From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #347 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe JMDL Digest Wednesday, June 21 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 347 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Kids these days (NJC) ["Kate Bennett" ] Re: Tunings (NJC) [Catherine McKay ] RE: www.rollingstone.com trashes joni [Louis Lynch ] Re: joni and judy [Jerry Notaro ] RE: joni bashing in downbeat ["Reuben Bell" ] RE: Kids these days (NJC) ["Nikki Johnson" ] Re: joni and judy [SMEBD@aol.com] Nancy LaMott (NJC) [Louis Lynch ] Re: joni and judy ["James L. Leonard" ] Re: joni bashing in downbeat [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Nancy LaMott (NJC) [SMEBD@aol.com] RE: joni bashing in downbeat [Don Rowe ] Re: joni and judy (and the JMDL archives) (NJC) [Catherine McKay ] Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #345 [Catherine McKay ] Re: joni bashing in downbeat [Don Rowe ] Re: joni and judy - now njc to satisfy the grouches [Catherine McKay ] Re: joni and judy [Catherine McKay ] Re: joni and judy ["Reuben Bell" ] Malvina (NJC) [Steve Dulson ] It's a Slow News Day ... (NJC) [Don Rowe ] RE: new job (NJC) ["Sue Cameron" ] Re: joni bashing in downbeat [Mark Domyancich ] Re: joni bashing in downbeat [PFallo@aol.com] brian wilson tix (NJC) ["Victor Johnson" ] Who Todays Kids really are [MDESTE1@aol.com] RE: catman ["Chris Marshall" ] East Troy Concert 1979 (possibley NJC) ["Steve Polifka" ] Re: Mitchell's Canadian voice [B Merrill ] RE: for the roses (NJC) ["Wally Kairuz" ] cheese on the way njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Kids these days (NJC) [Vince Lavieri ] Re: Beat of Black Wings [PPeterson4@aol.com] Re: cheese on the way njc ["Paul Pennington" ] Re: Beat of Black Wings [Jerry Notaro ] RE: cheese on the way njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: Beat of Black Wings ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Beat of Black Wings [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: NJC Re: Painting video ["Kakki" ] Emily Remler [Michael Paz ] Re: Kids these days (NJC) [RandyRemote ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:26:51 -0700 From: "Kate Bennett" Subject: Re: Kids these days (NJC) Michael, You make some excellent points and I find that I probably agree with you for the most part. Thank you for your very intelleigent & thoughtful post. Although I respect your opinion to love Eminem but to be honest I just don't get what is so unique, remarkable or humorous about him. Personally, I am drawn to music & lyrics that reflect & look towards the higher nature of human beings. For me it is difficult, maybe impossible, to separate lyrical content from flow & rhyme, etc. Obviously you are not alone in your opinion and probably the joni list is not the place to continue discussing this guy. I will take another look, listen and try to see what you are talking about. Kate Bennett Singer/Songwriter www.katebennett.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:32:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: Tunings (NJC) - --- Kakki wrote: > Hey Mikey, > > I find it very interesting but still don't > understand a word of it. The > author keeps indicating that it's so easy to figure > out now and all and I > was desperately trying to find the "decoder key" to > get it. .... I really need to find a copy of > "Music Theory for Dummies". Oh, so it ISN'T just me. This is one of those that I filed in the "save and read later when your brain is in gear" file! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 11:34:01 -0700 From: Louis Lynch Subject: RE: www.rollingstone.com trashes joni Hi Catherine, Let the rollingstone punks belittle anyone they want. I've determined that the word "belittle" is very aptly named. The more you belittle, the more little you be. (My new philosophy for the week.) Sorry to have upset you with the report of the partiers who abused the dog. It went through my veins like vinegar and salt, too. But, sadly, I didn't have enough personal observation to report it to the Humane Society. I only know the first names or nicknames of some of the people. Obviously, none of the other partiers felt inclined to report it either. I haven't been able to deal with any of that crowd since. I even skipped my favorite open mic session Tuesday, because people from that party would be there. I was afraid that if someone would have started telling me about the dog, I would have waxed spastic. Thanks for your response. I know some great kids, too. And come to think of it, when I was a kid, I knew some really mean ones. So it's just human nature. I've found that listening to a Joni Mitchell CD or two, having a nice dinner, and sleeping a full night helps cure general despondency about the way of the world. So, I'm more relaxed about things, but I'm still... Wondering about inhumanity, Harper Lou ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:34:29 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Little Boxes (NJC) In a message dated 6/21/00 8:36:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: << > Written in 1963 by Malvina Reynolds of Berkeley, CA. I'm sure she'd be > delighted that it was being sung by NZ schoolkids. > >> Actually the song was about Daly City, California and the Doelger homes that are there. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:37:57 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Little Boxes (NJC) MDESTE1@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/21/00 8:36:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > > << > Written in 1963 by Malvina Reynolds of Berkeley, CA. I'm sure she'd be > > delighted that it was being sung by NZ schoolkids. > >> > > Actually the song was about Daly City, California and the Doelger homes that > are there. Just to make it clear it was NOT me who wrote that. My message referred to Pete Seeger, not Malvina. