From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #225 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Monday, May 1 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 225 The 'Official' Joni Mitchell Homepage, created by Wally Breese, can be found at http://www.jonimitchell.com. It contains the latest news, a detailed bio, Original Interviews, essays, lyrics and much much more. --- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. --- Ashara has set up a "Wally Breese Memorial Fund" with all donations going directly towards the upkeep of the website. Wally kept the website going with his own funds. it is now up to US to help Jim continue. If you would like to donate to this fund, please make all checks payable to: Jim Johanson and send them to: Ashara Stansfield P.O. Box 215 Topsfield, MA. 01983 USA ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: WHY ISN'T THERE AN ALT.MUSIC.JONI-MITCHELL??? [MDESTE1@aol.com] re: Hillary standing by her man NJC [pat holden ] Re: found this [FMYFL@aol.com] Re: Judgement Of The Moon And Stars-lyric question [IVPAUL42@aol.com] New "good" music ["cassy" ] RE: Judgement Of The Moon And Stars-lyric question ["Wally Kairuz" ] entertainment weekly [JP ] Re: Musician Magazine (NJC) ["James L. Leonard" ] Re: entertainment weekly [Jerry Notaro ] Re: New "good" music [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: k.d. lang, Sue M., and "Impossible Dreamer" [Catherine McKay ] Re: baldies (NJC) [Treehuggergirl25@aol.com] Banjos (NJC) [Steve Dulson ] Re:- River / Travis [Gertus@aol.com] NJC ARLO GUTHRIE [Treehuggergirl25@aol.com] Re: Tribute Comments/Hillary NJC ["Alison Einerson" ] Re: Hillary standing by her man NJC ["Alison Einerson" ] bad music (njc) [evian ] Amy Grant (njc) [evian ] Re: bad music. (NJC) [Catherine McKay ] Re: Joni on VH1 "1970- Behind the Music" ["cassy" ] Fw: Saskatoon postcard ["Ronda Snyder" ] Music Business Careers ["C.A. Starkey" ] Re: - River / Travis [Siresorrow@aol.com] Re: Music Business Careers ["Brenda J. Walker" ] Re: June Tabor Cover ["Kakki" ] Re: Music Business Careers Critical Websites For Career Advancement [MDES] Re: Vickie Sue [Mark Domyancich ] Re: Flo and Eddy, Hillary, who chose? [AngelinoCoyote@aol.com] Re: June Tabor Cover [SMEBD@aol.com] Tour Photographers - LONG [leslie@torchsongs.com] Re: Hillary standing by her man NJC [catman Subject: re: Hillary standing by her man NJC catman wrote: <> mags responds: The thing is Colin, many women are subject to a standard of female socialization which embraces a "stand by your man no matter what" philosophy. Despite the feminist politic they may or may not be representing , it is very common for some women to do just that, no matter how badly they are treated. Many women are conditioned to hang in there just one more hour, one more day cuz baby he might just change...if and only IF the woman tries to do/be something different/better. Many women are also socialized to believe that they are nothing without a man period. It is a complicated issue, which Im sure you are well aware. Thanks for the thought provoking response. mags - -- - --------------------------------------------------------------------- _~O / /\_, ___/\ /_ - ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 07:53:07 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: found this Colin writes: << http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/8678/ssjonimitchell.html maybe you all red it already! >> Maybe someone has posted this altavista site before, but I never saw it. The best thing about it is if you scroll down thru the article, you can click on photos of Joni and there are hundreds of them! Thanks for the tip Colin. Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 08:16:20 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Judgement Of The Moon And Stars-lyric question In a message dated 5/1/00 7:35:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Ginamu@aol.com writes: << I listened to For The Roses (brilliant, totally brilliant!) on Saturday while folding mountains of laundry and I'm wondering about the line: "In the court they carve your legend with an apple in its jaw". I'm not sure if this has been brought up on the list before, nor do I know if this comment is common knowledge to Ludwig fans, but I'd love to know or to hear people's speculations. Take care, Gina >> You know of the tradition of putting an apple in the mouth of a roasted pig? Well, Joni is saying that Ludwig was served up like a fatted pig to the court, probably Napolean. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 08:12:38 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: New "good" music >>does anyone besides me cringe whenever they think of all the new groups coming out these days.....<< Yes, some of the new groups make me cringe... and then there are some newer artists that really restore my faith in the "new music" scene. Not ALL of the new music is bad! Shannon Curfman has recently released her debut album, "Loud Guitars, Big Suspicions." On the new album she sings every song, plays lead guitar on most of the cuts and wrote over half of the tunes. During the past year she has opened for such groups as Tab Benoit, Delbert McClinton, the Fabulous Thunderbirds, John Mellencamp and Steve Miller. She sat in with Jonny Lang and Jeff Healy and has recently spent time in Memphis, writing songs with some of the areas best tunesmiths. Reviewers are calling her "the princess of soul," "a seasoned blues singer," "a real belter, with a big Janis Joplin-like delivery," and "a blues sensation who sings like a legend." On top of all this, she has just signed with a major record label (Arista Records). This sounds like a pretty impressive resume for any seasoned blues singer. What's remarkable here, however, is that Shannon has done all of this before she even turned 14. Born July 31, 1985, Shannon Curfman is a young blues phenomenon. Singing before she could barely talk, Shannon began playing the guitar when she was 10, saying her biggest overall influence was Jonny Lang, "because he's an amazing musician, and also because he was a young musician just starting to break out. He was the first