giant curvaceous bodies lying there in the sun. A place of magic and spirit. Gives me great comfort to be there, especially in the good company of my best friend. I have no idea how this was formed, and I contemplate that very notion every time. The strange thing is that there is very little growth 'on' the hills, only around. I have spent many, many hours there and it is a special place of sanctuary. I'd love to be there at midnight, and gaze at the universe all around me. Another one of my favourite things to do. I love the stars. I wonder if we could see the Northern Lights there. Brian and I will check that out and let you know ;) mags, at the clay hills in my mind np: Always, Jonatha Brooke - -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- _~O / /\_, ___/\ /_ - ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 21:57:00 -0500 From: peves@marlboro.edu Subject: Joni/guitar olympics Hi Joniacs. It's Peg. Wouldn't we agree that Joni's melody (lead)instrument is the keyboard - where her chord progressions are invariably laced together by all those incredible melodic phrases? Of course she plays her instruments exquisitely. Her piano playing is thoroughly provocative. And I'm sure she could play fast repeatedly stringing those sublime meanderings into bonifide "riffs" and "licks" if that were her focus. Maybe she kicks ass in her living room on her instruments. I don't know. But if she IS an olympic lead player she's not sharing it with us. Mark Knopfler, Frank Zappa, Richard Thompson, Walt Becker, Larry Carlton, Jorma Peg ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 09:24:35 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni/guitar olympics In a message dated 10/30/00 9:11:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, peves@marlboro.edu writes: << And I'm sure she could play fast repeatedly stringing those sublime meanderings into bonifide "riffs" and "licks" if that were her focus. Maybe she kicks ass in her living room on her instruments. I don't know. >> Actually, my guess is that because of her post-polio syndrome and other factors, she doesn't have the hand strength or digital dexterity to play guitar in that style, not that anyone would really want her to. She's a chord strummer. Any expectations that Joni could play like Jimi Hendrix or Jimmy Page or comparisons to pickers or virtuosos are ludicrous. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 10:01:42 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: Re.Neil & Joni's Guitar play In a message dated 10/29/00 9:51:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, IVPAUL42 writes: << There must be other guitar languages as well. Doc Watson, Leo Kottke, BB King. How many? >> agreed. patrick np. p.simon - quiet ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 10:08:00 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: people's parties (NJC) In a message dated 10/29/00 11:10:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, waytoblu@mindspring.com writes: << I've never really played with anyone of that caliber before and it was really inspiring. It really gave me a feel for where these songs can go. >> it feels like leverage. it's a very powerful feeling. like a little bit goes a really long way. i'm envious. patrick np. chalk mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 15:46:59 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Nature & church NJC > And Kerry, I know exactly what you > mean about touching and being touched by the spirit of nature. Nothing has ever come close for me to the feeling I experienced whilst travelling thru New England. I was moved to tears on several occasions-like I had arrived home at last. The Vermont mountains, The White Mountains and Maine are just stunning. I feel something comparable when looking up into the clear night sky at all those stars. You know, it only occurred to me recently that you would see the same stars. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:27:18 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Nick Drake NJC My take on ND is, for a first time buyer, either of the first two are essential purchases; Pink Moon (the third) is often claimed to be his best, but it's stark, dark and not very appetising to beginners. For my money, Bryter Layter is the best ("Northern Sky" is one of my favourite songs ever), but Five Leaves Left isn't far behind. Azeem in London, blissed out, having returned on Saturday from a ten day Vipassana meditation retreat. Anyone else been on one of those? NP: PJ Harvey's latest meisterwerk, Stories From The City, Stories From The Sea - this woman is the most vital, original talent in the British music scene today. Check it out ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 00:11:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - October 