From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #465 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe JMDL Digest Friday, August 25 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 465 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Amazon Recommendations (SJC) ["Alan Lorimer" ] NJC: Trouble with trading [Manno Toshikazu ] Re: Definitive Versions of BSN songs (NJC) ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: NJC lions and dolphins [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re" Lyrics ["Blair Fraipont" ] Re: Does anyone have any Joni bootlegs to trade? [Don Rowe ] Re: Coyote - why a defector? ["Kakki" ] Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... [Seulbzzaj@aol.com] Fwd: Re: Coyote - why a defector? [Susan McNamara ] Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) [MDESTE1@aol.com] Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... [Seulbzzaj@aol.com] RE: While we're on the subject of BSN... ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re Lyrics [Gertus@aol.com] Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Does anyone have any Joni bootlegs to trade? [RandyRemote ] Jonatha live (njc) [Christopher Treacy ] Re: Re Lyrics ["Mark or Travis" ] definitive... [Christopher Treacy ] Re: Coyote - why a defector?; WARNING---Metaphorical content, LONG ["Jim ] lyrics [Christopher Treacy ] Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: popular vs. passionate [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re:While we're on the subject of BSN... [RoseMJoy@aol.com] At last...Stevie's Come Along! ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] joni sales/lagging audience ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] Re: Coyote - why a defector? [Dflahm@aol.com] Lahm's Coyote ["Christopher J. Treacy" ] Re: no joni content NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: While we're on the subject of BSN...NJC [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] FAvorite lyrics [IVPAUL42@aol.com] FAvorite lyrics [IVPAUL42@aol.com] RE: At last...Stevie's Come Along! (njc) ["Nikki Johnson" ] re: favorite lyrics ["Ray and Cathy" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:04:12 +1000 From: "Alan Lorimer" Subject: Re: Amazon Recommendations (SJC) I just checked out Amazon's recommendations for music for me, which are based on previous purchases, and lo and behold the following recommendation caught my eye: Jazz Takes On Joni Mitchell by our own David Lahm! It even gets a five star recommendation courtesy of a Lady from New Zealand (not our Hell though). Isn't it good to see that Amazon is promoting music by JMDL members :-) Alan Lorimer Hawley Beach Tasmania ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:37:16 +0900 (JST) From: Manno Toshikazu Subject: NJC: Trouble with trading Hi, All. I'm sorry for my questions not related JM. But the materials are JM's. I've been troubling with a trader. I trade some CDRs and VHS tapes with a person. He sent me 4 CDRs and videos. 3 CDRs are made by Dysan. 1 CDR made by dysan was already unreadable, and the rest of two became unreadable after 3 month. I realized that Dysan is the worst manufacturer. I claimed him to re-send me. But He denied it. And I asked him why he use Dysan's. His answer was "Because it is the most expensive." I was very confused. After some months later, he sent me a E-Mail, he would send me substitutes. But he missed my name, as female. (I'm male.) I answered that E-Mail but he never ent me. I'm been confused. So I have two questions; 1. In this case, should he send me substitutes in your common sense? 2. In Japan, we can't buy Dysan's. Is Dysan's CDR more expensive than other manufacturers? Thanks in advance. Manno Toshikazu ---Music, The Final Frontier--- jacopas@geocities.co.jp http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Cabaret/7219/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 06:44:14 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Definitive Versions of BSN songs (NJC) > Sheena Easton - The Man That Got Away (better than Jeff Buckley's, or Ella > Fitzgerald or Linda Eder, but they say Judy Garland's is the best but > haven't heard it yet -- from what album was this anyway?) I believe Judy sang 'The Man That Got Away' in just about every concert she did once the song entered her repertoire. It became a second signature song after 'Over the Rainbow'. The original version would be on the soundtrack of 'A Star Is Born' and I can't imagine anyone eclipsing that one, ever. It also appears on 'Judy at Carnegie Hall' and I'm sure there are other live performances of it floating around out there. The song was written by Harold Arlen & Ira Gershwin specifically for 'As Star Is Born'. > k.d. lang - So In Love (full of pain and agony and ecstasy at the same > time. sublime!) What is this song from? I don't know this one. Is it from a movie soundtrack? I know k.d. sang 'Skylark' on the soundtrack of 'Midnight in the Garden of Good & Evil' but I'm not familiar with 'So In Love'. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 10:03:27 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Definitive Versions of BSN songs (NJC) Mark or Travis wrote: > > > What is this song from? I don't know this one. Is it from a movie > soundtrack? I know k.d. sang 'Skylark' on the soundtrack of 'Midnight > in the Garden of Good & Evil' but I'm not familiar with 'So In Love'. And Bette's Skylark would be my definitive version. