From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V2000 #77 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Sunday, February 6 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 077 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- refresh my memory (Wally) ["Alan Lorimer" ] NJC: Racism, etc. [Kate Tarasenko ] refresh my memory (Wally) take 2 ["Alan Lorimer" ] Magnolias for Wally [Julie Webb ] Re: Why many of us are here [catman ] Re: More on political correctness (NJC) [catman ] Interview with Robert Hilburn, LA Times [Deb Messling ] Re: Alternate Blue ["Raffaele Malanga" ] Re: Punk (NJC) [Emily Kirk Gray ] Wally ["micks.mail" ] little green reunion [Walter R Rodgers III ] Re: icky business ["Matthew Hall" ] Re: BSN [Jerry Notaro ] Re: BSN Shipping Now [Brian Gross ] Re: Punk (NJC) [TerryM2442@aol.com] Re: BSN [TerryM2442@aol.com] Re: BSN [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: Punk (NJC) [SCJoniGuy@aol.com] Re: BSN [CaTGirl627@aol.com] Re: BSN [SMEBD@aol.com] Re: Punk (NJC) [catman ] Wally. [john low ] Wally RIP [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: NJC: Racism, etc. [Jason Maloney ] Re: NJC: Racism, etc. [Kate Tarasenko ] Goodbye Wally [Winfried Huehn ] Re: Punk (NJC) [michael w yarbrough ] Re: Joni in Entertainment Weekly Magazine NJC ["Eric Taylor" ] Wally [Bounced Message ] Re: Wally [Bounced Message ] Re: PWWAM viewing (SJC) [Maggie McNally ] music to lift the soul (NJC) [Maggie McNally ] Wally [Evan + Vanessa Thomson ] RE: Goodbye Wally who said goodbye laura nyro ["patrick leader" ] [none] [Walter R Rodgers III ] Re: Punk (NJC) [Randy Remote ] FW: Passing of Wally Breese ["Happy The Man" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 19:29:01 +1100 From: "Alan Lorimer" Subject: refresh my memory (Wally) Neil said: >I've been reading the Wally comments on the digest and noting the impact >he's had on so many people. What I haven't noticed (and what I've only >thought of this afternoon) is any mention of perhaps the most significant >part Wally played in the life of Joni: her reunion with "Little Green." >Have I screwed up the details in my mind or wasn't the website instrumental >in that "mother and child reunion"? Be happy to refresh your memory Neil :-) The web site *was* instrumental in reuniting Joni with her daughter, Kilaureen Gib. I'm sure Joni's love of Wally was due to the Joy that this brought to her life. There are some excellent articles on the Web sites covering this event :-) Alan Lorimer Hawley Beach Tasmania ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 01:38:58 +0000 From: Kate Tarasenko Subject: NJC: Racism, etc. Jason -- I started really reading the recent posts about PC-ness and racism and other related topics because my interest in the whole thread became intensified after I witnessed what I consider was a racially-motivated incident. It happened a couple of days ago at my local post office. It wasn't physically violent, but it was racist just the same. I'm also very concerned right now about our Austrian neighbors and the fascist who has just assumed an important policy-making post in that country -- I have them in my thoughts. Anyway, I don't want to encourage any defensiveness by taking your following remarks as a single quotation to comment upon, but some statements really CAN stand alone, and I think this one represents a crucial point about racism. (And I'm completely leaving out Don Henley and his remarks -- my input here is in a very general sense. As well, I agree with those who said that the whole PC issue is more or less a diversion, a political abstraction. There are more urgent issues at stake.) You wrote: "Too often in society, people are castigated for being supposedly racist when their actions or words are interpreted by the other party as being so." If by "other party" you are referring to the "injured" party, then I think that if you're on the receiving-end of behavior that you deem racist (even if it's only because it FEELS racist/bigoted/prejudiced), then it's racist. It doesn't need a witness, or some "impartial" third party for it to be classified as real and genuine. You go on to say: "...the person who feels they have been racially abused will be believed and given credibility over the other." And I believe that's as it should be. (This is assuming, of course, that the receiving party isn't PRETENDING, out of some hidden agenda, to be injured by the remark/act.) I can't think of a single instance why a person being treated or mistreated in a particular way that they find offensive should have his/her perceptions over-ruled or out-voted by the offending party, whether that person's acts or words were made by sheer mistake, accidental clumsiness, or malicious intent. If you (the generic "you") had meant differently than what you accomplished or expressed, then it's YOUR mistake, not the receiving party's. If it causes offense, it's worth re-examining by the responsible party. And if amends are required, amends should be made. There is perhaps a fine line between BEING a racist and committing a racist act (or making a racist remark) -- but on second thought, I don't think so. How MUCH of a racist? Is humanity measured in degrees? Maybe... The incident I personally witnessed the other day moved me to write a rather impassioned letter of complaint to my local postmaster (a postal employee was involved), and that's really as far as I can take it -- I wish I could do more in this instance. But I can't express how obligated I feel to have done what little I did. FWIW, Kate in CO P.S.: You also said to Catman: "...your view of racism appears far more cut and dried. If only it was like that. I have seen too much to suggest otherwise." We are all citizens of the world with our own world views. What you see is on your particular route. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 19:35:34 +1100 From: "Alan Lorimer" Subject: refresh my memory (Wally) take 2 Memory good, spelling bad, It's Kilauren Gibb. See the reunion page on the JMDL site Alan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 18:55:56 -0500 From: Julie Webb Subject: Magnolias for Wally I chose this song , "Wise Up" by Aimee Mann for Wally, not because the lyrics apply to him, but because the mood of the song is very sad. It's a reminder that----sometimes we grow--- through suffering. juliezwebb "Wise Up" It's not what you thought When you first began it You got what you want Now you can hardly stand it though By now you know it's not Going to stop It's not going to stop t's not going to stop Til you give up You're sure there's a cure And you have finally found it You think one more will shrink you 'til you're underground and living down But it's not going to stop It's not going to stop It's not going to stop 'Til you wise up Prepare a list of what you need Before you sign away the deed Couse it's not going to stop It's not going to stop Til you wise up No it's not going to stop Til you wise up Now it's not going to stop So just give up ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 10:04:59 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Why many of us are here diana wrote: > At 12:38 PM 2/4/2000 +0000, catman wrote: > >Listening to TTT. Tiger Bones is on. John says 'This is good. Glad she > >didn't spoil it by singing'!!! > >John gets no dinner. > > This is the reason why I found Wally's site the first day I hooked my new > computer up to the internet. This was back in the fall of '96. So many of > us have family that doesn't share our love of Joni's talent. We had no one > to share our JOY with. Just so. Until I joined the list, I knew no other Joni fans. > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 10:05:40 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: More on political correctness (NJC) > > > Yes...I am almost too wary of causing offence and creating ill-feeling, that I pre-empt it by > trying to figure what the other person is going to think, before they tell me themselves! I just > put two and two together and came up with five. No malice or manipulation intended. I know no malic is intended. I really understand the above lines too!Reminds me very strongly of someone I have come to know really well. > > > > > > > > . > > > > > > > , should be entirely in the hands of the > *victim*, regardless? I am not into vigilantiism, no. > > > > > Nor do I. None of those instances suggest extremism to me. Extremism IMHO suggests a lack of > objectivity in either promoting or campaigning for a cause, and a self-centredness. It is more > about sections of groups than the groups or causes themselves. Their particular cause MUST be > championed at all costs, and with little regard for other causes. So, it is possible for ANY group > or cause to have "extremist factions" within it. Minority or otherwise. The term means exactly > what it says...factions that are extreme. Okay, so you still need to explain what you mean by extreme and by factions. You just repeated your previous statement, just in a different way. So I still don't know what you mean.bw colin "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 06:15:28 EST From: JRMCo1@aol.com Subject: Sad Day Dear lovely death That taketh all things underwing- Never to kill- Only to change Into some other thing This suffering flesh, To make it either more or less, But not again the same. Dear lovely Death, Change is thy other name. - -Langston Hughes Goodbye dear Wally. You are loved now at rest just as you were in life. - -Julius ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 07:09:03 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: BSN review in 2/6 LA Times Joni's Standard Approach to Singing ** 1/2 JONI MITCHELL, "Both Sides Now," Reprise By ELYSA GARDNER Seminal singer-songwriter Mitchell joins a growing list of established pop musicians who are trying to revive interest in the dying art of interpretive singing. Working with members of the London Symphony Orchestra and with longtime collaborator Larry Klein, who serves as co-producer and musical director, Mitchell covers classics such as "At Last," "Stormy Weather" and "I Wish I Were in Love Again." Predictably, her selections on "Both Sides Now" (a limited special edition is due in stores Tuesday) show great taste, as do the warm, elegant arrangements. Her vocals, which have deepened and grown seductively dusky with age, avoid the stiff reverence many contemporary singers adopt when approaching standards. Granted, her renditions of tunes previously recorded by such giants as Ella Fitzgerald and Nat King Cole won't make anyone forget the earlier versions, just as Mitchell's updating of two of her own songs, "Both Sides Now" and "A Case of You," hardly improve on the originals. Still, Mitchell's mix of playfulness and understated pathos hits just the right note. Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ I love cats. They give the home a heartbeat. - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 07:17:25 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: Interview with Robert Hilburn, LA Times All She Needs Is Love Songs The singer-songwriter, tired of pop's current state, turns to an album of standards. By ROBERT HILBURN Joni Mitchell's latest album is a career vacation of sorts for one of the most acclaimed singer-songwriters of the modern pop era--not that the album is in any way a casual affair. Discouraged by the state of society and the reality of the conglomerate-dominated music business these days, Mitchell wanted to step back and do something that totally enchanted her. The result is "Both Sides Now," a collection of standards woven together ambitiously to reflect on the early glow and final ashes of relationships. The album--featuring such vintage tunes as "Stormy Weather" as well as two of her own songs--was recorded with the London Symphony Orchestra. The arrangements, by Vince Mendoza, evoke in places the signature sounds of such jazz masters as Duke Ellington and Gil Evans. Regular copies of the album won't be released until March 21, but special editions, featuring elaborate packaging and lithographs of Mitchell paintings, go on sale Tuesday. Some listeners may