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:48:47 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: joni and judy Catherine McKay wrote:I don't like to sound *too* cynical, but I also sent > an e-mail to Judy Collins and got a lovely answer from > her. I'm not sure I totally believe that it is really > Judy responding. I don't think she'd have time to > respond to every individual e-mail she gets (maybe she > does, who knows?) I think it's more likely a staff of I'm sure it is her. Before e-mail she sent me several letters that were in her hand. When I've met her on a few occasions she has commented on the content. Many others , like Janis Ian and Betty Buckley have also responded to me personally. BTW, Judy's husband Louis is an architect in NYC and is designing the new Museum of American Folk Music (gratis). Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 11:56:26 PDT From: "Reuben Bell" Subject: RE: joni bashing in downbeat Now, now. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean its bad. I don't think its very productive to compare something like Both Sides Now to a dance track. The two have very little to do with each other. I happen to like dance music (I had not hear DJ Alligator Project, though), but I don't hold it in the same place that I do other things. BNS and DJ Alligator Project serve different purposes. Reuben >From: Don Rowe >Reply-To: Don Rowe >To: joni@smoe.org >Subject: RE: joni bashing in downbeat >Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 11:01:12 -0700 (PDT) > >Just to put Joni's comments into perspective, point >your browsers at: > >www.theworld.org > >Click on the RealAudio link for yesterday's show >(6-20-2000) on NPR, and fast-forward to the story they >did on the Vivandi/Seagram's merger at the very end >... there you will be treated to DJ Alligator Project >-- who, if the new mega-music giant has it's way -- >will be the future of pop music. > >Then you tell me how good BSN sounds, and whether or >not you still think Joni Mitchell ever lies! > >Don Rowe > >===== >"I do not object to others hiding from history. What I object to are >others hiding history from ME." > >-- Shelby Foote > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com/ ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:59:46 -0400 From: "Nikki Johnson" Subject: RE: Kids these days (NJC) Ok I've been reading over this topic and had to say something...lol...probably the sociologist in me...I am 21 and still put in the category as a "kid"...which at times I have come to hate...b/c I don't see myself acting in the same manner as many other people my age. And many times have been considered an outsider b/c of that. I was never into 'being cool' and all that stuff...I'd much rather write and play guitar and travel. Anyway I did have a point...haha I don't know that you can specifically blame a generation...b/c I think it was brought up and rightfully so that every generation has it's problems and it is much broader than just the younger generation. People of every generation are guilty of some of the issues mentioned. Kakki mentioned a 'higher tolerance of violence" which I think is really desensitization. When we are forced to see it everyday we build up a wall to protect ourselves b/c it is everywhere. I won't get started on my media kick but that is part of the reason. I do know some great kids and also some not so great ones...I think a lot of it also has to do with family. Sometimes you can see in children the heartache they are being put thru b/c of negligent parents and it really does show. It's not something new...but maybe more evident now. Take care Nikki "Ever since I was a baby girl the one thing I wanted most in this world was to keep my love alive" ~ Heart > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of > Bounced Message > Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2000 9:14 PM > To: joni@smoe.org > Subject: Kids these days > > > From: "Kate Bennett" > Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 21:49:26 -0700 > > Harper Lou "Sorry, but I'm feeling a lot of lost hope for this next > generation right > now... Could someone counter the rollingstone site with something > hopeful? " > > Your drummer friend is not the norm. He is a VERY sick individual > who could > be prosecuted for what he is doing to young girls (sounds like > date rape to > me) and animals. However, he is no more the norm than Charles > Manson was the > norm for the children of the 60's. > > Here is the hopeful part (I hope)---I know many young kids & have a lot of > hope for the next generation. The kids I know are not like the creep you > mentioned (I am sorry if he is your friend- I have no tolerance for the > stuff he is into). They are for the most part very kind, spiritual, peace > loving kids. A little more street wise than I was, they grow up > faster these > days it seems. > > Here is the who is to blaim part---What I do see as the norm however is a > higher tolerance (not acts)of violence. I attribute this to a generation > that has been exposed to a lot of graphic violence portrayed in > the media. I > blaim the probably mostly middle aged people who use violence as a form of > entertainment for profit. (And thank you record company executives who are > promoting that guy Eminem or whatever is name is). > > Sorry, I have REALLY strong feelings about all of this but I don't want to > start another war of the words. Just in case as Hell would say > its all IMO. > > (putting away the soapbox now and ducking) > > > Kate Bennett > Singer/Songwriter > www.katebennett.