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 07:10:05 -0700 From: Leslie Mixon Subject: Music Calendar (NJC) I feel so blessed to be living in the Bay Area - upcoming shows in my little town of Santa Cruz; two of the shows are at Palookaville, with a capacity of 633 - Rickie Lee Jones and Dan Hicks with the Hot Licks. Richard Thompson is also playing there in a few weeks, but I only afford to be so much of a music slut. Also purchased tickets for the Brian Wilson Pet Sounds tour (we're taking Jim Johanson to the Brian Wilson show) and Herbie Hancock with Wayne Shorter at the Santa Cruz Civic Auditorium! A lucky girl. Anyone else have some exciting concerts coming up? Leslie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 10:04:40 EDT From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC lions and dolphins In a message dated 8/22/00 5:38:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, wally aka the squinter writes: << HAPPY BIRTHDAY, ASHARA, eternally playful dolphin and lion!!! blessings, wallyk >> a few years ago Ashara, who probably doesn't remember this,sent me a message about her love of dolphins. earlier this summer i was out in the early morning running. i went out to the dock which floats on top of a tidal stream that is near the ocean an therefore brackish. the tide was high and i stopped for a minute out there and just look at things. i sat down on the dock and it was still dark, maybe around 5:30 am. a big boat was coming really fast down the stream. big like....50 feet big. i was so impressed with it that i just sat there and watched. then i realized, that big fucking boat was not going to slow down. and there i was on a dock that is about 7 feet wide and about 100 feet long and floats with telephone poles piercing it every 20 feet. i was half way out on the dock and there was no way to get off with out jumping in and i didn't want to do that cause i had on running shoes and a walkman, so i jumped up and grabbed onto a telephone pole with both arms and just held on. the wake was huge and the dock was rocking so hard i almost fell in. the thing must have raised the dock a good five feet. finally it settled down again and i yelled at the guy but he was long gone. i think i called him a big boat jerkoff...you know, from holding on to the pole like that. it was so distressing of an experience that i just stood there for a minute. then all of a sudden, i heard this ...woosshhh. and i looked to the water and there was a dolphin. then there was another one and even another one. three of them swimming almost 5 miles inland from the ocean in a tidal stream in water that was about 30 feet deep at high tide. they came right up to the edge of the dock and i knelt down and could have touched them if they would have kept still long enough. i walked them all the way down to the end of the dock and watched them swim off. then i thought that if i had not gone out early that morning to run, and i had not gone on the dock, and i had not stopped to look around, and i had not admired that big boat too long, and i had not held on to the pole, and i had not stood there for an extra minute, i would never have seen the three dolphins. and then all that made me think of this canticle in the 3rd chapter of Daniel.... you dolphins and water creatures, bless the lord. and then that made me think of ashara. happy birthday ashara, amelia, kakki, and every other leo out there on this list. patrick np. dire straits love over gold ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 10:11:23 EDT From: "Blair Fraipont" Subject: Re" Lyrics I wish I had the wings Of Noahs pretty little white dove I would fly this raging river To reach the one i love But I have no wings And the water is So wide We'll have to row a little harder It's just in dreams we fly In my dreams we fly! I love it, i love it.. VA BENE!! blair bliggity F ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 07:35:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Does anyone have any Joni bootlegs to trade? - --- Relayer211@aol.com wrote: > I only love > 70's Joni Music,so shows > from the 70's are the only ones I'd be interested > in...preferably with Joni > talking to the audience on it. I guess that means I won't be burning you a copy of the mixing board back-up tapes from the "Dog Eat Dog" sessions -- even though there's this really cool argument, at the end of which Joni knocks Dolby and Klein's heads together -- decides it sounds really cool, samples it into the Fairlight CMI and uses it as the congas patch on "Ethiopia"? ;-) Don Rowe THIS IS A JOKE -- I HAVE NO SUCH RECORDING ... ===== "Closer Now" is now available at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 22:39:21 +0800 (JST) From: Joseph Palis Subject: Re: Definitive Versions of BSN songs (NJC) > > > k.d. lang - So In Love (full of pain and agony and ecstasy at the > same > > time. sublime!) > > What is this song from? I don't know this one. Is it from a movie > soundtrack? I know k.d. sang 'Skylark' on the soundtrack of 'Midnight > in the Garden of Good & Evil' but I'm not familiar with 'So In Love'. SO IN LOVE was composed by Cole Porter. k.d. lang sang this song in the Cole Porter tribute album called RED HOT + BLUE. This album also contained Annie Lennox's EVERYTIME WE SAY GOODBYE and another good singer's version of a Porter song: Lisa Stansfield's DOWN IN THE DEPTHS. The soundtrack of MIDNIGHT IN THE GARDEN OF GOOD AND EVIL also featured good performances from Paula Cole, but its k.d.'s SKYLARK I remember most especially how it was used in the opening scene of the film that immediately set the atmosphere of the setting: Truman Capote territory. Joseph np: Rufus Wainwright ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:31:22 EDT From: RSTM@aol.com Subject: Re: Lyrics Going through a period of self examination (I am too