lament the absence of more Mitchell material (see review, Page 66), but Mitchell herself is so pleased with working with the orchestra that she is now planning to record an entire album of her own old songs this way. * * * In an interview, Mitchell, 56, spoke about the album, the music business and her own latest relationship. Question: Why didn't you want to do an album of new Joni Mitchell songs? Answer: Because my music is drawn from my [feelings] and I just didn't want to be a social commentator at this time. I feel these are difficult times and we all need to develop some type of . . . discipline or soul nourishment or strength to deal with all the problems facing the world, problems that are coming to a head in every department. Even I wouldn't want to hear an album of that stuff right now. I just feel my point of view is too realistic and reality is too bleak. Q: What about the state of pop music these days? A: I think it is in a horrible state. I don't even think of it as music anymore, but just the "ic" business. It's "icky" because the "muse" has gone out of it. The divinity that it once contained is gone. Q: Why? A: Part of it is the capitalistic feeding frenzy. Music today is viewed [by corporations] as simply a [sales line] that is either going up or down. . . . It's just a graph for shareholders. We don't even know who is at the top anymore of all these corporations. There used to be the chairman, who was as high up in a company as you could go, but now the chairman is just a piss-ant in the larger corporation. The other thing I notice is music is being made by committees. I received a lifetime achievement award recently from Sony and they played the year's big songs. They were horrible, one after the other. . . . Drivel, commercial crap. And when people got up to receive the awards, you could see why: There were four to eight people getting up, and sometimes there was a businessman among them. A committee cannot make a work of art. Art is created by one person or two people working in unity. Q: So how did you get enthusiasm to make the new record? A: I decided to do it after singing "Stormy Weather" at the Don Henley benefit in Los Angeles in 1998. It was liberating just to sing someone else's music. Plus, I wanted to make an album that represented a romantic journey with [musical ideas] culled from some of the most creative music of the 20th century. Q: What about the romantic journey? A: It's the one we've all been on. First, you are smitten, which is the first song, "You're My Thrill," which was a Billie Holiday recording. Then you go through facets of pleading and making concessions along the way, then the romantic love goes away and the album ends with "Both Sides Now," which says you don't know love at all. Q: The album brings us to the debate over songwriting traditions . . . the pre-World War II tradition and the more introspective and complex tradition that you and Bob Dylan helped create. How do you rate those traditions? A: It's interesting, because "Both Sides Now," which was one of the first songs I wrote, clearly has one foot in each camp . . . old songwriting and new songwriting. The old songs were very symbolic. They used the weather a lot because they were coming out of an agrarian culture. There was a tremendous amount of references to the sky to denote emotion . . . "You Are My Sunshine," "Stormy Weather." But there was very little of the intimate soul-scraping of [the new tradition]. Q: So how did you go about finding your place in all that? A: With Dylan's words, you could have nice chord changes, but you couldn't be very musical. What I wanted to do was keep the melodic invention and bring the two together, . . . the musicality of the old school, but create a greater realism. . . . A less symbolic art and a more illuminating art. Q: Let's go back to the album's theme. What have you learned about romantic love over the years? A: Romantic love is a trick of nature, fueled by anxiety and insecurity. The moment the thing is secured it dissipates. It's a trick of nature to get us to procreate. There are other kinds of love, however, that are more stable. Romantic love goes out. The Sinatra song ["I Wish I Were in Love Again"] deals with it well. . . . "The quick toboggan when you reach the heights." . . . It's all downhill. But you end up saying, "Oh, I want another hit of it." It's kind of like drug addiction. Q: So how about yourself--are you optimistic about lasting relationships? Are you in a relationship? A: I have a very good relationship with a man from my hometown. He still lives there. We get together and travel. We are old enough where we are comfortable with a long-distance romance. In our youth, I don't think we could have done it. It's a growing, flowering relationship of nearly seven years. Plus, I have really good friends who I love. I have cats I love. I have a daughter I love. I have grandchildren I love. These are all different kinds of love, but lasting love. Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ I love cats. They give the home a heartbeat. - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 04:29:06 -0800 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Wally... can't think of anything clever or pretty to say... feel like my plugs been pulled. adios and farewell pat np: here's to you, ramblin' boy Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 04:29:31 PST From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Re: Alternate Blue Sorry if this has been already answered. As far as I know (thanks to Bob Muller) Alternate Blue is made of: Carey Little Green A case of you Hunter the Good Samaritan Blue California My Old Man Urge for Going This Flight Tonight River Apart from Hunter and Urge for Going, all the songs should be exactly the same as in the official Blue. Raffaele in London ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 10:46:40 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Kirk Gray Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) bob, definitely, definitely on the bands you listed, especially: the clash's "combat rock" -- how great is it to blare a song like "know your rights": "THIS IS A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT....WITH GUITAR!!!!!!!" and anything elvis costello: recently i've been listening to his "crooner" stuff, like the country album "almost blue" and that record he did with burt bacharach (sp?), but nothing can beat early angry elvis: "don't tell me you don't know the difference between a lover and a fighter with my pen and my electric typewriter even in a perfect world where everyone is equal i'd still own the film rights and be working on the sequel" and, bob, i haven't listened to XTC yet, although i've noted how much you dig them -- but the name of the group reminds me of one of my all-time favorite punk bands, X...anyone else like them? i wonder what exene is doing these days -- i saw her name on a spoken-word poetry event flyer once last year -- hmmm. - -- emily NP: "the gallery," joni ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 15:54:24 +0000 From: "micks.mail" Subject: Wally Oh Wally! So it has to be plain text eh? Thank you Wally for the website and thank you too for getting me onto this list. I know you're still close by so I MUST send you this > I know - no one's going to show me everything > But you showed me such a lot. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 11:39:41 -0500 From: Walter R Rodgers III Subject: little green reunion Neil; I'm pretty sure that all the details are at the JMHP (thanks Wally). I recall that Joni's daughter was led to the JMHP by a friend, where she pretty much firmed up her suspicions that Joni was her Mom. A few phone calls and meetings later and Little Green had her happy ending, I hope. Walter ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 17:17:36 -0000 From: "Matthew Hall" Subject: Re: icky business hmmm, i fear I'm going to get my throat cut for this, but I get kind of indignant when Joni refers to all of today's music as 'commercial drivel'. I realise that the quote was aimed at the 'big songs' of the year, but I do think it's unfair to tar everybody with the same brush. I agree with her that much of today's music is driven by sales potential and shaped according to the little boxes that are American and British radio, but what about the true artists? Yes, they are a part of the industry; Joni is part of the industry, and any industry centres itself on profit making, but that is left to the marketing men. Joni does what the fuck she wants, and so do many other artists (I'm not going to mention any names otherwise you'll just think I'm championing their cause), and they still sell, but if someone wants to write a hit record then I don't think it should be looked down on. I'll use Madonna as an example, yes, she's made some duds in her time, but consistently she creates hit records without any real compromise. I find the 'Ray of Light' and 'Like A Prayer' albums to be two of the most enlightening I've heard both lyrically and musically, and they both sold upwards of 12 million. Okay, I mentioned a name, but that was an example. I would hate it if every musician was like Joni. I am not trying to undermine her; she is the real deal and I do agree with her - there is much too much commercial crap flying around, but there is a lot of great stuff too. Much of it is bubbling under, hasn't it always been that way? Matthew > Q: What about the state of pop music these days? > > A: I think it is in a horrible state. I don't even think of it as music > anymore, but just the "ic" business. It's "icky" because the "muse" has > gone out of it. The divinity that it once contained is gone. > > Q: Why? > > A: Part of it is the capitalistic feeding frenzy. Music today is viewed [by > corporations] > as simply a [sales line] that is either going up or down. . . . It's just a > graph for > shareholders. We don't even know who is at the top anymore of all these > corporations. There used to be the chairman, who was as high up in a > company as you could go, but now the chairman is just a piss-ant in the > larger corporation. The other thing I notice is music is being made by > committees. I received a lifetime achievement award recently from Sony and > they played the year's big songs. They were horrible, one after the other. > . . . Drivel, commercial crap. And when people got up to receive the > awards, you could see why: There were four to eight people getting up, and > sometimes there was a businessman among them. A committee cannot make a > work of art. Art is created by one person or two people working in unity. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 13:29:32 -0500 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: BSN My close friend and Joni addict called me yesterday to tell me that BSN was already in our local record store. Jeesh, you would think those of us who ordered direct from Reprise would have had it by now. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:32:51 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: BSN Shipping Now - --- Mary Grace shared with us from the inside, earlier this week: > The backorder [in answer to Penny's question] doesn't mean that she's sold out, it simply means that they are waiting for the official street date of 02/08/00. At Valley, our stock on hand is about 2,500 pieces. > When Joni CDs come out, I always get the promotional stuff from our Marketing Department. What I find very disconcerting is that as of this Monday, we do not have any Joni promos for the BSN limited edition. > I find it interesting that Joni has so much artistic control over the entire package from the concept to the music to the packaging and what appears to be nada over the marketing strategy. > My company is the main supplier to places like CDNow, Amazon.com and various Indie record stores. They get their Joni from us as well as marketing incentives and promotional items. So far, we have not hawked it in our weekly "streetdate" beyond mention of its upcoming release. No posters, no advertising budget. Nothing. Boggles my mind. How can Warner/Reprise expect this new project, BSN, to