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:04:06 EDT From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: joni and judy In a message dated 6/21/00 2:43:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca writes: << I don't like to sound *too* cynical, but I also sent an e-mail to Judy Collins and got a lovely answer from her. I'm not sure I totally believe that it is really Judy responding. I don't think she'd have time to respond to every individual e-mail she gets (maybe she does, who knows?) I think it's more likely a staff of people who work on her behalf - if they're really good at what they do, they can use her "voice" in responding and would be hired on that basis - they'd have to be empathetic and would have to somehow convey Judy's personality. >> My lover has dealt with Judy's assistants and whenever they correspond, they sign their names. I know that he has often encountered delays in hearing back from her when she is traveling. I have heard Judy talk about having trouble sleeping and staying up at nights on the computer. I think that she is actually responding--the response that I read on the list does sound like her "voice." Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:09:16 -0700 From: Louis Lynch Subject: Nancy LaMott (NJC) Thanks Stephen, Nancy LaMott was a great singer, and a gem of a person by all accounts. If Kathie Lee was that kind to her, then she should be redeemed by everyone on the list. Kathie Lee obviously has a big heart. In fact, I think it would even be amply appropriate to include Kathie Lee Gifford's name in the very same sentence as Joni Mitchell's. Deliberately, even. Although usually I exercise my size 9-double-wide mouth (42 in the U.K.) on most things, I have stayed quiet about Kathie Lee until now. I think Kathie Lee was trashed unduly, and her singing really isn't all that bad. Her pitch sounds better to me than David Byrne, Bob Dylan and Anita Baker combined. So what if Kathie Lee schmaltzed up a Joni song -- Judy Collins schmaltzed up Both Sides Now, and everyone on the list seems to love her. Judy Collins comes off just as "adorable and sweet" as Kathie Lee -- so I can't understand why you would appreciate one and trash the other. However, I will grant that Kathie Lee's version of Circle Game might sound better accompanied by Kenny G with Shatner and Nimoy on back-up, though. I hope you all agree to resolve Kathie Lee of all formerly affirmed heinousness, just by nature of her kindness to Nancy LaMott. More softheartedly than usual, but, hey, I'm using all my testosterone to grow a moustache right now, Harper Lou ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:15:49 -0700 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Re: joni and judy Aside from such remembrances of listening to Hejira while fighting for sobriety, and crying at the beauty of Joni's early songs while being with her in her little Chelsea apartment, what convinces me most that the letter I received from Judy was, in fact, written by her, was the misspelling of the word "dissent" (she acknowledged not knowing the correct spelling by her insertion of "sp?") and some of the sentence structures she used, which I don't believe would have been used by someone hired for the expressed purpose of corresponding on her behalf. It was a heartfelt "first draft," I'm almost certain, by the lady herself. "Boston Jim" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:12:31 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat Obviously, the letter-writers quoted from DOWNBEAT were unhappy with JM's comments (and perhaps her in general). But how does that qualify as "bashing?" IMO, "bashing" would ocur when 100 letters in praise of JM arrived at DOWNBEAT and the editors chose (therein the bash) to reprint the only two negative ones. DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:17:48 EDT From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: Nancy LaMott (NJC) In a message dated 6/21/00 3:10:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Louis.Lynch@wonderware.com writes: << Nancy LaMott was a great singer, and a gem of a person by all accounts. If Kathie Lee was that kind to her, then she should be redeemed by everyone on the list. Kathie Lee obviously has a big heart. >> Harper Lou, Thanks for the kind words about Nancy--she truly was a wonderful person and a very talented singer who, IMHO, deserved to make it. As for Kathie Lee, I can never forget the kindness that she showed to my friend. She helped to promote Nancy's career. She really championed Nancy. And I know that she made Nancy's last days better. For these things, I respect her. Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:19:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: RE: joni bashing in downbeat - --- Reuben Bell wrote: > Now, now. Just because you don't like it doesn't > mean its bad. > BSN and DJ Alligator > Project serve different purposes. > Oh this isn't bad *just* because I don't like it. ;-) I agree, dance music's one thing, classic torch songs another. But there are a lot of not-so-great torch songs that were every bit as popular as the selections Joni chose for BSN -- and today the world is awash in software generated compu-swill like this guy's, when there's plenty of terrific dance music out there being played by real musicians that's being ignored. That was Joni's point, I think, at it's core -- and the reason for my using this example as context for her comments. Don Rowe ===== "I do not object to others hiding from history. What I object to are others hiding history from ME." - -- Shelby Foote __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:24:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: joni and judy (and the JMDL archives) (NJC) - --- FMYFL@aol.com wrote: >you can still read > all of the posts about > Judy and Joni by going to the JMDL archives at: > > http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni/ > > A lot of newbies don't know they exist, but I check > them out every now and > then just to find out what we were discussing this > time last year or the year > before. It's quite a hoot sometimes :~) > Well, I guess I'm not a newbie anymore since I've been here for close to a year now - but I'm embarrassed to admit, I didn't know they existed either (maybe I wasn't paying attention in class!) ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:59:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat - --- PFallo@aol.com wrote: > in the july issue of downbeat that i just received > today, it seems that > article didn't go over so well with some readers. in > the chords & discords > feature (letters to the editor), two readers wrote > in, apparently having > gotten a very negative impression of joni from that > article. i'll reprint > their letters below. please don't shoot the > messenger. > > phil > p.s. i'll get the hanging tree ready. > > Richard Thurston from Seattle writes: > > >I have a suggestion for a new category in your > annual Readers Poll: Egoist > of the >Year. I doubt that anyone you may interview > between now and Dec. 31 > will surpass >Joni Mitchell for her display of > conceited self-absorbtion in > the May 2000 issue. > James Vincent via e-mail writes: > > >I am so tired of Joni Mitchell always making > herself out to be somehow > greater >than other female artists who were also > popular in her hey day. > Lighten up, Joni. >You are not some statue of stone > in a park. All I can say to this is that there are a number of people *out there* who view everything that Joni does as some kind of ego trip. They see her as full of herself, in love with herself, making herself out to be better than... and so on. This has probably been the case since Day 1. While I can understand their saying this kind of thing if they knew only a little bit about her and perhaps heard or read an interview with her, where she has (no doubt) been baited into making rude remarks about other artists, or by reading the liner notes on BSN (which I think are *a bit much* myself, but I blame it all on Klein!) I truly believe these people *just don't get it*. I've never heard any "diva" stories about Joni. Yes, she's a perfectionist and maybe wants things a certain way, and she wants to be in control of her own work (why not?), but I've never heard any temper-tantrum stories of the kind you hear about other performers (only red jelly-beans - take all the black ones out! Only Evian water, none of your other bottled waters! and so on) Joni IS opinionated and sure of herself, but conceited? I don't think so - I've heard too many "hugging" stories about her, and she comes across as very warm and the kind of person you'd be able to yak with at the kitchen table. ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:12:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V2000 #345 - --- TIKIMOON007@aol.com wrote: > Hello everyone! I am really excited that I have > joined the list. I have > been reading a lot of wonderful things from a lot of > wonderful people. I had > a shy start at first but i think i will be ok. Take > Care > Welcome Stacy and anyone I've missed. I'll tell you what I told another new lister - if you hesitate about sending an e-mail, you may feel shy about ever doing it. So just jump in there, with both feet, or head first, whatever works for you. Nothing you say could possibly be any worse than anything anyone else has to say! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:20:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat - --- Catherine McKay wrote: > , or by reading the liner notes on BSN > (which I think are *a bit much* myself, but I blame > it > all on Klein!) But of course you do my dear. I'm the great whipping boy -- synths and perms, production, post-production and now an obviously cheeky bit of liner notation. I should've known I'd end up the fall guy for this. You know, for as dour as Joni claims I am, god forfend I try my hand at a little humor! Does Quincy have to put up with this abuse? Does Bob Clearmountain or Bob Ludwig? You think Bill Orbit endures these kinds of slings and arrows? Or Trevor Horn? Or any other producer you care to name ... Okay, so Lindsay Buckingham, Rupert Hine and I have swapped some stories ... maybe if I just stood very quietly in the corner ... Larry Klein __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:31:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: joni and judy - now njc to satisfy the grouches > I wrote:I don't like to sound *too* > cynical, but I also > sent > an e-mail to Judy Collins and got a lovely answer > from > her. I'm not sure I totally believe that it is > really > > Judy responding. - --- Jerry Notaro wrote: > I'm sure it is her. Before e-mail she sent me > several letters that were > in her hand. When I've met her on a few occasions > she has commented on > the content. Many others , like Janis Ian and Betty > Buckley have also > responded to me personally. BTW, Judy's husband > Louis is an architect in > NYC and is designing the new Museum of American Folk > Music (gratis). I'd really LIKE to believe Judy wrote it herself and I guess I am a bit too cynical. You've made my day - I feel SO much better! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:40:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat - --- Don Rowe wrote: > > --- Catherine McKay > wrote: > > > , or by reading the liner notes on BSN > > (which I think are *a bit much* myself, but I > blame > > it > > all on Klein!) > > But of course you do my dear. I'm the great > whipping > boy -- Ha! I was hoping to draw out Mr Klein - you reacted far more quickly than I would have guessed, especially since my snide remarks were buried (between parentheses) in the middle of a long paragraph. You can't fool Klein, that's for sure! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:42:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: joni and judy - --- "James L. Leonard" wrote: >what convinces > me most that the letter > I received from Judy was, in fact, written by her, > was the misspelling of > the word "dissent" (she acknowledged not knowing the > correct spelling by her > insertion of "sp?") and some of the sentence > structures she used, which I > don't believe would have been used by someone hired > for the expressed > purpose of corresponding on her behalf. It was a > heartfelt "first draft," > I'm almost certain, by the lady herself. Either that or a *really good* fake! Sorry, I couldn't resist saying that, but I've been convinced it was the REAL Judy Collins and not just another of Don Rowe's alter egos! ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:50:44 PDT From: "Reuben Bell" Subject: Re: joni and judy I can also attest to this. She's real. And very sweet. Reuben >From: Jerry Notaro >I'm sure it is her. Before e-mail she sent me several letters that were >in her hand. When I've met her on a few occasions she has commented on >the content. Many others , like Janis Ian and Betty Buckley have also >responded to me personally. BTW, Judy's husband Louis is an architect in >NYC and is designing the new Museum of American Folk Music (gratis). > >Jerry > ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:00:47 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Malvina (NJC) My buddy Marcel wrote: > Actually the song was about Daly City, California and the Doelger homes that > are there. After I wrote: > << > Written in 1963 by Malvina Reynolds of Berkeley, CA. I'm sure she'd be > > delighted that it was being sung by NZ schoolkids. > >> Right, but Malvina was living in Berkeley at the time, n'est-ce pas? That's what I meant, rather than "written *about* Berkeley". ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 14:17:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: It's a Slow News Day ... (NJC) This headline from the New York Times website: Coca-Cola Ships Soda Into N.Korea What? Just one? Without actually reading the story, surely it goes something like this: Executives of the Coca-Cola Company said a bottle of soda had been shipped across the North Korean border. It is hoped that the soda will penetrate the dense jungle forests, and interbreed with the local rabid feral cola. "The objectives are two-fold", said Martin Zeisner, EVP Marketing and Product Developement, "one, the recent food shortages in the country are not the result of the Communist regime, but rather the aggressive grazing on cropland by rabid feral colas. After mixing with Coke, our research shows these rapacious tendencies should be curbed considerably." When asked what was in it for Coca-Cola Inc. Zeisner commented that scientists hoped to capture one of the new hybrid colas, which according to Zeisner, "Should have a new wild, bolder taste." Don Rowe - --AP Wire Service ===== "I do not object to others hiding from history. What I object to are others hiding history from ME." - -- Shelby Foote __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:18:22 -0400 From: "Sue Cameron" Subject: RE: new job (NJC) Jamie, Congratulations on the job! Is this something that can be taped for the UK fest or will you be filming for future telecast? I am a big fan of UK comedies and watch them quite frequently on our PBS station. Not familiar with the one you are working on. Can you give us a plot line? My fingers are crossed for your continued employment! Sue Cameron ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 16:44:55 -0500 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat I apologize for letting this one get sent. I had it in my out box and when I checked my mail it got sent after I decided not to send it. I hope I didn't offend anyone and I'm sorry. >Oh boo-hoo, it sounds like we have another die hard Judy or Joan fan! - -- Mark Domyancich Harpua@revealed.net tape trading: http://homepage.mac.com/mtd/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:47:40 EDT From: PFallo@aol.com Subject: Re: joni bashing in downbeat In a message dated 6/21/00 3:12:31 PM, Dflahm writes: << Obviously, the letter-writers quoted from DOWNBEAT were unhappy with JM's comments (and perhaps her in general). But how does that qualify as "bashing?" IMO, "bashing" would ocur when 100 letters in praise of JM arrived at DOWNBEAT and the editors chose (therein the bash) to reprint the only two negative ones. >> david, the use of the word "bash" may have been a bit extreme, but at one in the morning it did "seem" like a bash to me. nonetheless, i was surprised that downbeat choose to print two negative responses and no positive ones to the joni article. obviously i have no idea how many positive ones there were. by printing the two negative responses, was downbeat publishing a representative cross-section of the responses or was the magazine itself making an editorial response itself to the interview? phil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:50:43 -0400 From: "Victor Johnson" Subject: brian wilson tix (NJC) I have some Brian Wilson "Pet Sounds Tour" tickets I need to sell for July 30 at Chastain Ampitheatre in Atlanta. The cost is $65.00 total for both, and they are general admission but that shouldn't be an issue since I think there will be plenty of seats(at Joni Mitchell we sat right behind the sound board on the second row which was practically empty.) Please email me if you are interested. Thanks, Victor http://www.mindspring.com/~waytoblu/Tangled.