From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #279 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk Archives: http://www.smoe.org/lists/joni Websites: http://www.jmdl.com http://www.jonimitchell.com Unsubscribe: mailto:joni-digest-request@smoe.org?body=unsubscribe JMDL Digest Wednesday, May 24 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 279 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: MSG 5/23 & some bittersweet lyrics [Janene Otten ] Inner Circle Meeting Time Change (NJC) [Steve Dulson ] [Fwd: Re: music for a Rainy day (Vljc)] [Bounced Message ] More Misc Ramblings.... [Steve Dulson ] Info Needed URGENT ["Michael Paz" ] Re: "Urge For Going" Covers Question [Brian Gross ] Re: Barangrill Question ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] Re: Inspired Jim & Robert Fripp NJC [RandyRemote ] Re: Joni at MSG taped last night [Brian Gross ] fig leaves ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: fig leaves [Janene Otten ] RE: Inner Circle Meeting Time Change [Howard Motyl ] Joni's coming...and someone else is, too (NJC) [Janet Hess ] NJC Rainy Day Songs ["James O. Phillips" ] Re: Barangrill Question ["James L. Leonard" ] Re: Joni's coming...and someone else is, too (NJC) [catman ] RE: fig leaves ["Bob Muller (Perception)" ] Putting up reindeer (njc) [Brian Gross ] RE: fig leaves [Janene Otten ] NJC new to the list ["Bob Muller (Perception)" ] Re: Putting up reindeer (njc) ["James L. Leonard" ] Re: TV Time ["P. Henry" ] Re: MSG 5/23 & some bittersweet lyrics [Don Rowe ] Joni's NYC Concert Reviewed in Wed NY Times [Kenny Grant ] RE: fig leaves [Scott Price ] I stand corrected ... maybe (fig leaves NJC) [Don Rowe ] RE: Putting up reindeer (njc) ["Peg Eves" ] Re: music for a Rainy day [Linda Worster ] RE: NJC new to the list ["Peg Eves" ] Re: Guitar ["P. Henry" ] Re: I stand corrected ... maybe (fig leaves NJC) [Brian Gross ] Re: Circles ["Kakki" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 10:56:22 -0400 From: Janene Otten Subject: RE: MSG 5/23 & some bittersweet lyrics and thank you Bob! > > < night to you like a fig leaf..." Why a fig leaf? Is there > something about > fig leafs that I don't know about? I need some enlightening. >> > > Janene, > > I'm sure the allusion is to the Adam & Eve story...after they > tasted the > forbidden fruit of knowledge, they were aware of their > nakedness and covered > themselves with a fig leaf. So I think what Joni is saying is > that someone > going to the "pickup station" is emotionally laying > themselves bare and is > protected only by the night. Just one more example of Joni's > brilliance! > > Bob > > NP: XTC, "Stupidly Happy" (which pretty much describes me > enjoying their > latest release, just out yesterday!!) > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 08:08:29 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Inner Circle Meeting Time Change (NJC) Lamadamma wrote: >The meeting time of the JMDL Inner Circle has been changed from 13:00 GMT to >15:00 GMT but the place has remained unchanged. See all you cool people >there! Remind me - am I really supposed to bring the Boone's Farm? ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 09:10:17 -0600 From: Bounced Message Subject: [Fwd: Re: music for a Rainy day (Vljc)] Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:59:09 +0100 From: Jason Maloney For some reason, this didn't go through yesterday (an e-mail to the Don Henley list suffered the same fate..hmmm), so I'm reposting :-) Jason. - -------- Original Message -------- Mark Domyancich wrote: > Edie Brickell and New Bohemians - Ghost Of A Dog Oh yes, there's one track on there in particular isn't there? About curling up together under a blanket and listening to the rain on the window......it's been waaay too long since I last played that CD! Personally, and this is JC, the perfect rainy weather track (and indeed album) is My Secret Place (and CMIARS generally, I guess). The last time it really poured down (thunder lightning and all), I stuck My Secret Place on the CD player here on my PC, and it sounded soooooo good :-) Jason. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 08:16:40 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: More Misc Ramblings.... Kakki wrote: >she has discussed the lyrics on Ludwig's Tune and >For The Roses. If you don't know it from reading the lyrics, she affirms >that those lyrics refer to her disillusionment with the music business and >related personal upheaval she was going through at the time. She was going >through the first of her many crises, deciding whether or not to quit the >business. I think I'd say "one of her ongoing crises"....Pat has discussed her reluctance to sign with the labels tha were courting her in '66, and by '69 she'd written "For Free", surely a sign of her ambivalence about the whole biz thing. And Kakki also wrote: >I truly can't help how I write. And I wouldn't have you change a thing! :) And Rick wrote: >TM told me he lives next to Wrigley Field, where I later found >out they play baseball. Heathen! Brute! I sentence you to three "Hail Cubbies" at the shrine of Harry Caray. :) And Patrick wrote in his great review: >For The Roses was, for me, the perfect justification of this orchestral >project. This was a brilliant arrangement of the song, perfect musically, >perfect vocally, perfect lyrically. Amen, amen, amen! - ------------------------------ ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 10:22:03 -0500 From: "Michael Paz" Subject: Info Needed URGENT Hello Gang- Be prepared to see me bald when you get here cause I am pulling my hair out. Not really, but boy it's been crazy. I am making the final schedule for airport pick ups and I am missing the following info: CATGIRL- NO AIRLINE SPECIFIED Phyliss Ward-I need a