person I ever saw that played blues. Robert Johnson also made a huge impact on me." Lang also played guitar on several tracks of her new album. Shannon is a fresh young talent with an impressively mature voice. You just have to wonder what she'll be up to by the time she's old enough to drive. Another great newer musician is Susan Tedeschi, she was nominated for a Grammy this past year for best new artist. With a voice that is frequently compared with Janis Joplin, Bonnie Raitt and Etta James, and a guitar style influenced by Johnny Guitar Watson, Magic Sam and Freddie King, Susan has taken her influences and sculpted them into a style all her own. With the release of her national debut CD, "Just Won't Burn" on Tone-Cool Records, Susan's profile has continued to grow: she's had a top-15 Triple-A radio hit with "It Hurt So Bad," has toured with Buddy Guy, Jonny Lang, BB King, Dr John and Delbert McClinton, has graced the covers of Pollstar and Blues Revue magazines, and registered one of the top selling albums in the country. Susan's from-the-heart vocals and stinging guitar work combined with her charismatic stage presence and electrifying live performances, have caused listeners and critics nationwide to take notice. If you take the time to go beyond what the DJs constantly spin on the Top-40 stations, you will find that there really are some wonderful newer talents. Cassy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 09:24:21 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Judgement Of The Moon And Stars-lyric question though i'm not sure about whose court joni is talking about, i've always thought along the same lines. wallyk - ----- Mensaje original ----- De: Para: ; Enviado: Lunes 1 de Mayo de 2000 09:16 Asunto: Re: Judgement Of The Moon And Stars-lyric question > In a message dated 5/1/00 7:35:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Ginamu@aol.com > writes: > > << I listened to For The Roses (brilliant, totally brilliant!) on Saturday > while > folding mountains of laundry and I'm wondering about the line: "In the court > they carve your legend with an apple in its jaw". I'm not sure if this has > been brought up on the list before, nor do I know if this comment is common > knowledge to Ludwig fans, but I'd love to know or to hear people's > speculations. > > Take care, > Gina > >> > You know of the tradition of putting an apple in the mouth of a roasted pig? > Well, Joni is saying that Ludwig was served up like a fatted pig to the > court, probably Napolean. > > Paul I > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 08:55:23 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Flo and Eddy, Hillary, who chose? - NJC "Helen M. Adcock" wrote: Personally, I don't care who a politician sleeps with, as long as their > politics are sound, and they do the job they were employed for well. Amen. > > > As an aside, I read a survey somewhere that said that 1 out of 4 married > Americans have been or have thought about being unfaithful, which makes the > whole outcry and scandal over Clinton/Lewinsky seem just a little > hypocritical. Just my opinion, but imagine what the money spent on that > trial could have done towards the homeless, or Aids or cancer research, or > any other worthwhile cause? Americans hypocritical? Never. > > > And as for Hillary, I get the impression (as a real outsider, with not much > knowledge of American politics) that she is an intelligent, professional > woman, who sees the offices of the President and First Lady as more > important than the individuals. Having said that, her reasons for staying > with her husband are her own. Go girl. Jerry, thinking about moving to NZ if they all think like Helly. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 09:11:11 -0400 From: "Ken (slarty)" Subject: Re: bad music. NJC I'm appalled too. She's not good enough to be considered a 'silly little tart" catman wrote: > Treehuggergirl25@aol.com wrote: > > > And those girls like Brittney Spears > > I was reading a newspaper yesterday and a reviewer of Ms Spears' latest > record referred to her as 'silly little tart'! I was appalled. Okay so > don't like the music and criricsie that but to name call like that is > childish and nasty. In fact I would have thought it was libelous. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 15:54:45 +0300 From: JP Subject: entertainment weekly hi, the program i saw on tv with joni & hillary must have been "entertainment today", not 'weekly'. is 'ew' a magazine? sorry for the confusion. - --jussi ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 09:27:25 -0700 From: "James L. Leonard" Subject: Re: Musician Magazine (NJC) Hi, Penny...and fellow JMDLers. :-) A longtime fan of Musician magazine, I was saddened to learn recently that it had ceased publication. Subscriptions had been in decline for quite some time, and in its last years the magazine began to take on a far greater "technical" focus. In the end, its content was tailored almost exclusively to the working musician. Most of the articles were devoted to emerging musical equipment technology, or recording techniques, or how to get a record deal, etc. I finally decided to let my subscription expire for this reason. I searched for Musician on the web not too long ago, and, on some site, I learned of its recent demise. :-( Downbeat, at least to me, is as close as a magazine gets to what Musician was like in its heyday. Downbeat's focus has moved from strictly jazz to "Jazz, Blues, and Beyond." There's quite a bit of "Beyond" in Downbeat nowadays, actually...a lot of purists think there's far too much "Beyond," in fact. They do features, or shorter stories, on just about everyone who's making good, adult-oriented music. "Boston Jim" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 09:30:30 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: entertainment weekly MDESTE1@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 00-04-30 13:05:41 EDT, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: > > << > Actually, it's true. It wasn't until the Clintons met Judy at the White > House that they discovered that Joni, and not Judy, had written the > song. Jerry > >> > > HILLARIOUS....the Clintons invited JUDY COLLINS but not Joni. Absolutely > clueless. I am rolling on the floor at this point. The whole matter is > getting deeper. This entire Hillary appearance is now resembling a Dan Quayle > bonk-up. Nowhere does it say the Clintons invited her. She appeared as part of the Inaugural entertainment at the invitation of the chair of the committee because the Clintons liked Judy Collins recording. Since they didn't even know Joni had written CM (not uncommon) it makes perfect sense to me. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 09:45:26 EDT From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: New "good" music In a message dated 5/1/00 8:19:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time, cassysweet@email.msn.com writes: << She sat in with Jonny Lang and Jeff Healy and has recently spent time in Memphis, writing songs with some of the areas best tunesmiths. Reviewers are calling her "the princess of soul," "a seasoned blues singer," "a real belter, with a big Janis Joplin-like delivery," >> yes! and jonny lang and jeff healy are no slouches either and certainly not old. jeff healy maybe is older...mid 30's or so. i think he was thirty when he did his first album, ..see the light....and of course, he's blind. but talk about talent. and execution. great post cassy. pat ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 09:53:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: k.d. lang, Sue M., and "Impossible Dreamer" - --- MDESTE1@aol.com wrote: > I am dreaming of K.D. lang in a gorgeous Armani > formal gown with her hair > absolutely manicured and styled by the best stylist > in the world, makeup > administered by New Yorks finest and stylish Italian > shoes and real diamond > pendant earrings......ah but Im being an Impossible > Dreamer. marcel. Marcel, have you ever seen kd's "Miss Chatelaine" video? You'd probably love her outfit in that - very feminine - she looked like a prom queen, so to speak. ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:06:44 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu \(Lamadoo\)" Subject: RE: Spice Girls NJC and other pre-fab groups Bad Hell was lamenting the creation of NZ's True Bliss and Australia's Popstars. Aww geez Hell, don't you think that the potential for greater societal benefit outweighs the lightweight musical contribution? I'm thinking about Ginger Spice in Penthouse here. :) If it hadn't been for those stupid Spice Girls, we would never know about Ginger's uhh.. finest attributes. Metaphorically, remember that Tom Hanks was in a bad sitcom for years and years and years. And he eventually became a responsible citizen. :) BTW, are there any former-Monkee fans in the house? All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:21:47 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Joni on VH1 "1970- Behind the Music" For anyone who missed last nights show, I must say it was quite enjoyable! I was roped into watching the '70s mini series (which is awful)........I think it was made just to sell the soundtrack to us boomers. I did record "Behind the Music" and watched it this morning. Joni is only in the hour special for about 3 minutes. They have clips of her singing "BYT" and a couple of statements from her about the early '70s. They talked about how some singer/songwriters turned their backs on politics to search for greater meanings in their everyday lives. The music at the time had shifted away from Janis Joplin and Grace Slick to Carole King and Joni Mitchell. Joni said "What I was thinking about basically was the only cure for all of this is love and *what is that*? " Looking at Joni in this special, it appears to me that it was a recent interview. Overall, the entire special was pretty good and informative. ( I had no idea Crissie Hynde was a sophomore at Kent State during the riots ), and Bernie Taupin is looking pretty good these days :~) If you look at the website that Jim J. has posted on JM.Com, I'm pretty sure this will be aired a few more times. Jimmy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 09:08:27 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: NJC - Rickie Lee Jones next album Joniphiles - The track listing for Rickie's upcoming album is quite interesting: 1. "Someone To Watch Over Me" (Gershwin/Gershwin) 2. "Trouble Man" (Marvin Gaye) 3. "For No One" (the Beatles) 4. "Cycles" (Frank Sinatra) 5. "One Hand, One Heart" (Bernstein/Sondheim) 6. "Show Biz Kids" (Steely Dan) 7. "Smile" (Charlie Chaplin) 8. "Up a Lazy River" (Arodin/Carmichael) 9. "Low Spark of High-Heeled Boys" (Traffic) 10. "On the Street Where You Live" (Lerner/Loewe) 11. "Can't Get Started" (Duke/Gershwin) Anyone know the release date? Les NP: Holly Cole "On The Street Where You Live" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:46:26 EDT From: Treehuggergirl25@aol.com Subject: Re: baldies (NJC) shave your head..... shave your head..................... i have a thing for guys who shave their heads. *sigh* (as long as they're nice too.) - -angela ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 08:49:38 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Banjos (NJC) >PaulC (off for a banjo session). Oh, no....another one bites the dust...And you seemed like such a tasteful guy, Paul! :) ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:54:39 EDT From: Gertus@aol.com Subject: Re:- River / Travis Pat wrote:- just saw this on the rt list and thought it fit here. i've never heard of travis aside from mark n travis. pat ==== Anyhow, I'd heard the second Travis album at his place last year, more or less in the background, and didn't find it objectionable. I'd actually found "Why does it always rain on me" to be a classic sort of pop single - something that The Turtles might have done in the Sixties, maybe - without realising who the band was. And then came the slight revelation. I was in the record store in January, and they were playing a really creditable version of Joni Mitchell's "River" - done quite straight. I discovered this was an extra track on a Travis single, which I bought on spec - then went back next day to get the second album. I've played