30 1998: The Toronto Sun reviews last night's concert, saying "The meeting of two music legends -- Joni Mitchell and Bob Dylan -- on one stage comes along so rarely you'd think there'd be high expectations. But judging from the weak attendance of last night's Maple Leaf Gardens show -- only 10,000 tickets were sold leaving another 6,000 seats empty -- you gotta wonder just how high." Read it here: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/981030ts.cfm - - The San Francisco Examiner reviews Taming The Tiger and interviews Joni, who says "Everyone thinks they're a singer-songwriter, and they're not. In order to make money, you have to write your own stuff. But very few have the gift. In the old days, somebody wrote the music, somebody wrote the words and somebody sang it. Now everybody thinks they have all three gifts — and they don't." Read the rest here: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/docs/981030sfe.cfm - - Joni performs in Kanata. Setlist and Jimdler reviews here: http://www.jmdl.com/performances/docs/981030.cfm - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 13:08:31 EST From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Neil young purchases Thanks for all replying to my question about neil young. I got a general consensus, of what next i should buy. I already own about 7 Neil young albums: Harvest After the Gold Rush Comes a Time Reactor Hawks and Doves Trans (one of my favorites) Neil young Unplugged and i have 4 way street by CSN&Y and Deja Vu SO, i really wanted to see what everyone thought were the "classics" and i'll definitely be looking into the First self titled album.. because Paul IV stressed its greatness and Ry Cooder helped Produce i!! now, HOW HOT IS that??!! and Rust Never Sleeps.. i have heard allot of good stuff about that. Thanks everyone love blair _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 13:22:19 EST From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Back in 1974 I was looking through my record and cd collection and of all my live cds, I realized that atleast half of my live albums stem from 1974. And in particular, ALl of those live albums Are excellento!! For instance, Van Morrison's " It's Too Late to stop Now" is just phenomenal. The version of Cyprus Avenue takes my breath away. Then ofcourse, "miles of Aisles" classic Joni, in a classic time period. David Bowie's "David LIve" .. The band is so tight and raw sounding and every song is energy charged... Frank Zappa and the MOthers of Invention, "Roxy and Elsewhere" This lineup is classic and Ruth underwood on percussion makes it all the better. Bob Dylan and the band, "Before the Flood" Marvin Gaye, "Marvin Live" Trouble man is spanktastic as well as the "Fossil Melody" and i am going to throw in Lou Reed's "rock n' rol Animal" eventhough it was made in '73, it is one of THE best Live albums i have ever heard. The glam rocked version of Sweet Jane and Heroin are classics. I dont know what was in the water then, but I wish i could have been alive back then to see all these performances... you just cant get a great live show today like you used to i suppose. If anyone else has anything else to add, feel free to give your comments. love blair _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 14:27:06 -0500 From: "Mike Hicks" Subject: Re: Re.Neil & Joni's Guitar play > From: IVPAUL42@aol.com > Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 21:51:58 EST > Subject: Re: Re.Neil & Joni's Guitar play > To: Siresorrow@aol.com, rustiescot@lineone.net, joni@smoe.org > Reply-to: IVPAUL42@aol.com > i think jimmi's is the language of guitar playing shared by clapton, page, > and howe. they don't need to sing along with their guitars. >> > > There must be other guitar languages as well. Doc Watson, Leo Kottke, BB > King. How many? You must throw in Pat Metheny, especially his pre-1990 material. His guitar speaks a language, at least to me. Mike > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 14:52:13 EST From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Back in 1974 (MD) First of all everything as so much newer then. Second of all everything was so much cheaper. Third of all we were so much younger then. The newer included not only the songs but the experience of going to a live show. (Newer) When The Who destroyed their instruments it was totally off the wall and ad hoc. No one had ever done that before. To witness it was amazing. After they got through with everything there was no possibility of an encore. There was nothing to use left to make music with. Today its hard to find an original act. Every things been done before several ways. So what can a new band today do that is totally original. In fact if you somehow ARE original you wont even be allowed to play because the corporates want something LIKE something else thats already making money. If it isnt original its hard to get too excited as an audience.