do anything, beyond the 600 or so of us, without any marketing support?? I get the distinct (and bad) feeling like they're just trying to placate her, while appearing to promote her by just allowing her to do this project. Seems pretty damned two-faced of them, IMHO Anybody have any suggestions as to how we let the powers at Warner/Reprise know how we feel? Does anyone else even feel this way? Brian, just in a real pissy mood today. ===== "No paper thin walls, no folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:38:35 EST From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) In a message dated 2/6/2000 10:49:15 AM Eastern Standard Time, ekg200@is5.nyu.edu writes: << and, bob, i haven't listened to XTC yet, although i've noted how much you dig them -- but the name of the group reminds me of one of my all-time favorite punk bands, X...anyone else like them? >> Emily, I bought XTC's Apple Venus after hearing Bob rave about them and still can't get those melodies out of my head. I'm ordering some of their other CD's now. Go for it, you won't be disappointed. Terry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:41:28 EST From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: BSN In a message dated 2/6/2000 12:27:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, notaro@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu writes: << Jeesh, you would think those of us who ordered direct from Reprise would have had it by now. >> I ordered through Tower and haven't heard a thing. Anyone else? Terry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:58:20 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: BSN In a message dated 2/6/00 12:44:37 PM US Central Standard Time, TerryM2442@aol.com writes: << I ordered through Tower and haven't heard a thing. Anyone else? >> I ordered through CD Now and no news from them... But it's supposed to be in the stores this Tuesday, so I plan on checking it out. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:05:11 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) In a message dated 2/6/00 9:49:27 AM US Central Standard Time, ekg200@is5.nyu.edu writes: << and, bob, i haven't listened to XTC yet, although i've noted how much you dig them -- but the name of the group reminds me of one of my all-time favorite punk bands, X...anyone else like them? >> X definitely marks the spot, Emily! "Under the Big Black Sun" is probably in my top ten of all time. John Doe and Exene's harmonies are so unique, and their songs run the gamut of emotion from laugh out loud funny to heartwrenching. Billy Zoom's guitar was always just right too..."Wild Gift" is exactly that, I remember listening to it with headphones on in case my folks wandered into the room at the wrong lyrical moment, which they always seemed to do... Bob NP: Roxy Music, "More Than This" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:29:06 EST From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: BSN In a message dated 2/6/2000 3:01:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, SCJoniGuy@aol.com writes: << I ordered through CD Now and no news from them... But it's supposed to be in the stores this Tuesday, so I plan on checking it out. >> I got mine from Barnes and Noble and got it on Friday..did anyone else get theirs yet or am I the only one? Catgirl np-cost of freedom- Four Track Mind (eric's first band from 1990) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:43:39 EST From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: Re: BSN In a message dated 02/06/2000 3:33:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, CaTGirl627@aol.com writes: << I got mine from Barnes and Noble and got it on Friday..did anyone else get theirs yet or am I the only one? >> I ordered thru the Reprise site and have not seen anything. I've also checked a couple of stores in NYC (Tower Records and a small, independent store) and they haven't had them out. The guy at the independent store knows me and my love for Joni and said that he tried to get it early as a surprise for me and he was unable. Guess I'll wait until Tuesday (or maybe I'll get lucky and get it tomorrow)! BTW, CaTGirl--what did you think? Stephen Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 22:16:16 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) > > > > I bought XTC's is this the british band that Polly Styrene used to sing with? way back when...(70's?)(she dropped out and joined the hari krishnas) > Apple Venus after hearing Bob rave about them and still can't > get those melodies out of my head. I'm ordering some of their other CD's now. > Go for it, you won't be disappointed. > > Terry - -- To change the world-change your self "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2000 08:19:21 +1000 From: john low Subject: Wally. It was really hot (40 degrees) on Saturday when I turned on my computer and read the terribly sad news about Wally's death. When I finished reading my mail I withdrew to a cooler part of the house and played some Joni Mitchell in his memory. I chose "Ladies of the Canyon" - I don't know why, it just seemed to choose itself and I went with my intuition. I hope it was an album he liked. Much has already been said by others on the jmdl but I would still like to make my public acknowledgement and farewell to a man I never met but whose passionate love for and promotion of Joni Mitchell's work has touched my life here on the other side of the world. John (in Sydney). __________________________________________________________________ Get your free Australian email account at http://start.com.au ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 18:12:41 EST From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Wally RIP I've just been listening to this, it gives me hope and I think it's lovely. if I could I would show you tomorrow so that the word trust would never fail us or the star it fell from so our journey begins turning on a piece of string I'd love to spin it forever this river that flows through you takes me too I'm truly honoured that you love me and I love