tired to blow it up into a full blown mid-life crisis), I was struck again by these lyrics: You could have been more Than a name on the door On the thirty-third floor in the air More than a consumer Lying in some room trying to die More than a credit card Swimming pool in the backyard The Arrangement - LOTC Of course, it does not apply to me - my office is not on the 33rd floor and I have no swimming pool. It does convince me that one of the wonderful things about JM is her ability to seize on a timeless theme -- selling out -- and choose to put it in a song, and then nail it both in lyrics and in melody/delivery. All at a very young age (early 20's)! I am not worthy. Ron suite 2288 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:55:13 EDT From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? I'm cycling back into list participation again and this one caught my eye, mostly because I was jogging to the Heirja CD this morning. Defector/deserter - why the first? I think that "defector" gives the action more of a values/ethical commentary to the action than deserter. "Deserters" remains open to a wide variety of reasons for leaving: fear, laziness, something better on TV. For me, "defector" implies leaving because those "petty wars" create a soul stirring reason for taking the hasta la vista. You might go back to it if things improved. That's what I was thinking until I tripped on the sidewalk. MG np: CRASH! The sound of my summer bachelorettehood coming to an end! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:36:14 -0400 From: B Merrill Subject: Re: Does anyone have any Joni boots to patch? >I only love >> 70's Joni Music,so shows >> from the 70's are the only ones I'd be interested >> in...preferably with Joni >> talking to the audience on it. >I guess that means I won't be burning you a copy of >the mixing board back-up tapes from the "Dog Eat Dog" >sessions -- even though there's this really cool >argument, at the end of which Joni knocks Dolby and >Klein's heads together -- decides it sounds really >cool, samples it into the Fairlight CMI and uses it as >the congas patch on "Ethiopia"? ;-) Do these heads resonate nicely, or is there too much sloshing of the brains? Youth wants to know... - --Briar "Patch" Adams ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:13:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? Once again, a perfect choice of words on Ms. Mitchell's part. Not only is it much more evocative than "deserter" ... or even "objector" (which would still have been fresh in the newly post-Viet Nam political mindscape) ... it helps to tie Hejira together as a whole -- especially considering the "neutral cafe" of "Blue Motel Room", and it's attendant cold war imagery. Don Rowe ===== "Closer Now" is now available at http://www.mp3.com/donrowe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 12:55:41 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? Don wrote: > Once again, a perfect choice of words on Ms. > Mitchell's part. Not only is it much more evocative > than "deserter" ... or even "objector" (which would > still have been fresh in the newly post-Viet Nam > political mindscape) ... it helps to tie Hejira > together as a whole -- especially considering the > "neutral cafe" of "Blue Motel Room", and it's > attendant cold war imagery. Joni tells us "Hejira" means "a leaving with honor" . My dictionary defines it as "separation, flight, a trip or journey, especially one made to escape a dangerous or undesirable situation." While the songs on the album all do seem to tie into this general theme, Joni never quite specifies or describes the situation she is leaving. Where are these "petty wars" occuring - with the music biz, with friends, with lovers, or all of the above? She is not deserting, she is defecting from an undesirable situation. One of the definitions of defection in the dictionary is "desertion", but an alternative definition is "an abandonment of loyalty." Yet, she has every intention of returning at some point, when "love sucks me back that way." She admits "it's funny how these old feelings hang around, you think they're gone, no, no, they just go underground, will you still love me when I get back to L.A. town?" In "Blue Motel Room" she seems to have gotten back some of her perspective. The hejira seems to have been good for her. I've also always wondered about the Amelia Earhart tie-in. I don't know much about Earhart's life but I do recall reading that she may also have been trying to find away to escape her fame and dilemmas in her personal life. While I will never dispute on any level that Hejira is a complete masterpiece, there is a sadness and a heaviness in it for me that has always made it somewhat hard for me to listen to. It is probably my least-played of Joni albums for that reason. Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:13:34 EDT From: Seulbzzaj@aol.com Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... I agree that Phoebe Snow's version of At Last is a real killer, but to me, Joni claimed ownership of the song (not that I wouldn't listen to Phoebe's). Billie Holiday didn't actually have a 'hit' with Comes Love - it was a track on one of Verve lp's. As for your list below of songs from BSN, I would guess that Joni was familiar with Billie's recordings of You're My Thrill, You've Changed, and Don't Worry 'Bout Me (although Sinatra did possibly the greatest version of that song). Don't Go To Strangers was a hit for Etta Jones(not James), who BTW, is a very underrated jazz singer, and I hope all of you check her out - Dinah Washington also did an excellent version of that. Sometime's I'm Happy was recorded as a wild scat vocal on "Sassy Swings The Tivoli", but was best known in jazz circles from Lester Young's recording. - Scott In a message dated Tue, 22 Aug 2000 11:19:51 PM Eastern Daylight Time, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: << A couple weeks back I picked up a tape for a buck at the record store. It was the New York Rock & Soul Revue from a couple of years ago, with Donald Fagen, Michael McDonald, Phoebe Snow, Charles Brown, etc. I got it for the Steely Dan content, but was really blown away by the whole show! Phoebe Snow just tears up "At Last" on it, I mean she just wails! Which got me thinking about the definitive versions of the songs on Joni's BSN project. I know Etta James haad a hit with At Last, Lena Horne with Stormy Weather, Billie Holliday with Comes Love, Nat King Cole with Answer Me, My Love...were there definitive/hit versions of the other songs on the record? Specifically: You're My Thrill You've Changed Don't Go To Strangers Sometimes I'm Happy Don't Worry 'Bout Me I Wish I Were In Love Again Of course, we all know that Hole has the definitive version of BSN, or is it Jim Nabors? Or Leonard Nimoy? :~) Bob NP: Joe Jackson, "The In Crowd" >> ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:30:11 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: Fwd: Re: Coyote - why a defector? >Joni tells us "Hejira" means "a leaving with honor" . My dictionary defines >it as "separation, flight, a trip or journey, especially one made to escape >a dangerous or undesirable situation." While the songs on the album all do >seem to tie into this general theme, Joni never quite specifies or describes >the situation she is leaving. Hejira is such a spiritual album to me I always think of the pilgrim's journey to a higher plane that leaves behind, as the mystics call it, "the world." All worldly things involve suffering, as Joni was definitely studying in her spiritual readings. I've never heard Joni describe Hejira in this way but that's what it conjures for me: the spiritual journey of detachment. >While I will never dispute on any level that Hejira is a complete >masterpiece, there is a sadness and a heaviness in it for me that has always >made it somewhat hard for me to listen to. It is probably my least-played >of Joni albums for that reason. > >Kakki I guess I understand why you would feel this way, Kakki, but to me the transcendent emotions are always a high every time I listen to it. "These are the clouds of Michaelangelo, muscular with gods and sungold!" Each sad emotion is coupled with a heroic perseverence that is her trademark. (Our Lady of Duality) Take care, sue ____________________ /____________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue McNamara || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake" - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:22:09 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) In a message dated 8/24/00 1:50:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: << While the songs on the album all do seem to tie into this general theme, Joni never quite specifies or describes the situation she is leaving. >> I am basing this comment on the order in which Jonis albums are listed in the lyrics section of the JMDL and assuming that that is in fact the order they were done in. According to that list (not counting Hits or Misses) Hejira was written after Hissing and before Don Juans RD. before Mingus and Dog Eat Dog. When I look at the works prior to Hissing I see MOA which is a live album and before that all the cool early albums well before she embarced on the radical trails that would come later. Hissing of course is very very different than anything before it. Hejira at the same time is different than anything AFTER it. Yet it is an album in tone and feel that is closer than what came before Hissing than after Hejira. (are you following this?) My guess is that she could be talking about relationships but if she is it is my guess that she is talking about that in conjunction with her music. Hejira sits at he crossroads of her career. The point at which she could never turn back. She doesnt return to this "mood" or style for another 7 albums in Night Ride Home. Furthermore, based on the impressions I picked up from DED she began with Hejira a future metamorphosis into the creation of the LAMM. For this reason I would have to vote for the reference to defection and "petty wars" referring to whatever relationship she was going south on but it was all part of her losing her bearings musically which was that place from which she derived her personal strength and identity. Lots of petty wars" in the music business. Nothing is worse than losing ones grip in their personal relationships AND their career at the same time in their life. I think (and have felt) that the reference to Amelia Erhardt is a direct reference to herself. here was a woman competing in what was known to be strictly the realm of men. In trying to set a universal record of achievement in this field she died. While Joni didnt die the refrence to Icarus is a closer analogy. In trying to reach the heavens her wings burned up and she crashed to earth. Pretty clear metaphor if you ask me. I am currently working on a chronology of this and will post it soon. It promises to be thought provoking. marcel deste ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:40:16 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... In a message dated 8/24/00 4:40:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Seulbzzaj@aol.com writes: << I agree that Phoebe Snow's version of At Last is a real killer, but to me, Joni claimed ownership of the song >> May I suggest you are suffering from the audio version of tunnel vision. Tunnel hearing? Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:54:23 EDT From: Seulbzzaj@aol.com Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... In a message dated Thu, 24 Aug 2000 5:40:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time, IVPAUL42 writes: << In a message dated 8/24/00 4:40:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Seulbzzaj@aol.com writes: << I agree that Phoebe Snow's version of At Last is a real killer, but to me, Joni claimed ownership of the song >> May I suggest you are suffering from the audio version of tunnel vision. Tunnel hearing? Paul I >> Sure, you can suggest it, but I don't you if you disagree with me about Phoebe's recording, or Joni's version or both? - Scott ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:14:35 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: While we're on the subject of BSN... LOL!!! you are dangerous scott!!! wallyk > May I suggest you are suffering from the audio version of tunnel vision. Tunnel hearing? > > Paul I > >> > > Sure, you can suggest it, but I don't you if you disagree with me about Phoebe's recording, or Joni's version or both? > - Scott > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 15:31:42 -0500 From: "Michael Paz" Subject: Jonatha info for you (NJC) I got this in my mailbox today and thought I would pass it on for your info. I can't wait to see her live. Please come to New Orleans Jonatha. Michael NEW JONATHA BROOKE DATES - Solo (All Shows All-Ages except where noted) SEPT. 17 - COLLINGSWOOD, NJ Newton Colony WXPN Music & Arts Festival, Cooper River Park. Phone 215/569-9700. Doors at 12 noon. Jonatha's showtime 3pm. Tickets: $12 advance, $15 at door. SEPT. 22 & 23 - NEW YORK CITY The Fez, 380 Lafayette St. Phone 212/533-3000. Shows at 7:30 & 10pm. Doors at 6:30pm. No opening act. The Fez will be selling tickets to these shows. Tickets: $25-On sale the week of Aug. 28TH at The Fez or at Other Music record store, 15 East 4th St. between Broadway & Lafayette. SEPT. 25 - CHICAGO, IL Schubas, 3159 N. Southport Ave. Shows at 7:00 & 9:30pm (late show ages 21 & over only). Doors at 6:30pm. Tickets: $20. For more info call 773/525-2508 or visit www.schubas.com. OCT. 14 - VIENNA, VA The Barns at Wolf Trap, 1551 Trap Rd., Vienna, VA. Showtime: 7:30pm. Tickets: $18. For more info call 703/218-6500 or visit www.wolftrap.org. DATES SUBJECT TO CHANGE WITHOUT NOTICE. Look for Jonatha's new album in January! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 18:31:08 EDT From: Gertus@aol.com Subject: Re Lyrics Unlurker from London wrote:- Hiya - lurker here, trying to unlurk. It's quite difficult to keep up because the topics change so fast. But the list is a fantastic bunch - and it's great to 'hear' people talking about Joni (I'm a teenager in London and nobody's really heard of her here). I love the references to 'wires in the walls' from Edith & The Kingpin and Man From Mars: "The wires in the walls are humming, a plane in the rain is humming" "I hear you in the water and the wiring in the walls" Welcome to the list from another UKer (in East Sussex). That's a really good spot. I had never noticed the repetition of that idea in those 2 songs. I think it's fairly unlike Joni to use the same phrase in more than one song. Can anyone think of any other examples? I just love it when teenagers get turned on to Joni. Regards Jacky ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 18:40:01 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) << I think (and have felt) that the reference to Amelia Erhardt is a direct reference to herself. here was a woman competing in what was known to be strictly the realm of men. >> I concur, Marcel, and I also think she was possibly comparing herself with Beethoven when she was telling her story on the '00 tour, which ended with him being remembered "for the worst piece of shit he ever wrote". I wonder (assuming this is true) which of her songs she was referring to...would probably either have to be BSN or BYT by default from the comment, but surely she wouldn't be referring to BSN as she re-recorded it for her latest project. That leaves BYT, which she also said she has a soft spot in her heart for...so maybe she was just telling this Beethoven story for the laugh? I doubt it... Bob NP: "For The Roses" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:09:06 -0700 From: RandyRemote Subject: Re: Does anyone have any Joni bootlegs to trade? Don Rowe wrote: > I guess that means I won't be burning you a copy of > the mixing board back-up tapes from the "Dog Eat Dog" > sessions -- even though there's this really cool > argument, at the end of which Joni knocks Dolby and > Klein's heads together -- decides it sounds really > cool, samples it into the Fairlight CMI and uses it as > the congas patch on "Ethiopia"? ;-) > > Don Rowe Yeah, the brutal part was that it took several takes to get the right recording levels and stuff..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:12:22 +1000 From: michaelb@coolgold.com.au Subject: Ricki Lee NJC Hi ya I was just after Ricki's email if anyone has it or if you happen to read this Rick, Hi Ya. I had to change my mother board and lost all my email info Cheers Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 11:27:21 +1000 From: michaelb@coolgold.com.au Subject: Tape Tree Hi All Just wondering if there is a tape tree coming up? Haven't had time to read the digest for the last few months so I don't really know whats been happenin. If the CD Tree ever got of the ground I would be more than willing to do the Australian, New Zealand branch duties as I now have a burner. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:34:14 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of BSN... In a message dated 8/24/00 5:54:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Seulbzzaj writes: << I agree that Phoebe Snow's version of At Last is a real killer, but to me, Joni claimed ownership of the song >> May I suggest you are suffering from the audio version of tunnel vision. Tunnel hearing? Paul I >> Sure, you can suggest it, but I don't you if you disagree with me about Phoebe's recording, or Joni's version or both? - Scott >> I was suggesting that it was "tunnel vision" to think that Joni could claim ownership of a song like that. But since you asked, I think it's also beyond reality to think that Phoebe or anyone for that matter could claim the "definitive" version of a song with that much history. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 20:09:12 EDT From: "star sailor" Subject: no joni content last time i saw joni was about 20 years ago...i still live on blue, ladies of the c, court and spark, and miles of isles... off topic: i'm looking for some native american indian music...i dont even know where to begin. (please not buffy...i have a lot of her stuff already) ps - i enjoy reading the list...even if i'm just a quiet lurker. any suggestions? email private to me so this doesnt clog up your digest. thank you all. now playing: CAT POWER (i recommend it) love, M ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 20:53:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Treacy Subject: Jonatha live (njc) Michael wrote : "I can't wait to see her live"... Well, Michael, if you've never had the pleasure, it's a wonderful experience. Jonatha used to be a dancer, and the way she kicks and stretches while she plya her guitar is, well...quite something! -Chris. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 17:56:00 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Re Lyrics > Unlurker from London wrote:- > > Hiya - lurker here, trying to unlurk. It's quite difficult to keep up > because the topics change so fast. But the list is a fantastic bunch - and > it's great to 'hear' people talking about Joni (I'm a teenager in London and > nobody's really heard of her here). > > I love the references to 'wires in the walls' from Edith & The Kingpin and > Man From Mars: > > "The wires in the walls are humming, a plane in the rain is humming" > "I hear you in the water and the wiring in the walls" 'The Jungle Line' has this line in it: Through i-bars & girders Through wires & pipes The mathematic circuits of The modern nights I don't think the line from 'Man From Mars' necessarily fits in but on THOSL Joni seems to be giving us a sense of something lurking beneath the surface when she refers to these wires and pipes & such. Wires twisting & winding through the walls, underground, across the landscape - somewhat akin to the snake in the grass on the cover or the poppy snake in the dressing room.... Another image that Joni uses more than once is the cactus tree. In the song of that name on STAS and in the line from 'Amelia' about the Cactus Tree Motel. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 20:58:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Treacy Subject: definitive... Jerry wrote it..."Bette's Skylark would be my definitive version." Applause, applause, sir. -Chris NP: "Losing Our Job"- The Roches ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:04:37 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector?; WARNING---Metaphorical content, LONG When Joni tells the Beethoven story / as a prelude to her BSN tour presentation of the amazing "Judgement of the Moon and Stars: Ludwig's Tune", I think she's saying that commercial pressure makes for bad Art. Considering that she feels so strongly that she IN NOT a commercial Product, she has shown a remarkable ability to make peace with her commercial successes. Take "You Turn Me On (I'm A Radio)". If you believe the folklore, and I do, a record company exec (David Geffen? or maybe her manager Elliot Roberts) urged Our Lady to write a hit, saying something like, "Write something that DJ's would like!" In one of the tape trees Joni says that her thought process was "Okay. What do DJ's like? Well, they like the radio." Full stop. So she wrote a radio song about a radio!! - ----- s k i p t h i s i f y o u w a n t !! metaphorical content ---- Okay, now that I've shown that the lineage of the song comes from the corruption of business, I'll talk about Buddhism for just a second. A key image in Buddhism is the lotus blossom. A lotus is a flower that floats in a pond. It's roots are in the soil, the filth, the silt, the dank dark corruption of the pond's bottom. The Buddhists took this simple flower and saw a metaphor for life- we are born of corruption yet we reach upwards, we strive, we extend ourselves towards the Light. Okay, enough. - ---- So the song "You Turn Me On (I'm A Radio)" is a ditty. So Joni says, "So what?" She worked on it, put some wonderful scat singing with it, did some beautiful intertwining interlude with Robben Ford, and lo, behold, the radio hit is now good enough for the Artist to open the "Miles Of Aisles" tour with it! She made her peace with it. Her story about commercial pressure get repeated, get quoted, and remembered forever. But her actions (like reworking I'm A Radio) go unnoticed, undiscussed. - ----- Back to "Judgement of the Moon and Stars: Ludwig's Tune". On the BSN tour, when she talked about commercial pressure making bad Art, I think maybe she holds her self exempt! (Can anyone point to a