(Cheaper)Its like Golf. In the old days when you paid $2.50 to play 18 holes if it rained you didnt care. If you quit before dark it was OK. If the group in front was slow, so what, you only paid $2.50. Now the experience has to be perfect and worth the $50 you paid. People are more demanding of the fair value for what they are being asked to fork over. Because the costs are so high the stakes are high and so original stuff isnt allowed. It must be sure to make money. As such the companies are marketing groups like the Stones who couldnt possibly have the performance energy they used to have. (Younger) We had more energy. When the hormones were all raging it was easier to get all fired up about the band, the show, and all the mages that the music conjured up. You can hear the enthusiasm i all these live albums. Today Im more analytical about the things that happen during the show itself. The equipment, the technology used, the techniques of the players. Musicians are by and large doing it for the money now. Period. Get on, get off, paycheck please. Im not saying they havent earned that right or whatever. Thats just the way it is today. unfortunately. Nothing raises the le vel of activity like hunger. Musicians arent hungry anymore. Ill add a last word. In the old days if you got all drunk at a show you were liable. Today the concert venue may be liable. So much is done to dampen the "enthusiasm" so things "dont get out of hand". In the old days that was the whole idea, to get things to a point where they were deliciously "out of hand". I hate to sound like a "things were always better" person because Im not. I could see the boaconstrictor of the music industry starting to do this years ago. We are today where i thought it looked like it was going to be. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 14:59:46 EST From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: My Neck NJC Well, the results are in and I'm afraid the news isn't good. I saw the neurosurgeon today and he recommends surgery to be done and not to tarry about it too much. I have several disc protrusions resulting in moderate spinal cord flattening which in a nutshell means if I don't have the surgery things will only get much worse. I am very stressed right now and probably won't be posting too much in the days to come. Just pray for me that things will turn out OK as this surgery is very dangerous. Oh and Steve, I got the tape today. thank you. Love, Rose ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 15:52:50 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC In a message dated 10/30/00 4:35:47 AM, hell@ihug.co.nz writes: >Obviously I've taken two extremes, and he is still capable of writing some >good songs! Nash and Crosby have not "deteriorated" as much IMO, and Crosby >in particular is still writing some good stuff. >I guess it comes back to one of the other reasons I love Joni so much. >The lyrics are as strong and meaningful as they were 30 years ago. I do understand why many folks connect primarily with the lyrics in a song. But for me songs are music, and none of the writers we've mentioned here, including, I'm afraid, Joni, write music as inspired and interesting and moving as they once did many years ago. In my less than humble opinion, of course. - -Fred Simon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:55:03 EST From: AsharaJM@aol.com Subject: Some questions about VideoTree #2 I've had several questions about this tree, and you can bet that if 1 or 2 people have asked, there are more out there wanting to know. So...here are a few answers so far. Q. Will there be a PAL version available? A. YES!! If you go to either the Branch or Leaf sign ups, you will see that you have many choices. Q. How do I know where to send the blank tapes for tree vol. 1 and 2?  After the cut-off date for Leaf sign ups, (November 18th) I will post a list of Branches and their leaves. It will be the responsibility of both the Branches *and* the leaves to get in touch with each other so you will know where to send your tapes. Q. How long will it take to receive my tapes? A. That will depend entirely on how quickly you send out your tapes, and how quickly your branch dubs them and sends them back to you. Please remember that every Branch is a VOLUNTEER, and may have many sets to dub. Please be patient! To sign up for VideoTree #2: Branches: http://www.jmdl.com/trading/branchsignup.cfm Leaves: http://www.jmdl.com/trading/leafsignup.cfm Hugs, Ashara www.photon.net/lightnet ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:40:26 -0600 From: "Michael Paz" Subject: War or SOB (Same Old Band) Victor Wrote: "Apparently, my friend's sister was the