number to get ahold of you Julius Mills-NO INFO YET Bill Dollinger-NO INFO YET Pearl and Steve-NO INFO ON FILE I MUST HAVE MISPLACED IT Dan Haas-NO INFO YET Craig (HAPPY THE MAN)-NO INFO YET Mary Grace-NO INFO YET Please call me at the office to day and give me this info so I can complete the airport pick up list for Jack and make the final reservations for the dinner on Friday night. Or email me to this address michaelpaz@worldnet.att.net Thanks Michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 08:29:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: "Urge For Going" Covers Question - --- "James L. Leonard" wrote: > Which was recorded first, Tom Rush's or George Hamilton's version? That > little descending lead guitar figure is present in both, and it also appears > in Rush's "The Circle Game." > > My guess is Rush recorded it first, and the Hamilton arranger lifted the > guitar line. On Rush's version, the lead playing reminded me a little of > Jerry Garcia, on something like "Playing In The Band." Who was the > guitarist? Tom's "The Circle Game" album credits are as follows: (the credits are not on a track-by-track basis) Musicians (only guitars listed here): Bruce Langhorne, Guitar Jonathan Raskin, Classical Guitar and Bass Joe Mack, Bob Bushnell, Electric Guitar Later, Brian np: just the usual buzzing here in the office, making me wish I was back at Judy's Chelsea or at a JoniFest so I could hang out in person with all of you. ===== "No paper thin walls, no folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 10:29:10 -0500 From: Howard Motyl Subject: RE: Our Lady of Duality--my last one Did I overreact? Probably a little. Was I wrong about the intentions of Kakki and Jim? Probably a lot. Am I sorry that I reacted the way I did? Probably. (But it is good to get our blood pumping sometimes.) (with all these probablys, I'm hedging a bit, aren't I?) What did I take away from this? That if Kakki and I run into each other at BSN Chicago (you're going to be here, aren't you?) that it will be a little tense. And . . . That there is a perception of exclusivity on the list. I AM NOT ACCUSING JIM AND KAKKI OF THIS! I think we all, in some way, promote it. Old folks who have a wider breadth of knowledge might not deal with questions they dealt with a hundred times. And new people need to be patient, I guess, and persistent. And lurkers, don't be afraid to chime in, speak your mind, let the rest of us know what you think the lyrics on Moon in the Window mean to you, or how much you hate Mingus (this said with a wink toward Jim). Your insights can make us see a song in a completely new way. So, that's what I hope we all got out of this. As much as I hate to say it, there is a bit of a feeling of us vs. them, and no one wants that. JM would want us all to feel included, whether we are stuck at Blue, or stuck on the notion that Hejira is one of the most underrated albums of the rock era (this would be my crusade) or that TTT is an amazing use of the VG-8. I'm beginning to sound like I've been force-fed too many happy pills. So, I will end. But let me give you an example of how wonderful this list can be, and you lurkers can read this as encouragement to ask questions, be insightful, reveal your truths--and that goes for the oldies, too. I have always loved Two Grey Rooms, from the moment I heard it. When I sang along, I always sang thinking of another man, of course (and this goes back to our discussion once about Joni being a gay man--or was it a gay black man? Or both?). For years, I thought it was just something JM had written from her head. A few months ago, I found out that it is actually written for someone she knew, a gay man, and it is written from his point of view. That kind of information is, to me, amazing and lifted JM even higher (is it possible?) on the pedestal I hold her on besides adding another layer to the song. My point, not one person knows everything about JM--whom we all love otherwise we wouldn't be here. So, we all--oldies, newbies, gentle souls, cantankerous ones (like me), lurkers and listeners--need to share our knowledge to enhance our love of JM. I do not believe that Jim or Kakki are elitist and I now believe their intentions were not elitist. Jim and I have agreed to disagree (haven't we?) about negative reviews on JM.com. Boy, it took me a long time to end. I must go back to work. Howard M ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:53:25 -0700 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Barangrill Question I posted this question last week, but no one responded. Is Barangrill the name of a town or some other real place, or does Joni simply mean "Bar And Grill?" I've wondered that since first hearing FTR, but never had anyone to ask. Thanks. "Boston Jim" NP: Richard Dworski, "Woodstock" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:59:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: Re: Barangrill Question Sorry I didn't get to meet you in West Palm Beach. The name is generic. Jerry On Wed, 24 May 2000, James L. Leonard wrote: > I posted this question last week, but no one responded. Is Barangrill the > name of a town or some other real place, or does Joni simply mean "Bar And > Grill?" I've wondered that since first hearing FTR, but never had anyone to > ask. Thanks. > > "Boston Jim" > > NP: Richard Dworski, "Woodstock" > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 09:03:41 -0700 From: RandyRemote Subject: Re: Joni at MSG taped last night That's interesting. I saw a similar setup at the Concord show, a few rows back from me. My thought was that they would probably get a alot of noise and bump sounds by attaching it to the seats. Also wondered how they got away with doing it so openly. The usher's comment would suggest that it was an "official taping", but why do that when they could go direct from the soundboard? RR SMEBD@aol.com wrote: > I attended Joni's show at MSG last night and noticed that they were recording > the event. There was a microphone directly in front of my seat and just > before the show, one of the ushers told the person whose chair the microphone > was attached to that he should be mindful of the microphone, as they were > recording. I don't know if this is something that is routinely done, but > thought that everyone would be interested to know this. The show was, IMHO, > simply wonderful. In the audience were Diana Krall, Bette Midler, and Judy > Collins, along with lots and lots of fans. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 09:08:08 -0700 From: RandyRemote Subject: Re: Inspired Jim & Robert Fripp NJC Robert Fripp produced their album "Keep on Doing", and it is the Roches at their peak. How can you not love titles like "The Largest Elizabeth in the World"? My favorite by the sisters. RR Peg Eves wrote: > I loved that record & I wondered the same thing. Don't know. He worked with > The Roches on one of their later releases. Maybe even co-produced it. Did > you know? I think The Roches are another hit of genius! They blow my mind. > > Peg > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 09:21:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: Joni at MSG taped last night Maybe because simon already had all the soundboard's output jacks occupied?? ;-) - --- RandyRemote wrote: > That's interesting. I saw a similar setup at the Concord show, a few > rows back from me. My thought was that they would probably get a > alot of noise and bump sounds by attaching it to the seats. Also > wondered how they got away with doing it so openly. The usher's > comment would suggest that it was an "official taping", but why do > that when they could go direct from the soundboard? > RR > > SMEBD@aol.com wrote: > > > I attended Joni's show at MSG last night and noticed that they were > recording > > the event. There was a microphone directly in front of my seat and just > > before the show, one of the ushers told the person whose chair the > microphone > > was attached to that he should be mindful of the microphone, as they were > > recording. I don't know if this is something that is routinely done, but > > thought that everyone would be interested to know this. The show was, > IMHO, > > simply wonderful. In the audience were Diana Krall, Bette Midler, and Judy > > Collins, along with lots and lots of fans. > ===== "No paper thin walls, no folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:24:48 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: fig leaves i think she refers to adam and eve after they ate the fruit. this must be one of joni's greatest lines!!!! wallyK, np blossom dearie l'étang > < night to you like a fig leaf..." Why a fig leaf? Is there something about > fig leafs that I don't know about? I need some enlightening. >> > > Janene, ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:28:01 -0400 From: Janene Otten Subject: RE: fig leaves One more comment on this. I think it's pretty funny that I never thought of Adam & Eve's fig leaf revelation because I go to bible study EVERY SUNDAY. *lol* Subject: fig leaves > > > i think she refers to adam and eve after they ate the fruit. > this must be > one of joni's greatest lines!!!! > wallyK, np blossom dearie l'étang > > > < > night to you like a fig leaf..." Why a fig leaf? Is there > something about > > fig leafs that I don't know about? I need some enlightening. >> > > > > Janene, > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:31:02 -0500 From: Howard Motyl Subject: RE: Inner Circle Meeting Time Change >From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" >Subject: Inner Circle Meeting Time Change >Howdy circlers!! >The meeting time of the JMDL Inner Circle has been changed from 13:00 GMT to >15:00 GMT but the place has remained unchanged. See all you cool people >there! >All the best, >Jim L'Hommedieu near Cincinnati - -- Whether or not you believe it, Jim, there are people who honestly do feel left out. This flippancy doesn't help. Howard M ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:37:12 -0400 From: Anne Sandstrom Subject: getting caught up... Hi everyone. First off, Bob (not M) wrote: > After being with the JMDL for a couple of days, I must say that you've been like family to me -- people who seem nice enough, but then act like perfect idiots when they get together. JMDLers are like family - but in the best sense. Don't worry, Bob, this thread will pass :-) I've been pretty much skipping through most of the 'elitist' posts myself. Also a big WOOHOO for Mark in Seattle's Mom. What great news! I hope she gets through the radiation with minimal side effects and maximum success! (no matter how great the prognonsis, it can be a lonely thing to go through - - see previous comment about this list. For all you newbies, suffice it to say that knowing I have several hundred people thinking about me makes it easier when they stick that IV needle in to do the chemo. BTW, the next treatment is tomorrow. Yipee...) lots of love Anne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:11:02 -0400 From: Janet Hess Subject: Joni's coming...and someone else is, too (NJC) OK, friends. Not only is Joni coming here to the DC area tomorrow night, not only have I developed a strange new wrinkle in the health dept. that I'm seeing a doc about in a few hours, not only that...but.... are you ready? I am not making this up ..... ELIAN GONZALEZ is MOVING INTO MY NEIGHBORHOOD!!!!!!! What more could a one-breasted fat dyke Jonifan want? ;p - ----------------- So when you see a man who's broken / Pick him up and carry him. And when you see a woman who's