giving it back to you but I'm not as wide as the earth nor the earth as the universe and so our journey begins... "This River" by Pooka Farewell to someone I'd never met A friend I'd not made yet There's now a Wally-shaped hole in the world Azeem ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 22:20:57 +0000 From: Jason Maloney Subject: Re: NJC: Racism, etc. Hello Kate, I don't take any offence at your post, or feel that it is a criticism on anything I said, but I honestly can't say I agree with you. That's okay. It doesn't mean I think you are *wrong*. I respect the views of others, and you wrote with heartfelt eloquence. The point you brought up over the *validity* or *reality* of the injured party's feeling of being on the receiving end of racism regardless of context is something I have already discussed with Colin yesterday. I agreed with that view up to a point. You also say you believe that the receiving party should be given the most credibility, which I would also agree with up to a point. The only reason that would put it in question is the very same one you yourself mention in brackets after your statement. So, again we have common ground. It does appear, though, that experience first-hand of any form of racism seems to create a differemce of opinion for many of us. As I have already said, I am not actually in disagreement with a lot of what's being said in principle. However, I cannot ignore what I have seen and experienced myself, which showed the other side of racism, and one that is all too often overlooked. That is not to discredit the validity or devalue the evil of the racism which most of us are talking about. Both sides have to be acknowleged, otherwise the whole issue is rendered unbalanced. Thanks for your input, Best wishes, Jason. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 16:57:36 +0000 From: Kate Tarasenko Subject: Re: NJC: Racism, etc. Thanks for your response, Jason. I do wish you could elaborate on this statement, which you have repeated previously without much detail, and where you and I (and Colin?) seem to diverge in consensus: "However, I cannot ignore what I have seen and experienced myself, which showed the other side of racism, and one that is all too often overlooked." I don't know what this means. (And I don't think you're talking about folks who pretend to be wounded and "play the race card," because you've addressed that in different parts of your posts.) What is this "other side of racism" which is "all too often overlooked"? Can you talk about your experience or one that you've witnessed? Kate in CO ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 01:04:05 +0100 From: Winfried Huehn Subject: Goodbye Wally A couple of months ago I discovered this goodbye-statement of Wally's on the Laura Nyro website (http://www.lauranyro.net): He wrote there: > Then "And When I Die" came on... Oh Goddess! The slow part of the song stopped me in my tracks as I > listened, and felt it, and heard the words that have such a different meaning today. It just broke me up. I'm so sad that she didn't > get the recognition she deserved from the fickle record buying public. I'm more than just sad that there'll never be another new > record from her. > > [SNIP] > > I love you, Laura. Your music has been a part of my life for 30 years and it will remain with me as long as I live. Thank you for > being here on Earth at the same time as me. I never met you in person, but I'll miss you forever. > > Wally Breese > This statement has fascinated me ever since, as I suppose Wally was quite aware of his own disease when he wrote these lines. So many similarities and deeper meanings here! So much strength and conscious optimism speaking out of this "Word from Wally" and all the other ones. Dear Wally, every single visitor of www.jonimitchell.com has added and will continue to add to the recognition you deserve for bringing joni-fans from all parts of the world together. You will be remembered and missed by a lot of people who never met you in person, but to whom you reached out and who you made an impact on. "vita brevis, ars longa" Winfried in Germany ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 18:13:14 -0600 (CST) From: michael w yarbrough Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) Colin, I think you're thinking of the X-Ray Spex, one of a few great girl-bands from that period (including the Raincoats and the Slits). Lots of cross-pollination in that scene, with many bands sharing members, lovers, safety-pins, you name it... Some great, creative stuff, though. You don't really hear great do-it-yourself technically unpolished music anymore, with the exception of some underground hip-hop. - --Michael - ----------------------------------------------------------------- "If I owned Texas and hell, I'd rent out Texas and live in hell." - --Gen. P.H. Sheridan On Sun, 6 Feb 2000, catman wrote: > > > > > > > > I bought XTC's > > is this the british band that Polly Styrene used to sing with? way back > when...(70's?)(she dropped out and joined the hari krishnas) > > > Apple Venus after hearing Bob rave about them and still can't > > get those melodies out of my head. I'm ordering some of their other CD's now. > > Go for it, you won't be disappointed. > > > > Terry > > > > -- > To change the world-change your self > "It is better to be hated for what you are > than to be loved for what you are not." > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 18:33:50 -0800 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: Joni in Entertainment Weekly Magazine NJC Quoting Entertainment Weekly << Mitchell's art is about her writer's voice more than her intreperter's voice >> Catman writes: << This is exactly what I was trying to say when I was saying that Joni 's singing is not what i call singing. >> Then, pray tell, exactly WHAT do you call the sound that comes out of Ms Mitchell's mouth?! You are certainly entitled to your oft stated opinion that Joni can no longer sing, Catman, but I think this is due to a lack of appreciation for her warmer, more intimate vocal style on