single song that is a pure ditty? Totally devoid of quality? I think not. There are many examples of naiveté in her lyrics but that's not the same thing.) Certainly she was not following commercial pressure when everyone told her to skip the Mingus project, that Mingus would alienate a lot of fans! Industry people told her it was a poisonous choice for her career. (Like when Paul left Artie.) She did Mingus because I think she's an Artist/Painter first, Artist/Songwriter second, Collaborator third, LA Celebrity/Party Animal fourth and a Commercial Product/Pop Star last. This Pop Star mantle is her cross to bear- her constant burden, and this year, she chose to remind us of that burden. Lama ps- Someone should write an essay called "What is metaphor?" as kind of a 100 level Lit class post. Marcel D? Deb T? Michael Y? I've been thinking about it but I'm committed to writing something a little different..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:06:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Treacy Subject: lyrics Or, how about well expressed anger... "Is your silence that golden? Are you comfortable in it? Is it the key to your freedom, or is it the bars on your prison? Are you gagged by your ribbons? Are you really exclusive, or just miserly? You spend every sentence as if it was marked currency!" "Maybe I'm just kidding myself when I say I love you I don't know - Loving without trusting you get frostbite and sunstroke! I wish I felt nothing.. You pimp - laughing and strutting her to my chartered seat, your old off night backstreet." I love the way she says 'you pimp'. She's pissed! -Chris NP: More Roches (can't get enough these days!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 18:08:15 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? (md) Hissing of course is very very > different than anything before it. Hejira at the same time is different than > anything AFTER it. Yet it is an album in tone and feel that is closer than > what came before Hissing than after Hejira. (are you following this?) I am. I've always thought that 'Hejira' was less musically adventurous than Hissing or Don Juan or even Court and Spark and therefore less interesting. It is more sophisticated than the records that came before Hissing but aside from Jaco, I could never see what was particularly new or innovative about it. Also, although the poetry is lovely and full of wonderful insights, I think Hejira is a totally self-absorbed work. Joni on Joni. I'm not saying that's necessarily a bad thing. Autobiography can be fascinating and with Joni it certainly is. But personally I'm glad she has progressed out of being strictly a confessional songwriter and broadened her horizons a bit. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:26:44 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: popular vs. passionate In a message dated 8/24/00 9:16:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jlamadoo@one.net writes: << Considering that she feels so strongly that she IN NOT a commercial Product, she has shown a remarkable ability to make peace with her commercial successes. Take "You Turn Me On (I'm A Radio)". If you believe the folklore, and I do, a record company exec (David Geffen? or maybe her manager Elliot Roberts) urged Our Lady to write a hit, saying something like, "Write something that DJ's would like!" In one of the tape trees Joni says that her thought process was "Okay. What do DJ's like? Well, they like the radio." Full stop. So she wrote a radio song about a radio!! ----- s k i p t h i s i f y o u w a n t !! metaphorical content ---- Okay, now that I've shown that the lineage of the song comes from the corruption of business >> How is this a corruption of business. I can see this conversation starting with Joni telling the record company or Geffen she wants more money, or a bigger share of the pie or whatever. The response she gets is, "Fine. You want more money? Help us make more, too. Expand your audience. Write a HIT, a song that gets airplay. " There is no question that Joni's largest audience was for her most accessible albums -- Court and Spark mostly, but also For the Roses and Blue. When she returned to doing the music that pleased herself -- particularly DJRD, but also Hissing, Hejira and Mingus -- her audience stayed with her previous albums or went on to other music. There's nothing wrong with suggesting to a musician who wants to make money that he or she write songs that people will like and pay money for. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:29:46 EDT From: RoseMJoy@aol.com Subject: Re:While we're on the subject of BSN... While I was shopping at Annie Sez a few weeks ago I heard Bonnie Raitt's version of At Last. She Rocks!!! I searched a few of her webpages to see if I could locate the album this song was on, but to no avail. Can any of you music sluts help me out here?? Bob Muller??? Rose in NJ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:32:28 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: At last...Stevie's Come Along! Scott wrote: "I agree that Phoebe Snow's version of At Last is a real killer, but to me, Joni claimed ownership of the song (not that I wouldn't listen to Phoebe's)" Not that I would call it definitive, but has abnyone heard Stevie Nicks do "At Last" from the stormy weather shows? WOW! That knocked my socks off. I really didn't think she had it in her...and live ,no less! -Chris. NP:"Sweet Forgiveness"-Bonnie Raitt ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:28:55 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: defector... Kakki wrote: "Joni tells us "Hejira" means "a leaving with