broken / Put her all into your arms 'Cause we don't know where we come from / We don't know what we are. Laurie Anderson, "Ramon" ------------------------------ Date: Wed May 24 13:25:08 EDT 2000 From: "James O. Phillips" Subject: NJC new to the list Dear all- I just signed up for the list last night and what an interesting list it is indeed. I thought that I would take the time to introduce myself to the list and some of my hobbies that I do. My name is James O. Phillips and I live in the college town of Champaign Illinois. I'm a 25 year old married "gay" male who is celebrating my 1st anniverary on the 17th of July to my partner, Patrick. I play the guitar (both acoustic and electric) the autoharp and I have a 3 sting dulicimer in a state of disrepair at the moment. I like to sing and perform music, in fact, I have a show lined up for the 6th of June at a local coffeehouse. In my sets, I do covers by assorted people like Joni, Lucinda Williams, Rickie Lee Jones, Nanci Griffith, Bonnie Raitt and many more. I do write songs, but I am so embarrased to play my own material because the songs that I write are like my own children. I write in sort of a Joni, Rickie Lee Jones and Laura Nyro type of vein. The Joni songs that I know how to play on the guitar (I play only in standard tuning cause I get lost in open tunings: It throws me off) are Woodstock, Big Yellow Taxi, Both Sides Now, California, Carey and River. I am going to try to figure out Chelsea Morning in standard tuning one of these days, but haven't gotten around to it. I do have a question for anyone that might be able to share with me. Can someone explain the Roland thing that Joni uses on her guitar? How is it able to switch the tunings for it? I am interested in knowing a little bit more about it, and would appreciate any help anyone can give me. I also thought that I would share something that may be of interest to anyone on the list. I have in good condition a used vinyl lp of "The world of Joni Mitchell". Does anyone else on the list have it, or am I the only one? Also, if anyone wants to know the song order, I'll send it to you. It has selections from her first four albums. Well, I had better go, so take care. To quote a favourite off of the Taming the Tiger cd, "We should stay in touch", James O. Phillips - ---------- Message To Spammers -- Game Over! Get spam-free email at http://www.MsgTo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed May 24 13:30:16 EDT 2000 From: "James O. Phillips" Subject: NJC Rainy Day Songs I noticed a thread of people's favourite Rainy Day music. Here is my list: Nanci Griffith - Dust Bowl Symphony Judy Collins - Shameless tied w/ Both Sides Now Bonnie Raitt - the Glow Rickie Lee Jones - Pop Pop Joni Mitchell - Taming the Tiger tied w/ Songs to a Seagull Laura Nyro - Stoned Soul Picnic: the best of Laura Nyro Liz Story - 17 Seconds to Anywhere Barbra Streisand - Classical Barbra Take care, James O. Phillips - ---------- Message To Spammers -- Game Over! Get spam-free email at http://www.MsgTo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:14:56 -0700 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Re: Barangrill Question Thanks for clearing that up for me, Jerry. I'm sorry, too, that we didn't get to meet at the WPB concert. At one point before the show, Jimmy took off to try to find you (I think he succeeded). I would have joined him, but I didn't want to leave my girlfriend sitting there by herself. There'll be a "next time," I'm sure. :-) Jim > Sorry I didn't get to meet you in West Palm Beach. The name is generic. > > Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 18:16:32 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Joni's coming...and someone else is, too (NJC) > > ELIAN GONZALEZ is MOVING INTO MY NEIGHBORHOOD!!!!!!! Janet it seems you are really excited. I have no idea why though! Who is Elian? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 18:19:30 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: NJC new to the list Welcome james. You will find there a quite a few people here who can hewlp you regarding the guitar stuff. I am not one of them tho. Can't play a thing. Congrats on your upcoming first anniversary. John and have our 19th on July 7th. bw colin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:21:33 -0400 From: "Bob Muller (Perception)" Subject: RE: fig leaves <> Sure you do, Janene, sure you do...;~) And while we're on the subject, it reminds me of the fact that the Adam & Eve story was what drove Joni away from organized religion, at least to hear her tell it. She wondered (as do I) if you interpret the A&E story literally (which I don't), then how did Cain and/or Abel ever have a family of their own, given that Eve was the only female? :~) I've posed this conundrum to people who say the Bible is the literal truth, and it's always fun to watch them wriggle and weasel around it... Bob NP: Tom Waits & Crystal Gayle, "This One's From the Heart" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 10:32:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Putting up reindeer (njc) But *why* would anyone even *consider* "Putting up reindeer"?? Can't they sleep outside? Wouldn't reindeer crap make a real mess in the house? oh... Never mind Emily Latella ===== "No paper thin walls, no folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:39:31 -0400 From: Janene Otten Subject: RE: fig leaves Yes, fundamentalism is a dangerous thing. Perhaps God was running a mail-order bride service. CRACK!!!! - that's lightning striking down around me. Ah, my pastor would be proud. J.O. > <> Bob wrote: > Sure you do, Janene, sure you do...;~) > > And while we're on the subject, it reminds me of the fact > that the Adam & > Eve story was what drove Joni away from organized religion, > at