MC at a show that WAR did recently in Atlanta and they fell in love on stage. So he came with her to the housewarming party. It was definately the highlight of my weekend Victor- For your info, the band known as War lost their rights to the name to on of the more astute business guys in the band and the main songwriters in the band got left out in the cold because they were not on top of the game. BB Dickerson, Harold Brown, Lee Oskar, Howard Scott, the lions share of the original members of War are now performing under the name of SOB (Same Old Band) or Guerra (War en espanol). These guys are the writers of those legendary WAR Hits - Low Rider, Cisco Kid, World is a Ghetto, Slippin Into Darkness, Why Can't We Be Friends?...etc. The web site is at http://www.sob-online.com/ if you want more info. They have been on my TV show a couple of times now and Harold Brown is a friend and New Orleans resident. I just thought you should have more info on these guys. I have not seen the band you are referring to, but they have played New Orleans lately. Sounds like you had a gas playing with their guitar layer though. Rock on Bro! Paz NP-Rhythm of Life-Paula Cole ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 18:10:47 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Some questions about VideoTree #2 NJC Ashara, Of course I have already done the sign-up thingy, but I DID forget to say a big THANKS in advance for putting the whole thing together. Thanks to Simon as well for the material and rare footage he contributed. I'm looking forward to it! Bob NP: All I Want ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 18:59:30 -0500 From: dsk Subject: Re: Joni/guitar gods peves@marlboro.edu wrote: > Mark Knopfler, Frank Zappa, Richard Thompson, Walt Becker, Larry > Carlton, Jorma Richard Thompson -- I was wondering where people think he fits in the guitar god pantheon. To me his guitar playing is amazing, and usually sounds like at least two guitars being played, one for the steady bassline and another with intricate notes all around that and not always following the same beat. And then sometimes he also taps the wood of the guitar for a percussive sound -- how many fingers does that man have? And then hearing sounds like the bells of Big Ben -- where did they come from? Last Monday I saw THE MAN himself in a solo performance, him and his guitar non-stop for over two hours. And from five rows away in a little theater I still couldn't figure out how he did all of that at the same time, and gracefully too, and sing too! The whole show blew me away. (And then having a chat with him after the show that ended with him saying "... a convert. Bless you" and patting me on the arm. Sweet. There's nothing quite like talking to a hero from four inches away, a first for me.) Hearing him play Woodstock at Joni's tribute woke me up to appreciating the sound of a guitar, to the point of focusing mostly on that now. For years I've given almost all my attention to the lyrics of songs (without realizing it) and no one can match Joni for the precision, beauty and subtlety of her lyrics, but Richard's guitar playing, wow, that's a whole new language, so visceral I'm completely smitten. And after hearing him, all of a sudden Eric Clapton and Carlos Santana captured me too. Dave Matthews did also because his guitar is a living being, especially when he plays with Tim Reynolds. In fact, at least on Luther College, the guitars are the main voice, and some of Dave's singing sounds like he's trying to mimic it. Mmmm. Not that I'm deaf to the words now, and certainly not to the singing, but hearing guitars at the forefront is a wonderful new way of hearing music. (Apparently I'm giving my analyzing brain a rest these days, maybe, finally.) Debra Shea NP: Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds, Live at Luther College, Lover Lay Down, hot and sweet at the same time, wonderful..... I could listen all day and hear new sounds each time. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 18:59:17 EST From: Julian51469@aol.com Subject: Treasure Trove o' Joni Hello dear friends, It's been while since I've had time to read the "list" but I litterally have my hands full with a beautiful baby daughter by the name of Lucy Iris (she was born October 1st, 12 minutes after midnight, between sides one and two of CSNY's "So Far" album...you know the one with the Joni drawing on the cover). Well the other day the three of us were out for a stroll in a glorious DC fall day when we happened upon a yard sale on 16th street... After a two minutes of browsing I spied Joni's face on the cover of a thin book peering up from the grass and colored leaves. Before I even looked inside it I bought it for .50 cents...The book is by Leonore Fleischer and is simply called "Joni Mitchell Her Life