both discs quite a lot since, and while I don't think they're in the same league as some of my alltimefaves, I still haven't tired of them. I've heard other stuff too, by Travis, which makes me think I'd enjoy them live. In particular I like the fact that they do (with apparent enjoyment/respect) older material by other artistes (like Joni, the Beatles and even Britney Spears!) Shows they are not so wound up in their infallible belief that they need to write all their own material - which is where many another contemporary band comes unstuck. - ---------------------------- Travis are a talented Scottish band, very big in the UK right now. They also covered "Urge for Going" very much in the same way - i.e. as an extra track on just one of two editions of a single, I forget which one now. They are clearly big Joni fans. They have just released a new single but, as yet I don't know whether it has any hidden Joni on it. Jacky ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:08:54 EDT From: Treehuggergirl25@aol.com Subject: NJC ARLO GUTHRIE Speaking of attractive men............. now that Arlo Guthrie (when he was my age) (25) could eat crackers in my bed, any day. as my grandma norma would phrase it. There are the bald men, and then there are the good hippie guys too. waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa - -angela ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:25:24 -0600 From: "Alison Einerson" Subject: Re: Tribute Comments/Hillary NJC i knew there was a reason i liked you, vince. >I was not aware that so many people here were privy to exactly what goes >on in Bill and Hillary's private life and minds and her exact motivation >in her marriage or future plans. >>If you don't like Hillary's or Bill's politics, fine. But ease up on >the personal snide remarks. You need something to speculate on, go >ponder George W. Bush branding tattoos on his pledge buddies butts. Or, >to elevate the conversation: > >if your mother was to show up at a tribute for the person whom you named >after, whose would it be? my father's adoptive mother, alice, who lives in little rock arkansas and is a HUGE fan of the clintons. alison e. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:19:17 -0400 (EDT) From: w evans Subject: Graham? Anyone know why Graham wasn't at the tribute? Are they still touring, is that it? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:30:11 -0600 From: "Alison Einerson" Subject: Re: Hillary standing by her man NJC >mags responds: > many women are subject to a >standard of female socialization which embraces a >"stand by your man no matter what" philosophy. Despite >the feminist politic they may or may not be >representing , it is very common for some women to do >just that, no matter how badly they are treated. Many >women are conditioned to hang in there just one more >hour, one more day cuz baby he might just change...if >and only IF the woman tries to do/be something >different/better. Many women are also socialized to >believe that they are nothing without a man period. >It is a complicated issue, which Im sure you are well >aware. Thanks for the thought provoking response. > >mags while i do think you have a point, there, mags, i don't think hillary falls into this particular category. i think hillary knew that divorce/seperation would ruin bill's political career (and possibly her own in the process). i think she rode that coaster as long as she could because she knew it was the only way to hold on to the possibility of her own political aspirations. i think she has the potential to do great things for women and children in this country. i would like to see what the future holds for her, and what she will do once she wins a seat in the senate. alison e. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:33:58 -0600 From: "Alison Einerson" Subject: Re: baldies (NJC) if i remember correctly, wally, this is on "Buy me, bring me, don't mess my hair-Volume 1-Life according to four bitchin babes". The bitchin babes, if you don't already know, were originally Christine Lavin (this song was written by her), Patty Larkin, Megan McDonough and Sally Fingerett. All incredible talents on their own, and insane fun when together. I think Sally and Megan are the only ones left in the current incarnation of the "babes". take care, alison e. Christine Lavin song: I Love >Bald >> Headed Men! >> > > >i must hear that song pronto!!!! it will become my personal anthem. i am a >baldyfreak. in fact, i wish i were bald myself. james taylor is looking so >handsome these days. >i once wrote a song about my seemingly endless string of bald lovers >entitled: >"here comes another bald man but he'll go down the drain" >wallyk, np james taylor, "music", sigh sigh sigh > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:25:10 -0600 From: evian Subject: bad music (njc) > Truthfully, I'd much rather my kids listen to Backstreet Boys than to Marilyn > Manson or Korn. If they did, though, I would try to understand why they liked > it just the same. > > Great post Gina! I feel the same way... And just to add something funny, a couple of weeks ago at work, we were all sitting around and the Backstreet Boys came on the radio, and everyone was admitting "Well, you know... they DO sound good" or "This IS a catchy song" and "Well, they ARE better than the New Kids were", and basically we were all trying to validate the reasons why we all sorta liked them. I dunno, maybe you had to be there, but it was funny, all of us trying to be so hip and cool and rationalize why we always hear humming from each of our offices whenever the BB's or whoever comes on the radio. Just this morning in the dentist's office, the woman who was filling my tooth basically started singing that new Brittney Spear's song (God, I'm sorry, but I just hate it), and then said "OMG, I can't believe I am singing this". Anyway, just had to pipe up about the BB thing...lol, did anyone see Simpson's last night when Lenny and Carl were discussing their favorite BB? LOL, it was funny. Your friend who is now hopefully out of dental pain, Evian np: "Echo Beach" -- Martha & the Muffins ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:32:34 -0600 From: evian Subject: Amy Grant (njc) Hey, I just deleted the digest, so now I can't remember who posted that pantless Amy Grant thang, but I just had to post again and tell people that they REALLY should check out Amy's "Lead Me On". It is an amazing album, which came out before she went a Celine Dion-ish. It's sort of a stopover between her religious stuff and her immersion in pop-ness. And, she does a GREAT GREAT GREAT version of Jimmy Webb's "If These Walls Could Speak". Ashara darling, back me up when you read this! Evian ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:47:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine McKay Subject: Re: bad music. (NJC) > > Treehuggergirl25@aol.com writes: > > << does anyone besides me cringe whenever they think > of all the new groups > coming out these days.....N Sync, backstreet boys, > etc? >> > > --- Ginamu@aol.com wrote: > I'd like to throw in my two cents on this one. I > have two daughters, ages 12 > and 11. Needless to say they love these groups. > Though I don't, I try to be > positive when they ask me "Mom, do you like this > song?" I try to say > something positive like "it has a nice melody, the > singer has a nice voice, > it's catchy". Then again, my younger daughter in > particular, is a flutist and > a pianist and adores classical music. She is also a > fan of Joni. XTC's Apple > Venus is a regular choice for her. >I know she recognizes > the difference between > the genius of Joni Mitchell, say, and the catchy pop > of Backstreet Boys and > is able to sort of put it all in perspective. She's > grown up listening to all > kinds of music. Everything from Elmore James to Liz > Phair. > > Truthfully, I'd much rather my kids listen to > Backstreet Boys than to Marilyn > Manson or Korn. If they did, though, I would try to > understand why they liked > it just the same. I too have kids of that age - a daughter just turned 13 and a son aged 9. They too like the 'NSync, S-Club-7, "junkfood for juveniles" kind of music and there are times, I have to grit my teeth listening to it. However, like Gina, I prefer not to see it as necessarily a negative thing - some of these people do sing well and what do you want for kids of that age? When I was 12, I was listening to the Monkees - a few years later, I discovered Joni. I'm hoping that, given a few years, these kids will discover "good" music that means something. Many of these boy and girl groups are put together as an act - they don't write their own material, they've been raised to be "Miss Teen America" (or the male equivalent thereof); they've been Mouseketeers, baton-twirlers, catalogue models, cutest-baby-of-the-year, the usual stuff that lies behind every Brittney Spears (Have you seen her "Milk" print-ad - the current Brittney and next to her, her younger self as a 4-yr old or thereabouts in the dance costume? these kids have been groomed into that whole scene from earliest childhood - they've probably been bleaching their teeth since birth!) IF they're really talented, they'll be around in a few years, otherwise, bye-bye. There are some talented young folks out there - they're not all Mariah Carey wannabes, but only time will tell and unfortunately, kitsch and emoting are part of the current fad (let's hope it is a fad! Black velvet paintings are still around in some neighbourhoods!) The other day, my kids' school had their spring concert. One thing about their school is, they have a fabulous music program - their vocal teacher, Mr. Brown (that's his real name, and I have no idea what his first name is!) teaches them some really lovely and different songs and gets quite a performance out of really young kids. There was one young girl from Grade 8 by the name of Krystyne James who sang a solo. It was in the R&B vein and a style of singing not necessarily my cuppa tea, but man, has this girl got lungs! My jaw dropped. I was the one whining a week or two ago about child prodigies and how far you can push them, and I still stand by that. But this girl may be one to watch out for in future. Despite this "adult"-sounding voice, she was very much a "normal" kind of 13-yr old - really cute in a regular way - you wouldn't mind if your kids hung out with her. When she finished singing, she just kind of giggled "thank you" in a way that reminded you, she was just a kid after all. She brought the house down - you should've heard all these parents hootin' and hollerin' and giving her a standing ovation. There is hope for these kids, if they can make it through all the hype. ===== Catherine (in Toronto) catrin_of_aragon@yahoo.ca _______________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:15:20 -0400 From: "cassy" Subject: Re: Joni on VH1 "1970- Behind the Music" Jimmy said: > Joni is only in the hour special for about 3 minutes. They have > clips of her singing "BYT" and a couple of statements from her > about the early '70s. What I really liked was the comment about how the singer/songwriters of the 60's were moving transitionally into the "complete musicians" of the 70's then segued into the piece about Joni very shortly after that, inferring that Joni was one of those "complete musicians." Cassy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:21:40 EDT From: Dolphnwomn@aol.com Subject: Re: k.d. lang, Sue M., and "Impossible Dreamer" Sue wrote: << I wish with all my heart that I could clone myself and get to the Jonifest in New orleans this year, but alas, that's Cornell graduation weekend and I owe my soul to the company store! :-( >> Ah, but that leaves the New England Labor Day Jonifest wide open for you to attend! :-) Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:33:59 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Fwd: Re: TNT Tape can any kind soul help this gal who wrote her request to catgirl's list? pat ps - I'd also like to get a copy... pleeeze? - --------- Forwarded Message --------- DATE: Mon, 01 May 2000 16:28:21 From: "RA Murphy" To: JoniMitchellfans@egroups.com Hello Everybody, I subscribed to this list last week with one goal in mind. I hope I am posting to the right list for this request. I promised to tape the TNT Joni Mitchell tribute for a