least to hear > her tell it. She wondered (as do I) if you interpret the A&E > story literally > (which I don't), then how did Cain and/or Abel ever have a > family of their > own, given that Eve was the only female? :~) > > I've posed this conundrum to people who say the Bible is the > literal truth, > and it's always fun to watch them wriggle and weasel around it... > > Bob > > NP: Tom Waits & Crystal Gayle, "This One's From the Heart" > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:37:44 -0400 From: "Bob Muller (Perception)" Subject: NJC new to the list Welcome James! Another talented songwriter and musician - that's great cuz you have to make up for those of us that aren't! :~) Please don't be a stranger - new voices are ALWAYS welcome here! And your opinions and comments will be respected and appreciated! PS, you didn't have to put an "NJC" on your post as you mentioned Joni a couple of times. But if you're not sure, you can always put it in there and you'll always be safe! Bob NP (Now Playing): Brian Blade, "Crooked Creek" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:55:32 -0700 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Re: Putting up reindeer (njc) Thanks for the mid-day smile, "Emily." :-) Jim - ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian Gross > But *why* would anyone even *consider* "Putting up reindeer"?? > > Can't they sleep outside? > Wouldn't reindeer crap make a real mess in the house? > > oh... > > Never mind > > Emily Latella ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:15:13 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: TV Time David wrote: >Hi: ...I heard Joni singing "The Circle Game". It's amazing that one artist can say so much within the context of one song, convey so much feeling and get her point across at the same time. 34 years later and she can still do that. WOW> what's possibly even more amazing is that this wisdom came originally from a mere girl of twenty years... pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:31:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: MSG 5/23 & some bittersweet lyrics I don't think Genesis is specific about what flora was used to 'cover the nakedness' of Adam and Eve, as I recall. The fig leaf, I believe, was an early tactic the Christians used to co-opt the symbolism of Greek/Roman paganism to speed conversion. But I could just be confusing my Art History and my Religious Symbol Systems courses from many ... many ... years back. I'll be interested to see what the "Judgment" of the Inner Circle is on this one ... tee-hee! ;-) Don Rowe ===== "I want a stillness inside, and a quiet of mind, and to stop dreaming of the comfort of strangers." -- Julia Fordham __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 14:34:11 +0000 From: Kenny Grant Subject: Joni's NYC Concert Reviewed in Wed NY Times Hi all, Was nice to see some listers at Judy's before Monday's show. Alot of new faces for me, as I've been lurking (at best) lately, though plan to get back to a more active status on the JMDL. Was nice to see that some people came from far away places (Prit from Spain, Lori from France, Alisone & Lane from Salt Lake, and Peter from London.) Always a pleasure to meet up with old friends and long time listers like Brian Gross, Patrick Leader, and Jill Linn. Not sure if it was the surprise in simon's voice when he rang me up over the weekend and learned that I only planned on going to Monday's show, or the fact that I can never get enough of Joni, but I returned last night, spur-of-the-moment, alone, last minute, and treated myself to a front section center stage seat (row 12). Doesn't compare to the 2nd row center seat that I have for the CT show on Sat with the "CT Group" - -- I am REALLY psyched about that!!! I've attached a hyperlink to a review of the Monday show published in today's NY Times (see below). Joni was in great voice and spirits both nights, and I truly enjoyed myself, especially Tues night, with the better seat and view. At last night's show she cracked up the audience. She was introducing the song Both Sides Now, and spoke of the many cloud formations she'd seen over the years, and said that one of the oddest cloud formations she'd ever seen was just recently - after the Florida show (Hi Paul, Pearl and Steve!) - "it was the strangest thing," Joni said. "I looked up and could swear I saw Magoo jacking off" The audience was in stitches! Here's the link to Monday's NYT review. Best, -Kenny http://www.nytimes.com/00/05/24/news/arts/mitchell-music-review.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:43:49 -0700 From: Scott Price Subject: RE: fig leaves "Down to You," --Joni Mitchell, Court and Spark Clutching the night to you like a fig leaf You hurry To the blackness And the blankets To lay down an impression And your loneliness ...brilliant Joni lyrics, as always... "Fig leaf" conjures up an image for me that shows the subject is feeling vulnerable. S/he has met someone at the "pickup station" and is about to engage in a physical relationship. It's after closing time and feeling a bit of desperation s/he has become "not so choosy." They hurry through the night to the darkened bedroom (blackness and blankets) where they both want to please and/or dazzle each other "lay down an impression" and at the same time stave off their "loneliness." It's happening fast. One minute s/he is "craving warmth and beauty" and the next has resigned to "settling for less than fascination." To me the "fig leaf" metaphor is that the subject is a little unsure about the whole evening's events, reaching out for *anything,* like the "night," that will help cover up or provide some reassurance and security. Further stretching it ;-) I might say that Joni was describing the subject of the song (Is it