Her Loves Her Music and came out in 1976. The book is filled with tons of pictures and and a wonderfully naive, dated and inspiring write-up. I then looked a little further into a couple milk crates and hit the jack-pot: The "Blue", "For the Roses", "Joni Mitchell Songbook 1966-1970", "The Dulcimer Book" by Jean Ritchie, "How to Make and Play the Dulcimore" by Chet Hines, and (one of the Holy Grails of Joni Mitchelldom...) "The Music of Joni Mitchell" with a list of known tunes and a massive list of unknown, unrecorded tunes (it actually starts off with her poem from highschool "The Fishbowl"). I am still reeling from this find. The real kicker came when the owner of these books said that I could have them all for $10!!! I said that that was an increadible deal and that I could give her a few of my tapes as added payment. Needless to say, I'm still walking on air about my finds...now I just need to find the time to actually use these books....soon, soon. If anyone would like to get copies of the sheet music for the unreleased tunes please e-mail me privately. My "Unreleased Tape" is on hold seeing as I lent out my "Club 57" tape and the guy who was going to transfer it to a CDR went on an emergency mission to Texas...who knows when he'll be back....soon, soon. Untill later, Take care, Julian ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 20:10:29 -0600 From: "kerry" Subject: Seeing Stars NJC >>I feel something comparable when looking up into the clear night sky at all those stars. You know, it only occurred to me recently that you would see the same stars.>> Colin, That was really a beautiful thought. My partner and I went to Montana 2 summers ago. We couldn't believe all the stars...and with the mountains as a backdrop! It was wonderful. All this talk about nature is, in a way, depressing me. I started my adult life with dreams of someday living in a log cabin and being a forest ranger and in life's weird twists and turns ended up as a teacher in the inner city. Now, since that was too stressful I took a job that I really like, but I mainly work in the back of a building downtown with NO WINDOWS and no more summers off!!! I'm already planning my next vacation - We will start in northern Wisconsin, head to Minnesota and then, Canada of course!!!! Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 17:49:54 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Neil Young Album Buying suggestions NJC Hell wrote: >> Nash and Crosby have not "deteriorated" as much IMO, >>and Crosby in particular is still writing some good stuff. >>I guess it comes back to one of the other reasons I love >>Joni so much. > >The lyrics are as strong and meaningful as they were 30 years ago. and Fred wrote: > I do understand why many folks connect primarily with the >lyrics in a song. But for me songs are music, and none of >the writers we've mentioned here, including, I'm afraid, Joni, >write music as inspired and interesting and moving as they >once did many years ago. In my less than humble opinion, of course. Fred, I'm not totally disputing what you say here. I agree with you about some of Crosby, Nash and Joni's later efforts compared to the early works. But.... I've been quite amazed by Crosby's recent songs written for his group CPR, especially from the music standpoint. CPR has another album coming out sometime soon and the couple Crosby songs I've heard previewed gave me absolute chills because they reminded me musically so much of early Joni. Check out CPR if you haven't already. Also, I adore Nash but have never much cared for his music. However, he seems to be going through some kind of renaissance and I like his newer music very much. He's currently working on a solo album of new songs that I'm very curious to check out. As for Joni, I think she still has the potential to blow us away musically like she used to - I still hold out hope. ;-) Kakki NP; Byrds early demos - For Me Again ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 17:54:16 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Five Fave Guitarists It's really impossible to pick just five and I agree with everyone's choices so far. I decided to pick five faves who I've actually seen perform live in ADDITION to Joni ;-) In no particular order: Larry Carlton Jorma Kaukonen John Mayall Jeff Pevar Richie Havens Kakki NP: Byrds - Tomorrow Is A Long Ways Away ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:19:18 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: My Neck NJC rose, darling, my best wishes!!! i'll be thinking of you and praying god/goddess, the source of health and well-being, for your recovery. love, wallyK - -----Mensaje original----- De: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]En nombre de RoseMJoy@aol.com Enviado el: Lunes, 30 de Octubre de 2000 05:00 