recent albums. I personally prefer the quality of her voice on NRH, TI & PWWAM than in earlier works. To each his own. E.T. __________________________________________ NetZero - Defenders of the Free World Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:34:28 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Wally Breese Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 13:05:16 -0800 (PST) From: Lori Fye As his surname suggests, Wally Breese arrived on the winds with his passion for Joni and his talent for bringing her music and art to so many ... to me, just when I needed it most. Thank you, Wally, for everything. Farewell, sweet man. Wishing I could've known you better, Lori in DC ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:37:23 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Wally From: "Hobbs, Rick - TP2RDH" Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:31:43 -0800 I have been trying to think of something I could add about the loss of my dear cyber friend. My words would be twisted and add little to what has been said. And today was the day I was going to introduce myself to the nice folks on the list and tell my "Joni Story." Maybe tomorrow, when I feel better. Does anyone know if the sad news has been related to Joni? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:36:41 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Re: Wally From: "Claudia SanSoucie" Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:53:28 -0500 As always I am behind with my digests. However, I still want to reach out with a few lines. When I lost a family friend years ago I felt there was so little I could say - so I internalized my thoughts and wrote these words to comfort me. Once again I reflect on death under a snowfilled sky - Wally... peace...you're in my thoughts. Letting you go a river runs dry a silent stone time passes by a sky filled with sorrow carrying snow the wind of the lonely has started to blow Letting you go the turning of hands the blood of a rose unfolding a gem a precious moment returns to the ground the wind of the lonely has gathered around Letting you go the surface can't bare but waiting below roots that will care nothing is lost just rearranged the wind of the lonely is part of the change ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 19:55:18 -0500 From: Maggie McNally Subject: Re: PWWAM viewing (SJC) Hi all, I sent this post to Emily, but my intentions had been to also send it to the list. So...here it is: I'm responding to two parts of your post. First part -- NJC stuff. I am a Joni-content-only subscriber only due to time limitations. In fact I also subscribe to the digest so that when time permits I can check out the non-Joni threads. But, I agree with Colin...ANY Joni content is worthy of my time, even if it is only a glance and delete! I just prefer that those threads about, say, the merits of Carly Simon (sorry Colin, couldn't resist ;-D) not tempt me on a regular basis. As for the Larry Klein bit, I'm shocked!! Personally, I think he is a sensuous musician (I'll leave the "in-depth analysis" to some of our more eloquent members) and his obvious devotion to Joni and her music has earned him a special place in my heart. It even has allowed me to forgive his transgressions in those DED years! Different strokes for different folks. Now, I suppose I should label this NJC, but to me, Larry Klein IS JC. At 05:52 PM 2/5/00 -0500, you wrote: > >hi everyone >i'm so stressed about how to quantify my joni-content >these days...nervous that referring to a joni-related >item without large doses of in-depth analysis of her >music will piss off lots of people! but i digress... > >but his only real disparaging comment was towards larry klein! >out of nowhere, my friend says, "who the hell is that >chump?" gesturing towards larry, and i explained, getting >irked but also giggling. my friend said "why is he playing >bass like he has to make up for the fact that he's not >jaco?" and i disagreed and tried to argue. but there >was no arguing and my friend was relentless in poking fun >at larry the whole time we watched the video. > >and you know what? now I'VE caught the bug and i DO find >larry's oh-so-into-it facial expressions and such kind >of annoying. or i did last night, i should say. > >isn't that annoying? i'm annoyed that he's gotten me annoyed >about larry! > >-- emily > >NP: "The Truth," by The Artist Formerly... > > > Maggie McNally ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 20:14:52 -0500 From: Maggie McNally Subject: music to lift the soul (NJC) Hi all, I just came from a performance by the Boy's Choir of Harlem at Symphony Hall (Boston). If you get the chance to see/hear/experience them -- do! They were all over the musical place with their program. At times I laughed -- especially at the site and sound of them doing hip-hop at Symphony Hall with all the proper gents and ladies of a typical Celebrity Series audience. But when they were in their "praise" phase I cried for Wally as they sang Amazing Grace. It lifted me up to the heavens above as their voices soared...how sweet, indeed. Maggie Maggie McNally ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 12:51:07 +1100 From: Evan + Vanessa Thomson Subject: Wally I've been off line for a couple of days now and cried when I read about Wally's passing. I just wanted to express my condolences to Jim, Leslie, Wally's family and friends. Those of you who met and knew Wally were blessed and although I never met Wally, being a part of this community has bought me great joy. I just wanted to thank all those who've touched my life and I thank Wally with all my heart for this community of people. I really am thankful that this List is filled with such warm, generous people and Wally's passing makes me appreciate it even more. Vanessa Thank you Wally. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 20:54:01 -0500 From: "patrick leader" Subject: RE: Goodbye Wally who said goodbye laura nyro winfried, thank you so much for this. a search of the site comes up with a couple of wally's writings on laura nyro, and they're quite wonderful. one of my strategies for dealing with death is to just keep thinking about specifics. here are a few of mine about wally. 