Joni herself? Most likely but the song isn't in the first person) as feeling naked in that situation, and when one is suddenly aware that a spotlight is on the instinctive reaction may be to reach for something to cover one's genitals. That's how the fig leaf was used by Adam and Eve and that's how I visualize the lyric. With a way-too-vivid imagination this morning, Scott ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:43:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: I stand corrected ... maybe (fig leaves NJC) Concerning the fig leaves ... the original King James Genesis is NOT specific, but the New Concordance amends Genesis to read: "and they (Adam and Eve) sewed garments together garments of fig leaves to cover their nakedness" Ain't the Web cool? Don Rowe ===== "I want a stillness inside, and a quiet of mind, and to stop dreaming of the comfort of strangers." -- Julia Fordham __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:45:34 -0700 From: Don Sloan Subject: Shadows and Light and re Ignoring questions and first-posters re: Ignoring questions and first-posters, I never take this personally as I, too, often must blow by many appealingly titled posts simply due to a lack of time. In fact, a post I recently submitted was left hanging w/o a response but given the extra traffic - and excitement - during Concert Mode, I understood. However, as one of the online music sellers is having a big sale and I would like to (finally) round-out my Joni collection with Shadows and Light, I'll re-ask my question: Seems there must be a difference between the domestic and import versions of this CD. In comparing tracks, it looks the same though I thought the import included extra titles. Can someone please let me know if the import is worth the extra cash and if so, why? Thanks! Don "Helen M. Adcock" wrote: > But when I've got 150 emails waiting to be > read, and it's 11pm at night, sometimes I just miss things, or think "Oh, > someone else will answer that" and I hit delete. I'll try and be more > careful, and more courteous, in the future. But we've all had posts ignored > on the list - personally, I've had hundreds, but then with the number that I > post, and their relevance to anyone but me, that's hardly surprising! > > Hell ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 14:44:50 EDT From: PPeterson4@aol.com Subject: New York Daily News Review May 24, 2000 I found this piece surprisingly forthright and agenda-less: Joni's Gold Standards Mitchell gives torch songs a new glow at MSG concert It had to happen: The boomer generation's bard of love, Joni Mitchell, had to tackle torch-song classics. Now she has. Mitchell's new album, named for her old hit "Both Sides Now," centers on love standards, mainly from the '30s, '40s and '50s. She performed those pieces, and some classics of her own, at the Theater in Madison Square Garden Monday and Tuesday joined by a tight jazz combo (featuring Herbie Hancock and Mark Isham) and surrounded by a 71-piece orchestra. Mitchell's unique approach to croonable hits has not been easy to warm up to. It took this critic no fewer than 10 hard listens to fall for the LP. Too bad I reviewed it, with sorrowful disappointment, five listens in. Luckily, late-arriving love can cut the deepest, and I swooned for her display on Monday. Appearing in a billowing magenta gown, the 56-year-old Mitchell made the most of her technically narrowing instrument. As a lifelong smoker, every cigarette she ever puffed has left its mark on her voice. Of course, there's a long history of older singers using their flaws to highlight the richness of their experiences. Late-period Billie Holiday leaps to mind. Similarly, at the Garden theater, Mitchell's shorter breath and huskier throat brought the audience closer and made her seem even more the battered authority on love's risks and rewards. The show, divided into two 55-minute segments, found Mitchell first performing every song from the new album — in order. She had to do it that way. The 12 songs off "Both Sides Now" trace the arc of a romance, moving from infatuation to rejection to healing. Tellingly, only the first two songs found the singer happy. After a long orchestral introduction full of foreboding and intrigue, Mitchell crooned "You're My Thrill" with resilient wonder. She expressed relief in "At Last." Mitchell next communicated all the witty doom of "Comes Love," a song made famous by Holiday and treating love as an incurable illness. Just four songs in, Mitchell declared "You've Changed." In every song, the singer drew on her long infatuation with jazz inflections. She also performed two numbers she wrote and included on the new CD. Mitchell turned "A Case Of You" from a soaring folk piece into a woozy jazz ballad. In the song "Both Sides Now," which completed the album portion of the program, she exuded an unsettling wisdom. Mitchell sang six pieces not included on the CD. She proved she could be playful in her '80s jazz swing piece "Be Cool." Otherwise, she kept the mood yearning or troubled. Her performance of "Hejira" used Larry Klein's questioning bass to put a fire under the orchestra. She made even grander use of the players in "Judgment of the Moon and Stars," her stirring song of support to uncompromising souls. With typical defiance, Mitchell ended the evening with "For the Roses," one of her best kiss-offs to the music business. Through its radical rearrangement, Mitchell proved yet again her commitment to challenge and change — the two things she values as highly as love. Original Publication Date: 5/24/00 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 14:51:57 EDT From: PPeterson4@aol.com Subject: New York Post Review May 24, 2000 Here's one from the Post (de gustibus non disputandum est!): COVER CONCERT