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:59:40 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Who Todays Kids really are U.S. teens today prefer sex, drugs and the Net-poll Updated 5:45 PM ET June 21, 2000 By Timna Tanners LOS ANGELES, (Reuters) - U.S. kids these days are not only more jaded than their parents -- familiar with handgun violence and drug abuse -- but also savvier in cyberspace and more relaxed with people of other races, according to a CBS News poll that tracked teens through four years of high school. While adults love to tell of braving high snow to get to school or enduring Depression-era hardships, the survey released this week suggests that today's high school graduates do not necessarily have easier teen years than their parents. In fact, 53 percent of teens said they have had to grow up faster than their parents. Nine out of 10 in the CBS poll reporting dealing with the death of a relative or friend, drug or alcohol abuse of someone close to them, divorce, accident, illness or natural disaster. The CBS poll was conducted among more than 2,300 U.S. high school students across the country in the graduating class of 2000. The surveys started four years ago when the class entered high school. The results will be published on the Internet by Simon & Schuster. Despite a presidential impeachment and teen violence increasingly making the front pages, the polled students became more and more optimistic during their high school years. At least 65 percent of the students said they expected their lives will be better than those of their parents. That optimism has grown in recent years amid a booming U.S. economy. Ninety-six percent of those polled said they felt safe at school, even though the memory of last year's shooting at Columbine High School was still fresh in people's memory. The survey reported that that drug and alcohol use was on the rise, with 61 percent of seniors polled said they drink alcohol and 18 percent saying they have tried marijuana. Fourteen percent were regular cigarette smokers, and 47 percent had tried a cigarette. About 50 percent of the graduating seniors said they had had sex, up from previous years, and 18 percent said they were not virgins when they entered high school. Just 18 percent of the senior class of 1997 reported having had sex. Race relations appeared to have progressed, with 72 percent of students saying they had a close friend of another race and 41 percent having dated someone of another race. Some 92 percent of graduating seniors said they used a computer regularly and 84 percent said they used the Internet. While their grandparents perhaps saw the telephone as a novelty, 35 percent of students said they had a mobile phone. Some 26 percent had pagers and 10 percent had a hand-held computing device. High-school-age kids were also more accepting of divorce, the poll said, and children whose parents had divorced were likely to say the separation was better than staying together for the children. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:57:46 -0700 From: "Chris Marshall" Subject: RE: catman Ada wrote:- > is everything alright with catman? he's not in some "2 grey rooms" case i > hope so just tell me he's ok. Well, he *is* OK, but he's not on the list at the moment, having left due to the "Colin's facist statement" thread. I'm not surprised actually. I *am* pretty f*****g upset, though, that due to someone so blatantly getting it wrong about him, he's felt the need to leave. We're all the poorer for it, him included. We *all* loose. A plague on both your houses. - --Chris (about 30 miles down the road from Colin, but feeling further away for the lack of his presence here) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 17:06:30 -0500 From: "Steve Polifka" Subject: East Troy Concert 1979 (possibley NJC) Hello all! Yes, I too was art the SRO (standing room only) concert at Alpine Valley August 16th; a Thrursday evening with NO RAIN in sight... except for the fog from funny cigs that was wafting too and fro o'er the audience... ;-) The one thing I did notice and remember distictly ,after all these years, was that during the solo on Goodbye Pork Pie Hat, she sat on a plastic chair in the back of the stage, and bury her head in her hands- looking road weary or performance tired, I know not which. Her performance was great, however. And the other thing was Brecker missing his little solo during Hejira-"Listen..." I got a T shirt-which is 2 sizes too small now, but in good shape, but don't remember even seeing a tour book. And I still have my tickets and Journal article. About a week later I was at this bar I hung out at, and met a man who then worked at Alpine Valley as stage crew. I told him I just saw Joni and he said he had a chance to meet her, and commented on how nice she was. They had discussed the Court and Spark album a little, and he told her he did not have that one, so she told him she'd send him one and ask for his address. Whether this is true or not I cannot say, but he (at the time) was a new fan, and I took him at his word. During the rest of our conversation he discussed other 'stars' he had met, but Joni seemed the nicest. Ah, such memories.... TTM! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 15:23:39 -0700 (PDT) From: leslie@torchsongs.com Subject: Beat of Black Wings I remember a while back there was a thread regarding the "Beat of Black Wings." Did we ever resolve what the lyrics are to the sections between verses in BoBW? Something like "Charlie Angel" ... Leslie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 18:28:15 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: ** Free** Joni Rarities More than a dozen cassettes of Joni Rarities are available free to JMDLers. These cassettes have been meticulously selected for the highest available quality by Simon and represent some very exciting performances and interviews. I recommend starting with a 3 cassette collection encompassing Tape Tree #1 & #2 that I call the Tape Tree Starter Kit. You'll get Joni in a Philadelphia coffee-house called the Second Fret on March 17, 1967. This is the earliest material on the Tape Trees and the roughest recording. This was before her first album was released but the American country and folk industry knew her from her songwriting credits on "Circle Game" and "Urge For Going". You get the BBC Radio Concert with James Taylor in 1970 featuring songs from "Blue", and a promotional radio program created for the "Night Ride Home" set. There's a 1994 live set including "Sex Kills" back when it was an unreleased song under a working title, "Just Ice". To cap it off, there's a 1995 interview from radio's "All Things Considered" program. To participate you send blank cassettes and postage. For instructions send me an e-mail and I'll get right back to you. Enjoy! Also available free are the TNT Tribute video (on VHS, USA format only), and an exquisite audience recording (on cassette) of the "Both Sides Now" tour in Camden, New Jersey, USA. All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu near Cincinnati All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu near Cincinnati ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 08:55:36 -0400 From: B Merrill Subject: Re: Mitchell's Canadian voice SCJoniGuy@aol.com wrote: I do feel like she compares her >country rural upbringing with the faster-paced American culture and prefers >the former... If that's the case, then why does she live in the US? Has she answered this question? Being wealthy, she could live wherever she chooses. Since I missed the prior thread, I'd be happy to hear more about her Canadian voice. Bruce ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:26:44 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: for the roses (NJC) kenny! have you moved to the new office yet or are you still schlepping all the way to jersey? please, find the FTR, since michael [salacious old man] has never seen fit to reply my post. hugs and see you at the duane read [or was it a rite aid???] on continental ave!!!! [remember?] wally the k ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:29:02 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: cheese on the way njc bob-o, i put the tape in the male today. blessings! wally le k ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:08:52 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Re: Kids these days (NJC) Hey all, I missed the original post on this but the reference to Eminem caught my eye. I don't have the Rolling Stone articles in front of me, they are at the office, but I read through Eminem's lyrics and they are disgusting homophobic violence pandering filth. (Come Vince, don't mince words...) To proclaim that he hates fags with the vehemence that Eminem does after the murder of Matthew Shepherd would kind of hint me where Eminem is at. Bigotry is not acceptable when it is directed against lesbians and gay men, no matter how hip hop Eminem tries to be. The fact that Eminem attaches his real name to the album title tells us that he really means those lyrics he says. Musically, the guy has talent, to be sure, some musical talent in a narrow violence promoting mind. That has nothing to do with kids these days. Back when I was a kid... George Wallace, Lester Maddox, and the KKK had millions of fans... a generation before, Hitler, Stalin, and generations before... it goes on and on. Hate is not new. And what is Eminem, in his late twenties? He is a little marketing machine. He is hardly the voice of any generation. He may be this year's outrage. I hope his lyrics don't breed violence but the thought of kids taking those lyrics seriously scares me. But I don't blame the kids. Eminem and those who are telling him how great he is are all adults with an eye to making money. Adults these days... now that is a subject the kids ought to be commenting on. (the Rev) Vince, 47 going on 48 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:30:40 EDT From: PPeterson4@aol.com Subject: Re: Beat of Black Wings In a message dated 6/21/00 7:51:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, leslie@torchsongs.com writes: << I remember a while back there was a thread regarding the "Beat of Black Wings." Did we ever resolve what the lyrics are to the sections between verses in BoBW? Something like "Charlie Angel" ... >> I have been wondering about this since this incredible CD came out with this great song. My theory has always been that she's saying "Charlie Angel" to the tune of the sixties Shelly Fabares song "Johnny Angel" ( Johnny Angel, And I love him, And I know that someday he''ll love me....). But does anyone know who Charlie Angel is? The troubled guy in the song? Or something entirely else? Paul Peterson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:50:51 -0400 From: "Paul Pennington" Subject: Re: cheese on the way njc Wally Kairuz wrote: > bob-o, > i put the tape in the male today. No! No! You're supposed to put the tape in the VCR! Poor Bob. (ROFL) Paul Pennington Augusta, Georgia ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:58:16 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Beat of Black Wings PPeterson4@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 6/21/00 7:51:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > leslie@torchsongs.com writes: > > << I remember a while back there was a thread regarding > the "Beat of Black Wings." Did we ever resolve what > the lyrics are to the sections between verses in BoBW? > Something > like "Charlie Angel" ... >> > > I have been wondering about this since this incredible CD came out with this > great song. My theory has always been that she's saying "Charlie Angel" to > the tune of the sixties Shelly Fabares song "Johnny Angel" ( Johnny Angel, > And I love him, And I know that someday he''ll love me....). But does anyone > know who Charlie Angel is? The troubled guy in the song? Or something > entirely else? > > Paul Peterson A reference, I would think, to the popular television show (and soon to be a major motion picture in your neighborhood) Charlie's Angels. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:12:02 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: cheese on the way njc oh my god!!!!!!!!!!! malapropism incarnate am i!!!!!!!!!!!!! it's my hormones: they're shrieking in my ears and i can't hear my thoughts! wally > Wally Kairuz wrote: > > > bob-o, > > i put the tape in the male today. > > No! No! You're supposed to put the tape in the VCR! > > Poor Bob. > > (ROFL) > > Paul Pennington > Augusta, Georgia > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:21:49 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Beat of Black Wings to me it has always sounded like "tired angel". you know, the angel of death, the beat of its black wings and all the work we humans give it. wally k, writing mail mail mail mail mail mail 100 X's...... > << I remember a while back there was a thread regarding > the "Beat of Black Wings." Did we ever resolve what > the lyrics are to the sections between verses in BoBW? > Something > like "Charlie Angel" ... >> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 21:49:05 EDT From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: Beat of Black Wings In a message dated 6/21/00 9:32:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, wallykai@interserver.com.ar writes: << to me it has always sounded like "tired angel". >> i thought maybe...child angel... in any event, i love that song. it is one of my favorites of joni's and it has such a cool illiteration...the beat ..boom.tik tik tik tik boom tik tik .. and then you can hear the little wings going faintly...dikadikadikadika and what a great line...i never had nothing to believe in...plus, she says the f word. and i have to love that! pat np. beat of black wings ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 19:15:09 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: NJC Re: Painting video > And no one has a sound board or pocketbook/coat >recording of this. The CA contingency of JMDL is >slipping. :-) Oh Stephen - being clever in the hidden recording department has never been one of our strong suits in SoCal! Although we are definitely making progress. Phyliss got some beautiful digital video of the second half of the Greek show (slightly marred by my shrieking and oblivious shoving of her camera arm) and we also imported Maxi Girl Catherine T. from Arizona, who had an ingenious recording system working that night. ;-) As far as the Joni taping, the chance to go happened so quickly that we were too gaga and blithering about it all before, during and after to think about more practical matters. Maybe someday the "long version" will surface, though ;-) Kakki NP: Joni at MSG - For The Roses (Holy Lordy, another amazing one - wow wow wow!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:32:19 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Emily Remler on 6/21/00 1:27 PM, JMDL Digest at Joseph Palis wrote: > Thabks, Stephen for that story about Nancy LaMott. I read in a magazine a > review of her posthumous CD and how that album would have catapulted Nancy > to mainstream pop audience. There seems to be an interest in a singer's > discography everytime that singer dies (Selena for example, as well as > other artists whom one never heard before but got interested after the > death. Guitarist Emily Remler did that to me). Joseph- How is your Emily collection? As you probably know she was from here in New Orleans and I had the good fortune to work woth her a couple of times at Jazz Fest etc. I haven't thought of her in ages, thank you for reminding me. I need to see what recordings (obscure) I can come up with. I am friends with Steve Masakowski who did lots of work with her ad well as many local artists. Michael NP-I Want You (She's So Heavy)-Beatles/The Last Year Feb 69-Jan 70) with McCartney on Vocal WOW! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:36:32 -0700 From: RandyRemote Subject: Re: Kids these days (NJC) Well said Vince. I say boycott the little bastard. (Like I WAS going to go out and get it). There's a nice job waiting for him at McDonalds. (As soon as he spends the money. His new one sold 1.7 million copies the first week. BSN is still under 1/2 mil). Here's a sample of his work: "my words are like a dagger with a jagged edge/ I'll stab you in the head, whether you're fag or les/ Or a homosex, a hermaph or a trans-a-ves/ Pants or dress/Hate fags? the answer's yes/" Joni he ain't. RR Vince Lavieri wrote: > Hey all, > > I missed the original post on this but the reference to Eminem caught my > eye. > > I don't have the Rolling Stone articles in front of me, they are at the > office, but I read through Eminem's lyrics and they are disgusting > homophobic violence pandering filth. (Come Vince, don't mince > words...) To proclaim that he hates fags with the vehemence that Eminem > does after the murder of Matthew Shepherd would kind of hint me where > Eminem is at. Bigotry is not acceptable when it is directed against > lesbians and gay men, no matter how hip hop Eminem tries to be. The > fact that Eminem attaches his real name to the album title tells us that > he really means those lyrics he says. > > Musically, the guy has talent, to be sure, some musical talent in a > narrow violence promoting mind. > > That has nothing to do with kids these days. Back when I was a kid... > George Wallace, Lester Maddox, and the KKK had millions of fans... a > generation before, Hitler, Stalin, and generations before... it goes on > and on. Hate is not new. And what is Eminem, in his late twenties? He > is a little marketing machine. He is hardly the voice of any > generation. > > He may be this year's outrage. I hope his lyrics don't breed violence > but the thought of kids taking those lyrics seriously scares me. But I > don't blame the kids. Eminem and those who are telling him how great he > is are all adults with an eye to making money. Adults these days... now > that is a subject the kids ought to be commenting on. > > (the Rev) Vince, 47 going on 48 ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #347 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?