1) some time before i met him, i referred in a post to 'wally's wonderful site'. he wrote to me privately to object. he said he always thinks of jm.com as a site belonging to all of us, not fairly described as 'wally's'. (this was just his innate generosity, but i was blown away) 2) i met wally just before the first time i saw joni, 5/98. both of us music addicts; we talked about tori amos. he'd seen her live a number of times, and he'd been a bit obsessed with her singing cover songs. she does this a lot, in concert and on eps, and wally got to the point where he had to have a tape of the show every time she covered a new song. i can't remember how many tori amos concerts he said he had, but i was deeply impressed. god knows, i love the ten-or-so cover versions by tori that i own, (including 'imagine', 'ain't no sunshine', famous blue raincoat' and 'a case of you') and intend to tip my cap to wally forever, each time i listen to tori amos. especially those covers... 3) then just last year, when dusty died i wrote a little bit about her. wally had some recommendations for me and then a wonderful 'news from wally' item about ms. springfield. he had loved dusty's music even before joni's... another part of the picture, of wally. i guess this all made me appreciate him more. wally loved music. joni's music was the best in the world, for him. but he loved so much other music. that i can understand... patrick np - play the numbers - (compilation by barbara burst) - even > >A couple of months ago I discovered this goodbye-statement of Wally's on >the Laura Nyro website (http://www.lauranyro.net): > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:51:34 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Thoughts on Wally Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 18:16:27 -0500 From: c I had un.sub.scribed since before the holidays and had only occasionally checked jonimitchell.com in January. So I don't know what sent me there earlier today, but when I arrived I knew something stronger had drawn me in. Goodbye, Wally. You were one of the angels of the internet, sharing your knowledge and your collection with us all, real good for free. We'll miss you greatly! It's still a thrill to have traded tapes with him back in '96 or '97. After seeing his incredible list, I was shocked to find that I had 1 or 2 that he didn't, and he got a song he had never heard on tape. I hope the songs comforted him in his suffering and that he's now in a better place. Goodbye and God bless you, Wally. This message boun_ced on it's way to Joniland - usually a result of the address from which it came not matching *exactly* any subscriber's address. If this message is from you, contact me so we can resolve the problem. -Les. - ------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 22:36:14 -0500 From: Walter R Rodgers III Subject: [none] Re; Entertainment Weekly review I haven't heard BSN yet, but the review brings to my mind the difference I hear between a technically perfect voice and a voice that's thoughtful, soulful and beautiful (not to say someone can't be both). Sometimes a little kid can bring me to tears (small ones that you can hardly see) with a song. What I'm trying to say, but having trouble finding the words, is it reminds me of a few musician friends of mine who only seem to hear the complexity or lack thereof in a piece of music and miss a moving melody. Am I a blind Joniphile and musical simpleton or can you put too much emphasis on the quality of a singer to the point where music looses it's artfulness? I'm serious... Am I full of you know what or is there something to what I'm saying? I'm going out on a limb here so don't beat me up too bad. One more thing... I posted the other day that I hadn't know anyone prior to the JMHP who shared my love for Joni's music. That's not completely true. One of my daughters really has an ear for Joni and I'll tell you it's a treat (for me) to hear her sing Little Green, her favorite. She's 11. My other daughter can't stand Joni, and my son is still in diapers. Walter ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 19:38:01 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Punk (NJC) Emily Kirk Gray wrote: how much you dig them -- but the name of the group reminds > me of one of my all-time favorite punk bands, X...anyone > else like them? i wonder what exene is doing these days -- > i saw her name on a spoken-word poetry event flyer once > last year -- hmmm. > X rocks!! I noticed that they have an upcoming show in the SF bay area. They seem to reunite as X or the Knitters every so often. I know Exene made some solo albums, got married. Not sure about her latest exploits. RR ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 21:56:40 -0600 From: "Happy The Man" Subject: FW: Passing of Wally Breese - -----Original Message----- From: Jody Denberg [mailto:jdenberg@kgsr.com] Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 7:33 PM To: Happy The Man Subject: Re: Passing of Wally Breese Craig - I just got your message. Sad news... I am on the air tonight 8-10 CST and will dedicate my final song on my new music program - the new version of Joni's "BSN" to Wally. Jody - -----Original Message----- From: Happy The Man To: jdenberg@kgsr.com Date: Saturday, February 05, 2000 6:30 PM Subject: Passing of Wally Breese >Jody, > >Wally Breese creator of the www.jonimitchell.com website passed from this >world on Feb. 4th. He was instrumental in reuniting Joni with her daughter >that she gave up for adoption along with creating a artist website that >became the official site for Joni. > >In honor would it be so much to ask that you play "Sweet Bird" of Joni's >Hissing on Summer Lawns. > >It would much appreciated. > >Peace, Craig > ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V2000 #77 **************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? - -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?