honor" . My dictionary defines it as "separation, flight, a trip or journey, especially one made to escape a dangerous or undesirable situation." While the songs on the album all do seem to tie into this general theme, Joni never quite specifies or describes the situation she is leaving." IMOH, It's the whole ugly picture. Most of this was written while apparently driving back across the country, right around the time of the Rolling Thunder tour. Joni has mentioned several times that she felt as though both her emotional and physical self were feeling very abused at this point, and driving across country helped her get back to square 1. I do believe there was also that break-up matter with John Guerin... Just some ideas... -Chris NP:"Gamblin' Man"-Bonnie Raitt ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:44:14 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: joni sales/lagging audience Paul wrote:"When she returned to doing the music that pleased herself -- particularly DJRD, but also Hissing, Hejira and Mingus -- her audience stayed with her previous albums or went on to other music." I'm not hen-picking at your point, Paul, not in the least, but it's worth noting that except Mingus, all of these records sold gold within a reasonable amount of time...DJRD is the 'last gold seller' for Joni, and HOSL may even have sold platinum. I get annoyed when people talk (including our Joan,herself) about how Joni's audience just falgrantly turned their backs. They actually hung in for a fair bit before losing their patience all together with "Mingus". -Chris ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 23:16:47 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Coyote - why a defector? Kakki, I also do not revisit HEJIRA that often but the main reason for me is that "Coyote" is performed so much more dynamically on S & L. BTW, one of the waiters at Judy's Chelsea sang "Coyote" with me tonight. It's always great to play that. DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 23:56:59 -0400 From: "Christopher J. Treacy" Subject: Lahm's Coyote David wrote:" It's always great to play that." And it must really be great to play it so well! Your "Coyote" is so playfully done - easily my favorite on the "Jazz Takes..." effort. Bravo, David! I'll take this moment to say Thank You. -Chris NP:Reruns of "Upstairs, Downstairs" ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:16:33 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: no joni content NJC << off topic: i'm looking for some native american indian music...i dont even know where to begin. >> Robbie Robertson did a nice record a couple years back...someone help me with the title...I don't have it but I've heard it and it's very good. Sail on Sailor! Bob NP: Joni, "Harry's House" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:18:47 EDT From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: While we're on the subject of BSN...NJC << Bonnie Raitt's version of At Last. She Rocks!!! >> Yes, she does, and I've got a load of her stuff but "At Last" is not on anything I've got. Maybe she's got a new disc out or it's an early release single from an upcoming project... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:38:52 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: FAvorite lyrics It's moments like these in my life that these lines run through my head: I've been sitting up waiting for my sugar to show I've been listening to the sirens and the radio She said she's be over three hours ago, I've been waiting for her car on the hill. She makes friends easy, she's not like me; I watch for judgment anxiously. Now where in the city can that girl be. I've been waiting for her car. Car on the hill. It always seems so righteous at the start when there's so much laughter, so much spark. When there's so much sweetness in the dark. Waiting for her car on the hill. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:39:43 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: FAvorite lyrics Climbin' climbin' Climbing the hiiiiiilllllllllllll. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 00:42:50 -0400 From: "Nikki Johnson" Subject: RE: At last...Stevie's Come Along! (njc) Chris asked: > Not that I would call it definitive, but has anyone heard Stevie Nicks > do "At Last" from the stormy weather shows? WOW! That knocked my socks > off. I really didn't think she had it in her...and live ,no less! Well I had to jump in on this one and say yup I have heard this and was really surprised how well she sang it! I am a huge Stevie fan but her live stuff lately hasn't excited me all that much but this I thought was the most power she's put into anything lately! probably not the definitive version but noteworthy! Nikki "I am just the bitter in a woman growing wise" ~ Terri Hendrix ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 22:30:57 -0700 From: byron bentley Subject: At Last Joni Mitchell, Phoebe Snow, Stevie Nicks, Bonnie Raitt, Jimmy Scott and so many others have great versions of At Last. Each one of them brings new flavor to an amazing song. While none of the above takes on At Last should be missed, especially Phoebe Snow, At Last = Etta James. I'll admit though, I would kick any of the others if they got between me and Joni. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 22:59:14 -0700 From: "Ray and Cathy" Subject: re: favorite lyrics Hopeless romantic that I am, these words have always stuck with me: She dusts her table with his shirt And waves another day good-bye... Cathy in Oregon ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #465 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?