DOESN'T DO JONI JUSTICE By DAN AQUILANTE - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ - -- MAYBE because Joni Mitchell is one of the most important songwriters of her generation, it's a little disappointing that her latest career move is dusting off cabaret standards and love songs. At the Theater at Madison Square Garden Monday for the first of a two-night engagement, Mitchell's performance ranged from pretty to pretty boring. She is a songwriter and a singer, but not a great stylist or interpreter. You don't have to look beyond her own career to realize that the best-known versions of her own songs - including the title track to her new album "Both Sides Now"- are by other artists. Making matters worse was Vince Mendoza, whose heavy-handed conducting and saccharine string treatments for the 70-piece backup band often overpowered Mitchell and the jazz group, which was also on stage through the evening. When you consider the jazz ensemble was a powerhouse, including pianist Herbie Hancock, bassist Chuck Berghofer, drummer Peter Erskine and trumpet ace Mark Isham, one has to wonder why Mitchell needed the orchestra at all. Mendoza and company were musically flaccid, dead weight that crushed Mitchell's performance and made no real room for any of these jazz greats to be great. The reason to hear performers such as Mitchell and Hancock is because they are thinkers who are able to move within the music, improvise and make it all seem effortless. For them to appear in this symphonic formation must have been incredibly restricting. And, as if she were singing along to a pre-recorded track, it seemed as if Mitchell had to pursue the band to keep up. The night's rendition of "Stormy Weather" was a good example of this. The orchestra worked the classic according to the sheet music, yet when Mitchell attempted to interject a bluer mood through variations in the tempo, her efforts were thwarted. The fans loved "Stormy Weather" anyway and rewarded it with some of the evening's biggest applause. What wasn't clear was if the cheers were because of the major song-recognition factor or Mitchell's delivery. But no tune during this event - including her own "A Case of You" and "Both Sides Now," two of the night's better moments - ever raised goosebumps. "I'm glad I saw this," one Mitchell fan said while leaving the theater. "I don't think I'd want to see it again." ------------------------------ Date: Wed May 24 15:10:49 EDT 2000 From: "James O. Phillips" Subject: favourite Joni songs.... Okay, I wasn't quite sure if I should do the NJC or not (just didn't want to step on anyone's toes.) Anyways, I had been reading how Joni is thinking of an orchestral album of her own songs. Here is my list of what I would love to see done: I had a Kindg Night in the City The Sire of Sorrow Night ride Home Ludwig's tune Chelsea Morning Michael from Moutains Stay in touch Amelia the Pirates of Penance the Silky Veils of Ardor (or whatever it is) Also, I think it would be cool if whatever orchestra she would use would play behind her guitar (or piano) a la Nanci Griffith's Dust Bowl Symphony. I am a fan of Miss Mitchell's guitar playing and am slightly disappointed that she didn't play at all on Both Sides Now. Am I the only one thinking this or are there others out there thinking the same thing? James - ---------- Message To Spammers -- Game Over! Get spam-free email at http://www.MsgTo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:57:22 -0500 From: "Pitassi, Mary" Subject: Attention, Saskatoon-goers! Who is going to the opening of Joni's exhibit at the Mendel Gallery in Saskatoon on June 30, 2000? And has a "sub-list" been established yet for this group? E-mail me privately and/or on-list. "Inquiring minds want to know"! Mary P. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 14:46:43 -0400 From: "Peg Eves" Subject: RE: Putting up reindeer (njc) Emily wrote: But *why* would anyone even *consider* "Putting up reindeer"?? > > > > Can't they sleep outside? > > Wouldn't reindeer crap make a real mess in the house? > > > > oh... > > > > Never mind > > > > Emily Latella > > Really! It's the animal rights people. They'll put up anything with fin, fur or feather Peg > > ----- > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:06:26 -0400 From: Linda Worster Subject: Re: music for a Rainy day today, it's "For the Roses"..... what perfect rainy day music... Joni's great for rainy days. Sunny days too. Linda, wishing the sun would come out around here soon... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 14:59:18 -0400 From: "Peg Eves" Subject: RE: NJC new to the list Well Hey James. A performer, eh? You've got guts. I hear 'ya on the wierd tunings idea. I used to play a few of her songs in D tuning and loved it. I found it easier physically. But I did it by eye & ear. I never noticed, unless I took it to the piano to play - what chords I was playing. Some of her sweetest songs are in wierd tunings. How 'aout that Ricky Lee?? Peg/ VT > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-joni@jmdl.com [mailto:owner-joni@jmdl.com]On Behalf Of James > O. Phillips > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 1:25 PM > To: joni@smoe.org > Subject: NJC new to the list > > > Dear all- > > I just signed up for the list last night and what an interesting > list it is indeed. > > I thought that I would take the time to introduce myself to the > list and some of my hobbies that I do. > > My name is James O. Phillips and I live in the college town of > Champaign Illinois. I'm a 25 year old married "gay" male who is > celebrating my 1st anniverary on the 17th of July to my partner, > Patrick. I play the guitar (both acoustic and electric) the > autoharp and I have a 3 sting dulicimer in a state of disrepair > at the moment. I like to