p.m. Para: joni@smoe.org Asunto: My Neck NJC Well, the results are in and I'm afraid the news isn't good. I saw the neurosurgeon today and he recommends surgery to be done and not to tarry about it too much. I have several disc protrusions resulting in moderate spinal cord flattening which in a nutshell means if I don't have the surgery things will only get much worse. I am very stressed right now and probably won't be posting too much in the days to come. Just pray for me that things will turn out OK as this surgery is very dangerous. Oh and Steve, I got the tape today. thank you. Love, Rose ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:22:14 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?tal=EDa=2C_margarita_and_juanita_NJC?= i've been listening to a cd copy of joan baez's magnificent ''gulf winds'' and i was wondering if she may have written this song to an open G tuning. what do you hear guitar players? wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 20:26:35 -0600 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists In no particular order... Trey Anastasio -- he can play the most amazing solos without looking at where his fingers are at. Very few guitar players can do that! Tim Reynolds -- without a doubt, the master of the acoustic guitar, although IMO not that great an electric player Kenny Withrow -- undoubtedly the most underrated guitarist out there. Lately I've been trying to figure out his stuff, but it's hard Susan Tedeski -- I heard her perform yesterday afternoon on E-Town. Very, very good Nick Drake -- a genius in his own style, he created some beautiful chords that blended perfectly with his words NP-Grateful Dead, 2/9/73 - Here Comes Sunshine (1st) - -- Mark Domyancich Harpua@revealed.net tape trading: http://homepage.mac.com/mtd/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 19:48:34 -0700 From: Les Irvin Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists NJC I can't seem to resist these lists: in random order - Pat Metheny Pierre Bensusan John McLean (from Chicago - do you know him Fred?) Clarence White Tony Rice Les NP: NE JoniFest 2000 DAT's - soon to be on CD! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 22:55:14 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists NJC Oh sure, why not.... 1. Chuck Berry 2. Stevie Ray Vaughan 3. Mark Knopfler 4. Chet Atkins 5. Eddie Van Halen 5. Carlos Santana 5. Ani DiFranco 5. Thurston Moore Wow - I'm surprised I could keep it to 5! ;~D Bob NP: Edith & The Kingpin, Red Rocks '83 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:37:04 EST From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists Here's mine: Jimi Hendrix Frank Marino Stanley Jordan Tuck Andress Jerry Garcia - -Julius who gives an honorable mention to Fred Frith ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 12:34:45 +0800 (PHT) From: Joseph Palis Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists not really a guitar person, but those who knocked me silly with their virtuosity includes: 1) alex de grassi 2) michael hedges 3) william ackerman 4) sara hickman 5) eric tingstad joseph (a big windham hill fan since the early 80s, and an even bigger fan of fred simon!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 21:35:07 -0800 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: talía, margarita and juanita NJC > > i've been listening to a cd copy of joan baez's magnificent ''gulf winds'' > and i was wondering if she may have written this song to an open G tuning. > what do you hear guitar players? > wallyK > I don't know what tuning she's playing in but I would love to get my hands on that cd! I don't think I've ever seen 'Gulf Winds' on cd and I think it's one of Joan's best. The title track & 'Sweeter For Me' - really beautiful songs. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 00:17:05 -0600 (CST) From: michael w yarbrough Subject: Re: Five Fave Guitarists (NJC) other than Joni, of course, and I, like Kakki, limit myself to those I've seen live: Ani DiFranco Carrie Brownstein (of Sleater-Kinney) Prince Tim Gane (of Stereolab) Vance Kelly (Chicago blues guitarist/singer) - --Michael - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Sometimes I contemplate moving to a warmer place But then the lake and skyline give me a warm embrace." - --Common, "Reminding Me (Of Sef)" On Tue, 31 Oct 2000, Joseph Palis wrote: > > not really a guitar person, but those who knocked me silly with their > virtuosity includes: > > 1) alex de grassi > 2) michael hedges > 3) william ackerman > 4) sara hickman > 5) eric tingstad > > > joseph > (a big windham hill fan since the early 80s, and an even bigger fan of > fred simon!) > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 03:47:54 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Five Fave Guitarists (NJC) other than joni -- whom i consider a FABULOUS guitar player and innovator, to the point that she has created a school of her own -- and limited to those i've seen, five of my favorites are [in no order and excluding classical music performers and jmdl members]: steve howe joe pass joão gilberto leo kottke adrian belew wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 22:35:40 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Back in 1974 (MD) > First of all everything as so much newer then. Second of all everything was > so much cheaper. Third of all we were so much younger then. Marcel, I have to say how much I always appreciate your historical perspective. As much as I enjoyed those early days, I was, as Steve Dulson said the other day "a mere child" who of course, just gladly lapped it all up at the time, but was too young in some respects to have the perspective of you and others who were experiencing it from a longer view. I did have a slight panic attack the other day when Lori wrote about the 70s being the decade when it all really came to fruition. Yes, the 70s were happening big time, but to me, the genesis of it all started from about '63 on and was so much more exciting than what followed in the 70s. Lori, I hope your boss will consider the 60s more - I felt a little like a victim of "revisionist history" when I read about his book! I know that we all hold the times when we become young adults as the "most important" to some extent but lordy, it is historical fact that so much was exploding in the decade that preceded the 70s - the Kennedy years idealism (1960-1963) really helped kick it all off, the Free Speech movement (1963), Civil Rights demonstrations (early 60s) and the Civil Rights Act (1964), the first protests against the Vietnam war (really got going strong by 1966 by my recall), "Flower Power" - Summer of Love '67, Woodstock '69 to name a few. The revolution in music was happening and there are too many artists to cite in support of this except to say there were more innovators emerging in the musical realm in the 60s than in the 70s. Lori, I think you cited to "Sugar, Sugar" being the no. 1 hit of 1969. Well, not in my neck of the woods! Yeah, "Sugar" was popular among some people but it was right beside the Doors, Cream, Jimi Hendrix, Joni, Love, Jefferson Airplane and scores of other groups that were certainly not "Bubble Gum"! ;-) I tend to think that part of the beauty of that time was that a song like "Sugar, Sugar" could be played and enjoyed and acheive chart status alongside the "heavyweights" of the time. Radio was wide open, truly liberal - and everyone got a shot for awhile there. Lori - please don't think I'm singling you out - the same day you wrote I was comparing notes with a friend at work about seeing "Almost Famous". Because of his age, the apex for him was the 70s, but I gasped when he said that all the great and improtant music happened then! For what it's worth, I have a very close friend whose apex was the 80s and he is convinced that all the great and important music happened *then*. Interestingly, my 80s oriented friend never knew much about Joni. I've "tutored" him a bot and he has been extremely impressed with her and guess which album he thinks is her greatest? DOG EAT DOG. Ha! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 04:06:49 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: costumes for tonight [vjc] have a wonderful halloween everybody!!!! don't eat too much candy, though. what are your costumes for this evening? i'm in two minds between joni in her miyasaki, mishosokki, shiitake [how do you spell that name, for god's sake!] outfit and queen elizabeth II in her phosphorescent green halston suit and her teapot cozy of a hat. i can't decide which one is more horrifying... suggestions welcome. wally K ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 23:48:56 -0800 From: Steven Barton Subject: Re: So Neil can't play guitar solos, can Joni? > Clapton, Page and Howe are great guitar players but not one of the three play in a way that moves me like Neil does. My feelings exactly! Neil can really make the guitar sing and evoke a variety of emotions. When rehearsing for the Ragged Glory tour, the Gulf War broke out. As a result the set list was changed and the music took on a whole different feeling! Blowing in the Wind had a long sequence filled with the sound of sirens, machine guns and bombs exploding...all from a couple of guitars! And Cortez the Killer almost makes you weep, it is filled with such emotion and color. Check out the WELD album and hear a much more developed artist than the one who played the "one note solos" back in the early days. Steve ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #572 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?