friend last month. Which I did. Then I accidentally taped over it. I've got to replace this tape! I live in Seattle, Washington. Is there anybody on this list from Seattle who would be willing to let me borrow their tape so I could dub it? Or is there anybody on this list who would be willing to dub their tape and mail it to me? I would reimburse them for any expenses (tape and shipping costs). Please let me know. Thank you. Rosie Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:52:46 -0400 From: "Ronda Snyder" Subject: Fw: Saskatoon postcard Hi fellow JMDL'ers....for anyone who might be heading to Saskatoon in the near future...? JMDL newbie and 30 year joniphile..Thanks!! Ronda Snyder http://home.att.net/~ronda.snyder - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 11:24 AM Subject: Saskatoon postcard > Hello, > I am a postcard collector from Guelph, Ontario. I have a large > collection of postcards (7500) from all over the world but still none > from Saskatoon. I collect postcards with city views, famous buildings, > historic places and landscapes. I would like to ask you for a small > favour to send me one postcard from Saskatoon to help me make my > collection more complete. Please help, it is very important for my > collection. My > address > is; > Janos Bajusz > 702-40 Vanier Drive > Guelph, Ontario > N1G-2X7 > Canada > Hope to hear from you very soon. > Best wishes, > Janos > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 12:53:12 -0400 From: "C.A. Starkey" Subject: Music Business Careers Darn, I really hate the vague world wide web! Does anyone know of a good music careers website? One that lists all the jobs available and the requirements needed to get such job? This is extremely urgent. Carol ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 14:07:00 EDT From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: - River / Travis In a message dated 5/1/00 11:54:39 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Gertus writes: << Travis are a talented Scottish band, very big in the UK right now. They also covered "Urge for Going" very much in the same way - i.e. as an extra track on just one of two editions of a single, I forget which one now. They are clearly big Joni fans. They have just released a new single but, as yet I don't know whether it has any hidden Joni on it. Jacky >> thanks very much jacky. travis seems to be very popular among the rt fans but that list also seems to be more u.k. centered which makes sense now based on what you have said. pat ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 11:14:53 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: Music Business Careers Try velvetrope.com and showbizjobs.com for job listings. As for careers, here's a link that's pretty good "C.A. Starkey" wrote: > Darn, I really hate the vague world wide web! > Does anyone know of a good music careers website? > One that lists all the jobs available and the requirements needed > to get such job? > > This is extremely urgent. > > Carol ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 11:16:32 -0700 From: "Brenda J. Walker" Subject: Re: Music Business Careers Sorry...forgot the link... Try velvetrope.com and showbizjobs.com for job listings. As for careers, here's a link that's pretty good http://www.lamn.com/html/lamn.html "C.A. Starkey" wrote: > Darn, I really hate the vague world wide web! > Does anyone know of a good music careers website? > One that lists all the jobs available and the requirements needed > to get such job? > > This is extremely urgent. > > Carol ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:25:47 -0700 (PDT) From: zapuppy2@webtv.net (Penny) Subject: Re: New "good" music (NJC) <> Agreeing with pat, great post Cassy! Shannon Curfman and Susan Tedeschi are both terrific! But I wonder just how much airplay they get around the country? We're lucky here in that we have a great station (KINK) where we get to hear these up and comers on a regular basis. KINK has been playing Tedeschi for what seems like ages, (personally I was quietly rooting for Susan over Macy Gray for best new artist last year) and they had Curfman playing live for us listeners from the KINK studio many months ago, before the start of her first ever tour. Frankly, I couldn't believe what I was hearing, when they were talking with her about her age. My jaw dropped! Anyway, for you souls who like to have a few more names to consider when you're thinking about adding to your CD collection, here's some more of the lesser known's KINK's been spinning a lot of lately: Nina Storey, Ben Harper, Tai Bachman, Catie Curtis, Lucy Kaplanski, Tab Benoit, Ellen Whyte & Reflex Blue, Curtis Salgado. And one that's becoming more well known and has been mentioned on the JMDL before is Sonia Dada....they're a must see! SD's "Lay Down And Love It Live" is a great disc, imho! Cheers Penny :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Grace dies when it becomes us versus them......Philip Yancey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 15:37:41 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Vickie Sue Vickie Sue Robinson just passed. Here from one of the srticle: In 1975, Vicki Sue signed with RCA to do her first LP, "NEVER GONNA LET YOU GO". She received a GRAMMY nomination for Best Female Vocalist of 1976, for the single "TURN THE BEAT AROUND", nominated along with Linda Ronstatd, Natalie Cole, Emmilou Harris and Joni Mitchell. That year she also won the BILLBOARD award for #1 POP ALBLUM of the Year, New Female Artist Category. That means I guess that Joni was nominated Best Vocalist for Hejira? How interesting. We here mostly honor her writing and playing genius. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:58:33 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: June Tabor Cover David Wright wrote: > Someone should hook Bob up with June Tabor's version of >"Fiddle and the Drum" (on _Abyssinians_ -- a classic >album). I must say, if you were only going to do *one* Joni >cover in your distinguished 25-year career, this wouldn't be >the one I'd pick, but I'm thankful for everything June records >(and Joni writes). Oh no! I actually did come across one copy of this CD the other day but for some reason thought Bob already had it! David - maybe you or someone else could send a copy of it to Bob. I think it needs to be included, especially since it is one of Joni's more obscure songs. I also like Joseph's idea of doing a little background write-up on the cover artists. Kakki NP: Nick Drake - Three Hours ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:45:11 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Music Business Careers Critical Websites For Career Advancement Dear Janice there are several that I know of and here they are: 1) www.castingcouch.com : At this site you basically arrange to be "interviewed" by a high ranking Industry rep with a major recording label.The er, uh, "interview" can take between 3 minutes and two or more hours but can lead to trips abroad with the industry executive himself. There will be indications of all kinds of things that this executive will do for you in the future and a promise to "keep in touch". A weekend in the near future at a remote carribean resort will be potentially offered "to listen to your tapes". 2) www.ripyouroriginaltunesoff.com : At this site you pay them money for the privilege of having them vette your songs. After months of waiting you may or may not hear back from them. You may also hear the song you wrote being sung by some established artist with the lyrics changed slightly. Its a thrill to know you have what it takes but then you need another internet address www.endlesslitigationtonoavail.com. 3) www.knowanindustrylawyer.com : At this site you get a chance to give someone tens of thousands of dollars in retainer fees and wait the customary 12-18 months while your legal representative shops your songs or demos around. Success here is spotty at best as with most sites of this kind (regardless of the advertising or reputation) BUT you will recieve letters occasionally which give you hope and make you think success is just around the corner with an additional 6 months retainer for the valuable time being spent NOT shopping your songs but subsidizing vacations and golf outings of industry executives. 4) www.beborntoapublishersattorney.com : Perhaps the best but most exclusive net address for music careers is this one. Super selective. If you are selected by the man upstairs to enter this website you will be offerred access to the best studios, best producers, millions in advertising and promotion and a date with the industry executive of your choosing as well as trips and guest spots on virtually all the best radio stations and MTV EVEN if you have lousey or zilch product. This seems to be the only website which guarantees a succesful career launch. However be fair warned that after the expensive career launch phase it is a high probability that you will be sent to www.intothediscardbinswithyourcrappyfinalproduct.com. 5) www.sneakintoorgivesexualfavorstogetintoanindustryparty.com : Now this is risky and tricky BUT has been known to work. It involves first finding the location and time of then by hook or crook literally sneaking into a party for industry execs wherby you get to meet them and achieve an email address at www.castingcouch.com. It is recommended that you bring your demo and females are recommended that they allow the executive to obtain the demo with their own hands from the front of your brassiere (you better need one). 6) www.pornomovieproductions.com : More or less a self descriptive website to begin a music career which has worked for many. While this is basically a film oriented site if you successfully gain acceptance at this site virtually all the other sites immediately become available to your access in the music industry. 7) www.slaveawaywithrealtallentbutnoinsiderlawyer.com : Of course you can do it the old fashioned way with real ability but this website requires an immediate 15 to 20 year waiting period during which, if you, with your own money, tons of ability, and a major stroke of luck (or an invitation into one of the other websites) actually are able to sell 150,000 records you will be granted immediate access to www.ripyouroriginaltunesoff.com. 8) www.temporaryofficeworker.com : virtually all other access to the music business is achieved at this web address. There is no hope BUT you get a chance to enter websites 5 & 3 if youve got what it takes....know...what...I...mean. It may comfort you to know that all the other people you meet actually IN the music industry all obtained their positions through one of these websites. Go get'em tiger. marcel deste ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 15:47:55 -0500 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Vickie Sue Actually I think it would be the nomination for HOSL since Hejira wasn't released until November. That would be something if she won for Hejira, wouldn't it? At 3:37 PM -0400 5/1/00, Jerry Notaro wrote: >That means I guess that Joni was nominated Best Vocalist for Hejira? How >interesting. We here mostly honor her writing and playing genius. > >Jerry - -- Mark Domyancich Harpua@revealed.net Tape trading --> homepage.mac.com/mtd/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:57:30 EDT From: AngelinoCoyote@aol.com Subject: Re: Flo and Eddy, Hillary, who chose? In a message dated 4/30/00 12:54:23 PM Pacific Daylight Time, CarltonCT@aol.com writes: Clark Wrote: << a parody of Joni Mitchell done by Flo and Eddy (sp?). Does anyone remember these guys? They were kind of the Weird Al Yankovich (sp?) of the early Seventies and did parodies of other bands and singers. >> Coyote Responds: OMG...Flo and Eddy? Yes, I do remember them and have a record of theirs somewhere in the vault. Didn't they have some popular top 40 hit(ish) that probably made me buy the album? Can't recall. No regrets, Coyote Casa Alegre Hollywood, California I'll be dancin' on a pony keg. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 17:18:12 EDT From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: June Tabor Cover In a message dated 05/01/2000 4:09:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, KakkiB@worldnet.att.net writes: << I also like Joseph's idea of doing a little background write-up on the cover artists. > Adrienne Barbeau needs an introduction??????? ;-D Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 14:40:50 -0700 (PDT) From: leslie@torchsongs.com Subject: Tour Photographers - LONG Hello: Thanks to Jim I will be taking photographs at Joni's Bay Area (Chronicle Pavilion) show. Jim still needs two more photographers for the tour; he asked me to post this message: Hi to all you JMDL folks from JoniMitchell.com! I know you're all as excited about the upcoming BSN tour as I am -- it's going to be quite a show. I'm writing because I need experienced photographers for the Philly and Atlanta shows (I've got people lined up for the other dates already). Time is of the essence. I have to get a list of photographers in to management immediately! I'll get you a photo pass so you can go right up to the edge of the stage for probably the first three songs and snap away. You’ll probably need to use very fast film because of the low light levels; when I took pictures during the tour with Dylan, photos shot with 800-speed film came out too dark and I had to switch to grainier (but still acceptable) 1600-speed film to get shots that were bright enough. An extra long lens is always a plus so you can zoom in, but there’s a drawback to zooming -- the tiniest shake of the camera can easily be “amplified” in those cases, resulting in a blurry picture. Then again, you may already know all about the ins and outs of concert photography, in which case the best thing you could do would be to just ignore everything I’m saying here! Some people are also using digital cameras (which of course will help a lot as far as getting the pictures to me in a timely manner goes). As you probably know, one of the aims on JoniMitchell.com has always been getting the word out to the world quickly, so I’m hoping everyone can do a quick turnaround and get their pictures back to me as soon as they can (if the pictures don't go up until two weeks after the concert, it's just not as much fun and I get lots of nasty email)! I’ll get everything up on the site as fast as I can put the pages together. It’s going to be essentially the same thing that went up the last time, a story by the official JoniMitchell.com reporter, followed by other reports from anybody who wants to send one in. If you want to refresh your memory, you can see what was done in ‘98 by clicking on “Tour Info” in the left hand window of the site’s screen and following any of the links for the ‘98 concerts, or you can just pull up the tour page by itself for 1998 at Joni Mitchell: Tour Info (if the link doesn't work, that's http://www.jonimitchell.com/TourHome.html#1998). If you'd like to do this, please send me an email at JoniMessages@aol.com right away! I need to send a list of names over to management by Wednesday. Let me know if you'd also like to write the report as official JoniMitchell.com reporter too. If not, that’s OK -- the reporter isn’t something that requires a pass from management, so I have a little more “wiggle time” to pull it together. Last time around, management supplied one pass for each show (most everyone also had a ticket) and that person did the photos and the reporting. But that's a lot of work, and I'd like to give more people the chance to participate anyway. Right now I’m working primarily on who’s doing the photography so I can get the list in to management, but I need Fabulous Writers as well as Fabulous Photographers for some shows; I'll be filling out the reporters roster next week. Many thanks… Leslie Mixon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:54:08 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Hillary standing by her man NJC > > mags responds: > > The thing is Colin, many women are subject to a > standard of female socialization which embraces a > "stand by your man no matter what" philosophy. Despite > the feminist politic they may or may not be > representing , it is very common for some women to do > just that, no matter how badly they are treated. Many > women are conditioned to hang in there just one more > hour, one more day cuz baby he might just change...if > and only IF the woman tries to do/be something > different/better. Many women are also socialized to > believe that they are nothing without a man period. > It is a complicated issue, which Im sure you are well > aware. Thanks for the thought provoking response. > > mags Hi mags-yes I am very aware. As a child of an abusive family, I know very well the frame of mind one develops. Years into adulthood the same mind set was there-allowing me to have abusive friendships, boyfriends etc. You could puch me and I would apologise. For many, far too many, years I believed I was abd boy and that if I had been good I would not have sexually assaulted or had my head bashed into walls etc. I was in my late 30's before I knew I wasn't a bad boy. Oh, and I kept going home!Again and again and again-trying to get it right. Finally I stopped going home but didn't undertand. I stopped because I knew I was never going to please them and avoid the violence. I stayed away eventually becasue i knew then I was not bad and that were sick as they come. In the end, we have to take responsibilty for ourselves no matter what our conditioning. At a fairly young age(17 or so) I did look for answers to my misery. The fact i was looking in the wrong place was unfortunate. By that I mean, i was looking to fix me-to make myself good so my family would love and accept me. Others encouraged me in this view-the church, other parents and adults-all of whome found it easier to think i needed fixing that to accept that parents would do this sort of thing to their children. Abuse of men, women and children does NOT happen in isolation. Society at large and those in the immediate vicinty-church, schools, doctors, neighbours etc all conspire to enable it. I am well aware of 'battered wives' syndrome. Children have it too and so do men. > > -- > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > _~O > / /\_, > ___/\ > /_ > ----------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #225 ***************************** ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?