sing and perform music, in fact, I have > a show lined up for the 6th of June at a local coffeehouse. In > my sets, I do covers by assorted people like Joni, Lucinda > Williams, Rickie Lee Jones, Nanci Griffith, Bonnie Raitt and many > more. I do write songs, but I am so embarrased to play my own > material because the songs that I write are like my own children. > I write in sort of a Joni, Rickie Lee Jones and Laura Nyro type of vein. > > The Joni songs that I know how to play on the guitar (I play only > in standard tuning cause I get lost in open tunings: It throws > me off) are Woodstock, Big Yellow Taxi, Both Sides Now, > California, Carey and River. I am going to try to figure out > Chelsea Morning in standard tuning one of these days, but haven't > gotten around to it. > > I do have a question for anyone that might be able to share with > me. Can someone explain the Roland thing that Joni uses on her > guitar? How is it able to switch the tunings for it? I am > interested in knowing a little bit more about it, and would > appreciate any help anyone can give me. > > I also thought that I would share something that may be of > interest to anyone on the list. I have in good condition a used > vinyl lp of "The world of Joni Mitchell". Does anyone else on > the list have it, or am I the only one? Also, if anyone wants to > know the song order, I'll send it to you. It has selections from > her first four albums. > > Well, I had better go, so take care. > > To quote a favourite off of the Taming the Tiger cd, > "We should stay in touch", > > James O. Phillips > ---------- > Message To Spammers -- Game Over! Get spam-free email at > http://www.MsgTo.com > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:21:11 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: Guitar stuart, for my part I can vouch that Joni played a Martin D28 (sometimes mine) exclusively from mid '66 to mid '68 (the two years we were friends) and, going by pics of her in concert as well as from the sound on recordings, she continued playing it well into the early '70's. also, during the time I was the booking guy at the Cellar, in the xeroxed promo material she gave me at the time, there were pics of her playing what looked like a small, pre-war Martin (maybe 000 model?) similar to the one Joan Baez used to play) but I never saw her with it. I'm guessing that she first started playing electrics in the C&S period... if I were trying to research this I would start with pics of her in concert... for example, I was somewhat thrilled last week when someone posted a concert shot on catgirl's list of Joni playing a Fender strat, the first I've seen. hope that helps. pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:53:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: I stand corrected ... maybe (fig leaves NJC) - --- Don Rowe wrote: > Concerning the fig leaves ... the original King James > Genesis is NOT specific, but the New Concordance > amends Genesis to read: > > "and they (Adam and Eve) sewed garments together > garments of fig leaves to cover their nakedness" Isn't that a bit of revisionism? hmmm, I wonder what the original Hebrew says? Brian np: NPR ===== "No paper thin walls, no folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:57:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: I stand corrected ... maybe (fig leaves NJC) - --- Brian Gross wrote: > Isn't that a bit of revisionism? > > hmmm, I wonder what the original Hebrew says? > > Brian Oh The Bible is nothing, if not a how-to manual of revisionist history. I'll have to go to www.thetalmud.com or some such site ... but my guess is figs aren't kosher! ;-) Don Rowe ===== "I want a stillness inside, and a quiet of mind, and to stop dreaming of the comfort of strangers." -- Julia Fordham __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 16:32:22 -0400 From: Kate & CJ Subject: Dog Eat Dog I can't remember who asked, but DED is available thru cdnow for $5.99! It did say low stock, but this looks like the best bet! CJ np Diana Krall (wow) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:31:00 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Circles Howard wrote: >What did I take away from this? That if Kakki and I run into >each other at BSN Chicago (you're going to be here, aren't >you?) that it will be a little tense. And . . . No need to feel tense - I can't get a flight change from New Orleans. But I hope you enjoy the concert with some of the Chicago and L.A. Circlers. > As much as I hate to say it, there is a bit of a feeling of us >vs. them, and no one wants that. JM would want us all to feel >included, whether we are stuck at Blue, or stuck on the >notion that Hejira is one of the most underrated albums of >the rock era (this would be my crusade) or that TTT is an >amazing use of the VG-8. It's too bad that there is a feeling of us vs. them. I really think it's more perceived than real. The key is to hang in there on the list and take the initiative to get to know people, even if you are ignored or rejected on your first attempts. For my entire first year on the list, I can count on less than one hand the number of people who befriended me, much less ever responded to my posts or questions. But I hung in there because I still thought it was an interesting place to be, and I'm really glad I did, despite that first painful year. And without mentioning names, I have to eternally thank those few who were so amazingly kind to me. They know who they are. Getting to know you own local group of jmdlers is also a great idea. I've come to cherish the little SoCal group (including the Arizonans ;-) so much - some of the best people I've ever met. Kakki ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #279 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?